Dangerous? Federal primers & Lee Auto Prime
John Wheeler
for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
Match.
Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
of this?
I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
in my hand!
Thanks,
John Wheeler
(Please reply to rec.guns)
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Strider
(John Wheeler) wrote:
#I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
#for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
#state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
#the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
#Match.
#
#Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
#unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
#of this?
#
#I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
#in my hand!
#
#Thanks,
#
#John Wheeler
#(Please reply to rec.guns)
#
As told to me, the reason that Lee advises use of certain primers is
that some are of thinner metal than others (soft primers. hard
primers). Lee seems concerned that soft primers might get crushed in
the process using the Auto Prime and go "kaboom", possibly initiating
a chain reaction with the other primers in the tray.
I took Lee's word on it and use only Winchester and CCI primers. Six
years later, I've had no "kabooms". Of course I can't say what would
have happened if I had used soft primers, but in reloading, no kaboom
on the bench is a good kaboom.
You would likely be OK if you want to use the Federals without the
Auto Prime.
Strider
Rodman S. Regier
(John Wheeler) wrote:
#I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
#for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
#state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
#the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
#Match.
#
#Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
#unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
#of this?
#
#I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
#in my hand!
Lee did tests with full trays of various brand primers in their Auto
Prime tool, and thermally cooked off the "ready to go" first primer to
create a consistent firing condition. They enclosed the whole setup
in a large cardboard box (replaced each time) as a skin simulant.
(If something can punch thru a cardboard box, it would likely
penetrate thru the skin of a human under similar circumstances).
Some primer brands just had the first primer fire without a chain
sympathetic firing of the rest of the primers. Those did not punch
holes in the cardboard box.
Other brands had primers sympathetically firing several other primers,
punching holes in the cardboard box or even tearing large gaps in the
cardboard box. It doesn't take much of a logical leap to extrapolate
such a result to a primer operator's skin under similar conditions.
Winchester and CCI primers did not display this chain reaction effect.
Alas, Federal primers did.
That is why Lee recommends Winchester and CCI printers in their
priming tools, and does not recommend Federal primers
in their priming tools.
For those using the Lee Loadmaster, it has a blast shield available
that will protect the operator from chain firing of primers in the
tray. In that case, the operator could consider using Federal
primers. You have to consider what other property could be demaged
that was on the other side of the blast shield...
Here is what Lee's web site says on the matter:
"Primer Brand Warning
We recommend only Winchester and CCI primers be used in the Auto Prime
because Federal and Remington primers pose a potential danger to the
operator. In testing, we found that the latter two brands of primers
almost always chain detonated if the primer being seated was
accidentally set off. A primer going off near your hand can be
compared to an M-80 firecracker.
When a full tray of primers explode, it does so with enough force to
cause injury to the operator and anyone else standing within a ten
foot radius.
The older Improved priming tool and our current production Ram-Prime
only accept one primer at a time, so this hazard did not apply.
We take no position as to the quality of primers and mention this only
because of the increased danger of chain detonation with some brands
only."
http://www.leeprecision.com/faq/index.cgi
priming and priming problems->Primer brand warning
MR
(John Wheeler) wrote:
#I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
#for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
#state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
#the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
#Match.
#
#Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
#unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
#of this?
#
#I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
#in my hand!
#
#Thanks,
#
#John Wheeler
#(Please reply to rec.guns)
I think Lee says that the Federal primers are a little softer than the
other brands; i.e. Winchester etc. I would take them back and
exchange them for some others since most primers are more or less the
same price. I would not take a chance on it. I load with Lee Load
Masters and never use Federal. I also have to use extra hard primers
in my semi auto military rifles reloads due to the floating firing
pins.
Good luck and enjoy your new hobby.
MR
Watchdog
"> That is why Lee recommends Winchester and CCI printers in their
# priming tools, and does not recommend Federal primers
# in their priming tools.
#
# Here is what Lee's web site says on the matter:
#
# "Primer Brand Warning
#
# We recommend only Winchester and CCI primers be used in the Auto Prime
# because Federal and Remington primers pose a potential danger to the
# operator.
Amazingly, the Lee Load Book (2nd Ed), amends this heretofore blanket
warning statement. I am happy to say, that 10,000 rounds later on a Lee Pro
1000 (whose primer feed is most unreliable IMHO), none of my Remington
primers have detonated.
Stan Schaefer
# I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
# for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
# state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
# the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
# Match.
#
# Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
# unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
# of this?
#
# I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
# in my hand!
#
# Thanks,
#
# John Wheeler
# (Please reply to rec.guns)
#
#
It's a pissing match between Lee and Federal. Guess who owns Federal?
Same guys that own RCBS. Guess who competes with Lee? I've used
Federal primers in any number of different priming tools with no
problems. You just have to be careful with any priming operation,
I've crunched a few but have never popped any. The tools you have to
be wary of are the ones that have a metal tube full of primers with
them stacked up, not edge-to-edge. There's have been some instances
of those blowing up and rocketing through body parts or building parts
or both. I've never heard of problems with the ones that have trays
and the primers are edge-to-edge.
Stan
Chris Morton
#
#john_w...@hotmail.com (John Wheeler) wrote in message
#news:<c13ue7$j27$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>...
## I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
## for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
## state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
## the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
## Match.
##
## Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
## unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
## of this?
##
## I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
## in my hand!
##
## Thanks,
##
## John Wheeler
## (Please reply to rec.guns)
##
##
#It's a pissing match between Lee and Federal. Guess who owns Federal?
# Same guys that own RCBS. Guess who competes with Lee? I've used
#Federal primers in any number of different priming tools with no
#problems. You just have to be careful with any priming operation,
#I've crunched a few but have never popped any. The tools you have to
#be wary of are the ones that have a metal tube full of primers with
#them stacked up, not edge-to-edge. There's have been some instances
#of those blowing up and rocketing through body parts or building parts
#or both. I've never heard of problems with the ones that have trays
#and the primers are edge-to-edge.
I also regularly prime with Federal 210Ms and a Lee Auto Prime. Never any
problems.
You won't have any safety problems with a Dillon RL550B either. The primer
magazine is enclosed in another heavy gauge metal tube. Any unlikely explosions
would be directed straight up.
--
Gun control, the theory that 110lb. women should have to fistfight with 210lb.
rapists.
Blair Hunewill
month now. I probably should have looked since I've been using
Federal Primers exclusively lately. Since I've purchased my
Auto-prime, I've primed about 300 9mm's, 40 .270, and 30 22-Hornet's.
The 9mm were just small pistol primers, and the others were gold match
small and large rifle primers. If I feel any kind of resistence, I
stop and fix it so the primer doesn't get mashed.
Ken Marsh
Stan Schaefer <Sta...@americanisp.net> wrote:
#It's a pissing match between Lee and Federal. Guess who owns Federal?
# Same guys that own RCBS. Guess who competes with Lee?
Maybe, but I don't think so. This warning pre-dates the sale of Federal.
Lee explains that it is the greater brisance of Federal primers, which
use a different isomer of Lead Styphanate than everyone else, make them
a little more dangerous to use in primer feed devices.
# I've used Federal primers in any number of different priming tools
# with no problems.
Me too.
# You just have to be careful with any priming operation,
Yup!
#I've crunched a few but have never popped any.
Me too.
# The tools you have to
#be wary of are the ones that have a metal tube full of primers with
#them stacked up, not edge-to-edge. There's have been some instances
#of those blowing up and rocketing through body parts or building parts
#or both. I've never heard of problems with the ones that have trays
#and the primers are edge-to-edge.
They can shatter too.
My Hornady press comes with a steel blast tube to contain the brass
primer feed tube. When charged with 100 primers, I treat it like a
loaded gun... with two barrels, one in each direction. I feel much safer
once it is mounted on the press, and the only thing it is endangering
then is the ceiling. The actual priming operation is removed a bit from
the bottom of the feed tube, which is a Good Thing(tm).
Ken.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Strider
(Ken Marsh) wrote:
***snip***
I read that the anvil can reach 1,000 fps+ if the primer gets popped.
That could hurt.
Strider
V.E. Dorn
#
# Maybe, but I don't think so. This warning pre-dates the sale of Federal.
# Lee explains that it is the greater brisance of Federal primers, which
# use a different isomer of Lead Styphanate than everyone else, make them
# a little more dangerous to use in primer feed devices.
#
I think you're dead on with this one. Consider how Federal primers are
packaged. I don't think they pay extra for packaging that ensures that they
are seperated and so much futher apart from one another for nothing. I know
that some others are doing this too but not to such an extreme. I use
primarily Lee equipment and stick to the "CCI or Winchester" rule with the
tray type primers but still use Federal on the Turret Press which are loaded
one at time.
Don
Charles Winters
brands of primers in my Autoprime for 25 years with no incidents. The catch
is, you should be wearing eye protection and must take care not to crush
primers with the tool. Occasionally, a primer will get caught sideways or
otherwise incorrectly feeding into the pocket. You can't just increase the
pressure. When something feels not right, you stop, look and disassemble
the situation to remove the blockage. Its true, Federal primers are softer
and more sensitive than other brands, esp Remington and CCI, but that should
not keep you from using Fed 210Ms, 155s, 215s as you please. - CW
x "John Wheeler" <john_w...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c13ue7$j27$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
# I've have just bought a Lee Anniversary reloading kit with components
# for reloading 308 Win. The instructions for the Lee Auto Prime tool
# state that Federal primers should NEVER be used as they are unsafe in
# the tool. Guess what primers my dealer sold me?...yes, Federal 210
# Match.
#
# Is the combination of Lee Auto Prime with Federal primers really
# unsafe? Why does Lee make this claim and has anyone had any experience
# of this?
#
# I'm new to reloading and don't fancy a tray full of primers going off
# in my hand!
#
# Thanks,
#
# John Wheeler
# (Please reply to rec.guns)
x
Bill VH
<ved...@cableone.net> writes:
#
#I think you're dead on with this one. Consider how Federal primers are
#packaged. I don't think they pay extra for packaging that ensures that they
#are seperated and so much futher apart from one another for nothing. I know
#that some others are doing this too but not to such an extreme. I use
#primarily Lee equipment and stick to the "CCI or Winchester" rule with the
#tray type primers but still use Federal on the Turret Press which are loaded
#one at time.
#
I once asked the owner of my shooter's supply store about the Federal
packaging. He said he'd heard it was because of shipping accident where
a case was dropped and exploded. Quien sabe? Even so I've been using
Federals in large and small pistol, large and small rifle, in a Dillon 550B,
and in a RockChucker for years. I've tried to seat them upside down and
crosswise. I've deprimed brass with live primers. The only time I have ever
had one go BANG was when it was pushing a bullet downrange.
The first time I used Federals was when I was having trouble with a batch
of brass with slightly oversized primer pockets. Using either Rem. or Win.
primers at the time. I mentioned it to a handloader friend of mine and he
suggested I try Federals. That worked. No more loose primers.
Bill Van Houten (USA Ret)
Thermopylae had it's messenger of defeat, COME AND GET THEM !
The Alamo had none.