Warewolf Pack Question
bswai...@my-deja.com
weapons) is chosen to take the damage from your Talbot's Chainsaw. Can
it ignore it?
Can Ambrosius?
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LSJ
> If the Warewolf pack (which is not affected by damage from melee
> weapons) is chosen to take the damage from your Talbot's Chainsaw. Can
> it ignore it?
No, since Talbot's Chainsaw isn't a melee weapon.
> Can Ambrosius?
Yes, since it isn't aggravated damage.
--
LSJ (vte...@white-wolf.com) VTES Net.Rep for White Wolf, Inc.
Links to revised rulebook, rulings, errata, and tournament rules:
http://www.white-wolf.com/vtes/
Pat Ricochet
> bswai...@my-deja.com wrote:
>> If the Warewolf pack (which is not affected by damage from melee
>> weapons) is chosen to take the damage from your Talbot's Chainsaw. Can
>> it ignore it?
>
> No, since Talbot's Chainsaw isn't a melee weapon.
For purely academic interest, if the Werewolf Pack was "immune to damage
from weapons," would they then NOT take the Talbot's Chainsaw collateral
damage if it was applied to them? I mean, is that really "damage from the
weapon?" Isn't it just an effect by card text?
To get even more in la-la land, would such a Werewolf Pack take the side
effect damage for using a Zip Gun? How about using a grenade at close
range? Using a Bomb(at any range)?
And, even if the text said that, would anyone play with it anyway? What
if they also weren't Unique?
Not that they need to be errata'd. Some cards were meant to just die;
but, they do make excellent proxy cards, I must say; most players in our
group have 20 or more of them.
--
Pat Ricochet
Soul Jar'rn Fool of Atlanta
"What if there weren't any theoretical questions?"
LSJ
> For purely academic interest, if the Werewolf Pack was "immune to
> damage from weapons," would they then NOT take the Talbot's Chainsaw
> collateral damage if it was applied to them? I mean, is that really
> "damage from the weapon?" Isn't it just an effect by card text?
An effect by a weapon's card text.
I'd rule that Talbot's untap damage is "damage from a weapon".
> To get even more in la-la land, would such a Werewolf Pack take the
> side effect damage for using a Zip Gun? How about using a grenade at
> close range? Using a Bomb(at any range)?
Same thing. Yes to all (if a Werewolf was immune to "damage from
weapons").
Jozxyqk
> if they also weren't Unique?
> Not that they need to be errata'd. Some cards were meant to just die;
> but, they do make excellent proxy cards, I must say; most players in our
> group have 20 or more of them.
Heh.. The first deck I ever made, being built out of a small pool of cards,
included a Werewolf Pack. When it came out, the experienced players at
the table snickered.. well, they out-and-out laughed at me. :)
Now that I understand the game a little better, I understand why they
suck, compared to other allies at comparable costs.
However, they're good for shock value.
Also, they're not such bad blockers, if you can waste the pool to
get them out (or Steal them, as happened a few times in that game).
Are there any cards out there that reduce the cost of playing Allies?
or Gangrel who get such a reduced cost? Or cards that retreive Allies
from the Ash heap directly into play without paying the cost?
Hmm. That gives me an idea.
Has the concept of an Abomination been introduced into Jyhad up til now?
Halcyan 2
>or Gangrel who get such a reduced cost? Or cards that retreive Allies
>from the Ash heap directly into play without paying the cost?
The only cards that help reduce cost (pool-wise) are Regina Giovannia and the
Little Tailor. The Little Tailor doesn't help with Werewolf (not Warewolf)
Packs, though Regina does. Regina saves you a pool per pack, but for 10 pool,
this really isn't an effective way.
If you want to get technical, you can also reduce the cost for allies such as
Courier (which rely on blood, not pool cost). Things like Ankara Citadel can
lower the cost in this situation.
The closest thing to bringing them back is Compel the Spirit which is great,
though it can only be used within a turn of the critter dying.
All and all, there aren't that many great options for allies. The new Vagabond
Mystic can greatly improve the staying value of the Pack. Other than that,
maybe try a Gangrel/Giovanni Necro deck with Ambrosius, Werewolf Pack, Renegade
Garou, etc.?
>Hmm. That gives me an idea.
>Has the concept of an Abomination been introduced into Jyhad up til now?
Ugh. All an Abomination really is, is a munchkin's wet dream. One of the most
dreaded questions in a VtM game is when some new guy asks if he can be an
Abomination. (I was never a big Werewolf: The Apocalypse fan myself).
But in Jyhad, the Abomination just *might* work. Some variation on the Renegade
Garou. Unique, maybe a rush, and some hideous and nasty ability and penalty.
The Abomination should be able to make short work of the Renegade Garou and
might even be able to take out a War Ghoul with no effort. So the idea could
work, but I really don't like it. I figure there'll print an Abomination ally
card the day they decide to print Samuel Haight as an ally as well...
Halcyan 2
Reyda
"LSJ" <vte...@white-wolf.com> a écrit dans le message news:
94smlg$c54$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> Pat Ricochet <sp...@socrates.gatech.edu> wrote:
> > For purely academic interest, if the Werewolf Pack was "immune to
> > damage from weapons," would they then NOT take the Talbot's Chainsaw
> > collateral damage if it was applied to them? I mean, is that really
> > "damage from the weapon?" Isn't it just an effect by card text?
>
> An effect by a weapon's card text.
> I'd rule that Talbot's untap damage is "damage from a weapon".
>
> > To get even more in la-la land, would such a Werewolf Pack take the
> > side effect damage for using a Zip Gun? How about using a grenade at
> > close range? Using a Bomb(at any range)?
>
> Same thing. Yes to all (if a Werewolf was immune to "damage from
> weapons").
I play "Memories of Mortality" on Jacko. Then he equips Talbot Chainsaw. Can
he inflict the 3 damage from the talbot on my "Survivalist" ally without
burning it ?
reyda
Jozxyqk
>>Has the concept of an Abomination been introduced into Jyhad up til now?
> Ugh. All an Abomination really is, is a munchkin's wet dream. One of the
> mostdreaded questions in a VtM game is when some new guy asks if he can be
> an Abomination. (I was never a big Werewolf: The Apocalypse fan myself).
Naw, not really. They're the solution to a problem.
They have way too many weaknesses to be playable as characters, if properly
portrayed. If Embraced Garou didn't give completely in to the Beast, they'd
be munchkiny as all hell. But that's more of a philosophical argument, as
well as Storyteller-dependent... ;)
> But in Jyhad, the Abomination just *might* work. Some variation on the
> Renegade Garou. Unique, maybe a rush, and some hideous and nasty ability
> and penalty.
> The Abomination should be able to make short work of the Renegade Garou and
> might even be able to take out a War Ghoul with no effort. So the idea could
> work, but I really don't like it. I figure there'll print an Abomination
> ally card the day they decide to print Samuel Haight as an ally as well...
I'd figure that, technically being Vampires themselves, an Abom would be in
your Crypt, not an ally. The severe penalty, I'd say, is that he has the
ability to Bum's Rush, along with equivalent penalties to Frenzy/Drawing out
the Beast and that is the _only_ action he can perform (not even Hunting, nor
escaping Torpor by himself). And he's got a permanent open Blood Hunt on
him, of course.
Or something like that.
Halcyan 2
>your Crypt, not an ally. The severe penalty, I'd say, is that he has the
>ability to Bum's Rush, along with equivalent penalties to Frenzy/Drawing out
>the Beast and that is the _only_ action he can perform (not even Hunting, nor
>
>escaping Torpor by himself). And he's got a permanent open Blood Hunt on
>him, of course.
>Or something like that.
Well...Gargoyles and Blood Brothers are technically vampires as well, but
they're portrayed as allies in the game.
And Talaq (whose a special case) is also just an ally.
It just seems a bit problematic to actually make the Abomination a Vampire card
IMO.
Halcyan 2
LSJ
> I play "Memories of Mortality" on Jacko. Then he equips Talbot Chainsaw.
> Can he inflict the 3 damage from the talbot on my "Survivalist" ally
> without burning it ?
No:
* Damage is only considered to have come from a minion if the
damage is from a strike or if an effect specifically states
that the damage is dealt by the minion. Damage from other
effects is considered "environmental," and has no particular
source. [RTR 30-JUN-1997]
Jozxyqk
> they're portrayed as allies in the game.
To avoid adding certain one-use disciplines...
If Blood Brothers were in the crypt, it'd be creepy. :)
They'd look something like this:
"Blood Brother": Sabbat. Non-Unique. Capacity 1.
You may tap as many Blood Brothers you control as you wish,
during a single action; combine all disciplines and
capacities and blood, and treat them as a single vampire
for the duration of that action. The "age" of this vampire
is considered to be the highest age of all participating
Brothers. Each Blood Brother participating provides one
optional Additional Strike, and may use an additional weapon
at the appropriate range.
You may choose how damage is distributed amongst your Blood
Brothers; if one of them goes to Torpor during such an action,
all of them go to Torpor.
If one of them is burned during such an action, however, the
rest take one point of aggravated damage instead.
Something like Magic's "banding" ability, only a little more
grotesque. :)