Bobby and phil now, what would Jerry be like today
Rev.Logan 714
Further, for most of the people on this board you have a snapshot in
your mind of the last time you saw Jerry. My last time was the last
time they played shoreline.
Now even though after Jerry died his estate was worth a decent amount
of money, I always felt he kept stark commercialization out of the
Grateful Dead. Like we never saw the Grateful Dead presented by Coca-
Cola did we? And I do know the last time Jerry was in DC playing with
the Grateful Dead, he was starting to get neuropathy in his feet and
swelling from the diabetes. Infact there were two igloo coolers full
of ice and water that he put his feet in to try and knock the swelling
and the pain down.
So, for the first question is: Could Jerry even play a guitar today if
he was alive? I have the beginning stages of neuropathy myself and I
also drop cups of coffee sometimes because it hurts to hold them. I
just lose control of my hand.
so, with everybody railing against John, not sounding or sounding too
much like Jerry, if Jerry were alive today, what, if anything would he
sound like? And if Phil and Bobby were still playing and Jerry
couldn't, would they be playing with somebody else with Jerry's
blessing?
I see a lot of posts on this board reliving the glory days ,but this
is how I think in the here and now. Dead Tour was a blast. Going
places was a blast. But, goddamn that was in my youth. But whatabout
today?
Logan
Baffle The Cat
Edwin Hurwitz
<1b9dc8f2-58e5-4128...@a39g2000pre.googlegroups.com>,
"Rev.Logan 714" <loga...@gmail.com> wrote:
I've thought about this too. He'd been off and on for years and it was
just a matter of time before something took him out. Even if his
arterial blockage hadn't brought him down, I don't think he'd have had
too many years of playing left. I have worries about other people I know
in similar physical shape and unfortunately, they don't have the budget
that Jerry did.
I don't doubt that he would have enthusiastically supported the other
band members following whatever musical path that they wanted. He didn't
seem like the jealous or vindictive type. If it got put to him that they
could continue without him or even quit altogether, he might have been
relieved.
As far as the bands getting corporate sponsors or not, I don't think
that has much to do with Jerry's influence. Until he died, there wasn't
the level of corporate sponsorship that we have today because it was
still possible to make an honest living in the music business, although
it was fading fast by 1995. CDs were still selling, the internet didn't
have the bandwidth for wholesale pirating of music and concert tickets
hadn't been hijacked by the scams that are being run now.
But, you are so right, it was a blast! I'm bummed that people can't
really live that these days, but it's not just that the band is gone,
the world was just a different place then.
Edwin
--
If you want to make peace, you don't talk to your friends. You talk to your
enemies.
-Moshe Dayan
Kirk McElhearn
> So, for the first question is: Could Jerry even play a guitar today if
> he was alive? I have the beginning stages of neuropathy myself and I
> also drop cups of coffee sometimes because it hurts to hold them. I
> just lose control of my hand.
Were there any suggestions that his neuropathy was in his hands? I
don't think so; I think it was related to the swelling and only
affected his feet (from what I've read, at least).
This said, if he hadn't gotten his ass in shape, he'd probably be in a
wheelchair by now, and most likely the gitar skillz would have faded
away...
Kirk
--
Kirkville: http://www.mcelhearn.com
Writings about more than just Macs
http://www.readinghenryjames.com
Reading Henry James
Kirk McElhearn
> But, you are so right, it was a blast! I'm bummed that people can't
> really live that these days, but it's not just that the band is gone,
> the world was just a different place then.
I've only been to a handful of (rock) concerts in the past 25 years,
all in small clubs, so I have no idea just how much it's changed (and
I've been away from the US that long), but I recall the fond memories
of the great atmosphere at the hundreds of concerts I attendend in NYC,
at places like the Palladium, MSG, even the Nasau Colliseum, as well as
all the outdoor shows in the summer. It looks now like getting into a
concert is like getting on an airplane...
3jane.
> is how I think in the here and now. Dead Tour was a blast. Going
> places was a blast. But, goddamn that was in my youth. But whatabout
> today?
I would say even if he could still play, no way he would be touring
with the Dead, he would have bagged that a long time ago. I could see
JGB/Grisman/other acoustic projects, maybe a little jazz or swing. I
also think he'd be very positive about DSO.
John Doherty
his life-- he died recently in his 90s, and was still gigging once a
week in NYC.
He said that he had serious limitations (arthritis, IIRC) in many
fingers, but worked around those limitations and still found a way to
make that guitar "cry & sing".
Rev.Logan 714
Since my wife types and she's not feeling that great, I don't mean to
offend anybody, but I've gotta respond as a blanket post to all the
other posts.
Perephial neuropathy, at least in my experience, spreads to all of
your limbs. that's why I was making a comment and the dexterity in
his fingers.
To what doug Said about DSO. I believe Jerry, being an artist, not
just a guitar player, would support any type of artistic expression.
Remember, he painted, he drew, and I think he even played around with
ceramics at one point. that's why when I see everybody railing
against DSO. I think Jerry's attitude would be "cool guys, you're
doing a good job.:"
As for Jerry still Jamming Like Les Paul did, yeah I could Jerry every
know and then showing up at the Catotti(SP) cabaret and jamming. It
was fairly close to his house. but he was also a producer and a writer
and I think he'd still have his fingers in the pie there.
Change in the music industry over time. Well, from a local crew stand
point at a 13,000 seat arena, the bands are real set piece now, follow
a rigid time schedule, which I think stifles the creativity of the
show, all the tickets are bar code scanned, so from the band
production stand point it's really tightened up a hell of a lot.
Although the venue employees still have certain privlidges that
regardless of what the talent tried to do, they're only here for a few
hours. The walk throughs aren't going to stop.
From an actual patrons perspective I have none. I think last time I
actually bought a ticket at a box office was 1982 at the Oakland Aud.
Yes, Live nation changed the game big time. Thank God they're not our
production company.
It still gets me when I see people bitch about what Further's doing.
I just look at it as people being creative and playing music. I hope
they decideto come trough the west. and stop by. I think they'd be a
blast.
can't turn back the clock. this is what's happening now. Either
accept it or ignore it. jerry can't be resurrected but we do have
fond memories of him.
Logan
Edwin Hurwitz
Kirk McElhearn <kir...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 2009-11-25 05:19:24 +0100, "Rev.Logan 714" <loga...@gmail.com> said:
>
> > So, for the first question is: Could Jerry even play a guitar today if
> > he was alive? I have the beginning stages of neuropathy myself and I
> > also drop cups of coffee sometimes because it hurts to hold them. I
> > just lose control of my hand.
>
> Were there any suggestions that his neuropathy was in his hands? I
> don't think so; I think it was related to the swelling and only
> affected his feet (from what I've read, at least).
Yes, there were suggestions. Blair's book talks about it. Once that
stuff starts happening, it's all over. Watch your blood sugar, folks!
Kirk McElhearn
>
> Yes, there were suggestions. Blair's book talks about it. Once that
> stuff starts happening, it's all over. Watch your blood sugar, folks!
Timely warning. I've got to get some blood sugar tests, because
something weird is happening... My doctor is, how can I say, very
curious about it. Sucks if something turns out bad.
Rev.Logan 714
If it's caught early and you haven't lived a life like mine, which is
beat the living crap out of yourself constantly by essentially living
on tour and hopping frieght trains for entertainment, and also having
a mechanical trades job which entails a lot of fine motor skills,
reaching around into weird positions, blind, and having to maintain
your hand in that weird position until you've driven the bolt home.
You shouldn't have it nearly as bad as I do. Remember, Jerry was a
professional musician and used his hands and very fine movements
continually daily. But, if you watch your sugars and your diet, if you
drink be prepared to see 500 on your blood sugars, I drank some Vodka
one night and my god. I'm glad I was still drunk when I took the
blood sugar reading or I would have flipped out. It should be fine. My
dad has lived with it so far for 40 years. He's 73, and he's had some
bone spur problems in his feet and he fucks himself up with cellulitus
occasionally, but he knows when he's pushing himself too far and the
conversations end up "dad what the fuck are you doing, you know
better." His answer, "I had too". My reply, "fuck you, you're
retired, there's nothing you HAVE to do that won't be there
tomorrow." My dad lives in Too Stoned Arid Zone and it's already way
laid back there. Me, at 46 I'm just getting to the point where I stop
some activities because of it. Like today, coming back from Walmart I
had to take my shoes off driving back and then I just walked in the
house and laid down for 20 minutes and waited for the Vicoprophen and
Soma to kick in.
That's why I posted it about Jerry. I know what he felt like.
An interesting connotation on jerry's death is, one of my friends is
in charge of a drug ombudsman office for a Large Co. with a large
population on the east coast. Anyways she is an RN too. I think she
let her license lapse because she went in the Administrative side of
it, but I could be wrong. When Jane was asking me about how Jerry
died, in the rehab itself, him falling out of his bed and ending up on
the floor, the first question she asked was "he's a cardiac patient,
therefore he was a high risk patient to start with, and that standard
operational procedure with a high risk patient with a cardiac risk is
to have them on a heart monitor. Which, was not done and he was found
on the floor over an hour later according to the corrinner So, if the
drug rehab didn't kill him with improper care, they sure as hell
majorly contributed to his death. we could still have Jerr-Bear here
if it wasn't for a bunch of scum bags who worked at the drug rehad and
the intervention that was pulled on him to get to the rehab. I know
who pulled the intervention but I'm not going name names because they
didn't do it to harm Jerry, they thought they were helping him. But
if they would have just left Jerry alone with his Persian, who knows,
he could be alive today. And even if he couldn't play, Jerry
Garicia's presence on the face of this earth would have still
continued to be a positive thing. Look at all the charity he did. I
mean what, it started out with Snack Sunday in '74 in Kezar I believe,
a benefit for arts in the SF School District I mean, my God, if he
would have followed the Grace Slick route I'm sure we could have all
had some Jerry Art work hanging on our walls right now. That's what
really tears me up about the whole thing. We lost one of the most
creative and talented people on this planet because of ignorance and
neglect.
Sorry for the ramble. When I lived in the Bay I had friends and we
were family. Hell, Jerry and I used to cop off of the same Persian
Dealer, and it's been a long time since I've said anything on the
subject.
I will say one thing about Jerry Garcia as a man; what Jerry dug most
was just to be treated like a normal person. To come over to his
friends house's, play with their kids, make dinner, and just be a
normal schmuck without anybody creaming their jeans because "it's
Jerry". He didn't mind if you said "hey Jer, these shows are all sold
out, can you put me on the will call list please?" He was just a down
brother from my experience. And even having and estate worth over
$200 million, he still wouldn't have a lighter in his pocket. And when
he asked for one everyone would just say something like "just keep it
man." I wonder where the beat up black beemer is now.
Bro, I sure as fuck miss you and hope you're jamming with Elvis,
Stevie Ray and Mr. Cash.
Logan
3jane.
> in charge of a drug ombudsman office for a Large Co. with a large
> population on the east coast. Anyways she is an RN too. I think she
> let her license lapse because she went in the Administrative side of
> it, but I could be wrong. When Jane was asking me about how Jerry
> died, in the rehab itself, him falling out of his bed and ending up on
> the floor, the first question she asked was "he's a cardiac patient,
> therefore he was a high risk patient to start with, and that standard
> operational procedure with a high risk patient with a cardiac risk is
> to have them on a heart monitor. Which, was not done and he was found
> on the floor over an hour later according to the corrinner So, if the
> drug rehab didn't kill him with improper care, they sure as hell
> majorly contributed to his death.
I've always wondered about this and felt the people at Forest Knolls
had something to answer for that they were apparently never asked. I
assumed it was because Ms. Koons put him there and didn't want the
scrutiny-or maybe just didn't give a shit either way.
Joe
>him falling out of his bed and ending up on the floor, the first
>question she asked was "he's a cardiac patient, therefore he was a
>high risk patient to start with, and that standard operational
>procedure with a high risk patient with a cardiac risk is to have
>them on a heart monitor. Which, was not done and he was found on
>the floor over an hour later according to the corrinner
chronology of that evening, he checked in at 10pm, they got him settled
in, and he was dead by 4 or 5am.
In even the widest speculation, I don't I'd ever heard anyone accusing
Serenity Knolls and/or negligence for Jerry's death.
Out of curiousity, I just looked to see if they're still listed in the
Marin County phone directory, and sure enough, they're still there in
Forest Knolls.
That said, to this day, I don't believe anything about diabetes or low
blood sugar; it was the drugs that did Jerry in. Even in 1974, when I
first got into the Dead, the rumor mill was awash with tales of Persian,
and those rumors/stories/speculations never stopped. It was like common
knowledge; everyone knew it, but only Jerry could do anything about it,
and he never did.
Joe
3jane.
> blood sugar; it was the drugs that did Jerry in. Even in 1974, when I
> first got into the Dead, the rumor mill was awash with tales of Persian,
> and those rumors/stories/speculations never stopped. It was like common
> knowledge; everyone knew it, but only Jerry could do anything about it,
> and he never did.
A few things occur to me:
You know absolutely nothing about heroin use, abuse and the negative
effects thereof.
You are some kind of Koons/Serenity Knolls apologist. If a known over
weight diabetic chronic drug addict with a well documented history of
life threatening disease checks into your prestigous accredited rehab
industry money generating factory and dies that night, you fucked up.
Hope that helps.
Brad Greer
wrote:
Also, I don't think anyone's said the diabetes did him in - it was the
clogged arteries which were the result of years of smoking and eating
poorly. Neither the diabetes nor the heroin helped anything.
Orlando Enrique Fiol
>If a known overweight diabetic chronic drug addict with a well documented
history of life threatening disease checks into your prestigious accredited
Actually, if that known overweight drug addict with a poor heart, diabetes and
a poor diet ignores everyone's attempts to keep him alive, he must have a death
wish. I hate to say it about our beloved Jerry, but all facts point to that.
Orlando
marcman
> On 2009-11-25 18:10:44 +0100, Edwin Hurwitz <ed...@indra.com> said:
>
>
>
> > Yes, there were suggestions. Blair's book talks about it. Once that
> > stuff starts happening, it's all over. Watch your blood sugar, folks!
>
> Timely warning. I've got to get some blood sugar tests, because
> something weird is happening... My doctor is, how can I say, very
> curious about it. Sucks if something turns out bad.
>
> Kirk
Yup, sucks is the right word. I hope its not your eyesight that's
getting tricky, thats the part about all this that scares me the most.
I found out a year ago what it looks like you found out recently.
Been exercising trying to drop some weight (not working out too well,
but at least not getting any fatter) and taking my meds as prescribed
and the blood sugar sits at a much more reasonable level - but still
unnacceptably high. The bad cholesterol on the other hand which was
off the charts high, if I told you the number you wouldn't believe me,
has reacted to the Lipitor and a slight change in diet and is well
under control. I just wish the diabetes meds worked as well as the
cholesterol meds. I've got a month or so until my next blood work,
if the glucose hasn't lowered by then, it's going to be a radical
change in diet, and like you said, it sucks. BUT . . . there could be
worse things going on. Wishing you the best, Kirk.
marcman
> On Nov 25, 2:47 pm, Kirk McElhearn <kir...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2009-11-25 18:10:44 +0100, Edwin Hurwitz <ed...@indra.com> said:
>
> > > Yes, there were suggestions. Blair's book talks about it. Once that
> > > stuff starts happening, it's all over. Watch your blood sugar, folks!
>
> > Timely warning. I've got to get some blood sugar tests, because
> > something weird is happening... My doctor is, how can I say, very
> > curious about it. Sucks if something turns out bad.
>
> > Kirk
> > --
> > Kirkville:http://www.mcelhearn.com
> > Writings about more than just Macs
>
> >http://www.readinghenryjames.com
> > Reading Henry James
>
> If it's caught early and you haven't lived a life like mine, which is
> beat the living crap out of yourself constantly
The problem is that teh liver is one of teh organs that the diabetes
first attacks, so if you did a lot of drinking (alcohol) and have
liver problems to begin with, its very problematic to develop
diabetes, because not only will the high sugar get ya, but some of the
meds will to. I take Micardis for blood pressure even though my blood
pressure is fine, because it lessens the ill effects that teh diabetes
meds have on the liver and kidneys..
> by essentially living
> on tour and hopping frieght trains for entertainment, and also having
> a mechanical trades job which entails a lot of fine motor skills,
> reaching around into weird positions, blind, and having to maintain
> your hand in that weird position until you've driven the bolt home.
> You shouldn't have it nearly as bad as I do. Remember, Jerry was a
> professional musician and used his hands and very fine movements
> continually daily. But, if you watch your sugars and your diet, if you
> drink be prepared to see 500 on your blood sugars, I drank some Vodka
> one night and my god.
500?!? Holy shit dude, I've never seen 500, 500 is just out of
control! I used to get readings in the low 200s, now after a year of
treatment I'm at like low to mid 100sm and even mid 100s is still too
high.
> I'm glad I was still drunk when I took the
> blood sugar reading or I would have flipped out. It should be fine. My
> dad has lived with it so far for 40 years. He's 73,
My dad too, and he's also 73. He's doing pretty well, the meds seem to
work for him, plus he got thinner. HE also like to eat well, which I
do not. I hope I have as much success as he does.
> and he's had some
> bone spur problems in his feet and he fucks himself up with cellulitus
> occasionally, but he knows when he's pushing himself too far and the
> conversations end up "dad what the fuck are you doing, you know
> better." His answer, "I had too". My reply, "fuck you, you're
> retired, there's nothing you HAVE to do that won't be there
> tomorrow." My dad lives in Too Stoned Arid Zone and it's already way
> laid back there. Me, at 46 I'm just getting to the point where I stop
> some activities because of it. Like today, coming back from Walmart I
> had to take my shoes off driving back and then I just walked in the
> house and laid down for 20 minutes and waited for the Vicoprophen and
> Soma to kick in.
I'm sorry to hear that. Thank you for sharing, you've actually made
me feel a little bit better about my own condition.
> Logan- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Rev.Logan 714
Now I'm remember more of my conversation with Jane, after all it was
10+ years ago.
So, try this take: Serenity Knolls was not a qualified nor certified
facility to handle a patient such as Jerry. They should have never
accepted or admitted him even if they said "yeah, c'mon down" at the
initial health screening intake; Serenity Knolls was not a qualified
facility to detox at patient with Jerry's known health conditions.
They should have immediately said "no, we cannot detox you. We can
treat you as a rehab once you are detoxified from Heroin."
Jerry should have been detoxed in a Hospital or a Hospital-like
setting with qualified Medical personnel monitoring him 24/7. And it
wasn't a question of money. It's not like the patient couldn't afford
to be detoxified in the proper setting. But, people like his wife had
no idea how to deal with a long term opiate addict. There were some
people in the Grateful Dead circle that decided for some reason they
had to import a fresh wife from outside of the entire circle and that
would straighten Jerry out. Yeah, right. That really worked
wonderfully. Oh, well, damn, he could have just continued to be a
Junkie instead of being dead. Hell, the Dead Organization took his
driving privileges away in '85 or '86 when he got busted on JFK Blvd
in Golden Gate Park.
Does anybody know why Jerry was sitting on JFK in GGPark doing a hit
of Persian? I know why and I'll tell ya. His connections house was
about 6 blocks away. Also his connection lived right next to an
entrance to GGPark. Therefore, Jerry must have been sick, ran out of
his connections house, jumped in the beemer, drove two or three
minutes and stopped to take a hit. But, unfortunately he was Jerry
Garcia and he was too fucking lazy to get out of the beemer, walk two
minutes past the roses, and walk into some fairly thick thicket like
the rest of us had to do when we just happened to be sick and go to
the same guy. But I'm sure brother would have let Jerry sit in his
living room and take a couple of hits if Jerry was that sick. Now
Jerry didn't chase the dragon. He used a pipe with a bell bowl and
multiple screens. It's like a really good freebase pipe but he didn't
use water in it, because Persian is freebase Morphine. Thus, unless
you're going to shoot it, the best way to smoke it is as if you're
smoking really good freebase.
Logan
Rev.Logan 714
people on this board treat me like shit. But I guess I'm getting sick
of the Schmoozing and the "my Grateful Dead dick is longer than your
Grateful Dead dick," and the "I went to this show or that show"
shit. I guess it's to see who was really involved with the Grateful
Dead as part of their life and not just a spectator.
Logan
Lfh
> Okay, I don't even know why I'm sharing this information.
Sure, you do.
> A lot of people on this board treat me like shit.
Oh, please. Maybe at one time, but now, it's pretty much just me, and
I'm losing interest fast.
> But I guess I'm getting sick
Hope you make it past the roses, d00d.
> of the Schmoozing and the "my Grateful Dead dick is longer than your
> Grateful Dead dick,"
So you thought you would come along with even bigger dick stories as a
way of protesting such?
> and the "I went to this show or that show" shit.
Weren't you the dope who came on to this board bragging about your 420
shows and all your scams for sliding through the walk throughs and all
that other bitchin' "hey, look at my big GD dick, people"
introduction? Why, yes, yes you were.
> I guess it's to see who was really involved with the Grateful
> Dead as part of their life and not just a spectator.
Looks like it is for you.
Fred
marcman
> Okay, I don't even know why I'm sharing this information. A lot of
> people on this board treat me like shit.
Waaaaaaa, waaaaaaaaa
> But I guess I'm getting sick
> of the Schmoozing
Schmoozing rules, dude.
> and the "my Grateful Dead dick is longer than your
> Grateful Dead dick," and the "I went to this show or that show"
> shit. I guess it's to see who was really involved with the Grateful
> Dead as part of their life and not just a spectator.
>
Really? If you're getting sick of what you perceive to be what this
place calls people thinking/saying they're a "better" deadhead than
somebody else, why do you give fuck one about who is what you're
calling a real DH?
> Logan
Brad Greer
Well, you've won the bigger dick contest, nicely done.
Rev.Logan 714
Yeah I started a thread. Asked some reasonable questions of people.
Then, when some people brought different things to my attention, it
brought back a flood of memories.
No Frank, I wasn't talking about you. You're just a minor annoyance
like a fly. I was just thinking in general. And I'm sorry but, from my
perspective some of these answers and exchanges just brought up some
memories that are disturbing and hurtful about how Jerry's life was
fucked off. Have your own opinion. I'll just kill file you at this
point. You know I do know some people in real life that post here and
that's more of the people I'm looking to have a conversation with.
But blow me anyways, but then again, you'd probably enjoy it.
Logan
marcman
> On Nov 25, 7:18 pm, marcman <marcmanstud...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 25, 9:00 pm, "Rev.Logan 714" <logan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Okay, I don't even know why I'm sharing this information. A lot of
> > > people on this board treat me like shit.
>
> > Waaaaaaa, waaaaaaaaa
>
> > > But I guess I'm getting sick
> > > of the Schmoozing
>
> > Schmoozing rules, dude.
>
> > > and the "my Grateful Dead dick is longer than your
> > > Grateful Dead dick," and the "I went to this show or that show"
> > > shit. I guess it's to see who was really involved with the Grateful
> > > Dead as part of their life and not just a spectator.
>
> > Really? If you're getting sick of what you perceive to be what this
> > place calls people thinking/saying they're a "better" deadhead than
> > somebody else, why do you give fuck one about who is what you're
> > calling a real DH?
>
> > > Logan
>
> Yeah I started a thread. Asked some reasonable questions of people.
> Then, when some people brought different things to my attention, it
> brought back a flood of memories.
>
> No Frank, I wasn't talking about you.
Who's Frank?
> You're just a minor annoyance
> like a fly. I was just thinking in general. And I'm sorry but, from my
> perspective some of these answers and exchanges just brought up some
> memories that are disturbing and hurtful about how Jerry's life was
> fucked off. Have your own opinion.
My opinion is that you're largely incoherent.
> I'll just kill file you at this
> point.
Oh, how original. Like I need you to respond to me in order to point
out your idiocy!
> You know I do know some people in real life that post here and
> that's more of the people I'm looking to have a conversation with.
Ever hear of email? Do you own a telephone?
> But blow me anyways, but then again, you'd probably enjoy it.
>
> Logan
Says the guy asking another guy to blow him.
Edwin Hurwitz
Orlando Enrique Fiol <of...@verizon.net> wrote:
I don't know if he had a death wish per se, but certainly it was easier
than confronting all of his demons.
Kirk McElhearn
And if he had had "real" medical treatment for his heart, instead of
accutpuncture and homeopathic sugar pills (as his doctor has said), he
would probably have lived a lot longer...
LP
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 18:00:38 -0800 (PST), "Rev.Logan 714"
>
> >Okay, I don't even know why I'm sharing this information. A lot of
> >people on this board treat me like shit. But I guess I'm getting sick
> >of the Schmoozing and the "my Grateful Dead dick is longer than your
> >Grateful Dead dick," and the "I went to this show or that show"
> >shit. I guess it's to see who was really involved with the Grateful
> >Dead as part of their life and not just a spectator.
>
> Well, you've won the bigger dick contest, nicely done.
He's, like, GD Family, d00d.
Kirk McElhearn
>>
>> Timely warning. I've got to get some blood sugar tests, because
>> something weird is happening... My doctor is, how can I say, very
>> curious about it. Sucks if something turns out bad.
>>
>> Kirk
>
> Yup, sucks is the right word. I hope its not your eyesight that's
> getting tricky, thats the part about all this that scares me the most.
No, it's actually getting low blood sugar, and being hungry an hour
after eating that has worried my doctor.
> I found out a year ago what it looks like you found out recently.
> Been exercising trying to drop some weight (not working out too well,
> but at least not getting any fatter) and taking my meds as prescribed
> and the blood sugar sits at a much more reasonable level - but still
> unnacceptably high. The bad cholesterol on the other hand which was
> off the charts high, if I told you the number you wouldn't believe me,
> has reacted to the Lipitor and a slight change in diet and is well
> under control. I just wish the diabetes meds worked as well as the
> cholesterol meds. I've got a month or so until my next blood work,
> if the glucose hasn't lowered by then, it's going to be a radical
> change in diet, and like you said, it sucks. BUT . . . there could be
> worse things going on. Wishing you the best, Kirk.
Thanks. I'm not overweight by much - I've got 20 lbs too much, most of
which I've put on in the past year or so. I thought it was from some
meds I'm taking but the weight went up, then came down halfway, then
went back up. So that tied with the low blood sugar has my doctor
suggesting that it "might" be early diabetes. Blood tests today, so
I'll see in a couple of days. From what I've read, though, it doesn't
seem I fit the standard type: I don't pee a lot, I'm not thirsty all
the time (although I regulary drink a good amount of tea during the
day, but have been doing that for about ten years), and I don't have
any other symptoms. So we'll see what good old French health care comes
up with...
Kirk
JimK
wrote:
>In article <MPG.2577a1fdf...@news.albasani.net>,
> Orlando Enrique Fiol <of...@verizon.net> wrote:
>
>> 3jane. <q3j...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >If a known overweight diabetic chronic drug addict with a well documented
>> history of life threatening disease checks into your prestigious accredited
>> rehab industry money generating factory and dies that night, you fucked up.
>>
>> Actually, if that known overweight drug addict with a poor heart, diabetes
>> and
>> a poor diet ignores everyone's attempts to keep him alive, he must have a
>> death
>> wish. I hate to say it about our beloved Jerry, but all facts point to that.
>>
>> Orlando
>
>I don't know if he had a death wish per se, but certainly it was easier
>than confronting all of his demons.
>
>Edwin
I sometimes wonder what those demons were that were so horrible they
made him throw his life away. But then, I think maybe it's just none
of our business.
JimK
Kirk McElhearn
> I sometimes wonder what those demons were that were so horrible they
> made him throw his life away. But then, I think maybe it's just none
> of our business.
There's certainly the fact that he saw his father drown, but there may
have been other things. Like drugs he took early on - all that acid.
JimK
wrote:
>On 2009-11-26 16:09:55 +0100, JimK <jkez...@comcast.net> said:
>
>> I sometimes wonder what those demons were that were so horrible they
>> made him throw his life away. But then, I think maybe it's just none
>> of our business.
>
>There's certainly the fact that he saw his father drown, but there may
>have been other things. Like drugs he took early on - all that acid.
>
>Kirk
I suppose you could be right about the acid, but somehow I don't think
that was it.
JimK
sparksfly
d00d, you're funny, no really you're cracking me up, you should post
more.
Mike
sparksfly
> On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:33:34 -0700, Edwin Hurwitz <ed...@indra.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
Isn't addiction a big enough demon itself?
Mike
Edwin Hurwitz
JimK <jkez...@comcast.net> wrote:
I think they were us. Too much pressure to be Jerry so that other folks
could make a living. As you can glean pretty easily, Jerry didn't handle
confrontation well, so rather than tell everyone that he was going to
quit and risk facing all the various emotions that would come up, he
just went away. I think he also had some pretty intense people around
him that cut him off from his old friends, so his view of the world must
have gotten kind of bleak. From what I've heard, the organization
changed pretty drastically at some point and shut the doors to a lot of
people that Jerry had known and who cared about him. All that was left
was the stage and Persian. All I know is I wouldn't want to live like
that.
Rev.Logan 714
> In article <de6tg5h1je12jqealb840ohl185m9ls...@4ax.com>,
>
>
>
> JimK <jkezw...@comcast.net> wrote:
> > On Wed, 25 Nov 2009 22:33:34 -0700, Edwin Hurwitz <ed...@indra.com>
> > wrote:
>
Well I see the point on self destruction. I mean, Jerry had diabetes
pretty bad. And then he'd sit there and pig out on a whole quart of
Ben and Jerry's or Hagandas. In my mind, being diabetic myself, it's
kind of in the back of the mind self destruction. A person knows that
they are going to pay for that behavior eventually in some way, which
could have been more neuropathy. But I think with Serenity Knolls, it
was just another professionally run intervention, which he had been
through many times before. So he probably thought "oh, they're just
going to throw me in this rehab. I'll clean up for a little while and
then just go about my life." He also probably thought "hey, this is
being done professionally. They know how to rehab people. Well, it
was the so called professionals in the drug rehabilitation industry
that dropped the ball, which those scumbags are absolute liars and
scum to start with.
There is this particular thing about the $5 Billion a year drug
rehabilitation industry which is, the best success rate they can claim
is 5%. Well, spontaneous remission has a success rate of about 5% a
year. So, what that means is, 5% of the people addicted per year stop
on their own because they want to. Drug Rehab has nothing to do with
it. So you've got a bunch of scumbags that claim they can save the
world, your family, yourself, whatever, that actually either a.) do
nothing with that $5 Billion a year, or b.) cause and hurt people. And
it gets even worse. Some of them can even claim a whopping 3% success
rate, so therefore they are actually thousands or millions of people a
year.
I used to do Heroin. I stopped on my own. All those scumbags did in my
20 some odd years of contact with them was make me want to do more
Heroin. And I think that's the trap Jerry was stuck in and it killed
him.
Logan
katrinka
don't think so; I think it was related to the swelling and only
affected his feet (from what I've read, at least).
I forgot to copy the attribution for the above, but I don't think that
really matters.
Just wanted to say that the last few shows where I saw Jerry
relatively close, in 1995, there were long stretches when he wasn't
playing.
I observed him shaking his hands, like his fingers or his whole hand
had gone numb.
Knowing that Jerry was diabetic, I assumed it was peripheral
neuropathy.
I think I even posted something to that effect at the time.
katrinka
Edwin Hurwitz
<66c0e28b-0239-4a03...@g22g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
"Rev.Logan 714" <loga...@gmail.com> wrote:
I don't doubt this, but I had thought that Jerry had been down at Betty
Ford doing the real professionally run intervention and checked out
early. I thought Serenity Knolls wasn't so much a professional rehab,
but a vacation spot for people having issues. I don't think they were
prepared for the issues that Jerry had. Besides which, he didn't die of
drugs. He died of plain old heart disease, which kills many many people
every year. If he had taken care of his cardio vascular and diabetes
issues, he could have been an emotionally dysfunctional drug addict for
a lot more years.
Orlando Enrique Fiol
>I sometimes wonder what those demons were that were so horrible they
>made him throw his life away. But then, I think maybe it's just none
>of our business.
Plenty of people go through unspeakable tragedies without throwing their lives
away on drugs. It's not so much how bad someone's demons are, but rather how
strong their constitution is to deal with them. Some people get so used to
being high that it becomes a comfort zone out of which they hate to stray.
Jerry could afford to get high almost daily for twenty years. He got high no
matter what was going on in his life, whether his playing was great or lousy,
whether Brent or Bruce played keyboards, whether he had or did not have a woman
in his life, whether he was fatter or thinner, etc. Like most drug addicts,
Jerry got high as a matter of daily mood regulation rather than in reaction to
life stresses.
Orlando
mr.rapidan
> reach arounds in weird positions
> until you've driven the bolt home
I have to confess, this is where I stopped reading.