Brolly notation

[Aidan]

I've written another article for the IJA ezine about Brolly notation. This is
a way of using siteswap to work out tricks in one count. Even if you know
about Brolly notation you might something new.
http://ezine.juggle.org/2012/11/01/brolly-notationtricks-in-one-count/
Aidan.

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[Varkor]

That's a very interesting idea. Thank you for explaining it, and so well at that!

[Adrian G]

Aidan wrote:
> I've written another article for the IJA ezine about Brolly notation. This is
> a way of using siteswap to work out tricks in one count. Even if you know
> about Brolly notation you might something new.
> http://ezine.juggle.org/2012/11/01/brolly-notationtricks-in-one-count/
> Aidan.
>

Awesome to see a proper writeup on that, I've tried a few things like this and
it's such an awesome way to work out cool tricks! And now I have some more to
work on... :)

A couple of cool things I've found:
- Instead of selves for 3s (and 4s with seven), use zaps, it really it much
more interesting.
- Synch patterns with seven 1 count are quite hard and a bit weird but they do
sort of work. I nearly managed to get (6x,4)* working with a friend. The other
person also transitions to synch.

Adrian

[Aidan]

Thanks for the feedback! I did think about zaps instead of self throws with
six clubs and zaps instead of heffs in seven clubs, but decided not to include
them in order not to confuse things. The problem is the receiver doesn't hold
through the gap if you throw zaps, but also they don't have enough time to
react to them, so you have to pre-warn them. An interesting idea with six
clubs is both people doing double zap pass continuously. It might be a bit
collision prone, but you can also do an asymmetric version!

The idea of synch patterns with seven is a nice one that I hadn't thought of.
You could use singles v doubles as your base pattern. Then all the tricks
would be thrown by the person doing singles, or the one throwing doubles would
throw quads for 6s and so on.

Another interesting trick I worked out while thinking about this idea is based
on both people doing the (6x,2x)(2x,6x) trick described in the article. Only
if both people do it continuously it's a seven club trick, a bit like a synch
version of oddz godz, and one person throws straight passes.
Aidan.

[Aidan]

Ok what I wrote about synch siteswaps with seven clubs doesn't make sense. It
was a rushed response to Adrian's idea. Having thought about it a bit more,
one way to do it would be to work out the transition from the five club
fountain to your synch siteswap, and then translate this into tricks via
Brolly notation. You'd also need the transition back to the cascade. I think
if you did this your partner would just react as normal. Whether their pattern
would be synch or not, I don't know. It's an interesting idea to explore
either way.

[Adrian G]

I really like the idea of both people doing double-zap, I'll need to try that
out!

When I was trying five club synch siteswaps, we were just throwing like 6x56x
to transition to (6x,4)* (we also worked out how to go directly into it), we
didn't get it working enough to bother learning the transition back out
though.

The other person does end up doing synch (at least how we did it). I
personally find it quite hard to visualise what it *should* be, this is
because as the other person is throwing single passes back, they must be
catching my '6x' and '4' two beats before they return, and seeing as a 4x, and
a 2 thrown on the next beat will 'peak' at the same time, the other person
should catch them at the same time. Hopefully that sort of made sense, I would
put it into JoePass! but I'm really bad at setting patterns up in it.

Another thing is working out the siteswap (either 4 handed or prechac) of the
whole pattern, given the 'siteswap' that one person does. I'm sure there's a
nice way, but I don't know of it.

Adrian

[Aidan]

>
> I really like the idea of both people doing double-zap, I'll need to try that
> out!
>
> When I was trying five club synch siteswaps, we were just throwing like 6x56x
> to transition to (6x,4)* (we also worked out how to go directly into it), we
> didn't get it working enough to bother learning the transition back out
> though.
>
> The other person does end up doing synch (at least how we did it). I
> personally find it quite hard to visualise what it *should* be, this is
> because as the other person is throwing single passes back, they must be
> catching my '6x' and '4' two beats before they return, and seeing as a 4x, and
> a 2 thrown on the next beat will 'peak' at the same time, the other person
> should catch them at the same time. Hopefully that sort of made sense, I would
> put it into JoePass! but I'm really bad at setting patterns up in it.
>
> Another thing is working out the siteswap (either 4 handed or prechac) of the
> whole pattern, given the 'siteswap' that one person does. I'm sure there's a
> nice way, but I don't know of it.
>

There's an explanation of working out these transitions on my webpage.
Download the pdf on this page:
http://www.geocities.ws/aidanjburns/contents.html
Aidan.

[Adrian G]

Aidan wrote:
>
> > Another thing is working out the siteswap (either 4 handed or prechac) of the
> > whole pattern, given the 'siteswap' that one person does. I'm sure there's a
> > nice way, but I don't know of it.
> >
> There's an explanation of working out these transitions on my webpage.
> Download the pdf on this page:
> http://www.geocities.ws/aidanjburns/contents.html
> Aidan.
>
>

I couldn't find anything about that on your website, I don't think I explained
what I wanted properly, I meant that given a siteswap that you want to throw
in 6 club 1 count (e.g. 552), what is the siteswap for the whole pattern. In
this case it would be something like <3p 3p 4p 4p 2|3p 3p 3p 2 3p> and 53
would be <3p 3p 4p 3|3p 3p 3p 2>. I worked these out by fiddling around a lot
but I feel like there must be a nice way to do it.

[Aidan]

It's another case of me replying too quickly, before I'd read your post
properly. I'd assumed you would ask how to work out asynch to synch
transitions. Once again the question you did ask didn't occur to me!
I think we're also talking across each other about the (6x,4)(4,6x) pattern.
You're assuming the 4s are zaps, which results in your partner getting a synch
one count pattern, whereas I'm assuming the 4s are heffs, then your partner's
pattern won't be synch.
I'm struggling to work out how to transition into the synch pattern at the
moment. It's not as straight forward as I thought!
Aidan.

[Aidan]

Aidan wrote:
> After playing about in JoePass for a while, I worked out transitions to and
> from (6x,4)(4,6x) which work for my understanding of the pattern and Adrian's:
> 554x5(6x,4)(4,6x)(6x,5)55
> Aidan.
>

I forgot to add that in both cases the 4x is a crossing self double!

[Aidan]

You're right, it's not a valid siteswap! I created the causal diagram in
JoePass and just assumed that the throws could be interpreted as a solo
siteswap by reversing the Brolly notation idea.
The causal diagrams work - JoePass animates them. From seven club one count
you throw a crossing double self followed by a pass, then you throw double
pass heff at the same time (or double pass zap) continuously. When you've had
enough you throw double pass single pass at the same time.

[Aidan]

After playing about in JoePass for a while, I worked out transitions to and
from (6x,4)(4,6x) which work for my understanding of the pattern and Adrian's:
554x5(6x,4)(4,6x)(6x,5)55

[Adrian G]

Aidan wrote:
> It's another case of me replying too quickly, before I'd read your post
> properly. I'd assumed you would ask how to work out asynch to synch
> transitions. Once again the question you did ask didn't occur to me!

Haha, ok. Well I think I've found half of the method, the person doing the
'siteswap' just subtracts one and adds a 'p' for all of their passes, selves
stay the same. So 642 becomes <5p 3p 2|3p 2 3p>. 7531 would be <6p 4p 3 1|3p 2
2 3p>, however if you wanted the 3 as a pass it would become <6p 4p 2p 1|3p 2
3p 3p>. I still haven't worked out a nice way of working out the other persons
pattern yet...

> I think we're also talking across each other about the (6x,4)(4,6x) pattern.
> You're assuming the 4s are zaps, which results in your partner getting a synch
> one count pattern, whereas I'm assuming the 4s are heffs, then your partner's
> pattern won't be synch.

Yeah, good point. I felt that the pattern would be much nicer with the 4s as
passes so that's how we decided to do it. I think we tried it with both
doubles/zaps and triples/singles though, I've forgotten which was nicer...

I think if the 4s were selves they might end up being singles not double
though, seeing as the 6xs are doubles normally.

> After playing about in JoePass for a while, I worked out transitions to and
> from (6x,4)(4,6x) which work for my understanding of the pattern and Adrian's:
> 554x5(6x,4)(4,6x)(6x,5)55

What's '554x5(6x,4)(4,6x)(6x,5)55'? it's not a valid solo siteswap... is it
like half the passing siteswap?

Adrian

[Adrian G]

OK, that seems to work in JoePass, though it's slightly odd, the most common
entry/exit for (6x,4)* is normally 55_6x56x1x_(6x,4)*_(7,5x)(4,6x)_55
(underscores separate transitions), so I would have assumed that would be one
to do for passing as well...

Anyway, I'll try to have another go over the next week and see how it turns
out.

Adrian