Handel Dettingen Te Deum warning
Simon Roberts
has a fairly good track record with regard to choral music, so I was
interested enough to buy an inexpensive copy of a new recording on
Haenssler by Hannoversche Hofkapelle, the Collegium vocale des
Bach-Chores Siegen, and a collection of soloists (all new names to me)
conducted by Ulrich Stoetzel (heck, they're all new names to me). I
would recommend this to no-one except perhaps an anti-HIPster who wants
to taunt his HIP friends. The orchestral playing is technically OK, but
everything else about it, from the timid conducting to the distant,
overresonant recording is not. The choir not only sounds completely
unfamiliar with how English is articulated and enunciated but unfamiliar
with the concept of phrasing - notes are emitted without any evident
thought as to where they came from and where they're going - a bizarre
effect. Most of the soloists should perhaps best remain anonymous - if
the countertenors in Gardiner's recent Dixit Dominus seemed to set a new
low, well, this chap sets the bar even lower. In this context, to
complain that the disc lasts a mere 38 minutes would be to miss the
point. For half the list price you can get a far superior HIP
performance, far better recorded, conducted by Fasolis which comes
attached to a decent Dixit Dominus (on Arts)....
Simon
John Wiser
> I would recommend this to no-one except perhaps an anti-HIPster who
wants
best remain > > anonymous - if the countertenors in Gardiner's recent
Dixit Dominus
> seemed to set a new low, well, this chap sets the bar even lower.
> In this context, to complain that the disc lasts a mere 38 minutes
> conducted by Fasolis which comes
> attached to a decent Dixit Dominus (on Arts)....
Simon, What a pity that you already have a life!
What a loss you represent to the present-day reviewing trade,
replete as it is with earless writers of imitation-vanilla-flavoured
prose.
bucked up markedly in Howells,
John Wiser
jic...@frontiernet.net
Thomas Wood
MrT <symbi...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:7a96283a.02022...@posting.google.com...
> Sir Simon:
>
> By the way, I've noticed that a lot of vocal HIP recordings are just
> plain awful. It's not enough to call yourself HIP: the main thing is
> to be able to sing.
A lot of non-HIP recordings are also just plain awful. Especially murky,
vibrato-clogged choruses who attempt to sing Baroque and pre-Baroque music.
Tom Wood
Simon Roberts
> plain awful. It's not enough to call yourself HIP: the main thing is
> to be able to sing.
Indeed. One puzzle re Gardiner's recordings of choral works is that on
the one hand he's plainly concerned with using a choir that's
technically beyond reproach (at least according to his taste), while on
the other he's willing to use as soloists members of that choir
regardless of any evident suitability for the task (this isn't to say,
of course, that choristers necessarily can't be good soloists). The
disparity in quality between choir and soloists in his recent Dixit
Dominus is shocking. Or does he really think they're good?
Simon
Neill Reid
>Sir Simon:
>>Just giving you ideas for future reviews. The stealth is there, as
>stealthmaster John Wiser points out, and the ears too.
>
>By the way, I've noticed that a lot of vocal HIP recordings are just
>plain awful. It's not enough to call yourself HIP: the main thing is
>to be able to sing.
By whom? the 16, La Capella reial de Catalunya, Tallis scholars,
Ensemble Clement Janequin, Les Arts Florissants, Hilliards,
Concert Spirituel, Cardinall's Musick, Henry's 8 ?
please tell
I reckon the crap is pretty well spread out - don't get samirised
Neill Reid
>
>Regards,
>
>MrT
Matthew Silverstein
> Indeed. One puzzle re Gardiner's recordings of choral works is that on
> the one hand he's plainly concerned with using a choir that's
> technically beyond reproach (at least according to his taste), while on
> the other he's willing to use as soloists members of that choir
> regardless of any evident suitability for the task (this isn't to say,
> of course, that choristers necessarily can't be good soloists). The
> disparity in quality between choir and soloists in his recent Dixit
> Dominus is shocking. Or does he really think they're good?
How are the female soloists? When I heard him conduct the Dixit Dominus in
London, the soloists all came from the choir, and I remember thinking that the
"De Torrente" duet was particularly lovely. (This was, however, my first time
hearing this piece.)
Matty
Simon Roberts
"Matthew Silverstein" <msil...@umich.edu> wrote in message
news:%iff8.611$Cf5....@news.itd.umich.edu...
>
> How are the female soloists? When I heard him conduct the Dixit
Dominus in
> London, the soloists all came from the choir, and I remember thinking
that the
> "De Torrente" duet was particularly lovely. (This was, however, my
first time
> hearing this piece.)
They're tolerable, but not remotely as good as the best who have
recorded it - including Margaret Marshall and Felicity Palmer on his
earlier recording of the piece from c. 25 years ago.
Simon
Matthew Silverstein
> They're tolerable, but not remotely as good as the best who have
> recorded it - including Margaret Marshall and Felicity Palmer on his
> earlier recording of the piece from c. 25 years ago.
I've heard Margaret Marshall on only one recording (Pinnock's Nelson Mass),
and I find her vibrato somewhat annoying.
I quite like the two singers on Minkowski's recording (and I also like their
slow tempo).
Matty
Simon Roberts
> Simon wrote:
>
> > They're tolerable, but not remotely as good as the best who have
> > recorded it - including Margaret Marshall and Felicity Palmer on his
> > earlier recording of the piece from c. 25 years ago.
>
> I've heard Margaret Marshall on only one recording (Pinnock's Nelson
Mass),
> and I find her vibrato somewhat annoying.
I find Pinnock's soprano annoying too (not just because of her vibrato
but her scooping on each "suscipe" in Qui Tollis; I find the purity of a
clean attack, such as Marshall's, far more affecting) but she's Felicity
Lott. Marshall is Marriner's - does she annoy you there?
Simon
Matthew Silverstein
> I find Pinnock's soprano annoying too (not just because of her vibrato
> but her scooping on each "suscipe" in Qui Tollis; I find the purity of a
> clean attack, such as Marshall's, far more affecting) but she's Felicity
> Lott. Marshall is Marriner's - does she annoy you there?
Sorry--that was just a typo. I have Marriner's recording, and I do find
Marshall's vibrato annoying (although I quite like other aspects of her
singing, including the one you mention).
Matty
Johan van Veen
Simon Roberts heeft geschreven in bericht ...
>There aren't many recordings around of this splendid work, and Haenssler
>has a fairly good track record with regard to choral music, so I was
>interested enough to buy an inexpensive copy of a new recording on
>Haenssler by Hannoversche Hofkapelle, the Collegium vocale des
>Bach-Chores Siegen, and a collection of soloists (all new names to me)
>conducted by Ulrich Stoetzel (heck, they're all new names to me).
Ulrich Stötzel has been a pupil of Harnoncourt....
Who are the soloists? I have searched with Google, but it didn't find that
recording.
Johan van Veen
Utrecht (Netherlands)
jvv...@wanadoo.nl
musica Dei donum
http://www.geocities.com/johan_van_veen/
Simon Roberts
>
>Simon Roberts heeft geschreven in bericht ...
>>There aren't many recordings around of this splendid work, and Haenssler
>>has a fairly good track record with regard to choral music, so I was
>>interested enough to buy an inexpensive copy of a new recording on
>>Haenssler by Hannoversche Hofkapelle, the Collegium vocale des
>>Bach-Chores Siegen, and a collection of soloists (all new names to me)
>>conducted by Ulrich Stoetzel (heck, they're all new names to me).
>
>Ulrich Stötzel has been a pupil of Harnoncourt....
Evidently he didn't learn the right things....
>Who are the soloists? I have searched with Google, but it didn't find that
>recording.
Dorothee Fries, Matthias Rexroth, Thomas Cooley and Raimund Nolte.
Haenssler 98.365
Simon
A. Brain
news:slrn3vsa803...@pobox.upenn.edu...
> >Ulrich Stötzel has been a pupil of Harnoncourt....
>
> Evidently he didn't learn the right things....
Herreweghe was also a pupil of Harnoncourt, wasn't he? He appears in some
of the Harnoncourt Bach cantatas, as I recall.
Yet the recordings I have heard by Herreweghe of Bach have been pretty dull.
--
A. Brain
Remove NOSPAM for email.
ulvi
I don't recall hearing anything dull by Herreweghe (this doesn't mean
I find him flawless, just that dullness is never one of his flaws).
--
Ulvi
ulvi.yu...@jpl.nasa.gov
Philip Peters
A. Brain wrote:
I don't know which ones you heard but they must be different from those
I know.
Did you try his second efforts at SMP & SJP? Dull? I don't think so.....
Philip
>
>
>Remove NOSPAM for email.
>
>
Paul Kintzele
ulvi wrote:
>
> "A. Brain" wrote:
>
> > Herreweghe was also a pupil of Harnoncourt, wasn't he? He appears in some
> > of the Harnoncourt Bach cantatas, as I recall.
> > Yet the recordings I have heard by Herreweghe of Bach have been pretty dull.
>
> I don't recall hearing anything dull by Herreweghe (this doesn't mean
> I find him flawless, just that dullness is never one of his flaws).
I don't know if I would go so far as to call him dull, but Herreweghe
has a rather soft-edged approach to conducting, which means that more
often than not opportunities for being explosive or dramatic go by the
wayside. His Beethoven 9 and second Bm Mass can be disappointingly
earthbound at times. More relaxed music, like Fauré's Requiem, he can
bring off much more successfully.
Paul
Matthew Silverstein
> I don't know if I would go so far as to call him dull, but Herreweghe
> has a rather soft-edged approach to conducting, which means that more
> often than not opportunities for being explosive or dramatic go by the
> wayside. His Beethoven 9 and second Bm Mass can be disappointingly
> earthbound at times. More relaxed music, like Fauré's Requiem, he can
> bring off much more successfully.
I quite like the reverential approach of his second B-minor Mass. The gently
pleading opening Kyrie--before the orchestral fugue--is by itself worth the
price of the set, in my opinion.
Matty
A. Brain
news:3C804464...@english.upenn.edu...
> I don't know if I would go so far as to call him dull, but Herreweghe
> has a rather soft-edged approach to conducting, which means that more
> often than not opportunities for being explosive or dramatic go by the
> wayside. His Beethoven 9 and second Bm Mass can be disappointingly
> earthbound at times. More relaxed music, like Fauré's Requiem, he can
> bring off much more successfully.
It was the Mass, or parts thereof, that I heard; "soft-edged" is the right
characterization.
But I had a similar experience, think bland, to some of the cantatas.