Fidelio - Maazel vs. Mackerras vs. Fricsay
Victor Chen
of Fidelio. I am deciding between some of the more theatrical performances
such as Maazel, Mackerras, and Fricsay. However, of these, only Mackerras
comes with a libretto I believe. Since I don't already own a copy of the
libretto, I was wondering if Mackerras would do, or would Maazel/Fricsay
still be better choices (I wonder where I can get a copy of the libretto
then)? A concern with Mackerras is that the forces he used seems a bit
smallish... Also, I am not too sure about Benackova vs Nilsson or Rolfe
Johnson vs McCracken (he is the Florestan in Maazel, yes?). Seems to me
like Benackova might be preferrable to Nilsson (Nilsson sounds a bit... is
rigid or edgy the right word here?) while McCracken is better than Rolfe
Johnson, but I can't tell which combination works better overall.
I've heard excerpts of Fricsay and I must say I love Rysanek's portrayal of
Leonore. The availability of the recording and the orchestral contribution
is a concern though.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Victor
Johannes Roehl
I can comment only on Fricsay's. Get it. The main concern is the sound,
which gives sometimes the impression that the orchestra is in the next
room (it was one of DG's first stereo efforts, I wish they had done it
in mono with fuller sound), but it's quite listenable. The singers are
all very good, Rysanek especially, and so is the conducting. AFAIK it's
on a DG double that includes the libretto and translation.
Johannes
Richard Loeb
dialogue is spoken by a different group of actors. Richard
"Johannes Roehl" <parr...@web.de> wrote in message
news:38eskgF...@individual.net...
Victor Chen
libretto. Good to hear otherwise though.
Victor
Simon Roberts
>
>I'm sure this has been discussed many times... but, I am looking for a copy
>of Fidelio. I am deciding between some of the more theatrical performances
>such as Maazel, Mackerras, and Fricsay. However, of these, only Mackerras
>comes with a libretto I believe. Since I don't already own a copy of the
>libretto, I was wondering if Mackerras would do, or would Maazel/Fricsay
>still be better choices (I wonder where I can get a copy of the libretto
>then)? A concern with Mackerras is that the forces he used seems a bit
>smallish...
They don't *sound* at all small - it may be a chamber orchestra, but they let
rip when required and do so to exciting effect. Orchestrally, this is easily
one of the best Fidelios around; for my money, the best since Karajan's.
Fricsay's orchesra, which is probably just as small, sounds a lot smaller,
partly because of the recorded balance, partly because the orchestra almost
never lets rip - the brass/wind/timpani playing is quite tame, at all times
subservient to the strings; the overall effect is annoyingly dainty in terms of
orchestral sonority (in terms of rhythm, tempo and other matters it's not dainty
at all).
Also, I am not too sure about Benackova vs Nilsson or Rolfe
>Johnson vs McCracken (he is the Florestan in Maazel, yes?). Seems to me
>like Benackova might be preferrable to Nilsson (Nilsson sounds a bit... is
>rigid or edgy the right word here?) while McCracken is better than Rolfe
>Johnson, but I can't tell which combination works better overall.
Benackova and Rolfe-Johnson are sadly past their primes. In R-J's case that
might be thought to be not entirely inappropriate, given the plight of the
character, and he acts the part well enough, but for first-rate vocalism you
have to look elsewhere. I don't like Nilsson (but then I don't like Rysanek
either), but Maazel, the VPO, the recorded sound, and most of the rest of the
cast more than make up for her (and I'm rather atypical in my reaction to her
anyway - then again, "rigid and steely" are two adjectives I would agree on);
the result is one of my favorite recordings of the piece. (Another favorite,
which is also perhaps surprisingly theatrical, and which you don't mention, is
Karajan's, whose only real drawback is the obvious - especially if you listen
via headphones - dubbing-in of Dernesch.)
Simon
jrs...@aol.com
I have the budget double import version of the Fricsay that is listed
at Amazon, for instance: it does not include a libretto.
I believe there was an earlier boxed issue of this recording (on DG
Dokumente?), out of print, that had the libretto.
Maazel partisans (one of his best recordings, but I haven't heard it in
too long) are in a similar situation, I think.
I haven't heard the Klemperer, on Testament, but if that includes a
libretto, go for that instead. It's more expensive, but if it's half as
exciting as his Hungarian Fidelio, and half as well sung as his EMI
Fidelio, it's the dream recording. Check the comments about it on
Amazon and Classicstoday.com
--Jeff
Bob Lombard
"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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[major snip]
(Another favorite,
> which is also perhaps surprisingly theatrical, and which you don't
> mention, is
> Karajan's, whose only real drawback is the obvious - especially if you
> listen
> via headphones - dubbing-in of Dernesch.)
>
My motto (recently formed) is: Prove out via headphones, enjoy via
loudspeakers.
It's amazing how those little nitpicking things that good cans reveal
disappear in loudspeakers' soundstage.
bl
Victor Chen
libretto?
Thanks,
Victor
"Simon Roberts" <sd...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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Richard Loeb
<jrs...@aol.com> wrote in message
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Richard Loeb
"Victor Chen" <pc12RE...@duke.edu> wrote in message
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Jon A Conrad
theatricality, but the use of different actors for the dialogue spoils
any theatrical atmosphere, and I have a Rysanek problem (not just with
this role) -- I feel that although executing the pitches and rhythms the
composer wrote are only a starting point, they're a *necessary* starting
point, and she usually doesn't manage this minimum requirement.
I've always found the Maazel to be a stirring, exciting traversal of the
score. James McCracken doesn't really work out as Florestan, though; his
brand of intense theatricality isn't enough to distract from his
idiosyncratic vocal production in this case. I'm also frequently aware, in
this version, of how much we have to listen to Marzelline, because
Graziella Sciutti's precariousness doesn't make for comfortable listening.
I do like the Mackerras. There's nothing small-scaled about his impact,
he's wonderfully in tune with both music and drama (as he always is), and
much of his cast is excellent. I even enjoy Benackova, though I know
others find her a bit past it here. But (I hate to say it, he's been so
good for so long) Rolfe Johnson does sound aged and wobbly as Florestan. I
don't know if it was wear on the voice, or the part hits him badly (as it
has many another tenor), but it doesn't sound good.
If you can acquire a libretto elsewhere, somehow, my suggestioni would be
one of the cheapest of all: the Naxos. It's really first-rate, very well
conducted, with maybe the best Florestan of any recording (Gosta Winbergh,
sounding fresh, strong, and ardent) and one of the very best Leonores
(Inga Nielsen, whose odd voice fits remarkably well with this odd
writing). It also has Kurt Moll and a generally strong cast. If you're
considering a text-less version anyway (Maazel), this one gives better
value, I think.
Jon Alan Conrad
Department of Music
University of Delaware
con...@udel.edu
david...@aol.com
from the first DGG release of this, the greatest imaginable performance
of Fidelio. My main cavil is that the tenor's voice is on the small
side for Florestan, but Rysanek and Fricsay are incendiary.
-david gable
Richard Loeb
actors for the spoken portions are not only badly matched for the singers
in most cases but they speak in that "mellerdrammer" way that the Germans
loved to do their radio things in the 50s and 60s and that puts a bit of a
crimp in it for me/. But the musical aspects are quite strong. Richard
<david...@aol.com> wrote in message
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Richard Loeb
"Theresa" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
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>I thought Maazel's Fidelio was OOP.
> Has it been re-released?
Victor Chen
and there online.
Victor
Johannes Roehl
> If its on a DG double then I doubt you get a text and translation - also the
> dialogue is spoken by a different group of actors. Richard
You're right, I am sorry for the confusion. I didn't bother to check as
I was certain a few other doubles (e.g. Berlioz faust with Ozawa,
Schubert Lieder/Janowitz) included text/translation so I inferred this
one would, too.
Johannes
Gareth Williams
> If you can acquire a libretto elsewhere, somehow, my suggestion would be
> one of the cheapest of all: the Naxos. It's really first-rate, very well
> conducted, with maybe the best Florestan of any recording (Gosta Winbergh,
> sounding fresh, strong, and ardent) and one of the very best Leonores
> (Inga Nielsen, whose odd voice fits remarkably well with this odd
> writing). It also has Kurt Moll and a generally strong cast.
I couldn't agree more - the Naxos set is a first-rate Fidelio, and has
superseded the lovely (EMI) Klemperer in my affections.
--
Regards,
Gareth Williams
lena_r...@yahoo.com
> from the first DGG release of this, the greatest imaginable
> performance of Fidelio.
I think some of what goes on in Fricsay does in fact have to be
imagined. :) The libretto is available on-line, so I too would choose
on a musical basis. A few comments:
Mackerras: As described by Simon, but with one caveat:
Mackerras's doesn't do the kind of tension one only gets
by fitting phrases together with a long view in mind.
Not primary for everyone, but if "attention span" matters to OP here,
Mackerras can seem close to a dud, merits aside. (A few more
details at http://www.6URL.com/CSA )
Maazel: Exciting at times, but nearly over the top. Like Mackerras,
short on more threatening, sustained tension. Maazel's Act II climax
may seem funny to someone who tends to see hearty dramatic gestures
as comical rather than striking. (Laughing at Act II spoils it.)
(Well, spoils it for the presumably intended purposes. :) )
Fricsay: Downsides as mentioned, but Fricsay (and Rysanek) excel at
what Mackerras etc. do not excel at. Out of the three, I'd get
this.
Lena
Terry Simmons
"Victor Chen" <pc12RE...@duke.edu> wrote:
My choice amongst the three you list is Mackerras. There are other good
recordings, and I recommend the Halasz (Naxos) and Bernstein (DGG) warmly. I've
never really appreciated the much-lauded Fricsay and Klemperer recordings.
--
Cheers!
Terry
Victor Chen
what I've listened to of the Naxos version, I can say that I like the
singers well enough except for Don Fernando, but he only appears in 2 scenes
anyway. However, I didn't get a very good sense of the overall conducting
(other than his relatively swift speeds) from my limited sampling.
As for Bernstein, isn't this another example of a slow Fidelio?
Victor
Richard Loeb
Russ and/or Martha Oppenheim
My cavils are the sound of the reduced orchestra, and primarily that the L
and R channels are reversed thru much of the recording.
I just bought a new copy of the Maazel/VPO. My operatic needs are pretty
modest. If tempos are fast, and the singers in tune, I'm happy.
- Russ (not Martha)
Simon Roberts
>
>How does Halasz's conducting compare with other mentioned conductors? From
>what I've listened to of the Naxos version, I can say that I like the
>singers well enough except for Don Fernando, but he only appears in 2 scenes
>anyway. However, I didn't get a very good sense of the overall conducting
>(other than his relatively swift speeds) from my limited sampling.
Fairly fast and taut, which I like, and tonally lightweight, which I don't. If
you get the chance, compare *his* introduction to Florestan's aria with Maazel
and Mackerras and you'll think you've gone from a monochrome sketch to an oil
painting.
>As for Bernstein, isn't this another example of a slow Fidelio?
Not really; anyway, it's one of the better recordings, especially if you can
tolerate Kollo (his opening note is one of the Great Blots In A Major
Recording).
Simon
jrs...@aol.com
Theresa wrote:
> "Russ and/or Martha Oppenheim" <moppe...@satx.rr.com> wrote:
>
> > I just bought a new copy of the Maazel/VPO. My operatic needs are
pretty
> > modest. If tempos are fast, and the singers in tune, I'm happy.
>
> A highlight LP of this was my first acquaintance with Fidelio more
> than 25 years ago and I would like very much to hear it again.
I see that Amazon lists it--new and used copies; I'll bet Tower does as
well.
--Jeff
Richard Loeb
>> modest. If tempos are fast, and the singers in tune, I'm happy.
>
Larry Rinkel
I agree the Naxos is very good, but it comes with a libretto only in German.
However, bookstores usually stock a set of books+CDs called the Black Dog
Opera Library, which always include a complete libretto and in this case the
Naxos Fidelio performance. It's available from Edward R. Hamilton if you
can't find a copy otherwise:
http://www.edwardrhamilton.com/titles/4/1/9/4192656.html