Knife steel
Gary
characteristics of the various steels used in knives? I have found several
web pages that describe steels that are available for folks who are making
knives, but none that cover all or most of the steels used in factory
knives. Specifically, I have not been able to find anything in 420 or 18/8,
both I have seen used in commercial knives.
Thanks, Gary
-----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
-----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =-----
A.T. Barr
Gary wrote:
--
A.T. Barr
http://www.customknives.com
Every day is a present just waiting to be opened and explored.
Togrul
they would have a website, like most other magazines (heck, I even order
subscriptions online now) and would be avaliable for direct e-mail, not to
mention FAQs and/or bulletin boards. Try Google.com, which is a search
engine, and try searching something like "knives and steel" or something
similar. . .I've had really good luck with google.
"Gary" <gwe...@nbn.net> wrote in message
news:3ae81...@corp.newsfeeds.com...
Doug Mlodzinski
news:3ae81...@corp.newsfeeds.com...
> Can someone point me to a web page or other resource that explains the
> characteristics of the various steels used in knives?
The Spyderco.com site has a great listing of steels and their
characteristics. It's under the "edgeucation" link.
--
Doug
dm...@frontiernet.net
AIM: Habano Lover
ICQ# 39438714
Brian W Edginton
>Knife World or Blade magazine would be a good source. I imagine, too, that
>they would have a website, like most other magazines (heck, I even order
>subscriptions online now) and would be avaliable for direct e-mail, not to
>mention FAQs and/or bulletin boards. Try Google.com, which is a search
>engine, and try searching something like "knives and steel" or something
>similar. . .I've had really good luck with google.
Good advice......why don't you make use of it yourself and stop using
a single paragraph in an encyclopedia for your source on steels?
brianWE
The above information is supplied for entertainment purposes only.
No responsibility is accepted by the author for inconvenience incurred
by any reader silly enough to act on unsubstantiated Usenet advice.
Webmarketing
your questions, though. I don't know what a commercial knife is but here
goes. 420 has always been a popular handle material in knife manufacturing
since it is high in corrosion resistance. It is somewhat "hardenable,"
though, and has been used as a blade material on inexpensive "collector"
knives made in Taiwan. Most knowledgeable knife people don't consider it a
blade steel. There are certainly different steels that share these three
numbers, nevertheless. 420V, as an example, is a very good and very modern
blade steel but it isn't really that similar to regular 420 and certainly
isn't comparable. So delving into different "types" of 420 may be important
to your search.
18/8 or 18/10 stainless isn't a cutlery steel and isn't used in knife blades
except, of course, for dinner or butter knives in a flatware set. It can't
hold a sharp edge and, for that reason isn't used to make knife blades. It
is used commonly for things like pots and pans and flatware. It is very
corrosion resistant so it's great for kitchen products (except for cooking
knives, of course.) Good luck with the search.
Fred
Knife Outlet
http://www.knifeoutlet.com
Gary <gwe...@nbn.net> wrote in message news:3ae81...@corp.newsfeeds.com...
Togrul
"Brian W Edginton" <ed...@dingoblue.net.au> wrote in message
news:9p5het4pmqeqshaqv...@4ax.com...
Carlo Morpurgo
Joe Talmadge
: Gary <gwe...@nbn.net> wrote in message news:3ae81...@corp.newsfeeds.com...
: > Can someone point me to a web page or other resource that explains the
: > characteristics of the various steels used in knives? I have found
: several
: > web pages that describe steels that are available for folks who are making
: > knives, but none that cover all or most of the steels used in factory
: > knives. Specifically, I have not been able to find anything in 420 or
: 18/8,
: > both I have seen used in commercial knives.
: > Thanks, Gary
I'll be updating this soon.
rec.knives Steel FAQ
Author: Joe Talmadge j...@cup.hp.com
Last Updated: September 1999
Let me start with my bibliography. I got the knowledge for this FAQ
from my own experience as a collector and amateur knifemaker, and from
countless conversations with custom makers. I've also read countless
articles on steels, but here are the ones that I actually had in front
of me:
Bob Engnath's Blades and Stuff Catalog. Bob's catalog is a
must-see for everyone, even for just collectors, as it contains
a wealth of information on all kinds of great knife subjects.
There is a section on knife steels. Bob passed away in 1998,
but if you can find an old copy of his catalog, grab it.
"The Secrets of Steel," by Butch Winter, _Tactical
Knives_, Spring 1995.
"What Alloys Do For Blade Steel," by Wayne Goddard, _Blade_,
June 1994.
Email conversation with Wayne Goddard, February 1998.
Don Fogg's article on damascus steels from his website
www.dfoggknives.com (information used by permission)
"Inside Steel: What the Alloying Elements Do For Your
Blade", by Ed Severson with Steve Shackleford, _Blade, August 1999.
Also worth reading:
# A great steel comparison page
http://www.shreve.net/~primos/steelcmp.htm
# Principal Metals vast database of steel properties & terms
http://www.principalmetals.com
# Crucible's Steel Pages, loaded with info on composition/selection/etc.
http://www.crucibleservice.com/cscd/crumain2.htm
# Suppliers Online huge database of steel info
http://www.suppliersonline.com
#A.G. Russell's FAQ Pages
http://agrussell.com/faq/index.html
#Spyderco's Steel Page
http://www.spyderco.com/spyderco_products.cfm#steelchart
# Malex's Steel Data Chart for Knifemaking
http://www.online.ru/people/malex/
# Knives.com entire site is interesting, but hit "Tech", then "Steel"
http://www.knives.com
# Metal Mart's dictionary of metallurgical terms
http://www.metal-mart.com/dictlist.htm
# Kevin Wilkins small Steel Crossreference Chart (US/Germany/Japan)
http://www.wilkins-knives.com
# A list of metallurgical sites, schools, organizations, and journals
http://www.mlc.lib.mi.us/~stewarca/metallurgy.html
# Titanium Info
http://www.halperntitanium.com/
# Don Fogg's excellent info pages
www.dfoggknives.com
# A good steel chart
http://www.pizzini.at/steellist.htm
The State of Knife Steels Today (editorial):
There are some very interesting things going on in the knifemaking
world, steel-wise. In the non-stainless steel world, Benchmade's
offering of an AFCK with M-2 steel has set off a flurry of interest in
non-stainless steel, a very good trend in my opinion. EDI and Mission
Knives have both come out with A-2 folders, and Kabar with a line of
D-2 folders.
Stainless-wise, there are even more exciting things going on. ATS-34
has been on fire for the past 10 years or so, but the leading-edge
consumers and makers are already looking past it. BG-42 and VG-10 are
offering significant improvements over ATS-34 in edge-holding, and
improvement in toughness too. 440V and 420V leapfrog even those steels in
terms of edge-holding, with 420V having good toughness.
In the area of non-steel materials, the interesting titanium alloys
that came out a few years ago are joined by some promising ceramic
materials and cobalt alloys. Talonite offers the non-paralleled
(outside of ceramics) edge-holding and non-corrosiveness of the older
Stellite 6K cobalt alloy, but talonite is much cheaper and easier to
work, making it affordable enough to be an interesting material. Rob
Simonich, T.H. Rinaldi, and Kit Carson have been using talonite
recently. David Boye's BDC cobalt alloy, made with Boye's dendritic
process, is also promising. On the ceramic side, Kevin McClung's
ceramic composite shows that ceramics are available that are tough
enough to chop with (though still less tough than steel). This
ceramic holds an edge forever and is non-corrosive.
A well-informed, leading-edge knife buyer or maker should be looking
at these promising trends carefully. The use of new stainless steels
and cobalt alloys and ceramics, and the renewed interest in
high-performing non-stainless steels, are all very positive and
exciting trends in cutlery technology.
Introduction:
One thing to keep in mind is that there's more to knife performance
than the steel. The blade profile is also important (a tanto format
isn't the best choice to skin a deer, for example). But perhaps most
important is the heat treatment. A good solid heat treatment on a
lesser steel will often result in a blade that outperforms a better
steel with inferior heat treatment. Bad heat treatment can cause a
stainless steel to lose some of its stainless properties, or cause a
tough steel to become brittle, etc. Unfortunately, of the three most
important properties (blade profile, steel type, heat treatment), heat
treatment is the one that is impossible to assess by eye, and as a
result excessive attention is sometimes paid to the other two.
Remember also to keep your particular application in mind. 440A is
often scoffed at, but I'd rather have my salt water dive knife made of
440A than L-6. Properly heat treated 5160 is wonderfully tough, but
if my application is skinning deer, I'm probably more interested in
edge holding ala 52100. And on and on.
Steel Alloys:
At its most simple, steel is iron with carbon in it. Other alloys are
added to make the steel perform differently. Here are the important
steel alloys in alphabetical order, and some sample steels that
contain those alloys:
Carbon: Present in all steels, it is the most important hardening
element. Also increases the strength of the steel. We
usually want knife-grade steel to have >.5% carbon, which
makes it "high-carbon" steel.
Chromium: Added for wear resistance, hardenability, and (most
importantly) for corrosion resistance. A steel with at least
13% chromium is typically deemed "stainless" steel, though
another definition says the steel must have at least 11.5%
*free* chromium (as opposed to being tied up in carbides) to
be considered "stainless". Despite the name, all steel can
rust if not maintained properly.
Manganese: An important element, manganese aids the grain structure,
and contributes to hardenability. Also strength &
wear resistance. Improves the steel (e.g., deoxidizes) during
the steel's manufacturing (hot working and rolling). Present
in most cutlery steel except for A-2, L-6, and CPM 420V.
Molybdenum: A carbide former, prevents brittleness & maintains
the steel's strength at high temperatures. Present in
many steels, and air-hardening steels (e.g., A-2, ATS-34)
always have 1% or more molybdenum -- molybdenum is what gives
those steels the ability to harden in air.
Nickel: Used for hardenability, and toughness. Present in
L-6 and AUS-6 and AUS-8. Nickel is widely believed to
play a role in corrosion resistance as well, but this
is probably incorrect.
Phosphorus: Present in small amounts in most steels, phosphorus is
a essentially a contaminent which reduces toughness.
Silicon: Contributes to strength. Like manganese, it makes the steel
more sound while it's being manufactured.
Sulfur: Typically not desireable in cutlery steel, sulfur increases
machinability but decreases toughness.
Tungsten: A carbide former, it increases wear resistance. When
combined properly with chromium or molybdenum, tungsten will
make the steel to be a high-speed steel. The high-speed steel
M-2 has a high amount of tungsten. The strongest carbide
former behind vanadium.
Vanadium: Contributes to wear resistance and hardenability. A carbide
former that helps produce fine-grained steel. A number
of steels have vanadium, but M-2, Vascowear, and CPM T440V and
420V (in order of increasing amounts) have high amounts of
vanadium. BG-42's biggest difference with ATS-34 is the
addition of vanadium. Vanadium also refines the grain
structure, resulting in a tougher steel.
CARBON and alloy steels (non-stainless steels):
These steels are the steels most often forged. Stainless steels can
be forged (guys like Sean McWilliams do forge stainless), but it is
very difficult. In addition, carbon steels can be differentially
tempered, to give a hard edge-holding edge and a tough springy back.
Stainless steels are not differentially tempered. Of course, carbon
steels will rust faster than stainless steels, to varying degrees.
Carbon steels are also often a little bit less of a crap shoot than
stainless steels -- I believe all the steels named below are fine
performers when heat treated properly.
In the AISI steel designation system, 10xx is carbon steel, any other
steels are alloy steels. For example, the 50xx series are chromium
steels.
In the SAE designation system, steels with letter designations (e.g.,
W-2, A-2) are tool steels.
There is an ASM classification system as well, but it isn't seen often
in the discussion of cutlery steels, so I'll ignore it for now.
Often, the last numbers in the name of a steel are fairly close to the
steel's carbon content. So 1095 is ~.95% carbon. 52100 is ~1.0%
carbon. 5160 is ~.60% carbon.
O-1
This is a steel very popular with forgers, as it has the reputation
for being "forgiving". It is an excellent steel, that takes and holds
an edge superbly, and is very tough. It rusts easily, however.
Randall Knives uses O-1, so does Mad Dog.
W-2
Reasonably tough and holds an edge well, due to its .2% vanadium
content. Most files are made from W-1, which is the same as W-2
except for the vanadium content (W-1 has no vanadium).
The 10-series -- 1095 (and 1084, 1070, 1060, 1050, etc.)
Many of the 10-series steels for cutlery, though 1095 is the most
popular for knives. When you go in order from 1095-1050, you
generally go from more carbon to less, from better edge holding to
less edge holding, and tough to tougher to toughest. As such, you'll
see 1060 and 1050, used often for swords. For knives, 1095 is sort of
the "standard" carbon steel, not too expensive and performs well. It
is reasonably tough and holds an edge very well. It rusts easily.
This is a simple steel, which contains only two alloying elements:
.95% carbon and .4% manganese. The various kabars are usually 1095
with a black coating.
Carbon V
Carbon V is a trademarked term by Cold Steel, and as such is not
necessarily one particular kind of steel; rather, it describes
whatever steel Cold Steel happens to be using, and there is an
indication they do change steels from time to time. Carbon V performs
roughly between 1095-ish and O-1-ish, in my opinion, and rusts like
O-1 as well. I've heard rumors that Carbon V is O-1 (which I now
think is unlikely) or 1095. Numerous industry insiders
insist it is 0170-6. Some spark tests done by a rec.knives reader
seem to point the finger at 50100-B. Since 50100-B and 0170-6 are the
same steel (see below), this is likely the current Carbon V.
0170-6 - 50100-B
These are different designations for the same steel: 0170-6 is the
steel makers classification, 50100-B is the AISI designation. A good
chrome-vanadium steel that is somewhat similar to O-1, but much less
expensive. The now-defunct Blackjack made several knives from O170-6,
and Carbon V may be 0170-6. 50100 is basically 52100 with about 1/3
the chromium of 52100, and the B in 50100-B indicates that the steel
has been modified with vanadium, making this a chrome-vanadium steel.
A-2
An excellent air-hardening tool steel, it is known for its great
toughness and good edge holding. As an air-hardening steel, so don't
expect it to be differentially tempered. Its outstanding toughness
makes it a frequent choice for combat knives. Chris Reeve and Phil
Hartsfield both use A-2, and Blackjack made a few models from A-2.
L-6
A band saw steel that is very tough and holds an edge well, but rusts
easily. It is, like O-1, a forgiving steel for the forger. If you're
willing to put up with the maintenance, this may be one of the very
best steels available for cutlery, especially where toughness is
desired.
M-2
A "high-speed steel", it can hold its temper even at very high
temperatures, and as such is used in industry for high-heat cutting
jobs. It is an excellent edge holder. It is tough but not as tough
as some of the toughest steels in this section; however, it will still
be tougher than the stainless steels and hold an edge better. It
rusts easily. Benchmade has started using M-2 in one of their AFCK
variations.
5160
A steel popular with forgers, it is extremely popular now for a
variety of knife styles. It is essentially a simple spring steel with
chromium added for hardenability. It has good edge holding, but is
known especially for its outstanding toughness (like L-6). This steel
performs well over a wide range of hardnesses, showing great toughess
when hardened in the low 50s Rc for swords, and hardened up near the
60s for knives needing more edge holding.
52100
A ball-bearing steel, and as such is only used by forgers. It is
similar to 5160 (though it has around 1% carbon vs. 5160 ~.60%), but
holds an edge better. It is less tough than 5160 however. It is used
often for hunting knives and other knives where the user is willing to
trade off a little of 5160's toughness for better edge holding.
D-2
D-2 is sometimes called a "semi-stainless". It has a fairly high
chrome content (12%), but not high enough to classify it as stainless.
It is more stain resistant than the carbon steels mentioned above,
however. It has excellent edge holding, but may be a little less
tough than some of the steels mentioned above. The combination of
great edge holding, almost-stainlessness, and good toughness make it a
great choice for a number of knife styles. Bob Dozier is one maker
who uses D-2.
Vascowear
A very hard-to-find steel, with a high vanadium content. It is
extremely difficult to work and very wear-resistant. It is out of
production.
"STAINLESS" Steels:
Remember that all steels can rust. But the following steels, by virtue
of their > 13% chromium, have much more rust resistance than the above
steels. I should point out that there doesn't appear to be consensus
on what percent of chromium is needed for a steel to be considered
stainless. In the cutlery industry, the de-facto standard is 13%, but
the ASM Metals Handbooks says "greater than 10%", and other books cite
other numbers. In addition, the alloying elements have a strong
influence on the amount of chromium needed; lower chromium with the
right alloying elements can still have "stainless" performance.
420
Lower carbon content (<.5%) than the 440 series makes this steel
extremely soft, and it doesn't hold an edge well. It is used often
for diving knives, as it is extremely stain resistant. Also used
often for very inexpensive knives. Outside salt water use, it is too
soft to be a good choice for a utility knife.
440 A - 440 B - 440C
The carbon content (and hardenability) of this stainless steel goes up
in order from A (.75%) to B (.9%) to C (1.2%). 440C is an excellent,
high-end stainless steel, usually hardened to around 56-58 Rc, very
tough and with good edge-holding at that hardness. All three resist
rust well, with 440A being the most rust resistant, and 440C the
least. The SOG Seal 2000 is 440A, and Randall uses 440B for their
stainless knives. 440C is fairly ubiquitous, and is generally
considered a very good general-use stainless, tougher and more stain
resistant than ATS-34 but with less edge-holding. If your knife is
marked with just "440", it is probably the less expensive 440A; if a
manufacturer had used the more expensive 440C, he'd want to advertise
that. The general feeling is that 440A (and similar steels, see
below) is just good enough for everyday use, especially with a good
heat treat (we've heard good reports on the heat treat of SOG's 440A
blades, don't know who does the work for them). 440-B is a very solid
performer and 440-C is excellent.
425M - 12C27
Both are very similar to 440A. 425M (.5% carbon) is used by Buck
knives. 12C27 (.6% carbon) is a Scandanavian steel used often in
Finish puukkos and Norwegian knives. 12C27 is said to perform very
well when carefully heat treated.
AUS-6 - AUS-8 - AUS-10 (aka 6A 8A 10A)
Japanese stainless steels, roughly comparable in carbon content to
440A (AUS-6, .65% carbon) and 440B (AUS-8, .75% carbon) and 440C
(AUS-10, 1.1% carbon). AUS-6 is used by Al Mar. Cold Steel's use of
AUS-8 has made it pretty popular, as heat treated by CS it won't hold
an edge like ATS-34, but is a bit softer and may be a bit tougher.
AUS-10 has roughly the same carbon content as 440C but with slightly
less chromium, so it should be a bit less rust resistant but perhaps a
bit tougher than 440C. All 3 steels have some vanadium added (which
the 440 series lacks), which will improve wear resistance and refines
the grain for both good toughness, and the ability to sharpen to a
very keen edge.
GIN-1 aka G-2
A steel with slightly less carbon, slightly more chromium, and much
less moly than ATS-34, it is used often by Spyderco. A very good
stainless steel, with a bit less edge holding than ATS-34.
ATS-34 - 154-CM
ATS-34 has been the hottest high-end stainless in the 1990s. 154-CM
is the original American version, but for a long time was not
manufactured to the high quality standards knifemakers expect, so
knifemakers switched over to ATS-34. CPM is again making high-quality
154-CM, and some companies seeking to stick with American-made
products (like Microtech) are using it. ATS-34 is a Hitachi product
that is very, very similar to 154-CM. Normally hardened to around 60
Rc, it holds an edge very well and is tough enough even at that high
hardness. Not as rust resistant as the 400 series above. Many custom
makers use ATS-34, and Spyderco (in their high-end knives) and
Benchmade are among the production companies that use it.
ATS-55
Similar to ATS-34, but with the moly removed and some other elements
added. This steel gives ATS-34 like performance. Since moly is an
expensive element useful for high-speed steels, and knife blades do
not need to be high speed, removing the moly hopefully drastically
decreases the price of the steel while at least retaining ATS-34's
performance. Spyderco is using this steel.
BG-42
Bob Loveless announced recently that he's switching from ATS-34 to
this steel. Keep an eye out for it, it's bound to catch on. BG-42 is
somewhat similar to ATS-34, with two major differences: It has twice
as much manganese as ATS-34, and has 1.2% vanadium (ATS-34 has no
vanadium), so look for significantly better edge-holding than ATS-34.
The addition of vanadium and the clean manufacturing process also
gives BG-42 better toughness than ATS-34. Chris Reeve has switched
from ATS-34 to BG-42 in his Sebenzas.
CPM T440V - CPM T420V
Two steels that hold an edge superbly, world class type edgeholding,
but it's difficult to get the edge there in the first place. These
steels are made with Crucible's particle metallurgy process, and that
process allows these steels to be packed with more alloying elements
than traditional steel manufacturing methods would allow. Both steels
are very high in vanadium, which accounts for their incredible edge
holding. Spyderco offers at least one model in CPM T440V. Custom
maker Sean McWilliams is a big fan of 440V, which he forges.
Depending on heat treatment, expect to have to work a bit harder to
sharpen these steels. For 440V, don't expect ATS-34 type
toughness. 420V is CPM's follow-on to 440V, and with less chromium and
almost double the vanadium, is more wear-resistant and may be tougher
than 440V.
400 Series Stainless
Before Cold Steel switched to AUS-8, many of their stainless products
were marketed as being of "400 Series Stainless". Other knife
companies are beginning to use the same term. What exactly *is* 400
Series Stainless? I always imagined it was 440-A, but there's nothing
to keep a company from using any 4xx steel, like 420 or 425M, and
calling it 400 Series Stainless.
DAMASCUS STEEL -- see www.dfoggknives.com for much more detail
Damascus steels are made by forge-welding two or more different metals
(usually steels). The billets are heated and welded; to get an idea
of the process, see Don Fogg's URL listed in the bibliography. The
damascus is then acid-etched. The different metals etch at different
rates, and depth and color contrast are revealed.
Damascus can be made with performance and/or aesthetic objectives in
mind. Aesthetically, the choice of materials is important. One
shiney steel and one darker steel etch out to show the most striking
pattern. If the maker is going more for beauty than performance, he
might even go with nickel, which is bright but does not perform as
well as steel for cutlery applications. The other factor affecting
beauty is of course the welding pattern. Many patterns of damascus
are available today, from random to star to ladder, and a whole lot
more.
The following steels will provide bright lines:
L-6 and 15N20 (the Swedish version of L-6) -- nickel content
O-1 -- chromium content
ASTM 203 E -- nickel content
Nickel
The following steels will provide dark lines:
1095
1084
5160
52100
W-2
NON-STEELS USED BY KNIFEMAKERS
Talonite - Stellite 6K - Boye Dendritic Cobalt (BDC)
These cobalt alloys have incredible wear resistance, and are
practically corrosion resistant. Stellite 6K has been around for
years, but was expensive and very difficult to work, and so is only
rarely seen. Talonite is easier to work, and as a result has been
gaining in popularity, especially among web-based knife buyers. David
Boye uses his casting process to manufacture Boye Dendritic Cobalt.
Titanium
Newer titanium alloys can be hardened near 50 Rc, and at that hardness
seem to take something approaching a useful edge. It is extremely
rust-resistant, and is non-magnetic. Popular as expensive dive knives
these days, because the SEALs use it as their knife when working
around magnetic-detonated mines. Mission knives uses titanium.
Tygrys makes a knife with a steel edge sandwiched by titanium.
Ceramics
Numerous knives have been offered with ceramic blades. Usually, those
blades are very very brittle, and cannot be sharpened by the user;
however, they hold an edge well. Boker and Kyocera make knives from
this type of ceramic. Kevin McClung recently came out with a ceramic
composite knife blade that much tougher than the previous ceramics,
tough enough to actually be useful as a knife blade for most jobs. It
is also user-sharpenable, and holds an edge incredibly well.
Gene
Togrul wrote in message ...
>Bite me, little boy
I have been following rec.knives for only a few months. I came here for the
sole reason of learning something. I have learned a lot and will continue to
do so because that is why I am here. I am eager to learn from the abundant
and varied experts at this site.
Reading the immature tritness of (Mr/Miss/Ms) Togrul is a sad time for this
group. Even though just as I was about to say that I had learned nothing new
by wading through his proudly misinformed diatribe *Eureka* Some one sent a
jewel.
http://octopus.freeyellow.com/metlinks.html
I have bookmarked it.
My hat is off to all of you who have continuously contributed in an affort
to simply share your knowledge to someone who would benefit greatly while
all the time being treated so poorly with such disdain and childish name
calling.
BrianW, JoeT, AndyD, Matt Co-Owner,...hell, All of ya.
>"Brian W Edginton" <ed...@dingoblue.net.au> wrote in message
>news:9p5het4pmqeqshaqv...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 26 Apr 2001 17:26:05 -0500, "Togrul" <tog...@fuse.net> wrote:
>> Good advice......why don't you make use of it yourself and stop using
>> a single paragraph in an encyclopedia for your source on steels?
>>
snip out
pa...@pbknife.com
Gene <ghu...@fone.net> wrote in message
news:9cift...@enews4.newsguy.com...
:
: Togrul wrote in message ...
: >Bite me, little boy
:
: I have been following rec.knives for only a few months. I came here
for the
: sole reason of learning something. I have learned a lot and will
continue to
: do so because that is why I am here. I am eager to learn from the
abundant
: and varied experts at this site.
: Reading the immature tritness of (Mr/Miss/Ms) Togrul is a sad time
for this
: group. Even though just as I was about to say that I had learned
nothing new
: by wading through his proudly misinformed diatribe *Eureka* Some one
sent a
: jewel.
: http://octopus.freeyellow.com/metlinks.html
: I have bookmarked it.
Yes it is an excellent site. I have literally hundreds of books
dealing with metals, not to mention the hundreds on other stuff, that
I have accumulated over the previous 25 - 30 years. I have found that
except for a few bits and pieces most of this info can be found either
in these links or in links from there. The sad part is the things I
don't remember, that I know are in the books, takes a lot longer to
dig out of the books than to go to these links.
Something about books though, maybe I'm a dinosaur, but I just can't
get rid of them, even though every time I've moved them, I swore I'd
throw them out next time. :-)
--
Paul-R
www.pbknife.com
mailto:pa...@pbknife.com
Knifemakers are a sharper class of people.
---