11/09/1989
ktaylor
was one of the most important events for the growth of the classical
guitar in the 20th century?
Kevin Taylor
Tommy Grand
Yes, far more important things happened in cg history between
1900-1989 than 1990-1999.
Tashi
May 14, 2000 - NY Times - Portugal
Pope John Paul II spoke yesterday with Lucia de Santos, 93, a
Carmelite nun, who believers say was the main recipient of prophecies
from the Virgin Mary that included the spread, and then the collapse,
of Communism.
http://www.crystalinks.com/fatima.html
RalphJ
> Pope John Paul II spoke yesterday with Lucia de Santos, 93, a
> Carmelite nun, who believers say was the main recipient of prophecies
> from the Virgin Mary that included the spread, and then the collapse,
> of Communism.http://www.crystalinks.com/fatima.html
Almost any significant event will be found, after the event, to have
been predicted by someone, somewhere. Stock-market crashes, natural
disasters, political changes. There's always someone who has predicted
them. Before the event, though, it's hard to know which prediction is
the one to back. It's like horse racing. Sadly, it doesn't necessarily
mean that the person who gets it right is specially endowed. Given a
big enough population, there's bound to be someone making a prediction
that turns out to be right amongst all the ones that turn out to be
wrong.
David Raleigh Arnold
Yes. Regards, daveA
--
For beginners: very easy guitar music, solos, duets, exercises. Early
intermediate guitar solos. One best scale set for all guitarists.
http://www.openguitar.com/scalescomparison.html ::: plus new and
better chord and arpeggio exercises. http://www.openguitar.com
Tommy Grand
> On Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:02:19 -0800, ktaylor wrote:
> > Twenty years ago the wall fell. Is it hyperbole to suggest that this was
> > one of the most important events for the growth of the classical guitar
> > in the 20th century?
>
> Yes. Regards, daveA
>
> --
> For beginners: very easy guitar music, solos, duets, exercises. Early
> better chord and arpeggio exercises. http://www.openguitar.com
lolol pwnd
ktaylor
> On Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:02:19 -0800, ktaylor wrote:
> > Twenty years ago the wall fell. Is it hyperbole to suggest that this was
> > one of the most important events for the growth of the classical guitar
> > in the 20th century?
>
> Yes. Regards, daveA
>
> --
> For beginners: very easy guitar music, solos, duets, exercises. Early
> better chord and arpeggio exercises. http://www.openguitar.com
What made me say this is the amount of literature behind the iron
curtain that has been released and the great players we are seeing
that would never had been able to come to the European and American
competitions and who are making concert careers. We are seeing an
entire pedagogy appear from China (a relationship between the fall of
the Soviets and the opening of China is not a stretch) with
outstanding performers. We are seeing the 7-string Russian tradition
coming to light. The classical guitar, though struggling to make
inroads in American pop music is being used in the Eastern European
pop bands. East German youths are studying the classical guitar in
huge numbers compared to the U.S. The Balkans continue to produce
great players year after year. The music schools in Croatia and Serbia
continue to thrive and gain world-wide prestige. Those players did not
have the concert opportunities before and thus there was an
environment of discouragement to even study the instrument. The flow
of information back and forth has been very fruitful and continues at
a heightened pace.
These are some of the reasons I initiated this post.
Kevin T.
David Raleigh Arnold
The relationship is not all that clear, especially because while
Stalin was responsible for building the wall, the Russians were
not really involved in tearing it down. That was all Germans.
Certainly the wall has nothing to do with China.
I have mucho downloads to Germany, Russia, Japan, and China, so
I am not reluctant to acknowledge that they are important to
guitar. ;-) Regards, daveA
Ray Victory
> On Nov 10, 4:39 pm, David Raleigh Arnold <d...@openguitar.com> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:02:19 -0800, ktaylor wrote:
> > > Twenty years ago the wall fell. Is it hyperbole to suggest that this was
> > > one of the most important events for the growth of the classical guitar
> > > in the 20th century?
>
> > Yes. Regards, daveA
>
> > --
> > For beginners: very easy guitar music, solos, duets, exercises. Early
> > intermediate guitar solos. One best scale set for all guitarists.http://www.openguitar.com/scalescomparison.html:::plus new and
> > better chord and arpeggio exercises. http://www.openguitar.com
>
> What made me say this is the amount of literature behind the iron
> curtain that has been released and the great players we are seeing
> that would never had been able to come to the European and American
> competitions and who are making concert careers.
Yes, similar to what we see in the Galapagos, the extreme isolation of
the Iron Curtain resulted much fine artistry that otherwise may never
existed. Three cheers for the wall!
Richard Jernigan
> The relationship is not all that clear, especially because while
> Stalin was responsible for building the wall, the Russians were
> not really involved in tearing it down. That was all Germans.
> Certainly the wall has nothing to do with China.
>
The Berlin Wall was built in 1961. Stalin died in 1953.
The Soviet decision not to use their troops stationed in Germany to
interfere with the Germans' tearing down the wall was a key event of
the 20th century.The Soviets were not physically involved with tearing
down the wall, but it would not have happened without Soviet consent.
The Germans' tearing down the wall symbolizes the collapse of the
Soviet controlled Warsaw Pact. The final collapse of the Soviet Union
itself followed only a little over two years later.
I took great pleasure in extending my personal welcome to the USA to
Dmitri Illarionov after his excellent concert for the Austin Classical
Guitar Society. I was very conscious that such a concert likely would
not have taken place during the majority of my lifetime.
Illarionov seemed young enough that the Cold War was perhaps only a
vague childhood memory.
You may believe the wall has nothing to do with China, but the Chinese
government disagrees. It has blocked the Twitter page of a German
organization celebrating the 20th anniversary of the wall's
destruction:
http://www.thelocal.de/society/20091030-22927.html
RNJ
David Raleigh Arnold
> On Nov 12, 7:23 am, David Raleigh Arnold <d...@openguitar.com> wrote:
>> The relationship is not all that clear, especially because while Stalin
>> was responsible for building the wall, the Russians were not really
>> involved in tearing it down. That was all Germans. Certainly the wall
>> has nothing to do with China.
>>
>>
> The Berlin Wall was built in 1961. Stalin died in 1953.
I stand corrected. Sorry. Soviet.
>
> The Soviet decision not to use their troops stationed in Germany to
> interfere with the Germans' tearing down the wall was a key event of the
> 20th century.
True.
> The Soviets were not physically involved with tearing down
> the wall, but it would not have happened without Soviet consent.
They did not "consent", they simply did not interfere. Possibly you
saw Gorbachev quoting Mitterand to the effect that he liked Germans
so much that he thought two Germanies were better than one. Any
stance but complete neutrality would have PO'd allies and adversaries
alike to no purpose whatever. They had nothing to gain by either
consent or opposition to the destruction of the wall.
> The Germans' tearing down the wall symbolizes the collapse of the Soviet
> controlled Warsaw Pact. The final collapse of the Soviet Union itself
> followed only a little over two years later.
My problem is attributing a specific causal relationship between these
events. That's not clear at all.
>
> I took great pleasure in extending my personal welcome to the USA to
> Dmitri Illarionov after his excellent concert for the Austin Classical
> Guitar Society. I was very conscious that such a concert likely would
> not have taken place during the majority of my lifetime.
>
> Illarionov seemed young enough that the Cold War was perhaps only a
> vague childhood memory.
>
> You may believe the wall has nothing to do with China, but the Chinese
> government disagrees. It has blocked the Twitter page of a German
> organization celebrating the 20th anniversary of the wall's destruction:
>
> http://www.thelocal.de/society/20091030-22927.html
Again, it's attributing a causal relationship that IMO is unwarranted.
Live long and prosper. Regards, daveA
ktaylor
> better chord and arpeggio exercises. http://www.openguitar.com
The fall of the wall represented the collapse of the communist
economic system. The Chinese Peoples Party were very aware of what
happened and were experiencing the same inability to create wealth
that the Soviets were (they were facing large scale famine by the
Spring). They had no Yeltsin so rather than eschew the monopoly on the
party, they kept the party, eschewed Mao's theory and freed up the
economic system. The rise of the classical guitar in China is a direct
result of that move. Chen Zhi used to deliver groceries during the
cultural revolution. He is now one of the most respected guitar
pedagogues in the world.
I also believe the scholarship regarding guitar history and repertoire
that has crossed between east and west since the fall of the wall is
unmatched in the previous 80 years.
Kevin T.
David Raleigh Arnold
Represented? What the hell does that mean? Regards, daveA
ktaylor
>
> > The fall of the wall represented the collapse of the communist economic
> > system.
>
> Represented? What the hell does that mean? Regards, daveA
>
Jernigan answered that pretty well. The fall of the wall was a very
meaningful sign. The fall was a sign that the Soviets could not muster
the will or means to keep eastern Europe within their sphere of
influence. They were not willing to support the East German Government
and the Stasi in the war against their own people's desire for the
fruits of freedom. That meant they were also not able. It was not too
long after that that Czechoslovakia, Hungary, even the Baltic states
threw out the communists. The dominoes fell. Those events set off
great introspection and the changes in China.
I don't think the history is really arguable, perhaps you do, but what
could be questioned is my original suggestion that this date (and its
signatory event) has had a profound influence on the growth of the
classical guitar world - and may be one of the most significant in the
20th century. How about that?
Kevin T.
David Raleigh Arnold
How about the fall of the Soviet empire rather than some event
which may or may not "represent" it? It may be true, but it
is not as significant as the internet. daveA