Let's discuss rust!
willshak
iron or steel.
There is no one paint color for rust, despite what Testors and other
model paint manufacturers want you to believe..
In my experience, rust comes in many colors. It is not necessary to view
a military vehicle to see this. A good source for military vehicle rust
color is right under your car. If your car is more than a few years old,
check the tailpipe, muffler, and frame for rust, and these are not
moving parts. Check the suspension. Find any Orange?
In the back of my yard, which borders a large wooded area, there is a
piece of farm equipment that is half buried in the dirt. It looks like
something that was towed behind a tractor and is constructed of various
sizes of angle iron. It has been there for the 22 years that I have
lived here and has been subjected to rain, snow, and drought for those
22 years. It is not Orange in color, even though it has never moved. It
is a very dark brown, almost Black in color. There are also pieces of
steel fencing that were used to keep cows from wandering. These are
brown in color.
My point is, I see a lot of tank models with Orange rust on the treads.
These treads are moving and subject to abrasion, dings, water, mud,
snow, and other things that wipe away dry rust, leaving a very dark
brown rust where parts are not subject to contact with others, and these
parts are shiny where two parts rub together as in drive and bogie
wheels on a tank tread, whether or not they have rubber treads.
I'm not disparaging any models showing orange rust, I just want to help
others apply realistic weathering.
Does anyone have any different experiences or opinions?
--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
To email, remove the double zeroes after @
Enzo Matrix
Not different. I agree with everything that you have said. I would also
point out that rust has a texture. Try mixing your rust paint colour with
talcum powder to provide that bubbled texture. Where the rust has been
breaking through paint, use a salt mask.
Get some ordinary table salt and dissolve it in water to provide a saturated
solution. Dab the salt on the areas that will be uncovered. Let the salt
solution dry. Then, spray the main coat of paint over the top. Once the
paint has dried, rinse the model in warm water so that the salt dissolves
away. This will leave a random pattern of rust showing through the
paintwork.
--
Enzo
I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.
The Old Man
>
> - Show quoted text -
I've heard (but NOT tried) of painting the model with actual rust.
According to the tip that I saw, rust out a steel screw or nail in
some vinegar for a few days or weeks until you get a ~lot~ of rust in
suspension. Brush this on the model in the area where rust would be
expected to be seen and let dry. Later, spray of light coat of clear
flat over the rust to fix it in place. I'm told that real rust will
have a shade and patina that paints can't quite match.
Bill Shatzer
Rust comes in all sorts of color flavors. But orangish red or orangish
brown is not uncommon.
http://www.keaggy.com/rust/
http://www.arctic-photo.com/images/abstract_texture/pages/rust.html
http://www.sonic.net/~dsscha/HumpbackImages/WreckRust.jpg
http://www.sonic.net/~dsscha/HumpbackImages/WreckTop2.jpg
In fact, that last photo kinda shows the range of colors rust can exhibit.
Fresh rust is orangish. It tends to darken towards a brown or reddish
brown as it ages. But presumably any rust on a operational vehicle or
ship (as opposed to a derelict) would be fresh. Ordinarily, rust would
be removed or repainted before it had time to darken appreciably.
Cheers,
Cheers,
Rufus
Ditto...except that my preferred texturing matter for both rust and
non-skid is baking soda. It's fine enough that you can control the
"grit" of it with the amount you use.
--
- Rufus
Ron Smith
willshak wrote:
> My point is, I see a lot of tank models with Orange rust on the treads.
> These treads are moving and subject to abrasion, dings, water, mud,
> snow, and other things that wipe away dry rust, leaving a very dark
> brown rust where parts are not subject to contact with others, and these
> parts are shiny where two parts rub together as in drive and bogie
> wheels on a tank tread, whether or not they have rubber treads.
> I'm not disparaging any models showing orange rust, I just want to help
> others apply realistic weathering.
> Does anyone have any different experiences or opinions?
Actually orange is the color of fresh rust and tank treads that move and
abrade away the old rust to show bright metal DO turn orange first.
Enzo Matrix
>
> I've heard (but NOT tried) of painting the model with actual rust.
> According to the tip that I saw, rust out a steel screw or nail in
> some vinegar for a few days or weeks until you get a ~lot~ of rust in
> suspension. Brush this on the model in the area where rust would be
> expected to be seen and let dry. Later, spray of light coat of clear
> flat over the rust to fix it in place. I'm told that real rust will
> have a shade and patina that paints can't quite match.
There is a model railway product available in the UK that actually *is*
rust. You paint on the base coat and then apply a solution that causes the
base coat to oxidise and become real rust.
Enzo Matrix
> Ditto...except that my preferred texturing matter for both rust and
> non-skid is baking soda. It's fine enough that you can control the
> "grit" of it with the amount you use.
Excellent tip! Thanks for that.
Kevin(Bluey)
in a jar with water works good .I just leave it until the steel wool
rusts away and then grind the rust in a motar and pedstal to a fine powder.
Steel wool and vinegar leaves a black coloured residue ,but turns
brownish when used.
I also have an old cast iron dutch oven which is out in the garden and
gets water in it from the sprinkler ,it makes really decent rust powder
when dried out.
--
Kevin (Bluey)
"I'm not young enough to know everything."
Gordon McLaughlin
1970's. They had Chieftain tanks and FV432 and FV434 carriers. I took
special note of the track colours. Brand new tracks were painted in a low
gloss black which I had also seen on Centurions in the 1960's.
Tracks that had been in use for some time had all weathered to a similar
colour which I think was a mixture of rust and dirt. This was a light
greyish buff colour. I later mixed this colour very successfully by first
mixing equal parts of black and white to produce a neutral light to mid
toned grey. I then mixed this with an equal amount of Humbrol No 26 Khaki
or No 29 Dark Earth. These two mixes covered the narrow range of variations
in the colour that I saw. The black rubber track pads had a dark grey
appearance produced by the grit and dirt embedded in them. Where the road
wheels ran in contact with the inner surface of the tracks, the paint had
worn off and the bare metal showed as a dull steel colour with a slight
gloss to it.
I don't doubt that some tracks might be orange when freshly rusted but I
think it would be unusual for it to last long.
Gordon McLaughlin
"Ron Smith" <rwsm...@rcn.com> wrote in message
news:wI2dnZU-2cew8s_b...@rcn.net...
willshak
> I remember going to Catterick to see the resident armoured regiment in the
> 1970's. They had Chieftain tanks and FV432 and FV434 carriers. I took
> special note of the track colours. Brand new tracks were painted in a low
> gloss black which I had also seen on Centurions in the 1960's.
>
> Tracks that had been in use for some time had all weathered to a similar
> colour which I think was a mixture of rust and dirt. This was a light
> greyish buff colour. I later mixed this colour very successfully by first
> mixing equal parts of black and white to produce a neutral light to mid
> toned grey. I then mixed this with an equal amount of Humbrol No 26 Khaki
> or No 29 Dark Earth. These two mixes covered the narrow range of variations
> in the colour that I saw. The black rubber track pads had a dark grey
> appearance produced by the grit and dirt embedded in them. Where the road
> wheels ran in contact with the inner surface of the tracks, the paint had
> worn off and the bare metal showed as a dull steel colour with a slight
> gloss to it.
>
> I don't doubt that some tracks might be orange when freshly rusted but I
> think it would be unusual for it to last long.
>
> Gordon McLaughlin
>
That's true. And one cannot go to a museum to see what a tank looked
like during war.
Someone posted examples of rust on concrete and steel ships that were
wrecked. That is not the same as steel on moving vehicles.
Just examine any piece of tracked construction equipment for how steel
tracks rusts and weathers.
I don't really know, but was the steel used to build tanks regular
ordinary steel, or were there some other ingredients to retard extreme
rusting, or make it a little stronger?
I don't mean to be contrary, but just want the best way to weather models.
> "Ron Smith" <rwsm...@rcn.com> wrote in message
> news:wI2dnZU-2cew8s_b...@rcn.net...
>
>> willshak wrote:
>>
>>> My point is, I see a lot of tank models with Orange rust on the treads.
>>> These treads are moving and subject to abrasion, dings, water, mud, snow,
>>> and other things that wipe away dry rust, leaving a very dark brown rust
>>> where parts are not subject to contact with others, and these parts are
>>> shiny where two parts rub together as in drive and bogie wheels on a tank
>>> tread, whether or not they have rubber treads.
>>> I'm not disparaging any models showing orange rust, I just want to help
>>> others apply realistic weathering.
>>> Does anyone have any different experiences or opinions?
>>>
>> Actually orange is the color of fresh rust and tank treads that move and
>> abrade away the old rust to show bright metal DO turn orange first.
>>
>
>
>
Ron Smith
Gordon McLaughlin wrote:
> I don't doubt that some tracks might be orange when freshly rusted but I
> think it would be unusual for it to last long.
It lasts about 2 minutes of running at speed before it's polished off.
Mad Modeller
Rustall? It's been available here for about 15 years. I've never tried
it myself so I can't offer an opinion.
Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr.
Mad Modeller
Oh come on, you just knew 'somebody' would.
Bill Banaszak, MFE Sr.
Richard Marmo
best weathering materials are the various powders (such as the new Magic
Dust) that can be mixed to create the entire range or rust tones. And let's
not forget that you can also mix larger amounts of weathering powders into
water or clear coat to create a slurry that ranges from thin to thick. This
approach can be used to replicate everything from rust to mud.
Hope this helps.
Richard Marmo
http://modelersweaponsshop.freeyellow.com/weathering_supplies.html
"willshak" <will...@00hvc.rr.com> wrote in message
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