[LSJ] Cost reduction declarations

[ira...@gmail.com]

Hello LSJ,

I searched but couldn't find a definite answer. For the various cards
that optionally reduce the cost of an action, when does a player
declare their intention to reduce the cost?

Here are some examples:
Baldesar Rossellini:
Once each turn, if Baldesar is ready, he can reduce the cost of a
location or of an equipment you play by 1 pool or blood.

Masochism:
Whenever the vampire plays a card, you may remove X rush counters from
this card to reduce that card's blood cost by X.

Ravnos Cache:
When equipping a minion, you may tap this card to use the blood
counters on it to pay some or all of the cost of the equipment.

I think in all of these cases, the player must declare the intention
to reduce when the card is played from the hand. If the card is then
DI'd or Suddened, the counters are not returned, and Baldesar wouldn't
get another chance to reduce that turn. Right?

In the case of Concealed Weapon + Ravnos Cache + DI on the Concealed,
I think that the window for DI is before the weapon is revealed from
the player's hand, and therefore the Ravnos Cache wouldn't have a
chance to activate yet.

I'm definitely not sure about this, though, so I'd appreciate an
official ruling, and maybe even an explanation why it works the way it
does.

Thanks!
Ira

P.S. A different case that is quite clear is:
Ravnos Carnival
Put X currency counters on this card when you play it, where X is the
number of Ravnos you control. If a Ravnos you control successfully
performs an action, you may use counters from the Ravnos Carnival to
pay some or all of the cost in blood (but not pool) for the card. When
the last counter is removed, burn the Ravnos Carnival.

In that case, the player obviously only pays after the action is
successful, by card text.

[LSJ]

ira...@gmail.com wrote:
> Hello LSJ,
>
> I searched but couldn't find a definite answer. For the various cards
> that optionally reduce the cost of an action, when does a player
> declare their intention to reduce the cost?

When paying the cost, unless otherwise stated in card text.

> Here are some examples:
> Baldesar Rossellini:
> Once each turn, if Baldesar is ready, he can reduce the cost of a
> location or of an equipment you play by 1 pool or blood.
>
> Masochism:
> Whenever the vampire plays a card, you may remove X rush counters from
> this card to reduce that card's blood cost by X.
>
> Ravnos Cache:
> When equipping a minion, you may tap this card to use the blood
> counters on it to pay some or all of the cost of the equipment.
>
> I think in all of these cases, the player must declare the intention
> to reduce when the card is played from the hand. If the card is then
> DI'd or Suddened, the counters are not returned, and Baldesar wouldn't
> get another chance to reduce that turn. Right?

Ravnos Cache:
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-cards.jyhad/msg/d1c2f2d6ec4d9392

Baldesar: no overriding text, so (like Ravnos Cache) when paid.

Masochism: "when ... plays", so when the action card is played.

> In the case of Concealed Weapon + Ravnos Cache + DI on the Concealed,
> I think that the window for DI is before the weapon is revealed from
> the player's hand, and therefore the Ravnos Cache wouldn't have a
> chance to activate yet.

Correct.

> I'm definitely not sure about this, though, so I'd appreciate an
> official ruling, and maybe even an explanation why it works the way it
> does.
>
> Thanks!
> Ira
>
> P.S. A different case that is quite clear is:
> Ravnos Carnival
> Put X currency counters on this card when you play it, where X is the
> number of Ravnos you control. If a Ravnos you control successfully
> performs an action, you may use counters from the Ravnos Carnival to
> pay some or all of the cost in blood (but not pool) for the card. When
> the last counter is removed, burn the Ravnos Carnival.
>
> In that case, the player obviously only pays after the action is
> successful, by card text.

Correct.