degenerate artist : a suspect term
mary jane
unknown contributor calling himself "Dr Nehemiah
Anthony", have used the term "degenerate artist". The
use of this term is distasteful to say the least when
applied to a Jewish person as it was used by the Nazis
in their anti-semitic pronouncements on art and
artists. I'm disappointed that people have responded
to these posts without making any reference to the
disgraceful origins of the term.
____________________________________________________________
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Posted from web13708.mail.yahoo.com [216.136.175.141]
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tom
mary jane wrote:
> Recent postings to this newsgroup, from a hitherto
> unknown contributor calling himself "Dr Nehemiah
> Anthony", have used the term "degenerate artist". The
> use of this term is distasteful to say the least when
> applied to a Jewish person as it was used by the Nazis
> in their anti-semitic pronouncements on art and
> artists. I'm disappointed that people have responded
> to these posts without making any reference to the
> disgraceful origins of the term.
it's possible that you're more educated than the rest of us "mary jane"
-- as if that's your real name, yeah right -- and that the rest of us
were not aware that the nazi bastards used the term degenerate artists.
also, i do believe the good doctor used the term to describe christian
conservative bob anyway. so there you go. in any event, thanks for the
information regarding the term. to paraphrase moses, ya learn something
knew every day.
np: lightning jazz, bernstein
Dr Nehemiah Anthony
mary jane <miz_ma...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:2001041115182...@web13708.mail.yahoo.com...
> Recent postings to this newsgroup, from a hitherto
> unknown contributor calling himself "Dr Nehemiah
> Anthony", have used the term "degenerate artist". The
> use of this term is distasteful to say the least when
> applied to a Jewish person as it was used by the Nazis
> in their anti-semitic pronouncements on art and
> artists. I'm disappointed that people have responded
> to these posts without making any reference to the
> disgraceful origins of the term.
If you had read my post instead of deliberatley and dunderheadedly
*mis*reading (you did that so you have something to post about) you wouldn't
have needed to waste bandwith saying something that is totally irrelevant.
Dr Nehemiah Anthony.
Andrew Gray
> it's possible that you're more educated than the rest of us "mary jane"
> -- as if that's your real name, yeah right -- and that the rest of us
> were not aware that the nazi bastards used the term degenerate artists.
> also, i do believe the good doctor used the term to describe christian
> conservative bob anyway.
At the risk of being pedantic, tom, the Nazis used it to describe the
Jewish *race*, not the religion; Bob may or may not be a conservative
Christian, but he's still definable as Jewish.
> np: lightning jazz, bernstein
/Smartie Mine/, or live? S'not bad, though my album is somewhat
iffy...
Pat Fitzgerald
> Take a Midol, honey.
Will that cure dunderheadedness?
Tricia J
>Take a Midol, honey.
>
Why is it every time a woman posts on here there's a sexist response?
No objection to some idiot posting nazi drivel but this knee-jerk
reaction every time a female dares make a comment. Loosen your
underpants, bub.
Tony Iremonger
Loosening his underpants will only make the jerkin' easier!
:-)
Tony
Patricia Jungwirth
>>>>
the rest of us
were not aware that the nazi bastards used the term degenerate artists.
<<<<
Anyone who has done even a little reading or history or art studies or
watched a few documentaries on tv would know that 'Degenerate Art' was the
title of an exhibition staged by the Nazis, and 'degenerate' was one of
their favourite euphemisms.
>>>>
also, i do believe the good doctor used the term to describe christian
conservative bob anyway.
<<<<
Then he is even more ignorant than would at first appear. And I guess it's
just coincidence that this post appears just before Passover?
Here's some links for those not familiar with the history:
http://www.ovationtv.com/artszone/programs/degenerate/index.html
>>>>
In July 1937, Adolf Hitler's Nazi party mounted an exhibition of
confiscated art, "Entartete Kunst," meaning, "Degenerate Art." It
showcased--and ridiculed--the work of contemporary artists such as Max
Beckman, Emil Nolde, Otto Dix, Oskar Kokoschka, and over 200 others. The
exhibition was intended to show the public the insanity, atrocity, and
depravity of the modern art movement. Artists included in the show, many of
whom are now recognized as modern masters, were depicted as demented,
deranged, and subhuman.
On March 20th, 1939, the Degenerate Art Commission ordered over one
thousand paintings and almost four thousand watercolors and drawings burned
in the courtyard of a fire station in Berlin. Other works were auctioned
off to the highest bidder. The final solution for artwork deemed
unacceptable for public consumption was complete.
In 1993, the Los Angeles County Museum of Art mounted an exhibition
"Degenerate Art: The Fate of the Avant-Garde in Nazi Germany," examining
the original exhibition. This film chronicles the rise of Hitler, a failed
artist himself, and places the Degenerate Art exhibition in the context of
the Nazi world view, which the artists threatened. It raises important
questions about the power of art and how easy it is to turn something that
is different into something that is wrong.
<<<<
this site is an excellent resource:
http://www.gis.net/~scatt/censor2.html
>>>>
from Stephanie Barron, ed. "Degenerate Art": The Fate of the Avant-Garde in
Nazi Germany (Los Angeles, Los Angeles County Museum of Art / New York,
Harry N. Abrams, 1991)
The Grosse Deutsche Kunstausstellung (Great German Art Exhibition) and
Entartete Kunst (Degenerate art) did not occur as isolated incidents. The
issues raised, the fusion of political and aesthetic themes, and the use of
the term entartet to designate supposedly inferior racial, sexual, and
moral types had been in the air for several years. (Entartet, which has
traditionally been translated as "degenerate" or "decadent" is essentially
a biological term, defining a plant or animal that has so changed that it
no longer belongs to its species. By extension, it refers to art that is
unclassifiable or so far beyond the confines of what is accepted that it is
in essence "non-art.")
<<<<
>>>>
The avant-garde artist was equated to the insane, who in turn was synoymous
with the Jew: the nineteenth century founders of German psychiatry felt
that the Jew was inherently degenerate and more susceptible than the
non-Jew to insanity. As Sander-Gilman has pointed out, the classifications
of "degenerate" and "healthy" appeared for the first time in the late
nineteenth-century; by the late 1930s they were fairly standard in
discussions about the avant-garde and the traditional.
<<<<
"Scan not a friend with a microscopic glass - you know his faults - then
let his foibles pass." Old Victorian proverb.
--
Posted from aardie.aardvark.net.au [203.36.12.10]
tom
Andrew Gray wrote:
> > it's possible that you're more educated than the rest of us "mary jane"
> > -- as if that's your real name, yeah right -- and that the rest of us
> > were not aware that the nazi bastards used the term degenerate artists.
> > also, i do believe the good doctor used the term to describe christian
> > conservative bob anyway.
>
> At the risk of being pedantic, tom, the Nazis used it to describe the
> Jewish *race*, not the religion; Bob may or may not be a conservative
> Christian, but he's still definable as Jewish.
excuse me, but we are talking about his politics and his religion right now.
> > np: lightning jazz, bernstein
>
> /Smartie Mine/, or live? S'not bad, though my album is somewhat
> iffy...
live. the good version.
tom
Patricia Jungwirth wrote:
> tom wrote:
> >>>>
> the rest of us
> were not aware that the nazi bastards used the term degenerate artists.
> <<<<
>
> Anyone who has done even a little reading or history or art studies or
> watched a few documentaries on tv would know that 'Degenerate Art' was the
> title of an exhibition staged by the Nazis, and 'degenerate' was one of
> their favourite euphemisms.
i disagree. with that said, nobody other than the person who started this post
mentioned anything about the connection...which means that those of you
familiar with the term are at fault. still, it's a stretch to connect the whole
thing considering that bob was christian when he became a "degenerate artist"
according to the good doctor's theory, which people aren't even talking about.
this is the problem with this place. dunderheadedness.
tom
Tricia J wrote:
this is weird. i didn't see this guy's post. anyway. every time a
woman posts here? that is kind of knee jerk. women rarely post here.
and when they do, not every post meets a so-called sexist response. the
fact remains that women aren't very serious dylanalogists. there isn't
any, now that i think of it. mostly, women like bob because he's so
cute.
Kenneth Wilson
> Anyone who has done even a little reading or history or art studies or
> watched a few documentaries on tv would know that 'Degenerate Art' was the
> title of an exhibition staged by the Nazis, and 'degenerate' was one of
> their favourite euphemisms.
And it wasn't just works of Jewish or African-influenced visual art they
labeled degenerate either -- the University of Virginia here recently held a
weekend's worth of events devoted to musical work the Nazis suppressed,
including jazz, chamber and opera pieces. The Hawthorne Quartet, drawn from
the Boston Symphony, has released several recording's worth of pieces by
then contemporary composers sent to a camp set up for propaganda purposes.
Many of the artists there eventually ended up in true concentration camps.
(http://www.terezinmusic.org/store/browse.html) London/Decca has also
released several CD's worth of this music, although I couldn't find it on
their web site. I'm no great judge of quality in classical music, but based
on what I heard in concert, I'd venture to say these discs are worth finding
for musical reasons alone.
Ken
Tricia J
>according to the good doctor's theory, which people aren't even talking about.
>this is the problem with this place. dunderheadedness.
>
Why would we want to add anything to the ridiculous theory "posited"
by the "doctor"? So lame. The problem with this place is the amount of
stupid trolls it attracts.
tom
Tricia J wrote:
listen, missy, why don't you say why it's a "ridiculous theory" before calling it
such? is it a little too hard to do so? i imagine it might be for you. are you
saying that bob wasn't so inclined politically during a certain era of his career?
do you not agree that he was a rather disgusting individual? i certainely hope
you do. if you don't, you belong in the same circle of hell that our dear lord
jesus christ has certaintly constructed in the bowels and or circles of hell for
those who would judge certain people because they are different. how dare you.
how dare you make this a mophitical issue to hind behind.
tom
tom wrote:
ok. look. i'm sorry. ok?
i'm very sorry, tricia. i know you're a cute little thing who prefers to look at
fuzzy and cuddly bobby but hey...some of us...some of us who are interested in serious
dylanalogy are interested in analyzing the complete bob dylan -- warts and all. yes,
yes, yes, we know you girls like how he looks and how sexy he is to you when he
wiggles to and fro upon the stage. we understand that. but, you must understand one
thing -- and this goes for the some of the fellas here too -- this is a forum in which
we can discuss bob dylan. and that means all aspects of bob dylan. all sides of
him. you must admit that he has gone through some very very very drastic changes,
nest pas? come on then, don't be such sticks in the mud about it all. listen -- i
know some of you write to rmd with the idea that bob is reading your posts. it's
cute. very cute. but look, even if he did read your posts, which he doesn't, they
would not offend him...no matter what you say. so, come on...don't be so gosh darn
critical of those who are so....uh...can't think of a good word right now...uh...who
are so brazen?....yeah...who are so brazen to criticize some of bob's personae.
hey...look...the guy was a fucking creep in the late seventies and early eighties...we
all know it...right?
raven
many tentacles. The Troll is unfortunately always there.
Dr Nehemiah Anthony
tom <blin...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3AD547D2...@hotmail.com...
Colourful language tom, but therein containeth truth.
Dr Nehemiah Anthony
>
>
Dr Nehemiah Anthony
raven <ra...@verdenet.com> wrote in message
news:3AD54AE7...@verdenet.com...
Such a rebarbative and droolingly american/suburban dismissal of opinions
other than you're own. Tricia J.'s problem is evidently a small brassiere
size. What's yours?
Dr Nehemiah Anthony
John Lettiere
> Jewish *race*, not the religion;
What Jewish race?
They're Semites like all Arabs, same racial stock, If you go by such things?
--
John Lettiere GM
Preferred Computing Inc.
http://perfcomp.homestead.com/Prefcomp.html
You Don't Need A Weatherman To Know Which Way The Wind Blows....Bob Dylan
"Andrew Gray" <shim...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:3ad4ceb9....@news.cableinet.co.uk...
Lloyd Fonvielle
> Such a rebarbative and droolingly american/suburban dismissal of opinions
> other than you're own. Tricia J.'s problem is evidently a small brassiere
> size. What's yours?
Has anyone noticed that trolls are getting more and more sophisticated every
day? They will post an almost serious message, that seems to have required a
little thought, or they will post an almost humorous message, that seems to
come from something resembling goodwill, before opening the virtual overcoat.
Eventually, however, they arrive at the kind of garbage posted above, and
reveal their true nature.
The desperation of it all is truly awesome.
G
the arguments you present (regardless of the content, of which I'm not
inclined to comment on) there's no fucking need to make narrow-minded
sexual-innuendo-laden comments like the one below - surely as a man of some
education, you could keep your mind and your derogatory comments out of the
gutter. Argue with the idea, not the person behind it, ok. G.
"Dr Nehemiah Anthony" <POOLHAL...@HOTMAIL.COM> wrote in message
news:9b3v6s$lv1$1...@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
David O'Brien
--
Posted from mail008.syd.optusnet.com.au [203.2.75.232]
Linn Carpenter
tom wrote:
>
>> this is weird. i didn't see this guy's post. anyway. every time a
> woman posts here? that is kind of knee jerk. women rarely post here.
> and when they do, not every post meets a so-called sexist response. the
> fact remains that women aren't very serious dylanalogists. there isn't
> any, now that i think of it. mostly, women like bob because he's so
> cute.
You know, tom, every time I think I'm starting to see the human side of
you, you revert back into a jackass.
Linn
Howard Mirowitz
Anthony but never see his original posts.
If the real Dr. Anthony is here, could he please send me an e-mail to prove
it?
TIA
H.
"tom" <blin...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3AD47DB3...@hotmail.com...
tom
Linn Carpenter wrote:
yeah? so? like, duh?
Linn Carpenter
pseudo-intellectual who has swallowed a few dictionaries only manages to
come across in this post as a pig. Speaking of degenerates...
Linn
tom
Linn Carpenter wrote:
> Amazing. Dr. N. a/k/a You Know Who trying to come across as a
> pseudo-intellectual who has swallowed a few dictionaries only manages to
> come across in this post as a pig. Speaking of degenerates...
i certainly hope you aren't talking about me, missy. how dare you.
tom
tom wrote:
wait a second. i know. you are so on your period, aren't you?
come on. lighten up. why do some dylan fans have like no sense of humor?
Tricia J
more maturity.
tom
tricia 'she no smell like fisha' jungwirth wrote:
> Why don't some people grow up? Little boys in the school yard display
> more maturity.
http://audio.msk.ru/waits/main.html
http://audio.msk.ru/waits/ra/bone_machine/14.ram
http://tom-waits.spb.ru/concerts/oakland/idontwannagrowup.mp3
When I'm lying in my bed at night
I don't wanna grow up
Nothin' ever seems to turn out right
I don't wanna grow up.
How do you move in a world of fog
That's always changing things
Makes me wish that I could be a dog
When I see the price that you pay
I don't wanna grow up
I don't ever wanna be that way
I don't wanna grow up.
Seems like folks turn into things
That they'd never want
The only thing to live or
Is today...
I'm gonna put a hole in my T.V. set
I don't wanna grow up
Open up the medicine chest
And I don't wanna grow up
I don't wanna have to shout it out
I don't want my hair to fall out
I don't wanna be filled with doubt
I don't wanna be a good boy scout
I don't wanna have to learn to count
I don't wanna have the biggest amount
I don't wanna grow up.
Well when I see my parents fight
I don't wanna grow up
They all go out and drinking all night
And I don't wanna grow up
I'd rather stay here in my room
Nothin'out there but sad and gloom
I don't wanna live in a big old tomb
On Grand Street
When I see the 5 o'clock news
I don't wanna grow up
Comb their hair and shine their shoes
I don't wanna grow up
Stay around in my old hometown
I don't wanna put no money down
I don't wanna get me a big old loan
Work them fingers to the bone
I don't wanna float a broom
Fall in love and get married then boom
How the hell did it get here so soon
I don't wanna grow up
so i guess it's true what they say about women in groups: cycle alignment.
the cursed moon.
chill out, sweetheart.
Linn Carpenter
L.
tom
linn 'rhymes with sin' carpenter wrote:
> Paranoia will destroy ya. ;-)
ok, honeybunch. i really didn't think you thought it was me. i was just making
sure. my love to the don, tell him everyone here at r.m.d. misses him very much.
forever yours,
jack
Michael Corleone
>linn 'rhymes with sin' carpenter wrote:
>
>> Paranoia will destroy ya. ;-)
>
>ok, honeybunch. i really didn't think you thought it was me. i was just
making
>sure. my love to the don, tell him everyone here at r.m.d. misses him very
much.
>
>forever yours,
>jack
>
I know it was you Fredo, I know it was you.
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raven
Tom impersonating Marty in drag.
tom
raven wrote:
> I thought he was Marty in drag, but have since come to the opinion that he is
> Tom impersonating Marty in drag.
oh god. that is sick. and i thought i was twisted. you're still kinky as ever,
norrie. and i like it. i like it a lot, luvvah!
Linn Carpenter
Linn
np: I Don't Believe You -- Live 1966
tom
Linn Carpenter wrote:
> Uh huh.
>
> Linn
>
> np: I Don't Believe You -- Live 1966
girls are so dumb. duh. just look at the page source information, man. that will
tell you that the good doctor resides in england. or is sending his posts from
england. stop being so dumb, linn. first norrie and now you. god. girls are so
dumb.
tom
and hey, what ya doing up so early? you posted this message at 5:17. is don one of
those senior citizens who wakes up really early every day and you got to make wake up
early too to make his breakfast or something? (her husband don who used to post here
but doesn't anymore because of you political assholes who are always talking politics
and being real simpletons about it is like 83...some kind of sugar daddy she found just
like that big blonde girl with the big boobs who bagged that old billionaire dude who
just died)
np: talkin' viagra stew blues, bernstein
tom
tom wrote:
wait. no. sorry about that. the old billionaire dude from texas didn't just die. he
died a couple of years ago. they were just in court fighting about how much of the guy's
money the big dumb blonde should get. that one. do you look anything like that gal,
linn? that would be very cool if you did. it would also be very cool if all the girls
here wrote to r.m.d to tell us their measurements. unlike bob, i really don't care if you
can cook and sew and make flowers grow, but like bob, i like boobies, as do many other guys
here, so come on, gang, how about it?
John Howells
<It's strange. I keep seeing people reply to the famous Dr. Nehemiah
<Anthony but never see his original posts.
Consider yourself fortunate.
--
John Howells
how...@bigfoot.com
http://www.punkhart.com
Chris Slavensky
>
>
> Tricia J wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 11 Apr 2001 13:03:24 -0400, tasso-...@cotse.com wrote:
> >
> > >Take a Midol, honey.
> > >
> >
mostly, women like bob because he's so
> cute.
Chris Slavensky
Chris Slavensky
"tom" <blin...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3AD6EBCF...@hotmail.com...
Linn Carpenter
>
> and hey, what ya doing up so early?
Had to be at work earlier today.
you posted this message at 5:17. is don one of
> those senior citizens who wakes up really early every day and you got to make wake up
> early too to make his breakfast or something? (her husband don who used to post here
> but doesn't anymore because of you political assholes who are always talking politics
> and being real simpletons about it is like 83
Not quite, tommy. He's younger than Bob and can still probably kick
your wussy little butt.
>
> np: talkin' viagra stew blues, bernstein
Playing a little mood music for you and the missus? I would think
during intimate moments with you, your better half would be more likely
to play Sammy Davis' "What Kind of Fool Am I"?
Linn Carpenter
>
> wait. no. sorry about that. the old billionaire dude from texas didn't just die. he
> died a couple of years ago. they were just in court fighting about how much of the guy's
> money the big dumb blonde should get. that one. do you look anything like that gal,
> linn?
No, tom. I look exactly like Catherine Zeta-Jones. As a matter of
fact, Sean Connery practically begged me to be her stand-in during the
filming of Entrapment, but I told him I couldn't spend that much time
away from rmd because I'd lose touch with current events, such as the
pertinent information you just provided.
tom
Linn Carpenter wrote:
she's so on her period
robertandrews
>I know it was you Fredo, I know it was you.
Dylan's been dying of the same heartbreak for 25 years.
I want that plane to Cuba met.