Is Gung Fu the superior art?
liju...@my-deja.com
I would like to hear especially from gung-fu people as to how
they feel about this POV. With all due respects to non-gungfu
practitioners (this might anger them), there are reasons why
this could be felt about gung-fu.
Gung-Fu takes longer, is more difficult to study, and
contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
which cover both external and internal, and styles which
emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
over other martial arts?
The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
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Before you buy.
The Dude
<liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message news:8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Lijunfan -- why are you using Bruce Lee's female name ;-)
1) Longetivity -- who ever said this was a good thing? If I live long
enough to see my grandkids get married or possibly hold my great grandkids,
that will be plenty long enough. Why the heck do I want to hang around this
place any longer when it means wearing diapers, eating a restricted diet,
and reading the obituaries every morning to see which of my friends croaked
the night before!!
Having said that, doing tai chi is a nice way to keep flexible, maintain
bone density, etc. -- so is weight lifting to some extent. Do both and you
can help live a more active life in your golden years :-)
2) Taking longer -- I think one of the major drawbacks to kung fu is it's
complexity. Sometimes simpler is better. If you can master the basics of
kicking, punching and blocking, timing, distance, etc. early on then you
will be in a much better position to defend yourself.
However, in terms of keeping a traditiona alive and doing something that is
a truly beautiful art, you can't beat kung fu.
For me though, a nice simple, easy to learn, yet lethal martial art is the
way to go.
Dude
Eric Iverson
> they feel about this POV. With all due respects to non-gungfu
> practitioners (this might anger them), there are reasons why
> this could be felt about gung-fu.
OK, I am a gung-fu student of roughly 4 and a half years,
not very long, I know, but now you have some background.
In my opinion gunf-fu is inferior to other arts for the
reasons you mention:
> Gung-Fu takes longer, is more difficult to study, and
> contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
> which cover both external and internal, and styles which
> emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
It's just too all-encompassing. I'm never going
to get good at everything. Better to learn something
simpler.
> Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> over other martial arts?
>
> The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
Yeah, but it'll take many years of practice
learning to promote longevity. By the time I have it
I'll be too old and close to death to really do anything with it.
The one redeeming thing about gung-fu is the destruction
of the ego.
--Eric
weisely
> 1) Longetivity -- who ever said this was a good
> thing? If I live long
> enough to see my grandkids get married or possibly
> hold my great grandkids,
> that will be plenty long enough. Why the heck do I
> want to hang around this
> place any longer when it means wearing diapers, eating
> a restricted diet,
> and reading the obituaries every morning to see which
> of my friends croaked
> the night before!!
Yes!
All people want longevity, and some even want to live
forever, dun want to die.
But the Law Of Natural say that every living creatures must
go through 4 stages: birth, develop, old and die. Nobody can
escape from it.
If u try to escape, u will get suffer. It is good if u live
until 100. But u will get suffer if u try to live until
1000.
> 2) Taking longer -- I think one of the major drawbacks
> to kung fu is it's
> complexity.
Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
experience taichi practiser.
BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
The complexity in kungfu can let u have more advantage when
u are in complex situation.
Actually, every kungfu movements is designed for street
fight situation, especially in the situation when u are
surrounded by 3-4 people.
A simple kicking and punching is only good for u to
encounter 1 by 1 situation.
But in kungfu , the complex and dynamic movements will help
u to fight in 3 by 1 situation.
Almost 4000 years alrady, kungfu has been clarified as a
very efficient fighting art.
* Sent from AltaVista http://www.altavista.com Where you can also find related Web Pages, Images, Audios, Videos, News, and Shopping. Smart is Beautiful
sctca
weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com...
> Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
> A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
> experience taichi practiser.
>
> BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
> up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
Oh come on.........
Brian C. Allen
>
> I myself practice both an internal stlyle Ba Gua Chuan and an
Then I guess you know that it is called baguazhang.
BCA
webCOMBO - America's Free Internet Access Provider
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qui_c...@my-deja.com
I myself practice both an internal stlyle Ba Gua Chuan and an
internal/external style Bai He.I have read what others have said in
reply to this post and think they are coming at it from the wrong
angle.In the west we have westernized Kung fu mainly because chinese
teachers of good quality do not in a majority of cases travel to
other countries to promote there art.One of there student or one of
their western students will be the representative for that style even
if this person is not a good teacher(which is most important)or a good
martial artist(which is quite important).An exsample western view of
tai chi chaun as only for helth and relaxation,and not as a martial art
this is because of the way it is taught here There is no zhan Zhaung
for half an hour until your legs and body are covered in sweat and you
are visable shaking because of all the chi created.Its all middle aged
people standing around in between practice having a chat.Its not that
I think these people dont have the right to lern if it helps them and
takes away any pain they have from incorect posture etc,its just that
you are expected to lern from a young age in most cases if taught in
china and if not then have a background with similar styles and a basis
ie solid stance,strong limbs etc.Another thing with kung fu is its
so varied and I belive there is a Chaun or fist style to suit
everybody.But if sombody who did not suit my art came to me and asked
to lern I would send them to sombodyelse whos art more suited them I
would see the needs of the individual above the dollar or pound signs.
All of this keeps Kung fu or chinese styles down in the west unlike
karate where the masters came over to teach and a lot stayed over to
make sure the art was taught properly.Make no mistake a lot of chinese
styles being taught in the west have little resembolance to those
taught elswhere but in the case you do get an authentic art with a
good teacher then your style will be one of the best and you will be
enhanced physicaly,mentaly and spiritualy.
Qui chu ji
Eric Iverson
> A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
> experience taichi practiser.
>
> BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
> up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
After 10 years, I'd hope both would have learned
enoguh to not try and beat up each other. :)
--Eric
Justin O. Wyss-Gallifent
: But the Law Of Natural say that every living creatures must
: go through 4 stages: birth, develop, old and die. Nobody can
: escape from it.
I've never heard of the "Law Of Natural".
I read somewhere about an undersea creature which doesn't have an aging
process. If it didn't have any natural predators, it would live forever.
Don't remember what it was, maybe I'm just going senile.
Justin
Jesus
Tsongdao
chuan=fist, used for almost everything
zhang=palm; I've seen it only in baguazhang
wseitz
sctca wrote:
> weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com...
> > Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
> > A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
> > experience taichi practiser.
> >
> > BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
> > up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
>
> Oh come on.........
Apples and oranges. The Karate practitioner will win if he can keep
distance, because Taiji focuses on close range fighting and not how to
close on a fighter trying to maintain distance. The Taiji guy will win
if the Karate guys thinks he can match him with his hands, because
Taiji specializes in short range fighting and power generation. Of
course, a low percentage of Taiji schools teach it as effective
fighting.
wseitz
qui_c...@my-deja.com wrote:
> I myself practice both an internal stlyle Ba Gua Chuan and an
> internal/external style Bai He.
Hey, I've studied some Bai He, although I have not progressed far at all. I
only know two very short sequences and still get many fundamental
corrections every time I do them. Actually thinking about it I know six
because I know some staff sequences which are really easy compared to the
barehanded stuff.
> In the west we have westernized Kung fu mainly because chinese
> teachers of good quality do not in a majority of cases travel to
> other countries to promote there art.
Nope, there are teachers here of high quality. Many lineages actually moved
away from China because of the communists.
> One of there student or one of
> their western students will be the representative for that style even
> if this person is not a good teacher(which is most important)or a good
> martial artist(which is quite important).
Students pass down the art. They are the ones who become the next generation
of teachers. I will agree that they are often weaker than their masters
because the times have changed and the nature of training has changed.
> An exsample western view of
> tai chi chaun as only for helth and relaxation,and not as a martial art
> this is because of the way it is taught here There is no zhan Zhaung
> for half an hour until your legs and body are covered in sweat and you
> are visable shaking because of all the chi created.Its all middle aged
> people standing around in between practice having a chat.
Actually lots of middle aged people in China practice Taiji this way. Taiji
is widely used as a kind of Qigong and not as a fighting system even in
China. Taiji for health in America isn't a dilution of the fighting system
because that dilution happened in China.
> Its not that
> I think these people dont have the right to lern if it helps them and
> takes away any pain they have from incorect posture etc,its just that
> you are expected to lern from a young age in most cases if taught in
> china and if not then have a background with similar styles and a basis
> ie solid stance,strong limbs etc.
Yes, training is tougher and better in China. That is not because the
teachers are better, but because the students start younger and have
stronger spirits caused by having a harder life. When your life is easy,
like it is in the states, you don't want to endure the costs of training
that they endure in China.
> All of this keeps Kung fu or chinese styles down in the west unlike
> karate where the masters came over to teach and a lot stayed over to
> make sure the art was taught properly.
Did the Okinawans really teach the invading Japanese all there fighting
secrets? Did the Japanese really teach the invading Americans all their
fighting secrets? Trace a karate students lineage and you will probably find
a period where the masters people had been invaded by the students people. I
believe that a lot has been lost from Karate over the years because of these
reasons.
> Make no mistake a lot of chinese
> styles being taught in the west have little resembolance to those
> taught elswhere but in the case you do get an authentic art with a
> good teacher then your style will be one of the best and you will be
> enhanced physicaly,mentaly and spiritualy.
Of course there are always good teachers and bad teachers, but in the end
what you get out depends much more on how much you put in than on what style
you choose.
William
ok gung fu aka kung fu is the mother of all martial arts.
Karate came from kung fu
ok now to master kung fu will take your entire lifetime and your youth will
be gone before you can master half the moves. Monkey style is the hardest
in my opinion for anyone because to do the kata you have to be fucking on
drugs...anyway...chinese kung fu covers everything you need to know about
martial arts...the only thing is finding a good instructor because kung fu
in itself is broken down into sub specialities and a little is lost when it
is passed down from generation to generation.
i personally dont like the iron palm and other methods which i dont believe
are practical because for the time involved, you dont get much additional
benefit, but there are those who go down that path...but youve got to ask
why, in modern day, people use guns so your "iron palm" isnt going to be
much use. Might as well have an iron cock.
kung fu fighting is more advanced than karate fighting because you have
rhythm and every attack and counterattack creates a sense of tranquility.
as to usefulness, it depends on what style of kung fu you learn and whether
you have understood the principles behind a move eg in a kata a move can
have numerous applications eg when you lift you toes up while you heel is on
the ground, that is to counter a sweep or a lower kick to your legs while
the upperbody may have the hand in tiger claw position to claw yoru
opponents face...whether you master the application is up to the individual
because the master may forget to explain or might not know himself the
application. ..
.but if you want short cuts, you can do the commercial martial arts such as
karate, aikido, taekwondo, judo and youd probably be no worse off. These
above mentioned commercial martial arts teach you all the basic skills you
need to fight a dude off the street.
doing the above mentioned commercial martial arts will give you a better
understanding of why kung fu moves are done when they are done in a kata and
how to apply them. for a person with no experience, they may find it fuking
hard to gain the coordination and may take twice as long to master a kung fu
kata than a karate kata.
ok bye bye im too tired to being typing
--
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liju...@my-deja.com wrote in message <8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>
> I would like to hear especially from gung-fu people as to how
> they feel about this POV. With all due respects to non-gungfu
> practitioners (this might anger them), there are reasons why
> this could be felt about gung-fu.
>
> Gung-Fu takes longer, is more difficult to study, and
> contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
> which cover both external and internal, and styles which
> emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
>
> Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> over other martial arts?
>
> The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
>
>
liju...@my-deja.com
"The Dude" <lebo...@iname.com> wrote:
>
> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>
> Lijunfan -- why are you using Bruce Lee's female name ;-)
Correction needed; it is/was Bruce's birthname, Chinese name,
not a female name.
;-)
Blkrckt
Blkrckt
>kung fu fighting is more advanced than karate fighting because you have
>rhythm and every attack and counterattack creates a sense of tranquility.
>
>chinese kung fu covers everything you need to know about
>martial arts...the
Brian C. Allen
>
> Correction needed; it is/was Bruce's birthname, Chinese name,
> not a female name.
>
birth name. Bruce's parents tried to "fool the spirits" by giving
Bruce a girls name because of the supposed curse on the males in
the Li family.
So, you are using a girls name and and thus thought to be a girl.
William
--
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"Respect My Authorata!!! Or I'll kick you square in the nuts!" - Eric
Cartman
liju...@my-deja.com wrote in message <8m53eg$nvq$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>In article <BGNg5.448$k3.1...@homer.alpha.net>,
> "The Dude" <lebo...@iname.com> wrote:
>>
>> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>news:8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>>
>> Lijunfan -- why are you using Bruce Lee's female name ;-)
>
> Correction needed; it is/was Bruce's birthname, Chinese name,
> not a female name.
>
William
and i would love to live forever while maintaining my youth. there is so
much to learn yet so little time...if only communism took over the world and
we all had equal treatment and access to facilities.
--
If you are half as smart as me, Then I am Twice as smart as you!!!
klum...@hotmail.com http://cum2.cjb.net 4 pornobabes
http://m2k.diz.nu 4 martial arts
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"Respect My Authorata!!! Or I'll kick you square in the nuts!" - Eric
Cartman
weisely wrote in message <1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com>...
>
>> 1) Longetivity -- who ever said this was a good
>> thing? If I live long
>> enough to see my grandkids get married or possibly
>> hold my great grandkids,
>> that will be plenty long enough. Why the heck do I
>> want to hang around this
>> place any longer when it means wearing diapers, eating
>> a restricted diet,
>> and reading the obituaries every morning to see which
>> of my friends croaked
>> the night before!!
>
>Yes!
> All people want longevity, and some even want to live
>forever, dun want to die.
>But the Law Of Natural say that every living creatures must
>go through 4 stages: birth, develop, old and die. Nobody can
>escape from it.
>If u try to escape, u will get suffer. It is good if u live
>until 100. But u will get suffer if u try to live until
>1000.
>
>> 2) Taking longer -- I think one of the major drawbacks
>> to kung fu is it's
>> complexity.
>
>Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
>A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
>experience taichi practiser.
>
>BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
>up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
>
>The complexity in kungfu can let u have more advantage when
>u are in complex situation.
>Actually, every kungfu movements is designed for street
>fight situation, especially in the situation when u are
>surrounded by 3-4 people.
>
>A simple kicking and punching is only good for u to
>encounter 1 by 1 situation.
>But in kungfu , the complex and dynamic movements will help
>u to fight in 3 by 1 situation.
>
>Almost 4000 years alrady, kungfu has been clarified as a
>very efficient fighting art.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
William
--
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"Respect My Authorata!!! Or I'll kick you square in the nuts!" - Eric
Cartman
Brian C. Allen wrote in message <3984F41D...@webcombo.net>...
>qui_c...@my-deja.com wrote:
>>
>> I myself practice both an internal stlyle Ba Gua Chuan and an
>
>Then I guess you know that it is called baguazhang.
>
William
practitioners have no combat experience so if i come along with my lovely
kicking skills the taichi dude really has to speed up his hands!
--
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"Respect My Authorata!!! Or I'll kick you square in the nuts!" - Eric
Cartman
sctca wrote in message ...
>
>weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com...
>> Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
>> A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
>> experience taichi practiser.
>>
>> BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
>> up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
>
>Oh come on.........
>
>
BarnesKenpo
>and i would love to live forever while maintaining my youth. there is so
>much to learn yet so little time...if only communism took over the world and
>we all had equal treatment and access to facilities.
With all due respect, you, sir, are a dick.
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
Jerry Love
> >In article <BGNg5.448$k3.1...@homer.alpha.net>,
> > "The Dude" <lebo...@iname.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> >news:8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> >>
> >> Lijunfan -- why are you using Bruce Lee's female name ;-)
> >
> > Correction needed; it is/was Bruce's birthname, Chinese name,
> > not a female name.
> >
> > ;-)
> >
him from the "family curse" on first-born males?
Jerry
harveyc
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote in message news:WGuh5.2401
> Wasn't Bruce's birth name a female name that his parents gave him to
protect
> him from the "family curse" on first-born males?
>
Not exactly. Lee Jun Fan is quite a "manly" name. However, his nickname
was Sai Fung or "Little Phoenix," which he later adapted/changed to Siu Lung
or "Little Dragon" for a stage name.
Cheers,
harveyc
remove "killspambots" to reply
> Jerry
>
>
harveyc
> Sorry, but it really is a female name even though it was Bruce's
> birth name. Bruce's parents tried to "fool the spirits" by giving
> Bruce a girls name because of the supposed curse on the males in
> the Li family.
No. Jun Fan means the "Protector of San Fransisco," a name with very
masculine overtones. Depending on the interpretation, the "Jun" part of his
name could also mean to conquer.
However, the nickname his parents used was "Sai Fung," a feminine sounding
name meaning "Little Phoenix." Later, he adopted "Little Dragon" as a
stage name as a play on his childhood nickname.
--
Cheers,
harveyc
remove "killspambots" to reply
>
> So, you are using a girls name and and thus thought to be a girl.
>
BarnesKenpo
Li? <grin>
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
Jerry Love
"harveyc" <harveyckill...@sprint.ca> wrote in message
news:Txvh5.3396$fV5....@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
> Brian C. Allen" <b...@webcombo.net> wrote in message
> > Sorry, but it really is a female name even though it was Bruce's
> > birth name. Bruce's parents tried to "fool the spirits" by giving
> > Bruce a girls name because of the supposed curse on the males in
> > the Li family.
>
>
> No. Jun Fan means the "Protector of San Fransisco," a name with very
> masculine overtones. Depending on the interpretation, the "Jun" part of
his
> name could also mean to conquer.
I don't see how "Fan" could mean "Saint Fransisco", since Fansisco is a
proper name and therefore has no translation.
Jerry
Badger
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
>
> I would like to hear especially from gung-fu people as to how
> they feel about this POV. With all due respects to non-gungfu
> practitioners (this might anger them), there are reasons why
> this could be felt about gung-fu.
>
> Gung-Fu takes longer, is more difficult to study, and
> contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
> which cover both external and internal, and styles which
> emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
>
First of all, you are making some gross generalizations. Some styles
take longer to learn than others. Wing chun and bak mei are two that
promote some fighting ability early on, for example. Putting out a
blanket statement like "is gung fu the superior art?" is so generalized
as to be impossible to answer.
How many totally different styles did the Chinese government catalog in
their national survey? Something like 250? If I was to indulge your
statement, it would only be to say that somewhere in that vast pool of
styles there is enough variety to find a good style for any random
person.
Rephrase your question, be more style specific, and maybe then we can
get a useful answer.
> Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> over other martial arts?
>
> The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
Other than developing a healthy body by actually doing something
physical, martial arts training promoted longevity by keeping you from
dying at the hands of your enemies. Recent trends have emphasized the
healthy aspects over the fighting aspects.
Badger
--
Shaolin Five Animals Kung Fu
& Filipino Martial Arts
http://www.cyberus.ca/~badger/
www3.sympatico.ca/t_s.creasey/16NCT/Seminar.htm
harveyc
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:NqFh5.659$PZ5.2...@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net...
> I don't see how "Fan" could mean "Saint Fransisco", since Fansisco is a
> proper name and therefore has no translation.
>
You don't suppose that the Chinese might have a Chinese name for San
Francisco? And perhaps the name "Sam Fan See" (a phonetic interpretation of
that name) might have the word "Fan" in it? And don't forget that Bruce
being born in Frisco might have something to do with his given name being
Lee Jun Fan.
Mei Guo is America, the "Beautiful Country," btw.
Of course, Chinese people wouldn't need to invent Chinese names for American
cities if only those Americans would learn to speak more loudly and slowly.
:)
klumsyboy
In article <NqFh5.659$PZ5.2...@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net>,
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
>
> "harveyc" <harveyckill...@sprint.ca> wrote in message
> news:Txvh5.3396$fV5....@newscontent-01.sprint.ca...
> > Brian C. Allen" <b...@webcombo.net> wrote in message
> > > Sorry, but it really is a female name even though it was Bruce's
> > > birth name. Bruce's parents tried to "fool the spirits" by giving
> > > Bruce a girls name because of the supposed curse on the males in
> > > the Li family.
> >
> >
> > No. Jun Fan means the "Protector of San Fransisco," a name with
very
> > masculine overtones. Depending on the interpretation, the "Jun"
part of
> his
> > name could also mean to conquer.
>
> I don't see how "Fan" could mean "Saint Fransisco", since Fansisco is
a
> proper name and therefore has no translation.
>
> Jerry
>
>
--
http://w.diz.nu
http://cumto.cjb.net
http://skateto.cjb.net
If youre half as smart as me, then Im twice as smart as you.
liju...@my-deja.com
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> > liju...@my-deja.com wrote in message
<8m53eg$nvq$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> > >In article <BGNg5.448$k3.1...@homer.alpha.net>,
> > > "The Dude" <lebo...@iname.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> > >news:8lvfnv$rrt$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > >>
> > >> Lijunfan -- why are you using Bruce Lee's female name ;-)
> > >
> > > Correction needed; it is/was Bruce's birthname, Chinese name,
> > > not a female name.
> > >
> > > ;-)
> > >
protect
> him from the "family curse" on first-born males?
You're off topic.
liju...@my-deja.com
Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai Chi
Chuan.
BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
liju...@my-deja.com
"William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> yeah i personally doubt it too. tai chi has its moments but most
> practitioners have no combat experience so if i come along with my
lovely
> kicking skills the taichi dude really has to speed up his hands!
A person who REALLY knows tai chi can get past kicks and
get a kicker off balance.
liju...@my-deja.com
wseitz <wse...@bbn.com> wrote:
>
> Apples and oranges. The Karate practitioner will win if he can keep
> distance, because Taiji focuses on close range fighting and not how
to
> close on a fighter trying to maintain distance. The Taiji guy will
win
> if the Karate guys thinks he can match him with his hands, because
> Taiji specializes in short range fighting and power generation. Of
> course, a low percentage of Taiji schools teach it as effective
> fighting.
>
But Taiji is extremely effective and very formidable when
applied by someone who knows it and has been taught to use it
as a martial art. It has been proliferated as an exercise but
it depends upon the person who is learning it...do you
just want exercise or do you want to use it to fight with as well?
Remember, Tai Chi Chuan is really Kung Fu, an Internal style.
liju...@my-deja.com
weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > 2) Taking longer -- I think one of the major drawbacks
> > to kung fu is it's
> > complexity.
Kung Fu has to compete in a world where everyone wants "instant
gratification," overnight results, but the rewards far outdistance
the drawbacks, if that's what you want to call them.
> Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
Depends upon how you train, who teaches you, et al.
> A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
> experience taichi practiser.
That would be the more popular belief, but ya never know...
> The complexity in kungfu can let u have more advantage when
> u are in complex situation.
> Actually, every kungfu movements is designed for street
> fight situation, especially in the situation when u are
> surrounded by 3-4 people.
Yes, but don't let yourself get too overconfident. Just
"go with the flow."
> A simple kicking and punching is only good for u to
> encounter 1 by 1 situation.
> But in kungfu , the complex and dynamic movements will help
> u to fight in 3 by 1 situation.
You mean, the finer points.
> Almost 4000 years alrady, kungfu has been clarified as a
> very efficient fighting art.
You said it.
liju...@my-deja.com
Badger <badger...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> First of all, you are making some gross generalizations. Some styles
> take longer to learn than others. Wing chun and bak mei are two that
> promote some fighting ability early on, for example. Putting out a
> blanket statement like "is gung fu the superior art?" is so
generalized
> as to be impossible to answer.
What about when you size up gung fu against other arts?
> How many totally different styles did the Chinese government catalog
in
> their national survey? Something like 250? If I was to indulge your
> statement, it would only be to say that somewhere in that vast pool
>of styles there is enough variety to find a good style for any random
> person.
That's a pretty fair statement.
> Rephrase your question, be more style specific, and maybe then we can
> get a useful answer.
>
> > Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> > over other martial arts?
> >
> > The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> > dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
>
> Other than developing a healthy body by actually doing something
> physical, martial arts training promoted longevity by keeping you
>from dying at the hands of your enemies.
It helped; I didn't say it for this reason, but you have a point.
>Recent trends have emphasized
>the healthy aspects over the fighting aspects.
Because the rate of crime has gone down.
liju...@my-deja.com
barne...@aol.com (BarnesKenpo) wrote:
> So far, I don't think you're getting the answers that you'd
hoped for, eh
> Li? <grin>
Hoped for? I would hope you'd stay out of it!
Jerry Love
> In article <398638b8$0$11142$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > BUT Aikido is good for mutliple attackers too you know.
>
> Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai Chi
> Chuan.
Care to try to support that? I see few similarities.
> BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
Yes, it translates that way, but it interpretes differently. It does not
mean it the way we would use that in English (e.g. ultimate martial art). It
could also be translated "Polar Opposite Boxing"
Jerry
Jerry Love
That's just untrue. Look at KF weapons, it is a war art adapted for
self-defense. Not the other way around. It's lost fighting emphasis because
it is not useful for modern warfare. Nor is it particularly useful for
firearm useage (the first, best method of self defense). So as a martial
art, it is no longer all things to all people.
Now what you have left is A) People that enjoy the activity B) People
looking for health benifits C) People rounding out their fighting skills
with unarmed and archaic-armed combat training D) People delusional about
the reality of combat.
The big group you lost was all the soldiers.
Jerry
liju...@my-deja.com
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:8ma47m$fp2$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > In article <8m7avt$cn3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> > Badger <badger...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > >Recent trends have emphasized
> > >the healthy aspects over the fighting aspects.
> >
> > Because the rate of crime has gone down.
>
> That's just untrue. Look at KF weapons, it is a war art adapted for
> self-defense. Not the other way around. It's lost fighting emphasis
because
> it is not useful for modern warfare. Nor is it particularly useful
for
> firearm useage (the first, best method of self defense). So as a
martial
> art, it is no longer all things to all people.
You're saying the traditional weapons are outdated. However,
the way the ancient weapons are used can be applied to modern
weapons available at hand, a hammer, a baseball bat, a pen,
a hubcap (?), a chair, et al I think you get the message
You would say the art is some things to some people? Or
all things to some people?
> Now what you have left is A) People that enjoy the activity B) People
> looking for health benifits C) People rounding out their fighting
skills
> with unarmed and archaic-armed combat training D) People delusional
about
> the reality of combat.
What about people who don't fight at all?
liju...@my-deja.com
"harveyc" <harveyckill...@sprint.ca> wrote:
>
> Of course, Chinese people wouldn't need to invent Chinese names for
American
> cities if only those Americans would learn to speak more loudly and
slowly.
Ah so, the old thought that Chinese can't say "r" so they have to
use an "l" in its place.
A man walks into a Chinese restaurant and asks the waiter
what's on the menu...
The Chinaman says slowly, "Fffaaa-ryed RRRRice"
"What?" is the reply.
Again: "Fffaaa-ryed RRRRice"
"Huh?"
Losing his patience, the Chinaman yells, "Flied Lice, You Plick!"
Brian C. Allen
>
> you know how tai chi chuan has fist meaning chuan...i dont believe tai
> chi uses the fist at all do they?
>
> at least aikido dont use fist.
>
You do not quite understand what you are trying to talk about.
Ch'uan (quan) does translate into "fist," but the word "fist" has
several meanings. You seem to think that "fist" is referring to
a closed fist. In this case and as is the case in many Chinese
gongfu system names, the word "fist" refers to system. Thus, a
common question that one gongfu practitioner may say to another is
"What fist do you practice?"
Jerry Love
> > That's just untrue. Look at KF weapons, it is a war art adapted for
> > self-defense. Not the other way around. It's lost fighting emphasis
> > because it is not useful for modern warfare. Nor is it particularly
> > useful for firearm useage (the first, best method of self defense). So
> > as a martial art, it is no longer all things to all people.
>
> You're saying the traditional weapons are outdated.
Yes.
> However, the way the ancient weapons are used can be applied to
> modern weapons available at hand, a hammer, a baseball bat, a pen,
What Kung-Fu weapon training do you think translates well to any of these?
> a hubcap (?),
When was the last time you used a hubcap in a fight?
> a chair, et al I think you get the message
I do. Don't think there is specific training for these in most Kung-Fu
styles.
> You would say the art is some things to some people? Or
> all things to some people?
>
> > Now what you have left is A) People that enjoy the activity B) People
> > looking for health benifits C) People rounding out their fighting
> > skills with unarmed and archaic-armed combat training D) People
> > delusional about the reality of combat.
>
> What about people who don't fight at all?
>
They would fall into groups A and B
Jerry
BarnesKenpo
>But Taiji is extremely effective and very formidable when
> applied by someone who knows it and has been taught to use it
> as a martial art.
So is any martial art.
>It has been proliferated as an exercise but
> it depends upon the person who is learning it...
Well there you go, isn't that what I've been saying all along? It's the
person not the art.
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
BarnesKenpo
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
klumsyboy
you know how tai chi chuan has fist meaning chuan...i dont believe tai
chi uses the fist at all do they?
at least aikido dont use fist.
In article <8ma32k$epm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <398638b8$0$11142$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > BUT Aikido is good for mutliple attackers too you know.
>
> Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai Chi
> Chuan.
>
> BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
--
http://w.diz.nu
http://cumto.cjb.net
http://skateto.cjb.net
If youre half as smart as me, then Im twice as smart as you.
BarnesKenpo
>(BarnesKenpo) wrote:
>> So far, I don't think you're getting the answers that you'd
>hoped for, eh
>> Li? <grin>
>
>
> Hoped for? I would hope you'd stay out of it!
Awwww, Li, you hurt my feelings. Why would you ever hope such a thing as
that? Could it be because most of the posts have echoed what I've been telling
you so far? Here's a little motto you might like to remember: "The mind is like
a parachute -- it only works when it is open."
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
klumsyboy
know. and for me my kicking isnt just kicking aimlessly in the hope of
landing, i use foong geuk and other techniques to close off my
opponents airspace so they cant generate power to push and it forces
them to grapple. thats why chinese kungfu kicking is superior to tkd
kicking.
In article <8ma37v$ern$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <398639b3$0$11187$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > yeah i personally doubt it too. tai chi has its moments but most
> > practitioners have no combat experience so if i come along with my
> lovely
> > kicking skills the taichi dude really has to speed up his hands!
>
> A person who REALLY knows tai chi can get past kicks and
> get a kicker off balance.
>
klumsyboy
xfiles... anyway i was eating and that just cracked me up
by the way the chinese translation of san francisco regarding the last
word, can be translated as shit...
In article <8maaut$krk$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
klumsyboy
some use kung fu for bad some for good...but its society's values which
cause crime. Cause and effect mate! Just look at karate and yakuza in
japan
In article <8ma47m$fp2$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <8m7avt$cn3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Badger <badger...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> >Recent trends have emphasized
> >the healthy aspects over the fighting aspects.
>
> Because the rate of crime has gone down.
>
klumsyboy
Kung fu training prepares a person to interact with their natural
environment so for example if you trained using a shield, you can
translate the way you use it to defend against someone using a hubcap
same goes for a lot of hand held weapons, you can use a broom and other
shit you find...
ancient weapons are still used by modern day police eg that rice
grinder handle thingy which usa police use as opposed to the ancient
baton which the english cops used to use which has now gone out of
style.
i agree different martial artists do kung fo for different reasons .
Jerry Love
are more common than fist attacks, but both are used.
"klumsyboy" <klum...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8mapiq$v48$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>
>
>
> you know how tai chi chuan has fist meaning chuan...i dont believe tai
> chi uses the fist at all do they?
>
> at least aikido dont use fist.
>
>
>
> In article <8ma32k$epm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> > In article <398638b8$0$11142$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> > "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > BUT Aikido is good for mutliple attackers too you know.
> >
> > Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai Chi
> > Chuan.
> >
> > BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
> >
Orbs
random large stick/broom- staff
hammer- golden mallet hammers
pen- knife (bloody small knife)
hubcap- discus hercules style
kinky leather set/hose- chain whip (jet li style)
People who carry nunckucks around in their car(i know people who do), so why
not carry
a three sectional staff around.
there is a "handy shovel" form around somewhere
chairs- look at the wrestlers
love orbs
> somebody wrote
Jerry Love
specific weapons translates.
"Orbs" <dav...@iinet.net.au> wrote in message
news:3988FB70...@iinet.net.au...
> baseball bat- sword
Ignoring thing's like "doesn't cut" could you be more specific as to what
CMA sword?
> random large stick/broom- staff
*Severe* difference in strenght and weight. Many things that will crack a
skill with a real staff will not do much more than cause pain with a broom.
> hammer- golden mallet hammers
Aren't golden mallet hammers several feet long? (not too familiar with them)
How common are they as a weapon form?
> pen- knife (bloody small knife)
'Cept no slashing and you need to reinforce it a bit with your hand. Even
with a small knife, I'd be looking to open up arteries. A pen I need short
jabbing attacks to inflict pain or against the eyes.
> hubcap- discus hercules style
A) a discus is not a weapon B) It's not Chineese and C) a hubcap lacks
anywhere near the weight or rigidity of a discus.
> kinky leather set/hose- chain whip (jet li style)
> People who carry nunckucks around in their car(i know people who do), so
why
> not carry
> a three sectional staff around.
> there is a "handy shovel" form around somewhere
> chairs- look at the wrestlers
> love orbs
And when are we gonna add the gun forms? Some other arts did.
Orbs
could slash randomly with control. no particular type of sword as long as its
not used for thrusting, thrusting with baseball bats is somewhat hard.
when practicing staff at home i use a broom stick, when training at my school i
use as many differnt sizes of staves as possible from 7 foot to 4 1/2 foot. a
hit over the head with a broomstick is still a hit in the head with a bit of
wood. the brooms that i know arent so flimsy and dont break or crack that easy.
golden mallet hammers are a short bit of wood 1-2 foot long with a large golden
balls on the end. we have them at the school at the school. i suppose not so
common as a weapon form but with around thirty different weapons its hard to
become friendly with all but the most common.
a pen no slashing but thrusting bit hard to use yes but still better (maybe) to
use than your fist, although having not been in such a situation... but if i was
and the pen was in my hand i probably use it.
i always thought the discus was a weapon it surely wasnt invented just for the
olympic games and track 'n' field events. maybe not chinese, but i was just
spewing shit about this one anyway.
there really is a handy shovel form (somewhere), i suppose it would have useful
for the farmers in those days
They pretty much made a form out of whatever was availible to bash people with,
there are common links between the forms so it wasn't like they come up with new
moves just for the weapon they wanted to use, most had similar moves like
continuos upper cut motion, or the reverse of the motion is seen in every
weapons form ive ever seen from the three sectional staff to those staves with
the meat clever on the end of them to the chained weapons as well. its more
whether you can convert the moves to suit the weapon than making completely new
moves for each individual weapon (some really really large number of weapons are
listed as having a fighting use, just from the chinese). no doubt if they had
guns they would have had forms for them, i see nothing wrong for adding in forms
for guns which would be useful for close range contact, esp those big guns with
machettes.
Jerry Love
> sword doesn't cut but instead of just slashing randomly with no control
you
> could slash randomly with control.
I don't think I understand that sentence.
> no particular type of sword as long as its not used for thrusting,
thrusting
> with baseball bats is somewhat hard.
Actually, you could thrust with it (though it's blunt damage). I suppose I
could see some similarites with a broadsword (I could swimg a bat like one)
but it's pretty different from most other styles (sabre, claymore, butterfly
swords, katana, etc)
>
> when practicing staff at home i use a broom stick, when training at my
school i
> use as many differnt sizes of staves as possible from 7 foot to 4 1/2
foot. a
> hit over the head with a broomstick is still a hit in the head with a bit
of
> wood. the brooms that i know arent so flimsy and dont break or crack that
easy.
Nor mine, but they are light and flexable. Not good for knocking out
opponents.
> golden mallet hammers are a short bit of wood 1-2 foot long with a large
golden
> balls on the end. we have them at the school at the school. i suppose not
so
> common as a weapon form but with around thirty different weapons its hard
to
> become friendly with all but the most common.
Sounds like that swing rate would be rather different than a hammer. Do you
swing them with your wrist or whole arm?
> a pen no slashing but thrusting bit hard to use yes but still better
(maybe) to
> use than your fist, although having not been in such a situation... but if
i was
> and the pen was in my hand i probably use it.
I agree it is a good weapon. My point has always been that there isn't a
weapon form in KF that trains you in a manner specific to how you would use
a pen.
> i always thought the discus was a weapon it surely wasnt invented just for
the
> olympic games and track 'n' field events. maybe not chinese, but i was
just
> spewing shit about this one anyway.
It's rather different from a hubcap though.
> there really is a handy shovel form (somewhere), i suppose it would have
useful
> for the farmers in those days
> They pretty much made a form out of whatever was availible to bash people
with,
> there are common links between the forms so it wasn't like they come up
with new
> moves just for the weapon they wanted to use, most had similar moves like
> continuos upper cut motion, or the reverse of the motion is seen in every
> weapons form ive ever seen from the three sectional staff to those staves
with
> the meat clever on the end of them to the chained weapons as well. its
more
> whether you can convert the moves to suit the weapon than making
completely new
> moves for each individual weapon (some really really large number of
weapons are
> listed as having a fighting use, just from the chinese). no doubt if they
had
> guns they would have had forms for them, i see nothing wrong for adding in
forms
> for guns which would be useful for close range contact, esp those big guns
with
> machettes.
And find me the KF school that has replaced "butterfly knife form" with
"shovel form" and I will admit I was wrong ;->
Jerry
Orbs
I must profess i havent seen the golden mallet hammers in action (mallet hammer
? just picked that up) so i wouldnt know how exactly they are used, but neither
have i seen a hammer used in an offense way except against nails. Ill ask my
sifus about it.
Well I don't suppose there is many things you could do with a pen besides stick
in someone's oriface or make your own. I'll have to make me a pen form now I
s'pose.
oh well i tried...
love orbs
longi...@my-deja.com
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
>
> I would like to hear especially from gung-fu people as to how
> they feel about this POV. With all due respects to non-gungfu
> practitioners (this might anger them),
I assure you, it only amuses "us."
there are reasons why
> this could be felt about gung-fu.
Anger? Or amusement?
>
> Gung-Fu takes longer,
Convolution and wasted motion can take longer, I'll grant you that.
is more difficult to study,
Considering the proliferation of ego and negative attitude among
instructors of the myriad styles, you're right about that, it is
difficult to study...it's hard enough overcoming our own egos, but
having to deal with our instructor's over-inflated ego as well would
definately hamper progress.
and
> contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
> which cover both external and internal, and styles which
> emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
This sentence is very much like gung fu in the way in which it was
written...repetitive and somewhat confusing in it superfluous wordage.
>
> Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> over other martial arts?
No. Not at all.
>
> The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> dynamic self-defense.
Self defense? Against dragons, monkeys, mutant mantids, tigers and
cranes? Sure, self defense. Whatever.
L
This could well be another factor.
>
longi...@my-deja.com
"sctca" <tci...@easynet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com...
> > Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
> > experience taichi practiser.
> >
> > up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
>
> Oh come on.........
>
> Actually I was thinking that in regard to the entire post.
Longimanus
longi...@my-deja.com
wseitz <wse...@bbn.com> wrote:
>
>
> sctca wrote:
>
> > weisely <chan...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:1bd14d26...@usw-ex0109-068.remarq.com...
> > > Taichi is one of the art that take longest to master.
> > > A 3 years-experience karateka will beat up 3 years
> > > experience taichi practiser.
> > >
> > > BUT, a 10 years-experience taichi practiser will surely beat
> > > up 10 years-experience of karate practiser.
> >
> > Oh come on.........
>
> distance, because Taiji focuses on close range fighting and not how to
> close on a fighter trying to maintain distance. The Taiji guy will win
> if the Karate guys thinks he can match him with his hands, because
> Taiji specializes in short range fighting and power generation. Of
> course, a low percentage of Taiji schools teach it as effective
> fighting.
>
> See, this is why traditional martial arts are as silly and ineffective
as they are...you spend too much of your precious training time worrying
about theory and technique insted of DOING. Theory is meaningless. The
"scenario" you described above is as ridiculous as the myriad arguments
about who can beat up whom. Taiji and karate are NOT fighting styles,
they are sparring styles and forms styles and theoretical styles, based
on hundreds of years of misinterpretation, ego flaming and bad teaching!
Training is fighting and testing what you can do in any given
circumstance, not learning a million techniques contained within the
matrix of some stupid style and trying to force them to fit into your
fantasy notions of what fighting SHOULD be.
Research honestly, it's the only way, and it is apparent you are not
being honest. If you put the aforementioned karate and taiji artists in
the octagon, you'd see them start out trying to fight within the
confines of their respective systems, but as they slowly realized that
they were not effective in the least, they would finally end up bashing
into each other and ultimately resembling a shitty boxer, a shitty
kicker, and finally a shitty grappler. Why? Because their systems were
not designed from honest research into what fighting is...they were
based on fantasy and a chicken-shit fear of actual contact.
Dustin Laurence
>Actually, you could thrust with it (though it's blunt damage). I suppose I
>could see some similarites with a broadsword (I could swimg a bat like one)
>but it's pretty different from most other styles (sabre, claymore, butterfly
>swords, katana, etc)
Pet peeve time.
Er, nonsense. The salient fact about a bat are that it is heavily
end-weighted (actually also that you can grasp it in the middle, but
forget that for now). It handles, in fact, like an axe, physical
appearance to the contrary. It's center of mass is closer to the business
end than the handle, while the center of mass of a "broadsword" is
probably a couple of inches beyond the hilt. A broadsword is exceedingly
well balanced.
Since that is mostly a Victorian collector's term it's a bit hard to say
what a broadsword might be, but I'm using it to refer to the sort of
Renaissance cut & thrust "short sword" (i.e. shorter than a long rapier)
they applied it to. What do you mean? What period, what handling
characteristics? Why do you think it handles more like a bat than the
other blades you mention? Assuming a Renaissance sword, it is in fact
used *less* like an axe than the others you mentioned (actually, I don't
know for butterfly sowords), since it is intended to be as suited to
thrusting as to cutting.
If you were thinking of a Medieval or earlier sword (which kind, how many
hands?), still no-go. As blades go, it would be closest to a falchion,
cutlass, or (I believe) dao--all end-weighted cleaver-type or machete-type
blades, so far as I know.
I claim no expertise in the use of these things, but even an armchair
swordsman can at least get the basic physical handling characteristics
right. I admit that the pet peeve is the idea that somehow European
swords were used for unskilled hacking using baseball bat swings. It just
ain't so.
Dustin
--
"I regard you as one of the largest obstacles to
the free dissemination of information to the world
aquarist community that has ever existed."
-- Richard Sexton, <4i406o$o...@gold.interlog.com>
qui_c...@my-deja.com
"Brian C. Allen" <b...@webcombo.net> wrote:
> qui_c...@my-deja.com wrote:
> >
> > I myself practice both an internal stlyle Ba Gua Chuan and an
>
> Then I guess you know that it is called baguazhang.
Ba Gua or eight triagrams of the yi jing or I ching remember when
translating you can use one of two systems Plus I will not use zhang
but chuan or fist ie my art is eight triagrams fist not style.
Qui chu ji
biugung - OG
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> You're saying the traditional weapons are outdated. However,
> the way the ancient weapons are used can be applied to modern
> weapons available at hand, a hammer, a baseball bat, a pen,
> a hubcap (?), a chair, et al I think you get the message
You dont need forms training to use those weapons. Come on. How much
of those weapon forms really look effective? Sure, to the people doing
them. Playing tough guy with a antiquated weapon, doing jumps, rolls
and spins. All manner of sillyness.
Weapons dont work like that.
--
biu...@my-dejanews.com-May contain proprietary material-All rights
reserved-Permission to archive/test/translate into other languages-
ICQ: 23934701 - Fax: 603-737-8274 -- Subject to evidentiary statutes
=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-==-=-=-=-===-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
"Any abberation [sic] that effects the human mind must have a three
dimensional coordinate point in the human nervous system." - William S.
Burroughs
biugung - OG
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> <liju...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> > In article <8m7avt$cn3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> > Badger <badger...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > >Recent trends have emphasized
> > >the healthy aspects over the fighting aspects.
> >
> > Because the rate of crime has gone down.
>
Okay i'm looking. Lets see.... Spears... Useless against ranged
weapons. Melon hammers (?), bamboo shields (?), tiger fork... Maim the
horses legs not the man. How cowardly can you get? Kwan dao...
Kwan dao was used like, what, 4 times in combat? Seriously....
War art my ass. What are these great conquests the chinese had? None.
Who had the capacity to fight against han migration? No one. Thats the
point.
It only became a problem with other han races began to fight amongst
themselves, and later some peaceful races learned how to fight. Then
the han used the huns and mongols as mercenarys to whipe them out. By
that time the huns became SOOOOOO superior that fighting was
barbaric....
(snip)
> The big group you lost was all the soldiers.
>
> Jerry
Wushu playing and Power rangers! Ahahahahahahhaah.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
> Sorry, but it really is a female name even though it was Bruce's
> birth name. Bruce's parents tried to "fool the spirits" by giving
> Bruce a girls name because of the supposed curse on the males in
> the Li family.
>
> So, you are using a girls name and and thus thought to be a girl.
Its a female sounding name in chinese but have other chinese friends
with similar female sounding names.You are given a name which is
thought to be lucky when combined with your surname.The stuff about
evil spirits is a generalization for bad fourtune.And the guy in the
armour suit coming after bruce was only in the movie,sorry to break it
to you like this bud.
Qui chu ji
Jerry Love
"Dustin Laurence" <laur...@cco.caltech.edu> wrote in message
news:8mcflo$i...@gap.cco.caltech.edu...
> "Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> writes:
>
> >Actually, you could thrust with it (though it's blunt damage). I suppose
I
> >could see some similarites with a broadsword (I could swimg a bat like
one)
> >but it's pretty different from most other styles (sabre, claymore,
butterfly
> >swords, katana, etc)
>
>
> Er, nonsense. The salient fact about a bat are that it is heavily
> end-weighted (actually also that you can grasp it in the middle, but
> forget that for now). It handles, in fact, like an axe, physical
> appearance to the contrary.
I can recover and reverse direction faster on a bat than an axe. It's not
quite the same amount of forward balance.
> It's center of mass is closer to the business
> end than the handle, while the center of mass of a "broadsword" is
> probably a couple of inches beyond the hilt. A broadsword is exceedingly
> well balanced.
The broadswords I swung (swords with about a 6in handle and 24in blade) were
foreward balanced chopping weapons. (good ole SCA days)
> Since that is mostly a Victorian collector's term it's a bit hard to say
> what a broadsword might be, but I'm using it to refer to the sort of
> Renaissance cut & thrust "short sword" (i.e. shorter than a long rapier)
> they applied it to. What do you mean? What period, what handling
> characteristics? Why do you think it handles more like a bat than the
> other blades you mention? Assuming a Renaissance sword, it is in fact
> used *less* like an axe than the others you mentioned (actually, I don't
> know for butterfly sowords), since it is intended to be as suited to
> thrusting as to cutting.
Pre renaissance, though I could well not be using the proper name for it.
Not a thrusting weapon, defanitely a chopping weapon.
> If you were thinking of a Medieval or earlier sword (which kind, how many
> hands?), still no-go. As blades go, it would be closest to a falchion,
> cutlass, or (I believe) dao--all end-weighted cleaver-type or machete-type
> blades, so far as I know.
One handed, a bit more foreward weighted than a baseball bat.
> I claim no expertise in the use of these things, but even an armchair
> swordsman can at least get the basic physical handling characteristics
> right. I admit that the pet peeve is the idea that somehow European
> swords were used for unskilled hacking using baseball bat swings. It just
> ain't so.
I fear I am not even an armchair swordsman. But I was an SCA stick jock, and
I do have some nice swords with the balance I am describing. But as I said,
perhaps not a broadsword.
Jerry
Jerry Love
news:8mco6i$erh$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <MU0i5.608$NI2.2...@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net>,
> "Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> >
> > That's just untrue. Look at KF weapons, it is a war art adapted for
>
> Okay i'm looking. Lets see.... Spears... Useless against ranged
> weapons.
That makes them not war weapons? Neither are swords, pikes, lances, or most
anything else then. That's a silly standard for war weapons.
> Melon hammers (?), bamboo shields (?), tiger fork... Maim the
> horses legs not the man. How cowardly can you get? Kwan dao...
Oh, now warfare is about being brave? I thought it was about winning.
> Kwan dao was used like, what, 4 times in combat? Seriously....
Don't know what Kwan Dao is.
> War art my ass. What are these great conquests the chinese had? None.
> Who had the capacity to fight against han migration? No one. Thats the
> point.
China was not always the size it is now. And it used to be composed of
several kingdoms, which were take over by force of arms.
> It only became a problem with other han races began to fight amongst
> themselves, and later some peaceful races learned how to fight. Then
> the han used the huns and mongols as mercenarys to whipe them out. By
> that time the huns became SOOOOOO superior that fighting was
> barbaric....
So, since someone is better at war, I don't have war skills? The Europeans
didn't have any war skills then since they lost to Kahn too. And the Moors
would loose to the Europeans (when the latter weren't sying of heat stroke)
so they had not war skill eaither?
> (snip)
>
> > The big group you lost was all the soldiers.
> >
> > Jerry
>
> Wushu playing and Power rangers! Ahahahahahahhaah.
Wushu is modern and (as I pointed out) not suited for war. Your power ranger
fantasies are your own, I don't want to hear about them.
Jerry
klumsyboy
ps i was also replying to aikido being the japanese version of tai chi
chuan which someone wrote but aikido doesnt use fist (unless youre the
uke) right???
In article <GD6i5.1112$NI2.4...@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net>,
"Jerry Love" <sp...@microsoft.com> wrote:
> Yes, Chen more than Yang (cannot comment on other styles). Open hand
attacks
> are more common than fist attacks, but both are used.
>
> "klumsyboy" <klum...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:8mapiq$v48$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> >
> >
> >
> > you know how tai chi chuan has fist meaning chuan...i dont believe
tai
> > chi uses the fist at all do they?
> >
> > at least aikido dont use fist.
> >
> >
> >
> > In article <8ma32k$epm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> > liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> > > In article <398638b8$0$11142$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> > > "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > BUT Aikido is good for mutliple attackers too you know.
> > >
> > > Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai
Chi
> > > Chuan.
> > >
> > > BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
> > >
> > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> > > Before you buy.
> > >
> >
> > --
> > http://w.diz.nu
> > http://cumto.cjb.net
> > http://skateto.cjb.net
> > If youre half as smart as me, then Im twice as smart as you.
> >
> >
> > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> > Before you buy.
>
>
--
http://w.diz.nu
http://cumto.cjb.net
http://skateto.cjb.net
If youre half as smart as me, then Im twice as smart as you.
Stephen
wrote:
>> > That's just untrue. Look at KF weapons, it is a war art adapted for
>>
>> Okay i'm looking. Lets see.... Spears... Useless against ranged
>> weapons.
>
>That makes them not war weapons? Neither are swords, pikes, lances, or most
>anything else then. That's a silly standard for war weapons.
If you ask me, a weapon is anything that can be used to cause damage.
>
>> Melon hammers (?), bamboo shields (?), tiger fork... Maim the
>> horses legs not the man. How cowardly can you get? Kwan dao...
>
>Oh, now warfare is about being brave? I thought it was about winning.
If you are fighting a war to be fair, you're an idiot. If you get in
a fight, are you worried about being fair or about winning? I don't
know about anyone else but I'm gonna do whatever it takes to make sure
I put my adversary on the ground or under the ground.
>
>> Kwan dao was used like, what, 4 times in combat? Seriously....
haha, that's foolish. Kwan Dao's are especially brutal weapons which
were highly effective.
>
>Don't know what Kwan Dao is.
A kwan dao is like a spear with a chinese broadsword blade on the end.
The unbladed side can be a jagged "dragon's tooth" edge or it can have
9 rings on it for catching sword blades and breaking them. Also, on
the bottom, it usually has a large ring with a bunch of smaller rings
used to catching poles and stuff
I found a picture of a Kwan Dao with the dragons tooth here and
without the rings.
http://www.tlhkungfu.com/products/productpix/pix037.jpg
I couldn't find a pic of the 9 ringer
>
[Snip abuncha stuff about chinese warfare]
China was never actually a militarized country like the rest of the
world. Most of the warfare was not that big or spectacular.
>
Jerry Love
> I WAS ALL CONFUSED...NOW IVE FOUND "the way"
>
> ps i was also replying to aikido being the japanese version of tai chi
> chuan which someone wrote but aikido doesnt use fist (unless youre the
> uke) right???
A) There is no Uke in TaiChi
B) Akido does use fists (I've seen them an Atemi)
qui_c...@my-deja.com
> it is not useful for modern warfare. Nor is it particularly useful for
> firearm useage (the first, best method of self defense). So as a
martial
> art, it is no longer all things to all people.
Yeah it is situational and I would never fight someone with a gun.but
there is a classical line in Enter the dragon were bruce asks mr
braithwait 'Why does no one pull a 45 and settle it'To this mr
braithwait tells lee that han is scared of guns 'besides any bloody
fool can pull a trigger'.A gun is not as good a wepon as a fist it
requires maintinance it can also go wrong there is the chance with an
automatic wepon or a wepon that uses dispersal that others you were not
intending to kill would be hurt.You can not carry one around with you
at least in my country(which is a good thing).And need a licence to own
one at all.So basicly a gun of any type is the most ineffective in a
combat situation as there are so many variables And you can'ot deliver
a non-lethal response.
Qui chu ji
Jerry Love
news:8mf5q4$82d$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>
>
> > it is not useful for modern warfare. Nor is it particularly useful for
> > firearm useage (the first, best method of self defense). So as a
> martial
> > art, it is no longer all things to all people.
>
> Yeah it is situational and I would never fight someone with a gun.
Because of a gun's effectiveness?
> but
> there is a classical line in Enter the dragon were bruce asks mr
> braithwait 'Why does no one pull a 45 and settle it'To this mr
> braithwait tells lee that han is scared of guns
Again, because they are so effective at inflicting damage.
> 'besides any bloody fool can pull a trigger'.
The old "it's not sporting" defense. I've known other martial artists to say
that about my entire art.
> A gun is not as good a wepon as a fist
Let's just soak that one in a bit before we look at your support......
> it requires maintinance it can also go wrong
Reliability on a maintained firearm is very high.
> there is the chance with an automatic wepon or a wepon that uses
> dispersal that others you were not intending to kill would be hurt.
The "it's a bad weapon because it's such a good weapon" defence?
That is a danger even with a single-firing weapon. They can overpenitrate,
you can miss, etc.
Course fighting the burgler in the dark you could hit the wrong person too.
> You can not carry one around with you at least in my country
> (which is a good thing). And need a licence to own one at all.
That might make it an unavailable weapon (always a danger) but not a bad
one.
> So basicly a gun of any type is the most ineffective in a
> combat situation as there are so many variables
There is a reason the millitary uses them. Armies that do defeat armies that
don't.
> And you can'ot deliver a non-lethal response.
You can, but I would not recommend it.
Jerry
BarnesKenpo
> Yeah it is situational and I would never fight someone with a gun.
Smart move.
>but
>there is a classical line in Enter the dragon were bruce asks mr
>braithwait 'Why does no one pull a 45 and settle it'To this mr
>braithwait tells lee that han is scared of guns 'besides any bloody
>fool can pull a trigger'.
"Any bloody fool can pull a trigger" is probably one of the more
ridiculous lines in that movie. Guns are very effective and it is relatively
easy to use them; they do not take an inordinate amount of training to
effectively use them. If they did, I doubt they would be the weapon of choice
for every gang banger and street punk.
>A gun is not as good a wepon as a fist it
>requires maintinance it can also go wrong there is the chance with an
>automatic wepon or a wepon that uses dispersal that others you were not
>intending to kill would be hurt.
A fist is a better weapon than a gun? You cannot be serious. If that is
so, why are firearms the choice of protection for law enforcement and military
the world over? Why aren't they simply fighting crime or fighting wars by
punching the daylights out of each other? Besides, I've never heard of the fist
that can leave a gaping exit wound, have you?
>You can not carry one around with you
>at least in my country(which is a good thing).
Unavailability is one thing; effectiveness quite another.
>And need a licence to own
>one at all.
If you cannot carry one, why would you need a license?
>So basicly a gun of any type is the most ineffective in a
>combat situation as there are so many variables
Really? Did you actually think about what you wrote? Have you ever been
held up at gunpoint? A gun has another factor that a fist oftentimes does not:
visual deterrence and intimidation. The threat of being shot carries alot more
weight in my book than the threat of being punched.
> And you can'ot deliver
>a non-lethal response.
>
Sure you can. Emergency rooms are filled with tons of people who have been
shot and lived.
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
liju...@my-deja.com
qui_c...@my-deja.com wrote:
>And the guy in the
> armour suit coming after bruce was only in the movie,sorry to break it
> to you like this bud.
Yes, I'm aware there were a FEW errors in the film.
Ariel
fighter, if you put in the same time as you put in in studing the slower
one, but that is just me...
Ariel
david carradine
(hope i spelled his name right) and he can fly and see the future too, which
is very valuable as a fighting method.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
>
> "Any bloody fool can pull a trigger" is probably one of the more
> ridiculous lines in that movie. Guns are very effective and it is
relatively
> easy to use them; they do not take an inordinate amount of training to
> effectively use them. If they did, I doubt they would be the weapon
of choice
> for every gang banger and street punk.
>
> >A gun is not as good a wepon as a fist it
> >requires maintinance it can also go wrong there is the chance with an
> >automatic wepon or a wepon that uses dispersal that others you were
not
> >intending to kill would be hurt.
>
> A fist is a better weapon than a gun? You cannot be serious. If
that is
> so, why are firearms the choice of protection for law enforcement and
military
> the world over? Why aren't they simply fighting crime or fighting
wars by
> punching the daylights out of each other? Besides, I've never heard
of the fist
> that can leave a gaping exit wound, have you?
Any bloody fool can pull a trigger thats what it means you do not need
training or a certain type of body shape to be able to use one.I have
seen a fist that can leave a gapping exit wound,why have you not?
I have seen fists go through wood and brick,claw techniques rip the
bark off trees palm techniques that make you fall over and not get back
up.
Qui chu ji
qui_c...@my-deja.com
The moder army is using less and less soldiers with guns and more long
range missiles etc.Are you trying to tell me firing a missile from a
boat 100 miles away is a martial art.Plus the chinese invented gun
powder but did not develope it into a wepon.I guess they were more sure
of there fighting ability.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
Yeah want's up with the other guy that he thinks he is some kind of
expert on chinese names.They should do a little reserch before
presuming themselves in the right and making jokes at others expenses.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
From the obove statment you have never read up on chiese history except
that which is published in a reader's digest book of history.The many
wars faught with the siam kings to the south and the mongol hordes to
the north.Sure they did invade but were eventualy overthrown in a
rebelion.The waring states period were there was so many battles and
skirmishes they have not all been accounted for.Not to mention bandits
who in the mountinous regions had a hundred or so followers and would
raid whole towns.No test in combat get your facts straight please.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
> Self defense? Against dragons, monkeys, mutant mantids, tigers and
> cranes? Sure, self defense. Whatever.
Written by a man whos only expirience of chinese boxing is having
watched david caridine in kung fu the movie.You dont have to forget how
to talk english properly and walk around barefooted.I to whould have
been put off by this but my uncle was a chinese boxer and qi gong
expert He could lift incredible amounts of weight and when my cousin
got ill he took another job so was working a 24 hour day.The tigers
part of the above statment is true My current sifu whould probably just
look at the bugger and it would run away.
BarnesKenpo
>I have
>seen a fist that can leave a gapping exit wound,why have you not?
Nope can't say as I ever have ... not when working in a bar where fights
were a common occurrence ... and neither has the ER nurse I know who has seen
the results of literally dozens of fights. Why? Cause it doesn't happen. Kind
of like the old myth of the masters who were able to rip out a guys heart, show
it too him while it was still beating, before he died. A physical
impossibility. Next time you see someone leave a gaping exit wound with a punch
... do me a favor ... take a picture, cause that's one for the record books.
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
Dustin Laurence
>I can recover and reverse direction faster on a bat than an axe. It's not
>quite the same amount of forward balance.
The point was just that European swords balance close to the hilt,
certainly not beyond their midpoint as a bat does. The axe may be
becoming a red herring--forget it. Unless it falls into the
"meat-cleaver" class of blades like falchions and cutlasses. I haven't
seem them being called "swords" much, though.
>The broadswords I swung (swords with about a 6in handle and 24in blade) were
>foreward balanced chopping weapons. (good ole SCA days)
All respect to the most honorable SCAdians, but the people who have
handled period blades don't seem to think a lot of the SCA sparring tools.
I'd be reluctant to use them to judge anything about real swords.
>Pre renaissance, though I could well not be using the proper name for it.
>Not a thrusting weapon, defanitely a chopping weapon.
There was apparently never a time when thrusting was not used, legend to
the contrary. I'm told that the round-tipped swords coexisted with
pointed ones, so it must have been a personal preference throughout that
period.
(Notice the peeve meter? I didn't like being lied to for all these
years.)
You're thinking of a medieval sword, I guess. It still should be *much*
better balanced than a bat. Unfortunately my Medieval Swordsmanship is
loaned out, or I'd check to see where the balance point tends to be.
That said, there are a number of types--the type with parallel edges would
be the closest to what you're thinking of. I'm not sure where the balance
point is, but the hilt should still ensure that it is on the hilt side of
the midpoint.
>I fear I am not even an armchair swordsman.
Well, I found some people that I can work out with one day a week. At
that rate, I'll be the most skilled swordsman in the nursing
home! "Armchair" is probably close enough!
The wooden longswod wasters (like bokken) they use are supposed to balance
and swing something like the real thing; they balance a few inches forward
of the crossguard. That isn't forward weighted to me.
>...But I was an SCA stick jock, and
>I do have some nice swords with the balance I am describing. But as I said,
>perhaps not a broadsword.
Perhaps I don't understand what you have in mind, or perhaps this just
exceeds my limited knowledge. But I don't recall any mention of swords as
end-weighted as a bat. Are you sure these swords have any historical
accuracy? Did the maker mention which museum or private collection piece
they were made from? I ask because the most common "swords" are
apparently gawdawful badly balanced. The nice cheap ways of machining a
blade make a heavy, end-weighted blade, as does the obvious idea of
scaling up from knive blades. As do blades made for stage combat. I'd
kinda guess your reproductions (and I assume they are modern
reproductions) may not represent anything historical. Just a guess.
Steve Scott
> Gung-Fu takes longer, is more difficult to study,
Not necessarily. Try Capoeira sometime. I can think of a number of
arts equally challenging.
> and
> contains internal as well as external styles, and styles
> which cover both external and internal, and styles which
> emphasize external over internal or vice-versa.
You just pointed out that Gung Fu is NOT a monolith. So, which STYLE
of Gung Fu do you think is superior? You should narrow it down, first.
> Do these points make it an advantage to know Gung-Fu
> over other martial arts?
You haven't set a good list of criteria yet for why you think gung fu
is superior.
> The promotion of longevity as well as efficient and
> dynamic self-defense. This could well be another factor.
Sorry...I don't think there are any studies that indicate gung fu makes
a person live longer than any other martial art or activity of equal
intensity.
SCS
Jerry Love
news:8mkaf6$ihb$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
>
>
> The moder army is using less and less soldiers with guns and more long
> range missiles etc.Are you trying to tell me firing a missile from a
> boat 100 miles away is a martial art.
Technically it is. However, I tend to restrict my personal definition of
martial arts to skills that include "contest". So up to and including
handguns.
> Plus the chinese invented gun powder but did not develope it into a wepon.
You mean like the war rockets they used?
> I guess they were more sure of there fighting ability.
Or lacked the metalurgical skills to develop cannon? Actually there were
some cultural issues preventing good technology development around that
time.
BTW, didn't their martial skills fail miserably against said firearms? (The
British took and held land, so did the Portugese. The French took IndoChina,
the Japaneese (with firearms) took a good chunk of China until the Americans
(with firearms) defeated them) Does anyone remember the Boxer's rebellion?
Jerry
liju...@my-deja.com
"harveyc" <harveyckill...@sprint.ca> wrote:
>
> However, the nickname his parents used was "Sai Fung," a feminine
sounding
> name meaning "Little Phoenix." Later, he adopted "Little Dragon" as
a
> stage name as a play on his childhood nickname.
FYI, he used the name "Lung" in his film "Way of the Dragon"
AKA "Return of the Dragon;" "Lung" is Chinese for "dragon."
alle...@my-deja.com
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <398638b8$0$11142$7f31...@news01.syd.optusnet.com.au>,
> "William" <buffy...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > BUT Aikido is good for mutliple attackers too you know.
>
> Aikido could be viewed at as the Japanese counterpart of Tai Chi
> Chuan.
>
> BTW, Tai Chi Chuan means "Grand or Supreme Ultimate Fist".
>
to aikido, others to judo, etc.,. The art can only speak thru the man.
Vu
BarnesKenpo wrote:
> qui_chu_ji wrote:
>
> >I have
> >seen a fist that can leave a gapping exit wound,why have you not?
>
> Nope can't say as I ever have ... not when working in a bar where fights
> were a common occurrence ... and neither has the ER nurse I know who has seen
> the results of literally dozens of fights. Why? Cause it doesn't happen.
i havn't seen or been to the snow.
now i know why. it doesn't exist!
--
Vu.
200 ways to annoy your room-mate
9. Speak in tongues.
Badger
In article <8ma47m$fp2$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
liju...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <8m7avt$cn3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
> Badger <badger...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>
> > First of all, you are making some gross generalizations. Some
styles
> > take longer to learn than others. Wing chun and bak mei are two
that
> > promote some fighting ability early on, for example. Putting out a
> > blanket statement like "is gung fu the superior art?" is so
> generalized
> > as to be impossible to answer.
>
> What about when you size up gung fu against other arts?
Again, you don't get the point. Trying to compare "gung fu" against
other arts is moronically vague. Are you talking wing chun, choy lee
fut, hung gar, lau gar, choy gar, mok gar, lee gar, shaolin (Gu Yu
Cheong, southern, northern, five animals), mantis (seven stars, eight
step, half step, tai chi, southern), white eyebrow, emei, hsing i
(Honan, Hebei, Shanxi), pakua, tai chi (Chen, Yang, Sun, Hao, Wu, etc),
baji, iron Buddha, monkey, long fist, tam toi, white crane (Fukien,
Tibetan), etc., etc., friggin' etc.? Well? Which is it? They are not
created equal and should not be treated as such.
>
> > How many totally different styles did the Chinese government catalog
> in
> > their national survey? Something like 250? If I was to indulge
your
> > statement, it would only be to say that somewhere in that vast pool
> >of styles there is enough variety to find a good style for any random
> > person.
>
> That's a pretty fair statement.
No, its a pretty vague statement. I might as well have said that in
every martial arts style IN EXISTANCE, there is something that will fit
a person. In fact, it is so generalized as to be essentially useless,
as is your original question.
> > Rephrase your question, be more style specific, and maybe then we
can
> > get a useful answer.
Reread this above statement. Get back to me when you understand.
Badger
--
Shaolin Five Animals Kung Fu
& Filipino Martial Arts
http://www.cyberus.ca/~badger/
www3.sympatico.ca/t_s.creasey/16NCT/Seminar.htm
qui_c...@my-deja.com
No up until the 19th century china was ahead of all other nations when
it came to mettalurgy.so they could have easily created a cannon,they
created the first moving clock using coggs etc.throwing a couple of
cannons together would have been a piece of cake.They did not see the
reason to invade other countries and bring death and destruction.At
least when the mongols invaded they were civalived you cant say that
about the americans or the europeans.As far as the boxers were
concerned they were a small ill equiped group but managed to terify the
americans and europeans in china at the time it was political menouvers
by the chinese government that crushed the majority of the movment.
Qui chu ji
BarnesKenpo
> havn't seen or been to the snow.
>now i know why. it doesn't exist!
>
Maybe you're just blind.
Or stupid.
Or totally ignorant of environmental factors in parts of the world other
than your own.
Maybe you simply don't get ou of the house much.
I don't know and it doesn't matter. In either case the logic isn't the
same. The point was not that such injuries don't exist because *I* have never
seen them, but honestly, when is the last time in your experience that a punch
has left a gaping exit wound on a body? Cuts, contusions, lumps, bumps, and
bruises, definitely and without question. But a GAPING (emphasize that, GAPING)
exit wound? Only in the movies, dude. Wake up and smell the reality.
Regards,
Gary R. Barnes
qui_c...@my-deja.com
barne...@aol.com (BarnesKenpo) wrote:
> qui_chu_ji wrote:
>
> >I have
> >seen a fist that can leave a gapping exit wound,why have you not?
>
> Nope can't say as I ever have ... not when working in a bar
where fights
> were a common occurrence ... and neither has the ER nurse I know who
has seen
> the results of literally dozens of fights. Why? Cause it doesn't
> of like the old myth of the masters who were able to rip out a guys
heart, show
> it too him while it was still beating, before he died. A physical
> impossibility. Next time you see someone leave a gaping exit wound
with a punch
> ... do me a favor ... take a picture, cause that's one for the record
books.
>
> Regards,
> Gary R. Barnes
So the stuff I talked about before is nothing there is a policeman in
china who can spit water so fast and hard it can break rocks.He does
not even have to carry a gun.Your physical immposibilty stuff is
probably what is stoping you becoming an exceptional martial artist.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
> Sorry...I don't think there are any studies that indicate gung
fu makes
> a person live longer than any other martial art or activity of equal
> intensity.
>
> SCS
Yang meijing 113 years old grandmaster of wild goose qi gong and wild
goose fist style.Still able to get here leg above her head(can you even
accomplish this now!).Name me another martial artist of the same age
still practicng there art.Bet ya cant.
KuramaYou
china who can spit water so fast and hard it can break rocks.He does
not even have to carry a gun.Your physical immposibilty stuff is
probably what is stoping you becoming an exceptional martial artist.>>
I highly doubt that this is true. If it is, than it has nothing to do with
martial arts and more with genetics. And even if you could spit water like
that at that force, a gun would be better to have on you.
It's not the size of the dog in the fight...
It's the size of the fight in the dog!
((Uness...it's a big dog with a lot of fight. Than you're screwed))
http://www.thehungersite.com By visiting you can feed the needy for free.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
Yes we do get burdanded with all the bad role models dont we.
Lets see davids flying ability that must be what he uses those big
yellow fethers for.His seeing into the future would be futile as he
would only see himself getting beat up every week.'Goan' and the crap
that comes out of his mouth sounds less like daoism and buddhism and
more like the one liners that you find in fourtune cookies.Yet his
image endures as the ambassador of kung fu the guy can hardly act let
alone do martial arts.I saw a book resently with him in on tai chi
seems like after the the shaolin temple thing blew over he retured to
china to study on wu dong mountain and mastered that art to is there
nothing this man can not do.Please whould sombody teach him a few
karate moves or somthing so he can become 25 dan in that instead.
coldblood
--
andrew
cats the other white meat
GOU RONIN® <kenpo...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:39938184...@news.golden.net...
> qui_c...@my-deja.com scribbled with their crayola:
>
> >there is a policeman in
> >china who can spit water so fast and hard it can break rocks.He does
> >not even have to carry a gun.
>
> I believe it. After all. The bullsh*t you're spewing is coming
> so hard and fast it's breaking my monitor all the way over here.
>
>
> GOU RONIN® - The Unforgiven...
> ICQ# - 49024165
> http://members.tripod.com/~kenpo_ronin/houseofronin.html
GOU RONIN®
>Yang meijing 113 years old grandmaster of wild goose qi gong and wild
>goose fist style.Still able to get here leg above her head(can you even
>accomplish this now!).Name me another martial artist of the same age
>still practicng there art.Bet ya cant.
Bet ya if I wait a bit he'll keel over dead in front of me.
GOU RONIN®
>there is a policeman in
>china who can spit water so fast and hard it can break rocks.He does
>not even have to carry a gun.
I believe it. After all. The bullsh*t you're spewing is coming
so hard and fast it's breaking my monitor all the way over here.
qui_c...@my-deja.com
Gou your lame atempts at hummour are at best worth a chuckle at worst
fucking annoying.You never debate only stick in half assed one liners.
Is this because you in fact no nothing about the martial arts,thought
maybe you would pick a thing or to up did you impress your mates.Well
you would have if your brain was switched on and your ears open.Try
reading a response right the way down,I mean realy read it not
formulate smart assed response in your mind before getting off the
first paragraph.I am sure this response will meet with a witty repartie
of seven sylabyls or less but then we have come to expect no less or
more from you Gou Ronin(the unforgiven).