WHYBL? May/June 2006
Matthew B. Tepper
brand-new recordings.
I bought the new CD of John Foulds orchestral music on Warner Classics,
Sakari Oramo/City of Birmingham SO with Peter Donahoe, piano, in "Dynamic
Triptych." Listened only once so far, but this looks like another keeper
following Oramo's initial Foulds disc.
Two newish CDs I bought just yesterday, but don't know when I'll have time
to listen to them:
Brahms Ballades, Rhapsodies, and Paganini Variations, Nicholas Angelich, on
Virgin.
Mendelssohn "MSND" Overture and Sym. #2 "Lobgesang," Chailly/Gewandhaus, on
Decca. Ironically, since this was his inaugural concert as Music Director
of the Leipzig ensemble, I've already heard and enjoyed the Brahms Piano
Concerti with Nelson Freire.
And next Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert Craft's
recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-Schoenberg
Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of the stereo era
on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least expected ever to see
on CD. (Well, this and all of those Ives recordings. HINT HINT!)
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
I ask you to judge me by the enemies I have made. ~ FDR (attrib.)
MIFrost
much. I also have Podger, Tetslaff (sp), Grumiaux and Hahn. All are
fine. And Kremer is about as good as it gets. Much of what I've been
listening to has been library CDs I've burned. These include a 6-disc
collection of Rachmaninoff with Ashkenazy and Previn. It includes the
2nd and 3rd Concerti, the Variations on a Theme of Paganini and various
piano pieces. They are all, to these ears, outstanding. He's a bit
slower, tempo-wise, than my other concerto recording, but the orchestra
is a full participant and refuses to play "background" to a domineering
pianist. It combines to give the works a beautiful total sound. Very
full, rich and powerful.
MIFrost
alanwa...@aol.com
Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
> This is for Nick Sun, who seemed concerned that I wasn't buying very many
> brand-new recordings.
>
> I bought the new CD of John Foulds orchestral music on Warner Classics,
> Sakari Oramo/City of Birmingham SO with Peter Donahoe, piano, in "Dynamic
> Triptych." Listened only once so far, but this looks like another keeper
> following Oramo's initial Foulds disc.
>
> Two newish CDs I bought just yesterday, but don't know when I'll have time
> to listen to them:
>
> Brahms Ballades, Rhapsodies, and Paganini Variations, Nicholas Angelich, on
> Virgin.
>
> Mendelssohn "MSND" Overture and Sym. #2 "Lobgesang," Chailly/Gewandhaus, on
> Decca. Ironically, since this was his inaugural concert as Music Director
> of the Leipzig ensemble, I've already heard and enjoyed the Brahms Piano
> Concerti with Nelson Freire.
>
> And next Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert Craft's
> recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-Schoenberg
> Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of the stereo era
> on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least expected ever to see
> on CD. (Well, this and all of those Ives recordings. HINT HINT!)
>
> --
> Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
Probably not new issues but new to me.
A marvellous issue in tribute to the Norwegian composer Ole Bull known,
if for anything, for the trifle A Herdgirls Sunday. There is more to
him than that on Simax PSC 1261 although it is in a similar lighter
style but I am glad to hear it.
The best recording of the most thrilling performance of Brahms Symphony
No 2 I have ever heard - Furtwangler 1945 Vienna Philharmonic - on
Societe Wilhelm Furtwangler SWF 902.
Allegro Con Spirito Movement IV? You have to got to be joking. It is
in Orbit, not with Spirit.
The last movement of that performance contains some of the greatest
orchestral playing I have ever heard on a recording and at last it has
got a properly balanced recording as it deserves. Magnificent transfer
supervised by Sami Habra - the last recording Furtwangler made before
going into exile in Switzerland.
All the distortion and silly balances of the original issues and
pirates of the original issues gone for ever! In the closing measures
how the hell do the orchestra keep up - but they do, all of them. And
Lord knows what was going on with the stick waving bit.
Vive la Societe Wilhelm Furtwangler!
Victor Silvester's Jive Band (1943-1945) on Harlequin CD 176 as a
memory of one of my great teachers (Ben Edwards) strutting his stuff as
they say in the business.
Brilliant out of time signature stuff by a brilliant player and always
exactly back in. And what a band.
Billy Munn on piano, Tommy McQuater on trumpet and George Chishlom on
'bone.
Does Mr Ansermetniac know of Mr Chisholm on Bone?
Kind regards,
Alan M. Watkins
Vaneyes
Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
> This is for Nick Sun, who seemed concerned that I wasn't buying very many
I'm not, either. The one fairly recent recording I wanted to try, soon
popped up as a previously-enjoyed, at my truly independent brick 'n
mortar.
Something old, something new:
Dvorak - Piano Concerto, Golden Spinning Wheel - Aimard/ACO/Harnoncourt
(Teldec)
Bruckner - Sym. 5 - MunichPO/Thielemann (DG)
Saint-Saens Clo Cto 1, Lalo Clo Cto D minor, Faure Elegie -
Gastinel/Lyon/Krivine (naive)
Miaskovsky - String Quartets 3, 10, 13 - Leningrad Taneyev Quartet
(Melodiya)
Scriabin - Sym. 2, "Poem" - USSRSO/Svetlanov (Regis)
Enescu - Orchestral Suites 1 & 2 - MonteCarloPO/Foster (Erato)
For me, Aimard does more for the Dvorak PC than others did (some more
famous), so it'll stick around for a while. The coupled "GSW" is no
revelation...still preferring Neumann for that.
This Thielemann rec perked my ears quickly. For a longish 5, no waning
interest. Of course, for this band it was a short drive compared to
Celi's steering.
An artist that's pleasing these days more often than not, is Gastinel.
Add her to a rapidly growing French list that includes the likes of
Aimard, Boffard, Bertrand, Le Sage, Guy.
I'd not heard Taneyev's Miaskovsky. Brilliant. Hopefully, soon, someone
will get more of a grip on expired Melodiya items.
Good Svetlanov account of Scriabin Sym. 2, though this work still lacks
for me beyond movement one.
Enescu Orchestral Suites are new for me. Delightful. I'll be seeking
the remainder. Monte Carlo's guided nicely by Foster.
Regards
Matthew Silverstein
Mahler 9 - Maderna (BBC)
Mozart Clarinet Quintet - Hagen +Brunner
Mozart Divertimenti and Serenades - Koopman
Liszt Piano Concerti - Richter (Philips)
Shostakovich Cello Concerto No. 1 - Chang (EMI)
Bloch Violin Sonatas - Shaham/Erez (Hyperion)
Mozart Horn Concerti - Bruns/Fey (Profil)
Ravel Trio - Rubinstein/Heifetz/Piatigorsky (RCA)
Matty
dg
wrote:
>This is for Nick Sun, who seemed concerned that I wasn't buying very many
>brand-new recordings.
>
>I bought the new CD of John Foulds orchestral music on Warner Classics,
>Sakari Oramo/City of Birmingham SO with Peter Donahoe, piano, in "Dynamic
>Triptych." Listened only once so far, but this looks like another keeper
>following Oramo's initial Foulds disc.
>
>Two newish CDs I bought just yesterday, but don't know when I'll have time
>to listen to them:
>
>Brahms Ballades, Rhapsodies, and Paganini Variations, Nicholas Angelich, on
>Virgin.
>
>Mendelssohn "MSND" Overture and Sym. #2 "Lobgesang," Chailly/Gewandhaus, on
>Decca. Ironically, since this was his inaugural concert as Music Director
>of the Leipzig ensemble, I've already heard and enjoyed the Brahms Piano
>Concerti with Nelson Freire.
>
>And next Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert Craft's
>recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-Schoenberg
>Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of the stereo era
>on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least expected ever to see
>on CD. (Well, this and all of those Ives recordings. HINT HINT!)
I have spent more time browsing than actually shopping lately,
particularly at things like the Edwin Fischer set on M&A, the
new Sorabji Transcendentals with Frederik Ullen, and the Fabiana
Biasini disc of J. Hofmann works. Another Edition Hera cd that
sparked my interest was Iveta Apkalna's album "HIMMEL & HÖLLE" which
features both Liszt Legends transcribed for organ.
One thing I have bought was a EMI GROC reissue of the Hotter/Moore
Winterreise. I only listened to part of it yesterday and still
prefer my LP of the 48' D. F-D,Billing version, but it was either
this or the new Bostridge/Andsnes recording and I opted for the
former.
Allan Rogg
Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
>
> And next Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert Craft's
> recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-Schoenberg
> Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of the stereo era
> on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least expected ever to see
> on CD. (Well, this and all of those Ives recordings. HINT HINT!)
>
> --
Allan Rogg
Steven de Mena
"Allan Rogg" <ar...@payroll.nyc.gov> wrote in message
news:1149168019....@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
They released Scott Joplin on the harpsichord played by E. Power Biggs, so
anything is possible.
Steve
J. R. Robinson
Gidon Kremer [ECM]
These are forceful, trenchant, highly wrought performances of
unflagging focus & concentration -- "relaxed" is not a word that
comes to mind when listening to these performances. Even the most
lyrical and "relaxed" music is played with teeth ever so slightly
clenched.
Kremer plays a potent Guarneri del Gesů, the "Ex-David" from 1730,
which has much oomph and authority. He employs little vibrato and
produces an unsweetened grayish tone with a slightly plaintive
character. Consequently, when he varies his tone for expressive
purposes -- which he does liberally and often -- the expression is
austerely cast in shades of gray. His tone is fairly full and rich
considering the sparing use of vibrato, becoming unapologetically
raw and gruff in some of the grueling double- and triple-stopping.
Most tempos fall within Kremer's temporal sweet spot, sounding
neither too fast nor too slow in the context of his post-HIP/pre-
postmodern revisionist approach to the works. The tempos that fall
outside of his sweet spot are mostly those of slow movements that
are played too slowly, with the Sarabande & Double of Partita I,
the Andante of Sonata II, and the Loure of Partita III being the
most conspicuous of them.
Kremer is willing to sacrifice surface elegance -- tone quality,
lyrical flow, dynamic continuity, etc. -- for expressive purposes,
and he tends to express himself through strings of bold declarative
statements rather than through homogenized smooth-flowing prose.
His penchant for bold declarative statements does not, however,
mean that he bulldozes the music's finer points; on the contrary,
his performances are abuzz with all manner of crafty and insidious
little goings-on. His phrasing of lyrical passages is elegant and
unindulgent but never smoothed over, and there's always a just-
palpable sense of the rhythm underlying even the most flowing of
melodies.
Contrasts tend to be strong, even stark, with Kremer not afraid to
juxtapose soft and loud, gossamer and coarse, gentle and harsh. I
sometimes find myself wishing that Kremer was afraid, at least a
little bit, as many of the dynamic contrasts strike me as
exaggerated and arbitrary. I'm sure there's a method to his
dynamic madness, but I for one can't always divine it. Transitions
tend to be abrupt and efficient (though elegantly abrupt and
efficient) rather than suave and seamlessly negotiated. Consequent
to all these stark contrasts and undisguised transitions,
individual phrases/passages/etcetera tend to be clearly
differentiated, and the boundaries between them clearly delineated.
As a result, some movements have a curious sectionalized, almost
modular, feel about them.
Kremer brings great rhythmic trenchancy and precision to the
fugues, allowing enough rhythmic flexibility to ward off any sense
of stiffness but ensuring that rhythms snap smartly back into time
to match and maintain the regular and steadily advancing pulse of
his music-making. As a result of all this temporal discipline,
harmonies, whether they be stated or implied, have an uncommonly
straight, vertically stacked feel about them -- it's all very
punctus contra punctum if you ask me. The fugues, of course,
demand a balanced and coordinated approach to the weighting of
voices just to let all the voices be heard (or inferred, in the
case of implied voices), let alone be discernable and
complementary. This challenge gives Kremer's playing a sense of
dynamic purpose that keeps his dynamic madness in check, and he
does and excellent job of weighting and balancing the voices in the
context of his doughty fuguing. He also gives each voice more
individual character than is common (through accents and whatnot),
making voices that much easier to pick out. Given all that, it
will come as no surprise that Kremer's fugues sound profoundly
fuguish.
Elsewhere, rhythmic playing varies from moderately flexible and
resilient to trenchant and severe, with the more "rhythmic" and/or
"harmonic" movements tending toward the latter and the more
"lyrical" movements tending toward the former -- though that's just
a tendency and not a rule. His rhythmic drive imparts a strong
sense of continuous forward motion to the faster movements, but not
much in the way of sweep, I'd say -- things move along a bit too
regularly and steadily for that. There's a gentle sense of ebb &
flow to many of the lyrical movements, however.
The performances of the three Sonatas offer grave, searching,
opening movements; manly, ripsnorting fugues (particularly that of
the Third Sonata, the highlight of the set); and unprettified yet
beautiful slow movements. Kremer's bold dynamic contrasts stand
out even more than usual in the context of the relatively regular,
repetitious, perpetually moving final movements, and the contrasts
often sound more over-the-top and arbitrary than expressive. Parts
of the First Partita suffer in much the same way.
Kremer takes on the Chaconne with clenched teeth, meting out a good
deal more punishment than he receives as he runs the gauntlet of
variations. He maintains great intensity throughout the piece, and
he strongly characterizes each variation, but the sectionalized
nature of his playing does not allow for anything like the kind of
cumulative dramatic buildup that I happen to crave. Still, the
sheer quantity and quality of unique and curious insights make this
a Chaconne to be reckoned with.
His account of the Third Partita's Preludio is brilliant in an
earnest and plaintive sort of way, but it suffers a bit from
exaggerated dynamic contrasts. The dances feature some delicately
trenchant, rhythmically savvy playing, though, again, Kremer's
earnestness and plaintive tone seem a bit at odds with the
relatively jubilant spirit of the work. I'm not much for
"jubilant," however, so I derive a perverse kind of enjoyment and
satisfaction from his subtly audacious take on the dances.
My response to this set varies wildly with every listen: what
sounds fresh and bold one listen, sounds exaggerated and
overwrought and even arbitrary the next. I haven't heard any other
performances of the Sonatas & Partitas even remotely like these, so
I didn't bother with comparisons. The recorded sound is excellent
in all respects.
J. R. Robinson
Denver, Colorado
Vaneyes
J. R. Robinson wrote:
> J. S. Bach: Sonatas & Partitas for violin solo
> Gidon Kremer [ECM]
>
> These are forceful, trenchant, highly wrought performances of
> unflagging focus & concentration -- "relaxed" is not a word that
> sometimes find myself wishing that Kremer was afraid, at least a
> little bit, as many of the dynamic contrasts strike me as
> exaggerated and arbitrary. I'm sure there's a method to his
> to this set varies wildly with every listen: what
> sounds fresh and bold one listen, sounds exaggerated and
> overwrought and even arbitrary the next. I haven't heard any other
> performances of the Sonatas & Partitas even remotely like these, so
> I didn't bother with comparisons. The recorded sound is excellent
> in all respects.
Thanks! Yet another opinion that makes me want this. I'll get around to
it one of these days.
It's the enigma, I guess, that's the attraction. I've had a few sets
that didn't strike enough right chords for me. Frequent mind-wandering.
I don't see that happening with this.
FYI, in January, I posted a 2002 Andante interview with Kremer, as
these "basement performances" were being edited. A glimpse into method
for madness?
It hadta be a very relaxed and satisfying experience for him. After
reflecting on the work for some time, he just let it fly, with no buyer
in mind.
http://www.andante.com/article/article.cfm?id=17119&highlight=1&highl...
Regards
Matthew B. Tepper
following letters to be typed in
news:xa6dnUxsjrLqveLZ...@comcast.com:
> "Allan Rogg" <ar...@payroll.nyc.gov> wrote in message
> news:1149168019....@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> Matthew B. Tepper wrote:
>>>
>>> And next Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert
>>> Craft's recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-
>>> Schoenberg Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of
>>> the stereo era on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least
>>> expected ever to see on CD. (Well, this and all of those Ives
>>> recordings. HINT HINT!)
>>
>> You thought they'd release the Kostelanetz Hovhaness recordings first?
>
> They released Scott Joplin on the harpsichord played by E. Power Biggs,
> so anything is possible.
Well, yes, "released" it completely unheralded and unpromoted on an obscure
sub-label, which is technically better than not releasing it at all.
david...@aol.com
CROSSING THE CHANNEL: British and French Painting in the Age of
Romanticism
(Tate/Met exhibition catalogue)
COROT (Met exhibition catalogue)
John House: IMPRESSIONISM: Paint and Politics (Yale U Press)
Joachim Pissarro: PIONEERING MODERN PAINTING: Cezanne & Pissarro
1865-1885
(MoMA exhibition catalogue)
"Crossing the Channel" was remaindered at the Met, but "Corot" is out
of print and cost me a small fortune. Now I'm too broke to buy any
CD's. The first one I do buy will probably be Maderna and the BBC SO
performing Mahler's 9th.
(For the record, the price of out of print exhibition catalogues
suddenly seems to be soaring. I used to pick up out of print
catalogues at a little below the original price. Now paperback copies
of, for example, "Corot in Italy," a MoMA exhibition catalogue
edited by Peter Galassi, are listed at Amazon and Alibris starting
around $350, hardback copies starting around $400.)
-david gable
david...@aol.com
Mr. Tepper scripsit:
> [N]ext Tuesday, I'm buying that long-awaited reissue of Robert Craft's
> recording with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra of the Brahms-Schoenberg
> Piano Quartet in G Minor. Of all the obscure treasures of the stereo era
> on Columbia, this must surely be one of those I least expected ever to see
> on CD.
Where is this available? And what's the coupling? Something from the
first Schoenberg box is probably too much to hope for.
-david gable
david...@aol.com
the favorable buzz around here!
-david gable
Matthew Silverstein
> I'm not normally Mr. Kremer's biggest fan, but this set sure is getting
> the favorable buzz around here!
This may dampen your enthusiasm a bit: I quite like it as well.
Matty
david...@aol.com
Matthew Silverstein wrote:
> This may dampen your enthusiasm a bit: I quite like it as well.
Not necessarily. Besides everybody is characterizing that set as
somewhat unlike the usual Kremer.
-david gable
Simon Roberts
david...@aol.com says...
>
>I'm not normally Mr. Kremer's biggest fan
I'm not either, but J.R.'s superb review explains in part why I was so bowled
over by this recording. I don't think I would ever have guessed the violinist
had I heard it "blind."
Simon
Matthew B. Tepper
following letters to be typed in news:1149195703.908154.252450
@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000F6YW2G
Lena
> J. S. Bach: Sonatas & Partitas for violin solo
> Gidon Kremer [ECM]
>
Again, an excellent specimen of a review.
> Consequent
> to all these stark contrasts and undisguised transitions,
> individual phrases/passages/etcetera tend to be clearly
> differentiated, and the boundaries between them clearly delineated.
> As a result, some movements have a curious sectionalized, almost
> modular, feel about them. [...]
Which? The Chaconne in particular?
> His rhythmic drive imparts a strong
> sense of continuous forward motion to the faster movements, but not
> much in the way of sweep, I'd say -- things move along a bit too
> regularly and steadily for that.
That's maybe a bit disappointing (although much applause to reviewer
for being helpful and differentiating between overall shaping and
momentum).
> Kremer takes on the Chaconne with clenched teeth, meting out a good
> deal more punishment than he receives as he runs the gauntlet of
> variations. He maintains great intensity throughout the piece, and
> he strongly characterizes each variation, but the sectionalized
> nature of his playing does not allow for anything like the kind of
> cumulative dramatic buildup that I happen to crave.
That's interesting. Also, disappointing (since I too want dramatic
buildups observed here). Unique and curious insights can be had
anywhere...
> Still, the
> sheer quantity and quality of unique and curious insights make this
> a Chaconne to be reckoned with.
>
> His account of the Third Partita's Preludio is brilliant in an
> earnest and plaintive sort of way, but it suffers a bit from
> exaggerated dynamic contrasts. The dances feature some delicately
> trenchant, rhythmically savvy playing, though, again, Kremer's
> earnestness and plaintive tone seem a bit at odds with the
> relatively jubilant spirit of the work. I'm not much for
> "jubilant," however, so I derive a perverse kind of enjoyment and
> satisfaction from his subtly audacious take on the dances.
(laugh) OK.
> My response to this set varies wildly with every listen: what
> sounds fresh and bold one listen, sounds exaggerated and
> overwrought and even arbitrary the next.
Ouch; potentially. But thanks very much for this report.
Lena
J. R. Robinson
> Thanks! Yet another opinion that makes me want this. I'll get
> around to it one of these days.
>
> It's the enigma, I guess, that's the attraction. I've had a few
> sets that didn't strike enough right chords for me. Frequent
> mind-wandering. I don't see that happening with this.
>
> FYI, in January, I posted a 2002 Andante interview with Kremer,
> as these "basement performances" were being edited. A glimpse
> into method for madness?
>
> It hadta be a very relaxed and satisfying experience for him.
> After reflecting on the work for some time, he just let it fly,
> with no buyer in mind.
>
> http://www.andante.com/article/article.cfm?id=17119&highlight=1&h
> ighl...
Kremer is much more down to earth in the Andante interview than he
is in his rather transcendental program notes. If I understand his
notes rightly (and it's not at all certain that I do), Kremer did
his best to divorce himself from his instrument and reconsider the
works as music in the abstract rather than as violin music in order
to rid his interpretations of violin-based biases and "get closer
to Bach and his universe." This would seem to explain his rather
unviolinist-like willingness to sacrifice, when necessary, tone
quality, lyrical flow, dynamic continuity, etc., for expressive
purposes -- or so I hear it.
In any event, Kremer's performances are as thought-provoking and
just plain provocative as you're likely to encounter -- you may or
may not like them (I still don't know quite what to think of them
myself), but you'll certainly never mistake them for performances
by Szeryng.
J. R. Robinson
>> J. S. Bach: Sonatas & Partitas for violin solo
>> Gidon Kremer [ECM]
>
>> Consequent to all these stark contrasts and undisguised
>> transitions, individual phrases/passages/etcetera tend to be
>> clearly differentiated, and the boundaries between them clearly
>> delineated. As a result, some movements have a curious
>> sectionalized, almost modular, feel about them. [...]
>
> Which? The Chaconne in particular?
The Chaconne, yes, but also (to varying degrees of conspicuousness)
the Allemandes and Sarabandes of Partitas I & II, the Siciliana of
Sonata I, the Largo of Sonata III, and other movements in the
Partitas, but I forget which ones off the top of my head. It
bothers me in the Chaconne because I blame it for thwarting
dramatic buildup; it's just a bit tedious in the Allemandes and the
Sarabandes, but I don't mind it (yet) in the Siciliana and the
Largo. (It's my experience that sectionalized playing doesn't wear
well over the long run.) Some of the sectionalized feel is simply
the result of Kremer actually pausing at almost-pauses, and in the
Allemandes he adds some new pauses mid-measure à la Carl Flesch.
david...@aol.com
J. R. Robinson reports some of Kremer's "thoughts."
>If I understand his
> notes rightly (and it's not at all certain that I do), Kremer did
> his best to divorce himself from his instrument
???????????????? What does he do? Play the pieces on the piano?
>and reconsider the
> works as music in the abstract rather than as violin music in order
> to rid his interpretations of violin-based biases and "get closer
> to Bach and his universe."
This strikes me as cosmic baloney. Not that performers are obliged to
say anything interesting, reliable, intelligent, intelligible, or
persuasive in order to be interesting when they play their instruments.
But if I read any more, it may prejudice me against his performances.
(The other side of that coin would be convincing yourself that what he
says IS intelligible and that you can hear it in his performances.)
>you'll certainly never mistake them for performances
> by Szeryng.
I hope Kremer's goal was more than merely sounding different or
unprecedented. (I rather like both of Szeryng's recordings.)
-david gable
MrT
I't sensational. I wouldn't have bought it had it not been for Simon's
original alert here. A few days later, I popped into the FNAC in
Barcelona and there it was, well displayed, so I popped for it. It now
shares honors with the DG Milstein and Bylsma's first recording. Unlike
others here, I have always liked Kremer, alone or in company. In these
Bach recordings, he sounds a bit different, but just as musical.So far,
it's the best classical disk I've bought this year.
Best,
MrT
MrT
favorite set of the solo cello pieces...
Best,
MrT
Lena
> Lena wrote:
>
> >> J. S. Bach: Sonatas & Partitas for violin solo
> >> Gidon Kremer [ECM]
> >
> >> Consequent to all these stark contrasts and undisguised
> >> transitions, individual phrases/passages/etcetera tend to be
> >> clearly differentiated, and the boundaries between them clearly
> >> delineated. As a result, some movements have a curious
> >> sectionalized, almost modular, feel about them. [...]
> >
> > Which? The Chaconne in particular?
>
> The Chaconne, yes, but also (to varying degrees of conspicuousness)
> the Allemandes and Sarabandes of Partitas I & II, the Siciliana of
> Sonata I, the Largo of Sonata III, and other movements in the
> Partitas, but I forget which ones off the top of my head.
Thanks.
> It bothers me in the Chaconne because I blame it for thwarting
> dramatic buildup; it's just a bit tedious in the Allemandes and the
> Sarabandes, but I don't mind it (yet) in the Siciliana and the
> Largo. (It's my experience that sectionalized playing doesn't wear
> well over the long run.)
I agree. Except of course when the listener too becomes sectionalized
over the long run. (Read: occasionally, there are detail-obsessed
listening phases...)
> Some of the sectionalized feel is simply
> the result of Kremer actually pausing at almost-pauses, and in the
> Allemandes he adds some new pauses mid-measure à la Carl Flesch.
>
(laugh)
Lena
A. Brain
should have been labeled an "OT" thread about "Dubya"
has evolved into some abstruse argument about how
many angels can dance on the head of a pin--and has
not been relabelled. (See above, where I relabel
as "Ameling etc." so that anyone who might care to read
about her, but may not care what I have bought lately,
can choose to read this post. And where others have
complained about OT threads "wasting time", surely
they do not waste as much time as threads where
something other than the "on topic" or "off topic"
is being discussed.)
Anyway, today at my local truly independent store,
it was a choice between the Elly Ameling box set
on Phillips (probably not including texts) and two
"Pentatone" CDs of Ameling--Schubert/Schumann
and Mozart/Schubert.
The Pentatones have song texts. And at SACD
prices, they should, but I suppose someone
might contend that the SACD alone justifies
the premium prices.
Flipping through "Third Ear" guide, I notice
that it mentions some EMI recordings of
Ameling that supposedly have never made
it to CD. One hopes to see these on "Gemini".
I think I had or have one or two on EMI
'Electrola" LPS somewhere around here.
--
A. Brain
Remove NOSPAM for email.
JohnGavin
> Anyway, today at my local truly independent store,
> it was a choice between the Elly Ameling box set
> on Phillips (probably not including texts) and two
> "Pentatone" CDs of Ameling--Schubert/Schumann
> and Mozart/Schubert.
>
> The Pentatones have song texts. And at SACD
> prices, they should, but I suppose someone
> might contend that the SACD alone justifies
> the premium prices.
>
all means. Her singing is perfection. That was the first Ameling
recording I ever heard, and it turned me into a lifelong fan.
She did a series of mixed recital disks for Phillips (one called
Serenata, another one of French songs) around the early 80s - they are
quite nice, but for many of recordings of that time, she was a bit past
her prime. Elly Ameling's best years were around 1965 - 1977.
tomdeacon
JohnGavin wrote:
> She did a series of mixed recital disks for Phillips (one called
> Serenata, another one of French songs) around the early 80s - they are
> quite nice, but for many of recordings of that time, she was a bit past
> her prime. Elly Ameling's best years were around 1965 - 1977.
I know you didn't intend the comparison, John. But the same thing could
be said about Chevrolets, although personally I preferred the 1956-1970
period. Pre catalytic converters, you know.
Ameling's finest performance on record remains the Shepherd on the Rock
with Demus on a fortepiano. I think it was on a BASF LP, perhaps DHM
CD?
TD
dr...@andadv.com
tomdeacon wrote:
> Ameling's finest performance on record remains the Shepherd on the Rock
> with Demus on a fortepiano. >
Good lord, Tom. Here's something musical that we ABSOLUTELY AGREE ON.
(How did that happen? ;-D) In fact, I mentioned her Shepherd on the
Rock in a thread elsewhere not two days ago, and the version she did
with Demus is my favorite.
Ameling's voice in her younger years was, to my ears, absolute purity.
Back in the late '70s or early '80s, when I first heard it, this
recital LP (my copy may have been a BASF, but from a German Harmonia
Mundi original IIRC; oddly enough, I think this and her Bach Anna
Magdalena Notebook recording were also available on RCA Victrola
editions for a while) singlehandedly made me begin listening to
classical singers, whereas I had previously been known to run screaming
from the room whenever anything operatic or lieder-like was placed upon
the turntable.
What a sweetly glorious voice she had!
Dirk
JohnGavin
Certainly, the Shepherd on the Rock is sublime, but there are many
other Ameling recordings that are absolutely on the same level. One
such example is the Schubert song Nacht und Traume - which must be very
difficult to pull off vocally - long sustained notes, Elly Ameling
sings it to absolute perfection. One of those instances of the
complete merging of composer and performer, but there are so many other
examples. That early recital of Mozart Songs with Demus is right up
there at the top.
Paul Goldstein
dr...@andadv.com says...
Both the Schubert recital with Demus and the Anna Magdalena LP were issued by
RCA in its Victrola LP line. The Bach also appeared on Quintessence (LP and
cassette). In the CD era, both appeared in the "Editio Classica" line
double-branded by RCA and DHM. The catalog number of the Schubert is
77085-2-RG. I don't have the Bach on CD.
The Schubert recital is sublime because of Ameling (and Deinzer's clarinet in
Der Hirt auf dem Felsen is very good too), but you have to come to grips with
Demus' unfailingly clumsy playing to appreciate it. Demus almost sounds as bad
on this CD as Clifford Curzon always does in Schubert.
Steve Emerson
<u%7kg.189257$Fs1.1...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,
"A. Brain" <abr...@NOSPAMatt.net> wrote:
There's some Ameling in an EMI box set of Debussy -- Mélodies. That's in
print. Unfortunately the performances of Ariettes oubliées and Trois
chansons de Bilitis are not Ameling's. Those were done to magnificent
effect by Ameling with Dalton Baldwin in a CBS Masterworks LP of 1980,
c/w the Fauré La bonne chanson -- recordings licensed by CBS from Klaas
Posthuma Productions of The Netherlands.
Notes by Ned Rorem quoting the following from Fauré. "Never speak to me
of Debussy. I don't want to know there is a Debussy. If I like Debussy I
can no longer like Fauré. How can I then be Fauré?"
Since the rest of us never stood a chance of being Fauré, I guess we can
like them both with impunity.
Don't know the CD history if any of these sublime recordings.
SE.
JohnGavin
Beside that French Album on Columbia, Elly Ameling recorded an LP for
them entitled "Souveniers" and a Christmas Album. Unfortunately none
of those made it to CD.
david...@aol.com
Steve Emerson wrote various things about Ameling's Debussy recordings.
Steve, I don't know the recordings in question, but I'm surprised that
you have anything good to say about Dalton Baldwin. Do you generally
like him or is that he's in his element with Debussy? His presence on
so many Schubert recordings with Ameling is a major disincentive for
me.
-david gable
JJ
@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:
Some of the Schubert EMI recordings were used as filler on the Andre
Previn Mahler 4. But most have not been reissued (I remember an Odeon
LP) - too bad as they are some of Ameling's most glorious performances.
"The Art of Elly Ameling", a box which Philips released the other year,
is good, but irritatingly does not include some wonderful items,
particularly her LP entitled "German Romantic Songs", a desert island
disc for me, which has never been issued on CD, AFAIK. The
Schubert/Schumann lied with Demus on fortepiano I've never enjoyed as
much as I'd hoped to. It's certainly not helped by a terrible acoustic.
I tend to like her singing best in the 70s. At that point, the voice
had acquired greater richness and depth (her earlier records are a shade
too clean and pure for my taste).
Jon
Lena
[...]
>
> There's some Ameling in an EMI box set of Debussy -- Mélodies. That's in
> print. Unfortunately the performances of Ariettes oubliées and Trois
> chansons de Bilitis are not Ameling's.
OTOH, they're not that bad... That box is well worth getting, since
Debussy himself is good - unless everything absolutely has to be by
Ameling.
> Those were done to magnificent
> effect by Ameling with Dalton Baldwin in a CBS Masterworks LP of 1980,
> c/w the Fauré La bonne chanson -- recordings licensed by CBS from Klaas
> Posthuma Productions of The Netherlands.
>
> Notes by Ned Rorem quoting the following from Fauré. "Never speak to me
> of Debussy. I don't want to know there is a Debussy. If I like Debussy I
> can no longer like Fauré. How can I then be Fauré?"
I only see that as an insurmountable problem if liking Debussy turns
him into... let's say, randomly, Gregory Peck.
Lena
Matthew B. Tepper
be typed in news:1150482812....@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:
> Steve Emerson wrote:
>
> [...]
>>
>> There's some Ameling in an EMI box set of Debussy -- Mélodies. That's in
>> print. Unfortunately the performances of Ariettes oubliées and Trois
>> chansons de Bilitis are not Ameling's.
>
> OTOH, they're not that bad... That box is well worth getting, since
> Debussy himself is good - unless everything absolutely has to be by
> Ameling.
>
>> Those were done to magnificent effect by Ameling with Dalton Baldwin in
>> a CBS Masterworks LP of 1980, c/w the Fauré La bonne chanson --
>> recordings licensed by CBS from Klaas Posthuma Productions of The
>> Netherlands.
There's some fine Ameling in EMI's old box of Fauré's Mélodies, for which
the recording dates are scattered over 1970, 1973, and 1974. Here it's
Gérard Souzay who sings "La bonne chanson," and Dalton Baldwin is pianist.
One of my graduate seminars in the early 1980s was on these works (my own
contribution was a comparison of certain of the songs to the Barcarolles),
and I recall being lucky enough to find the two Connoisseur Society boxes
to add to my collection, while my fellow-students had to resort to donning
headphones in the U of M library. ;--)
>> Notes by Ned Rorem quoting the following from Fauré. "Never speak to me
>> of Debussy. I don't want to know there is a Debussy. If I like Debussy I
>> can no longer like Fauré. How can I then be Fauré?"
>
> I only see that as an insurmountable problem if liking Debussy turns
> him into... let's say, randomly, Gregory Peck.
Could we find some way to turn Tom Deacon into Atticus Finch? Or would
that be so extreme as to destroy the universe in the attempt?
Steve Emerson
"david...@aol.com" <david...@aol.com> wrote:
> Steve Emerson wrote various things about Ameling's Debussy recordings.
>
> Steve, I don't know the recordings in question, but I'm surprised that
> you have anything good to say about Dalton Baldwin.
It was really Ameling that I meant to praise.
> Do you generally
> like him or is that he's in his element with Debussy? His presence on
> so many Schubert recordings with Ameling is a major disincentive for
> me.
I generally have no feeling about him at all. I certainly don't remember
him mucking up the Debussy....
SE.
JohnGavin
For what it's worth, I prefer Baldwin to Ameling's other accompanists,
Demus and Jensen. Baldwin may not project a strong individuality in
his playing, but he always sounds fluid, transparent, light and
remarkably graceful. His style certainly doesn't get in the way of
Faure or Debussy to my ears. Can't imagine Souzay using Baldwin for
decades if he were unidiomatic. On a personal level though, I have a
vague impression that he wasn't well liked by all - I'm going on some
past comments.
Richard Schultz
: There's some fine Ameling in EMI's old box of Faur?'s M?lodies, for which
I agree that the Ameling is fine, but it has to be admitted that the Souzay
is, well, not.
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"We cannot see how any of his music can long survive him."
-- From the New York Daily Tribune obituary of Gustav Mahler
Andrys Basten
JohnGavin <dag...@comcast.net> wrote:
>If the Mozart is a lied recital with Jorg Demus from the 60s get it by
>all means. Her singing is perfection. That was the first Ameling
>recording I ever heard, and it turned me into a lifelong fan.
I think I bought them all. And still have them.
>She did a series of mixed recital disks for Phillips (one called
>Serenata, another one of French songs) around the early 80s - they are
>quite nice, but for many of recordings of that time, she was a bit past
>her prime. Elly Ameling's best years were around 1965 - 1977.
Saw her in the mid-70s. A boyfriend of the moment was in
charge of a theater she was singing a recital at and got me
5th row center seats for my birthday. What a wonderful
singer she was. A real flair for the French songs. Hahn
was a favorite.
The French discs were -very- nice. The ones I had
were mid to late 70s though. Dalton Baldwin accompanied
but it was Demus' Schubert Shepherd on a Rock with her that was
my introduction to them. The Bach 'Wedding Cantata' BMV 202
was my introduction to her singing with other instruments.
- Andrys
--
http://www.andrys.com