Project Tarrega

[John Nguyen]

Ladies and Gents,

I’m starting my own CG project with the Tarrega repertoire. And on the
day after the April Fools Day, what could more appropriate than a
teaser called Studio Scherzo?

This is the fruit from the effort in the last two months, obviously
nowhere near the polished level I would like to have, but I thought I
would put it up for kicks and solicit any comments to bring it to the
next level.

There, please have a go at it if you would. I’m fairly thick skin and
I can take it :-)
Cheers,


John

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY

[Matt Faunce]

Hey, I play that piece too. Good job. I think you captured the
sprightliness of it. More tomorrow.

Matt

[Cactus Wren]

John, good to see you posting! I am impressed with how surely you
navigated the different textures and shifts, making very few mistakes
and making it look quite easy. What I am not hearing is how you feel,
musically, about the piece.

[JPD]

On Apr 1, 9:55 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi John,

Nice going. If you want to make it a little better, how about playing
around with the dynamic levels? Play a passage or section at a
distinct dynamic level, then play the next one at a different level,
louder or softer, your creative choice. Just make it clear that it's
intentional and expresses your creative judgement. It's an easy and
fun thing to do and it gets a very nice payoff.

Cheers,
John

[JPD]

On Apr 1, 10:41 pm, Cactus Wren <elegantspanishgui...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Really? Sounded pretty darned happy to me. Sunny and very good-
natured, too. Delightful.

[wollybird]

pretty damn good for an amateur

[Fadosolrélamisi]

It sounds good! (Nice images of ladies with umbrellas on a promenade)And the project is a good one.
Could it be that this study carry the idea from which HVL elaborated his study No.2?

Alain

[Slogoin]

On Apr 1, 9:55 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> There, please have a go at it if you would.
> I’m fairly thick skin and
> I can take it :-)

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY

I'd like to hear your thoughts first but, can you block out the
chords for this piece and strum a rhythm like a lead sheet?

Thanks for posting nice quality video.

[Douglas Seth]

On Apr 2, 12:55 am, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

Nice job, John! You have a a good start. I like your playing. The
first thing I noticed was your technique, your left hand is like the
really old Shearer books. Kind of tilted to the left. It seems to be
working for you and your RH appears to be a good, fundamental
technique. Specifically, I would work on shaping the melodic line. On
the most basic level, when a line goes up, cresc., when a line goes
down, decresc. Many times in Romantic era music like this, the
opposite is done for expression. The line goes up and you play a
decresc. or as a line goes down you play a cresc. which sounds cool
too. There are as times in this piece where there are leaps and
changes of direction in a line which sound good with a slight accent.
Also, I would work more on bringing out the harmonic tension. For
example, where the bass line is E-E#-F#. Play the E# louder than the
F#. This will help create the feeling of tension/release... Many
times, accidentals are red flags for this sort of thing in tonal
music. Doing a harmonic reduction of the piece would help you hear
this. I love hearing someone who is playing for no other reason other
than the love of the art. I have an older student like this. It is
great!

Doug

[Cactus Wren]

What I said was a, perhaps clumsy way, of saying what you said. But
yes, John is a delightful and sunny person.

[Matt Faunce]

On Apr 2, 12:55 am, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

If you haven't tried this yet, try playing the end chords as block
chords. That's how I prefer them, but you've gotta decide based on how
you pull it off and according to your taste.

Check the score, you're playing an E in the bass of the Amaj chord at
50 second mark and again at 1:13. I play an A in these spots.

Matt

[Lutemann]

Doug, this is good advice, but I wonder about the hand position as
well. To me, he's tilting the hand to right too much and playing on
the right side of the nail. But then you are correct in saying that
he's got it working. I think he might get a better P stroke if he
played in a perpendicular position.

[Lutemann]

It sounds to me like you've gotten a lot better.

[dsi1]

I find your hands to be fascinating. Looks like a right powerful grip!
You've got the chops, now please try some real i.e., Spanish, music. :-)

[John Nguyen]

> You've got the chops, now please try some real i.e., Spanish, music. :-)-

Thanks. All the labor work back then surely helped build up the
forearms, I think. Definitely some Spanishy (if that's a word) stuff
will be in the near future. Working on it.
Cheers,

John

[2cts]

Great - a very nice start!

With the time passing everyone perhaps wants to feel his own play
going and feeling as easy as possible. As I always piffle its a
good idea to try to close the eyes during exercising... For the left
hand to feel safe during the many position shifts one should exercise
these position shifts each one (slowly) to the end that he always
conciously and relaxed touches each gutter-stick before he plays
a note (no haste and eyes closed and counting and seeing the number
of gutter-sticks to move). This would later cost NO time (and mental
action) but it should enhance the ease (and the fun) of playing greatly.

You right hand looks pretty good strong to me.

[John Nguyen]

On Apr 2, 12:55 am, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hey gang!

Thanks all for the feedbacks. I'll try to incorporate them into the
2nd cut this weekend.

Cactus: I'll try to be more explicit with my musical feel the next
time If I could.

JPD: Thanks for the dynamics suggestion. I could see that in my head
now.

Wollybird: thanks for the comment. This my first somewhat fast-pace
piece recorded.

Alain: If you could see a stroll in the park from this, I'm more than
flattered!

Slogoin: Yes, block chords next time.

Doug: Thanks for the shaping suggestion. It makes perfect sense, and
I'll see what I can pull off in the next cut.

Luteman: Thanks for the compliment. I actually played on my left side
of the nails. Perhaps the angle of the camera had something to do with
it. In this position, I feel my thumb is the most articulated playing
finger.

Matt: I'll certainly try block chords in the next cut. My score has
the E bass note that the places you pointed out, but when I listened
to David Russell CD, he did play the A. Somehow at the moment I'm in
favor of the E at that place as it helps accentuate more on the F# to
E pull-off in the melody, but I'll try both as it should be an easy
change.

Overall, I had a lot of fun playing this piece.
Cheers,

John

[John Nguyen]

> You right hand looks pretty good strong to me.-

Thanks. Good suggestion on closing eyes. I normally would run through
a piece in the dark to build up muscle memory, but I never consciously
feel for the frets. Certainly I'll try that.
Cheers,

John

[dsi1]

You were in an altered state of consciousnesses. That's the payoff for
me in playing the guitar. OTOH, drugs would have been a heck of a lot
less work. :-)

> Cheers,
>
> John

[Pamilearner]

On Apr 2, 12:55 am, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

Great playing, John. Sorry I'm a little late to the party. Seems
like you got a few good pointers here, too. I like this piece but had
never heard it before. (I never heard the Rachmaninov #1 by Andrew
before, either. Excellent! You must be very proud.)

Cheers!
Ken

[Matt Faunce]

On Apr 2, 5:44 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

I'd like to highlight some of the comments.

> JPD: Thanks for the dynamics suggestion. I could see that in my head
> now.

This is great advise. Take this principle and exaggerate it for
practice, that is, practice the piece in various moods, like animato,
andante, con moto maestoso, etc. then when you return to the mood you
think fits the piece best you'll have a fuller palette to draw from.

> Slogoin: Yes, block chords next time.

I think he meant to practice strumming the chords throughout like a
folky, i.e.,
A | E7 | E7 | A |
A | D | E7 | A | ... which is a great idea to get the folk element,
from which this piece came, ingrained in your head.

> Doug: Thanks for the shaping suggestion. It makes perfect sense, and
> I'll see what I can pull off in the next cut.

Yes. Great advise on E F F#. I was going to comment on these notes,
but Doug said it better than I was thinking about saying it.

Matt

[2cts]

On Mon, 2 Apr 2012 15:23:09 -0700 (PDT), Pamilearner wrote:

> I like this piece

I don't ;)

(just my 2cts [I knew it but never liked it;)])

[John Nguyen]

Thanks, Ken! I like both pieces myself :-)
Cheers,

John

[John Nguyen]

Yep! Especially when I started dozing off in the middle of the piece
with the lights off.

[John Nguyen]

On Apr 2, 6:58 pm, Matt Faunce <mattfau...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Apr 2, 5:44 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > Slogoin: Yes, block chords next time.
>
> I think he meant to practice strumming the chords throughout like a
> folky, i.e.,
> A | E7 | E7 | A |
> A |  D | E7 | A | ... which is a great idea to get the folk element,
> from which this piece came, ingrained in your head.
>
>

> Matt

Oh, that chord! I didn't try that as I thought the structure was
fairly simple. I'll take a crack at it later.

John

[Slogoin]

On Apr 2, 5:43 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:

> > I think he meant to practice strumming the chords throughout like a
> > folky, i.e.,
> > A | E7 | E7 | A |
> > A |  D | E7 | A | ... which is a great idea to get the folk element,
> > from which this piece came, ingrained in your head.

> Oh, that chord! I didn't try that as I thought the structure was
> fairly simple. I'll take a crack at it later.

Correct. Simple flowing chords of the first line: home high low
home, I V V I, Do So So Do.

Shape it as others recommended using volume, tone and tempo. You can
record the chords phrasing them with the voicing, then playing to that
so you really fit your arpeggios to the chords changes. Try singing
just the chord roots, Do up to So, down to So, back up to Do, as you
play the arpeggios, fist solo then the same way as you play it.

[Slogoin]

On Apr 2, 3:58 pm, Matt Faunce <mattfau...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> This is great advise. Take this
> principle and exaggerate it for
> practice, that is, practice the
> piece in various moods, like animato,
> andante, con moto maestoso, etc.

As the piece is a simple chord progression why not improvise? It's a
great piece to use for a jam session.

You can use different rhythms and work up and down the neck
alternating between the first two chords to really learn the fretboard
patterns. Arpeggios need to sound like rolling chords. The changes in
direction on chord changes is a common pattern. The shape needs to
lean to the next chord change so you get the waves of chords like with
HVL #1 even though you can't hold all the chord tones.

[gtr...@tds.net]

On Monday, April 2, 2012 12:55:34 AM UTC-4, John Nguyen wrote:
> Ladies and Gents,
>
> I’m starting my own CG project with the Tarrega repertoire. And on the
> day after the April Fools Day, what could more appropriate than a
> teaser called Studio Scherzo?
>
> This is the fruit from the effort in the last two months, obviously
> nowhere near the polished level I would like to have, but I thought I
> would put it up for kicks and solicit any comments to bring it to the
> next level.
>
> There, please have a go at it if you would. I’m fairly thick skin and
> I can take it :-)
> Cheers,
>
>
> John
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY

John,

Lovely playing!

Could you post a link to a pdf file of this piece? I was looking for it and can't locate it. I remember playing it at some point in my life. Thank you in advance. I would like to give it a read through.

Charlie

[Fadosolrélamisi]

On Sunday, April 1, 2012 9:55:34 PM UTC-7, John Nguyen wrote:

One of the central technique of the Tarrega school is ... Ze rest stroke!
I am surprise no one mentioned the absence of rest stroke in your version ...
is rest stroke gone forever? (I think that some use of the rest stroke might help giving more (what's the word?) to your interpretation).

Alain

[John Nguyen]

True! I did play rest trokes off and on for this piece but not on this
video. I'll try do sprinkle it around in the next cut if I can.
Cheers,

John

[John Nguyen]

Good idea but not sure I can improvise with the pace of this piece for
now. Got a very limited connectome in my head! But there are lots of
good patterns here that can be recycled elsewhere.
Cheers,

JOhn

[Douglas Seth]

Alain, John,
Consider Tarrega played without nails which drastically changes the
result of what Tarrega's rest strokes might have sounded like opposed
to what modern rest strokes do sound like. In a modern technical
context, it is no that important how Tarrega might have played. All
that said, how you play something is less important than the resulting
sound/tone.

[John Nguyen]

> Charlie-

Hi Charlie,

It's the No. 9 in the 12 studies here: http://www.classicalguitarschool.net/en/Download.aspx?id=1056

Cheers,

John

[David Raleigh Arnold]

On Sun, 01 Apr 2012 23:29:18 -0700, JPD wrote:

> On Apr 1, 9:55 pm, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Ladies and Gents,
>>
>> I’m starting my own CG project with the Tarrega repertoire. And on the
>> day after the April Fools Day, what could more appropriate than a
>> teaser called Studio Scherzo?
>>
>> This is the fruit from the effort in the last two months, obviously
>> nowhere near the polished level I would like to have, but I thought I
>> would put it up for kicks and solicit any comments to bring it to the
>> next level.
>>
>> There, please have a go at it if you would. I’m fairly thick skin and I
>> can take it :-)
>> Cheers,
>>
>> John
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY
>

> Hi John,
>
> Nice going. If you want to make it a little better, how about playing
> around with the dynamic levels? Play a passage or section at a distinct
> dynamic level, then play the next one at a different level, louder or
> softer, your creative choice. Just make it clear that it's intentional
> and expresses your creative
judgment. It's an easy and fun thing to do
> and it gets a very nice payoff.

Absolutely, but only after the forever basses are cleaned
up. Regards, daveA

--
Guitar teaching materials and original music for all styles and levels.
Site: http://www.openguitar.com (()) eMail: d.raleig...@gmail.com
Contact: http://www.openguitar.com/contact.html"

[David Raleigh Arnold]

[David Raleigh Arnold]

[gtr...@tds.net]

Merci bien!

Charlie

[John Nguyen]

Good point, Doug. I never really pay much attention to rest or free
strokes. I just used either to squeeze out the sound I want, whatever
works.

[John Nguyen]

On Apr 3, 12:18 pm, David Raleigh Arnold <d.raleigh.arn...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Site:http://www.openguitar.com(()) eMail: d.raleigh.arn...@gmail.com
> Contact:http://www.openguitar.com/contact.html"- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Basses clean up it is. Thanks.

John

[Slogoin]

On Apr 3, 8:48 am, John Nguyen <johnnguyen5...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Good idea but not sure I can improvise
> with the pace of this piece for now.

The chords are slow. A simple strum pattern like a lead sheet is all
you need.

To improvise just apply different rhythms to the chords. Try LH
block chords and you should be able to play faster than the piece
where arpeggios have position changes; That tends to be where you are
having problems getting it to roll. Keep it simple, improv does not
have to be more elaborate.

[John Nguyen]

Oh, that's not a problem. I used to accompany other instruments/
singers with chord strumming before. You know, those Paso-Double,
Bolero, Dixie, Tango, Polka, Valse, etc. have the lives of their own
with rhythms. Loved them.

[Steven Bornfeld]

On 4/2/2012 12:55 AM, John Nguyen wrote:
> Ladies and Gents,
>
> I’m starting my own CG project with the Tarrega repertoire. And on the
> day after the April Fools Day, what could more appropriate than a
> teaser called Studio Scherzo?
>
> This is the fruit from the effort in the last two months, obviously
> nowhere near the polished level I would like to have, but I thought I
> would put it up for kicks and solicit any comments to bring it to the
> next level.
>
> There, please have a go at it if you would. I’m fairly thick skin and
> I can take it :-)
> Cheers,
>
>
> John
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY

Nicely done! I should get this and have a go at moidering it!
Wow--your hands look very strong!

Steve

--
Mark & Steven Bornfeld DDS
http://www.dentaltwins.com
Brooklyn, NY
718-258-5001

[Cactus Wren]

On Apr 3, 2:27 pm, Steven Bornfeld <bornfeldm...@dentaltwins.com>
wrote:

Steve, I'm not stalking you. But I am working on Sor/Segovia #15. It
is stuffed to the gills with muting and damping opportunities/
neccesities.

[Steven Bornfeld]

On 4/3/2012 5:30 PM, Cactus Wren wrote:
> On Apr 3, 2:27 pm, Steven Bornfeld<bornfeldm...@dentaltwins.com>
> wrote:
>> On 4/2/2012 12:55 AM, John Nguyen wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> Ladies and Gents,
>>
>>> I’m starting my own CG project with the Tarrega repertoire. And on the
>>> day after the April Fools Day, what could more appropriate than a
>>> teaser called Studio Scherzo?
>>
>>> This is the fruit from the effort in the last two months, obviously
>>> nowhere near the polished level I would like to have, but I thought I
>>> would put it up for kicks and solicit any comments to bring it to the
>>> next level.
>>
>>> There, please have a go at it if you would. I’m fairly thick skin and
>>> I can take it :-)
>>> Cheers,
>>
>>> John
>>
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iU6nPPmN_KY
>>
>> Nicely done! I should get this and have a go at moidering it!
>> Wow--your hands look very strong!
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> --

>> Mark& Steven Bornfeld DDShttp://www.dentaltwins.com

>> Brooklyn, NY
>> 718-258-5001
>
> Steve, I'm not stalking you. But I am working on Sor/Segovia #15. It
> is stuffed to the gills with muting and damping opportunities/
> neccesities.

I'll make a note of it. Right now half of my stuff is still buried
somewhere in my garage. We moved in February and my wife won't rest
until everything is perfect. And if my wife doesn't rest, I won't
either. Not pretty, but it is what it is. Things will get back to
normal someday...

Steve

--

[John Nguyen]

On Apr 3, 5:27 pm, Steven Bornfeld <bornfeldm...@dentaltwins.com>
wrote:

> 718-258-5001-

Thanks, Steve! Hey, I butchered it up pretty well. I think you should
give it a go. My intention was to have something interesting for
practcing the arpeggio and chromatic scale, and this piece suits the
purpose. For the life of me, any dry scale or arpeggio practice would
doze me off at no time flat.
Cheers,

John

[Cactus Wren]

John, you might have a go at Barrios' Maxixe. I used to play it, but
I butchered it so bad, I let it go. It has lots of interesting licks
and a very impressive arpeggio section. I think you might find the
Tarrega to be a good etude for the Maxixe.

[John Nguyen]

Yep, difinitely that's on the to do list. I love that piece, but the
runs scared me off back then. Once I get really comfortable with the
Tarrega, I have to give the Maxixe another try.

John

[David Raleigh Arnold]

I only sent my message once, but there was some software that
did not agree. ;-)

Where practical, appoggiato on the basses would give the bass a better
tone, too. Appoggiato in the top voice would probably not be a good idea.

1. You get more benefit from appoggiato with low notes than high.

2. It is inconsistent with slurs because of the radical difference
in tone between the slurred note and the unslurred note. It
can work in some music with very strong phrasing. In any case
there is a problem with dynamics.

3. Mixing appoggiato and tirato strokes in the same melody line
gives the voice an inconsistent character, especially if you
are not just trying to play everything as loudly as
possible. Such uneven tone color is not nearly as unnoticeable as
you may think.

This may not apply now, but you will run into it before long:
Within a voice within a phrase, for example, do something like
a(3) e'(2) c#'(2) e'(1) if practical,
to avoid abrupt change in tone between the 3rd and 1st
strings. You see that in all sorts of guitar music from
competent editors. Otherwise, the two notes seem to be
in different voices, which is not good in a single
phrase.

Kindest regards, daveA

--
Guitar teaching materials and original music for all styles and levels.