Protection and 'damage cannot be prevented'
Hemispheres
Was playing casual with friends yesterday. A buddy played a spell from
Shadowmoor:
Everlasting Torment {2}{BR}
Enchantment
Players can't gain life.
Damage can't be prevented.
All damage is dealt as though its source had wither.
(A source with wither deals damage to creatures in the form of -1/-1
counters.)
What happens if, say for example, a black creature attacks a player and
is blocked by a creature with protection from black while Everlasting
Torment
is in play? Is the protection "overridden" by the Torment's "can't be
prevented"?
- Hemispheres
Focus
i...@not.telling says...
The protection is 'overridden'.
'Protection from <foo>' does a number of things. One thing it does is
preventing damage from a <foo> source (rule 502.7e). Everlasting Torment
says that damage can't be prevented.
For this contradiction there is rule 103.2
103.2. When a rule or effect says something can happen and another
effect says it can't, the "can't" effect wins. For example, if one
effect reads "You may play an additional land this turn" and another
reads "You can't play land cards this turn," the effect that keeps you
from playing lands wins out.
Regards,
Focus
David DeLaney
>Was playing casual with friends yesterday. A buddy played a spell from
>Shadowmoor:
>
>Everlasting Torment {2}{BR} >Enchantment
> though its source had wither. (A source with wither deals damage to creatures
> in the form of -1/-1 counters.)
>
>What happens if, say for example, a black creature attacks a player and
>is blocked by a creature with protection from black while Everlasting
>Torment is in play? Is the protection "overridden" by the Torment's "can't be
>prevented"?
Since the part of protection-from-black you're thinking of is "Prevent all
damage that would be dealt by black sources", yes, that's definitely affected
by "Damage can't be prevented"; that 'turns off' that one-quarter of what
protection-from does. (The blocking creature still can't be enchanted/equipped,
targetted, or blocked by black stuff.) The blocking creature will have the
appropriate amount of -1/-1 counters placed on it, whose source-as-damage will
be the black attacking creature.
Dave
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Zoe Stephenson
> Hi all,
> Was playing casual with friends yesterday. A buddy played a spell from
> Shadowmoor:
Everlasting Torment {2}{B/R} Enchantment
/ Players can't gain life.
/ Damage can't be prevented.
/ All damage is dealt as though its source had wither.
> What happens if, say for example, a black creature attacks a player and
> is blocked by a creature with protection from black while Everlasting
> Torment is in play?
The damage to the blocking creature gets dealt, in the form of -1/-1
counters, rather than being prevented by the protection ability.
> Is the protection "overridden" by the Torment's "can't be
> prevented"?
Exactly. The other bits of protection still work, but the damage
itself can't be prevented, so it isn't. There's even a little rule
that spells out that a "can't" wins out over a "can".
103.2. When a rule or effect says something can happen and another
effect says it can't, the "can't" effect wins. For example, if one
effect reads "You may play an additional land this turn" and another
reads "You can't play land cards this turn," the effect that keeps
you from playing lands wins out.[...]
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-- Zoe Stephenson, NetRep rec.games.trading-cards.magic.rules
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