Request for some old (LP) recordings of Ustad Vilayat Khan

[Archisman Mozumder]

Dear friends,

With reference to this link:

http://www.vilayatkhan.com/vk/index.php/disc

I will be very obliged if one can indicate to me, the source from
where I may obtain the following recordings:

1. Vilayat Khan - EMI ASD 0539 1963 Suha Sugrai & Thumri in
Piloo

2. Vilayat Khan & Imrat Khan - HMV EALP 1308 1966 Yaman Kalyan
& Jhinjhoti

3. Vilayat Khan - HMV EASD 1332 1968 Nat Bhairav

Thanks in advance.

Warm regards,
Archisman.

[C Parthapratim]

You want the recordings, or the vinyl records physically? I might have the last two in your list, in MP3 format.

[Archisman Mozumder]

> You want the recordings, or the vinyl records physically? I might have the last two in your list, in MP3 format.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thanks Partha. Files in mp3-format will be just fine.

Regards.

[bosmart]

> 3. Vilayat Khan - HMV   EASD 1332        1968           Nat Bhairav

This is probably a mistake. The number corresponds to the famous
Darbari recording. No Nat Bhairav anywhere in sight in the ustad's
discography. But then, if ever I am mistaken I would be very
interested indeed to hear it!
Hans Bosma
Paris
France

[Bhuvanesh]

I guess Archisman got the number from this webpage:

http://www.vilayatkhan.com/vk/index.php/disc

Nikhil and Ali Akbar have pretty good Nat Bhairavs, but I haven't come across one by Vilayat.

Bhuvanesh

[Imnot Apadmashri]

On Apr 14, 12:23 am, Bhuvanesh <BhuvaneshBh...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Nikhil and Ali Akbar have pretty good Nat Bhairavs, but I haven't come across one by Vilayat.

Doesn't Ravi Shankar claim that Nat Bhairav is his creation? In which
case VK playing it would be very interesting!

DG

[C Parthapratim]

There is indeed one Natbhairav by VK, but I am not sure if that was the same record label mentioned here, probably not, for the total duration of this clip is 28 minutes odd whereas it had to be something over 40 min to make a full LP. I am trying to send it to Archisman, as soon as BSNL broadband starts working normally in my area. I won't upload anything to Mediafire.

[Imnot Apadmashri]

On Apr 14, 2:59 pm, C Parthapratim <c.parthapra...@gmail.com> wrote:

> the total duration of this clip is 28 minutes odd whereas it had to be something over 40 min to make a full LP.

Unlike a CD, an LP had two sides. Do you happen to know, Partha,
whether the Nat Bhairav clip you have originally rested on one side or
both?

The maximum length of one side (worldwide) was gradually pushed from
the original design demand of 17 minutes to over 30 minutes. See

http://www.stevenlewis.info/crosby/lphist.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LP_record

Early HMV LPs did have an overall duration of 40 minutes or so, but
they (HMV) did better later on. Don't VK's yaman and darbari exceed
that limit?

But all that is detail. I am really curious to know whether VK made
any comment on the origins of the raga. Can anyone throw light on
that?

Oh, for the sleeve notes! Few who digitized the music thought of
preserving those.

DG

[Havanur]

On Apr 14, 9:26 pm, Imnot Apadmashri <imnotapadmas...@yahoo.com>
wondered:

> Early HMV LPs did have an overall duration of 40 minutes or so, but
> they (HMV) did better later on.  Don't VK's yaman and darbari exceed
> that limit?
>

Both are double sided, each side running into 24 +/- 1 minute. Alap
and jor one side, gat-s on the second. Both have been resissued as
CDs.

> But all that is detail.  I am really curious to know whether VK made
> any comment on the origins of the raga.  Can anyone throw light on
> that?

Me curious too. Evidence so far suggests that VK never recorded a Nat
Bhairav. Wonder what is CP's source?

Havanur

[C Parthapratim]

RS claimed so many things, do they all count? According to him, barring the obvious like Yaman, Bilawal etc. every other Raga with a beautiful name was his creation!

However, I have rarely seen a 28-minutes-per-side LP, way back in the 60s RS's NatBhairav was one of the longest I think. VK's is a continuous clip, apparently, can't be a double-sided disc with tracks/sides joined together. My source is another amateur collector, and apparently cannot be contacted any more, I have no further clue about the provenance. I am also curious to know, but my ISP won't let me upload even a 5 MB clip.

[Siddhartha Chaudhuri]

The mistake is because of the sleeve notes:
http://www.bollywoodvinyl.com/ekmps/shops/bollywoodvinyl/images/idjsdd-9.jpeg
. The thaat of Darbari is described as "Natbhairavi".

> I am also curious to know, but my ISP won't let me upload even a 5 MB clip.

When you say, "won't let me upload", could you describe the exact
issue a little more precisely? There must be some workaround (e.g. if
you can attach files to email, just email it to me and I'll upload it!
I mean it's technically even possible to cut and paste an mp3 as
plaintext into a series of emails :P). If the issue is file size, it
can always be split up into smaller pieces. Or just compress the first
5 minutes as a 500kb file at whatever compression level for a "sneak
preview" :).

I'm extremely interested in hearing this recording, thanks much for
the upload offer.

S

[C Parthapratim]

Actually there is an issue with my connection here, it drops every now and then. However, hopefully I'll fix it by this weekend.

[C Parthapratim]

On Monday, April 16, 2012 11:52:13 AM UTC+5:30, Siddhartha Chaudhuri wrote:

Rejoinder: Indeed, Asavari had an ancient name NatBhairavi, which is different from NatBhairav. There are two (I have seen only one) Sirohi miniature paintings that used Asavari and Natbhairavi interchangeably.

[vinay s pande]

On Apr 15, 12:26 am, Imnot Apadmashri <imnotapadmas...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

i have all these LP's with their original sleeves. i dont think they
say anything terribly profound, best i recall. if you wish i can scan
them and post them here when i get back to the usa.

[Siddhartha Chaudhuri]

Partha, if your net problems have been resolved, perhaps you could try
posting the recording?

Vinay, which LP's do you refer to? This mysterious Nat Bhairav one?!

S

[C Parthapratim]

Yes I have found an alternative solution, another connection in fact. Posting soon.

[Siddhartha Chaudhuri]

On May 1, 12:43 am, C Parthapratim <c.parthapra...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 1, 2012 3:12:16 AM UTC+5:30, Siddhartha Chaudhuri wrote:
> > Partha, if your net problems have been resolved, perhaps you could try
> > posting the recording?
>

> Yes I have found an alternative solution, another connection in fact. Posting soon.

Thanks! Looking fwd to it.

S

[vinay s pande]

On Apr 30, 5:42 pm, Siddhartha Chaudhuri

no siddharth i have never seen a nat bhairav. i have all the LP's
except the smaller format solomon's mines LP that was released in
bombay in the 60s, i believe. all the LPs have been uploaded as mp3 at
one time or the other. one of you was asking for sleeve notes. other,
perhaps, than the ones written by n a jairazbhoy i dont believe they
are worth the effort chasing down. but if anyone wants a copy let me
know which and i will scan and post.

[Bhuvanesh]

On Tuesday, May 1, 2012 2:43:33 AM UTC-5, C Parthapratim wrote:
> On Tuesday, May 1, 2012 3:12:16 AM UTC+5:30, Siddhartha Chaudhuri wrote:
> > Partha, if your net problems have been resolved, perhaps you could try
> > posting the recording?
> >

> Yes I have found an alternative solution, another connection in fact. Posting soon.

How soon? ;) Sorry to push, but we're understandably excited and looking forward to it.

Bhuvanesh

[C Parthapratim]

The 28 minutes MP3 I mentioned earlier also contains a Ragmalika. I am there cutting out NatBhairav part, recompressing it and posting as a Google file. The doubt that people have been talking about in this thread was about whether VK played Nat Bhairav at all. So here is a MP3 file that says "Bilayet Khan -- Nat Bhairon", certainly encoded and labelled by some Bengali bloke. Possibilities were there that either this was not Nat Bhairav, or this was not played by VK. However, the raga here is definitely Nat Bhairav or at least NOT-Bhairav of some kind. Whether VK or not, I leave the decision on you. On a personal note after hearing this repeatedly, I think there are doubts; VK elements are there, even the sound of the instrument is very much VK-like, but certain definite non-VK stuff is there too. The Madhyalay Gat is almost what RS played. Confusing, but enjoyable nonetheless.

(PS: upload is still not happening, posting the link in my next mail, pl wait)

Partha

[C Parthapratim]

The 28 minutes MP3 I mentioned earlier also contains a Ragmalika. I am therefore cutting out NatBhairav part, recompressing it and posting as a Google file. The doubt that people have been talking about in this thread was about whether VK played Nat Bhairav at all. So here is a MP3 file that says "Bilayet Khan -- Nat Bhairon", certainly encoded and labelled by some Bengali bloke. Possibilities were there that either this was not Nat Bhairav, or this was not played by VK. However, the raga here is definitely Nat Bhairav or at least NOT-Bhairav of some kind. Whether VK or not, I leave the decision on you. On a personal note after hearing this repeatedly, I think there are doubts; VK elements are there, even the sound of the instrument is very much VK-like, but certain definite non-VK stuff is there too. The Madhyalay Gat is almost what RS played. Confusing, but enjoyable nonetheless.

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B5jp2ZJOYtZPZy14aC1Udml3aEE

[C Parthapratim]

I don't have many Shahid Parvez in my collection. Can anybody tell if this is him wrongly attributed to VK? Just thinking aloud.

[C Parthapratim]

On Saturday, May 19, 2012 12:56:20 PM UTC+5:30, C Parthapratim wrote:

[Vivekanand P V]

This link: http://discog.piezoelektric.org/hmvindia/index.php?image=EASD+1332
says it is Nat Bhairav"i". And this page: http://hem.bredband.net/asoberget4/emi.html
enlists it (search the page for "CDNF 150186") as the popular Darbari
Kanada CD.

They say Darbari Kanada belongs to Nata / Natha Bhairavi scale (mela)
of Carnatic system. So I presume the "i" must have been skipped in the
link you gave.

V

[C Parthapratim]

I think I mentioned this earlier that Asavari, to which clan Darbari belongs, had an ancient name "Nat Bhairavi" as I can see in some miniature paintings; I didn't know that the name is still there in the Carnatic legacy.

[Bhuvanesh]

Thanks for the recording! My mom says this is Vilayat, based on the fast portion (he sometimes slows down within a cycle when doing taans, which Shahid does not do).

Bhuvanesh

[chandra.ka]

On Sunday, May 20, 2012 3:41:54 PM UTC+5:30, C Parthapratim wrote:
>
> I think I mentioned this earlier that Asavari, to which clan Darbari belongs, had an ancient name "Nat Bhairavi" as I can see in some miniature paintings; I didn't know that the name is still there in the Carnatic legacy.

In a lighter vein: once a name enters any legacy, it has to continue to be present in it. That is the nature of legacy.

Yes. Nata Bhairavi is a melakartha raga (20th) and post-trinity, many compositions have been composed in the raga. And many movie songs have been composed based on the raga as well.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=nata+bhairavi&oq=nata+bhairavi&aq=f&aqi=g-s3g-ms1&aql=&gs_l=youtube.3..0i10l3j0i5i10.490.2049.0.2347.9.9.0.0.0.0.204.1255.3j5j1.9.0...0.0.X6yk7TVP0ws

--chandra

[ani...@gmail.com]

Well, this does sound to me like Shahid Parvez. Was this ever clarified ?