Soul Burn

[1jbt...@unixstew.tstc.edu]

On the thaumaturgy strike card Soul Burn, it says:
"For the remainder of this round, the opposing
minion cannot inflict damage with weapons."

When does the remainder of this round begin?

I assume that if this card is not played as a first
strike, the current weapon strike will do damage, yes?

This would be different from Blood Fury and Blood Rage
which say:
"If the opposing vampire attempts to strike with a
weapon this round, he or she does no damage."
These two clearly cancel the current weapon strike.

If any of these three strikes is dodged, may I blur and
shoot them twice or not?

Carpe Noctem.

Jeff
1jbt...@unixstew.tstc.edu
http://unixstew.tstc.edu/~1jbt2197/vtes.htm

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[LSJ]

1jbt...@unixstew.tstc.edu wrote:
>
> On the thaumaturgy strike card Soul Burn, it says:
> "For the remainder of this round, the opposing
> minion cannot inflict damage with weapons."
>
> When does the remainder of this round begin?
>
> I assume that if this card is not played as a first
> strike, the current weapon strike will do damage, yes?

Yes.

> This would be different from Blood Fury and Blood Rage
> which say:
> "If the opposing vampire attempts to strike with a
> weapon this round, he or she does no damage."
> These two clearly cancel the current weapon strike.

Yes. It really just looks like Soul Burn simply fouled up the template.
I'll see if anyone wants to issue errata to make it work properly.

> If any of these three strikes is dodged, may I blur and
> shoot them twice or not?

Dodge cancels/negates the effect of the strike*, yes. [8.3]

*On the dodging minion and any non-Retainer cards on him.

--
L. Scott Johnson (vte...@wizards.com)
Official VtES Net.Rep for Wizards of the Coast.
(*) - Subject to review by Rules Team

[Lupus Australis]

On Fri, 13 Feb 1998, LSJ wrote:

> 1jbt...@unixstew.tstc.edu wrote:
> >
> > On the thaumaturgy strike card Soul Burn, it says:
> > "For the remainder of this round, the opposing
> > minion cannot inflict damage with weapons."
> >
> > When does the remainder of this round begin?

I presume it begins during the "resolve strike" phase.

> > I assume that if this card is not played as a first
> > strike, the current weapon strike will do damage, yes?
>
> Yes.
>
> > This would be different from Blood Fury and Blood Rage
> > which say:
> > "If the opposing vampire attempts to strike with a
> > weapon this round, he or she does no damage."
> > These two clearly cancel the current weapon strike.
>
> Yes. It really just looks like Soul Burn simply fouled up the template.
> I'll see if anyone wants to issue errata to make it work properly.

Are you sure errata is necessary? It could be argued that the card
already works as intended, though it certainly could have been more
clearly worded.

Unless I am mistaken, then the damage from a weapon strike will resolve
*after* other strike effects are resolved. After the "resolve strike
phase" comes the "damage prevention phase", which is followed by the
"resolve damage phase".. IOW, the restriction of Soul Burn resolves
before it is determined if the damage from the opposing minions weapon
strike is (successfully) inflicted. Thus, the "cannot inflict damage"
prohibition still has time to kick in.

Imagine Soul Burn had been worded: "For the remainder of this round, the
opposing minion cannot *successfully* inflict damage with weapons." In
that case, I think you would have ruled the other way. But, as previous
rulings have indicated, there is no difference between inflicting damage
and successfully inflicting damage. The word "successfully", when it
appears, is merely a redundant clarification.

I presume that Soul Burn does not prohibit the opponent from striking with
a weapon, but merely from inflicting damage when he/she does. One could
still strike with a Rowan Ring, whose effects would resolve as normal.

Which brings me to a question: Could Soul Burn, Blood Fury, or Blood Rage
prevent one from dealing damage to oneself by means of a bomb, zip gun, or
grenade? The ruling with respect to Skin of Steel and Leather Jacket do
not necessarily apply, since the words "damage from a strike" are not
used.

Thanks

Lupus Australis
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[LSJ]

Lupus Australis wrote:
> On Fri, 13 Feb 1998, LSJ wrote:
> > 1jbt...@unixstew.tstc.edu wrote:
> > > On the thaumaturgy strike card Soul Burn, it says:
> > > "For the remainder of this round, the opposing
> > > minion cannot inflict damage with weapons."
> > > When does the remainder of this round begin?
> I presume it begins during the "resolve strike" phase.

after both (simultaneous) strikes have begun resolving, sure.

> > > I assume that if this card is not played as a first
> > > strike, the current weapon strike will do damage, yes?
> > Yes.
> >
> > > This would be different from Blood Fury and Blood Rage
> > > which say:
> > > "If the opposing vampire attempts to strike with a
> > > weapon this round, he or she does no damage."
> > > These two clearly cancel the current weapon strike.
> >
> > Yes. It really just looks like Soul Burn simply fouled up the template.
> > I'll see if anyone wants to issue errata to make it work properly.
>
> Are you sure errata is necessary? It could be argued that the card
> already works as intended, though it certainly could have been more
> clearly worded.
>
> Unless I am mistaken, then the damage from a weapon strike will resolve
> *after* other strike effects are resolved. After the "resolve strike

No. The strikes (assuming none are at First Strike, S:CE, or Dodges)
resolve simultaneously.

> phase" comes the "damage prevention phase", which is followed by the
> "resolve damage phase".. IOW, the restriction of Soul Burn resolves
> before it is determined if the damage from the opposing minions weapon
> strike is (successfully) inflicted. Thus, the "cannot inflict damage"
> prohibition still has time to kick in.

No. The damage (from the weapon) is applied at the same time as
Soul Burn resolves. You heal the damage later, but the damage is
still done.

> I presume that Soul Burn does not prohibit the opponent from striking with
> a weapon, but merely from inflicting damage when he/she does. One could
> still strike with a Rowan Ring, whose effects would resolve as normal.

Right.

> Which brings me to a question: Could Soul Burn, Blood Fury, or Blood Rage
> prevent one from dealing damage to oneself by means of a bomb, zip gun, or
> grenade? The ruling with respect to Skin of Steel and Leather Jacket do
> not necessarily apply, since the words "damage from a strike" are not
> used.

"Inflict" typically means "to the opposing minion/retainer" (see Pulled
Fangs). So these cards would not nullify the self-damage of those
weapon strikes.