California Superbike School
Bill Dorsey
School day during the rec.photogawk session this past Saturday at Ted
Lemon's. There seemed to be sufficient interest that I've decided to
post.
The California Superbike School will be at Laguna Seca on April 9th-11th
this year. On the 9th and 10th, they'll be holding their regular
school which lasts for half the day. You get something like 40 laps
which are all timed. On the 11th, they'll be holding their expanded
school which lasts for the whole day. You're supposed to get around
100 laps here. The school is using Kawasaki Ninja ZX-6's this year
which are, "race preppared." All that means is they probably have a
louder exhaust system, different fork springs, and a different shock.
Anyway, the regular school costs in the neighborhood of $225 (1989
price) and the expanded school costs $400. The 1990 prices may be
a bit more, but I'm not sure since I haven't received any information
from the school yet. They supposedly give group discounts, so if
enough people are interested, the price could drop somewhat.
What I'd like to know at this point is how many people are interested
in attending. Furthermore, I'd like to know whether you're interested
in the regular or expanded schools. Whichever gets more votes will be
the one we plan for. So it helps if you're a little flexible.
My mailer hasn't been working terribly reliably of late. So, if you
can't get through to any of the addresses I've listed below, send
mail to bi...@apple.com. I'll try to have that account forward mail
to me here at DEC.
------------------------------ Nature rejects the monarch, not the man;
The subject, not the citizen; for kings
- Bill Dorsey And subjects, mutual foes, forever play
A losing game into each other's hands,
dorsey@{decwrl.dec.com | Whose stakes are vice and misery. The man
decpa.pa.dec.com | Of virtuous soul commands not, nor obeys.
relay.pa.dec.com} Power, like a desolating pestilence,
Pollutes whate'er it touches; and obedience,
Bane of all genius, virtue, freedom, truth,
Makes slaves of men, and of the human frame
A mechanized automaton.
------------------------------ - Percy Bysshe Shelley
Chick Webb
>The California Superbike School will be at Laguna Seca on April 9th-11th
>this year. On the 9th and 10th, they'll be holding their regular
>school which lasts for half the day. You get something like 40 laps
>which are all timed. On the 11th, they'll be holding their expanded
>school which lasts for the whole day.
Funny you should mention the Superbike School. I've already put a
deposit down on the Monday session. (It's my 30th birthday present to
myself!) I was planning on going down to watch the GP on Sunday the
8th, and staying in the area overnight.
> The school is using Kawasaki Ninja ZX-6's this year
>which are, "race preppared." All that means is they probably have a
>louder exhaust system, different fork springs, and a different shock.
Yup, plus they pull off all the breakables (signals, mirrors, etc.) and
add some sacrificial plastic just in case you slide. Also, he drains
the rear master cylinder. (One of Code's claims is that locked-up rears
cause most race crashes.) The bikes will be brand-spankin' new on the
9th, since that's the first session of the year.
>Anyway, the regular school costs in the neighborhood of $225 (1989
>price) and the expanded school costs $400. The 1990 prices may be
>a bit more, but I'm not sure since I haven't received any information
>from the school yet. They supposedly give group discounts, so if
>enough people are interested, the price could drop somewhat.
The cost is $225, so it looks like they haven't raised the prices.
>What I'd like to know at this point is how many people are interested
>in attending. Furthermore, I'd like to know whether you're interested
>in the regular or expanded schools. Whichever gets more votes will be
>the one we plan for. So it helps if you're a little flexible.
Like I said, I'm already signed up. Since I've never ridden on a track
before, I'm not sure about the full day class. But, I would be willing
to move to the Tuesday session, if that's what other people are
interested in. (Assuming that The School would let me change the
reservation.) So count me in for Monday or Tuesday, OK?
>- Bill Dorsey
Chick Webb "Common sense is not so common."
Hewlett-Packard Company -- Voltaire
Cupertino, CA
UUCP: {ucbvax, etc.}!hpda!ckw
ARPA: c...@hpda.HP.COM
v064...@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
For the regular school, one gets about 16 laps in. Subtract from this
number the laps that are yellow-flagged because someone threw it away.
The Ninja's are race-prepped in that they have the lights, mirrors etc.
removed, they are safety wired, the speedo is removed, the usual stuff.
Also, the Ninja's were fitted with Storz handlebars. These are wide pipe
mounted on the top of the triple-clamp. They are higher than stock and
give more leverage I guess, and makes the bike feel like a dirt-tracker.
A lot of time is spent waiting around, but Keith Code is a cool guy
and he instruction is worthwhile. If money is no object, I would
have to recommend the expanded schools.
John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E
the latest issue of _American Roadracing_ tells us that Keith Code,
founder of the California Superbike School, is a follower of Dianetics(1),
the mental discipline promoted by the late(2) science fiction writer L.
Ron Hubbard's Church of Scientology(3). In fact, the article goes on
to say that the Church may be providing $$$ for race sponsorship!(4)
(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?). It has
nothing do to with Dianetics, and precious little with Zen or
motorcycle maintenance. But it does have some interesting things to
say, using Zen and motorcycling as metaphors, about how we choose live
our lives and view ourselves. It describes a cross country trip on a
Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
New York City a few years ago.
(2) At least the Church claims he's dead. He died in his home, a yacht
that he kept off the coast of the U.S. in international waters,
conveniently during an IRS investigation. Since his death several long
sf novels have been published posthumously under his name. Go figure.
(3) The apocryphal story is that sf author Hubbard bet the late John W.
Campbell, well known and long time editor of _Astounding_ (later
_Analog_) sf magazine that he could found a religion and make money at
it. Hubbard died a multimillionare.
(4) If this had been the April issue I would really have wondered. I
guess I do anyway.
--
John Sloan NCAR/SCD NSFnet: jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu
AMA #515306 P.O. Box 3000 UUCP: ...!ncar!jsloan
DoD #000011 Boulder CO 80307 Voice: +1 303 497 1243
Logical Disclaimer: belong(opinions,jsloan).belong(opinions,_):-!,fail.
Charles Blair
>(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
>try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
Robert M. Pirsig.
>[...]
>It describes a cross country trip on a
>Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
>(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
>New York City a few years ago.
What makes you say it was a Triumph? I don't think he explicitly
mentions the kind of bike, maybe intentionally, now that I think about
it (if I'm right). He definitely wants to keep this on a level higher
than bike wars. The two makes he does mention, BMW and Harley
Davidson, are incidental to other points he's making.
Rumour also has it that Pirsig was a student here at the University of
Chicago, in the Committee on Social Thought.
I agree that the book is worth reading. I've read it twice.
--
Bitnet: pmrcjdb@uchimvs1
Internet: cj...@tank.uchicago.edu
Carl Schaefer
>try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
The author's name is Robert M. Pirsig. The book is subtitled "An
Inquiry into Values".
It is thought-provoking and extremely fun to read. So, if you like
thinking or fun, read it. The book is awesome.
>It describes a cross country trip on a
>Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
>(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
>New York City a few years ago.
This is not a rumor; it is mentioned in an Afterword appended by
Pirsig in 1984 (original copyright 1974). It happened in 1979.
The Afterword also mentions a sequel in progress. Anybody know
anything about it?
Carl
--
Carl Schaefer
ca...@csli.stanford.edu
Steve Barnhouse
name of the bike that he rode. For part of the trip, a buddy rode
with them on a BMW. Pirsig made a point that the buddy chose a BMW
because it was relatively maintenance-free. Pirsig preferred his
older generic bike because the required regular user maintenance kept
him directly involved with his bike and with the ride. The metaphor
(in gross terms) equated the unexamined life with the un-maintained
bike.
In the preface (or postscript?) to the new edition of the book, Pirsig
wrote that his son was killed in a mugging in Berkeley.
--Steve
Michael Coleman
>In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu> jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
>>It describes a cross country trip on a
>>Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
>>(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
>>New York City a few years ago.
ZAMM is one of my favorite books. I feel fairly certain that it is in fact
autobiographical (although I have discovered it in various sections of
libraries, including _travelogues_). I was bored one day and looked up a
number of the original reviews of the book. Needless to say, they were mixed,
but there are a number of tidbits about Pirsig not included in the book
itself. One even had a picture of him sitting on his bike (like Robert
Heinlein, he looks a lot different than you'd expect). Sorry, I don't know
what kind it was; but it did look like my image of the archetypical
motorcycle: small, round headlight, no fairings, none of that damn plastic
crap, standard body. One common thread I remember from the reviews was that
regardless of whether they liked the book or not, they seemed truly impressed
with his effort.
>it (if I'm right). He definitely wants to keep this on a level higher
>than bike wars. The two makes he does mention, BMW and Harley
As you indicate, the book really isn't about motorcycles, although it does
make me want to take some cross country trips on mine.
>Rumour also has it that Pirsig was a student here at the University of
>Chicago, in the Committee on Social Thought.
I assumed that UC was the school in question. Probably a little research
would uncover the parties in question (who are probably long since dead or
mired in obscurity), although people in these roles can be found anywhere.
>I agree that the book is worth reading. I've read it twice.
I've read it several times and I second the motion. If anyone knows more
about where Pirsig is or what he's doing, I'd be very interested in hearing
about it.
Mike
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
try. %% "When at first you
try :- try. %% don't succeed, ..." (col...@cs.ucla.edu)
JAC...@yalevm.ycc.yale.edu
ke that....
I always thought Pirsig rode something like a Honda 750/4. I don't know
where I got that impression from; I do remember hwo consciously he tried
not to emphasize the type of motorcycle he was riding.
oh well.
-Conrad J.
Thien-Thi Nguyen
- no, Pirsig does not mention the type of bike, just that it has "28 horses"
under it -- funny how my riding mower has 60% of that figure (things change)
- in the later publishings of ZAMM (over *30* so far!), a little epilogue is
added detailing his (Pirsig's) current views, his son's unfortunate meeting
with pinheads-extraordinaire, and the birth of a baby daughter -- also men-
tioned is a possible sequel (?!?)
- this is a good book to introduce to non-motorcyclists IMO, because it makes
them see the light in one way or another
Incidentally, ZAMM was the single force that brought me into an awareness of
both motorcycling and philosophy. I can't think of anything else so powerful
and yet so beautiful all at once -- sort of like a religious experience, if
you understand me (no flames please). Definitely worth a look.
>>> 1 more week until these crutches go, 2 more weeks until spring !!! <<<
Take care,
Thi
-------
txn102@psuvm "Those who know do not speak. Those who speak
txn...@vm.psu.edu do not know." -- Lao-tzu
As i was saying ...
P.S. I've read the book seven times, so nyah ... :-)
Alex S. Crain
>What makes you say it was a Triumph? I don't think he explicitly
>mentions the kind of bike, maybe intentionally, now that I think about
>it (if I'm right).
I think you're right in that he never mentions the name of teh bike,
but I also guessed that it was a triumph because:
1) The back cover shows a piacture of a man, a boy and what looks
like a bonniville or tiger (Yes, it could be a BSA twin, and yes, cover art
means nothing)
2) He does explicitly mention Harley and BMW machines and implies
that they are differnet from his.
3) He implies that this is a "larger" machine then his old boke, also
a twin. From his description of the manitaince work I envisioned an upright
twin. I think that he specifically states that the bike is 28hp.
All of this narrows the field alot, especially since the book was
printed around 1973. There wasn't much in japaneese hardware at the time,
especially larger twins. Given the popularity of british hardware, a triumph
seems like a good guess.
Carl Schaefer
>In the preface (or postscript?) to the new edition of the book, Pirsig
>wrote that his son was killed in a mugging in Berkeley.
It's in the Afterword. It was not in Berkeley, it was SF. The son
was a student at Zen Center, and was on his way from there to a
friend's house a block away at about 8:00pm on Saturday, 17-Nov-79.
--
Carl Schaefer
ca...@csli.stanford.edu
Paul Blumstein
+In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu> jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
+>It describes a cross country trip on a
+>Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
+>(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
+>New York City a few years ago.
+
+This is not a rumor; it is mentioned in an Afterword appended by
+Pirsig in 1984 (original copyright 1974). It happened in 1979.
Make that San Francisco, not NYC.
=============================================================================
Paul Blumstein | "The Democratic System is the worst system to have--not
Citicorp/TTI | counting the other systems" -- heard on the radio
Santa Monica, CA +----------------------------------------------------------
{philabs,csun,psivax}!ttidca!paulb or pa...@ttidca.TTI.COM
DISCLAIMER: Don't believe everything I hear or anything you say.
Scott Baldwin
>I always thought Pirsig rode something like a Honda 750/4. I don't know
When he adjusted his valves, they were in a BMW twin. The valve adjustment
happened along the way, and he never mentioned actually *buying* a bike,
so I deduce the bike he rode was a BMW.
--
"...when you see something which needs to be done and there's nobody else
doing it, that's your legitimate territory, take it." -- Robert Hunter
|| Have fun, RoseRunner ||
Scott Baldwin
> 1) The back cover shows a piacture of a man, a boy and what looks
>like a bonniville or tiger (Yes, it could be a BSA twin, and yes, cover art
All that means was the author didn't care what kind of bike was pictured,
and the artist knew what a Triumph looked like.
> 3) He implies that this is a "larger" machine then his old boke, also
At one time, a 650 was the biggest bike in BMW's lineup.
Dave bd Hsu
>that he kept off the coast of the U.S. in international waters,
>conveniently during an IRS investigation. Since his death several long
>sf novels have been published posthumously under his name. Go figure.
That is, since the published date of his death. Hubbard had not actually
been seen since 1976 when the Church posted the notice. His novels had
been ghostwritten for years anyhow...see below.
>(3) The apocryphal story is that sf author Hubbard bet the late John W.
>Campbell, well known and long time editor of _Astounding_ (later
>_Analog_) sf magazine that he could found a religion and make money at
>it. Hubbard died a multimillionare.
Campbell had made enough claims for the veracity of this story that I
think it's well beyond "apocryphal". Hubbard was a writer from the
"golden age" of pulp SF. That is, he actually wrote his own material
in the forties and fifties. Sometime after founding Scientology, he
appears to have turned writing duties over to a team of ghostwriters
(I've heard figures between 6 and 8) who continue to spew out volumes
of pseudo-Hubbard pabulum.
A critical look at the founding years of Scientology is available in
one of Martin Gardner's earliest tracts dating from 1956 or so.
-dave
--
Dave Hsu Systems Research Center
h...@eng.umd.edu The Maryversity of Uniland, College Park, MD 20742-3311
"We plan ahead. That way, we don't do anything right now."
Dimitry Struve
I vaguely remember reading a tongue-in-cheek review of ZAMM, as if
written by a Hell's Angel or maybe just a Harley mechanic ... maybe in
National Lampoon ... ? As I recall, there was some speculation in it
about what type of bike Pirsig rode, and the conclusion was a
mid-sixties Honda, like a Hawk or Dream, based on various hints
throughout the book.
As I said, it's a vague memory. Anyone else?
-Dimitry
paul
> In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu> jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
>
> >(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
> >try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
>
>
Sounds interesting! Could you please post it to the net so we can all read it?
Paul J. Mech
oucsace.cs.OHIOU.EDU!deadpup!paul
uiucuxc!oucs!oucsace!deadpup!paul
For the humor impaired ... :-)
Thomas Huggett
>In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu> jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
>>(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
>>try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
>Robert M. Pirsig.
>>[...]
>>Trimuph by a man and his young son. Rumor has it that Pirzig's son
>>(the book feels strongly autobiographical) was killed in a mugging in
>>New York City a few years ago.
>What makes you say it was a Triumph? I don't think he explicitly
>mentions the kind of bike, maybe intentionally, now that I think about
>it (if I'm right). He definitely wants to keep this on a level higher
>than bike wars. The two makes he does mention, BMW and Harley
>Davidson, are incidental to other points he's making.
>Rumour also has it that Pirsig was a student here at the University of
>Chicago, in the Committee on Social Thought.
>I agree that the book is worth reading. I've read it twice.
Yes, Charles we agree again:
It is worth reading. I always thought it was a BSA lighting from
some friends who knew him maybe it could be proved by analysis
instead of "facile assumptions".
I recall darkly that he had a nervous breakdown shortly after
writing the book. Also this book was rejected by about 128 publishers
and actually would have been a Guiness World record of the time
but he did not apply to Guiness.
Not all harley riders are bikers just the most interesting.
Michael Palmquist
what he's doing, I'd be very interested in hearing about it."
When I read ZAMM the first time (1983-84), I was living in South
Minneapolis -- it turns out that Pirsig lived about 12 blocks from me.
He kept kind of a low profile.
Mike Palmquist
************************
mp...@andrew.cmu.edu
Department of English
Carnegie Mellon University
voice: 412/268-5636
Jim Isom
+In article <75...@tank.uchicago.edu+, cj...@tank.uchicago.edu (Charles Blair) writes:
++ In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu+ jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
++
++ +(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
++ +try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
++
++ I agree that the book is worth reading. I've read it twice.
++
+Sounds interesting! Could you please post it to the net so we can all read it?
+For the humor impaired ... :-)
How about if everyone who *hasn't* read it post their name and the rest of
us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
--
Jim Isom ji...@well.sf.ca.us
ji...@sun.com
Bob Pasker
+p...@deadpup.UUCP (paul) writes:
++Sounds interesting! Could you please post it to the net so we can all read it?
+How about if everyone who *hasn't* read it post their name and the rest of
+us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
+that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
Uh, Jim, I haven't read it. Tried once, in 1985, but couldn't get
through it; couldn't get through life at that point, either, so it may
just have been a passing thing. You may laugh or you may weep, but
I'd like to see it posted.
--
- bob
;-----------------------------------------------------------------
; Bob Pasker, San Francisco, CA | r...@well.sf.ca.us
; +1 415-695-8741 | {apple|pacbell}!well!rbp
Randall J. Davis
|pa...@deadpup.UUCP (paul) writes:
|+In article <75...@tank.uchicago.edu+, cj...@tank.uchicago.edu (Charles Blair) writes:
|++ In article <62...@ncar.ucar.edu+ jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu (John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E) writes:
|++ +(1) For an interesting viewpoint regarding motorcycles and philosophy,
|++ +try _Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance_ By Pirzig(sp?).
|++ I agree that the book is worth reading. I've read it twice.
|+For the humor impaired ... :-)
|How about if everyone who *hasn't* read it post their name and the rest of
|us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
|that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
Nope, haven't read it. I daresay a not-insignificant number of the members
of this newsgroup haven't either. Of course, if you are going to ask, you had
better change the Subject line, as most of us have probably "K"'d it by now. I
was going to, like any other subject that doesn't interest my (like hopping up
a K75?), yet the low traffic on the subject hasn't warranted it yet...
Randy Davis UUCP: dell.dell.com!rjd
1K Ninja Pilot (ZX-11 Pilot soon - deposit's down)
Chuck Karish
+ji...@well.sf.ca.us (Jim Isom) writes:
++p...@deadpup.UUCP (paul) writes:
+++Sounds interesting! Could you please post it to the net so we can all read it?
+Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
++that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
+Uh, Jim, I haven't read it. Tried once, in 1985, but couldn't get
+through it; couldn't get through life at that point, either, so it may
+just have been a passing thing. You may laugh or you may weep, but
+I'd like to see it posted.
+- bob
Uh, Bob, Paul was making a JOKE. The book is about 250 pages long, and
copyrighted. Probably available from your public library.
Maybe you should wait for the comic book version. It's not likely
to be made into a movie any time soon.
Chuck Karish kar...@mindcraft.com
(415) 323-9000 kar...@forel.stanford.edu
Paul Thompson
>
>Maybe you should wait for the comic book version. It's not likely
>to be made into a movie any time soon.
>
to a more ambitious project. Now we need to select the cast of characters...
Paul Thompson
a...@minster.york.ac.uk
>JAC...@YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu writes:
>>I always thought Pirsig rode something like a Honda 750/4. I don't know
>
>When he adjusted his valves, they were in a BMW twin. The valve adjustment
>happened along the way, and he never mentioned actually *buying* a bike,
>so I deduce the bike he rode was a BMW.
My recollection is that his friend rode a BMW, and was obsessive about cleaning its
exterior, but knew little about mechanical aspects, resulting in his inability at
one point to diagnose that the failure to start was due to having flooded the engine.
Pirsig and his son rode some large vertical twin. I always thought of something like
a Yamaha XS650, but a Triumph/BSA/Norton sounds equally plausible. The contrast,
shown by the valve adjustment amongst other things, was that Pirsig was unconcerned
with cosmetic appearance, but concerned with maintaining mechanical correctness.
I tend to work by the latter philosophy myself, the problem being that when one comes
to sell a bike it is difficult to pursuade purchasers to read an entire book just
to understand that the dirt in the corners doesn't mean the oil has never been changed.
Andy H.
(a...@uk.ac.york.minster)
Tom Dietrich
>+Uh, Jim, I haven't read it. Tried once, in 1985, but couldn't get
>
>to be made into a movie any time soon.
>
> Chuck Karish kar...@mindcraft.com
Naaa, I'm waiting for the Cliff Notes!!!!!
*********************************************************************
Tom Dietrich
CAUTION: RIDER MAY BAIL!!!!!
Disclaimer: This company doesn't agree with me and I don't agree with
this company!
*********************************************************************
Martin A. Lodahl
>that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
YES!! My local library SWEARS they have it, but it's never on the damn
shelf!! Some day ...
--
= Martin Anders Lodahl Pac*Bell Minicomputer Ops Support Staff =
= {att,bellcore,sun,ames,pyramid}!pacbell!pbhyf!mal 916/972-4821 =
= If it's good for ancient Druids, runnin' nekkid through the wuids, =
= Drinkin' strange fermented fluids, it's good enough for me!! 8-)} =
Bob Pasker
$In article <16...@well.sf.ca.us$ r...@well.sf.ca.us (Bob Pasker) wrote:
$+ji...@well.sf.ca.us (Jim Isom) writes:
$++p...@deadpup.UUCP (paul) writes:
$+++Sounds interesting! Could you please post it to the net so we can all read it?
$+Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
$++that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
$+Uh, Jim, I haven't read it. Tried once, in 1985, but couldn't get
$+through it; couldn't get through life at that point, either, so it may
$+just have been a passing thing. You may laugh or you may weep, but
$+I'd like to see it posted.
$+- bob
$Uh, Bob, Paul was making a JOKE. The book is about 250 pages long, and
$copyrighted. Probably available from your public library.
You mean I really needed smiley faces? What's this world coming to?
$Maybe you should wait for the comic book version. It's not likely
$to be made into a movie any time soon.
Reminds me of a letter to the editor in an old motorcycle mag: Guy writes:
I live in briton and I find the driving in the US to be horrible. Once
as I was riding down the fast lane of the highway at speed, I saw a man
in the middle lane reading a novel! - charles of whales.
EDITORS' REPLY: that is strange... most folks just wait for the movie
to come out.
Kiliki
> us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
> that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
ok, Chris Cooke and I'll admit it. I haven't read ZAMM. does anybody
have the number for ZAMM anonymous? seriously(what here?) I've looked
for ZAMM and found no bookstore which stocks this or any other motorcycle
type reading material. ideas?
Chris Cooke coo...@mmlai.UUCP
AMA#512697
Josh Sirota
>I've looked for ZAMM and found no bookstore which stocks this or any other
>motorcycle type reading material. ideas?
You're probably checking the automotive/motorcycle section. How silly of
you!
Seriously, I noticed it recently in my local B. Dalton store ... I'm sure you
can find it if you look in the right place, and that's usually the religion/
philosophy department, believe it or not.
It's a hard book to miss ... solid purple cover.
Josh
--
Josh Sirota
Sun Microsystems, NSE group
INTERNET: j...@sun.com UUCP: ...!sun!jss
paul
>
> How about if everyone who *hasn't* read it post their name and the rest of
> us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
> that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
Have three copies of it, never got more than a couple of pages into it.
Weep if you want, but I just couldn't get started on it.
Paul J. Mech
oucsace.cs.OHIOU.EDU!deadpup!paul
uiucuxc!oucs!oucsace!deadpup!paul
{ CAUTION: some reply generated paths end on oucsace and are lost. }
v291...@ubvms.cc.buffalo.edu
> ok, Chris Cooke and I'll admit it. I haven't read ZAMM. does anybody
> have the number for ZAMM anonymous? seriously(what here?) I've looked
> for ZAMM and found no bookstore which stocks this or any other motorcycle
> type reading material. ideas?
> Chris Cooke coo...@mmlai.UUCP
> AMA#512697
motorcycle material. Look under philosophy, or maybe even new age. It's a
strange book and it would fit either category. :)
-Patrick Salsbury
U. of Buffalo, NY
Steven Aucella
>In article <6...@mmlai.UUCP> coo...@mmlai.UUCP (Kiliki) writes:
>>motorcycle type reading material. ideas?
>
>can find it if you look in the right place, and that's usually the religion/
>philosophy department, believe it or not.
well, it's not really about motorcycles.
pirsig never mentions what type of motorcycle he rides, but he
does say that his friend john rides a BMW R60. purchase price: $1800.
anyway, tell this to your bookseller or librarian:
>
>It's a hard book to miss ... solid purple cover.
>
arrrg.
>JosISBN 0-688-00230-7
0-688-05230-4 (paperback)
the cover on my copy (published by quill) is black with white letters, with a wrench thrusting
upward out of some plant thing.
h good luck reading this. my editor is trashing me.
- steve
Jim Isom
+> How about if everyone who *hasn't* read it post their name and the rest of
+> us will weep in sympathy. Is there really anyone who reads this newsgroup
+> that hasn't read ZAMM? At least once?
+ok, Chris Cooke and I'll admit it. I haven't read ZAMM. does anybody
+have the number for ZAMM anonymous? seriously(what here?) I've looked
+for ZAMM and found no bookstore which stocks this or any other motorcycle
+type reading material. ideas?
Weel...if it's out of print, I suppose that someone who lives in SF and
knows the bookstores there could help you out. For that matter, I could
look at Moe's in Berkeley. The last going price I saw for a used one was
$5.95, I think. Seriously interested?
If you really want some, we can make a list, collect the mone and...
John Sloan,8292,X1243,ML44E
subsequent discussion, I'm glad that I have already read ZAMM. If I had
not, and I were following this thread, I might not have an accurate
idea as to just what this book is about.
New readers will find that it operates on several levels. One the
surface it is about a cross country motorcycle trip by a man and his
young son. Since the enforced seclusion of long motorcycle trips often
lead introspection (one of my favorite aspects of cross country rides),
it should be no suprise that Pirsig uses this as an excuse (or perhaps,
inspiration) to discuss phislosophy and the nature of values and
quality. But the book is also about the thin line between sanity and
insanity, and a man's battle with mental illness. Although this is
presented as somewhat metaphorical, the book's strong autobiographical
tone leaves one with little doubt as to what was fiction and what was
surely based on real life experience.
Because of my interest in both motorcycles and philosophy, I found the
book fascinating. But because of it's sometimes harrowing recount of the
narrator's mental breakdown and recovery, I also found the book both
disturbing and at the same time cathartic.
Readers are likely to find much more than just a book about motorcycles.
Or about Zen.
--
John Sloan NCAR/SCD NSFnet: jsl...@ncar.ucar.edu
+1 303 497 1243 P.O. Box 3000 UUCP: ...!ncar!jsloan
AMA #515306 Boulder CO 80307 BITNET: jsloan%ncar@ncario
Logical Disclaimer: belong(opinions,jsloan).belong(opinions,_):-!,fail.
Ilana Stern
I thought I'd share why and how I _did_ read it.
My grandmother sent us a whole bunch of paperback books that she'd
had lying around and didn't want any more, and I sifted through them
and found ZAMM. Now this was in my early moto-fascination phase;
as a matter of fact, I was in eighth grade, certainly not old enough
to ride, but old enough to stare, and to wish.
I wasn't very popular in school, so I usually brought a book with me
to read during lunch, since nobody wanted to sit with me (of course
this is no longer a problem :-). One day my English teacher saw
me with my copy of ZAMM and asked, incredulously, "Are you really
reading that?" (Whatsa matter, you don't think it's appropriate for
a 12-year old girl? :-) When I told him I was, he made me an offer:
if I wrote an acceptable book report on it, he'd give me an A in
the class for the quarter, regardless of how I did on the other
assignments.
Well, I did, and he did. So that's how I got an A in eighth-grade
English class, and why I read ZAMM, carefully, all the way through.
Ilana Stern / il...@ncar.ucar.edu
We Virgos tend not to believe in astrology.
Kirk Pearson
>Since people have been posting their reasons for _not_ reading ZAMM,
>I thought I'd share why and how I _did_ read it.
>
I was required to read ZAMM in my 12th-grade Humanities class (kind of a
catchall class for philosophy, english, music, classical art and other things
most high-schoolers don't spend their time thinking about). I'm still not
sure why we had to read it (it probably had a lot to do with the fact that one
of the two teachers for the class was a flower-child into Talking Heads
music :-)), but it, more than the other 11 books we read for the class, made
me think, a lot, about everything. I didn't get into the Zen and deep philo-
sophical aspects of it then (I would like to re-read it now), but I did like
the analysis of the motorcycle and Quality. It made me really want to get
a motorcycle (something I've always wanted anyway, but still have never
owned )-: ).
ZAMM is great reading for anyone, for anything he or she wants to get out of
it.
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||||
___ __ ___ Kirk Pearson
/ \/ \ | \ uunet!csu-cs!pearson
_/ \| \ pea...@handel.cs.colostate.edu
\__ pearson%handel.cs.colostate.edu@cunyvm
"Elvis was a truck driver who made a record for his mama, sold a lot of
copies, became a big star, got fat, took dope and died. Any questions?"
-- Bill Ramal
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | ||||||
Stefan Fielding-Isaacs
>In article <64...@ncar.ucar.edu> il...@cgdra.ucar.edu (Ilana Stern) writes:
>>Since people have been posting their reasons for _not_ reading ZAMM,
>>I thought I'd share why and how I _did_ read it.
>>
>[story of reading ZAMM in school deleted...]
>
I first read it freshman year in college. I'd been working
part-time repairing friends cars and found myself wondering
what it would be like to work on a bike. Shortly thereafter
I was asked to fix a bike. I worked on them, cafe'ing them
out for friends and souping them up for at least a year
before I learned how to ride them myself.
Strange, the book led me to work on them first, and then
ride them second. Probably not a typical migration path.
Stef
Stefan Fielding-Isaacs AMA/CCS #120
Sun Microsystems, Federal Systems Division MRA expert #60
Milpitas, California (408) 276-7971
"Heaven is the streets of Steamboat on a sunny day."
Paul O'Neill
>
>Readers are likely to find much more than just a book about motorcycles.
>
>Or about Zen.
>
Can all this ZAMM stuff. Across the US on a bike. Pshaw!
How about around the world on a Triumph?
Lots of philosophy, too. I sure liked it, I think. Long time ago.
(One of his sponsers was Lucas :-)
TITLE : Jupiter's travels
AUTHOR : Simon, Ted, 1931-
EDITION : 1st ed. in the U.S.A.
PUBLISHER : Garden City, N.Y. : Doubleday,
PUB. DATE : 1980, c1979.
DESCRIPTION : 424 p. : maps ; 24 cm.
LANGUAGE : ENGLISH
SUBJECT : Simon, Ted, 1931-
: Voyages around the world -- 1951-
: Cyclists -- Great Britain -- Biography
Paul O'Neill p...@oce.orst.edu
Coastal Imaging Lab
OSU--Oceanography
Corvallis, OR 97331 503-737-3251