Here's the ratings of all the systems
John Black
owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
NES: A-
Brought back the industry after Atari, and changed the face of gaming.
Only problem is too many crap games.
Genesis: B
The sports games ran smoother here than the SNES, but in the later
days of 16 bit, the SNES caught up, and the Genesis' graphics weren't
as impressive.
SNES: A
The most impressive technical capabilities of it's day, a slew of
killer games, what else do you need?
Playstation: A-
Revolutionary use of full motion video, and CD technology. Also
includes a killer library of titles. Only problem is that waiting for
the thing to load gets rather annoying and the controller isn't as
good as the N64's.
Nintendo 64: A-
The most technically advanced system ever released, and the N64's top
titles blow me away. Big problem here is that the games that interest
me come out once every five months or so, so my N64 spends a lot of
it's time unplugged and sitting under a dust cover. But when the
games I like come out, I can't stop playing it.
Dan13
like their systems :)
These are fair ratings to the systems I own, and what they were in their
"prime" or now for recent systems:
NES: B+: Sure, the games were great, the variety was the best, and the
graphics and sound were decent, but it just died a slow painful death, which
was the end of an era IMO. Also, the lack of support, like Sega had with its
power bases, was kind of disappointing, which is the reason I never bought a
SNES. I still have my NES today :)
Genesis: A : I believe that this is the best system around. The games were
top notch, the library was varied and very likable (and still is the
biggest, if I'm not mistaken), and it had the added features, though they
didn't always work (eg: 32x), they introduced innovation in the market and
inspired the next-gen systems that we see today. The only reason why it
doesn't get an A+ in my book, is the fact that 1 out of 4 titles were utter
garbage. You didn't have to buy them, but they were on the shelf clouding up
a good game.
PSX: B : Sony's first entry into the videogame market is a great one, and I
like it a lot. But is it just me, or do games have a serious lack of
imagination and captivating gameplay? Once in a while, a new kind of game
comes out, but how many times do we have to put up with another Tekken? 3D
fighters abound, which isn't a bad thing, but as the genre with the worst
problem, there are more bad games than good games. However the price is
usually right, and finding a good title isn't a problem. The currently
library and forseeable future for the PSX make it the buyer's choice, but I
don't spend enough time on it to keep buying games for it. I'm waiting for
the cheapos :) But then there's Metal Gear Solid...
N64: C+ : The only reason I even have a N64 is that I got it for $25. Don't
even ask :) I also must admit that I am a Goldeneye Addict. This is one of
the few reasons for getting a N64. Plagued by delays, I turn towards my SS
and PSX for comfort, and the price of the games is another horn in the
devil's head. The sound is pretty much enhanced MIDI, and the graphics are
good, but rather limited. The only stake that this system has is gameplay
for the few good games it has. I love the control (except for the digital
pad...), and it adds so much to the games themselves (but not much to
Cruisin' USA :( Nintendo is losing ground fast, and with the PSX2 and
Dreamcast(!) coming out, this might be the nail in the coffin...
SS: A- : This is the new boy on my block...And he's got a great welcoming
party! With a great line of games, and the overall adaptability of the
Genesis, it's a damn shame that something so good could be deemed so bad by
SoA...I am in the Saturn market for the 2D, like almost everyone else, but I
do like the 3D (although chunky). I just find that the Saturn's games have
more soul than the PSX or N64, and that is my reason for such a high rating.
However the 4meg card helps too...(BTW, I'm looking for a 4 "n" 1 card.
Email me if you have one for sale/trade!)
Portables:
GB: A+ : I'm only giving my 3 reasons for the GB's rating- 1) Portability:
Now with the pocket, you can fit TWO in your pocket... 2) Library: Who can't
resist about a billion versions of Tetris? 3) Support/Innovation: Gameboy
LIGHT, Gameboy COLOR, Gameboy CAMERA/Printer, Super Gameboy, and new games
coming out all the time, with most exceeding the quality of NES games!
GG: C: Too big, needs too much juice, crummy games, but the first successful
system with a color screen :) Anybody want to buy mine?
Nomad: B: It's a portable Genesis! What more could you ask for?...except
more playing time with 6AA batteries. Ouch. The only battery pack at the
time was the Nomad Powerback, and it was almost as much as the system
itself! Now you can find both cheap (if you can find the pack at all!), and
with an average price of $60, you can't go wrong! Anybody want to trade me
theirs?
That's what I've got, and I'm standing by my ratings!
Thanks for reading my ranting,
Dan
--
***********Please reply to d...@rbcubed.com***********
ICQ#3307189 "To be is to do; To do is to be. Do Be Do Be Do."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
------->
Ken Small
Bally Astrocade: C-. My first system, most people had never heard of it.
While it ostensibly was more powerful than the 2600, it didn't show it. It
gets some points for having a 4 controller ports, and pretty good
controllers.
Atari 2600: B+. I didn't actually get one until years later, but it was
the most fun even when at a friend's house.
Atari 800: A-. Technically not a console, but I used it like one. A-.
The only real minus point come from the one-button controller, and the
fact that the C64 (didn't own) games tended to look better.
Vectrex: A-. Could have stood to have a bigger library, or longer life.
I didn;t get one until only recently, but I've had friends with them since
they were new.
Atari ST: B. Pretty good selection of games, but not like the 800 by any
means, and the graphics weren't stellar. Again, a one-button controller
(in fact, the same ones!)
Amiga: A-. Like the ST, but better.
NES: C. Don't flame me, I really didn't get into the scrolling shooters
and platform games of this era. I have one now, and I like quite a number
of games for it, but when it was current I didn't know about most of them,
or didn't think they were worth the asking price.
Lynx: B. I'd rate this one higher, based on how much fun I had with it,
but it's balanced by the long wait between game releases.
SNES: B. We get a little variety from the NES library, and a decent
controller. Still a lot of emphasis on types of games I don't like much.
Genesis/CD: B-. Pretty good games, but not a lot of them that really
appealed to me. I was always looking over at the SNES selection and
thinking they were greener pastur (I got my SNES later).
Gameboy: I dunno, A or F. Really, depends on when. I thought it was
terrbile the first few years of its life, then it started getting all
manner of stuff I liked.
Playstation. A. For somebody who always tended to like the quirky games,
this was it. Plus classics, plus racing games, plus at least a decent
selection of everything else I liked at least a little. Also, the first
time I ever owned a "winner" system during its prime, the other closest
contenders being the Genny and the Atari 800. I've never seen support
like this on my platform of choice before, I like it.
Saturn: N/A. I had one for a while, but I never gave it much time. Too
much overlap with the PS, which I already had, I guess. I suspect if I
had gotten it first I would have been pretty well satisfied.
N64: N/A. I got tired of waiting for games, but now it looks like it
might be getting to be time to get back in the pool. But I've been saying
that for a while.
--
Ken Small
"I used to get A's is psychology class, but it didn't make my life okay."
-- Loud Family
Dave
: Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
: owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
Great idea:
NES: C+ although is was the most popular home console at the time, it
lacked imagination and personality. The only saving feature was the first
party titles like Mario, Zelda, and Punchout. A few noteable exceptions
are made for the Megaman series and the random game of high quality.
SMS: B+ it lacked the sheer number of titles that made the NES popular,
but the 3D glasses and personality of the system more than made up for it.
I never had a hard time finding quality titles, and it gave me pleasure
owning a niche product.
Genesis: A- Lacking the color depth and sound capabilities of its rival
the SNES didn't slow down the Genesis. The most impressive library of
games (most of which came out in the infant stages of the system), ans
Sonic made this the system of choice.
SNES: B It could've been so much more, if realized. Developers took the
easy road out, giving quality games (for the most part), but the
derivative nature of many games (cute, fluffy games and unimaginative
RPGs) slowed it down. First party apps (and a kick-ass MK2 translation)
saved Nintendo once again.
PSX: B+ Tons of fun, cheap and abundant games, and....not much else. The
PSX is responsible for the 3D-ifying of home consoles, and nothing comes
close to it's market strength. With several high-quality titles in each
genre, it's the second most played system in my house.
N64: D Nintendo should be ashamed of themselves. Lucky for me, my
roommate bought one, and saved me the money. A couple of really good
games, and not much else. Expensive, space restrictive cartridges killed
it early. The lack of a good RPG lowers it's grade even more.
Saturn: A The most played system in my home, by everyone. Even my friends
come over just to play it. Killer RPGs, kick-ass 2D gaming, serious arcade
translations, and Fighter's Megamix make this the system of choice. It's
even cheaper now.
And yes, I did say there were no good RPGs for the SNES. I never liked
the Final Fantasy series (VII was ok) and Zelda was a let-down.
Dave
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Greco |
University of California at Davis | Crazy with the Cheeze Whiz.
dmg...@ucdavis.edu |
icbm://121.41.18.W/38.33.08.N 100m alt|
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sean Robertson
thought it was impressive? Compared to the Shinobi series?
Sean
Dave wrote in message <6po4db$85j$1...@mark.ucdavis.edu>...
<SNIP
>Genesis: A- Lacking the color depth and sound capabilities of its rival
>the SNES didn't slow down the Genesis. The most impressive library of
>games (most of which came out in the infant stages of the system), ans
>Sonic made this the system of choice.
<SNIP>
>
>Dave
>
>
> --
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave
: So, You played Altered Beast (earliest UK Megadrive game/pack-in), and
: thought it was impressive? Compared to the Shinobi series?
:
: Sean
I never mentioned Altered Beast. I was thinking:
Ghouls and Ghosts (or was it Ghosts and Goblins?)
Forgotten Worlds
Phantasy Star 2
Mystic Defender
Revenge of Shinobi
Golden Axe
Hang On
Michael Jackson's Moonwalker
and others.
Dave
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perry Denton
a NES, and the first games did blow me away. In the first six
months of the system, I purchased "Ghouls N Ghosts" "Revenge of Shinobi"
and "Golden Axe". The fall of '90 brought the EA titles "Madden"
and "Lakers Vs Celtics".
Perry
In article <901748388.23397.0...@news.demon.co.uk>,
Sean Robertson <se...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>So, You played Altered Beast (earliest UK Megadrive game/pack-in), and
>thought it was impressive? Compared to the Shinobi series?
>
>Sean
>
>Dave wrote in message <6po4db$85j$1...@mark.ucdavis.edu>...
><SNIP
>>Genesis: A- Lacking the color depth and sound capabilities of its rival
>>the SNES didn't slow down the Genesis. The most impressive library of
>>games (most of which came out in the infant stages of the system), ans
>>Sonic made this the system of choice.
><SNIP>
--
--
Perry Denton
Motorola, Inc.
Schaumburg, Illinois
Phone: (847) 538-7195
kwarlord
John Black wrote in message <35be8d84...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
>Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
>owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
>
>Brought back the industry after Atari, and changed the face of gaming.
>Only problem is too many crap games.
>
that's debatable ;-)
>Genesis: B
>The sports games ran smoother here than the SNES, but in the later
>days of 16 bit, the SNES caught up, and the Genesis' graphics weren't
>as impressive.
>
true. but which system had the Phantasy Star series? Those games alone make
it worthwhile!
>SNES: A
>The most impressive technical capabilities of it's day, a slew of
>killer games, what else do you need?
>
Final Fantasy 2 (Japan)
Final Fanrasy 3 (Japan)
Final Fantasy 5 (Japan)
***knocks on the head of the president of Squaresoft***
HELLO, MCFLY?!
>Playstation: A-
>Revolutionary use of full motion video, and CD technology. Also
>includes a killer library of titles. Only problem is that waiting for
>the thing to load gets rather annoying and the controller isn't as
>good as the N64's.
>
I couldn't agree more.
>Nintendo 64: A-
>The most technically advanced system ever released, and the N64's top
>titles blow me away. Big problem here is that the games that interest
>me come out once every five months or so, so my N64 spends a lot of
>it's time unplugged and sitting under a dust cover. But when the
>games I like come out, I can't stop playing it.
again, I couldn't agree more.
you forgot:
Gameboy: A+
The perfect little toy to take with you for waiting rooms! You can also play
those tiny games on your TV thanks to the good old Super Gameboy adapter!
Jesse Morrison
Also- Your rating of the SNES is a bit out of control. It had nice
colors, but the speed of the processor was pathetic. If you remember ALL
of the initial games (and many of the later), you'll surely recall the
comical slowdown and flicker. I would rate it more of a B. If Smash TV
was representative of SNES games, it would get an A.
I'll give the PSX credit for eye candy, but the deficiencies were there.
Controller, 2D support, RAM, systems melting down, FMV skip- these are
real issues. Not too much substance to the much-hyped releases.
The Saturn was overlooked in your evaluation. American- C. Japanese- A-.
This system had crazy amounts of cool games in Japan, just not all 3D.
The 3D games that were properly programmed, however, were often amazing.
I still prefer the hi-res look of DOA to any other fighter. And 2D
slapped every other system down.
The N64 has got to go IMO. I really thought Mario was cool, but all the
kiddie romps eventually broke me. They also defiled the Star Wars
universe with that shite game. It has cool tricks, but take a close
gander at how few polygons are really being displayed and how limited the
textures are. Let's not analyze the sound..... I'd say a B.
Later
Dan Mazurowski
>
> This isn't a bad idea, and it would be fun to see how much gamers _actually_
> like their systems :)
> These are fair ratings to the systems I own, and what they were in their
> "prime" or now for recent systems:
>
Atari 2600: A- Man was I in heaven when my Dad brought this home. To
think there was a time when I couldn't stop playing Combat!
Intellivision: B- Didn't own one 'in the day', but a friend did. VERY
cool strategy games. Sports games looked nice, but I never cared for
them. The action games were usually horribly slow. Now that I have one
in my collection I like playeing Burgertime and AD&D.
Atari 5200: A+ I must be the only guy on the planet who was good at
using those controllers. Smaller library than ColecoVision, but much
higher quality titles. I still love to dig out Dreadnought Factor on
occasion.
ColecoVision: C- Another one I didn't own until recently. Beautiful
graphics and a large library, but few of the titles really got me
excited.
Atari ST: B Not a console, but this wonderful machine tore me away from
console gaming for YEARS.
NES: D I didn't have one back then. I rememebr a lot of people owning
them, but none of the titles were fun enough to make me want one. But I
do own one now, and I love Dr. Mario (though not much else).
SMS: C Once again, I didn't own it when it was out. In fact, nobody I
knew did. Now that I have one in my collection, I like a few titles -
especially R-Type. Certainly the graphics are better than the NES. But
overall, it's easy to see why it never hit it big.
Gameboy: C Had some fun games, but I hated the screen so much that they
weren't enough to hold my interest. Besides, I was in the Army at the
time and needed a backlit screen for playing in low light conditions -
like in a tent.
Atari Lynx: A When I picked this up, there were only two portables on
the market - Lynx and Gameboy. One look at the GB screen and I made my
decision. Never regretted my choice, and I still play with it
frequently.
Genesis: B I always liked playing my friends systems, and the selection
of titles was pretty good. But it just wasn't enough to pull me (and my
dollars) away from gaming on my ST. I did get a kick out of seeing a lot
of ST titles ported to the Genny.
Atari Jaguar: B- Sure it died a humiliating death after only two years
on the market. But this system (and games like Tempest 2000, Cannon
Fodder, AvP, etc) finally got me excited about console gaming again.
Nintendo Virtual Boy: C- Interesting idea, terrible execution. Only
bought one cuz it was dirt cheap and made an interesting addition to my
collection. But I do love Panic Bomber - man I wish they'd put that on
the N64!
Nomad: B+ Would've gotten an A if Ms Pac-Man worked on it!
Nintendo64: B+ The first Nintendo product that really caught my
attention. Well, it wasn't so much the system that got me, it was
GoldenEye. After only 20 minutes at a Wal Mart demo kiosk, I knew I had
to have one!
--
Check out my video game retrospect web site!
http://home1.gte.net/smedley/index.htm
To reply via e-mail, edit my ISP address.
Jin
Here are my rankings of the more recent systems.
Playstation:
Very good system even though it did have a lot of problems with the older
models but there really isnt that much of a problem with the new models.
Great selection of games in Japan as well in US. Lots of cool RPGs
coming out from Square like XenoGears, Parasite Eve, Final Fantasy VIII
and others. 3D power is pretty good being a system thats around 3
years old.
Rating: A
Saturn:
Saturn has the best 2D graphics. The arcade fighting ports are also the
best of any system out yet. This system had great potential but I think
US gamers were looking past the system due to the failure of 32X. In
Japan this system is doing pretty strong and some awesome games are
out. Only if most of those games stuck in Japan made it over the US
could have seen the real Saturn.
Rating: B-
Nintendo64:
I thought using cartridges was a big mistake for Nintendo, but as
Nintendo said they wanted to use a format that they were familiar with.
Right now Nintendo is doing fairly well with some good games like 1080
Snowboarding, GoldenEye, Mortal Kombat 4, Allstar Baseball 99 and others.
Games are coming out slowly which is turning a lot of people from the
system. N64 is doing horribly in Japan, but with releases like Zelda 64,
Mother 3 and Ogre Battle maybe it will be more popular in Japan.
3D graphics on the system are quite good, but some games tend to get
foggy and fuzzy due to anti aliasing, but most games are good.
Rating: C+
These are just my thoughts on the systems.
John Black
some.
On Wed, 29 Jul 1998 10:38:58 -0400, Jesse Morrison <jes...@mit.edu>
wrote:
John Black
wrote:
>
>John Black wrote in message <35be8d84...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
>>Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
>>owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
>>
>>NES: A-
>>Brought back the industry after Atari, and changed the face of gaming.
>>Only problem is too many crap games.
>>
>
>that's debatable ;-)
>
>>Genesis: B
>>The sports games ran smoother here than the SNES, but in the later
>>days of 16 bit, the SNES caught up, and the Genesis' graphics weren't
>>as impressive.
>>
>
>true. but which system had the Phantasy Star series? Those games alone make
>it worthwhile!
>
>>SNES: A
>>The most impressive technical capabilities of it's day, a slew of
>>killer games, what else do you need?
>>
>
>Final Fantasy 2 (Japan)
>Final Fanrasy 3 (Japan)
>Final Fantasy 5 (Japan)
>
>***knocks on the head of the president of Squaresoft***
>HELLO, MCFLY?!
Blame Americans for not liking RPGs as much as the Japanese.
>>Playstation: A-
>>Revolutionary use of full motion video, and CD technology. Also
>>includes a killer library of titles. Only problem is that waiting for
>>the thing to load gets rather annoying and the controller isn't as
>>good as the N64's.
>>
>
>I couldn't agree more.
>
>>Nintendo 64: A-
>>The most technically advanced system ever released, and the N64's top
>>titles blow me away. Big problem here is that the games that interest
>>me come out once every five months or so, so my N64 spends a lot of
>>it's time unplugged and sitting under a dust cover. But when the
>>games I like come out, I can't stop playing it.
>
>again, I couldn't agree more.
>
>you forgot:
>
>Gameboy: A+
>The perfect little toy to take with you for waiting rooms! You can also play
>those tiny games on your TV thanks to the good old Super Gameboy adapter!
Never owned a Gameboy, so that's why I left it out.
s.tes
received/bought/traded.
Coleco Vision: C, My first Video Game system. Memories of playing this
system are very hazy to me, but my favorite Atari game of all time;
Vanguard, brings back fond memories.
Atari 7800: C+, Used all my old games on this puppy. Pole Position, and
the "3d" Asteroids were awesome on it. I've still got it sitting under my
TV, next to my SNES.
Nintendo (NES): B, The system that truly got me hooked as a video game
enthusiast. I still have over 20 games for this system, and still put it
to some serious use every so often.
Sega Genesis: B, I loved SF 2 on this machine, even though it was an
inferior version. Sports games were awesome, plus I believe the reason why
I requested this machine from my parents was because it was the thing to
own...and it was at it's time.
Sony Playstation: A-, I am a BIG fan of RPG's. I missed the SNES in it's
prime, as well as some of the greatest RPG's released. Currently this is
the rpg machine. The moment Tekken booted up on my PSX for the first time,
I was awestruck. However, my first PSX was plagued with the now infamous
FMV skipping problem. Then the controller ports stopped function.
Super Nintendo: B+ I picked this up solely for the system's great RPG's.
Final Fantasy 2, 3, Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, Breath of Fire and of
course Zellllldaaaa. So far, I have FF 3, SoM, BoF 1, Zelda, as well as a
few other obscure titles.
Nintendo 64: B- Some games initially blew me away. Playing SM64 for a few
minutes at my local EB sold me on this system. However, I was caught up in
all the hype, and since then I only purchased five games for system since I
bought it(September 96). The only other game that I am looking forward to
is Zelda, and Hybrid Heaven. Sorry, 1st person shooters don't do it for
me. I can't stand them. I could of sold this system for so much more than
I paid for it, but that was Christmas 96. I should have went for it.
Sega Saturn: A- Man, what an underrated system. I picked this system up
cheap. The reason why I purchased this system was for it's RPG's as well
as Virtua Fighter. I am very happy with this system, and some of it's
niche games are great.
--
-Socheath
s....@ix.netcom.com
or
st97...@pip.cc.brandeis.edu
AOL IM: Sochtes
In a world of indesicive people,
it's nice to have choices.
Ed Giangrande
bombardment, still had some killer games I love today.. If you have one
now, its kinda almost like having a cheap 80s arcade..
NES: A: everyone seems to be giving the NES a hard time, but I'd like
to think of all the great and positive things the system had to offer.
There were too many great games to even name, and many still today have
more depth than current 32 and 64 bit games..
SMS: A-: Too bad this system didn't take off as much since I really
liked the games.. In maybe some other word in Sliders that hasn't been
taken over by the Chromags, maybe this system was king..
Game Boy: A: Hard to beat as the best system available in my mind.
Great games on the Go, low battery usage, color comming on the way, and
pretty cheap to boot. Portable gaming systems are the best systems to
own since they only really lack killer multi-player, then again, even
most consoles suffer from that too..
Game Gear: B: Needed some more games albeit the ones it had were pretty
darn goodlooking.. I think If it cost less, it would have beaten the
GameBoy... but at such a high cost compared to GB, it was kinda doomed
to be second best..
Lynx: B: Heck, this system has some killer games on teh Go, but just
never took off.. i love the fact it has the actual Ninja Gaiden and not
that NES crap for the title.. I also like STUN runner, gauntley, and a
bunch of the other well knon games it has.. however, too few titles and
not long enough in the stores.. Coulda picked them up with 4 games at
one point at EB as well if you were lucky for under $60...
Genesis: A: Quite possibly the best mix of games for any system. Sports
games changed forever on this system.
SNES: A-: While I think toward the end it started to show in games like
DKC that it WAS the better 16 bit system, it all happened too late for
my tastes.. Initial line-up, and that SF2 game really made this an
awesome system, but it really lacked the sports until late.. It also
had a huge graphical edge in some manners that was unused, and never
really had the answer for the speed on Sonic (which maybe the only
reason now that Blast Processing still remains in my mind).. Mario Kart
is still the best game on that system in my mind, and is tough to knock
out of the 'top games of all time list' in my book..
TG-16: INC: Sadly, When I started to really play the games, the system
was dying.. then again, I still think this system quite possibly had
the best overall shooters available for total colors and such.. just
not enough 'name' games I guess..
TG Express: INC: Nice idea to be able to use the same games, bad that
it cost WAY WAY too much.
Neo Geo (cart): D-: I'm only not failing this system because I REALLY
REALLY LOVED the games (and the arcade machines that had the memory
card slots and the headphones) GREAT ideas!.. however, it cost WAY WAY
WAY WAY too much, and for a game to cost $250 minimum is crazy..
NOMAD: INC: Gotta love the Price now, and it has a ton more games than
people think cause it plays most genesis titles.. somewhat small of a
screen and high battery usage.. nice effort though.
Saturn: B+: I think It would have been my best system if it had just
lasted longer than 2 and a half years.. Sega games carried this system
and really had NO EQUAL in my book compared to the competition, but 3rd
party games just didn't arrive.. However, the system's death has
created a lot of cheap titles to buy, which pumps up the grade a bit
when you consider i got COTA, Wipeout, NightWarriors, SFA2, Bust a Move
2, Nights, Daytona CCE, and VC for $5 each... deals like that don't
come around too often..
PSX: A- : I think for popularity and number of titles alone, this
system has to be given the highest grade of all the next Gen systems..
It isn't soo much that i personally liked all of the games, but there
were enough ones that I did like that I liked soo much that I think in
the ends it justifies the system despite the crap it also had. It was
cost effective and gave people good gaming at a good price, and is
still going fairly well..
N64: B: For now at least, I think this system is lucky I'm being this
kind.. I think it is a two way road... On one hand, I'd be crazy to
think that N64 is even close to having the total number of great games
it needs to survive, then again I'd be crazy not to think that of the
actual games on the system, it does have some real knockouts. I also
think it is a huge step for multi-player games that teh system has 4
slots on the front. Multi-player saves this system from a C, and
possibly a good showing by Zelda and NFL Blitz as well as Cruisin World
and WWF Warzone might bump this to an A- by years end in my book..
Jaguar: INC: I loved being able to buy one of these for $30 and getting
games for $5 a pop (reminds me now of saturn).. I think some of the
great games will always be classics in my book, but at this time, most
of the best games on this system havce actually been done better on
other next-gen systems.. Too bad though, since I liked the feel of the
controller despite its many small buttons on the keypad..
3DO: INC: It had some really good games, but like Saturn, failed
because i think it just simply cost too much.. However, at least saturn
had some better titles and still lasts in importing games.. 3DO kinda
is gone.. I would give a grade but I'm tired of writing anymore..
any that i missed? (aside from most Atari systems, etc)..
JO1317
PSX- Great system with many games but not to many exiting. Crappy hardware (
its uncomfortable) bad cd skipping and load times. Good RPGs. Huge library.Has
a bright future
B
saturn-awesome systems in many ways but with faults. Not many games compared to
PSX. The machines dying. Great innovative and fun games with morals. Awesome
RPGs. The system has short load times and no cd skipping. Very very good
hardware
B+
Nintendo 64-Good system. Its all right with exeptionally good games with better
grapghics.Low amount ofRPGs. cartridge based system.
C+
Marty Chinn
Nintendo 8 bit - A+
What can I say, this is what got me into video gaming. I played plenty of
arcades, Atari at my cousin's house, games on my old Apple ][+, etc, but
it really wasn't until the NES that I got to where I am today. That
system triggered my view on video games, as well as starting I guess what
is a hobby, if not potentially a life. Great variations on different
genres, definite classics all over the system.
Sega Master System - D
There were some good games on it like Phantasy Star, and it technically
was the better system, but really the games just didn't draw me in. Some
good ones that I can appreciate now, but not enough.
Genesis - B+, C-
Sega's best success in the US. They took the fire from Nintendo and gave
them a run for their money. The first true competition for Nintendo as
well as supplying an assortment of good games, not to mention great
sports titles. B+ is for the US, the C- is for the Japanese side where it
didn't do so well. They pulled dead even with the SNES for some time but
eventually the SNES pulled ahead.
SNES - A-, A-
The SNES was nintendo's successor to the NES. Just about everything you
could expect from a follow up to their system. More powerful hardware
overall, except for the slower CPU, great graphics that were a step up
above the Genesis, not to mention the sound. They came through in the
end, and in my opinion had a better selection of quality games. Square,
Nintendo, Capcom, etc. Come on it had Street Fighter 2 for how long as an
exclusive? Even from its release it had instant classics. Super Mario
World, F-Zero, Street Fighter 2, Final Fantasy 2, Contra 3, Castlevania 4....
It deserves an A- for both the US and in Japan.
PC Engine/Turbo Grafx 16 - C-, A-/B+
NEC made plenty of mistakes in the US release, but they did release some
good games here. However where it shines is the system in Japan. As an
anime fan, I liked the assortment of games based off them. Not all of
them were great games but combined with the CD-ROM it added to the
experience. Not to mention this was the first system to have a CD-ROM and
my first experience with a CD game. Ys Book 1 and 2 and JB Harold Murder
Club were just beyond anything I had experienced before. Afterall look
what you had to compare it to, NES and just barely the Mega
Drive/Genesis. It looked and especially sounded better than anything
available. Great games, but more of a niche in the US for those who
imported. It did beat out the Mega Drive in Japan, and did fairly well
against the Super Famicom. C- for its bad support in the US, but I'm torn
between an A- and B+ for its Japanese release. I'm leaning toward higher
because it was the best of its time, the first CD-ROM system and really
the first time to experience a CD game. B+ since it really didn't have
nearly as many good games as the Super Famicom/SNES.
3DO - D-
3DO had some decent games to it, but lacked in several areas, had an
expensive price tag, and died a moderate death. Easily some games worth
playing at the time. Too bad despite the hype, and the misleading
developer listing, it never got any further.
Jaguar - F
Must we really say more? The Jaguar was a failure. I loved Alien vs
Predator, Tempest 2000 and Iron Soldier, but not much beyond that. It
really lacked in all areas. Not a huge leap, some things looked plain
ugly, lacked games, the list goes on and on.
Sega CD - C-, F
Sega CD was Sega's attempt at a CD based system following the PC
Engine's. It did pretty poorly in Japan, thus the F grade, and did ok
here, but still not that great. At least several games worth owning came
out stateside. Snatcher, Lunar, Lunar Eternal Blue, Sonic CD (although
the Mega CD version was MUCH better), and so forth. Compared to the PC
Engine CD though it really lacked in comparison of the assortment of
games in both territories for the Sega CD. Too many cartridge ports with
minor enhancements where as most of teh PC Engine CD games were developed
exclusively for the CD, which took advantage of it.
32X - F
From the first day I saw it at CES behind closed doors, I knew it would
fail. The leap wasn't nearly as much as people hoped, the Saturn had just
come out in Japan, lack of games, too many ports, it was a complete
failure.
Saturn - C-, B
The Saturn had a bad launch here but tried to keep up and had an
assortment of titles that were crossplatformed, but Sega of America just
screwed things up. The system did go out with a bang with its final
selection of titles. In Japan it faired much better, being Sega's most
successful console in Japan, however once FF7 hit, it went on a steady
decline from keeping up with the PlayStation. Saturn being the better of
the two systems for 2D, having great SNK and Capcom ports, not to mention
kick ass 4 meg RAM cart games. It did fall a bit short in the 3D area,
while improved greatly, just couldn't keep up with the PlayStation which
has the slight edge.
PlayStation - A, A
Where to begin? Sony came in, and cleaned up. They pretty much took
Nintendo's role in the 32 bit/next generation race. They have games in
every genre with likely a game that will fit you in its respective genre.
Classic ports, arcade ports, arcade perfect ports, 2D, plenty of 3D, all
typical genres, niche genres, innovating genres, you name it, they just
about had it. Gran Turismo and the upcoming Metal Gear Solid mark a high
level of the PlayStation's life. Great periphials such as the NeGcon,
Guncon, and Dual Shock Controller. Not to mention the things Sony did for
the US market. Pushing RPGs, which now seem to be appearing and getting
more press than ever before. Lowering prices on CD games to as low as $30
to $35 for first party games. Average price though being $35 to $40 for
first party and $45 to $50 for third party. Sony has also brought over a
bunch of niche titles, as well as third parties doing so. Just about
anything that sells fairly well in Japan now gets ported without much
question. PaRappa the RApper and Mina No Golf are two examples. The
biggest spot on Sony's record though is the skipping CD drive which just
about everyone is aware of. While not happening to everyone, it does
happen more often than it should from a typical defect rate. Thankfully
mine hasn't yet, but the problem is there. I think the good still
outweighs the problem though. We'll have to see if Square remains in
their corner for the next round. If so you could see a repeat.
Nintendo 64 - D, F
Check back to 1994 and 1995. I was quite a big supporter of the N64.
Thinking Nintendo could pull off what they have done with their last two
systems. Boy was I wrong and boy was I disappointed. I first played Mario
64 at E3 1995 and was simply amazed. I decided to not wait and import a
system upon release. I did so and enjoyed Mario 64 and Pilotwings a lot.
Several months later came Wave Race 64, the third game, and it was great
too. From there it started to fall apart. Games got delayed, developers
were hesitant, prices were somewhat higher on games, and the lack of
selection to choose from. While enjoying a healthy 6 months in Japan and
excellent sales during Christmas in the US, things simply didn't get
better. In the US it remained pretty popular, mostly from hype, but in
Japan the lack of games hurt them bad. The N64 is all but dead in Japan,
which is why I gave it an F there. Sales are pretty slow, and simply no
interest there. There are about 80 games in the US right now, and
releases have picked up a little bit, but still after 2 years, releases
are slow, the game library is still small given the time frame, and up
until F-Zero and Banjo Kazooie, the last game worth buying was a year
ago, Goldeneye. That was the last game I bought before these two. I
considered Diddy Kong Racing, and while its first player mode was
excellent, its replayability didn't hold well. I play games regardless of
what system is on, and with a lack of games, I have to grade the system
low in the US. That doesn't mean there arne't games worth owning. Mario
64, Goldeneye, ISS64, Wave Race, and F-Zero are easily worth owning as a
few others, but the system still lacks games. To date after two years,
they still are missing games in some genres, and those that do have one
game in their genre, several genres have yet still get even a decent game
in that genre. I've played every N64 game, be it US or Japanese, so I
know what's out there, and its not much. Tis a shame as Nintendo and
Miyamoto are two icons I respect a lot. I supported them greatly during
the NES days, and the SNES. I even supported the N64, until the end of
1995 when I realized they fell through and things weren't getting better.
Neo Geo - B-
What can I say, I really like my Neo Geo. To be fair though, due to the
pricing of the games, it has kept my library small, but it does have
several gems. The original Bust A Move of course, not to mention other
games which I consider to be classics. Personally I got the system as a
result of playing King of Fighters '94. Since then I have bought 95, 96
and 97, and planning on getting 98. Can't beat the original cartridge
versions on any system, even the Saturn. Also Wind Jammers is a nice
addition to my collection and League Bowling is fun in a group of people.
I still need to get games like Crossed Swords. Despite the dated
hardware, it still gives current systems a run for its money and still
keeps up in the arcades. Neo Geo Cartridge is a great system if you can
afford it and like their games. I only gave it a somewhat bad score due
to its game selection and pricing.
Game Boy - A
Geez look how long this thing has lasted. Its been ages. Its still going
strong. Now with the Color Game Boy, it looks like it will be lasting
even longer. A small, low battery consumption, great library of games,
and the best way to play Tetris against someone anywhere. What's great
is the enhanced screen on the recent Pocket Game Boy. Great
for going just about anywhere, especially long plane rides to Japan. =)
Game Gear - C
My biggest gripe was the screen. The size of the unit i could deal with
but sometimes the screen was a pain to look at. A medium sized library of
games, with some good ones such as Shining Force. Unfortunately it just
kinda died out without any notice.
Nomad - B+
A great system, better screen than the Game Gear. Plays just about any
Genesis game and is portable. What more can you want? Only bad point is
it sucks up batteries quickly. Too bad there was never a portable SNES.
Turbo Express/PC Engine GT - A-
This is the most common known PC Engine/Turbo Grafx portable system. It
was the shape of a Game Boy, but slightly bigger. It played all hu card
games, and had an excellent screen quality to it.
PC Engine LT - A+
A rare portable system that most people don't know about. Its in my
opinion the best portable system ever released. Its small, folds in half
like a mini laptop. About the sizze of two double jewel cases stacked on
top of each other when folded. It had an 4.5" active matrix color screen,
built in controller, port for external controller, port for CD-ROM
attachment, video input, built in tv tuner, the works. Its also one of
the rarest video game items I know of. Excellent for playing games such
as Gradius. Again, easily the best portable system ever releaed. Too bad
its so rare that most will never get to see one. Not to be confused with
the above PC Engine GT/Turbo Express.
Virtual Boy - F
Nintendo's worst failure. Not many games, not color, not very portable.
It just bombed. Not much needs to be said about this.
And that just about covers it for all the systems I own. I hope at least
=) Any comments? I know its pretty long.
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marty Chinn ** E3 - May 28 - 30, 1998 **
Video Source PlayStation, Nintendo 64, Saturn, Imports
973 Foxglove Dr. M-F: 9:30-6:00, Sa: 10:00-3:00 PST, Sun: Closed
Sunnyvale, CA 94086 Ordering, and Preordering info at:
<408> 720-8575 Voice E-Mail: vids...@netcom.com
<408> 720-8576 FAX WWW : http://www.video-source.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Black
Jeez, where do you find the $$$ to buy so many systems?
Do you think Square developing for the PC is a result of Sony's RPG
push into the US mainstream?
>Lowering prices on CD games to as low as $30
>to $35 for first party games. Average price though being $35 to $40 for
>first party and $45 to $50 for third party.
My comment is that Sony also forced Nintendo to lower their prices
too. If it weren't for the PSX, knowing Nintendo, they would gladly
charge us $80-100 for a game and get away with it.
I started this thread, and here is the only place where I disagree
with you. Sure the games aren't much, but what's there is very
playable and most of the time, technically amazing. Plus, the N64 was
the first to use combination analogue/digital controllers and
Rumble/Shock packs. I gave the PSX and N64 both an A-.
Woah. Is there anything video game related you haven't owned?
Craig B.
PSX:
Early PSX's where faulty and just lately have been repaired.
Software wise, the system has a huge library but, *alot* of games are
garbage. Not all games are bad in fact there are many good games. I never
really liked the controllers. The sound quality is good. Many RPG's coming
out. The system still has a future.
Overall: B
Sega Saturn:
You have to be a Sega fan to own this system. Some people may not realize
it but, Saturn has a huge variety of software. RPG's, Shooter, 3D and 2D
fighters, Racing etc.
The sound is good on the system. The system isn't faulty like the old PSX
systems. I like the controllers, especially the original Japanese
controller/ newer Saturn pack-in controller. Optional modem! Imports can be
played with a cart. Some negatives are:
Some Programmers took a while to learn how to make games that look as good
as Sega's. The system only has a handful of US games coming out.
Overall: For a non-Sega fan C. For me I'd give it a A.
N64:
When the system first came out I'd give it a C- or a D. But, just up until
recently we are finally seeing what the system can do for once. Turok 2,
Perfect Dark, F-ZeroX, Zelda, all show that the system is worthy of
purchase. I personally love playing 4-player games on this system.
Goldeneye and others are pretty fun with some friends. Sound quality has
been surprising for me. I expected it to be crappy compared to my Sat & PSX
but, it actually sounds pretty good sometimes. I honestly think that if
Nintendo chose CD that there would be much more games available and they
might even look better. But, I can live with carts. I sold my N64 a few
months after I received my pre-ordered system. Now, I'm thinking of picking
up one again.
Overall: B
(I have been disappointed with some of the PSX to N64 ports, some of the
graphics actually look better or the same on PSX, In the Zone '98, and some
others)
SNES & Genesis get A's baby! These two systems are great and the have tons
and tons of games. Alot of games can't be surpassed in the fun department,
and alot of the games and the systems themselves can be found pretty cheap
now! SNES and Genesis have great RPG's (Some would say even better than all
of the 32-bit ones) and the shier variety of titles is amazing. Both are
excellent systems. Low color pallet for the Genesis? No problem. Play any
Sonic game or Lost World: Jurassic Park and see if you notice! The 16-bit
days where an absolute blast for me and it's a pity to see them go.
More ratings coming soon:
Turbo Grafx-16, Game Gear, Game Boy/Pocket, Neo Geo.
--
CraigB....
~~~Star Wars & SEGA return in '99~~~
Feel the power!
to...@no_spam.com
systems. Most of these ratings take into account the initial list price
and various market factors... I couldn't be bothered, since I never made
enough money back in the early days of the TurboExpress to buy one new.
:)
GamebBoy vs. TurboExpress: many people can rightly point out the large
number of GB games widely available to the general public, but nothing
beats my memory of playing Devil's Crush in full frigging color and super
sound. Or Blazing Lazers, or Parasol Stars, or Time Cruise... too bad the
TE and NEC didn't prevail. I could care less about the GB's entire
history.
Mark & Michelle Wood
NES : C -- I got this system originally during the same times that I had a
C64 and later after I got my Amiga. Aside from Super Mario, Base Wars, and
Hogan's Alley, nothing else really seemed to matter on this system. The
controllers were too tiny, also.
SNES : B -- This system has some great titles that I still love to play
like Looney Tunes Basketball. Capcom's X-Men Mutant Apocalypse was another
great title. NBA Live 95 on SNES was the very first Live and plays
differently (actually better) than the rest of the series. My only real
problem with this system is the lousy controllers, generally poor sports
games compared to Genesis, and few non-sports multiplayer titles. Despite
being released later than Genesis, it seemed to have very few games that
actually looked a lot better.
Genesis : A -- Probably the best system I've owned to date. It has many
great sports titles and the original Madden is why I bought it! It seemed
to handle multiplayer games much better than SNES, too. It also had a lot
more titles in the "other" category and more strategy titles. I do like
other systems better now but this was the only "popular" system that I've
really liked. The 6-button controller was the first gamepad I really
liked.
SegaCD : C -- This system had so much wasted potential. If Sega could've
gotten off the FMV kick, they could have made more of the titles that
showed what it could really do. There were some really great RPG's,
adventure, and old-fashioned 3D titles (like Thunderstrike). It was the
first system that I'd ever heard voice used extensively (Rise of the
Dragon) and it really hit me what could be done with a CD. Other titles
like Eternal Champions CD showed the raw storage power since it's literally
packed with characters, cinemas, story, etc. I never really felt like Sega
failed to support this system since I was getting new games for it for a
couple of years. The real problem with it was that it was too expensive
and not enough people had one to garner real support.
32X : D -- If not for a few good titles, I would probably rate this system
a failure. But Virtua Fighter, Virtua Racing, Doom, and Shadow Squadron
were all way ahead of what my Genesis/SegaCD or SNES could do at that time.
But it's still basically a failure for me because not long after those
games, Sega decided to dump it. I think it got a lot of false press (too
hard to hook up? C'mon!) and it was actually selling for $80 (with a $20
rebate or even $40 if you bought VF), not the $150 that was still being
said in the summer of 1995.
Jaguar : D -- This system has a lot more power than most games showed.
Most games were unfortunately crap but when you look at Id's games, you can
see that the system had a lot of potential. In fact, the first person
shooters are/were the only reason to really own this system outside of Iron
Soldier unless you really liked the classics.
Saturn : B -- I love this system. I still think it has the best fighting
and racing games. I love the Netlink and games. The controllers, digital
and analog, are great designs. I didn't really find it lacking that much
in games that I prefer. But the lack of support in stores really bites,
hence the lower grade.
Playstation : B -- This system has some really great games. I don't feel
as strongly about it because of the fighting games available (though yes,
some I do like). It's finally gotten away from Ridge Racer being the most
popular racer (thankfully) and better racers are coming out. I like the
fact that it has the more unusual titles like Carnage Heart or Armored
Core. I've yet to find a controller that I really like for this system.
Lynx : D -- Despite having one of the best multiplayer games for any system
(6 player Battlewheels), this system just doesn't have that much else that
I like. Some of the early titles were so very good (like Electrocop) but
most everything else has been downhill from there. This system actually
had the potential for some great network games since besides the 8 player
network, it also had a decent sized color screen to make these games on.
Gameboy : F -- I know that everybody loves this thing but I just couldn't
get into it. I could live with the B&W screen but it's just too small for
me to comfortably make things out. The controls and sound were awful.
Nomad : B -- Since I already had a full library, this was a great idea in
my case. Most games adapt well to it's generously sized color screen and
sound with earphones is great. Control is pretty good though the unit is a
bit bulky. The fact that it can also be used with a TV makes it a great
system to take to someone's house. My only real complaint is that it
should have a port 1. Without it, you are forced to play it with the built
in control even with a TV (and no option to turn off the built in screen to
save juice). Also, with no port 1, you can't use EA's multiplayer adapter
for any of it's 4-player sports games. Battery life is short but usually
anywhere I take it there is an outlet handy (or cig. lighter in the car) so
it's never really been a problem. If Sega could have added 32X capability
then they could have continued to make new games for it. Okay, it would've
been too expensive but I would sure like to play VF32X on the go. I wish
Nintendo had allowed the portable SNES (made by a third party) to hit the
market. Heck, even the portable NES would be better than the Gameboy, IMO.
Skid
kwarlord
John Black wrote in message <35bfe532...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...>wrote:
>
>>
>>John Black wrote in message <35be8d84...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
(snip)
>>>SNES: A
>>>The most impressive technical capabilities of it's day, a slew of
>>>killer games, what else do you need?
>>>
>>
>>Final Fantasy 2 (Japan)
>>Final Fanrasy 3 (Japan)
>>Final Fantasy 5 (Japan)
>>
>>***knocks on the head of the president of Squaresoft***
>>HELLO, MCFLY?!
>
>Blame Americans for not liking RPGs as much as the Japanese.
>
So now that RPGs are the "greatest things since sliced bread" I ask you,
WHERE THE F#CK ARE THEY?!
I still think that Squaresoft are the most racist little.......
>>you forgot:
>>
>>Gameboy: A+
>>The perfect little toy to take with you for waiting rooms! You can also
play
>>those tiny games on your TV thanks to the good old Super Gameboy adapter!
>
>Never owned a Gameboy, so that's why I left it out.
your loss.
Marty Chinn
: >Welp here are mine based on the systems I own:
: Jeez, where do you find the $$$ to buy so many systems?
Heh its all over a long period of time =) Although its not the systems
that add up in cost, its the games, sigh.
: Do you think Square developing for the PC is a result of Sony's RPG
: push into the US mainstream?
Maybe. Its either that or Square simply testing the waters. Maybe its a
combination of both. Hard to pinpoint the reasoning behind it.
: >Nintendo 64 - D, F
I think Nintendo hasn't done very well. Ignore system sales, and simply
compare the Nintendo 64 to the SNES and NES. Nintendo has really dropped
the ball in the transition. The way they do things, their presence in the
market, and so forth all has dropped big time. They're all but dead in
Japan, and not even Zelda at this point can save them there. So I think
the F in Japan is valid, and based on comparing great hits of the SNES
and NES, 80 games in 2 years, its a pretty pathetic showing for the once
mighty Nintendo. Plus the software gaps are just unbarable at times. Sure
some of the games are technically amazing for a console system, of course
ignoring PC 3DFX, but when you have games like Metal Gear Solid
impressing me more than most games on the N64, you know the step isn't
that big, or development isn't that good as it could have been as well as
what you would expect out of Nintendo. Of course Nintendo and Rare games
tend to be top notch, but you don't have much outside of that. Out of the
games I own, Mario 64, Wave Race 64, Pilotwings 64, Mario Kart 64, Star
Fox 64, F-Zero X, Banjo Kazooie, Goldeneye, ISS64, Shadows of the Empire,
Bomberman, Tetrisphere, and NBA Hamgtime, only 4 of those are third party
and the rest are first and second party games. I think that's all the
games I have right now. The third party support is obviously lacking
hard. If I had the SNES and never another system, I'd be fine, if I had
the NES alone, and never another system, I'd be fine. Same goes for
Saturn or PlayStation. However with the N64, I simply couldn't last with
the way they are releasing games. Not to mention again, 2 years and they
don't even have all genres filled, let alone a quality game in each
genre. That's a long time to have gaps. So I stand by my grading. My
purchase plans for the rest of this year, without seeing anything after
this year being worthy of buying yet, would be Zelda, Blitz, Perfect
Dark, and Turok 2.
: Woah. Is there anything video game related you haven't owned?
A Super Grafx would be nice in my collection =) Also I've never had a FM
Towns Marty or a PC FX. But I don't plan on getting those. Oh yeah never
had a Lynx. Other than that, I think I've owned all the systems from NES
on.
Raymond McKeithen II
Marty Chinn wrote in message ...
>A Super Grafx would be nice in my collection =) Also I've never had a FM
>Towns Marty or a PC FX. But I don't plan on getting those. Oh yeah never
>had a Lynx. Other than that, I think I've owned all the systems from NES
>on.
>--
(both my systems are in their boxes in a closet). But shouldn't you have a
Marty because it's named after you? ;)
remove *2* nospam's for email...
Raymond
Blarg Yort
First of all, the guy only did systems he owned.
Second, I agree with his evaluation of the SNES. There really wasn't
alot of slowdown in the latter half of its life.
Overall, his look seemed accurate and unbiased.
Mike
Plus the software gaps are just unbarable at times.
unbearable
(snip {took a long time to say "i own"})
Mario Kart 64
wasn't mario Kart better on SNES anyway? thats what i heard
kwarlord
John wrote in message <35c2828...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
>>>Blame Americans for not liking RPGs as much as the Japanese.
>>>
>>So now that RPGs are the "greatest things since sliced bread" I ask you,
>>WHERE THE F#CK ARE THEY?!
>
>that, for the chargin of American RPG fans, that they aren't as
>popular stateside as in Japan. I would just import them, and sign up
>for the Japanese class next semester...
Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
kwarlord
John wrote in message <35c2a33...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
>>Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
>>upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
>
been living under a rock for the past 3 years? I am talking about: Breath of
Fire 3, Grandstream Saga, Alundra, Saga Frontier, Lunar, and more I can't
think of right now. And these RPGs have been (or will be) released THIS
year. And there are also the Strategy/RPG hybrids I haven't even mentioned
yet.
you closed minded little.....
Marty Chinn
: Marty Chinn wrote in message ...
: >A Super Grafx would be nice in my collection =) Also I've never had a FM
: >Towns Marty or a PC FX. But I don't plan on getting those. Oh yeah never
: >had a Lynx. Other than that, I think I've owned all the systems from NES
: >on.
: >--
: I have an FM-Towns Marty and a PC-FX. Believe me, you haven't missed much
: (both my systems are in their boxes in a closet). But shouldn't you have a
: Marty because it's named after you? ;)
Heh that's the reason I don't plan on getting either one =) I haven't
seen a game I really wanted. Heh if you don't want it, would you let them
go for cheap? =)
: remove *2* nospam's for email...
: Raymond
John
John
>that add up in cost, its the games, sigh.
Yeah, that's where the system makers pull in the $$$. No wonder they
cut the price of the systems so often.
>Maybe. Its either that or Square simply testing the waters. Maybe its a
>combination of both. Hard to pinpoint the reasoning behind it.
Speaking of that, are they planning on bringing FF8 to the PC?
I'm not saying you're wrong or anything, I'm just saying I gave the
N64 a higher grade because I'm more impressed with the titles I own.
I agree with you, if I had the N64 only, I would go insane. And the
gaps are pretty bad, as for your comment about it not living up to
it's potential, I think it's the development for the games rather than
the hardware. Nintendo is the dictionary definition of control
freaks, and they only insist on releasing titles that they think would
do well with a younger American audience, and fulfilling the
hardware's power be damned. (Some notable exceptions notwithstanding)
However, I do think Nintendo's misfortunes are the result of the
stubborness of their management, and their control freakishness.
to...@no_spam.com
> My ratings for the systems I own : [snip]
> Saturn : B -- I love this system. I still think it has the best
> fighting and racing games.
Fighting games, sure. Even though I'm not one to really comment on
them since I suck at them. :) Racing games? This is probably a highly
subjective matter, but I haven't yet seen racers on Saturn that would
persuade me to forget my PlayStation.
> I love the Netlink and games. The controllers, digital and analog, are
> great designs.
The 2nd-gen pad with rounder curves and edges is indeed quite a nice one.
The 3D analog pad, however, does nothing special for me.
> I didn't really find it lacking that much in games that I prefer.
If only they had brought over more 2D shooters to North America, I might
be a more fervent Saturn player... Right now, VC2 and Last Gladiators
Pinball are the main reasons for my continued Saturn ownership.
> Playstation : B -- [snip] I've yet to find a controller that I really
> like for this system.
This may be because there is no one pad designed well enough to handle all
tasks for all people. For racing, I will always go back to my faithful
neGcon, assuming the game supports it (thank HEAVENS Gran Turismo does).
No Saturn controller I ever used was able to give me this much
satisfaction.
Maybe my Mad Catz Dual Force is in the mail - I'll have to try it and form
opinions.
> I wish Nintendo had allowed the portable SNES (made by a third party) to
> hit the market.
Oh, MAN!!!! Would I ever have enjoyed this little piece. But of course,
Nintendo has to play control freak and stifle any real creativity from
outsiders.
> Heck, even the portable NES would be better than the Gameboy, IMO.
Was such a thing ever created or even proposed?
John
Benjamin
looking, but none the less a "portable" NES). I forget the magazine(s) which
included the photographs/sketches, but it was a third party company who
designed it, and, as we know, Nintendo doesn't care much for third party
companies producing hardware (ie., Galoob).
Benjamin
toto@no_spam.com wrote:
<snip>
> > Heck, even the portable NES would be better than the Gameboy, IMO.
>
Jesse Dorland
wrote:
>>Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
>>upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
>
>What upsurge?
There *has* been an "upsurge" of American RPG releases in the last seven
months or so. Off the top of my head:
Final Fantasy Tactics (debatable whether or not this is an RPG)
Tactics Ogre (ditto)
SaGa Frontier
Alundra
Azure Dreams
The Granstream Saga
Breath of Fire 3
Quest 64
Shining Force 3
Panzer Dragoon Saga
Compare that to the American RPG releases in the last six months of 1997
-- unless I'm forgetting something (which is entirely possible), Final
Fantasy 7 was the only console RPG released in the second half of last
year.
And what about the six months before that? There was Wild ARMs, Shining
the Holy Ark, and not a whole lot else. Before that? Suikoden.
There's definitely been a large increase in the number of RPGs that make
it stateside.
-Jesse
====================================================
Jesse Dorland
jessedorland AT hotmail DOT com
10268731 on ICQ
34189 on EGN
====================================================
Nick Zitzmann
jessedorlan...@BEFOREMAILINGhotmail.com wrote:
:) There *has* been an "upsurge" of American RPG releases in the last seven
:) months or so. Off the top of my head:
:)
:) Final Fantasy Tactics (debatable whether or not this is an RPG)
:) Tactics Ogre (ditto)
:) SaGa Frontier
:) Alundra
:) Azure Dreams
:) The Granstream Saga
:) Breath of Fire 3
:) Quest 64
:) Shining Force 3
:) Panzer Dragoon Saga
I'd dispute some of those. FF Tactics and Tactics Ogre are more strategy
than RPG. I haven't played Azure Dreams, but it sounds like a Moria-style
dungeon hack. Alundra and Quest 64 are more like adventure games, not real
RPGs.
Nick Zitzmann
(Macintosh Forever! PSX Rules!)
Warning! People who send me UCE will be reported to the state!
To see my real signature, finger my E-Mail address.
<http://www.lut.fi/htbin/finger?nick...@eskimo.com>
AtomX80
>jessedorlan...@BEFOREMAILINGhotmail.com wrote:
>
> :) There *has* been an "upsurge" of American RPG releases in the last seven
> :) months or so. Off the top of my head:
> :)
> :) Final Fantasy Tactics (debatable whether or not this is an RPG)
> :) Tactics Ogre (ditto)
> :) SaGa Frontier
> :) Alundra
> :) Azure Dreams
> :) The Granstream Saga
> :) Breath of Fire 3
> :) Quest 64
> :) Shining Force 3
> :) Panzer Dragoon Saga
>
>I'd dispute some of those. FF Tactics and Tactics Ogre are more strategy
>than RPG. I haven't played Azure Dreams, but it sounds like a Moria-style
>dungeon hack. Alundra and Quest 64 are more like adventure games, not real
>RPGs.
>
True, but the principal still stands. RPG's and tactical strat games have
gotten a lot more accpetance over the past few years. 5 years ago, a game like
Tactics ogre probably would never have been released here. Actually, it wasn't,
not the SNES version at least.............
«-----¤•À†ÖM•¤-----»™
John
>
>been living under a rock for the past 3 years? I am talking about: Breath of
>Fire 3, Grandstream Saga, Alundra, Saga Frontier, Lunar, and more I can't
>think of right now. And these RPGs have been (or will be) released THIS
>year. And there are also the Strategy/RPG hybrids I haven't even mentioned
>yet.
Haven't heard of any of these games. And what about all the RPGs
released for the SNES? And Genesis for that matter? The PC has had a
healthy RPG market for years. Anyway, I'm not trying to knock a
genre, RPG's have an avid following stateside, as evidenced by people
here. But they aren't as popular as other genres, which explains some
companies' (Nintendo) emphasis on sports when people have been crying
for RPGs for their system.
Occupant
> Nomad: B+ Would've gotten an A if Ms Pac-Man worked on it!
I have both a Nomad AND the Genesis Ms Pac-Man cartridge. *IT WORKS*.
All you have to do to get it to work is hold down the MODE button on the
Nomad until you see the title screen of the game. This is even
mentioned in the Nomad's instructions (that some games will not
recognize the 6 button controls and will only work properly with the 3
button controls). Holding down the Mode button puts the Nomad in 3
button control mode. I've played this title on the Nomad, I know this
works.
But you already mentioned you had a Lynx and there is a Ms Pac-Man for
that as well....
--
"He who stands for nothing will fall for anything." (author unknown)
Occupant
> > Heck, even the portable NES would be better than the Gameboy, IMO.
>
> Was such a thing ever created or even proposed?
Yes, I remember when it was being talked about in the game mags some
years ago. Nintendo never let it happen.
kwarlord
John wrote in message <35c316c...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
I see your point, but I still don't entirely agree with it. Even if the
16-bit era had a good dosage of RPGs, they are still gaining momentum in the
32 and 64 bit systems of the here and now. Why else would Namco take a big
gamble and release Tales of Destiny?
Look at it this way, half a dozen good RPGs in this year alone is a MILLION
times better than another bland game Like Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest making
a MOCKERY of the American diehard RPGer!
___________________________________________________
(begin alt.games.final-fantasy .sig parody)
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Member of the Kult of Kefka
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http://members.tripod.com/~kwarlord/index.html
HAVE A NICE DAY!- Mankind from the WWF
___________________________________________________
John
>16-bit era had a good dosage of RPGs, they are still gaining momentum in the
>32 and 64 bit systems of the here and now. Why else would Namco take a big
>gamble and release Tales of Destiny?
>
>Look at it this way, half a dozen good RPGs in this year alone is a MILLION
>times better than another bland game Like Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest making
>a MOCKERY of the American diehard RPGer!
True. By the way, what's Final Fantasy Tactics like? Havn't tried
it. Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest, wasn't that the coined "RPG for
kids" that came out for some Nintendo system a while back?
kwarlord
John wrote in message <35c364ab...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
Final Fantasy Tactics is a well-made strategy game. you should buy it as
soon as possible.
no, Mystic Quest was coined as "RPG for us stupid lazy Americans" (this is
what Squaresoft thought of us at the time).
Joshua Kaufman
>
> kwarlord wrote in message <6q089f$k8n$1...@news.cmc.net>...
> >
> >Final Fantasy Tactics is a well-made strategy game. you should buy it as
> >soon as possible.
>
> "predecessor", Tactics Ogre. Inferior because of fewer units to control,
> smaller maps (which equals less strategy, the whole point). In the US
> everyone seems to prefer it because TO "looks like a 16 bit game". Once
> again graphics win out over gameplay in the US market; the "graphics
> whores(tm)" win again.
I never had a problem with the graphics...I liked them.
But, I personally liked FFT better because it has horrible button
configuration, those annoying little load time (yes, I know the SFam
version didn;t have them), the insanly difficult beginning, and a few
other minor things.
> >
> >no, Mystic Quest was coined as "RPG for us stupid lazy Americans" (this is
> >what Squaresoft thought of us at the time).
> >
> In Japan Mystic Quest was released as "Final Fantasy USA: Mystic Quest"...
>
Actucally, it was just called FF:USA, and relased 10 months after the US
version (because of a petition...)
-Joshua
--
User of the name Aerith... Master bad punner... Composer of 8 opi....
Player of FF series... Worshiper of Nobuo Uematsu... Watcher of Sailor
Moon... Member of the Ellipsis Faction... Proprietor of the ellipsis...
ICQ#: 5404138 AOL-IM: TerraEpon
"Is the whole world going bonkers or is it just me!?!"
- Serena on Sailor Moon (eps. 54)
"As you can see, this is a Playstation black disk. Cut number 1 contains
computer data, so please, don't play it. But you probably won't listen
to me, will you?"
- Alucard, when you put C-SOTN in a CD-player
Ed Giangrande
jessedorlan...@BEFOREMAILINGhotmail.com (Jesse Dorland) writes:
>
>On Sat, 01 Aug 1998 05:10:23 GMT, Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com
(John)
>wrote:
>
>>>Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the
(continuing)
>>>upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
>>
>>What upsurge?
>
>There *has* been an "upsurge" of American RPG releases in the last
seven
>months or so. Off the top of my head:
>
>Final Fantasy Tactics (debatable whether or not this is an RPG)
>Tactics Ogre (ditto)
>SaGa Frontier
>Alundra
>Azure Dreams
>The Granstream Saga
>Breath of Fire 3
>Quest 64
>Shining Force 3
>Panzer Dragoon Saga
>
>Compare that to the American RPG releases in the last six months of
1997
>-- unless I'm forgetting something (which is entirely possible), Final
>Fantasy 7 was the only console RPG released in the second half of last
>year.
>
>And what about the six months before that? There was Wild ARMs,
Shining
>the Holy Ark, and not a whole lot else. Before that? Suikoden.
>There's definitely been a large increase in the number of RPGs that
make
>it stateside.
>
I don't argue that the number of RPGs has increased over the last 6
month, but to say that this isn't just a bit of a coincidence would be
equally as true. RPGs take a while to get out in the US, and perhaps at
least for 3 of those titles, the mere fact they are comming out now is
just a simple matter of timing.. i mean Panzer was basically a 'gift'
game by Sega that honestly didn't have to come out and is based off of
a lot of shooters, and likely sold just on the reputation of past
Panzer games (though I never saw it once out here in stores). Heck, ANY
Saturn RPG wasn't going to sell in huge numbers to begin with, if they
did, i have no doubt we would have seen more.. Quest 64 was a HORRIBLE
RPG that likely was simply rushed out to capitolize on a weak market of
games for N64 and a TOTAL lack of RPGs for the system.. i dunno.. I
think it in some ways is just a matter of luck, and perhaps a rise on
PSX because maybe FF7 got a few people hooked on RPGs that normally
wouldn't have gone near the genre..
Raymond McKeithen II
kwarlord wrote in message <6q089f$k8n$1...@news.cmc.net>...
>
>Final Fantasy Tactics is a well-made strategy game. you should buy it as
>soon as possible.
IMO FFT is a mediocre strategy game that is greatly inferior to it's
"predecessor", Tactics Ogre. Inferior because of fewer units to control,
smaller maps (which equals less strategy, the whole point). In the US
everyone seems to prefer it because TO "looks like a 16 bit game". Once
again graphics win out over gameplay in the US market; the "graphics
whores(tm)" win again.
>
>no, Mystic Quest was coined as "RPG for us stupid lazy Americans" (this is
>what Squaresoft thought of us at the time).
>
In Japan Mystic Quest was released as "Final Fantasy USA: Mystic Quest"...
remove *2* nospam's for email...
Raymond
Nick Zitzmann
Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com (John) wrote:
:) >Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
:) >upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
:)
:) What upsurge?
We all seem to forget the first CRPGs, and still quite a few RPGs these
days, are produced in the United States. Look at the companies which got
the CRPG genre started: Interplay, Origin, whichever company produced
Wizardy, etc... I guess they just don't get as much PR as the Japanese
RPGs do.
I wouldn't call it an "upsurge", but there are still quite a few RPGs
produced statewise. Fallout and Ultima Online are the first two which come
to mind, but there are titles by smaller businesses, such as Realmz and
Exile.
AtomX80
>Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com (John) wrote:
>
> :) >Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
> :) >upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
> :)
> :) What upsurge?
>
>We all seem to forget the first CRPGs, and still quite a few RPGs these
>days, are produced in the United States. Look at the companies which got
>the CRPG genre started: Interplay, Origin, whichever company produced
>Wizardy, etc... I guess they just don't get as much PR as the Japanese
>RPGs do.
>
>I wouldn't call it an "upsurge", but there are still quite a few RPGs
>produced statewise. Fallout and Ultima Online are the first two which come
>to mind, but there are titles by smaller businesses, such as Realmz and
>Exile.
>
Yeah but that was mostly relegated to PC's. This IS a console discussion isn't
it? :-)
Other than that I agree though. CRPG's on the PC have been around since forever
so there is no upsurge in that sense. But for consoles? There have been more
console strat games and RPG's released stateside in the past year than I can
ever remember in the history of consoles.
«-----¤•À†ÖM•¤-----»™
Alan Kwan
<nospamr...@nospamjas.net> wrote:
>
>kwarlord wrote in message <6q089f$k8n$1...@news.cmc.net>...
>>
>>Final Fantasy Tactics is a well-made strategy game. you should buy it as
>>soon as possible.
>
>IMO FFT is a mediocre strategy game that is greatly inferior to it's
>"predecessor", Tactics Ogre. Inferior because of fewer units to control,
>smaller maps (which equals less strategy, the whole point). In the US
>everyone seems to prefer it because TO "looks like a 16 bit game". Once
>again graphics win out over gameplay in the US market; the "graphics
>whores(tm)" win again.
My opinions:
FFT: Colorful job system, but inferior to FF5. Tiresome party
development system (job points), calling for too much 'leveling'
(in terms of job points). Unrealistic and structurally problematic
"4D Battle" system inherited from TO.
TO: Colorful character classes. Weird game balance system, calling
for too much "training", unfriendly, unintuitive, and unrealistic.
Origin of the unrealistic and structurally problematic "NATS" system.
Why do I say that the apparently realistic "NATS/4D Battle" system is
unrealistic? In reality, characters do not act in turns. They act
/continuously/. A fighter doesn't walk forward and then stand there
waiting to be struck down until his next turn: when he is walking,
he holds his weapon in a prepared position so that he strikes no later
than an enemy also walking towards him. Why do strategy games use
turns? As an abstraction so that the game is playable. By
manipulating the turns according to the characters' "speed",
especially in the way of TO/FFT, the game becomes very unrealistic.
The "turn" system is a very abstract abstraction, and NATS within such
abstraction is too much detail. When game designers abstract the
continuous action as "turns", putting in NATS (without extra care as
to realism/structure, such as that found in "The Eternal Dagger") is
taking a step back, and it generates contradictions.
FFT has the colorful job system, but if I want to have fun with a
colorful job system, I would rather play the more concise FF5.
"Live life with Heart."
Alan Kwan / ta...@notme.netvigator.com
http://home.netvigator.com/~tarot (hard-core game reviews)
(please remove anti-spam section "notme." from mailing address)
Wen Hsieh
: In article <35c2a33...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>,
: Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com (John) wrote:
: :) >Well if RPGs weren't so popular than please explain all the (continuing)
: :) >upsurge of American RPGs, smartguy.
: :)
: :) What upsurge?
: We all seem to forget the first CRPGs, and still quite a few RPGs these
: days, are produced in the United States. Look at the companies which got
: the CRPG genre started: Interplay, Origin, whichever company produced
: Wizardy, etc... I guess they just don't get as much PR as the Japanese
: RPGs do.
Sir-Tech. Console players might not know about US produced PC games, as
it turns out some don't even think there are any good US developers.
: I wouldn't call it an "upsurge", but there are still quite a few RPGs
: produced statewise. Fallout and Ultima Online are the first two which come
: to mind, but there are titles by smaller businesses, such as Realmz and
: Exile.
: Nick Zitzmann
Jim Pratt
>
> >I see your point, but I still don't entirely agree with it. Even if the
> >16-bit era had a good dosage of RPGs, they are still gaining momentum in the
> >32 and 64 bit systems of the here and now. Why else would Namco take a big
> >gamble and release Tales of Destiny?
> >
> >Look at it this way, half a dozen good RPGs in this year alone is a MILLION
> >times better than another bland game Like Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest making
> >a MOCKERY of the American diehard RPGer!
>
> True. By the way, what's Final Fantasy Tactics like? Havn't tried
> it. Final Fantasy: Mystic Quest, wasn't that the coined "RPG for
> kids" that came out for some Nintendo system a while back?
Final Fantasy Tactics is stupid, an almost direct rip-off of Shining
Force, except with less Strategy and Crappier Music (And its in 3D,
Obviously). I always thought Mystic Quest was an "RPG for Beginners".
Jason Wong
Jim Pratt wrote:
Final Fantasy Tactics is stupid, an almost direct rip-off of Shining
Force, except with less Strategy and Crappier Music (And its in 3D,
Obviously). I always thought Mystic Quest was an "RPG for Beginners".
Final Fantasy:Mystic Quest *was* dubbed for
beginners... you actually don't have to think it anymore... it was written.
Jason
K. Kulyk
Final Fantasy Tactics is a great game, I would put it up in the top 3 role
playing games of all time. It's a strategy based RPG, and a mighty fine one
at that. The music is OK, the spells are great and all in all it's just a
superb game. If you don't believe me, check out the review at
www.videogames.com
Jim Pratt wrote in message <35C619...@cswnet.com>...
Keldroc
>I just find that the Saturn's games have
>more soul than the PSX or N64, and that is my reason for such a high rating.
Not to get too embroiled in all this, but I have to say that you hit it right
on the head with this one. SS remains my favorite of the next gen systems, and
the heart put into the games is what keeps it in that spot. PDS, Guardian
Heroes, Legend Of Oasis, Dragon Force, even Sonic R. All have such life to
them, such as is rarely seen on PSX. And there's one thing SS has that will
keep it head and shoulders above PSX for me: Nothing on the PSX has anything
close to the, for lack of a better word, magic that NiGHTS has. For all the
NiGHTS vs. Crash vs. Mario 64 crap that went on back when the three were
released so close together in 96, the latter two never had a chance.
~Keldroc
_________
"Scully, let me tell you, you haven't seen America 'til you've
seen it from a train." - Fox Mulder, "731"
"He's a smirker! Mangle!" - Scorponok, "Dark Designs"
John E Larkspur
<35c316c...@news.atl.bellsouth.net> <6pvn6t$gjp$1...@news.cmc.net>
<35c364ab...@news.atl.bellsouth.net> <35C619...@cswnet.com> <6qagvt$9...@priv-sys04-le0.telusplanet.net>:
Organization: Netcom On-Line Services
Distribution:
K. Kulyk (lev...@planet.eon.net) wrote:
: Jim Pratt wrote in message <35C619...@cswnet.com>...
: >Final Fantasy Tactics is stupid, an almost direct rip-off of Shining
: >Force, except with less Strategy and Crappier Music (And its in 3D,
: >Obviously).
Nonsense. FFT is a direct rip-off of Tactics Ogre, not Shining Force.
: Hi Jim. Please put down your crack pipe and pull your head out of your ass.
: Final Fantasy Tactics is a great game, I would put it up in the top 3 role
: playing games of all time. It's a strategy based RPG, and a mighty fine one
: at that. The music is OK, the spells are great and all in all it's just a
: superb game. If you don't believe me, check out the review at
: www.videogames.com
Nonsense. FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
would have been forgotten in a week; I have to think all the hype came
from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before. Everything in
FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
and battle maps to the artwork and story. Not to mention that a five
character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
Playstation, let alone all time.
Lark
S.Knight
> Nonsense. FFT is a direct rip-off of Tactics Ogre, not Shining Force.
True, though the story of Shining Force 3 can be considered a ripoff
of FFT.
> Nonsense. FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
> high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
> would have been forgotten in a week; I have to think all the hype came
> from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before. Everything in
> FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
> and battle maps to the artwork and story. Not to mention that a five
> character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
Agreed, you can't have much strategy with only 5 characters.
> To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
> Playstation, let alone all time.
I haven't played many strategy games on the playstation. What others
are there?
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Hardset Head
:
: > Nonsense. FFT is a direct rip-off of Tactics Ogre, not Shining Force.
How can a development team rip-off their own work? FFT and Tactics Ogre
were designed by the same team. Square basically contracted the design
team behind T. Ogre to to the primary stuff behind FFT.
--
-------------
psl...@nmia.com
-------------
Practice random acts of kindness and senseless acts of tricking small
children to travel down into the sewers to fetch your "sweet old aunties
favorite watch", then closing the grate and welding it shut.
Alan Kwan
wrote:
> FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
>high quality stuff.
Disagree. The strategy/RPG genres are mostly orthodox (i.e. copycat,
clone) stuff, FFT included. Poorly designed, complex and unrealistic
game systems with always more complexity than gameplay. (i.e. There
are some simple games wiht next to no playability, and some complex
games with only very sparse playability.) Most of the playing time is
repetitive boredom.
Brandon Barnette
>> To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
>> Playstation, let alone all time.
>
>I haven't played many strategy games on the playstation. What others
>are there?
3 that come to mind are Vandal Hearts (my personal favorite), Ogre
Battle, and Tactics Ogre.
Tyler V. Snow
> > high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
> > would have been forgotten in a week;
The only thing that I forgot about FFT was the "Final Fantasy" in the title. I
played and finished it in 70 hours, and I would have done the same whether it
was called "Final Fantasy Tactics" or not.
> I have to think all the hype came
> > from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before.
I love FF Tactics, and I consider it to be one of my favorite games ever. I
have played lots of strategy RPGs: all of the Shining Force games, Ogre Battle,
Vandal Hearts, Dark Wizard, Dragon Force, and Tactics Ogre (and probably more).
> Everything in
> > FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
I had no problem with the class system in FFT. Name a strategy RPG with a
better class system. All of the strategy RPGs I named above had primitive class
systems in comparison.
> > and battle maps
What was your problem with the battle maps??
> to the artwork
I loved the artwork....
> and story.
I enjoyed the storyline...
> Not to mention that a five
> > character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
I had no problem with that. If anything, it made the game more enjoyable for
me.
Why don't you elaborate? Why, exactly, don't you like the artwork, the class
system, the 5 character limit, the battle maps, the story......?
> > To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
> > Playstation, let alone all time.
Not IMO.. FFT was MUCH more fun than Tactics Ogre, Vandal Hearts, and Ogre
Battle (these are the only PSX turn-based strategy RPGs I can think of).
--
Tyler V. Snow
tvs...@nextgenfan.com
Andy Howard
John E Larkspur wrote in message ...
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><35c316c...@news.atl.bellsouth.net> <6pvn6t$gjp$1...@news.cmc.net>
><35c364ab...@news.atl.bellsouth.net> <35C619...@cswnet.com>
<6qagvt$9...@priv-sys04-le0.telusplanet.net>:
>Organization: Netcom On-Line Services
>Distribution:
>
>K. Kulyk (lev...@planet.eon.net) wrote:
>: Jim Pratt wrote in message <35C619...@cswnet.com>...
>: >Final Fantasy Tactics is stupid, an almost direct rip-off of Shining
>: >Force, except with less Strategy and Crappier Music (And its in 3D,
>: >Obviously).
>
> Nonsense. FFT is a direct rip-off of Tactics Ogre, not Shining Force.
>
>: Hi Jim. Please put down your crack pipe and pull your head out of your
ass.
>: Final Fantasy Tactics is a great game, I would put it up in the top 3
role
>: playing games of all time. It's a strategy based RPG, and a mighty fine
one
>: at that. The music is OK, the spells are great and all in all it's just
a
>: superb game. If you don't believe me, check out the review at
>: www.videogames.com
>
> Nonsense. FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
>high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
>would have been forgotten in a week; I have to think all the hype came
>from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before. Everything in
>FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
>and battle maps to the artwork and story. Not to mention that a five
>character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
> To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
>Playstation, let alone all time.
>
>
>Lark
Joshua Kaufman
>
> > > Nonsense. FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
> > > high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
> > > would have been forgotten in a week;
>
> played and finished it in 70 hours, and I would have done the same whether it
> was called "Final Fantasy Tactics" or not.
I agree. Even with Chocobos, the names of spells, and Cid, I really
didn;t fell like I was playing an FF game. The gameplay, and of course
the music, just didn;t have the same feel. Even if the team had stuck
with Atlus, had called the game something else, and used a few
non-Square things to replace the Chcobos and such, I still definatly
would have played it and enjoyed it much more than TO, VH, or OB.
>
> > I have to think all the hype came
> > > from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before.
I played Vandal Hearts before I knew that FFT was gonna be the same
genre. I was convinced to buy FFT more because of that than because it
was called FF.
> > Everything in
> > > FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
>
> I had no problem with the class system in FFT. Name a strategy RPG with a
> better class system. All of the strategy RPGs I named above had primitive class
> systems in comparison.
The class system was great. Much better than in FF5 IMO. Compare it to
say VH where you had a very limited say in how your characters grow.
>
> > > and battle maps
What was wrong with the battle maps?
>
> > to the artwork
So Ramza looked like a girl, so what?
> > and story.
>
Much better than the classic good vs evil.
>
> > Not to mention that a five
> > > character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
>
But they designed the game that way. It works fine, because it was meant
to.
>
> > > To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
> > > Playstation, let alone all time.
>
> Not IMO.. FFT was MUCH more fun than Tactics Ogre, Vandal Hearts, and Ogre
> Battle (these are the only PSX turn-based strategy RPGs I can think >of).
There's also X-Com, and a bunch of imports like Front Mission 2, but I
agree. Out of the ones I;ve played, FFT is the best.
Alexander Mendes
>> > Nonsense. FFT is okay, but the strategy/rpg genre is almost completely
>> > high quality stuff. Take out the "Final Fantasy" in the title and the game
>> > would have been forgotten in a week;
Nope, sorry. Most of us liked it for the gameplay, not the title. It's
just as likely that people would have liked it had it not been named Final
Fantasy-some people were bothered because it didn't "feel" like an FF
game.
>The only thing that I forgot about FFT was the "Final Fantasy" in the title. I
>played and finished it in 70 hours, and I would have done the same whether it
>was called "Final Fantasy Tactics" or not.
>
>> I have to think all the hype came
>> > from FF fans who had never played a strategy game before.
>
>I love FF Tactics, and I consider it to be one of my favorite games ever. I
>have played lots of strategy RPGs: all of the Shining Force games, Ogre Battle,
>Vandal Hearts, Dark Wizard, Dragon Force, and Tactics Ogre (and probably more).
It's almost my favorite from VH, TO, Ogre Battle, Shining force, X-com,
Militery Madness and, from the real-times, Warcraft, C&C, and Myth (I love
the last one)
>> Everything in
>> > FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the class system
>
>I had no problem with the class system in FFT. Name a strategy RPG with a
>better class system. All of the strategy RPGs I named above had
primitive class
>systems in comparison.
Frankly, FFT's class system was far superior to VH (way too limited, and
the small number of chahracters only made things worse), and somewhat
better than TO or Ogre Battle.
>> > and battle maps
>
>What was your problem with the battle maps??
Too small, probably. But, they got the job done better than most, as it
used the heights so well.
>> to the artwork
>
>I loved the artwork....
Again, it was better than most, especially VH (an eyesore).
>> and story.
>
>I enjoyed the storyline...
Thank goodness they actually came up with a storyline with some complexity
in it, rather than the normal us-vs-them. It allowed the characters to
get some sort of personality. I'd like to see more of this in
RPG/strategy games.
>> Not to mention that a five
>> > character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
>
>I had no problem with that. If anything, it made the game more enjoyable for
>me.
I think the restriction was mostly to block out those pesky load times
that TO had. Still, it allowed the computer to outnumber you by 2-1
without forcing you to spend several hours on a single board. The
restriction had certain benefits and drawbacks.
>Why don't you elaborate? Why, exactly, don't you like the artwork, the class
>system, the 5 character limit, the battle maps, the story......?
>
>> > To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
>> > Playstation, let alone all time.
>
>Not IMO.. FFT was MUCH more fun than Tactics Ogre, Vandal Hearts, and Ogre
>Battle (these are the only PSX turn-based strategy RPGs I can think of).
I had a few problems with it-that you couldn't "take back" a character's
movement, so you couldn't check on attack ranges from different spots on
the map, and that if you weren't careful, you could leave the character
roster screen too easily between battles when you were in one of the
multi-battle locations. But these are minor compared to, say, VH's
limited classes and characters, and TO's constant loading and clumsy
menus.
-Alex Mendes
Nejimakidori
Joshua Kaufman <kauf...@email.uc.edu> wrote:
> Even if the team had stuck with Atlus, had called the game something else, and
> used a few non-Square things to replace the Chcobos and such, I still
> definatly would have played it and enjoyed it much more than TO, VH, or OB.
Atlus didn't have anything to do with developing Tactics Ogre. They just
published the US PS version.
marketing
John E Larkspur
: > Everything in
: > > FFT is poorly designed compared to the other s-rpgs, from the
: > > class system
: I had no problem with the class system in FFT. Name a strategy RPG with a
: better class system. All of the strategy RPGs I named above had
: primitive class systems in comparison.
I say poorly designed rather than just poor because they did make an
attempt at complexity, but they apparently made no attempt at all on
balancing the skills out. The majority of classes have one worthwhile
skill in one category and the rest you can throw out (Squire's jp up,
Geomancer's counter, Ninja's two swords, etc). In the Chemist class you
have absurd point costs for extremely limited primary skills. Meanwhile
the Archer class is pointless because it saddles you with Charge skills.
Lancers, meanwhile, have a great jump skill, but only if you skip all of
them but the two biggest since the rest are rendered obsolete every time
you upgrade. Most of the skills in the Samurai class are never used
because the game never gets around to spitting out the items you need
(unless you sit there like a twink and play random battles for an
eternity). Another example is the Calculator class. Completely
useless until you have all the skills, whereupon it becomes completely
overpowering. The special character classes are also poorly designed.
Orlandu vs Rafa.
I could go on and on and on, but my main point is that, were a gun put
to my head and were i forced to play this game again, I'd simply make 4
male monks and 1 female monk, then turn the males into ninjas and the
female into a dancer/calculator. Anything else you do to grab an extra
counter or movement skill.
: > > and battle maps
: What was your problem with the battle maps??
1. Much too small.
2. Frequently devoid of areas with strategic holding value (bottlenecks,
missile cover).
3. Incomprehensible grid system. How many times have you tried to use
the Monk's Revive or Chatka skills and inexplicably it won't light up 3
out of four neighboring grids? I once found a spot where it wouldn't
light anything. All their nice rounding out of the sharp edges doesn't
count for much if the computer can't handle slopes adjacent to plains.
This is especially infuriating since it doesn't let you take back your
moves.
I did, however, like the rare over/under bridges and passes, which I
hadn't seen before. The use of height was also nice, but it almost never
gave you the chance to use it strategically (only to have it used against
you).
: > to the artwork
: I loved the artwork....
I'm talking about the washed out, androgynous, look-alike portraits
mainly, as well as the character sprite animation (what little there was).
This is one thing from Tactics Ogre that they should not have copied.
Even the summon spells frequently used "South Park" animation.
: > and story.
: I enjoyed the storyline...
A really, really poorly explained yet simplified version of the
Tactics Ogre plot. They should be embarassed on both counts. It's also
annoying that you have to use the special characters to get more story
points, since you only have five available slots to begin with. And what
the hell is the deal with the proposition mode?
: > Not to mention that a five
: > > character limit is ludicrous in this genre.
: I had no problem with that. If anything, it made the game more enjoyable for
: me.
Why? As if the skill system wasn't restrictive enough, the 5 member
limit functionally squashed almost all troop variety. How many people
actually used the chocobos, for example? Other than out of
boredom/curiosity. When riding a chocobo immediately annihilates 20% of
your total firepower, it just isn't feasible. Give me 10+ characters,
however, and then those unique abilites become situationally useful.
Also, at least half your characters need to be jack-of-all-trades,
because there just isn't any way to put up a serious defensive formation
with only 2 or 3 full warriors, especially when the terrain is so
screwy. It's a freakin miracle if you can find 4 squares next to each
other that the computer actually agrees are really next to each other.
: > > To put it bluntly, FFT is not even a top 3 strategy game on the
: > > Playstation, let alone all time.
: Not IMO.. FFT was MUCH more fun than Tactics Ogre, Vandal Hearts, and Ogre
: Battle (these are the only PSX turn-based strategy RPGs I can think of).
I rate it below X-Com, Tactics Ogre, and Vandal Hearts, but above Ogre
Battle (which I find unplayable, and not really in the same sub-genre).
Of the real time stuff, I haven't given Warcraft enough play time, but
FFT is definitely better designed than Warhammer. I'm generally not a big
fan of strategy games that are mostly a test of your mouse skills. The
Saturn also has at least 3 strategy games better than FFT IMO, each with
a sequel (so count as 6): Iron Storm, Shining Force, and Sakura Taisen.
But like I said, FFT is okay, I wouldn't be using such harsh language about
it if it wasn't so overhyped. It's both too ambitious in some areas (the
skill system) and not ambitious enough in others (too much Tactics Ogre
copying). Very disappointing in lieu of all the buildup.
Lark
Matthew Trevor
> Agreed, you can't have much strategy with only 5 characters.
Which, no doubt, is why it wasn't called Final Fantasy Strategy.
Believe it or not, there *is* a difference between tactics & strategy.
--
Matthew Trevor (al...@place.org)
"It was good to look up during the day and know the stars were still
above his head, even though he couldn't see them. It was doubtless the
same for countless other mysteries. That they shone, but the world shone
more brightly, and blinded him to them."
- Clive Barker
Nejimakidori
jl...@netcom.com (John E Larkspur) wrote:
> 3. Incomprehensible grid system. How many times have you tried to use
> the Monk's Revive or Chatka skills and inexplicably it won't light up 3
> out of four neighboring grids? I once found a spot where it wouldn't
> light anything. All their nice rounding out of the sharp edges doesn't
> count for much if the computer can't handle slopes adjacent to plains.
> This is especially infuriating since it doesn't let you take back your
> moves.
Uh that's because each area effect spell/ability has a certain height
(vertical range) limit in addition to the planar range. If you cast a Fire
spell (vertical range 1) on a square with a height of 2.5, the spell will
spread to adjacent squares with heights of 1.5 or 3.5, but not 4. The
vertical range of abilities are clearly shown when you use the help function
on them.
I really wouldn't advise criticizing a game that you apparently didn't even
understand.
> But like I said, FFT is okay, I wouldn't be using such harsh language about
> it if it wasn't so overhyped. It's both too ambitious in some areas (the
> skill system) and not ambitious enough in others (too much Tactics Ogre
> copying). Very disappointing in lieu of all the buildup.
Please look up the phrase "in lieu of" in the dictionary (or whatever it is
you use to look up things like that)
marketing
"We met in the mist of morning
And parted deep in the night
Broken sword and shield and tears that never fall
But run through the heart
Washed away by the darkest water
The world is peaceful and still..."
kwarlord
Matthew Trevor wrote in message ...
>S.Knight (we...@concentric.net) wrote:
>> Agreed, you can't have much strategy with only 5 characters.
>
>Which, no doubt, is why it wasn't called Final Fantasy Strategy.
>
>Believe it or not, there *is* a difference between tactics & strategy.
how can the words tactics and strategy be different when they are, in fact,
synonyms???
Jeremy Reaban
(look synonym up in the dictionary if you don't believe me). The term
strategy is applied to a grander (bigger, higher) level than tactics.
Tactics is usually small scale (man to man) combat, like a battle.
Strategy would be the overall war.
Anyway, he's right - you can't have much 'tactics' with only 5 characters.
I liked FFT a lot, but the 5 character limit was a huge flaw (IMHO,
anyway). That's probably the main reason I liked TO better.
kwarlord <kwar...@hotmail.com> wrote in article
<6qon40$dc6$1...@news.cmc.net>...
kwarlord
Jeremy Reaban wrote in message <01bdc4fd$14a57680$960560d1@jer>...
>Just because they are synonyms, doesn't mean they mean the exact same thing
>(look synonym up in the dictionary if you don't believe me). The term
>strategy is applied to a grander (bigger, higher) level than tactics.
>Tactics is usually small scale (man to man) combat, like a battle.
>Strategy would be the overall war.
>
>Anyway, he's right - you can't have much 'tactics' with only 5 characters.
>I liked FFT a lot, but the 5 character limit was a huge flaw (IMHO,
>anyway). That's probably the main reason I liked TO better.
>
you just contradicted yourself there. If tactics is a small scale battle,
then Final Fantasy Tactics is rightfully named as such.
in that case a game like Warcraft is better suited to the term strategy and
a game like Heroes of Might and Magic is in fact a tactics game. But what do
most people call both of these games? you guessed it, Strategy. so let's
stop nitpicking and leave it at that, ok?
Jeremy Reaban
tatical battles), I just said there wasn't much tactics to it - because it
only has 5 characters, it really lacks depth, whereas in something with a
lot of characters, like your X-coms or your Tactics Ogres, you have to
think a lot, and apply a lot of good tactical thinking. To make an analogy,
FFT is like Tic-Tac-Toe, while X-com/TO is like connect 4. Same games
basically, just one is more complex
HoMM is more of a strategy game. While it does feature tactical battles,
like FFT - it doesn't have all that much depth to them. But, it requires a
lot of strategy in resource management, building armies, etc to win a
scenario.
Warcraft is more of a tactical game, because it mostly consists of small
scale battles (though with a lot of units). There's a little strategy in
building units and collecting resources, but ultimately, you're still
fighting on a small scale, for a short term goal.
kwarlord <kwar...@hotmail.com> wrote in article
<6qoq2n$ed0$1...@news.cmc.net>...
<snip>
> you just contradicted yourself there. If tactics is a small scale battle,
> then Final Fantasy Tactics is rightfully named as such.
>
> in that case a game like Warcraft is better suited to the term strategy
and
> a game like Heroes of Might and Magic is in fact a tactics game. But what
do
> most people call both of these games? you guessed it, Strategy. so let's
> stop nitpicking and leave it at that, ok?
<snip>
John E Larkspur
: jl...@netcom.com (John E Larkspur) wrote:
: > 3. Incomprehensible grid system. How many times have you tried to use
: > the Monk's Revive or Chatka skills and inexplicably it won't light up 3
: > out of four neighboring grids? I once found a spot where it wouldn't
: > light anything. All their nice rounding out of the sharp edges doesn't
: > count for much if the computer can't handle slopes adjacent to plains.
: > This is especially infuriating since it doesn't let you take back your
: > moves.
: Uh that's because each area effect spell/ability has a certain height
: (vertical range) limit in addition to the planar range. If you cast a Fire
: spell (vertical range 1) on a square with a height of 2.5, the spell will
: spread to adjacent squares with heights of 1.5 or 3.5, but not 4. The
: vertical range of abilities are clearly shown when you use the help function
: on them.
Yes, but even on a simple "Plains" map you've got these tiny little
dips and and holes. They are NOT a full square or even half a square
higher or lower, they're just Square's attempt at ground texture, yet they
give you inconsistent results when you try to line up a simple skill like
the monk's. I'd give a specific example if I still owned the game.
: I really wouldn't advise criticizing a game that you apparently didn't even
: understand.
I really wouldn't advise copping such a condescending attitude with
complete strangers, particularly when you don't even take a stab at the
other criticisms...
: Please look up the phrase "in lieu of" in the dictionary (or whatever it is
: you use to look up things like that)
... but do feel free to criticize my typos _in lieu of_ giving quality
analysis.
Lark
Alan Kwan
wrote:
> I say poorly designed rather than just poor because they did make an
>attempt at complexity, but they apparently made no attempt at all on
>balancing the skills out. The majority of classes have one worthwhile
>skill in one category and the rest you can throw out (Squire's jp up,
>Geomancer's counter, Ninja's two swords, etc). In the Chemist class you
>have absurd point costs for extremely limited primary skills. Meanwhile
>the Archer class is pointless because it saddles you with Charge skills.
>Lancers, meanwhile, have a great jump skill, but only if you skip all of
>them but the two biggest since the rest are rendered obsolete every time
>you upgrade. Most of the skills in the Samurai class are never used
>because the game never gets around to spitting out the items you need
>(unless you sit there like a twink and play random battles for an
>eternity). Another example is the Calculator class. Completely
>useless until you have all the skills, whereupon it becomes completely
>overpowering. The special character classes are also poorly designed.
>Orlandu vs Rafa.
> I could go on and on and on, but my main point is that, were a gun put
>to my head and were i forced to play this game again, I'd simply make 4
>male monks and 1 female monk, then turn the males into ninjas and the
>female into a dancer/calculator. Anything else you do to grab an extra
>counter or movement skill.
FFT is balanced like Magic: the Gathering (the card game). They just
throw in a bunch of elements, and assign high JP costs to everything.
Then the players balance the game with their patience at JP
accumulation. Just like in Magic, there are a few very useful
elements (skills) and lots of useless ones.
The game is not balanced by the designers: the job is left to the
players. Unfortunately, the players don't get paid for the work; on
the contrary, they have to pay.
> And what
>the hell is the deal with the proposition mode?
An idea presented without polish.
>Also, at least half your characters need to be jack-of-all-trades,
>because there just isn't any way to put up a serious defensive formation
>with only 2 or 3 full warriors, especially when the terrain is so
>screwy.
And the characters move fast (3 or more squares), there are no ZOC or
engagement rules, and ranged attacks are every bit as powerful as
close-combat attacks. A defensive formation? Must be a joke.
The only defense is to wipe out enemies before they strike.
(Once I played Shadows of the Tusk, none of the other Japanese console
"strategy" games seem to have any strategic depth.)
Mike G.
> Matthew Trevor wrote in message ...
> >S.Knight (we...@concentric.net) wrote:
> >> Agreed, you can't have much strategy with only 5 characters.
> >
> >Which, no doubt, is why it wasn't called Final Fantasy Strategy.
> >
> >Believe it or not, there *is* a difference between tactics & strategy.
>
>
> how can the words tactics and strategy be different when they are, in fact,
> synonyms???
--------------
Excuse me for barging in, but they are anything but synonyms. Here's from
American Heritage Dict.:
Strategy: The science and art of military command as applied to the
overall planning and conduct of large-scale combat operations.
Tactics: The military science that deals with securing objectives set by
strategy, especially the technique of deploying and directing troops,
ships, and aircraft in efficient maneuvers against an enemy
So ... strategy is more about looking at the big picture and tactics
is/are more about micromanagement. A game like X-COM employs both strategy
and tactics while FFT is just tactics.
--mike g.
Keldroc
>limit functionally squashed almost all troop variety. How many people
>actually used the chocobos, for example? Other than out of
>boredom/curiosity. When riding a chocobo immediately annihilates 20% of
>your total firepower, it just isn't feasible. Give me 10+ characters,
>however, and then those unique abilites become situationally useful.
>Also, at least half your characters need to be jack-of-all-trades,
>because there just isn't any way to put up a serious defensive formation
>with only 2 or 3 full warriors, especially when the terrain is so
>screwy. It's a freakin miracle if you can find 4 squares next to each
>other that the computer actually agrees are really next to each other.
Just thought I'd point out that this is one of the most beautifully-worded
summations of one of FFT's most prominent fatal flaws. Fantastically accurate.
Alan Kwan
wrote:
>: What was your problem with the battle maps??
>
> 1. Much too small.
It's not only the size of the maps, but the way the entire game is put
together, that turns the strategy into triviality. In FFT, everybody
just runs around like a bunch of monkeys, with no objective other than
to strike down enemies (no defined victory condition areas to
hold, etc.), and no way to form a defensive formation.
OTOH, in Shadows of the Tusk, despite the small size of the map
(5x5!), there are "Mana areas" that the players compete for. And with
the billiant scaling down of everything - characters move either one
or two squares - I can actually form a defensive formation, because it
is harder to "go around" the front-line characters moving only 1 or 2
squares! Despite the small map, I find there actually to be plenty of
strategy.
Raymond McKeithen II
Raymond McKeithen II wrote in message ...
>
...deleted.....
What the heck is going on? All these messages posted long ago coming around
again? This and the 'weed' messages all coming back...
remove *2* nospam's for email...
Raymond
Marty Chinn
: Marty Chinn wrote:
: >John Black (Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com) wrote:
: >: Woah. Is there anything video game related you haven't owned?
: >
: >A Super Grafx would be nice in my collection =) Also I've never had a FM
: >Towns Marty or a PC FX. But I don't plan on getting those. Oh yeah never
: >had a Lynx. Other than that, I think I've owned all the systems from NES
: >on.
: You didn 't mention the NeoGeo. I own one and it still offers an
: excellent arcade experience. I 'm still looking for a few hard to find
: carts though, Viewpoint and Pulstar in particular.
Uh read again, I own a Neo Geo cartridge system. I rated it.
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marty Chinn ** E3 - May 28 - 30, 1998 **
Video Source PlayStation, Nintendo 64, Saturn, Imports
973 Foxglove Dr. M-F: 9:30-6:00, Sa: 10:00-3:00 PST, Sun: Closed
Sunnyvale, CA 94086 Ordering, and Preordering info at:
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<408> 720-8576 FAX WWW : http://www.video-source.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hardset Head
: Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
: owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
This is, like, the BILLIONTH thread that someone is reposting. This
thread is well over a month old...someone is reposting these old messages,
most of them being flame war oriented threads. This is really starting to
get old. I'm sick of getting onto r.g.v.s. and going 2-3 months into the
past.
LeChuck
>LeChuck (lec...@voodoo.net) wrote:
>: You didn 't mention the NeoGeo. I own one and it still offers an
>: excellent arcade experience. I 'm still looking for a few hard to find
>: carts though, Viewpoint and Pulstar in particular.
>
>Uh read again, I own a Neo Geo cartridge system. I rated it.
Oops. Must have missed that part.
Sorry.
John Hokanson Jr.
wrote:
>LeChuck (lec...@voodoo.net) wrote:
>: Marty Chinn wrote:
>
>: >John Black (Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com) wrote:
>: >: Woah. Is there anything video game related you haven't owned?
>: >
>: >A Super Grafx would be nice in my collection =) Also I've never had a FM
>: >Towns Marty or a PC FX. But I don't plan on getting those. Oh yeah never
>: >had a Lynx. Other than that, I think I've owned all the systems from NES
>: >on.
>
>: You didn 't mention the NeoGeo. I own one and it still offers an
>: excellent arcade experience. I 'm still looking for a few hard to find
>: carts though, Viewpoint and Pulstar in particular.
>
>Uh read again, I own a Neo Geo cartridge system. I rated it.
>--
Man, I had to pull your list off of Deja news....
Anyways, I agree with your list for the most part. Though I think that
if you gave the PC Engine/PCE CD a B+ (nearly an A-) I think you
should also give the Saturn a B+. Come on Marty, I have friends that
have owned Turbo products and the Saturn just *screams*
"bastard child of the Turbo". =P Especially if your anywhere near the
anime fan you claim you are.
You also should maybe invest in an MSX if you can find one. There were
versions of Snatcher and a spin off called SD Snatcher on it, and the
Metal Gear games just totally blow away the NES versions in graphics
and depth (I know, I've played them). Many great Konami ports aplenty.
Marty Chinn
: Anyways, I agree with your list for the most part. Though I think that
: if you gave the PC Engine/PCE CD a B+ (nearly an A-) I think you
: should also give the Saturn a B+. Come on Marty, I have friends that
: have owned Turbo products and the Saturn just *screams*
: "bastard child of the Turbo". =P Especially if your anywhere near the
: anime fan you claim you are.
The difference is the PC Engine/PCE CD did stuff for the first time where
as the Saturn did not. The PCE CD in its own way was a significant step
forward in video gaming, the Saturn was not. That doesn't mean the Saturn
wasn't a good system, I own enough games to say it was, but I didn't feel
it had the same impact that the PCE once had. I actually find the two
systems a lot more different in comparison that a lot of people do. I
also don't think of the Saturn as a system flowing with tons of anime
titles either. Its got its share, but not the way the PCE was at its time.
: You also should maybe invest in an MSX if you can find one. There were
: versions of Snatcher and a spin off called SD Snatcher on it, and the
: Metal Gear games just totally blow away the NES versions in graphics
: and depth (I know, I've played them). Many great Konami ports aplenty.
I saw a brand new MSX system the last time I was in Japan. In box and
everything. I considered it, but decided not to. It was gone like 2 days
later but maybe this year when I go back I might give in. I know i'm
going to that store at least, it was one of the best stores i went to.
:
John Hokanson Jr.
wrote:
>John Hokanson Jr. (yangn...@hotmail.com) wrote:
>
>: Anyways, I agree with your list for the most part. Though I think that
>: if you gave the PC Engine/PCE CD a B+ (nearly an A-) I think you
>: should also give the Saturn a B+. Come on Marty, I have friends that
>: have owned Turbo products and the Saturn just *screams*
>: "bastard child of the Turbo". =P Especially if your anywhere near the
>: anime fan you claim you are.
>
>The difference is the PC Engine/PCE CD did stuff for the first time where
>as the Saturn did not. The PCE CD in its own way was a significant step
>forward in video gaming, the Saturn was not. That doesn't mean the Saturn
>wasn't a good system, I own enough games to say it was, but I didn't feel
>it had the same impact that the PCE once had. I actually find the two
>systems a lot more different in comparison that a lot of people do. I
>also don't think of the Saturn as a system flowing with tons of anime
>titles either. Its got its share, but not the way the PCE was at its time.
>
Granted yes it's not "revolutionary" like the PCE was. However, I
still dissagree with you on the anime game part, and I don't think I
can change my mind there. Many PCE CD games have been reborn on the
Saturn (Yuna for instance). And then there's the whole Sakura Taisen
thing......
It's a LOT closer then the PSX is. PSX has an entirely different share
of the market.
>: You also should maybe invest in an MSX if you can find one. There were
>: versions of Snatcher and a spin off called SD Snatcher on it, and the
>: Metal Gear games just totally blow away the NES versions in graphics
>: and depth (I know, I've played them). Many great Konami ports aplenty.
>
>I saw a brand new MSX system the last time I was in Japan. In box and
>everything. I considered it, but decided not to. It was gone like 2 days
>later but maybe this year when I go back I might give in. I know i'm
>going to that store at least, it was one of the best stores i went to.
>
GET IT! =P
Assuming of course the price is right......
dekaver
puff piece"...arrrghh its getting FREAKIN' aggravating.
Marcus Heuser
<35be8d84...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
|
| Playstation: A-
| Revolutionary use of full motion video, and CD technology. Also
| includes a killer library of titles. Only problem is that waiting for
| the thing to load gets rather annoying and the controller isn't as
| good as the N64's.
You should play "Unreal" on PCs with 64 MB or less. Gives "loading
times" a new meaning...
bye
Marcus
s.tes
--
-Socheath
s....@ix.netcom.com
or
st97...@pip.cc.brandeis.edu
AOL IM: Sochtes
In a world of indesicive people,
it's nice to have choices.
John Black <Soul_B...@NOSPAM.yahoo.com> wrote in article
<35be8d84...@news.atl.bellsouth.net>...
> Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
> owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
>
> NES: A-
> Brought back the industry after Atari, and changed the face of gaming.
> Only problem is too many crap games.
>
> Genesis: B
> The sports games ran smoother here than the SNES, but in the later
> days of 16 bit, the SNES caught up, and the Genesis' graphics weren't
> as impressive.
>
> SNES: A
> The most impressive technical capabilities of it's day, a slew of
> killer games, what else do you need?
>
> Playstation: A-
> Revolutionary use of full motion video, and CD technology. Also
> includes a killer library of titles. Only problem is that waiting for
> the thing to load gets rather annoying and the controller isn't as
> good as the N64's.
>
> Nintendo 64: A-
> The most technically advanced system ever released, and the N64's top
> titles blow me away. Big problem here is that the games that interest
> me come out once every five months or so, so my N64 spends a lot of
> it's time unplugged and sitting under a dust cover. But when the
> games I like come out, I can't stop playing it.
> .
>
s.tes
fix it?" It doesn't work with this thread, however.
AOL IM: Sochtes
In a world of indesicive people,
it's nice to have choices.
Hardset Head <psl...@nmia.com> wrote in article
<6rf381$b...@hume.nmia.com>...
> Hitting random keys, "John Black" spelled out:
> : Just for fun, I decided to give grades to all the systems I've own or
> : owned. Hope this doesn't start a flame war:
>
Chuck No2
NES: C+ It was sweet... during it's time...
SNES: A Nice library! Civilization, Sim City, Street Fighter 2 Turbo... this
is a great system...
Genesis: B Kinda like a NES and SNES mixed, power-wise... at least I think...
Game Boy: A at first, D now: I'm just sick and tired of freakin' 8 bit 4
shades of gray crap... maybe the new Colour Gameboy can change my grade...
N64: B It's nice, but without Miyamoto, would it be doing so well?
PSX: A: Full of sweet as hell games.
Brian Glen Palicia
Based on my own personal opinions, in order of the game
systems I owned:
1. Sears Video Arcade - C It basically was Atari but with
a different name on it. I played it on a 13" black and white
TV that used *tubes* not transistors! God this was a long
time ago. 100 games in 1 was a good way to present these games.
Naval battle, tank war, pac-man. I still preferred to go to
the arcade.
2. Atari 5200 - B I had more titles, 20 of them, for this system
than for any other system I ever had. I guess you could say
this was my home video game playing peak. Most played game
was Mario Bros., which was the first video game I extensively
played with friends. Also played Pitfall II: Lost Caverns so
much that I can *still* hear the music. I liked the baseball
game, too.
3. NES - A- I used to bike 4 miles to a pizza shop to play
Super Mario Bros. once in a while. Long after the NES was
out, I finally managed to buy one. This system was like
losing your virginity. Once you saw the FAR FAR FAR FAR
superior graphics of the home version of SMB, there just
was no way the Atari 5200 would really be played again.
Beat SMB in one day, tho. Most played game: SMB 3.
4. TurboGrafX-16 - A+ Second most titles I had for any
system. I could not believe they had super cool games
like Military Madness, World Class Baseball (Which is still
the best baseball game I've ever played. It was so damn
hard!), Alien Crush, Blazing Lazers, yet they promoted
only the worst of the titles like BONK?!?! I ended up
selling it to buy my next system, and I've regretted it
ever since. I still want to re-purchase a TG-16 when I
have the cash. Most-played game: Military Madness.
5. Genesis - C- My freshman year in college, everyone had
an NES. I was the first on the block to get a Genesis.
Suddenly I became Sega Man (tm). I slowly began to realize
just how bad everyone sucked at games compared to me.
By the end of that first quarter everyone had gone out
and bought their own Genesis. Then I sell mine (never
regretted it) to get my next system. Most-played game:
Sonic (but not played that much) I really missed my TG-16.
I realized that games aren't going to get better and better.
6. SNES - B+ Some of my friends in college were surprised
I bought this. Sega Man with an SNES? Sure. What I really
wanted was to get SF 2, because I felt that would be the
perfect dorm game. Super Mario Kart looked like it would
be good, too. Alas, freshman year was over before they
were released. Nintendo held a tournament that year in
25 campuses around the nation. I won the tournament for
my campus and won another SNES + 2 free games. My sophomore
year I did get Super Mario Kart and SF 2 and Kart became
the most played game since Military Madness.
I've since sold my SNES and haven't dipped into the next gen
of systems. I don't think I'd like the playstation. I
played it and the N64 and it looks like the N64 will have
more games I like. Plus I've never liked CDs. I don't
even buy music CDs. (I think I might like MiniDiscs)
I've heard the optic on the playstation can have problems,
and it can skip. And loading times.
Bri
Marty Chinn
: Saturn: A+ Dammit, I love this system!
The N64 is a better system than the NES??