Plea for heraldic advice

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi all,

I've been working on the genealogy of my patrilineal line, which is from Sweden. I came across a man named Johan Docken, who may or may not be my 6xgreat grandfather. I've always assumed that all of my ancestors were farmers and peasants, but I stumbled upon a website that may suggest that Johan was major and married a woman named Charlotta von Becker (who looks to have been the daughter of a baron/major general): http://www.brittstromback.se/Html/0001/704.htm

I know nothing of the Swedish language, Swedish genealogy or Swedish heraldic traditions. I may be misunderstanding the text of the website, or the website may be full of faulty information, and perhaps I'm not even related to Johan Docken. But the thought that perhaps one of my patrilineal ancestors used burgher arms has surprised me.

The odds are against it, but if he was armigerous, I wonder what I should do. Use the ancestral arms? Use the arms I've been using for almost 20 years? Combine the two designs? What would you do if you adopted/were granted/matriculated arms, but then found out that your ancestor was armigerous. Any and all comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated!!!

Cheers,

-Sebastian Nelson

[Turenne]

The first thing I would do is explore Marianne Douglas' line. She may be related to Robert Douglas, Count of Skenninge a Field Marshal in the Swedish army during the 30 Years War. One descendant is Count Archibald Douglas, who married Archduchess Walburga of Austria.

I note also that one of the Docker ancestors is Hildegard Elisabet von Yxkull. The von Yxkhulls are another very old aristocratic Swedish family.

In answer to your previous question; I would be strongly tempted to incorporate your newly found arms in some way with your existing arms. That said; your arms were properly matriculated (unlike some others!), and it would be a shame to mess the design about...

Here are the von Becker arms:

http://www.riddarhuset.fi/sve/atterochvapen/

The family seem to have emigrated from Livonia and become naturalised Swedes.

Richard L

[Turenne]

I also note that the ancient family of Munck af Fulkila is mentioned as a Docker ancestor.

The whole thing is fascinating, and well worth further research..

RL

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Thanks for your messages Richard. After my initial post I discovered that the website I was looking at took the family line down another generation closer to myself...to a man named Hans Petter Docken: http://www.brittstromback.se/Html100409/index.htm?/Html100409/000/0003/785.htm

The details seem to confirm what I have in my family papers...not enough to be sure, but enough for me to think about hiring a professional genealogist to sort this out. It looks like Hans Petter Docken's mother may have also come from a patrician family.

Cheers,

Sebastian

[Turenne]

It occurs to me that if you were to add the various quarterings of your armigerous forebears to your arms, your 'fret counterchanged' will become a bit of a blur...

Richard

[gregs talkin]

Hi Sebastion,

The first and most obvious question is; what evidence, besides a name,
qualifies this man as a grandfather? Is he from a known familial
town? Is there perhaps a family tradition that links this man?
Lastly, if you do have some supporting evidence, it is indeed possible
that he moved up in life in some way, or he could be a great great
uncle. . . You might want to plunk his name into the IGI and see what
happens https://familysearch.org/search/collection/igi

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi Greg,

Good question! I've been able to document (with birth, marriage and death records) my descent from my paternal great-grandfather Sante August Nelson. He was born in Sweden in 1883 and died in California in 1959. His sister Alma Karolina Nilsson, on the other hand, was born and died in Sweden. I obtained some handwritten genealogical notes from a cousin in the 1990s about Sante and Alma's parents and other ancestors. Here are links to two of those notes:

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557746370

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557817715

Unfortunately I never got around to confirming or disproving these details with firm research. But if I am reading the documents correctly, some of the names and dates seem to match up with the information on that website:

http://www.brittstromback.se/Html100409/index.htm?/Html100409/000/0003/785.htm

The part about Elna Svensdotter appears a near match, and the part about being buried in Förslöv church also seems to be a match. Of course, none of this proves anything. I hope I am not misreading the similarities and connections. Maybe someone out in rec.heraldry-land who isn't wearing my rose-tinted glasses can give it a second look.

-Seb

[gregs talkin]

On Apr 21, 2:45 pm, sebnel...@gmail.com wrote:
> Hi Greg,
>
> Good question!  I've been able to document (with birth, marriage and death records) my descent from my paternal great-grandfather Sante August Nelson.  He was born in Sweden in 1883 and died in California in 1959.  His sister Alma Karolina Nilsson, on the other hand, was born and died in Sweden.  I obtained some handwritten genealogical notes from a cousin in the 1990s about Sante and Alma's parents and other ancestors.  Here are links to two of those notes:
>
> http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557746370
>
> http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557817715
>
> Unfortunately I never got around to confirming or disproving these details with firm research.  But if I am reading the documents correctly, some of the names and dates seem to match up with the information on that website:
>

> http://www.brittstromback.se/Html100409/index.htm?/Html100409/000/000...

>
> The part about Elna Svensdotter appears a near match, and the part about being buried in Förslöv church also seems to be a match.  Of course, none of this proves anything.  I hope I am not misreading the similarities and connections.  Maybe someone out in rec.heraldry-land who isn't wearing my rose-tinted glasses can give it a second look.
>
> -Seb

Real quick: did some of your family settle in Utah?

[gregs talkin]

On Apr 21, 2:45 pm, sebnel...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi Greg,
>
> Good question!  I've been able to document (with birth, marriage and death records) my descent from my paternal great-grandfather Sante August Nelson.  He was born in Sweden in 1883 and died in California in 1959.  His sister Alma Karolina Nilsson, on the other hand, was born and died in Sweden.  I obtained some handwritten genealogical notes from a cousin in the 1990s about Sante and Alma's parents and other ancestors.  Here are links to two of those notes:
>
> http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557746370
>
> http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557817715
>
> Unfortunately I never got around to confirming or disproving these details with firm research.  But if I am reading the documents correctly, some of the names and dates seem to match up with the information on that website:
>

> http://www.brittstromback.se/Html100409/index.htm?/Html100409/000/000...

>
> The part about Elna Svensdotter appears a near match, and the part about being buried in Förslöv church also seems to be a match.  Of course, none of this proves anything.  I hope I am not misreading the similarities and connections.  Maybe someone out in rec.heraldry-land who isn't wearing my rose-tinted glasses can give it a second look.
>
> -Seb

No, I don't think that you're misreading anything: genealogy gets
"that way" sometimes. The IGI however shows "Docken" as coming from
Germany and up through the 17th century there was a lot of emigration
into Sweden, apparently a lot of soldiers came in, miners, specialists
etc. So that fits with your military feature. And, ya'know just
glancing over your notes again, I think that Alma Karolina Nilsson is
the key you're looking for: it was not unusal at all for a man to
adopt his wife's name, for any number of reasons; usually to avoid
confusion, or because of family estrangement (spelling variations
persit due to family feuds). That reference to Alma may be
overstating the obvious, but you hadn't touched on it. The Dockens
were also a noble German family, and the Docken in your notes was a
major it says, so you may be onto something. I'm assuming of course
that you have a direct line to miss Alma?

You've kind of hit the nail on the head for me though. Your heraldic
conundrum is exactly why I haven't gone for an offical grant myself: I
want all my 'i's crossed and my 't's dotted before I do that, because
I don't want to miss any references.

You may want to go the DNA route at some time too. There is a name
project for Nelson at Family Tree DNA, but none thus far for Docken;
which doesn't mean of course that the are not Dockens who have
submitted results.

Go here: http://www.familytreedna.com/projects.aspx go to N projects;
click and go the listed site. clik on Y - Results and take a look at
the names: ya'never know . . .

[rha_s...@yahoo.com]

On Monday, April 22, 2013 12:49:50 AM UTC+1, gregs talkin wrote:
>//snip// I want all my 'i's crossed and my 't's dotted before I do that, because >I don't want to miss any references.

Greg, If you think that "I"s are crossed and "T"s are dotted, you may well be missing quite a few references!

Regards,
Edward

[Chris Pitt Lewis]

In message <b2d68860-2183-40e7...@googlegroups.com>,
sebn...@gmail.com writes

Seb

I don't really know about Swedish genealogy, only British. In
particular, I don't know how likely it is for a surname like Docken to
be lost in favour of a patronymic in the 19th century, or whether the
apparent move down the social scale makes sense in a Swedish context.
But I can perhaps give you some suggestions for further research.

Sante and his siblings, and his father Nils are within living memory so
that bit of the family tree from your cousin, at least, ought to be
accurate. The Olof Docken and Elna Svensdotter on your tree and the
website certainly look as if they are the same persons. That does not of
course prove that either your tree or the website are accurate.

Images of most or all Swedish church books (parish registers) are online
here: http://www.arkivdigital.net/ The site seems to be in English as
well as Swedish, but the images are behind a paywall. Of course the
images themselves will be in Swedish, but register entries tend to
follow a set formula and it is not usually too difficult to follow
foreign language registers with only a limited knowledge of the language
- the real difficulty may be unfamiliar handwriting. That is my
experience with German registers, anyway. But you would probably find it
worth a look. I would guess that some of the source notes on Britt
Strömbäck's website refer to registers on that site.

I would think it would also be worth emailing her to discuss your
apparent relatedness, and hope that, like many Swedes, she speaks some
English (or that someone in her family does). If I have navigated her
site correctly, she traces her descent from an elder son of Bengt Henric
Docken.

http://www.slaktdata.org/ seems to have transcriptions of many
registers, but apparently not Förslöv (see tab "Registerlista"). The tab
marked "Lexikon" however links to some useful-looking Swedish-English
glossaries.

--
Chris Pitt Lewis

[gregs talkin]

Very good Stew,

You have between the reading lines!

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi again,

Thank you all for all of your comments, questions and suggestions. I've contacted the owner of the website, Britt Strömbäck. I showed her those handwritten genealogical notes I posted here earlier. She did some research and seems pretty sure that we are indeed cousins. She kindly sent me some images of documents that relate to these individuals...here are a few examples:

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48817856656

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48817897203

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48817943657

I asked if she knew if they used burgher arms, but she doesn't know.

I asked about the dropping of the surname Docken in favor of patronymic surnames. She suggested that in Sweden individuals sometimes took surnames based on and in response to military service. Perhaps the Docken “fell off” because their descendants did not have military careers, but rather worked in different occupations.

Here is a link with an article about this: http://heirsofsweden.blogspot.com/2012/02/swedish-surnames-and-family-names.html

“...some people also got special [sur]names if they were soldiers. These soldier [sur]names was most of the times only used by the soldier himself and not passed on to his children, but sometimes they became family names also. Most of these military [sur]names were either directly connected to the place the soldier served under or some classical ones like for example; Trygg (confident, safe), Hård (hard), Stark (strong), Grym (cruel), Dunder (thunder), Stolt (proud)...”

I asked if Karsten Docken was Swedish, or maybe German. She said that she hasn't been able to find out about his parents, but that his wife had some German ancestry.

According to Britt, one of these men that I might be descended from, Bengt Henric Docken, “...antogs vid Skånes Husarregemente 17570910 Pålstorp 4 i Raus därefter flyttade familjen till Ekholm 1-3 Örkelljunga och 1760 1129 flyttade de till Killebäckstorp. 1757-1762 deltog han i Pommerska kriget. Det var ett krig mot Preussen som varade mellan 1756-17630215. Svensk regent vid den tiden var Adolf Fredrik och i Preussen regerade Fredrik ll. Han var med i slaget vid Tarnow 26/9 1758 som vanns av Preussen , slaget vid Fehrbellin 28/9 1758, sjöslaget vid Frisches Haff 10/9 1759 och fältslaget vid Neu Kahlen 2/1 1762 och de tre sista krigen vann Sverige. Freden slöts i Hamburg 22/5 1762...”

I think that means he fought for Sweden during the Pomeranian War. After consulting with wikipedia, it turns out that the Pomeranian War was not a dog fight: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pomeranian_War

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Smiling_Tan_Pomeranian.jpg

Cheers,

Sebastian

[re]

how about asking
http://www.heraldik.se/heraldica/default.asp
they speak English

[elias.g...@gmail.com]

“...antogs vid Skånes Husarregemente 17570910 Pålstorp 4 i Raus därefter flyttade familjen till Ekholm 1-3 Örkelljunga och 1760 1129 flyttade de till Killebäckstorp. 1757-1762 deltog han i Pommerska kriget. Det var ett krig mot Preussen som varade mellan 1756-17630215. Svensk regent vid den tiden var Adolf Fredrik och i Preussen regerade Fredrik ll. Han var med i slaget vid Tarnow 26/9 1758 som vanns av Preussen , slaget vid Fehrbellin 28/9 1758, sjöslaget vid Frisches Haff 10/9 1759 och fältslaget vid Neu Kahlen 2/1 1762 och de tre sista krigen vann Sverige. Freden slöts i Hamburg 22/5 1762...”

Translated from Swedish to English:

"...was taken up at the Hassar Regiment of Scania on 10th Sept. 1757, [Pålstorp etc. is an address] then the family moved to [another place name] and on 29th Nov. 1760 they moved to Killebäckstorp. 1757-1762 he took part in the Pomeranian War. This was a war against Prussia which lasted between 1756 and the 15th Feb. 1763. Swedish head of state by this time was [King] Adolf Fredrik and in Prussia Fredrik II ruled. He fought in the Battle at Tarnow on 26th September 1758 which was won by Prussia, the battle at Fehrbellin on 28th Sept. 1758, the sea battle at Frisches Haff on 10th Sept. 1759 and the field battle at Neu Kahlen on 2nd of January 1762 and the last three battles were won by Sweden. The peace treaty was signed in Hamburg on 22nd of May 1762..."


Best Regards,
Elias Granqvist

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Egads I think I found something! I saw another Swedish genealogist's website that has information about some individuals: http://dock.nu/docktree/Dock%20tree/p7260742b.html

It seems to match up with the genealogical notes I obtained from my cousin: http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557746370

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/image/48557817715

This Swedish genealogist's website also has what appears to be a pdf of a family history paper about the Dock/Docken family that shows heraldic seals: dock.nu/docktree/Dock papper.pdf#page=16

I wonder if I'm looking at my paternal ancestors' arms?! It feels so weird...

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Here is that link again: http://dock.nu/docktree/Dock%20papper.pdf#page=16

[sebn...@gmail.com]

On Thursday, May 23, 2013 7:43:11 AM UTC-7, sebn...@gmail.com wrote:
> Here is that link again: http://dock.nu/docktree/Dock%20papper.pdf#page=16

Unfortunately this pdf doesn't offer a citation for these two black and white line drawings of the heraldic seals. But I think these individuals lived in Malmö, and I think there was a book published in the 1930s about seals from Malmö: http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/186903700

I can't seem to find a copy of this book in the USA...perhaps someone on the forum owns or has access to a copy? If so, would you be willing to see if these two seals were taken from this book?

Many thanks!

-Sebastian Nelson

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi all,

I want to thank everyone for their comments and kind assistance over the past few weeks. Yesterday I received some great pictures from the staff at the Malmö City Archives of Carsten Docke's seal. According to the archivist, “they were used in the context of proceedings at the city court...it is in the documents of Rådhusrätten i Malmö 1, volume F1AA:24, proceedings dated 13 December 1697.”

Here is one of the images:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/663d83cf4da5eeb413e3ffd2d36e64af/tumblr_mog3t09goe1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Here is another image with the contrast enhanced to bring out some of the details:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/f371e3b653b3e483dc46eed367180800/tumblr_mog3h0S33a1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

The photograph is shown next to a black and white line drawing of the same seal as published by Einar Bager in 1939 in a book called “Kronomagasinet.”

Unfortunately I think the next step is just to wait (im)patiently for the copy of my paternal great-grandfather's Alien Registration File that I ordered to arrive from the US Citizen and Immigration Service. Hopefully it will contain more information to take the next step in either proving or disproving my descent from Carsten.

-Sebastian Nelson

[Tim Powys-Lybbe]

On 15 Jun at 18:55, sebn...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I want to thank everyone for their comments and kind assistance over
> the past few weeks. Yesterday I received some great pictures from the
> staff at the Malmö City Archives of Carsten Docke's seal. According
> to the archivist, “they were used in the context of proceedings at the
> city court...it is in the documents of Rådhusrätten i Malmö 1, volume
> F1AA:24, proceedings dated 13 December 1697.”
>
> Here is one of the images:
>
>
http://25.media.tumblr.com/663d83cf4da5eeb413e3ffd2d36e64af/tumblr_mog3t09goe1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg
>
> Here is another image with the contrast enhanced to bring out some of
> the details:
>
>
http://25.media.tumblr.com/f371e3b653b3e483dc46eed367180800/tumblr_mog3h0S33a1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

You have done a service to the patient followers of heraldry in proving
that a silk purse can be made out of a sow's ear. Congratulations on
getting that amount of detail out of an apparently black blob on a sheet
of paper. Just as an exercise I grabbed one or two of the image
enhancing programs and gave them a whirl to see if I could equal your
prowess. An almost total failure! Would you care to say how you
managed to use 'contrast enhanced' to obtain that not unpleasing image?
And which program did you use?

--
Tim Powys-Lybbe t...@powys.org
for a miscellany of bygones: http://powys.org/

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hello Tim,

When I first saw the images I too could only see black blobs. To my father must go the credit of enhancing the image (I am rather useless with computers). He tells me that he used a program called PhotoStudio, used a feature called auto-enhance and played around with something called hue and contrast.

Here is the original image that I believe he started from:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/9f62f14d192b07e4bec64877379418a2/tumblr_mohvh2lSfY1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Cheers,

Seb

[Tim Powys-Lybbe]

Yes that program is excellent and, apparently, it is free. I was able
to achieve about 75 % of your father's result within about five minutes.
The best graphic enhancer that I have found!

I give it some more time tomorrow.

Many thanks, and to your father.

[Derek Howard]

The whole of this adventure of yours is fascinating. I do hope that when you finally manage to pull it all together and translate thee sources you can write it up in full. I would especially love to know the military histories of your forebears in greater detail. In the meantime you should definitely be displaying if not bearing the ancient arms.

Derek Howard

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Here are some more pictures from the kind staff at the Malmö City Archives. These show the seal of Carsten's son Johan, who may or may not be my 6 x great-grandfather in the paternal line. According to the archivist, “yes, Malmö City Archives also keep the document with the seal of Johan Docke. As was the case with the seal of Carsten Docke, it is in the records of the City Court of Malmö or to be exact Rådhusrätten i Malmö 1, volume F1AA:73, proceedings dated 7 April 1725. The seal is slightly damaged as you can see from the photos and are attached to a letter written by Johan Docke.”

http://25.media.tumblr.com/3fa9681c8dfcf9b4ded122254b42527e/tumblr_mop9spYC7l1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

http://25.media.tumblr.com/3415650011020fd3a79b04db932af95e/tumblr_mopa1ucIqa1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

It is too bad about the damage. I wish I knew what the charge in the (now missing) base was. Maybe a crane in its vigilance contourné?

-Sebastian

[cj.t...@gmail.com]

Hello Seb!

Greetings from Sweden. I had some free hours last week, between two meetings, and - being summer and all - decided to run past the War Archive (Swedish: Krigsarkivet) to dig up some information on your (possible) Swedish ancestors.

I think my short stop was pretty successful!

Here is the information I managed to dig up:


1. JOHAN DOCKEN, was a son of the merchant Carsten Docke and Botilda (unknown surname). Born 1693, on the 3rd or 4th of September in Malmö. Fourier (three-bar warrant officer) of "The Smallander Fivemen Infantry Regiment" on the 1st of May 1710. Cornet of "The West Gothia Threemen Cavalry Regiment" on the 13th of October 1711. Ensign of "The Eastern Scanian Infantry Regiment" on the 17th of January 1712. Cornet of "The Life Dragoon Regiment" on the 9th of February 1712. Lieutenant on the 22nd of September 1712 of "The West Gothia Threemen Cavalry Regiment". Confirmed as a Lieutenant on the waiting list of "The West Gothia Threemen Cavalry Regiment" on the 13th of July 1716. Discharged as a Captain of Cavalry on the 30th of May 1720. On expectancy of "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment" on the 10th of August 1723. Cornet on the 7th of July 1729. Lieutenant on the 23rd of September 1734. Was retired with the character of a Major on the 14th of February 1749. Lived 1760 in the wapentake of Torne in Scania. Married to the Baroness Helena von Becker in her second marriage. (She was married the first time in 1718 with Colonel Gustaf Reinhold Skogh.) She was a daughter of Major General Baron Johan Wilhelm von Becker and Baroness Maria Helena Rehbinder. They had in 1752 no less than eight sons, of whom three were Corporals of the Scanian Cavalry Regiments. Among the sons were Lieutenants Carsten and Carl Johan of "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment".

2. CARSTEN DOCKEN, was a son of the Major Johan Docken (on expectancy of "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment") and Helena von Becker. Lived on Hjära in the parish of Högneröd, in the fief of Malmöhus. Married 1755 on the 5th of September with his cousin Anna Catharina Öhreus in her first marriage. (She married the second time with the vicar of the parish of S:t Olof in the Diocese of Lund, Otto Klerck, who was born 1728 on the 28th of February and died 1798 on the 24th of March.) She was born in 1734 on the 4th of September in Simrishamn, daughter of the trader Olof Öhreus and Catharina Docka.

3. CARL JOHAN DOCKEN, was a son of the Major Johan Docken (on expectancy of "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment") and Helena von Becker. A brother was the Lieutenant Carsten Docken, of "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment". Married to Maria Charlotta N (unknown surname).


The signatures of Carsten Docken, from 1762, and of Carl Johan Docken, from 1764, are extant.


THE ROYAL SCANIAN DRAGOON REGIMENT, OR CAVALRY REGIMENT NUMBER 6, was created and recruited in the fief of Kronoberg in 1676. After being called alternatively "Strombergs Regiment" and "Örnestedts Regiment" it was granted the name "The Southern Scanian Cavalry Regiment" in 1695. After 1897 it was garrisoned in Ystad.

[cj.t...@gmail.com]

Den måndagen den 22:e juli 2013 kl. 05:43:02 UTC+2 skrev cj.t...@gmail.com:
> Den torsdagen den 20:e juni 2013 kl. 18:54:01 UTC+2 skrev sebn...@gmail.com:
>
> > Here are some more pictures from the kind staff at the Malmö City Archives. These show the seal of Carsten's son Johan, who may or may not be my 6 x great-grandfather in the paternal line. According to the archivist, “yes, Malmö City Archives also keep the document with the seal of Johan Docke. As was the case with the seal of Carsten Docke, it is in the records of the City Court of Malmö or to be exact Rådhusrätten i Malmö 1, volume F1AA:73, proceedings dated 7 April 1725. The seal is slightly damaged as you can see from the photos and are attached to a letter written by Johan Docke.”
>
> >
>
> > http://25.media.tumblr.com/3fa9681c8dfcf9b4ded122254b42527e/tumblr_mop9spYC7l1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > http://25.media.tumblr.com/3415650011020fd3a79b04db932af95e/tumblr_mopa1ucIqa1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > It is too bad about the damage. I wish I knew what the charge in the (now missing) base was. Maybe a crane in its vigilance contourné?
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > -Sebastian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hello Seb!
>
>
>
> Greetings from Sweden. I had some free hours last week, between two meetings, and - being summer and all - decided to run past the War Archive (Swedish: Krigsarkivet) to dig up some information on your (possible) Swedish ancestors.
>
>
>
> I think my short stop was pretty successful!

4. ERASMUS DOCKA, born ca 1692 in Sweden. Entered service in 1712. Feldwebel (NCO rank) of "The Upland Fivemen Infantry Regiment". Ensign of "The Infantry Regiment of the City of Malmö" on the 22nd of September 1715. Cornet of "The Scanian Estate Dragoon Regiment" on the 18th of August 1716. Cornet of "The West Gothia Threemen Cavalry Regiment" on the 26th of June 1718. Discharge on the 30th of September 1719. On expectancy of "The East Gothia Cavalry Regiment" in 1723.


Note: The surnames DOCKA and DOCKEN were most likely of the same family.

[cj.t...@gmail.com]

Den söndagen den 21:e april 2013 kl. 04:00:54 UTC+2 skrev sebn...@gmail.com:
> Hi all,
>
>
>
> I've been working on the genealogy of my patrilineal line, which is from Sweden. I came across a man named Johan Docken, who may or may not be my 6xgreat grandfather. I've always assumed that all of my ancestors were farmers and peasants, but I stumbled upon a website that may suggest that Johan was major and married a woman named Charlotta von Becker (who looks to have been the daughter of a baron/major general): http://www.brittstromback.se/Html/0001/704.htm
>
>
>
> I know nothing of the Swedish language, Swedish genealogy or Swedish heraldic traditions. I may be misunderstanding the text of the website, or the website may be full of faulty information, and perhaps I'm not even related to Johan Docken. But the thought that perhaps one of my patrilineal ancestors used burgher arms has surprised me.
>
>
>
> The odds are against it, but if he was armigerous, I wonder what I should do. Use the ancestral arms? Use the arms I've been using for almost 20 years? Combine the two designs? What would you do if you adopted/were granted/matriculated arms, but then found out that your ancestor was armigerous. Any and all comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated!!!
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
>
> -Sebastian Nelson

Hello again!

The family of Docken seems to be of southern Swedish descent, originally perhaps from Denmark, Germany or the Netherlands. (The Christian names used by the family suggest a Danish origin.) The family seems to be of a merchant background, later turned into a family of mostly Cavalry officers.

I suggest you do the following:

1. You should first check the patrilineal descent. Why not take a Y-DNA swab with the help of FTDNA, and use it to compare with some collateral lines of the same family? Then you would know for sure.

2. If you and your kin belong to the merchant family of Docken, you should of course - under Swedish heraldic customs and tradition - take the original coat of arms of your most ancient Docken ancestor. It could be so that he had a self-assumed burgher coat of arms, or that he was of ancient knightly descent. (Most likely he was a burgher.) But seniority prevails (or shold prevail).

All male lines of the same family inherit the same coat of arms, under the Swedish and German heraldic traditions. Possibly you could change the crest, to differentiate your family from the other Dockens or Dockas.

[cj.t...@gmail.com]

I don't really know about Swedish genealogy, only British. In
particular, I don't know how likely it is for a surname like Docken to
be lost in favour of a patronymic in the 19th century, or whether the
apparent move down the social scale makes sense in a Swedish context.
But I can perhaps give you some suggestions for further research.
>

> --
>
> Chris Pitt Lewis




This makes indeed great sense, from a Swedish point of view. The traditional custom of the entire society was - in ancient Viking style - to take the firstname of the father, and to add "son", as a surname. Thus "Eric, son of Knut", would be "Eric Knutsson."

And yes, you might have 10 or 20 persons in the same parish with the same name, but they would be differentiated by the name of their farm, or their occupation, such as "Eric Knutsson, of Westby" (if he was an Udaller, roughly equivalent to a freeholder), but "Eric Knutsson, from Westby" (if he was a tenant farmer). Or "Eric Knutsson, the Blacksmith", and so on.

Family names came in from the continent by mostly German, Dutch, French and Scottish immigrants. Also the nobility began to use family names in the early 17th century (which was very late, from a continental point of view).

In some cases physical attributes would be used as family names, and mostly in cities. If for instance "Lisa, the tavern-keeper", was bald, and had a son by an unknown man, her son might be called by several different names in his own lifetime, such as "John Lisasson", or "John, of Bald-Lisa", or maybe just "John Bald". And then John Bald would be the ancestor of a family named "Bald", and the name might one day be misspelled into "Bold", to make it less stigmatic.

In regard to names being lost, suppose for instance the following ficticious case of "the noble house of Goldenmace":

1. John, is the son of the tenant farmer "Jacob from Newthorpe". John escapes from home and joins the Army. He is known as "John Jacobsson", or by his soldiers name "John the Lusty". He raises himself through the ranks, and ends his career as a Lieutenant Colonel. After a certain glorious battle, he is also ennobled as "Goldenmace", and given a coat of arms by the king, and a seat in the House of Knights. He will die as "John Jacobsson Goldenmace", the first of his noble line.

2. His son Peter Goldenmace, will end his days as a Captain, after a long and distinguished career.

3. The son of Peter Goldenmace, John Goldenmace, will not rise in the ranks beyond that of a Dragoon, because he had some medical problems.

4. The son of John Goldenmace, the Dragoon, is Nicholas Goldenmace. He will not inherit much, and becomes very poor. He will work as a shoemaker, and would be known in his parish as "Nick, the Shoemaker", although he was born and registered in the parish records as "Nicholas Goldenmace, son of the Dragoon John Goldenmace".

5. The son of "Nick the Shoemaker", Andrew, will be born as "Andrew Nicholasson". He will end his life as a farmhand. He does not know anything about his noble ancestors, and think he is of a humble origin.

6. Any later descendants of "Andrew Nicholasson", will not know anything about their background, until some future member of their family conducts a proper investigation.

And in the House of Knights, no one has heard or met any of the Goldenmaces for more than a 100 years, and the noble family is supposed to have become extinct.

[for Nicolai]

Maybe this will help you... !!!! ???
"The Swedish Gotha"

http://books.google.de/books?id=sI5AAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA506&dq=Joachim+Krebs+Mecklenburg&hl=en&ei=RTjFS9DPF6XMMfGh0KwO&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=Becker&f=false


and maybe you'll find something in the SAAGA ARCHIVE...
registration and usage is "Free of Charge"

http://www.ra.ee/dgs/explorer.php?tid=332&iid=200000117510&tbn=1&lst=2&hash=2c2b3a1e59edeb1214acaf22e6fccb63

[for Nicolai]

regarding change of Names,
very common in Sweden

"Specht" stayed "Specht"
"Specht" became "Liljenancker" - Adel ätten Liljenancker - New Arms in 1656
"Wolf" became "Wolffensköld" - Henric Wolf nobil. Wolffensköld

and so on..............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi Carl,

Thank you so much for this information! It is very very interesting. I hope that someday I will be able to confirm or deny my descent from this family.

-Seb Nelson

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi all,

In the months since I last posted to this thread I've conducted some further genealogical research to help determine whether or not I descend in the direct male line from Johan Docke and his father Carsten, both of whom apparently used burgher arms. I want to share the preliminary results of this research here. I hope you find all of this as interesting as I did!

My paternal great-grandfather Sante August Nelson immigrated to the US from Sweden, and I've collected copies of his marriage and death certificates here in California, as well as his ship passenger arrival records from the US National Archives and his alien registration file from the US Citizenship and Immigration Service. From these records I've been able to obtain his birth date, birth location, his parents' names, the date his left Sweden and the city he left from. I thought it would be a good idea to hire a genealogist since I cannot read Swedish, am ignorant of Swedish genealogy, and because I wanted the opinion of a dispassionate party, so I presented all of these details to the Swenson Swedish Immigration Research Center. The Swenson Center is located on the campus of Augustana College (a liberal arts college in Rock Island, Illinois that was founded by Swedish immigrants in the nineteenth century) and offers genealogical research services.

The Swenson Center assigned my case to Ingrid Nilsson, a genealogist who specializes in records from the Swedish province of Skåne. I am happy to report that her research indicates that I do indeed descend in the direct male line from Johan and his father Carsten. Below are links to two pdf documents detailing her findings. The first is a pedigree chart showing Sante's ancestors, and the second displays this information in an Ahnentafel-style genealogical numbering system. The third link provides some information about the abbreviations and sources Ingrid used in her research.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/8b7mmasgp62wcqb/Nelson1.pdf

https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1guz5wasdnp4d2/Nelson2.pdf

http://heraldryjunkyard.tumblr.com/post/80378986713/sources-please-observe-that-dates-from-the-birth

Based on her research, I thought it might be helpful to see if genetic testing could help confirm these findings. Luckily I discovered a Swedish toxicologist named Lennart Dock online. His late father Carl-Gösta Dock was a genealogist who researched the Dock family in detail. Carl-Gösta self published a history of the Dock family in 1992 titled "Docka-släkten och dess rötter," or "The Dock Family and it´s roots" which, incidentally, is where I first saw Carsten's and Johan's armorial seals (when I stumbled across an electronic copy online). Based on his and Ingrid's research, Lennart is my sixth cousin once removed. Furthermore, we seem to be agnatic cousins. Lennart descends from Johan's son Olaus, while I apparently descent from Johan's other son Bengt Henric.

Here is a link that shows our relationship:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/42234ed372305d459b058ee26887076e/tumblr_n2uoukwBdP1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Lennart kindly provided me with an Excel Spreadsheet which outlines the connections in greater detail:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/qbdhk2bvt5i3qhu/DockTree.xlsx

He also kindly agreed to take a DNA test with me. We both recently took 37 marker Y chromosome DNA tests administered by Family Tree DNA. The test results indicate that we share 35 out of 37 markers. If I understand the test results correctly, there is a greater than seventy percent chance that my and Lennart's most recent common ancestor in the direct male line lived sometime within the past eight generations (see the screen shots below):

https://24.media.tumblr.com/c1c86d79235e30c9c8466be9cca3dd58/tumblr_n2uogukeA51rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

https://24.media.tumblr.com/acc1dc3a4aace7bacf917ae7bf8f2211/tumblr_n2uoi4dg121rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Interestingly, Lennart's family appears to have retained the Dock surname down through the generations. My branch apparently dropped it in favor of patronymic surnames sometime during the nineteenth century, and then it became fixed and anglicized as Nelson when my great-grandfather immigrated to the US. I wonder if this first change was a product of downward social mobility (according to Ingrid's research my great-great-great-great grandfather Olof Dock was a deaf beggar).

This is a lot of information, but since I am thinking about publicly using ancestral arms it only seems right and proper to share my reasons for doing so. In fact, the primary reason I have for sharing all of this information is to renew my plea for heraldic advice. I can't decide whether to continue using the same arms I've been using for the past twenty years, or to abandon them in favor of the Dock arms, or to perhaps marshal the different designs together into a new coat. I'm not sure if names and arms necessarily go together in Swedish heraldic tradition like it does in Scotland. If a prerequisite of registering Dock arms with one of the Swedish societies would be to first use the name Dock, then I would probably keep my current arms (since I don't think I would ever legally change my Nelson surname).

One complication is that Johan Docke's arms and his father Carsten's arms are only known from surviving seal impressions in the Malmö Stadsarkiv, so there is no information about tinctures. Here are some pictures of Carsten's seal:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/663d83cf4da5eeb413e3ffd2d36e64af/tumblr_mog3t09goe1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

http://25.media.tumblr.com/f371e3b653b3e483dc46eed367180800/tumblr_mog3h0S33a1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Here are some pictures of Johan's seal:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/3fa9681c8dfcf9b4ded122254b42527e/tumblr_mop9spYC7l1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

http://25.media.tumblr.com/3415650011020fd3a79b04db932af95e/tumblr_mopa1ucIqa1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

The designs are hard to see, but luckily black and white drawings of them were published by Einar Bager in 1939 in a book called "Kronomagasinet." To make this more confusing, both father and son used different arms. I have no idea if it was common in eighteenth century Sweden for burgher arms to change so radically in a single generation. And, if the arms aren't being used in an hereditary fashion, does it even fit the definition of heraldry? Sometimes I wonder how your typical eighteenth century Swedish merchant or officer went about obtaining an armorial seal. Perhaps he would commission an engraver for a specific design, or maybe it was as simple as going to a local jeweler and picking out one from a number of ready-made seals, each with its own particular arms already engraved.

I think the next prudent step would be to research whether or not any of Carsten's and Johan's other descendants used burgher arms during the eighteenth century or later. Perhaps one of these two designs was used with greater frequency by more members of the Dock family. Even if I could narrow down the design, however, I'm still stuck with the initial question of what to do. As always, any and all comments are greatly appreciated!

Cheers,

Sebastian

[for Nicolai]

"""both father and son used different arms. I have no idea if it was common in eighteenth century Sweden for burgher arms to change so radically in a single generation."""

Yes, it was very common, and I guess for all those who decided to
have "Personal Arms" the "original" CoA would still apply"

[Tim Powys-Lybbe]

What a glorious story. I must congratulate you and your researcher on
getting this far.

Now for a few thoughts. First you live in California, USA; in this land
of the free you may all freely bear arms without let or law or
hindrance. So you may do what you like and everyone must clap in
celebration of their freedom.

Your next option is to join a club with rules, even if the membership is
a mere one. Your club may start by being totally unique with your rules
precisely and you then hope a few others might wish to collaborate in
some manner. Or you could join an existing club, perhaps one based in
your free land or perhaps one based in Sweden; make sure you are happy
with their rules before going down any such path too far.

This is where I can come in as I have mostly decided to accept the
English rules, save where it is inconvenient or prohibitively expensive.
But some of the English rules are relevant:

1. You may change you arms totally. I have seen this done by personal
choice, by a regrant from the heralds and by the massive expense of a
royal licence.

2. Once you have adopted your new arms, you may quarter all the arms
previously held by your male line ancestors. This is a very well
established custom in England and is particularly exemplified by some
Nevill displays.

3. Having started up a display of arms, usually arranged as quarterings
of some pattern (remember that the Scots do thing rather differently),
you stagger upon the strange practice of recognising heraldic heiresses,
whose father's lines have died out in the male lines and any armigers
with them. So you add the heiresses to your display to ensure such
ancestors and armigers and arms live for evermore.

4. Add in a few exotics such as the occasional inheritance of arms by a
female only line of heiresses (I only found the first one of these a
week ago).

This should give you enough work for at least another couple of years
and then you can come back to us with a display for us all to marvel at.

And it is open to you to claim all arms born by all ancestors, male and
female and have no truck with this heiress business.

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi all,

I've run across a reference to a chalice donated in 1704 by my ancestor Carsten Docke to a church in the Swedish city of Malmö : http://www.sydsvenskan.se/malmo/carolis-ode-vacker-fragor/

Thinking that perhaps this chalice was engraved with a coat of arms, I've done some more research in the hopes that it may help me better understand the burgher arms of the Docke family. Here are some articles written about this chalice, and indeed it bears a coat of arms (although not those of Carsten):

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lc3ax3oope1dmni/chalice.pdf

Apparently the chalice was made at the end of the seventeenth century by a silversmith named Nathanael Schlaubitz in the city of Danzig (Gdańsk) for the famous Ukrainian cossack leader Ivan Mazepa: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivan_Mazepa

Here are images of the chalice and the Mazepa arms on its base:

https://33.media.tumblr.com/844ad75a955101d3f3635d98f77db973/tumblr_nb5co3QEmj1rq2fm7o1_1280.jpg

Neither article seems sure why or how the chalice ended up in Carsten's possession. Some speculate it was war booty, but I've seen some references that suggest Carsten had a brother residing in Danzig. Unfortunately I've never been able to find out where on the continent Carsten and his family originally came from. The second article contains some clues: Carsten had been working as a trader in Hamburg before moving to Malmö (he gained Swedish citizenship on March 21, 1696). Also, the church he donated the chalice to, the Caroli church, was founded in the 1680's or 1690's for Malmö's German-speaking community (http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caroli_kyrka,_Malm%C3%B6). Also known as the German church, services were conducted entirely in German until 1778. By 1831 services were held only in Swedish. The original building was replaced in 1880 by the present church structure, but this church was later closed and the building sold off in the past few years.

The second article also mentions that Carsten also once owned the Swedish manor of Tunbyholms. I think Carsten's son sold off the manor after just a few years, but in 2011 a Swedish television program called Slottsliv aired a program about Tunbyholms and the family that currently lives there:

http://www.tv8play.se/program/slottsliv/253121?autostart=true

Unfortunately I couldn't spot any heraldry visible during the program.

PS a few months back the internet file hosting service Dropbox attempted to fix a problem relating to privacy issues. Their fix broke some of the links I had posted to some of my genealogical charts earlier in this thread. Here are some new links to these documents:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/j3st6skxocz4kau/Nelson1.pdf

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xih7ci2uszbkkn2/DockTree.xlsx?dl=0

-Sebastian

[Peter Kurrild-Klitgaard]

I would seriously consider quartering Dock and Nelson. There are several examples of British families doing that in similar situations.

Congratulations!

Best wishes,

Peter Kurrild-Klitgaard

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi all,

I am considering commissioning some heraldic artwork showing the arms of some of my Swedish ancestors. Before I begin to look for an artist, I thought I would try to firm up some of my genealogical research and also try to correctly identify the arms of these ancestors. It would be very frustrating to learn only after the fact that some of the arms were painted incorrectly, or that I am unrelated to the individuals depicted. This research project has proven to be challenging, in part because I cannot read Swedish and because I have been unable to travel to Sweden. Thankfully, I have managed to locate some helpful items. I thought I would share my preliminary findings here in the hope that some of you find this as interesting as I do, but also as a form of peer-review. I have had the pleasure of meeting some of the most knowledgeable people here, and hopefully some eagle-eyed readers can spot any errors that I may have made.

My initial idea was to commission a chart showing the name of my 5x great-grandfather in the direct paternal line Bengt Henric Docken, and the names of Bengt's parents (Johan Docke and Friherrinna von Becker), and the names of Bengt's grandparents (Carsten Dock, Botilda Rasmusdotter, Major General Friherre Johan Wilhelm von Becker and Friherrinna Maria Helena Rehbinder). Unfortunately I have not been able to find any evidence that Bengt or any of his brothers ever used arms.

For Carsten Dock I plan to base his arms on the drawing of his armorial seal published by Einar Bager in 1939 in a book called "Kronomagasinet": https://www.dropbox.com/s/rg4afn1qcabf5wx/aa.jpg?dl=0

The general accuracy of this drawing can be seen in a number of surviving impressions of Carsten's seal in Swedish archives including the Malmö Stadsarkivet: https://www.dropbox.com/s/xh1bso3camgvjxc/1.jpg?dl=0

For Johan Docke I also plan to base his arms on the drawing of his seal in "Kronomagasinet": https://www.dropbox.com/s/yvpleqyyrmi69r1/bb.jpg?dl=0

For a time I was only able to find a damaged and incomplete surviving impression of Johan's seal: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5b5g7a5baxhdh1m/sss.jpg?dl=0

Now I have finally found another surviving impression of his seal on the ArkivDigital website. This one is damaged too, but the base of the shield remains intact: https://www.dropbox.com/s/vc64ww5kdj9bfot/base.jpg?dl=0

The image isn't very clear, and I have yet to obtain a better photograph. But the two seals taken together do seem to confirm the accuracy of Bager's drawing (although the identity of the charge in the base remains illusive). Since the tinctures of Carsten's and Johan's arms are unknown, I had thought of having these arms illustrated as black and white line drawings. Also, since neither Botilda Rasmusdotter nor her father appear to have used arms, I thought about leaving her space on the chart blank.

Next I thought about Bengt's mother Friherrinna von Becker. According to "Kronomagasinet," Carsten Dock and Major General Johan Wilhelm von Becker appear to have been neighbors in Malmö: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ooo1kbugca21mta/book.jpg?dl=0

Unfortunately, all of the secondary sources I have consulted gave the name of one daughter of Johan Wilhelm von Becker: a woman named Helena von Becker who married a Colonel Gustaf Reinhold Skogh (not an ancestor of mine): http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Von_Becker_nr_642
Without evidence of a von Becker connection, how could I include either the von Becker or Rehbinder arms in my artwork? Thankfully I recently received a very helpful email from a gentleman named Göran Mörner. He is the Riddarhusgenealog at the Riddarhuset in Stockholm. I cannot read the Swedish, but from what I can tell it appears to confirm the Docke-von Becker connection (see Note #1 below).

According to the adelsvapen.com link above, Johan Wilhelm von Becker had his arms displayed in a church in the Swedish town of Hellestads (Död 1733-03-27 och jämte sin fru begraven i Hellestads kyrka i Skåne, där hans vapen uppsattes). I have been able to find photographs online of the interior of this church, including a kind of pulpit that appears to show the von Becker arms:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1hedeslttr0s9m0/H%C3%A4llestads1.jpg?dl=0

Here is a close-up: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nnz3q34mvnz9ktu/Hellestads%20kyrka.jpg?dl=0

Incidentally, there appears to be a portrait of Johan Wilhelm von Becker in the Nationalmuseum in Stockholm: http://collection.nationalmuseum.se/eMuseumPlus?service=ExternalInterface&module=collection&objectId=176988&viewType=detailView

I have ordered a photograph, but it has not yet arrived...but I think it may look something like this: http://sok.riksarkivet.se/sbl/bilder/19110_7_002_00000797_2.jpg

I have also had some luck tracking down some heraldic artifacts relating to Johan Wilhelm von Becker's father: Johan von Becker. Here are his arms in the Riddarhuset in Stockholm: https://www.dropbox.com/s/7j5e2jetx4nhmwx/coatofarms.jpg?dl=0

Here is a photo of Johan von Becker's sköldebrev from the Västergötlands Museum: https://www.dropbox.com/s/cljhpq2z3go308c/skoldebrev%20small.jpg?dl=0

I've also found a photograph of a painting purported to be Johan von Becker: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5io0gyq115kjd4s/church.jpg?dl=0

This painting is one of many in a small twelfth century church called Sankta Marie kapell near the Sweidsh town of Lidköping. I have no idea when the portrait was painted, or if it was painted during his lifetime, but it is a curious thing. The church was heavily renovated by Count Magnus Gabriel de la Gardie (1622-1686) for his wife Princess Maria Eufrosyne of Zweibrücken (1625-1687), sister of King Charles X of Sweden (see Note #2 below).

As for the arms of Rehbinder, I think that blazon has been pretty well sorted in my July 2015 posting here about the Rehbinder arms.

And now I am considering pushing back the generations shown on this imaginary piece of heraldic artwork to show Bengt's son Olof Dock (my 4x great-grandfather in the direct paternal line), Olof's mother Elisabeth Catharina von Clevenow, and Olof's maternal grandparents Ernst Wilhelm von Klevenow and Agneta Catharina von Scheibe. I can find no evidence that Olof used arms, but I think that some of his maternal ancestors did. I can find Ernst and Agneta in my family tree: https://www.dropbox.com/s/j3st6skxocz4kau/Nelson1.pdf
https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1guz5wasdnp4d2/Nelson2.pdf

I can also find Ernst and Agneta in secondary sources like this: http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Scheibe

According to this website, Agneta's line appears to lead back to other armigerous Swedish families including Hammarskjöld and von der Linde. Does anyone here know if either these Scheibe and von Klevenow families were armigerous? The only thing I could find for Klevenow was this entry in Rietstap, but I have no idea if these Klevenow's are related to my Klevenow's: https://archive.org/stream/bub_gb_TU4EAAAAIAAJ#page/n612/mode/1up

Thanks very much!

-Sebastian



Notes

[1] Hej och tack för din förfrågan.

Ätten von Becker har varit föremål för omfattande revidering nyligen. Våra nuvarande stamtavlor anger följande:

Johan Wilhelm von Beckern, friherre von Beckern (son av Johan von Becker, adlad von Becker, Tab. 1). Huvudman för den adliga ätten efter fadern 1675-..-... Född 1655-..-.. i ........................ i Livland. Kom i tjänst vid Österbottens regemente 1673. Förare 1676-08-19. Sergeant 1677-09-01. Fänrik 1677-10-08. Löjtnant 1679-04-11. Bevistade med den s k livländska armén vinterfälttåget i Preussen 1678-1679 samt blev vid något tillfälle under Karl XI:s krig Var åren 1686-1691 anställd vid den svenska kontingenten till tyska rikets krigsmakt mot turkarna. Kaptenlöjtnant 1687-06-28. Avsked 1696-03-10. Överstelöjtnant vid Magnus Vilhelm Nieroths värvade livländska infanteriregemente 1700-12-29. Låg i garnison i Reval 1702 och i Pernau 1703. Deltog under generalmajor V H von Schlippenbachs befäl i höstfälttåget i Estland och norra Livland 1703. Överste för ett värvat och av honom själv uppsatt regemente 1704-03-02. Konfirmationsfullmakt 1704-05-06. Låg i garnison i Pernau 1705-1707-04-.. och därefter i Riga. Bevistade belägringen av Riga 1710 och blev fången med sitt regemente vid kapitulationen 1710-07-04. Återkom ur fångenskapen 1711-05-.. och hade för avsikt att uppsöka kungen i Turkiet men kvarstannade i Stralsund till sommaren 1715. Överste och chef för Västgöta femmänningsinfanteriregemente 1715-03-06, vilket regemente samma sommar ingick i fältmarskalken Nils Gyllenstiernas armé i Skåne. Låg i garnison i Malmö hösten 1715-hösten 1720. Generalmajor av infanteriet med bibehållande av regementet 1717-12-07. Överkommendant i Malmö 1718. Uppförd på Skånska fältstaten som kommenderande general vid Södra armén 1719. Friherre 1720-03-02 (ej introducerad). Chef för det nybildade regementet >>Upplands och Västgöta femmännings tillsammanstötte och nuvarande Stralsundska garnisonsregemente>> 1720-12-21. Tillförordnad kommendant i Stralsund 1720. Avsked 1721-11-14. Död 1733-03-27 på Västra Tvet i Hällestads socken, Malmöhus län (db saknas), och jämte sin fru begravd i Hällestads kyrka, där hans vapen uppsattes.
Han bevistade under kriget mot turkarna stormningen av Ofen 1686-09-02 samt slagen vid Mohacz 1687-08-12 och Szalankemen 1691-08-19 samt deltog därefter i nederländska kriget. Undertecknade 1700-07-09 i Riga livländska ridderskapets förklaring mot Patkull [Lk].
Hans porträtt av D von Krafft fanns 1920 på Drottningholm. Se SBL.
Gift 1698-01-24 i ................... (troligen i Livland kanske i Riga) med friherrinnan Maria Helena (von) Rehbinder i hennes 2:a gifte (gift 1:o 1689-02-28 i Reval (Nikolai förs., 6707) med Bengt (von) Wolffensköld, nr 366 (Tab. 4), född 1664-03-26, död 1697-11-26, ägde Lennewarden, Ringmoise och Askemoise i Lennewardens socken i Livland), född 1666-06-08 i ................., död 1723-01-03 på Västra Tvet i Hällestads socken, Malmöhus län (db saknas). Dotter av översten, friherre Bernhard Rehbinder, nr 77 (Tab. 2), och hans 1:a fru Elisabeth Munck af Fulkila, nr 130.
Döttrar:
Helena, född 1...-..-.. i .................. (sannolikt i Livland), död 17..-..-.. (levde 1752) i ...........................
Gift 1718-..-.. i ......................... med överstelöjtnanten vid Hälsinge regemente, översten Gustaf Reinhold Skogh, nr 704 (Tab. 5), född 1692-..-.. i ......................, död 1739-04-09 i ................................
En son Carl Gustaf född 1723 i december i Fredrikshamn i Finland. En son Claes Johan uppges vara född 1738 i febr i Hamrånge socken men har ej påträffats i fb. Se Biografica.
Charlotta Hilma, född 17..-..-.. i .......................... (sannolikt i Livland), död 17..-..-.. i ................... (Se SoH 1/1995 fråga nr 1723).
Dopvittne i Simrishamn 1757, 1758 och 1759 och kallas det senare året Majorskan baronessan Docken. Se Biografica.
Gift 17..-..-.. (före 1726) i ....................... med ryttmästaren vid Södra skånska kavalleriregementet, majoren Johann Docken (Docke i fb), född 1693-09-03/04 i Malmö (Caroli förs., fb CI:1 s 22), död 1762-..-.. i .................... (enligt annan källa 1780-04-14 på Södertorp i Västra Karups socken, Kristianstads län, 86 år gammal, har dock ej påträffats i db).
Sonen Johan Wilhelm anges född 1726-09-09 på S:t Olofs gård i Sankt Olofs socken, Kristianstads län (fb saknas). Bodde på Västra Tvet i Hällestads socken, Malmöhus län, 1748 (dopvittne). De hade en son Johan Wilhelm (1726-1780) och en son Bengt Henric (1730-).

Vänliga hälsningar

Göran Mörner
Riddarhusgenealog

RIDDARHUSET
Box 2022
103 11 Stockholm


[2] Here is a link about Sankta Marie kapell that mentions von Becker: http://www.bebyggelseregistret.raa.se/bbr2/byggnad/visaInterior.raa;jsessionid=4191F6A5FB5CC4EA329EBA6EAC7CC1DF?byggnadBeskrivningId=21704434380763&byggnadId=21400000443438&interiorBeskrivningId=21000000364000

Here are some more photos of the Sankta Marie kapell including some heraldry: http://www.kyrkokartan.se/057593/images/57593_57848532

http://www.kyrkokartan.se/057593/images/57593_1009204

http://www.kringla.nu/kringla/objekt?referens=raa/bbr/21400000443438

[Tim Powys-Lybbe]

On 2 Aug at 1:02, sebn...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> I am considering commissioning some heraldic artwork showing the arms
> of some of my Swedish ancestors. Before I begin to look for an artist,
> I thought I would try to firm up some of my genealogical research and
> also try to correctly identify the arms of these ancestors. It would
> be very frustrating to learn only after the fact that some of the arms
> were painted incorrectly, or that I am unrelated to the individuals
> depicted. This research project has proven to be challenging, in part
> because I cannot read Swedish and because I have been unable to travel
> to Sweden. Thankfully, I have managed to locate some helpful items.
> I thought I would share my preliminary findings here in the hope that
> some of you find this as interesting as I do, but also as a form of
> peer-review.

I must emphasise that I am not in the same scholarly bracket as you and
others who have frequented this Newsgroup, but I have shared your
ambition of creating heraldic pedigrees and thought I might make the odd
comment from doing this.

I see you are following the heraldic and genealogical research together
and are already struggling to exclude exciting arms that are not on your
genealogy. I was more fortunate in that I did not have access to any
peripheral heraldry early on and spend around 12 years on genealogy more
or less alone. Only when I was satisfied I could go no further with the
genealogy (I come a cropper with both Latin and with medieval to
post-medieval scripts) did I seriously search out the heraldry. I do
not remember the heraldry particularly helping the genealogy.

I was confined to British Heraldry, if only because I did not trust the
genealogy links to continental families. And doing it in recent years
meant that I had the benefit of the marvellous series, now complete, of
"The Dictionary of British Heraldry", making my task much easier.

One resource that is most helpful for British genealogy are the various
local Archaeology and suchlike societies of the 19th century. I do not
know if other countries, particularly the Swedes, had well educated
parsons and country gentlemen with the leisure to pursue such matters,
but we are very fortunate in this country for their industry.

Finally if you are going to commission an artist, that will probably be
as expensive as a journey to Sweden. There is the Institution of
Amateur Heralds at <http://amateurheralds.com> that might reduce your
costs mightily. And there is the possibility of doing the armorial
pedigree yourself, not as good as an artist's work but many times
cheaper; my latest offering is in outline here
<http://powys.org/Heraldry/Garter> and an armorial pedigree with gross
file size can be downloaded here
<http://powys.org/Heraldry/Garter/armorial_pedigree.html>.

[sebn...@gmail.com]

Hi Tim,

Thanks very much for your kind message. I hadn't seen the charts of your ancestors before. They are very interesting! Unfortunately there aren't many British resources that are related to my current research project. One tangent, however, is Johan von Becker's supposed service during the English Civil War. According to some continental publications I've seen, von Becker fought under Cromwell at the battles of Dunbar and Worcester, and later participated in Sir Bulstrode Whitelocke embassy to Sweden in 1653-4: https://archive.org/stream/ttartaflorfverd00wasagoog#page/n87/mode/1up

Perhaps as a professional soldier he was looking for work after the Peace of Westphalia? Regrettably I am ignorant of seventeenth century British history, but I hope to read Professor Mark Stoyle's relatively recent book "Soldiers and strangers: an ethnic history of the English Civil War." I think it features a chapter on foreign soldiers of fortune. Unfortunately von Becker's name does not seem to appear in Whitelocke's account of his retinue:

https://archive.org/stream/journalofswedish01whituoft#page/77/mode/1up

But presumably von Becker's wife Anna Maria Douglas was Scottish. It would be interesting to learn if she was a member of a Scottish family that had previously settled on the continent, or if von Becker found his wife while campaigning in Scotland. Would you happen to know any dedicated historians of the Douglas family? Perhaps somebody knows more about her.

Cheers,

Sebastian

[Chris Pitt Lewis]

The Counts Douglas are a prominent Swedish noble family and in the 20th
century intermarried with such families as the Habsburgs and
Wittelsbachs. They supposedly descend from a Robert Douglas (1611-1662)
who went from Scotland to Sweden, and whose ancestry is said to be from
the Douglases of Whittinghame and Sandikstone. He was made a Count by
Queen Christina in 1654. He has a page on the Swedish version of Wikipedia.

I am sure that at some point I have seen a discussion of his ancestry
online - try the archives of this group or soc.genealogy.medieval or
alt.talk.royalty. For an outline see this page:
http://www.jacobite.ca/essays/douglas.htm

I think for all these families you should follow up your correspondence
with Riddarhuset (the Riddarhus - et is the Swedish definite article) if
you can. I visited the building when I had a chance to visit Stockholm
two years ago. As well as the chamber (the former Swedish "House of
Lords"), the walls of which are lined with plaques bearing the arms of
all the families introduced into the nobility over the centuries, they
have a library which, as I understood it, has files recording the
genealogies of these families. The "Sveriges Adelskalender", comparable
to Debretts, publishes details of living family members. For historical
material, when I was there they had on sale a very expensive CD, which I
resisted the temptation to buy, which I understood contained many of
their older pedigrees.

I feel sure that there must be someone there who could correspond with
you at least partly in English, though I understand why their
genealogist chose to write in Swedish. I can't read Swedish either but
the document he is quoting seems to be full of military terms and place
names which would be hard to translate accurately, and I expect he was
cutting and pasting from a database.

Swedish noble families based in Finland should also be recorded in the
equivalent organisation which exists in Finland
(http://www.riddarhuset.fi/english/) - the 2010 Adelskalender, which I
did buy, suggests this is the case for von Becker.

--

Chris Pitt Lewis

[sebn...@gmail.com]

> And now I am considering pushing back the generations shown on this imaginary piece of heraldic artwork to show Bengt's son Olof Dock (my 4x great-grandfather in the direct paternal line), Olof's mother Elisabeth Catharina von Clevenow, and Olof's maternal grandparents Ernst Wilhelm von Klevenow and Agneta Catharina von Scheibe. I can find no evidence that Olof used arms, but I think that some of his maternal ancestors did. I can find Ernst and Agneta in my family tree: https://www.dropbox.com/s/j3st6skxocz4kau/Nelson1.pdf
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1guz5wasdnp4d2/Nelson2.pdf
>
> I can also find Ernst and Agneta in secondary sources like this: http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Scheibe
>
> According to this website, Agneta's line appears to lead back to other armigerous Swedish families including Hammarskjöld and von der Linde. Does anyone here know if either these Scheibe and von Klevenow families were armigerous? The only thing I could find for Klevenow was this entry in Rietstap, but I have no idea if these Klevenow's are related to my Klevenow's: https://archive.org/stream/bub_gb_TU4EAAAAIAAJ#page/n612/mode/1up

It looks like the Scheibe family is a branch of the Ridderborg family, along with another branch (de Maré): http://www.adelsvapen.com/genealogi/Ridderborg_nr_1428 A Henrik Scheibe (born ca. 1673) was knighted by King Charles XII of Sweden (and apparently the grant of arms was donated to the Riddarhuset in 1949). Unfortunately my ancestor Agneta Catharina von Scheibe doesn't appear to be a direct descendant of Henrik. She seems to be a direct descendant of Henrik's uncle Johan Vendelsson Scheibe instead (so presumably Agneta wouldn't fall under the terms of the grant of arms)...shucks.

[Tim Powys-Lybbe]

In the land of the blind, the one-eyed is king! If I had Swedish
relatives, this would give me a good start.

And in answer to Seb's question about Anna Maria Douglas, there is
nothing in the indices to either "The Scots Peerage" or to Bruce
McAndrew's "Scottish Historic Heraldry" and I regret I have no study of
the Douglas family as a whole. Though the latter had found hints that
the Douglases migh be of Flemish origin.