Bach: St John Passion
D Stephen Heersink
there is a lot of redundancy, but the music is so good . . .
Almost all of my recordings are "professionally" done, by which
I mean by big-name SATBs, orchestras, and directors. Because of
someone's strong recommendation a while back of Bach's "St. John
Passion" by the Scholars Baroque Ensemble (on the Naxos label),
purchased it.
My first reaction was, Oh no, how amaturish! As I continued to
listen, however, I discovered this recording sounds like an excellent
church choir. In fact, a perfect church choir!
It didn't take long to draw the inference that Bach wrote much
of his choral music for church choirs, not for secular professionals.
Suddenly, this piece took on added beauty.
I felt like I had heard Bach as Bach would have heard it
performed. Less than stellar or spectacular, more like a church choir
singing to the highest level of their skill.
Truly, beautiful, intimate, and heart-felt--not mechanical,
deliberate, and antiseptic. A truly inspiring experience I've played
over and over.
Stephen Heersink
dsh....@ix.netcom.com
FerrumJeff
>Date: 4 Feb 1995 02:06:51 GMT
>Message-ID: <3gunfr$j...@ixnews2.ix.netcom.com>
>I own recordings and enjoy most of Bach's choral music. Yes,
>there is a lot of redundancy, but the music is so good . . .
>Almost all of my recordings are "professionally" done, by which
>I mean by big-name SATBs, orchestras, and directors. Because of
>someone's strong recommendation a while back of Bach's "St. John
>Passion" by the Scholars Baroque Ensemble (on the Naxos label),
>purchased it.
>My first reaction was, Oh no, how amaturish! As I continued to
>listen, however, I discovered this recording sounds like an excellent
>church choir. In fact, a perfect church choir!
Wish I could share your enthusiasm. I don't have any problem with the
"perfect" church choir. It's the "perfect" church soloists I found
disappointing. Anyone have any alternative recommendations?
Jeff Horn
hatf...@omni.voicenet.com
>>>>
You are assuming that the church choir of Bach's time was similar to the typical church choir of today. Bach was unhappy with some
members of the choirs under his jurisdiction. But if you read the available history it seems they received more musical training than the
average choir member of our times.
Simon Ensanian
hatf...@omni.voicenet.com
James C Liu
> Almost all of my recordings are "professionally" done, by which
>I mean by big-name SATBs, orchestras, and directors. Because of
>someone's strong recommendation a while back of Bach's "St. John
>Passion" by the Scholars Baroque Ensemble (on the Naxos label),
>purchased it.
> My first reaction was, Oh no, how amaturish! As I continued to
>listen, however, I discovered this recording sounds like an excellent
>church choir. In fact, a perfect church choir!
> It didn't take long to draw the inference that Bach wrote much
>of his choral music for church choirs, not for secular professionals.
>Suddenly, this piece took on added beauty.
> I felt like I had heard Bach as Bach would have heard it
>performed. Less than stellar or spectacular, more like a church choir
>singing to the highest level of their skill.
> Truly, beautiful, intimate, and heart-felt--not mechanical,
>deliberate, and antiseptic. A truly inspiring experience I've played
>over and over.
This is something I've tried to get across in my recommendations
on vocal performance. It also makes a big difference in the Renaissance
repertoire, where the difference between a great church choir (e.g.
Westminster Cathedral Choir under David Hill) and a professional
group is the difference between a religious experience and an aesthetic
exercise. It's also much of what I rant and rave about when I tear
into contemporary period-instrument performances (not, of course, that
that's automatically how all period performances sound). I'd love to
hear a St. John sung with true passion (I heard a fine one in DC a
few years back; alas, not on disc), and it might be time to check this
out. Or Corboz, who's another one I've heard good things about.
In many ways, the same virtues apply to Karl Richter's Munich Bach-choir
performances.
--
/James C.S. Liu, MD "Studies have now shown that laboratory
jl...@world.std.com research causes cancer in rats."
Department of Medicine
New England Med Ctr, Boston MA -- from the After Dark screensaver
R. Iain Farquhar
>From: hatf...@omni.voicenet.com
>Subject: Re: Bach: St John Passion
>Date: 6 Feb 1995 02:25:03 GMT
>>Reply to Stephen Heersink comments regarding amateur choirs singing Bach
>>>>>
>You are assuming that the church choir of Bach's time was similar to the typical
>church choir of today. Bach was unhappy with some
>members of the choirs under his jurisdiction.
It was a little more complicated than that. At the end of the 1720's, the St.
Thomas choir school got a new rector named Ernesti. This fellow was a
nascient member of the developing enlightenment it seems, who believed it was
patently unfair that the only boys (other than the rich or nobility) that
could get a good education where those good enough to sing in a church choir.
He started letting boys into the school who had flunked Bach's auditions.
Needless to say, this frosted Bach's butt something terrible! He wrote a long
letter to the church council bitterly complaining of this outrage, and listed
every boy in the choir with his assessment of their talent. Nevertheless, if
you count the boys he considered good singers, he had enough to fill the choir
stalls in the St. Thomas and St Nicolai churches. The Collegiate Church and
the New Church had to make do with those boys barely capable of singing
motets. Bach's cantatas seem only to have been sung in the first two
churches. Bach, being a perfectionist, would have preferred providing high
class music in all the churches he was responsible for, but I'm sure the
church council, being very practical men, merely said "sure -- yeah - yeah" to
Bach's complaints!
>But if you read the available
>history it seems they received more musical training than the
>average choir member of our times.
> Simon Ensanian
> hatf...@omni.voicenet.com
Iain
Ed Zakreski
--
Ed Zakreski
74667...@compuserve.com
Martin Rand
> "perfect" church choir. It's the "perfect" church soloists I found
> disappointing. Anyone have any alternative recommendations?
I have mixed reactions to the soloists. Robin Doveton as Evangelist is OK
by me. Julian Podger seems to be having trouble with breath control at
times (e.g. "Erwaege, wie sein blutgefaerbter Ruecken") which spoils his
phrasing. But then he seems to manage the sustained lines in "Mein Herz,
indem die ganze Welt" all right. Adrian Peacock does seem very weak at
times - "Betrachte, meine Seel'" is utterly nondescript and gives the
impression that he's singing at the floor. Angus Davidson has some
tendency to wobble and to misjudge emphases, but not to the point where
it spoilt my enjoyment.
I am less happy about the instrumentalists when they have to come to real
prominence. Some of the playing seems flat-footed and - well, 'bucolic'
might be a polite term. Kym Amps' performance in "Zerfliesse, mein Herze"
seems very good to me but is undermined by the lack of sensitivity to
phrasing and dynamics in the accompaniment.
I still enjoy this recording and wouldn't want to put off anyone who has
a limited budget. I prefer Kuijken's soloists on the mid-price RCA, but I
actually think Summerley is better in the choruses.
| Martin Rand
| Chandler's Ford, UK
James C Liu
>Who performed the good St. John Passion that you heard in DC a few years ago?
Washington Bach Choir. I forgot soloists and conductor, I'm afraid.
D Stephen Heersink
singing of religious music vis-a-vis (I noted previously Naxos' Saint
John Passion by Bach), I also am reminded of the Tallis Scholars in
their "Live in Rome" recording on the Gimell label.
Absolutely exquisite and etheral singing of Palestrina and
Allegri in the very Church (Saint Mary Major) in which Palestrina sung
400 years ago--totally ruined by applause after every cut!
Don't editors know that CD buyers aren't interested in audience
applause, AND especially applause after every cut. Totally ruins this
otherwise stellar recording.
Stephen Heersink
dsh....@ix.netcom.com
James C Liu
Ethereal perhaps. But for real SOUL I turn to the Westminster Cathedral
Choir under David Hill for my Palestrina. Hyperion has a fine disc with
the Missae Papae Marcelli and Brevis which are unsurpassed to these ears.