Recognize is one thing.  Know anything much about, is another.  I
_recognize_ all but about 26.  There are some duplications in that list,
by the by...
Pick-Mangiagalli I remember from a Bb-minor quartet whose parts I looked
over, and a work - can't recall the name- on a Quartetto Italiano LP at
the library sandwiched between Malipiero and Respighi. (I listened to the
Malipiero, haven't yet listened to the other two pieces. His Bb-minor
quartet has, I think, yet to be recorded itself; it looked nice.)
Paul Graener wrote a few string quartets (among other things!), one of
which I happened to see in score at New York Public Library and thought
well of, in a book with a quartet or two by Wellesz, both of Borodin's
quartets, a quartet or so of Rimsky's, and other works.  Wellesz, whom you
mention, has of course gotten some attention of late too, what with his 9
symphonies and Symphonic Epilogue up for recording by the RSO Wien (they
begin taping, so says a webpage of theirs, this fall; my thanks to
Thanh-Tam Le for pointing this out to MCML.)  Perhaps someone will record
his 9 quartets as well. (cpo is now doing a Toch quartet cycle as well as
their Toch symphony cycle; such things could happen ;) )
-Eric Schissel

--
All nature is dreaming
Of a happiness deeper
Than can be reached.

In article <%eWh7.61208$gj1.5651...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,

More than half.

Stephen

In article <%eWh7.61208$gj1.5651...@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>,
praetoriusN...@worldnet.att.net says...

Echoing Eric Schissel's "knowing" and "recognizing" not being the same
things, I recognized 122 of the 195 unique names presented (I can't
compete with Eric's 169).  Of these 122, I have heard at least one
composition by all but 9.  For 96 of the other 113, I have or have had
one or more recordings of their work in my collection.

Dave Gomberg

Actually (checking that library's catalog) it was the Quartetto della
Scala, on a Urania LP from the early 1950s; Fugues for Quartet by
Pick-Mangiagalli, Quartet (probably the Dorico, but might have been the D
major) by Respighi, and Quartet no. 7 by Malipiero.

And counting again I see that it's more like 30, not 26, composers I don't
quite recognize.  Ah well.  (But to include Vaughan Williams and Walton in
such a list?  Well, it's true that they've had their years fighting for
recognition...)
-Eric Schissel

Eric Schissel wrote

I was almost going to put a parenthetical in the post saying you weren't
included <g> (I assume that you saw the aside to you in my original
post to the thread "Forgotten Composers who were Famous in their
own Time?").

Anyway, as indicated, this isn't a compilation that I made up as some
sort of "stumper list." It is the list of composers (the index/table of
contents quoted entirely and exactly, minus the page references) from
the book _Composers of Today - A Comprehensive Biographical
and Critical Guide to Modern Composers of All Nations_, by
David Ewen (New York: The H .W. Wilson Co., 1934). Ewen¹ wrote
many books on classical music for the everyday classical music listener
(I don't know how else to describe the target audience). I was presenting
the list in an attempt to show a true contemporary (for one time period)
reflection of important" or "famous" composers, many of whom are not
even footnotes anymore.

Ewen was not trying to be "comprehensive."Quoting from the
Introduction:
        It was, of course, not possible or even feasible to include
    in this volume every contemporary composer who has earned
    performances or publication. Selection was essential if the
    book was not to grow to encyclopedic size. The compiler,
    therefore, wishes to make his method clear. He was guided
    by three principles in making his selection. First, only living
    composers are included; second, their artistic aim had to be
    of the highest; and third, their work has had to arouse sufficient
    curiosity either in American or in important European musical
    centers.
        The first principle was permitted a certain degree of elasticity.
    There are some composers who died when the book was in
    progress; to have omitted them would have left sorry gaps.
    The compiler is thinking particularly of Gustav Holst, Frederick
    Delius and Sir Edward Elgar. Also, there are a few composers
    who—because they are so intimately associated with modern
    music and have influenced it so profoundly—appear with such
    frequency thruout these pages that the compiler believed it might
    be helpful for the reader to have their lives, and a critical estimate
    of their work, included. Composers such as Debussy, Vincent
    D’Indy, Erik Satie, Alexander Scriabin and Gabriel Fauré are not
    the less modern because they have been dead several years.
    For the most part, however, the rule has been adhered to; there
    are not more than ten composers, among the two hundred
    included in this book, who are not alive.
        To the second rule the compiler has conformed uncompromisingly.
    Only composers with unquestionably high artistic standards are
    included. The volume, therefore, contains no representative from
    Tin-Pan Alley, with the exception of George Gershwin who has made
    a serious attempt to express jazz in a permanent artistic form.
    Composers of operettas and cream-puffs such as Franz Lehar,
    Oscar Straus, etc., cannot be considered in a book of this nature.
    For the same reason, the compiler has omitted composers of
    morsels for violin or piano, such as Fritz Kreisler and Leopold
    Godowsky, whose canvas is such a limited one for artistic
    self-expression.
        The third rule called for a greater exercise of discretion. There
    are certain composers included in the following pages who are,
    as yet, unfamiliar to American music-audiences. The compiler
    feels that, in the light of their European reputations, they cannot
    remain strangers much longer, and should, therefore, be included.
    There are other composers who have not produced a page of
    importance for a decade or two, but who, because they are
    contemporary and because of their past achievements, are
    deserving of inclusion.
        The compiler realizes only too well that in a book of this nature
    there will always appear gaps and omissions, notwithstanding his
    most scrupulous care to avoid them. For one thing, in the case
    of at least two composers, sufficient material was lacking at the
    time the book went to press, and the failure of these two
    composers to cooperate with the author has made it necessary
    for him to exclude them. He does so regretfully. Also, during a
    music season there are always one or two comets to soar across
    the musical sky—plunging out of complete darkness. These
    names will no doubt not be found in this book since they emerge
    so unexpectedly into public notice. Such omissions are, of course,
    unavoidable. But it is the purpose of the compiler and publisher,
    with each edition of this book, not only to fill in the gaps as they
    become apparent, but also to delete those figures who, for
    reasons unforeseen, return tomorrow to obscurity and unimportance.
    By keeping an alert watch over the musical sky, it is possible for
    the compiler to keep this book, with each edition, as vibrantly
    alive and as contemporary tomorrow as it is today; this, at any
    rate, is his firm resolve.
_________________________________________________
¹ The entry for him in _The New Everyman Dictionary of Music_
(6th Ed., 1988 at p. 220): Ewen, David (b Lwów, Poland, 26 Nov
1907; d Miami, 28 Dec 1985), American writer on music. He
moved to the USA in 1912 and studied in NY; Univ. of Miami from
1965. In 50 years he pub. more than 80 music reference books,
e.g. _Dictators of the Baton (1943)_, _Encyclopedia of the Opera_
(1955, rev. 1971), _The World of 20th Century Music_ (1968),
_Composers Since 1900_ (1969), _Musicians Since 1900_
(1978) and _American Composers (1982).

Frank Decolvenaere
To reply by e-mail, replace NMBR with 1612.

  "You are no bigger than
   the things that annoy you."
            Jerry Bundsen

Recognize?  I own a recording of at least one work by the following, and
I daresay most of us would score a similar percentage.  (This is non CD.
I have a few others on LP, at least one work.)

Brendean

I think you're pessimistic - I'm not much of a specialist and I
recognized 135 names, though some for non-compositional reasons (Deems
Taylor, for example).

Of course, mere recognition doesn't take much. About a third of the
names are just that -- names, with maybe a title or two associated
with them, like Atterberg and his "Dollar" Symphony, Ethel Smyth and
"The Wreckers," or Montemezzi and "L'Amore Di Tre Re." I've never
heard a note of their music.

Also, I don't know one Tcherepnine from the other, but I know that's
not the spelling I'm used to seeing.

But here's a question: given the copyright date (1934), is anyone of
lasting interest *missing*? (Just to be fair, I think only composers
born before 1903 and alive in 1930 should be eligible - though
Markevitch was born in 1912, and Debussy had been dead since 1918)
I'll start:

Eugen d'Albert
Havergal Brian
Joseph Canteloube
Andre Caplet
Paul Dessau
Henri Duparc
Marcel Dupre
Hans Eisler
Gerald Finzi
Arthur Foote
Roberto Gerhard
Charles Koechlin
Franz Lehar
Carl Orff
Carl Nielsen (!)
Silvestre Revueltas
Joaquin Rodrigo
Othmar Schoeck
Germaine Tailleferre

On Sat, 25 Aug 2001 23:09:47 GMT, "Praetorius"

I think it's now possible to own recordings of the music of a good number of
these. Maybe 140 or 150 of them. That's not too bad. It's interesting that
there are so many other composers from the period, not on this list, who now
are well represented in the discography.

--Jeff

Seeing Leo Ornstein's name on this list reminded me of some amazing numbers.
Ornstein is now 108, and I believe, stopped composing at a youthful, 104.

ds

On Sat, 25 Aug 2001 23:09:47 GMT, "Praetorius"

Ca. 55% I have music from, on lp, cd or sheet. A further 10-15% I
recognize the name. Although I'm not sure about Sean Sibelius. The
Irish cousin?

--
Jan Winter, Amsterdam
(j.win...@xs4all.nl)

David Gomberg  <dgomb...@home.net> wrote:

You beat me by 3: I counted 192 unique names. I have recordings of
95, have heard recordings of another 5, have heard of another 23.
This leaves 69 names new to me. More work (:>).

Naturally, there are many more names of composers famous now and then
(!), who were active by 1934 -- not that such lists prove much...

Cheers,

--
 Dr. Stan Szpakowicz, Professor         http://www.site.uottawa.ca/~szpak
 School of Information Technology & Engineering     sz...@site.uottawa.ca
 University of Ottawa           tel +613-562-5800/6687  fax +613-562-5187

I did that on purpose to make sure people read the whole list.  ;^]

Frank Decolvenaere

I should have either replaced "even more composer-knowledgeable"
with "most" or changed "half" with a higher percentage (but that would
have required higher math on the part of respondents and there probably
would not have been as many responses <g>). And I probably should
have said "know more than the name of" rather than "recognize."

Anyway, I think I made my point, whatever that may have been.

Frank Decolvenaere
To reply by e-mail, replace NMBR with 1612.

  "You are no bigger than
   the things that annoy you."
            Jerry Bundsen

"Praetorius" <praetoriusN...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in
news:%eWh7.61208$gj1.5651630@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net:

All but 27 of them.  (I know that's not a percentage but I'm in a hurry.)

--
Matthew B. Tepper:  WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/index.html
My main music page --- http://home.earthlink.net/~oy/berlioz.html
To write to me, do for my address what Androcles did for the lion
Top 3 worst UK exports: Mad-cow; Foot-and-mouth; Charlotte Church

Which was? I smell a hidden agenda something along the lines of "None of
these 20th century composers measure up to Ludwig Van and they haven't
lasted".

I think the response you've had should put that canard to terminal rest.
Pool the musical loves of all the contributors to this newsgroup, and
you'll find virtually all the composers you list will have fervent
admirers alive somewhere on this shrinking globe of ours.

I for one enjoyed your list as a demonstration of the range, quality and
dazzling stylistic variety of an epoch which knocks all the others into
a cocked hat!
___________________________
Christopher Webber,  Blackheath, London,  UK.
http://www.nashwan.demon.co.uk/zarzuela.htm
"ZARZUELA!"

On Sun, 26 Aug 2001 16:40:12 GMT, Praetorius

No, you did not.  The more knowledgable collecters here probably have
*recordings* of more than half those composers.  That's a lot more than just
being familiar with the names. I have recordings of music of about 40% of
the composers on that list, and I'm not as avid a collector as many others
here.

Dave Cook

Boy, how far do I have to put tongue in cheek before it becomes visible?

Frank Decolvenaere

According to film composer David Raksin, Ornstein wrote some rather
remarkable incidental music to the ancient Greek play Lysistrata that
deserves to be heard and recorded today. (Maybe it could be coupled with
some orchestral pieces by Dane Rudhyra...)
news:20010826033042.29080.00001170@mb-fg.aol.com...

As Bugs Bunny (I think) once said, "He don't know me very well." ;^]

For example, in my post last week in the thread "Futile search for
that 'ideal' recording" I said:

    I, like many others in this ng I suspect, try to balance the two
    [obtaining multiple versions of "established" works vs. exploring
    new repetoire]. On the one hand, I enjoy exploring new composers
    and works; but sometimes I want to revel in the great and familiar
    (although perhaps with a different perspective).

    The thrill of finding an attractive new composer/work seems to
    balance out the agony of wasting time listening to a piece rightfully
    (de gustibus) relegated to the musical graveyard, not to be
    disinterred.

    I would feel all the poorer for not having gambled on the Erato CD
    containing the Pretre/ONF Marcel Landowski's Symphony No. 1
    "Jean de la Peur," or those recordings of Todd Dockstader's
    Luna Park [Dockstader on Starkland], Jón Leifs' Saga Symphony
    [Vänskä/Iceland Sym. on BIS] and Geysir [Zukofsky/Iceland Sym.
    on ITM], Czeslaw Marek's Sinfonia [Gary Brain --any relation?--/
    Philharmonia on Koch], and John Foulds' Hellas and Three Mantras
    [Wordsworth/LPO on Lyrita], to name just a few (don't ask me why
    I came up with all 20th Century; there's, e.g., Pavel Vejvanovsky,
    Georg Muffat, Joseph Martin Kraus, Robert Volkmann).

I would probably be the last person on this ng to make the kind of statement
that you ascribe as my "hidden agenda." I tend to avoid comparisons of
"worthiness" of composers, basically because they are meaningless.
Among my "favorite" composers are Paul Hindemith and Robert Simpson,
and I have more versions of Nielsen's Clarinet Concerto than Mozart's.
Heck, I even listen to Alvin Lucier (and, when I have the time and
concentration, Morton Feldman).

No, no "hidden agenda."

Frank Decolvenaere
To reply by e-mail, replace NMBR with 1612.

  "You are no bigger than
   the things that annoy you."
            Jerry Bundsen