Uriah Winter / Army of Rats question

[Mari]

Hi All,

I have a question that came up Wednesday at our game. Here's the
situation: I am controlling Uriah Winter and have an Army of Rats in
play. At my untap phase, I have 1 less pool than my prey, does my prey
get Uriah BEFORE the Army of Rats hits my prey or do I keep Uriah
because the Army of Rats hit him already?

Thanks in advance for the info!

Mari
Malk Admin Assistant for
Portla...@yahoogroups.com
Chatelaine of Portland, OR

[Halcyan 2]

>I have a question that came up Wednesday at our game. Here's the
>situation: I am controlling Uriah Winter and have an Army of Rats in
>play. At my untap phase, I have 1 less pool than my prey, does my prey
>get Uriah BEFORE the Army of Rats hits my prey or do I keep Uriah
>because the Army of Rats hit him already?

Army of Rats [Jyhad, V:TES, SW]
Cardtype: Action
Discipline: Animalism
+1 stealth action. Put this card in play. During your untap phase, your prey
burns 1 pool. You may only burn 1 pool each turn with Army of Rats cards. Any
minion can take a (D) action to burn the Army of Rats.

Uriah Winter [Jyhad, V:TES]
Cardtype: Vampire
Clan: Caitiff
Capacity: 1
Discipline: for pot
If your prey has more pool than you do at the beginning of your untap phase, he
or she takes control of Uriah.

Note that Uriah's effect occurs "at the beginning" while Army of Rats is
"during." Thus I would conclude that you would transfer Uriah before the Army
of Rats hits your prey.

Halcyan 2

[Arnaud Clavel]

'at the beginning' is like 'at the start' , right ? And
"At the start of the untap phase" is another way of specifying "during
the untap phase". Neither phrasing specifies a period of time before the
other. [RTR 19990105]
IMo, you can choose which effect takes place first and then keep Uriah.

We had the same situation i our playgroup with Uriah coming back from
contest. We discussed to know weither Uriah was in play at the beginning
of the untap to know if its effect took place.

Klav

[LSJ]

>===== Original Message From Arnaud Clavel <Arnaud...@renault.com> =====

>'at the beginning' is like 'at the start' , right ? And
>"At the start of the untap phase" is another way of specifying "during
>the untap phase". Neither phrasing specifies a period of time before the
>other. [RTR 19990105]
>IMo, you can choose which effect takes place first and then keep Uriah.

The ruling was made for effects that are to occur "at the beginning"
of the untap phase, and was necessary because the only effect that
could occur at the specified time is "untap all your cards". [4]

For Uriah, you check your pool total at the beginning of the phase
(before untapping anything). Then, if your total is less than your
prey's, you lose Uriah sometime during your untap phase.

>We had the same situation i our playgroup with Uriah coming back from
>contest. We discussed to know weither Uriah was in play at the beginning
>of the untap to know if its effect took place.

If Uriah is in play during your untap phase (and you had less pool than
your prey at the beginning of the untap phase), then Uriah defects.

--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
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[Jozxyqk]

> For Uriah, you check your pool total at the beginning of the phase
> (before untapping anything). Then, if your total is less than your
> prey's, you lose Uriah sometime during your untap phase.

Does that mean you can pass Uriah before you untap him?

[LSJ]

No. Untapping is the first thing that you do in the phase. [4]

[Dark Howler]

this is what I was saying earlier about Compel the Spirit which says "since
your last turn" which to me means any part of your last turn... be in the
beginning or the end

Dark Howler

"Arnaud Clavel" <Arnaud...@renault.com> wrote in message
news:3AE93F08...@renault.com...

[LSJ]

>===== Original Message From "Dark Howler" <darkh...@bastardsquad.org> =====

>this is what I was saying earlier about Compel the Spirit which says "since
>your last turn" which to me means any part of your last turn... be in the
>beginning or the end

No. For a thing to have happened "since your last turn", it must've
happened in one of the turns after your last turn. If it happened
during your last turn (and hasn't happened again since your last
turn), it doesn't count.

--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) V:TES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/

[Reyda]

"LSJ" <vte...@MailAndNews.com> a écrit dans le message news:
3B10...@MailAndNews.com...

> >===== Original Message From "Dark Howler" <darkh...@bastardsquad.org>
=====
> >this is what I was saying earlier about Compel the Spirit which says
"since
> >your last turn" which to me means any part of your last turn... be in the
> >beginning or the end
>
> No. For a thing to have happened "since your last turn", it must've
> happened in one of the turns after your last turn. If it happened
> during your last turn (and hasn't happened again since your last
> turn), it doesn't count.
>

now, imagine Rafaele impersonating in malkavian with a madness network in
play. Can he play Compel the Spirit in each of his opponents'turn to bring
back, say, a Guardian Ghoul burned to save a key location arsoned multiple
times ?

reyda

[LSJ]

Reyda wrote:
> now, imagine Rafaele impersonating in malkavian with a madness network in
> play. Can he play Compel the Spirit in each of his opponents'turn to bring
> back, say, a Guardian Ghoul burned to save a key location arsoned multiple
> times ?

If the retainer has been burned since his last turn, he can Compel it, by card
text.