> OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
> Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>
OK, I'll bite. When I built my Chipmunk, I decided to get clever and make
a jig to help cut all those red stripes. I fashioned a jig out of a 2x4
with another piece fastened to it to create an edge stop, and razor-knife
groove the right distance away from the stop. I clamped a straight-edge
over the wood and slipped the full width covering under the straight edge.
Then, just pull the edge of the covering up to the stop and draw the knife
through the groove while holding the straight edge down with the the
forefinger and thumb of my other hand to keep the material tight.
By the 14th pass,I was getting GOOD. And fast. And inattentive. I failed
to recognize that the forefinger holding down the straightedge was now
rolled over the edge, and I drew the knife right over it. Nice deep, 1
1/2" ling swipe down the length of my finger. Bled like hell. 10 stitches.
Whatta schmuck, if I do say so myself.
From that day on, I re-focus myself EVERY time I draw a knife.
-----
P.S. I am very good at this sort of thing. I have also held a small part
to be drilled, only to drill some portion of a hand or finger after the
bit popped through the material.... Burned myself on the monokote iron,
glued my hands to just about everything in the shop, including my other
hand, ....
C'mon guys - let's hear it. This is gonna be a great thread, I just know
it. So give 'til it hurts...:)
/-------------------------------------------------------------\
| Greg Heumann gr...@heumann.com |
| Peninsula Channel Commanders Half Moon Bay, CA |
| www.aimnet.com/~greg/pcc.html
|
| |
\-------------------------------------------------------------/
I had just put in a brand new #11 blade. The handle rolled off the table
and headed point first for my sneakered foot. I picked it up and didn't
think much about it untill.....my foot started feeling damp! I took off
the sneaker but did not remember putting on red socks. The point had
made a direct hit on a small vien. Nothing real serious, just black and
blue and real sore for a few days. Lesson learned, no more round handles
and when something rolls off table, I jump back.
-Bill Archibald
>OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
My friend did serious nerve and ligament damage done to his hand.
He was cutting out some sloppily die-cut lite ply with a #11
blade,applying brute force. The wood broke where he was not expecting it
to. Needless to say that he was not thinking safety when cutting toward
his other hand that way. It was gruesome.
I once stuck one of my favorites.....an icepick....into my thumb. I
stopped up the hole to stop the bleeding, but it did not stop! Hey!
wheres that blood coming from? I then noticed that it had gone
completely through. Got very sore!
Bob
"Stay off those binaries!"
Like the first poster I also had an exacto knife come off the table
with a nice fresh blade. I had to pull it out of my heel though. ]-(
Ouch...
Mark Hoy mark...@eng.sun.com
--
--
Mark Hoy mark...@eng.sun.com SunSoft x84068 415 786-4068
Greg...
You are a real "Tim the Tool Man" if I've ever seen one!
I've had a few incidents myself, but none like yours. My Exacto rolled off
the table and stuck in my flip-flop between my 1st and 2nd toe... just lucky
I guess! I work around heavy machinery all day and HAVE to be careful or I
could die. I use the same safe practices in my shop.
The reason for this response though was to remind you and others that if you
seriously cut yourself as you just described, thin CA will close the cut and
help you get to the ER for stitches without bleeding all over the car. Take
a bottle of CA remover with you so the doc can get it off your injury.
Good Flying
Fly Safe
Floyd->>>
This posting reminded me that several years ago at work, a draftsman had a
minor accident that could have been more serious using an Exacto
knife. It was fitted with the common, long triangular-blade. I believe he was
cutting thin cardboard whilst leaning over a flat drawing board, and the
tip of the blade broke off and flew up at his face leaving a small mark
next to his eye! Most people (myself included) were amazed that this could
happen, but the guy to whom it happened was careful to always put on safety
glasses thereafter, so obviously he did not believe he was doing something
foolish or avoidable at the time.
--
*****************************Rod Woolley*************************************
>OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>I had just put in a brand new #11 blade. The handle rolled off the table
>and headed point first for my sneakered foot. I picked it up and didn't
>think much about it untill.....my foot started feeling damp! I took off
>the sneaker but did not remember putting on red socks. The point had
>made a direct hit on a small vien. Nothing real serious, just black and
>blue and real sore for a few days. Lesson learned, no more round handles
>and when something rolls off table, I jump back.
>-Bill Archibald
The same exact thing almost happened to me when I was about 10 years old.
I was building something on the old drafting table that was my workbench. The
table was angled toward me at a very slight angle. I picked up a paint bottle
without thinking about the x-acto knife that was leaning against it. The knife
quickly rolled off the edge of the table and I instictively jumped back. The
knife stuck in the floor right where my BARE foot (hey, I was only 10) had
been a second earlier! The knife surely would have stuck my foot pretty good
since I wasn't wearing any shoes. I always put the knives back in the kit after
that.
Something else that's sort of modeling related- also when I was about 10 years
old (c. 1981). I was soldering a Heathkit digital alarm clock kit while sitting
on the carpeting (why I was doing this on the floor, I will never know). My mom
called me to dinner so I went to stand up. I had set the soldering iron on
the carpet (!) and when I put my hand down to get up, I put it right across the
iron! I pushed down pretty hard before I realized I was getting burned. The
result: a very nasty (2nd degree?) burn across the entire palm of my hand. The
carpeting didn't fare too well, either. I remember keeping that hand hidden
under the table during dinner so my parents wouldn't freak out. BTW, I did
finish the clock and it still keeps perfect time. :)
Chris
>On Thu, 18 Jul 1996 14:52:20 -0400, Wm F Archibald <wa...@ultranet.com>
>wrote:
>>OK, OK,
>> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>My friend did serious nerve and ligament damage done to his hand.
>He was cutting out some sloppily die-cut lite ply with a #11
>blade,applying brute force. The wood broke where he was not expecting it
>to. Needless to say that he was not thinking safety when cutting toward
>his other hand that way. It was gruesome.
>I once stuck one of my favorites.....an icepick....into my thumb. I
>stopped up the hole to stop the bleeding, but it did not stop! Hey!
>wheres that blood coming from? I then noticed that it had gone
>completely through. Got very sore!
>Bob
>"Stay off those binaries!"
After working in manufacturing for several years, you learn ALOT of
safety awareness. One thing I learned and use is - Always cut away
from you. Always cut away from things that potentially can be injured
or destroyed due to slippage.
Just food for thought...
Mark
I can top that.
When I way a stupid kid(13) I was backing a model boat. I carved out a place
in the bottom to put some lead for ballast.
I thought that I would use a soldering iron to melt solder in the openning. I
finally got it filled with molten lead when the thing fell out of the vice,
and spilled the solder on my bare leg. I had to pell the solder off my leg.
To this day, X years later, I still have a round scar from that.
My 2cents..
Wayne
90243
Mark Kriz, S.J.
While glueing some plastic parts together with thin CA, it wasn't
drying quick enough, so I proceded to blow on it (I was inexperienced
at the time). Well, the water-thin CA sprayed against the side of the
piece of plastic and rebounded back into my mouth, glueing the sides
of my lips together, along with temporarily glueing the tip of my
tongue to my upper lip! It came apart easily, but even after a day
later, I had no sense of taste on my tongue due to the thin layer of
CA still dried on it.
Joe Klemencic
j...@prairienet.org
I was in high school, building my second airplane. I was such a plane nut at the time
that I was in the habit of waking up, going down to the kitchen for some OJ, and on
to the workshop, still in my PJ's.
I was down there working for an hour or so, when I set the exacto knife down
on the edge of the bench. Of course, it rolled off. I was working on getting a glue
joint set at the time, and didn't pay much attention. I could feel that it had
landed beside my foot, and it felt like the hilt was laying across my instep.
Well, it wasn't. I looked down once I had gotten that glue joint set and
there was that knife, sticking straight up out of my foot. Didn't hurt a bit.
The sight of that knife at attention did kind of panic me though....
MMMOOOOOOOOOOOOOMM!!!!
John
>In article <31EE87...@ultranet.com>, Wm F Archibald
><wa...@ultranet.com> wrote:
>
>> OK, OK,
>> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>> Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>>
>
>
>OK, I'll bite. When I built my Chipmunk, I decided to get clever and make
>a jig to help cut all those red stripes. I fashioned a jig out of a 2x4
>with another piece fastened to it to create an edge stop, and razor-knife
>groove the right distance away from the stop. I clamped a straight-edge
>over the wood and slipped the full width covering under the straight edge.
>Then, just pull the edge of the covering up to the stop and draw the knife
>through the groove while holding the straight edge down with the the
>forefinger and thumb of my other hand to keep the material tight.
>
>By the 14th pass,I was getting GOOD. And fast. And inattentive. I failed
>to recognize that the forefinger holding down the straightedge was now
>rolled over the edge, and I drew the knife right over it. Nice deep, 1
>1/2" ling swipe down the length of my finger. Bled like hell. 10 stitches.
>Whatta schmuck, if I do say so myself.
>
>From that day on, I re-focus myself EVERY time I draw a knife.
>
>-----
I did almost the exact same thing. I use a good straigjt edge yard
stick as a guide when I cut Monokote. I was cutting parts of a
repeated triangle pattern when I got careless. The tip of my pointer
finger was hanging over the edge of the straight edge. Zip! I cut
the tip clean off - I thought finger nails were supposed to help
prevent such accidents, but it too was straight as the ruler when
done. It didn't really start to hurt 'till the next day.
I now have a cutting board with clamps that do the holding. I still
look where my fingers are before cutting.
As well you should!
Happy Flying,
Floyd->>>
What... you wear flip flops at work also?? Wish *I* could!!! <G>
>The reason for this response though was to remind you and others that if you
>seriously cut yourself as you just described, thin CA will close the cut and
>help you get to the ER for stitches without bleeding all over the car. Take
>a bottle of CA remover with you so the doc can get it off your injury.
Once I use CA on the cut, I never go to the doctor. It works good by itself. I *DON'T*
recommend this! I just hate paying the doctors.
Kelly Matchett kma...@tgn.net
AMA 474754 IMAA 19509
Van Vleck,Texas
>I did almost the exact same thing. I use a good straigjt edge yard
>stick as a guide when I cut Monokote. I was cutting parts of a
>repeated triangle pattern when I got careless. The tip of my pointer
>finger was hanging over the edge of the straight edge. Zip! I cut
>the tip clean off - I thought finger nails were supposed to help
>prevent such accidents, but it too was straight as the ruler when
>done. It didn't really start to hurt 'till the next day.
>
>I now have a cutting board with clamps that do the holding. I still
>look where my fingers are before cutting.
>
>
I know where mine would be. Right in my pocket! OUCH!!
When an X-Acto knife rolls off the edge of the bench, don't try to catch
it by clenching your thighs together. It pushes the pointed end into
your leg, and the knurling on the handle hurts when you pull it out.
It also puts a hole in your jeans.
But you do gain a valuable lesson.
>OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
Great thread! I did the Xacto thing until I got those with the
chuck-lock in the rear of the handle. My favorite accident was from
using CA:
When I was single, I'd build deep into the night in my basement, and
being tired from a day of work, I would sit on a bar-stool in front of
the bench. In my concentration to make progress, I didn't always clear
much space around the projects (Read: my bench was always a mess).
Anyways, when you build late at night, you take off your shoes, fold
your legs around the bar-stool, and have at it. About 1 AM, my elbow
knocks the 2 oz bottle of ZAP pink off the bench. At 1:15AM I look for
it by jumping off the bench... I stepped squarely on the bottle,
cracking the plastic and drenching my stockinged feet! Sizzle!! Aieee.
After soaking my foot for an hour, I have a few minor burns and a sock
glued to my foot. This was in the days before debonders, so I looked
in my chemicals collection and only could come up with my precious K&B
Racing fuel as anything close to a solvent to remove my sock. This
worked, but, my secretary really teased me the next morning as I went
to work all bleary eyed and with two different colored socks on.
Lessons: Nitromethane is a great debonder,
Make holders so that those bottles of CA stay put
Get several pairs of socks the same color
-Fritz
Wm F Archibald <wa...@ultranet.com> wrote:
>OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>I had just put in a brand new #11 blade. The handle rolled off the table
Andy.
>
>Once I use CA on the cut, I never go to the doctor. It works good by itself. I *DON'T*
>recommend this! I just hate paying the doctors.
Hey....I thought I was the only one that sutured cuts with CYA......
That stuff works good. It's good for damaged finger nails also. Burns
for a minute or 2, but really helps keep cuts clean and heal
better......
Now of course I do not use it on gunshot wounds or major trauma....just
on fingers to get those skin flaps out of the way.
I'm sure our docs frown upon this, but I'm also sure it's better than
the alternative......an open cut with filth, balsa dust, and floor
sweepings impacted in the cut...
(Band-aids just get in the way)
=:-)
I was using thin CA to fix a split in a sheet of balsa. The two pieces
kind of snapped together and squirted the CA out of the joint. A small
droplet squirted into my eye and instantly cured, burning the cornea.
I really can't recommend that experience.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark S. Miller dasm...@aol.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
"The opinions expressed are mine alone and do not reflect
those of my employer, family, the U.S. Government, or any
national television program. They all evidently know some-
thing I don't."
>>Once I use CA on the cut, I never go to the doctor. It works good by
>>itself. I *DON'T* recommend this! I just hate paying the doctors.
>[...]
>That stuff works good. It's good for damaged finger nails also. Burns
>for a minute or 2, but really helps keep cuts clean and heal
>better......
>Now of course I do not use it on gunshot wounds or major trauma....just
>on fingers to get those skin flaps out of the way.
>I'm sure our docs frown upon this, but I'm also sure it's better than
>the alternative......an open cut with filth, balsa dust, and floor
>sweepings impacted in the cut...
Is there any worry about the side-effects of CA or component chemicals
getting into the bloodstream? I mean, I guess it wouldn't get far (being
CA glue and all), but still...
--
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
nate waddoups email sent to any address of mine is
nat...@metareality.com subject to posting via usenet and/or
http://www.metareality.com/~nathan serving via the world wide web.
Needless to say it was quite
painful so I decided to fix it with CA and light weight fiberglass.
I cut a bit of fiberglass to the shape of the nail and then put
some thick CA on the nail and then put the fiberglass over it.
Worked perfectly and recently fell off leaving a perfectly
intact nail underneath.
--
+------------------------+-------------------------+
|Peter Ashwood-Smith | Email: pet...@nortel.ca |
|Northern Telecom | Work#: (613) 763-4534 |
|Ottawa, Ontario, Canada | Home#: (819) 595-9032 |
+------------------------+-------------------------+
I was tightening a drill bit with the "chuck", and accidentally squeezed
the trigger. My finger was caught in the chuck and spun around with the
drill and fractured. Ooops!
After going to bed I was struck with wondering if I had put my plane on
charge for Saturday's flying. So down to the basement workshop in my pajamas
to check. I was in the habit of leaving a small 25 watt soldering iron hang
over the edge of the bench to cool off when I finished using it. With only
the 40 watt bulb at the other end of the cellar at my back I made my way to
the bench. I reached up over the bench to turn on the light. My chargers
were plugged in - and so was my soldering iron. I think I smelled the
problem before the pain.
I since have become a devout user of soldeing iron holders.
Red S.
AMA 951 IMAA 18939
Flying Gators MAC
Gainesville, FL
UGH.
:)
--
-swb- (Steve Bixby, sbi...@crl.com)
The mind boggles---- what on earth does anyone do with a pint of nail
varnish remover? Your mum must know her son very well and have a
great deal of foresight!
--
*****************************Rod Woolley*************************************
Check DejaNews for last year's thread on this topic.
One fellow posted information from a medical database
on the use of CA in surgery, etc.
> Ross Meyer wrote:
> >
> > I thought I read somewhere that the original CA was developed by Kodak
during
> > the Korean war to be used in field hospitals as opposed to stitches.
I've also
> > heard dentist use it to repair dental work. Can anyone verify?
A dentist in our club claims it was developed to replace sutures in liver
surgery, since the liver isn't strong enough to retain normal sutures. I
have no idea if this is true, but he's a decent sort of fellow, at least
as far as dentists go... :)
: Those dremel cutting wheels are dangerous too.
: Wear those glasses people!
Indeed. I have a very nice pit on my glasses, about where the pupil of my
eye usually is, caused by a piece of a cutting wheel that shattered. Had I
not ben wearing glasses, the fragment would have sliced right into my eye.
--
Dave Nasatir Telephone +510 845 1029
Fax +510 644 2781
e-mail nas...@garnet.Berkeley.EDU
-snip-
>
>Is there any worry about the side-effects of CA or component chemicals
>getting into the bloodstream? I mean, I guess it wouldn't get far (being
>CA glue and all), but still...
>
hmmm, is the "cyano" in cyano-acrylate (sp?) the one i think it is?
iain
Iain Chalmers, mighty media productions
http://www.mightymedia.com.au
big...@mightymedia.com.au
>The mind boggles---- what on earth does anyone do with a pint of nail
>varnish remover? Your mum must know her son very well and have a
>great deal of foresight!
>
>
>
She must have got it at a discount store or something. You should see our
supply of bandages.
Andy.
>OK, OK,
> If no one else will start it ....I will. *My Favorite Accident With A
>Modelling Tool*. Maybe others will learn from our mistakes.
>
Everybody knows mixing thick CA with copious amounts of kicker kind of
spurts, pops, etc. I did too, but was too lazy to put on the trusty
ol' glasses. The trouble is, it's fun to watch this stuff kick off.
It spatterered right into my left eye.
Now the trouble is, when one eye is that toasted, you can't see
straight with the other one. I wound up calling my girlfiend at work
(30 min away) and having her leave work, come by, and take me to the
hospital.
No permanent damage, but I had to wear a patch for a week, missed 2
days of work (not so bad), and the pain medication kept me distanced
from reality for several days (not bad at all).
I wear glasses now whenever I am gluing (even epoxy) or using power
equipment. Those dremel cutting wheels are dangerous too.
Wear those glasses people! And by the way, why can't X-acto square
off the but end of the knife handle?
<snip>
suggestion:
The triangular rubber "grips" made for pencils will fit over a standard
(no. 1) X-acto handle. They're super-cheap, and will do an excellent job
of preventing the handle from rolling off the bench.
Cheers!
Jonathan
I was building in the house and running a dremel. I hear a ZING Thunk and notice I no
longer have the bit in the chuck. We never have found it. It is somewhere in the living
room... Kinda spooky.
>
> The triangular rubber "grips" made for pencils will fit over a standard
> (no. 1) X-acto handle. They're super-cheap, and will do an excellent job
> of preventing the handle from rolling off the bench.
>
Excellent suggestion. In light of the overwhelming number of people who
wrote of the exact same injury, my guess is that this is something
everyone should do. I will certainly do it to all my knives.
/GH
That's what I thought too! Isn't that the byproduct when you
burn the stuff?
--
________ _____ ______
___ __ )____ ____ /___________ /_
__ __ |_ / / /_ __/_ ___/__ __ \
_ /_/ / / /_/ / / /_ / /__ _ / / /
/_____/ \__,_/ \__/ \___/ /_/ /_/
>during
>> > the Korean war to be used in field hospitals as opposed to stitches.
>I've also
>> > heard dentist use it to repair dental work. Can anyone verify?
>
--
Dentists don't use CA glue to make any of their repairs that will go in a
patients mouth, since CA is water soluble over time (especially in saliva).
A good reason not to use it for repairs on things that will be soaked
constantly.
Martin
AMA #240487
Amateur Radio #KD4OAE
Surgury was one of the original uses, and I use it for small cuts all
of the time. Even keep a tube in my desk drawer for paper cuts. ;->
I used it to close a deep cut that was getting arterial blood the other
day (got my finger a bit to close while adjusting low idle) the nursing
staff that work for me about ____. It seems that the medicos quit
using it where there was high blood flow years ago because the CA
crystals tended to dislodge and move about in the body until they found
a really nasty place to stop. Stroke city.
Van Moore
>>From that day on, I re-focus myself EVERY time I draw a knife.
>>
>>-----
>
>I did almost the exact same thing. I use a good straigjt edge yard
>stick as a guide when I cut Monokote. I was cutting parts of a
>repeated triangle pattern when I got careless. The tip of my pointer
>finger was hanging over the edge of the straight edge. Zip! I cut
>the tip clean off - I thought finger nails were supposed to help
>prevent such accidents, but it too was straight as the ruler when
>done. It didn't really start to hurt 'till the next day.
>
>I now have a cutting board with clamps that do the holding. I still
>look where my fingers are before cutting.
>
A good way to avoid this in the future is use a T bar sander without the
sandpaper for a straight edge keeps your fingers away from the blade. Now if
I would have taken my own advice..........
I was using CA. Got my thumb and forefinger stuck together extremely well.
That CA is good stuff. Well, not knowing where my sister hid her damn nail
polish remover, I ripped my fingers apart.
Result: forefinger with skin. thumb without outer skin. Extremely painful.
It started burning like hell, so I thought "Ahh. Put some ice on it." Went to
the freezer and saw there was no ice left in the ice tray. (Damn. Damn. Damn.)
I should have called it quits and stuck to cold water, but it was burning like
hell and extreme cold works best, so I put my thumb down on the freezer
bottom.
Felt good for a while.
Tried to take my thumb off.
You can imagine what came next. Yes, the thumb was stuck good onto the freezer
wall. This time I was bright enough to take a bottle of water and pour it onto
the area. Got my thumb loose, but....
Result : SKINNED THUMB and FROSTBITE.
Its an ugly combination. I kid you not!!!
My doctor gave me the devil about it.
Gussie
There you go, clouding the issue with facts... <G>
> In Navy Carrier (C/L) we use a mixture of 70% Nitro, 20% oil and
>10% Propelyne Oxide. Without the Prope it is very difficult to get
>it to idle, it cools off too fast.
>
What's up with this? Is there that much demand for power with a size limit? Enlighten me.
Then again, "you C/L guys" try to be different. <G>
>
>heh heh heh.
>And if you smoke or do something stupid while using pure Nitromethane to
>debond your cyano, you will soon post here with an accident story to end
all
>accident stories. :)
>
>Gussie
Not true. Nitro is rather inert as long as it is not sensitized. Pure
nitro is a clear liquid. The Nitro we use has a yellow dye in it. If the
Nitro changes color then it is sensitized and you should call somebody
(bomb squad) to remove it. Otherwise it is a very stable solvent.
Methanol is the flammable portion of your fuel and Nitro gives it more
power. In Navy Carrier (C/L) we use a mixture of 70% Nitro, 20% oil and
10% Propelyne Oxide. Without the Prope it is very difficult to get it to
idle, it cools off too fast.
================================================================
Bill Calkins AMA 1976 clf...@aol.com
Carrier Fliers do it very slowly
================================================================
>Felt good for a while.
>Tried to take my thumb off.
>You can imagine what came next. Yes, the thumb was stuck good onto the
>freezer
>wall. This time I was bright enough to take a bottle of water and pour it
>onto
>the area. Got my thumb loose, but....
>
>Result : SKINNED THUMB and FROSTBITE.
Were you one of those kids who stuck his tongue to the flag pole in the
winter?
;-)
>Were you one of those kids who stuck his tongue to the flag pole in the
>winter?
>
I was, but to a pole at the top of a slide at the park (like an idiot,
I ripped it off, leaving the tip behind).
Joe Klemencic
j...@prairienet.org
Incredible! I certainly hope you are well done now!
--
Blue Skies.....
AMA 313072
Yes, There really is a Kalamazoo
Yup it is, but the C=N group is not harmful if attached to organic compounds.
Methyl-cyanide actually has medicinal value. But attach it to a Potassium atom
(KCN) and you will rock.
Gussie
>Were you one of those kids who stuck his tongue to the flag pole in the
>winter?
Only when the soup was too hot. :)
Gussie
Well, nitro *can* be very explosive. And when you say sensitized, does it
crystallize on the bottle walls? I haven't checked the actual mechanism
for nitromethane. Ether, I know, crystallizes out near the bottle cap.
Its a good thing to know if you mix fuel at home (like I used to.)
If you see any signs of crystallization on or near the bottle cap, then it
is dangerous to even open the bottle up. May cause an explosion. happened in
our lab once. Old unused bottle. Blew up like a bomb and injured 2 people.
A good precaution is to inspect all old bottles of chemicals before trying to
open them.
Anyone know off-hand the dangerous tell-tale signs for other fuel ingredients?
Gussie
OUCH!
Thanks to this thread, at least you know there are a bunch of other idiots
out there just as dumb as you... (myself included!)
Hope it heals quickly. Sorry to hear about your misfortune.
/GH
Is this nitromethane you're talking here? I've always brewed my own
fuel for my Cox'es, bought nitromethane from several sources (pharmacies
to hobbyshops), and no-one has *ever* warned me that the bottle may
become a bomb. Would they even sell it if it was possible to make bombs
out of? Now nitroglyserine is explosive, but that's not the stuff I put
into my engines...
-Tapio-
No no no. I was talking about "ether". Its the ether that blew up.
people use it for the diesels.
normally it isnt dangerous, but if it gets old, it is a worry. you cant do
anything about it but call the hazardous chemical disposal guys.
> fuel for my Cox'es, bought nitromethane from several sources (pharmacies
> to hobbyshops), and no-one has *ever* warned me that the bottle may
> become a bomb.
well, any chemical stuff they sell over the counter is a bit different. :)
they add shitloads of inhibitors in them to prevent accidental oxidation.
If you work with pure chemicals like I do at work, you learn to be a bit
paranoid about everything.
> Would they even sell it if it was possible to make bombs out of?
> Now nitroglyserine is explosive, but that's not the stuff
Heh. Heh heh heh.
I see you arent related to chemistry, my lad. You can gets LOTS of things over
the counter which you can make bombs out of. Or rather... which turn into
bombs due to some freak accident or the other.
Now since this is a "favourite accident" thread, let me give you an example of
a fun home made pyrotechnic device.
(The following part can be Potentially Dangerous if you are a klutz) .
Ingredients : Potassium Permanganate (KMnO4) available as an ingestible
disinfectant and Glycerine (hey you can eat glycerine too.)
Well, take these 2 harmless substances available at the pharmacy of your
choice and mix them. No. First make a *little* pile of KMnO4... then add a few
drops of glycerine onto it. the reaction is delayed... so dont add it too fast
and flood the thing. If you do it right, it will soon start smouldering....
nice purple smoke.... and then all of a sudden...
WhooSH!!!!
Miniature fireworks. :)
We used to make mud/sand volcanoes and then put this in the middle... Makes a
damn good special effect if you do it right.
Gussie
ps: and ofcourse you can buy some good old fertilizer....
And a jolly good pip to you!
Fancy running into you in the metrop. like this. As for Bertram, I assure you,
I try to stay away from that fathead. Always getting me into things, he is.
Scarlet tights and gin my left eyeball !!!
Oh.. and before I forget, you were never more correct then when you mention
the Drones. Our local flying club here is called C.A.R.D.S.
Capital Area Radio DRONES Squadron. So I indeed am a member of TWO Drones
Clubs now. :)
pip-pip,
Gussie
ps: check out alt.fan.wodehouse sometime.
In article <4ti28c$j...@msunews.cl.msu.edu>, bhur...@egr.msu.edu says...
: > Is this nitromethane you're talking here? I've always brewed my own
: No no no. I was talking about "ether". Its the ether that blew up.
: people use it for the diesels.
Pheww... Then I still dare to enter my modelling studio, which has been
deserted for two days due to the half-full bottle of nitro on the
chemicals - shelf.
-Tapio-
(Ps. Just kidding!)
Nitromethane only becomes shock sensitive (explosive) when it is
mixed with amines (i.e. Chlorine). If for some reason chlorine gets into
the nitro and you shake it up, it will explode. I have even been told
that you could throw a match into an opened container and it will not ignite.
John Welsh
jwe...@lonestar.utsa.edu
___________________________
On 29 Jul 1996, Tapio Linkosalo wrote:
> Augustus Fink-Nottle (bhur...@egr.msu.edu) wrote:
> : In article <4tddm5$o...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>,
> : >Not true. Nitro is rather inert as long as it is not sensitized. Pure
> : >nitro is a clear liquid. The Nitro we use has a yellow dye in it. If the
> : >Nitro changes color then it is sensitized and you should call somebody
> : >(bomb squad) to remove it. Otherwise it is a very stable solvent.
>
> : Well, nitro *can* be very explosive. And when you say sensitized, does it
> : crystallize on the bottle walls? I haven't checked the actual mechanism
> : for nitromethane. Ether, I know, crystallizes out near the bottle cap.
> : Its a good thing to know if you mix fuel at home (like I used to.)
> : If you see any signs of crystallization on or near the bottle cap, then it
> : is dangerous to even open the bottle up. May cause an explosion. happened in
> : our lab once. Old unused bottle. Blew up like a bomb and injured 2 people.
> : A good precaution is to inspect all old bottles of chemicals before trying to
> : open them.
>
> Is this nitromethane you're talking here? I've always brewed my own
> fuel for my Cox'es, bought nitromethane from several sources (pharmacies
> to hobbyshops), and no-one has *ever* warned me that the bottle may
Hold on there, John! Either I am getting early senility or something is
wrong here. While my training is as a physicist, and I rarely delve into
the mysteries of better living through Chemistry (I leave that to my
wife, who is indeed a chemist), I seem to remember that an amine was an
organic compound containing the NH2 group, e.g. ethylamine is C2H5NH2
(these should be subscripts of course), just as ethanol is C2H5OH.
The explosive ingredient is, of course, nitorglycerine, which is
CH2NO3CHNO3CH2NO3. As I say, I know little chemistry, and it may be that
Chlorine acts as a catalyst in the presence of air to produce that
compound, and hopefuly maybe some chemist in the group reading this can
answer that. BUT chlorine is an inorganic halogen gas, and <not> an
amine!
Paul K.
:>:>nitro is a clear liquid. The Nitro we use has a yellow dye in it. If the
:>:>Nitro changes color then it is sensitized and you should call somebody
:>:>(bomb squad) to remove it. Otherwise it is a very stable solvent.
The dye is probably a PH color indicator. If the nitro gets a higher PH >12
the color turns from yellow into red or clear depending on the type of dye.
--
Cheers, Wilfred /^\
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ |N|
M.V.C. Jupiter Wilfred van Bergen |E|
ber...@mpn.cp.philips.com |R|
Model Jet Promoting Netherlands /|O|\
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ /_|_|_\
>> fuel for my Cox'es, bought nitromethane from several sources (pharmacies
>> to hobbyshops), and no-one has *ever* warned me that the bottle may
>> become a bomb.
>
>well, any chemical stuff they sell over the counter is a bit different. :)
>they add shitloads of inhibitors in them to prevent accidental oxidation.
>If you work with pure chemicals like I do at work, you learn to be a bit
>paranoid about everything.
Umm.. ??
Tech grade stuff is usually pretty pure. Not pure enough to use as a
carrier in a GC, but pure enough for most purposes..
>
>> Would they even sell it if it was possible to make bombs out of?
>> Now nitroglyserine is explosive, but that's not the stuff
Nitromenthane _is_ pretty inert, unless sensitized. To sensitize it,
you put in ammonia, or some other alkali. Then it becomes shock
sensitive.
Unsensitized nitromethane will detonate, but you need to use a
detonator. They use it for seismic shots.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Iskandar Taib | The only thing worse than Peach ala
Internet: nt...@silver.ucs.indiana.edu | Frog is Frog ala Peach
Home page: http://bigwig.geology.indiana.edu/iskandar/isk2.html
Heheh.. another newt fan ^O^
>Not true. Nitro is rather inert as long as it is not sensitized. Pure
>nitro is a clear liquid. The Nitro we use has a yellow dye in it. If the
>Nitro changes color then it is sensitized and you should call somebody
>(bomb squad) to remove it. Otherwise it is a very stable solvent.
>Methanol is the flammable portion of your fuel and Nitro gives it more
>power. In Navy Carrier (C/L) we use a mixture of 70% Nitro, 20% oil and
>10% Propelyne Oxide. Without the Prope it is very difficult to get it to
>idle, it cools off too fast.
Hmm..
Where do you find propylene oxide these days? The place I _was_
getting it from can't get it anymore. I was wanting to mix up high
nitro 1/2-A fuel, which benefits from having about 15% propylene
oxide, so I hear..
In small quantities, I hear acetone is a good substitute. But will it
work when you mix in 15%?
>> In Navy Carrier (C/L) we use a mixture of 70% Nitro, 20% oil and
>>10% Propelyne Oxide. Without the Prope it is very difficult to get
>>it to idle, it cools off too fast.
>>
>What's up with this? Is there that much demand for power with a size limit? Enlighten me.
>Then again, "you C/L guys" try to be different. <G>
He flies Navy Carrier. "Different" about described it.
Anyone want to formulate rules for a RC Carrier event?
>The dye is probably a PH color indicator. If the nitro gets a higher PH >12
>the color turns from yellow into red or clear depending on the type of dye.
The warning on the back of the bottle said "blue".
Might be pH, but it might also be an indicator of metallo-organic
complexes..
> John A. Welsh wrote:
>
> answer that. BUT chlorine is an inorganic halogen gas, and <not> an
> amine!
> Paul K.
Actually, chlorine is not a halogen gas.
>Nitro is also combustible, at the higher temperature and pressure that is
>provided by burning methanol. Then the nitro provides a much higher heat
>content when oxidized than methanol per unit volume. Heat is energy,
>simple as that. If it don't burn, its either oil or perfume!
>Rich Hollyday
>
>
Don't get me wrong, Nitro is flammable, but it is much harder to ignite
that Methanol. C/L racing changed their rules to use only 10% nitro years
ago. The first year, many racers were catching their models on fire.
They used to slosh fuel into and over the engine in an effort to cool it
and when they increased the percentage of Methanol, they just started
catching on fire.
>Hmm..
>
>Where do you find propylene oxide these days? The place I _was_
>getting it from can't get it anymore. I was wanting to mix up high
>nitro 1/2-A fuel, which benefits from having about 15% propylene
>oxide, so I hear..
I have about 1.5 gallons stashed in a cool dark place. At 10% that should
yield 15 gallons. Since I only use about 2-3 quarts per year I have a
pretty good supply. I bought mine before the new regulations went into
effect.
>
>In small quantities, I hear acetone is a good substitute. But will it
>work when you mix in 15%?
>
>
>
Don't know about acetone, only way is to try it.
>>Methanol is the flammable portion of your fuel and Nitro gives it more
>>power.
Nitro is also combustible, at the higher temperature and pressure that is
For the rocord. I did not write that.
John Welsh
_______________________________________-
>Actually, chlorine is not a halogen gas.
Then what, pray tell, is it?
>>Actually, chlorine is not a halogen gas.
>
>Then what, pray tell, is it?
>
>
Poisonous? derr ;-)
Rich Hollyday (jules...@aol.com)
Raleigh, NC AMA567744
I've also burned (with a soldering iron) and cut my fingers and hands so
many times that they're covered with scars...
--
Matt White
----------->
"Give me liberty, or give me warm Pepsi."
<-----------
I'm neither Physicist nor chemist, but _from memory_ (it was a while ago)
the hazardous goods data sheets we received at work with the last drum
of nitromethane indicated it was any strong alkali that could cause it to
become shock-sensitive. I have heard that in some cases the nitro changes
colour to show it's contaminated & therefore dangerous (I haven't tried
to prove this theory myself!!). I should have another look at the info.
I have also been told that it won't burn if you toss a match into a tin
of nitro...I think I'll give this one a miss too.
Martin.
Airsail International Ltd,
Auckland, New Zealand.
High quality Model Aircraft kit manufacturers.
(R/C DHC Beaver, Auster AOP9, Volksplane VP1, and coming soon..DHC Chipmunk)
(F/F Rubber Scale Auster AOP9, Pilatus PC9, CT4 Airtrainer, Pilatus Turbo
Porter)
(+ others...)
OUCH!
And wow - your ISP must have a HUGE backlog buffer... this thread died
out MONTHS ago!
--
-swb- (Steve Bixby, sbi...@crl.com)
The bandage was quite a sight. It was still on at the meeting as
the wings were awarded. What did I tell them? Well I lied of course.
What else could a person do? Risk having his wings stripped from
him a moment after getting them? A few people know now but for then
it was a ........ nail in a 2x4 that fell off a scaffold.
John H
sh (y...@somehost.somedomain) wrote:
: Okay, here goes:
: My Xacto accident:
: It was rolling off my drafting/building board, it apparently was about half
: way off the table when I made the grab for it. I hit the handle and it flipped
: around and stabbed me in the chest! No real damage but it scared the hell out
: of me! :)
: My Hot Stuff accident:
: I used to keep a piece of music wire to unstop the small teflon tube. Well one
: day it was really plugged and I pushed really hard. It was going in and then
: all of the sudden the teflon kinked and the wire came out of the side of the
: tube, went through the end of my thumb and immbedded into the side of my index
: finger! The worst part was that the damn wire had gotten some Hot stuff on it
: and it refused to come out! I grabbed a pair of pliers and pulled real hard
: and it did come out, but no blood! I believe the glue cauterized the injury!
: Again no permanent or serious damage but boy was it scary!
: Steve Hales
<SNIP>
>: and it refused to come out! I grabbed a pair of pliers and pulled real hard
>: and it did come out, but no blood! I believe the glue cauterized the injury!
>: Again no permanent or serious damage but boy was it scary!
>
>
>OUCH!
>
>
>And wow - your ISP must have a HUGE backlog buffer... this thread died
>out MONTHS ago!
Steve,
Let's be happy he's time warped into mid-July and hasn't gotten to
mid-August yet.
Bill Arch.
> It was sitting up on a wall that borders the lake, just at a
> convenient height to run out the last of the fuel and wipe up the oil.
> I thought I would take a look while it was running to see just how
> much throttle opening coincided with that particular rpm. WHOP, WHOP,
> WHOP, the propeller went as it tore through the fleshy part of my
> nose!!
> John H
Geez, John.
How close did you have to get to look at the carb!!! Glad you are
feeling better, I hope.
Cheers
Don
So, since you've obviously seen it closer than anyone else here,
except for the fella up north who speaks with a lisp now;
1. Did you learn anything?
2. What can you tell us about your one-of-a-kind view?
<G>
Kelly Matchett kma...@tgn.net
AMA 474754 IMAA 19509
Web page at www.tgn.net/~kmatch
> Eeeoooooo.......
> Can't top that one john.
> Bob
No kidding, that's a good way to get spent fuel in your eyes!!!
dj
When I just started out on RC models I got my first wet engine, an Enya 5cc
(.32), brand new and shining in the box. I wanted to be real carefull with
this precious (I was still at school these days) piece of technology, so I
build a test bench to brake it in.
I setup the rig on the little field in front of our house and started the
engine. After a lot of trying it finally starts and it runs nicely. I only
let it run for a short period and then stopped it. As the manual indicated
that 'overheating' the engine was a major error, I was cautios not to let
this happen to me. To check the temperature I grab the cylinderhead with
my thumb, index and middle finger, only to hear a soft singeing. I
immediatly retracted my hand, but the harm was already done. The flesh was
instantly cooked by the hot ricinus oil covering the engine. Some of the flesh
was ripped of when I pulled back and all the fingers had this groove implant
of the cylinderhead.
I ran for water as the pain started to become more noticable every second. By
the time I reached the tap I was screaming out loud and a lot of water was
spend before I took my hand out from under the tap.
For months the imprint of the cylinder head was clearly vissible and it took
a long period before I regained sense in these three fingers.
Stop laughing!
If you think that I have learned my lesson, you're all wrong.
A few months ago I was soldering some clevisses on some music wires. As ussual
the entire workbench was occupied with 'project' so I'm working on the
complete edge of the table. As I put down the soldering iron, the cord didn't
flex and the iron falls off the table. Under the table is a pile of styro and
rubber foam, which I remembered as I see the iron fall. In an instant I grab
for the iron to prevent damage to it and the foam.
You guess it; I got hold of the wrong end of the iron which I only noticed
when I brought my hand over the table surface. A quick release of the iron
couldn't prevent a solid burn through the palm of my hand and the top of my
fingers. It took monthes before the damaged tissue had grown out.
--
Cheers, Wilfred /^\
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ |N|
M.V.C. Jupiter Wilfred van Bergen |E|
ber...@mpn.cp.philips.com |R|
Model Jet Promoting Netherlands /|O|\
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ /_|_|_\
http://www.win.tue.nl/win/cs/ooti/students/martijnb/nero/index.html
SNIP
> this happen to me. To check the temperature I grab the cylinderhead
with
> my thumb, index and middle finger, only to hear a soft singeing.
Snipped the gory part.
> You guess it; I got hold of the wrong end of the iron which I only noticed
> when I brought my hand over the table surface.
Geez, Will and we let you loose on the world with turbines? G> Everybody
take cover! As we would say here in the swamp, "This guys is plain snake
bit".
Red S.
ok-very carefully and slowly back away from the fireplace...
--
Roger W Guinn, PE
Structural Analysis, Vibration, Loads, Stress
"Take-off's are optional. Landings are Mandatory"
>Stop laughing!
I'll tell you about what I did when I was 10years old.
Soldering Iorn Incident:
I saw my dad using the big(1inch diamiter) soldering iorn. But I
thought it was a engraver. So when he was out of the room I was going
to try this thing out. Well I just happend to wrap my fist around it,
and suddenly my pain recepors told me it was not an engraver! I
immediatly ran to the sink and put cool water on it. I looked at it
for the first time and it hade three distinct orange lines acrossit
running in this direction:
(put your left hand near theese marks and rotate it conterclockwise
30degrees):
L L L
L L L
L L L
L L L
L L L
L L L
L L L
L L L LL(THUMB)
LL
My dad never knew this even happend!
I told him about 3 years later.
-Dean
Yep, this looks pretty much like my hand a few months ago, only in my case it
was the right hand.
R R R
R R R
R R R
R R R
R R R
R R R
R R R
R R R
(THUMB)RR R R R
RR
Teehee, auch, it hurts when I laugh.
My favorite tool accident involves the monokote sealing iron. I have
the habit of wiping the iron on my jeans to get rid of the buildup. On
one particular day I did this but got a nasty surprise, I was wearing a
pair of worn out jeans and you guessed it, I wiped the iron right on the
spot where the hole was. Nice imprint of a monokote iron soon appeared
on my leg. ouch! ;-)
'Course, from then on, you have a really strong, abrasion-, stain- and
flex-resistant spot on your jeans - you pick at it every time you wear
them from then on, and .. nothing happens!
Hmmm. Wonder if CA-impregnated denim would be a good building material...
/-------------------------------------------------------------\
| Greg Heumann gr...@heumann.com |
| Peninsula Channel Commanders Half Moon Bay, CA |
| www.aimnet.com/~greg/hangar.html
|
| |
\-------------------------------------------------------------/
I've had my father twice step on the cord to my soldering iron. Once it
went through my fingers completely, leaving a small first degree burn.
The second time I ended up with the tip still in my fingers, which
caused large second degree burns.
I also have two scars from an X-Acto knife. One when I slipped and
slice a finger open. The funny part was it was I new blade and I didn't
know I cut myself, until blood dripped on my workbench. The second time
was when I dropped the knife and ended up with a #11 blade embedded in
my thigh.
Andrew
disclaimer:
These views are mine and not my employers.
Hey, this kind of stuff happens more than folks realize. It happened to a
cousin of mine over 30 years ago and he didn't realize it at first either.
Well, here's my story!
My grandfather and I were into control line back before we tried RC; this
was in the late 1950s. Top Flight produced a kit of the Flight Streak
combat airplane. (Now it's s.l.o.w. combat!)
My grandfather built a twin engine version of it by adding 13 inches to the
center of the wing and a second fuselage along with a larger stab and
elevator. (I have a photo I could scan and upload if anyone wants to see
it.)
Starting twins is an easy procedure if the engines are set up right. We
were using McCoy .35's which were surprisingly reliable considering their
$5.00 price tag. (Fox .35's were in the $18 range!)
Back then electric starters were unheard of so you started your engines
using your finger to flip the prop.
On this airplane, for safety's sake, I always started the inboard engine
first. That way I was always flipping away from the running engine when
starting the second one.
Have you noticed how a cold engine starts and runs poorly in the winter?
Well, it was winter time, ... cold and a little windy. But being the
die-hard modelers we were, out to the field we went!
The lines were run out and connected to the model. Both tanks filled. With
one shot of prime the inboard engine fired and ran. Moving the battery to
the outboard engine, I primed it, and it hit on the first flip!
Then ... the inboard engine quit!
I moved the plug wire back to the inboard engine, pulled some fuel into the
venturi and flipped it several times. Nothing. So I primed it again. Then
when I flipped it, it kicked back, whacking my hand with the prop. I jerked
my hand . . . right into the outboard engine's running prop!
It chewed on my hand for a moment before I realized I should move it, so I
jerked again! Right into the inboard engine's prop arc, ..... which had
conveniently started running at full power!
After bleeding for a while I decided my flying was over for the day. My
hand hurt for a week, but luckily I suffered only from minor cuts and
bruises; No serious damage! That's when I discovered "Chicken Sticks"! ! !
--
Eddie Warren
edd...@wilmington.net
Wilmington/Carolina Beach, NC 28402 - USA