Light load for 30-06
Bill Jungbauer
getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
Bill Jungbauer
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nb...@bigfoot.com
says...
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
Check out Hodgdon's web site. They offer lots of load data and in fact
state that the 150 gr bullet minimum load with H4895 is 46 grains. I
have had good luck with Hodgon's data and powders.
For a light handload I would look (as do the ammo manufacturers) to a
lighter bullet. There is a huge assortment of 30 caliber bullets out
there. I would probably look around the 125 or 130 gr mark and work my
way up.
Rubaiyat of Omar Bradley
# If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
4895 is an excellent choice as a general purpose powder for the 30-06.
For reduced loads, there is a particular powder, SR 4759, which is an
ideal choice. It will produce about 1900fps with good accuracy.
Gunny_2007
"Bill Jungbauer" <red...@sihope.com> wrote in message
news:fbm44a$jp9$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me
into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are
in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If
I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
# Bill Jungbauer
Try going to the source: http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
They show a 110 gr bullet using 4895. Using their cartridge research option
you may be able to find other cartridges using that powder.
Dennis Jenkins
light loads listed for it.
Dennis Jenkins
On Wed, 5 Sep 2007 11:32:26 +0000 (UTC), "Bill Jungbauer"
<red...@sihope.com> wrote:
#My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
#getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
#After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
#the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
#grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
#increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
#Bill Jungbauer
browningh...@yahoo.com
> ...
IMR 4895 was the "original powder" used in the military 30-06. Even
to this day this powder is the "powder of choice" for working up super
accurate loads. I have used this successfully with bullets ranging
from 126 grains up to 180 grains with absolutely outstanding
accuracy. When I used the 30-06 for National Match shooting the match
shooters either all used 4895 powder or IMR 4064 with the 150 and 168
grain match bullets.
I worked up some cast bullet loads with 4895 powder at about 1,900 fps
that were phenomenal accurate at 100 yards shooting way better than
using expensive jacketed bullets which cost me 10 times more money.
The cast bullets cost me about 2 cents to make and the recoil was
about that of a .223 Remington , in other words almost non-existent.
No muzzle blast, no recoil, no excess wear and tear and early burn out
of the barrel either.
> ...
works not only in the 30-06 but in just about every military caliber I
have ever used it in and that encompassed many military rifle calibers
over the years of collecting and shooting military caliber rifles.
oldpink
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
My recommendation would be to do this differently by using light
bullets, either 125 or 135 grain with the starting loads instead of the
full house loads in the manuals.
Once he is comfortable using those loads and can hit a 2-3" target
consistently at 100 yards, make up some loads using the same bullets
with a grain or two more powder, and have him practice with those until
he is as good or better than with the starting loads.
Once he has gotten used to those intermediate loads, (carefully) work up
to the maximum loads.
As you move up in power, the loads will hit higher on the target, of
course, but simply have him shoot for the same aim point, and his shots
should hit higher but similarly closer together.
Also, you can make the recoil even more manageable by purchasing a PAST
wearable recoil shield.
You can get these at midwayusa.com, among other retailers, and they work
remarkably well.
In fact, my 12 year old daughter, who weighs just over 100lbs can handle
my .30-06 with full power loads using the PAST Magnum Plus.
After your son is fully comfortable with the lighter bullet loads, move
up to something more suitable for deer, either 150 grain or (my
preference) 165 grains.
Again, work up from the starting loads up to maximum until he is
comfortable.
btw...generally speaking, most firearms shoot at their best with powder
that most nearly fills the case, which usually means maximum power loads.
Disclaimer: Use the following with caution, and ALWAYS use in modern
firearms in good condition, working up to it in steps first.
My favorite load in the '06 uses Winchester cases with 57 grains of
IMR4831 behind a Barnes-XLC 165 grain fired by a CCI 200 primer.
I am able to get sub MOA 5 shot groups at 100 yards with that load, and
the recoil doesn't bother me at all.
Most of the people who gripe about the recoil of the .30-06 either
didn't know how to hold the rifle properly to minimize the punch, or
they shot it the first time from the prone position, which tends to
magnify the discomfort.
Good luck with your son, and happy shooting.
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.
zxcvbob
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
# Bill Jungbauer
#
Have you considered using 13 grains of Red Dot powder (and any
appropriate bullet)? It will shoot low, but accuracy is supposed to be
outstanding. I would start with 165 or 170 grain .30-30 cast bullets.
Bob
haraoi...@yahoo.com
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
# Bill Jungbauer
My favorite light load for 30-06 is 13 grains of Red Dot behind a 165
cast bullet. I get about 1800fps. It is real economical to shoot and
accurate to boot.
hot-ham-a...@hotmail.com
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
# Bill Jungbauer
Consider 130 to 150gr bullets for the 30-30. They will perform well
at the lower velocities you're looking for.
Louis Boyd
On Sep 5, 8:32 am, "Bill Jungbauer" <redh...@sihope.com> wrote:
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me
into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads
are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for?
If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
#
# Bill Jungbauer
It seems to me if your son wants a 30-06 instead of a 243 he's not
recoil shy. The age of a person or their body weight does not determine
their tolerance to recoil. If he's big enough to hold the rifle he's
likely to take the 30-06 recoil just fine. You'll probably find he
won't like your wimpy 30-06 loads any more than he likes the 243. When
he gets older he may learn to appreciate the 243.
As to your suggested loads, the light loads may be safe, but I would
not expect either to be very accurate. Expect both loads to give more
vertical stringing and higher wind deflection than normal 30-06 loads or
his 243. I wouldn't use either load in my 30-06s.
As to buying H4895, it's a reasonable powder for 150 gn and lighter
bullets in a 30-06 with normal pressure loads and can give good
accuracy. No powder guarantees accuracy with all load, bullet and rifle
combinations.
Jonathan Spencer
<bo...@apt0.sao.arizona.edu> writes
#
#On Sep 5, 8:32 am, "Bill Jungbauer" <redh...@sihope.com> wrote:
## My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me
#into
## getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
## After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads
#are in
## the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
## grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for?
#If I
## increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
##
## Bill Jungbauer
#
#It seems to me if your son wants a 30-06 instead of a 243 he's not
#recoil shy.
I'm not sure that follows. He may *think* he wants a 30-06, but has he
fired a 30-06 or something that does recoil? If he has, then he know
what to expect, but if all he's fired is a .243 .....
--
Jonathan
Remember: Marriage is the number one cause of divorce.
jadel
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore ...
Why not? Has it stopped killing deer?
Has he fired full power '06 loads? Does he know how hard they kick?
You could get him a .308 Win.--not quite the kick of an '06, but more
'oomph' than any .243.
J. Del Col
Louis Boyd
# In message <fbqcr1$jd5$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, Louis Boyd
# <bo...@apt0.sao.arizona.edu> writes
# ## ## My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me
# #into
# ## getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# ## After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads
# #are in
# ## the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# ## grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for?
# #If I
# ## increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
# ##
# ## Bill Jungbauer
# #
# #It seems to me if your son wants a 30-06 instead of a 243 he's not
#
# I'm not sure that follows. He may *think* he wants a 30-06, but has he
# fired a 30-06 or something that does recoil? If he has, then he know
# what to expect, but if all he's fired is a .243 .....
Did Mr Jungbauer bother to discuss with his son why he wants a 30-06
rather than a .243? If the son didn't give a well though out reason
maybe the kid's just a spoiled brat. I wonder how the "talked me into
getting him a 30-06" conversation transpired?
Bill asked for advice on light loads. My advice was that downloading a
30-06 to give 243 recoil levels isn't likely to give good accuracy. The
question wasn't whether he should buy a 30-06 for his son. That's
apparently a done deal.
wb
You can use a fast, bulky powder like IMR SR4759 for light loads. If
you use a 150 gr bullet, my manual suggests loads between 20 and 24
grains to deliver velocities between 1600 and 1900 fps. If you have not
bought the 30.06, you may want to consult your son and offer the
suggestion of using the .308. It is a powerful cartridge and generally
shoots only 100 fps slower then the 30.06. But, that smaller cartridge
is easier to load light then the 30.06. Just a thought.
Here are some load guidelines for light loads:
150gr bullet. 20 - 24 gr SR4759
165 gr bullet. 21 - 25 gr SR4759
180 gr bullet 26 - 30 gr IMR 4198
200 gr bullet. 27 - 31 gr IMR 4198
Velocities for all run between 1600 and 2000 fps and will kick about
like the .243 your son was using. Power will be on par with the 30-30
so these loads can actually be used to hunt deer with.
This load data is out of my Sierra reloading manual.
.
oldpink
# On Sep 5, 8:32 am, "Bill Jungbauer" <redh...@sihope.com> wrote:
# # My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me
# into
# # getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# # After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads
# are in
# # the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# # grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for?
# If I
# # increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
# #
# # Bill Jungbauer
#
# recoil shy. The age of a person or their body weight does not determine
# their tolerance to recoil. If he's big enough to hold the rifle he's
# likely to take the 30-06 recoil just fine. You'll probably find he
# won't like your wimpy 30-06 loads any more than he likes the 243. When
# he gets older he may learn to appreciate the 243.
Good points, all.
I suspect that he would probably be fine with the bigger caliber's
recoil even in his later years.
After all, plenty of old timers used steel buttplated .45-70s their
entire lives.
# As to your suggested loads, the light loads may be safe, but I would
# not expect either to be very accurate. Expect both loads to give more
# vertical stringing and higher wind deflection than normal 30-06 loads or
# his 243. I wouldn't use either load in my 30-06s.
I would agree...were it my suggestion to use the reduced loads only.
My suggestion would be to use starting powder charges with 135 grain
bullets just to get acclimated, then work up powder charges, then up to
the ideal bullet weight (IMNSHO) of 165 grains.
# As to buying H4895, it's a reasonable powder for 150 gn and lighter
# bullets in a 30-06 with normal pressure loads and can give good
# accuracy. No powder guarantees accuracy with all load, bullet and rifle
# combinations.
Of course, the powder that most nearly fills the case while giving the
desired MV is usually the one that yields the best groups.
For my money, IMR4831 is that powder, plus it is single based, resulting
in less barrel erosion over time than the double based ones, such as W760.
There is also visibly less muzzle blast and flash.
And, at least if the loading data books are accurate, it does all this
with lower chamber pressures.
IMR4350 is also a good choice for lighter bullets.
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.
oldpink
# In message <fbqcr1$jd5$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, Louis Boyd
# <bo...@apt0.sao.arizona.edu> writes
# #
# #into
# ## getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# ## After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads
# #are in
# ## the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# ## grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for?
# #If I
# ## increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
# ##
# ## Bill Jungbauer
# #
#
# I'm not sure that follows. He may *think* he wants a 30-06, but has he
# fired a 30-06 or something that does recoil? If he has, then he know
# what to expect, but if all he's fired is a .243 .....
*shrug*
I have to wonder at all the hogwash I have heard and read all these
years about the "abusive" recoil dished out by the old warhorse.
Bunk, my 12 year little GIRL can handle my Ruger .30-06 off a bench.
It reminds me of all the talk I had heard for years about the "arm
snapping" .44 Remington Magnum.
Again, bunk.
I have shot three different handguns in .44 magnum, including the Desert
Eagles, an S&W 29, and a Ruger Super Blackhawk, all using full power
loads, and the recoil was not a problem at all, more like a shove than
the characteristic punch produced by a GP-100 in .357 Remington Magnum.
I even had the good fortune to be at the range two years ago with a guy
with a shiny new S&W in .500 S&W Magnum, and he asked me to fire a whole
cylinder full of top power (400+ grain slugs) loads out of it.
No problem at all, and I even fired it once one handed.
It sure was earsplittingly loud, though!
I would recommended double hearing protection for this pea shooter.
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.
nord...@yahoo.com
# My 13 year old son said he did not like his .243 anymore and talked me into
# getting him a 30-06. I plan on loading him some light loads to begin with.
# After looking at my load books, I see that the only noted light loads are in
# the Speer book. 150 grain bullet with either 42 grains of H4895 or 26-28
# grains of 5744. If I buy some 4895, what else is this powder good for? If I
# increase the dosage later, is it a reliably accurate load?
Haven't used H4895 but on my bench a pound of powder never lasts a
long as I want. If your boy gets 200 shots from a can you'll be
lucky. I've used IMR3031, IMR4198, and Reloader7 to duplicate 30/30
ballistics with the 150 grain bullets. Another way to speed your
son'd adoption of full power loads is to fit his rifle with a one inch
Decelerator recoil pad.
zxcvbob
# Bunk, my 12 year little GIRL can handle my Ruger .30-06 off a bench.
You named your little girl "Bunk"?
Best regards, ;-)
Bob
Bill Jungbauer
First, I would like to thank all of you, for all of your input to my
question. I feel that I got what I asked for, advice on light loads.
Second, I wish to point out that the last thing my son is, is a spoiled
brat.
He was eleven when I bought him his .243. It was a youth model. I loaded him
up some 55 grain Blitz Kings and 42 grains of Varget. about a month before
hunting season, I took him to the range with some full blown deer capable
loads. My reasoning was to get him comfortable with the rifle with out
developing any desire to flinch. This worked out well, he shot his first
deer that fall.
We have been sharing a stand for two years now, and he has seen me do the
bang- flop to two deer and he is impressed, thus, his desire for a 30-06.
As far as hand guns go, he shows competence and confidence when he shoots my
.44 or my 10mm.
Bill Jungbauer
> ...
jadel
# # Bunk, my 12 year little GIRL can handle my Ruger .30-06 off a bench.
#
# You named your little girl "Bunk"?
#
# Best regards, ;-)
Only if there were a comma after GIRL. (annoying emoticon here)
J. Del Col
Petey
# oldpink wrote:
# # Bunk, my 12 year little GIRL can handle my Ruger .30-06 off a bench.
#
#
# You named your little girl "Bunk"?
Slightly better than "Car Backseat" ;-)
oldpink
# oldpink wrote:
#
#
# You named your little girl "Bunk"?
*thwap*
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.
oldpink
# First, I would like to thank all of you, for all of your input to my
# question. I feel that I got what I asked for, advice on light loads.
You're welcome.
;-)
# Second, I wish to point out that the last thing my son is, is a spoiled
# brat.
Yeah, I was thoroughly annoyed by the presumptious twits who posited that.
Who the hell are they to jump to such an INSULTING conclusion?
# He was eleven when I bought him his .243. It was a youth model. I loaded him
# up some 55 grain Blitz Kings and 42 grains of Varget. about a month before
# hunting season, I took him to the range with some full blown deer capable
# loads. My reasoning was to get him comfortable with the rifle with out
# developing any desire to flinch. This worked out well, he shot his first
# deer that fall.
You did things exactly right.
Start with something mild recoiling with low muzzle blast to prevent bad
habits such as jerking the shot and flinching, THEN work up to full
power loads.
I started with a pump Crosman 2100 pellet rifle, moved up to a Marlin
39A .22 rimfire, then on to the .30-06 in rifles, then on to the .45
Colt revolver, and the 10mm autopistol.
No flinch, even when I was invited to fire something REALLY impressive,
that being a .500 S&W revolver.
Nothing is gained by handing a new shooter a .458 Winchester Magnum and
saying "Hey, shoot this thing from the prone position."
# We have been sharing a stand for two years now, and he has seen me do the
# bang- flop to two deer and he is impressed, thus, his desire for a 30-06.
Plus, he probably wants something that can handle more than just deer
and coyotes.
Can you say black bear, elk, and moose?
Hell, if you load up some full powder charges behind the 200 grain
Nosler Partition, big Grizzlies are suddenly within reason.
# As far as hand guns go, he shows competence and confidence when he shoots my
# .44 or my 10mm.
Well, he is clearly ready for prime time.
Congratulations on having such an avid marksman at such a young age.
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.
oldpink
# zxcvbob wrote:
#
# # oldpink wrote:
# # # Bunk, my 12 year little GIRL can handle my Ruger .30-06 off a bench.
# #
# #
# Slightly better than "Car Backseat" ;-)
*double thwap*
--
And what exactly is a joke?
.