vtes 3rd edition reprint list in sabbat in france
eRol
here is the link:
http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5731
have some fun ;)
Orpheus
interesting infos... I don't have it, it's only hear-say for me so I won't
reprint anything, but... I think some people are gonna like it !! :-)
--
Orpheus
Nearly made it to LSJ's Killfile !!
"eRol" <errikos.(no spam)oenguen@web(no spam).de> a écrit dans le message de
news: ea9pda$nim$1...@news01.versatel.de...
Huruem
eRol (no spam no spam) a écrit :
You're reading Sabbat in france? I thought you couldn't speak/read
French?
eRol
"Huruem" <Huruem_...@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:1153987185.5...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
I lived for one year near Marseille, so I understand a little bit if you
talk slowly(thats is very, very difficult for the Parisian guys, I know),
reading is a little bit easier. ;)
And no, I dont read Sabbat in France, as I am an old camarilla fart, I read
VEKN France. But there was a link and so the Information Network worked out.
I just asked myself, why do the !Nosferatu have a Intercept Master Card and
the Nosferatu who build the SCHREKnet dont.
Orpheus
> >French?
>
> I lived for one year near Marseille, so I understand a little bit if you
> talk slowly(thats is very, very difficult for the Parisian guys, I know),
> reading is a little bit easier. ;)
Well then if you speak Marseillais you can't understand Parisian, they don't
speak normally like us folks do ! And they don't drink exclusively pastis,
they don't play pétanque... Barbarians, they are !! ;-)
> And no, I dont read Sabbat in France, as I am an old camarilla fart, I
read
> VEKN France.
lol.
> But there was a link and so the Information Network worked out.
>
> I just asked myself, why do the !Nosferatu have a Intercept Master Card
and
> the Nosferatu who build the SCHREKnet dont.
Maybe because the players need hints to play Sabbat from time to time ?
Sure, the logic of the game would imply such a thing, but... There might be
other ways to represent SCHREKnet in Jyhad (and I don't remember, doesn't it
benefit - secretly - both sides of the Clan ?).
--
Orpheus
-----------------------
My story doesn't happen in the sound of the notes
but in the silence between them.
That is where the magic happens.
Echo
eRol
> > I just asked myself, why do the !Nosferatu have a Intercept Master Card
> and
> > the Nosferatu who build the SCHREKnet dont.
>
> Maybe because the players need hints to play Sabbat from time to time ?
> Sure, the logic of the game would imply such a thing, but... There might
be
> other ways to represent SCHREKnet in Jyhad (and I don't remember, doesn't
it
> benefit - secretly - both sides of the Clan ?).
How dare you name the sabbtat and the camarilla in one sentence, you are an
insolent bloke to think of such an defamatory presumption. ;)
Orpheus
an
> insolent bloke to think of such an defamatory presumption. ;)
Well, exactly the same way that I can take the money of both sides on the
same night. Giovanni business knows no such limitations.
But your point is duly noted, as is your deference or lack thereof. We will
speak again of these matters after your precious Camarilla has fallen and
you come crawling back to the "neutrals" for protection. B)
Or maybe you'd trust the Ravnos more with your unlife ?
--
Orpheus
-----------------------
I'm dead serious ! Well, mostly dead...
HC
Can someone copy the list of reprints on this topic please?
Thanks.
Orpheus
>
> Thanks.
You don't have access to the link ??
Anyway, here it is. Enjoy !! :-)
Ablative Skin R
Art Scam R
Art of Pain, The R
Awe R
Banshee Ironwail R
Black Metamorphosis R
Blood of the Sabbat R
Bloodbath R
Body Flare R
Creation Rites U
Daring the Dawn R
Darkness Within U
Dauntain Black Magician (Changeling) R
Decapitate U
Depravity U
Derange R
Direct Intervention U
Disarm R
Dreams of the Sphinx R2
Freak Drive U
Gang Territory R
Gangrel Conspiracy R
Giant's Blood R
Haven Affinity R
Horrid Form U
Hungry Coyote, The R
Immortal Grapple U
Infernal Familiar R
Infernal Pact R
Intimidation R
Ivory Bow R
Living Manse R
Lunatic Eruption R
Magic of the Smith R
Marked Path R
Mylan Horseed (Goblin) R
Nephandus (Mage) R
Nosferatu Kingdom R
Palla Grande R
Parthenon, The U
Patterns in the Chaos R
Perfect Clarity R2
Power Structure R
Powerbase: Montreal R
Protected Resources R
Quickness R
Read the Winds U
Reality Mirror R
Regent R
Restructure R
Sabbat Inquisitor U
Shadow Court Satyr (Changeling) R
Shadow Step R
Sibyl's Tongue R2
Sire's Index Finger R
Slave Auction R
Soul Gem of Etrius R
Spirit Summoning Chamber U
Succubus R
Sunrise Service R
Telepathic Tracking U
Using the Advantage R
Visit from the Capuchin R
War Ghoul R
Weighted Walking Stick U
agzocgud
/Mathias
HC
Orpheus wrote:
> > Can someone copy the list of reprints on this topic please?
> >
> > Thanks.
>
> You don't have access to the link ??
>
>
I,m at work now, i only have access to google.... XD
Thanks for the list
>
Jozxyqk
> Direct Intervention U
I see.
Also note, Camarilla Vitae Slave is NOT on the list, and there's no new
Lasombra starter either, so (assuming this list is accurate), we won't
be seeing it...
Alias
nor Shroud of Absence..
Orpheus
> >
> > I see.
It always was, and was just considered a Rare because it hadn't been
reprinted. This is the best move if we want to keep that card in the game.
What other rarities are changed ? Didn't get a close look at that...
> > Also note, Camarilla Vitae Slave is NOT on the list, and there's no new
> > Lasombra starter either, so (assuming this list is accurate), we won't
> > be seeing it...
No big deal for the CVS, but I'll never understand why they didn't reprint
the Lasombra starter, and did again !Tore for instance. Aren't the Lasombras
leaders of the Sabbat or something ?!
> nor Shroud of Absence..
Yup. Will have to do with my 6.
Noting that I don't think the price of many cards will change : as War Ghoul
isn't fixed in the starter, I don't see why it should go down much ; same
for Black Metamorphosis etc.
So I guess I'll have some cards from the Sabbat War set I won available for
sale... :-)
--
Orpheus
-------------------------
"You'll regret being so damn abusive when the electric UFO gods transphase
in from dimension ten to appoint me manager of the universe".
The Drummer, in Planetary.
Alias
Orpheus wrote:
> > > > Direct Intervention U
> > >
> > > I see.
>
> It always was, and was just considered a Rare because it hadn't been
> reprinted. This is the best move if we want to keep that card in the game.
>
> What other rarities are changed ? Didn't get a close look at that...
>
> > > Also note, Camarilla Vitae Slave is NOT on the list, and there's no new
> > > Lasombra starter either, so (assuming this list is accurate), we won't
> > > be seeing it...
>
> No big deal for the CVS, but I'll never understand why they didn't reprint
> the Lasombra starter, and did again !Tore for instance. Aren't the Lasombras
> leaders of the Sabbat or something ?!
>
> > nor Shroud of Absence..
>
> Yup. Will have to do with my 6.
>
> Noting that I don't think the price of many cards will change : as War Ghoul
> isn't fixed in the starter, I don't see why it should go down much ; same
> for Black Metamorphosis etc.
I think price might go down a lot, depends on quality of the new cards.
so far, it seems like almost none of the shits which haunted the Sabbar
War (from Aggresive Tactics through Up Yours! to Vicissitude Poisoning)
is going to be reprinted, so people will buy a lot of boosters because
of the low risk of getting a wallpaper rare.
As for me, I am definitely going to buy two booster displays.
>
> So I guess I'll have some cards from the Sabbat War set I won available for
> sale... :-)
> --
> Orpheus
> -------------------------
> "You'll regret being so damn abusive when the electric UFO gods transphase
> in from dimension ten to appoint me manager of the universe".
>
> The Drummer, in Planetary.
There is No Camarilla - sweetest words ever printed on a VTES card.
Andreas Nusser
>>Noting that I don't think the price of many cards will change : as War Ghoul
>>isn't fixed in the starter, I don't see why it should go down much ; same
>>for Black Metamorphosis etc.
>
>
> I think price might go down a lot, depends on quality of the new cards.
> so far, it seems like almost none of the shits which haunted the Sabbar
> War (from Aggresive Tactics through Up Yours! to Vicissitude Poisoning)
> is going to be reprinted, so people will buy a lot of boosters because
> of the low risk of getting a wallpaper rare.
I do not know if the prices for singles such as War Ghoul and Direct
Intervention will change. I have not seen any drops when the Anniversary
Sets came out. People might hae easier access but seeing the demand
for cards just DI will not affect the prices.
However I will definitely encounter more Decks inclduing the Sabbat OOP
decks such as the War Ghould Decks. In addition to that I think that a
lot of people will play more DIs.
Andreas
--
Andreas Nusser
Walch & Nusser GbR
Visit premier VTES shop in Europe
at http://www.vtes.de
XZealot
agzocgud wrote:
> Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>
That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
They are changing the layout again. :)
Comments Welcome,
Norman S. Brown, Jr
XZealot
Archon of the Swamp
Andreas Nusser
> agzocgud wrote:
>
>>Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>>
>
>
> That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
> They are changing the layout again. :)
Oh come on, Norman. You have been misinformed. They do not change the
layout. They are changing the Jyhad green and golden backs of the cards.
Andreas
XZealot
I am firing my intern that works for White Wolf! :)
Joshua Duffin
"Orpheus" <orphe...@DEADSPAMfree.fr> wrote in message
news:44c894c9$0$32182$636a...@news.free.fr...
> You don't have access to the link ??
>
> Anyway, here it is. Enjoy !! :-)
Thanks for the post! I also can't get there from here. :-)
> Ablative Skin R
Ew, why bother? I can't remember ever seeing this played. Isn't Masochism
way better?
> Mylan Horseed (Goblin) R
I see he's a 'staple' now. Excellent. :-)
Super sweet:
> Derange R
> Direct Intervention U
> Dreams of the Sphinx R2
> Giant's Blood R
> Horrid Form U
> Hungry Coyote, The R
> Ivory Bow R
> Lunatic Eruption R
> Read the Winds U
Pretty sweet:
> Awe R
> Decapitate U
> Disarm R
> Freak Drive U
> Immortal Grapple U
> Parthenon, The U
> Perfect Clarity R2
> Telepathic Tracking U
> Visit from the Capuchin R
> War Ghoul R
> Weighted Walking Stick U
Josh
can never have enough dreams
pd...@lightlink.com
Jozxyqk wrote:
> > Direct Intervention U
>
> I see.
Man. I mean, yeah, ok, if DI needs to exist, it is probably better that
it is Uncommon, rather than Rare. But man, now we'll see even *more* of
them...
Stupid Direct Intervention.
-Peter
Fred Scott
news:1154011515.3...@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> agzocgud wrote:
> > Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>
> That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
> They are changing the layout again. :)
Arg! :-P
Fred
pd...@lightlink.com
Orpheus wrote:
> It always was, and was just considered a Rare because it hadn't been
> reprinted. This is the best move if we want to keep that card in the game.
Really? I thought it was a Rare in Sabbat (and it did get reprinted in
the SW !Brujah starter, for what it is worth). But it is very likely I
was mistaken. In any case, yeah, like, if the card needs to be in the
game, having it an uncommon in the new base set is clearly the right
choice. But man...
-Peter
Fred Scott
>> > > Direct Intervention U
>> >
>> > I see.
>
> It always was, and was just considered a Rare because it hadn't been
> reprinted.
It was reprinted in the Sabbat War Brujah Antitribuu starter.
As for being printed as an uncommon in The Sabbat, no it was not.
WotC created a card list listing rarities in the Sabbat that had
something like four or six (I forget which) rare cards listed
as uncommons and the same number of uncommon cards listed as
rares. Direct Intervention was one of the former. White Wolf
picked up WotC's list and treated it as accurate (hence it's
listed on White Wolf's lists as being uncommon) but it was not.
I opened enough Sabbat booster packs to know where the Direct
Intervention cards were slotted. I assure you, there are no more
The Sabbat Direct Intervention cards in existence than Camarilla
Vitae Slaves.
Assuming this card list is accurate (I swear, if we keep treating
these things as gospel, some day someone's gonna have a lot of
fun at our expense), there will be an unprecedented flood of DIs
hitting peoples' card collections. Which will be great! (Other
than that it's really going to annoy David Cherryholmes. But
WTF.)
Fred
tobinator
> > They are changing the layout again. :)
>
> Oh come on, Norman. You have been misinformed. They do not change the
> layout. They are changing the Jyhad green and golden backs of the cards.
>
> Andreas
Not only are they changing the cardbacks but they're including, in only
5 random boosters, a special "Bloody Ticket," that will grant the
bearer a tour of the Spawning Pool from which cards like Eyes of the
Dead are created.
:)
-tpl
Andreas Nusser
> Andreas Nusser wrote:
>
>>XZealot schrieb:
>>
>>>agzocgud wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
>>>They are changing the layout again. :)
>>
>>Oh come on, Norman. You have been misinformed. They do not change the
>>layout. They are changing the Jyhad green and golden backs of the cards.
>>
>
>
> I am firing my intern that works for White Wolf! :)
Who is your intern?
Mine is the Hidden Lurker right in Oscar´s office. ;)
--
Andreas Nusser
atomweaver
@fed1read07:
> "Orpheus" <orphe...@DEADSPAMfree.fr> wrote in message
> news:44c8a462$0$32176$636a...@news.free.fr...
>>> > > Direct Intervention U
>>> >
>>> > I see.
>>
>> It always was, and was just considered a Rare because it hadn't been
>> reprinted.
>
> It was reprinted in the Sabbat War Brujah Antitribuu starter.
>
> As for being printed as an uncommon in The Sabbat, no it was not.
> WotC created a card list listing rarities in the Sabbat that had
> something like four or six (I forget which) rare cards listed
> as uncommons and the same number of uncommon cards listed as
> rares. Direct Intervention was one of the former. White Wolf
> picked up WotC's list and treated it as accurate (hence it's
> listed on White Wolf's lists as being uncommon) but it was not.
> I opened enough Sabbat booster packs to know where the Direct
> Intervention cards were slotted. I assure you, there are no more
> The Sabbat Direct Intervention cards in existence than Camarilla
> Vitae Slaves.
>
Fred is right...
I had to go into the Wayback Machine, but I found the resultant thread
of an eight-box opening of Sabbat boosters, checking agianst the WotC
rarity list
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-
cards.jyhad/msg/12ff0b194f2eb2df?dmode=source
Note, that list checks against the WotC list of the time. I haven't
checked it against what WW currently has at their site.
DaveZ
Atom Weaver
Fred Scott
news:Xns980D7CA37A...@207.115.17.102...
> Fred is right...
>
> I had to go into the Wayback Machine, but I found the resultant thread
> of an eight-box opening of Sabbat boosters, checking agianst the WotC
> rarity list
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.trading-
> cards.jyhad/msg/12ff0b194f2eb2df?dmode=source
>
> Note, that list checks against the WotC list of the time. I haven't
> checked it against what WW currently has at their site.
I don't know when they had it totally right, then. The list I saw
that they had posted for a long time always had the same eight or
ten errors I related. And White Wolf appeared to pick up the same
list, as far as I could see. I'll bet if I went over them, the
same errors would be there right now.
Fred
who doesn't really have the steely tenacity for this sort of thing
right at the moment...
Huruem
eRol (no spam no spam) a écrit :
> "Huruem" <Huruem_...@hotmail.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:1153987185.5...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> eRol (no spam no spam) a écrit :
>
> >> just found it:
> >>
> >> here is the link:
> >>
> >> http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5731
> >>
> >> have some fun ;)
> >
> >You're reading Sabbat in france? I thought you couldn't speak/read
> >French?
>
> I lived for one year near Marseille, so I understand a little bit if you
> talk slowly(thats is very, very difficult for the Parisian guys, I know),
> reading is a little bit easier. ;)
> And no, I dont read Sabbat in France, as I am an old camarilla fart, I read
> VEKN France. But there was a link and so the Information Network worked out.
>
> I just asked myself, why do the !Nosferatu have a Intercept Master Card and
> the Nosferatu who build the SCHREKnet dont.
I honestly think that you should read Sabbat in France more frequently
if you can. I read both, and I can't tell you how SIF is more
interesting in all points, whether you're talking about deckbuilding or
whatever. There are tons of strategy articles, tons of decks and tons
of great French players using it.
Don't look at me like that ! I know, they are great but still frenchies
^^
But maybe it's just my fiendish passion as a tzimisce that is
speaking... or not.
Huruem
... Gonna give Orpheus a good ol' spanking tonight.
Ankur Gupta
> they had posted for a long time always had the same eight or ten errors
> I related. And White Wolf appeared to pick up the same list, as far as
> I could see. I'll bet if I went over them, the same errors would be
> there right now.
Since you seem to be the only person at present who actually knows what
the disparity is, do you think you'd have the time to post them sometime?
I'm kind of curious to see what the errors were.
Thanks,
Ankur
bluedevil
Fred Scott wrote:
> Assuming this card list is accurate (I swear, if we keep treating
> these things as gospel, some day someone's gonna have a lot of
> fun at our expense), there will be an unprecedented flood of DIs
> hitting peoples' card collections. Which will be great! (Other
> than that it's really going to annoy David Cherryholmes. But
> WTF.)
Grab your ankles everybody! It's time to make omelettes!!
Actually I'm just hoping more people will get an understanding of what
sitting between 8 DI's feels like. One or two DI's in any given deck
is no big deal. The cumulative effect of everybody having 3 or 4 in
each deck is going to be fucked up like a soup sandwich. If you think
weenie auspex is some kind of a problem in the game, wait until you see
this.
And if you think tossing 4 master slots at DI is any more of a stretch
than auto-blowing 4 slots on blood dolls, I think you underestimate the
return on DI. It ousts. It snatches VP's. It implodes combos. It's
sick.
Orpheus
I wanna go there !!
(and kill an idiot or twenty...)
Orpheus
> ... Gonna give Orpheus a good ol' spanking tonight.
Ruru, I told you not to expose your sexual fantasies all over the place,
you're a Prince, even if there's no one in your town, you should maintain a
certain status... ;-)
Oh, and about the spanking :
KEEP DREAMING !! B)
Klai...@gmail.com
to uncommon, about time too.
James Coupe
Because, yes, the right thing to do is make commonly wanted cards like
Direct Intervention super-rare. And to make Immortal Grapple even
rarer! One per thousand boxes of boosters!
--
James Coupe
PGP Key: 0x5D623D5D YOU ARE IN ERROR.
EBD690ECD7A1FB457CA2 NO-ONE IS SCREAMING.
13D7E668C3695D623D5D THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION.
jeff...@pacbell.net
> > Can someone copy the list of reprints on this topic please?
> >
> > Thanks.
>
>
> Anyway, here it is. Enjoy !! :-)
>
This is the only card in this list which is multi-disciplinary. Sure,
it's perfect for the Tzimisce, but I was kind of hoping/expecting there
would be more multi-discipline cards that made the cut.
Jeff
Ben Swainbank
Orpheus wrote:
> > Can someone copy the list of reprints on this topic please?
>
>
Good list. Interesting there are no Commons though. Does the source say
this is a complete list of the reprints or should we assume this just a
list of the Rare and Uncommon reprints?
-Ben Swainbank
Orpheus
It is. It was a choice for an article in a magazine, I guess the readers
don't care about the commons...
atomweaver
news:Pine.LNX.4.63.06...@fiordland.cs.duke.edu:
Here's what is different on the WW site, as compared to the rarity list
that the newsgroup collected back in '97. All of these are listed as
Sabbat Uncommon, but should probably be listed as rares.
Cardinal Sin: Insubordination
Catatonic Fear
Command the Beast
Consecration Rites
*Detection
Direct Intervention
Festivo dello Estinto
Lyndhurst Estate, NY
*Malk Derangement: Paranoia
*Mistaken Identity
Revelations
*Out of Control
*Unacceptable Appearance
*I can tell you from direct experience that the Clan Hosers showed up in
one of the two Rare slots. Every time. Guaranteed. I know this going
back over five to nine years, to the last time I opened a Sabbat
booster, because you remember that that stupid clan hoser could have
been a War Ghoul. Every time. Guaranteed.
DaveZ
Atom Weaver
Fred Scott
news:Pine.LNX.4.63.06...@fiordland.cs.duke.edu...
I'd have to do it the some time I'm at home, since I can't seem to bring
up my old postscript files on any app software I have at my disposal now
and my physical lists are there.
Taking a quick look at the list I could bring up, though, it looks like
my memory is all FU again (as usual) and that David may have been basically
correct. I can't find any examples of uncommons that were listed as rares
on the list. The one example in David's old post was Cardinal Benediction,
which got fixed, along with some of the rares. I think there's still
about a dozen or so rares that are still listed as uncommons in White Wolf's
list. And Steam Tunnels, which White Wolf is showing as a common is
listed as uncommon in this particular list of mine. I'll have to go home
and check that because I didn't recall any (holdover) errors involving
commons.
There may have also been some issues about certain Rs and Us being R2s
and U2s, explaining why there are less than 110 rares and uncommons
in that list. But I don't have anything about on the list I can see.
Fred (donning the Nerdrage Ring and becoming infused with the Steely
Tenacity...)
Fred Scott
> that the newsgroup collected back in '97. All of these are listed as
> Sabbat Uncommon, but should probably be listed as rares.
>
> Cardinal Sin: Insubordination
> Catatonic Fear
> Command the Beast
> Consecration Rites
> *Detection
> Direct Intervention
> Festivo dello Estinto
> Lyndhurst Estate, NY
> *Malk Derangement: Paranoia
> *Mistaken Identity
> Revelations
> *Out of Control
> *Unacceptable Appearance
Yes, these are the exact same ones I came up with. Except the
Steam-Tunnels-as-an-uncommon thing.
> *I can tell you from direct experience that the Clan Hosers showed up in
> one of the two Rare slots. Every time. Guaranteed. I know this going
> back over five to nine years, to the last time I opened a Sabbat
> booster, because you remember that that stupid clan hoser could have
> been a War Ghoul. Every time. Guaranteed.
I remember thinking it was a good thing clan hosers were rares.
That way, I didn't have many of them. The next step I hoped (which
was more less what happened), was to make _so_ rare we'd never see
them all! :-)
And War Ghoul should have been uncommon.
Fred
talonz
bluedevil wrote:
> Fred Scott wrote:
>
> > hitting peoples' card collections. Which will be great! (Other
> > than that it's really going to annoy David Cherryholmes. But
> > WTF.)
>
> Grab your ankles everybody! It's time to make omelettes!!
>
> Actually I'm just hoping more people will get an understanding of what
> sitting between 8 DI's feels like. One or two DI's in any given deck
> is no big deal. The cumulative effect of everybody having 3 or 4 in
> each deck is going to be fucked up like a soup sandwich. If you think
> weenie auspex is some kind of a problem in the game, wait until you see
> this.
>
Well we could always hope and pray that its going to be reprinted with
some kind of erratta/restriction on it dave...at least, those of us
with any sense of the impact that ridiculous card has on the game will.
G
Atom Weaver
James Coupe wrote:
> In message <1153995995.8...@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>,
> agzocgud <per_m...@hotmail.com> writes:
> >Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>
> Because, yes, the right thing to do is make commonly wanted cards like
> Direct Intervention super-rare. And to make Immortal Grapple even
> rarer! One per thousand boxes of boosters!
>
Aye. I'm not seeing the need for the So Upset, yet. I don't see any
rocks in the gumball machine (commons reprinted as rares), and we don't
yet know the content of the starters (hoping a WarGhoul or two will
show up there, too. This list doesn't rule that out), so I'm not even
distraught yet that War Ghoul wasn't made uncommon.
DZ
AW
agzocgud
of these changes get screwed.
/Mathias
Klai...@gmail.com
each deck. :) It is really nice card as it gives decks without good
combat discplines (such as dom/obf) some decent rush defense.
Alias
agzocgud wrote:
> There are people that trade, collect and sell these cards, and because
> of these changes get screwed.
>
> /Mathias
Fuck them. This game is primarily for players.
Orpheus
> There are people that trade, collect and sell these cards, and because
> of these changes get screwed.
>
> /Mathias
I wouldn't go as far as Alia,s but if you're in the collecting / selling
trade, then it's all about betting that you'll get more than what you
originally spent, so there's a chance factor in that anyway. If you're not
ready for such risks - which can eventually also help you make more money at
times - you should change your trade.
But yes, this game is for players, and when changes are made that help
players (as with Creation Rites, as opposed to some shit we saw in LoB) I'm
quite happy with that.
Orpheus
That certainly would be nice, and if they don't do it now they probably
never will.
bluedevil
Obedience, Absorb the Mind, Swallowed by the Night, Behind You!,
Gemini's Mirror, Mask of Judas, every disciplineless option out there
and, lastly, not being tapped. I'm sure we have different ideas about
what "decent" is.
But thank you for lending weight to my argument. The dom/obf guy
thinks this will be "nice", and those are exactly the kind of decks
which can most easily afford to jam 4 of them in.
John Flournoy
agzocgud wrote:
> There are people that trade, collect and sell these cards, and because
> of these changes get screwed.
>
> /Mathias
Let's look at your three options: Trade, collect, and sell.
Traders either want to trade for the cards to play with, or to collect,
or to sell. Nobody trades _just_ for the experience of trading.
Irrelevant.
People who collect these cards generally want to either:
....Collect/Own one of every card from every set, in which case they
are looking to get a certain number of rares and uncommons out of an
upcoming set, making 'what the specific cards are' relatively moot (it
doesn't matter if Card A is a rare and Card B is an uncommon or the
other way around, since I know I want one of each in the end)
....Collect/Own one of every card (not caring about from what set), in
which case they already have most of the cards being reprinted - for
those they don't, 'lower rarity' (R->U) is a BONUS to them (easier to
finish the collection), and U->R just means that they'll look to older
sets or players who already have a stack of the U version and got rares
they don't need for playing.
People who want the cards for the resale value might have reason to be
upset. But you know what? Ultimately, they're hoping to either sell the
cards to collectors or players, and the people who make the game are
not making a game with the intent of pleasing secondary sellers who pay
WW not one penny more for the cards than a player or collector.
If there are 1,000 people playing the game, those people are going to
buy the new expansion they want to play the game, and they're going to
do so regardless if they're getting the cards from WW, a retailer,
their friends, or someone auctioning stuff on ebay. Making the game
more appealing (or preventing it from 'screwing') the resellers doesn't
change the fact that there are still the exact same 1,000 people
wanting to acquire those cards from _somebody_ as an end-user.
So, yes, a small number of people who want the cards independently of
playing with them will have reason to be upset about changing rarities,
and those people happen to be the ones whose opinions should (and
probably do) matter the absolute least.
-John Flournoy
Fred Scott
news:1154068511.2...@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> There are people that trade, collect and sell these cards, and because
> of these changes get screwed.
So whenever a card has been printed in an overly rare slot, like
Immortal Grapple (once a rare card despite being highly useful
as a multiple-copies-per-deck combat card) or Freak Drive (also a
rare, used 50+ copies in an Una deck), the game should ignore
it? Sorry, collecting game cards is a risky business. Better
they should suffer than the game as a whole.
Fred
John Flournoy
agzocgud wrote:
> Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
"WTF! Didn't they learn from the LAST time that changing rarities
means... um... that the game _still_ sells well... CURSE THEM!"
On the contrary; I think WW has learned very well what happens when you
change the rarities of cards, which has been happening for a very long
time (since lots of cards went from 'rare' or 'uncommon' to 'fixed' as
early as Sabbat War.)
> /Mathias
-John Flournoy
James Coupe
agzocgud <per_m...@hotmail.com> writes:
>There are people that trade, collect and sell these cards, and because
>of these changes get screwed.
And if they've been hoarding War Ghouls bought for many dollars at a
time, they get screwed anyway the day the Sabbat 3rd Edition expansion
was announced.
Remember kids, the right way to help the game thrive in the long term is
to make it hard for new people to access because the cards they want are
stupidly rare, because it helps out a few collectors maintain the value
of a piece of cardboard as being twenty or thirty dollars. Because that
works so well!
Busy now. Have to go cry a river for the poor, poor people trying to
get rich off investing in pieces of cardboard rather than, you know,
things with some intrinsic value.
librarian
Orpheus wrote:
> > Can someone copy the list of reprints on this topic please?
> >
>
> You don't have access to the link ??
>
>
[snip list]
Does anyone think that the only new cards will be the vamps again, like
Cam Ed? Or do you think it's pretty likely that there will also be new
library cards. The sales info IIRC said about 100 new cards, which is
really only enough for vamps. I just counted the Cam Ed list, and
there were 100 new vamps exactly. And maybe the new cards will be
exclusively commons. That would be nice. Judging by the rare list
posted here, that would make a pack buy awesome.
best -
chris
(looking foward to drafting like a madman).
Blooded Sand
Theft
Blackmail
Sell drugs, star in a porno, WHATEVER!!!!!!!!
Please can I just get enough money to buy like 10 boxes,
PLEEEEEEEEEEEEASE!!!!
Need 10 War Ghouls, gonna get about one a box. Also means got more
commons and the like to give to weenies
(Maybe this means I can finally have my wall of aid from bats!)
James Coupe
librarian <ino...@ix.netcom.com> writes:
>Does anyone think that the only new cards will be the vamps again, like
>Cam Ed? Or do you think it's pretty likely that there will also be new
>library cards.
Camarilla Edition had a number of new library cards in it, such as
Weighted Walking Stick.
There weren't huge numbers of them, but that's fairly inevitable when
the major purpose of a base set is to recirculate the cards for core
strategies rather than inventing and extending new ones.
Daneel
wrote:
> XZealot schrieb:
>> agzocgud wrote:
>>
>>> Changing rarities AGAIN. WTF! Don´t they ever learn?
>>>
>>
>>
>> That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
>> They are changing the layout again. :)
>
> Oh come on, Norman. You have been misinformed. They do not change the
> layout. They are changing the Jyhad green and golden backs of the cards.
Actually, what I've heared, is that they are doing both - and more; to
make VTES more popular, the new set is going to be fully MtG compatible.
--
Regards,
Daneel
Daneel
wrote:
> Direct Intervention U
Fuck. Now any deck that sits down to actually *do* anything except
for masturbating for 2 hours will have 16 DIs pitted against him
(insted of the current standard 8). Great. If we cannot just ban
Direct "Silver Bullet" Intervention (for cards like PTO and bunch
make it unfortunately necessary), couldn't we just make sure that
there are as few as possible copies in circulation? Honestly...
:-(
--
Regards,
Daneel
sutekh_23
Well, we were asking for disciplinless bleed reduction and in some
twisted way it fits the bill :)
Ankur Gupta
>
> Fuck. Now any deck that sits down to actually *do* anything except for
> masturbating for 2 hours will have 16 DIs pitted against him (insted of
> the current standard 8). Great. If we cannot just ban Direct "Silver
> Bullet" Intervention (for cards like PTO and bunch make it unfortunately
> necessary), couldn't we just make sure that there are as few as possible
> copies in circulation? Honestly... :-(
No. Though I dislike DI myself, I say if they're gonna stay in the game,
roll them out en masse. If they're truly that useful, let everyone have
them. I'd strangle someone if say Blood Doll (a well-established strong
master) were equally as difficult to obtain.
Ankur
Pat
news:Pine.LNX.4.63.06...@fiordland.cs.duke.edu...
Agreed. The recent Dreams of the Sphinx reprints were incredibly helpful in
that regard.
- Pat
XZealot
Man, even for this forum, that was a low blow.
Comments Welcome,
Norman S. Brown, Jr
XZealot
Archon of the Swamp
Orpheus
I do think that for a while after 3rd Ed we'll see lots and lots of Directs
everywhere, and that after a while it will calm down. Why ? Because :
- it is a powerful card, but as such must be well played, if not it's very
disruptive ; it took me a long while to learn how and when to play it, and
I'm not the only one
- the place taken by DIs can't be allowed to other Masters, and while
countering other player's strategies can be useful, it won't win you the
game in many cases
- DI is best in defensive decks ; offensive decks will prefer Suddern
Reversals anytime, which is why I barely play any of the DIs I have anymore
(I never play wall and prefer active decks to those which wait forever and
ever).
So, wait and see, but I don't think there will be much more than a
fad -except of course for those very few people who actually would have
played thoroughly with DIs before but just didn't have them.
And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
Orpheus
> On Thu, 27 Jul 2006 17:06:12 +0200, Andreas Nusser <a.nu...@vekn.de>
> wrote:
>
> > XZealot schrieb:
> >> agzocgud wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> That's not the worst of it. Okay, prepare yourself.
> >> They are changing the layout again. :)
> >
> > Oh come on, Norman. You have been misinformed. They do not change the
> > layout. They are changing the Jyhad green and golden backs of the cards.
>
> Actually, what I've heared, is that they are doing both - and more; to
> make VTES more popular, the new set is going to be fully MtG compatible.
You mean more geek-compatible ? More 12-years-old compatible ?
--
Orpheus
-----------------------
I'm dead serious ! Well, mostly dead...
Ankur Gupta
>> game, roll them out en masse. If they're truly that useful, let
>> everyone have them. I'd strangle someone if say Blood Doll (a
>> well-established strong master) were equally as difficult to obtain.
>
> I do think that for a while after 3rd Ed we'll see lots and lots of
> Directs everywhere, and that after a while it will calm down. Why ?
> Because :
>
> - it is a powerful card, but as such must be well played, if not it's
> very disruptive ; it took me a long while to learn how and when to play
> it, and I'm not the only one
Once they learn it will again become commonly played, perhaps.
> - the place taken by DIs can't be allowed to other Masters, and while
> countering other player's strategies can be useful, it won't win you the
> game in many cases
This seems to be an empty observation, since in many cases, it *will* win
you games. My experience has seen rather the opposite.
> - DI is best in defensive decks ; offensive decks will prefer Suddern
> Reversals anytime, which is why I barely play any of the DIs I have
> anymore (I never play wall and prefer active decks to those which wait
> forever and ever).
DI is fantastic for decks that move forward. Want a one-shot,
general-purpose defense? Slap in a DI.
> And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
Though possible, I default to original card text (and its implications)
until shown the error of my ways. That seems reasonable, no?
Ankur
bluedevil
Orpheus wrote:
> - it is a powerful card, but as such must be well played, if not it's very
> disruptive ; it took me a long while to learn how and when to play it, and
> I'm not the only one
Certainly it's a card that invites crystal-ball gazing, but it doesn't
really have to be that complicated. Deflection, Freak Drive, Immortal
Grapple, game-wrecker actions like PTO or Sense Dep..... the list goes
on, but I don't think you need to be some kind of super genius to know
when to drop your DI on the table.
> - the place taken by DIs can't be allowed to other Masters, and while
> countering other player's strategies can be useful, it won't win you the
> game in many cases
I would argue that DI will win you a game more often and more clearly
than just about any other single card play. Yes it's a master card
slot but room can be made, and usually the more "cheesy" the deck the
easier that will be.
> - DI is best in defensive decks ; offensive decks will prefer Suddern
> Reversals anytime, which is why I barely play any of the DIs I have anymore
> (I never play wall and prefer active decks to those which wait forever and
> ever).
Deflection is best in a defensive deck too. If something is insanely
good it will get played whether it's being put in the "best" archetype
or not. Heck, if it's good enough it will get bolted on like a second
thumb.
> So, wait and see, but I don't think there will be much more than a
> fad -except of course for those very few people who actually would have
> played thoroughly with DIs before but just didn't have them.
Somebody give me a call when the fad is over then, because I still say
it's going to suck ass.
> And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
Maybe, but I doubt it.
Kevin M.
> I would argue that DI will win you a game more often and more clearly
> than just about any other single card play. Yes it's a master card
> slot but room can be made, and usually the more "cheesy" the deck the
> easier that will be.
It would seem that Suddening an early Blood Doll or Minion Tap is more
damaging than any DI effect I can think of. But maybe that is just my
experience (and why I usually start out each deck with 4 SR).
Kevin M., Prince of Las Vegas
"Know your enemy, and know yourself; in one-thousand battles
you shall never be in peril." -- Sun Tzu, *The Art of War*
"Contentment... Complacency... Catastrophe!" -- Joseph Chevalier
Daneel
wrote:
> I do think that for a while after 3rd Ed we'll see lots and lots of
> Directs
> everywhere, and that after a while it will calm down. Why ? Because :
I'd challenge You to that statement. I'm pretty sure the causality is
simple - more DIs in circulation, more people can put 4+ copies in
their decks, not only people who can actually play it to win, but
also folks who can only play it to make others lose. Now that's
aggravating. And unfun.
> - the place taken by DIs can't be allowed to other Masters, and while
> countering other player's strategies can be useful, it won't win you the
> game in many cases
Countering other players strategies is probably the single most
efficient way to win. Sure, cancelling a single card is far from
being a full counter-strategy, but well played, it's all the
difference.
> - DI is best in defensive decks ; offensive decks will prefer Suddern
> Reversals anytime, which is why I barely play any of the DIs I have
> anymore
> (I never play wall and prefer active decks to those which wait forever
> and
> ever).
Nope. DI is better. If I'm playing bleedzooka (probably the fastest
deck there is)... Suddening a Minion Tap means I need to get in,
like, one or two bleeds fewer. Directing a PTO means I actually
*have* the minion to place those bleeds... and maybe more.
> So, wait and see, but I don't think there will be much more than a
> fad -except of course for those very few people who actually would have
> played thoroughly with DIs before but just didn't have them.
No, don't think so. I would hope You are right - but my gut tells me
You just aren't.
> And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
How exactly? Cancels a minion card *on Wednesdays*? C'mon, be realistic! ;)
--
Regards,
Daneel
Daneel
wrote:
> bluedevil <david.che...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I would argue that DI will win you a game more often and more clearly
>> than just about any other single card play. Yes it's a master card
>> slot but room can be made, and usually the more "cheesy" the deck the
>> easier that will be.
>
> It would seem that Suddening an early Blood Doll or Minion Tap is more
> damaging than any DI effect I can think of. But maybe that is just my
> experience (and why I usually start out each deck with 4 SR).
I disagree. You either overestimate that early Blood Doll, or underestimate
the "any other DI effects" part. I used to say, Blood Doll is for those
decks that don't really know what they want to do - there is always a
better Master for a more self-confident deck.
Now I don't say that anymore, but still, I think the game value is
overrated. On the average even an early Blood Doll won't net you that
much. You recover, like, 2-3 blood off the minion, and then pump back
1-2. I'd rather play Corporal Reservoire if I could in most decks.
As for DI... I don't really even want to go into that. DIing Voter, bounce,
Freak, PTO... The list is pretty long and convincing. I've lost
innumerable
VPs to DI. If there weren't even worse minion cards in the game, I'd lobby
for banning it outright.
--
Regards,
Daneel
XZealot
> > And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
>
> How exactly? Cancels a minion card *on Wednesdays*? C'mon, be realistic! ;)
How about "Cancels an action card". That's pretty concrete.
talonz
XZealot wrote:
> > > And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
> >
> > How exactly? Cancels a minion card *on Wednesdays*? C'mon, be realistic! ;)
>
> How about "Cancels an action card". That's pretty concrete.
>
How about 'once per methuselah per game'?
Concrete, and already in use ala Retribution, which has a far greater
opportunity cost and arguably less impact on the game.
G
bluedevil
Kevin M. wrote:
> It would seem that Suddening an early Blood Doll or Minion Tap is more
> damaging than any DI effect I can think of. But maybe that is just my
> experience (and why I usually start out each deck with 4 SR).
DI is more of a sniper card. I mean, DI'ing any Freak Driving monster
is probably a good play, but doing it on turn 12, when there's 10
minutes left in the game, people have cut the shit and started to play,
and lots of people are on the verge of being ousted..... that's when
DI'ing some key component of somebody's play just collapses the table
in a whole other direction. It's like Delaying Tactics vs. the seat
switchers used to be.... sure they can just call it again next turn,
but when things are tight +1 turn is the difference between winning and
losing.
Orpheus
> On Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:15:58 +0200, Orpheus <orphe...@DEADSPAMfree.fr>
> wrote:
>
> > I do think that for a while after 3rd Ed we'll see lots and lots of
> > Directs
> > everywhere, and that after a while it will calm down. Why ? Because :
>
> I'd challenge You to that statement.
Ok, I bet you a drink, that one can pay the other when / if we meet. ;-)
Let's say we'll value the situation one year after 3rd Ed (if we both still
play lol).
> I'm pretty sure the causality is
> simple - more DIs in circulation, more people can put 4+ copies in
> their decks, not only people who can actually play it to win, but
> also folks who can only play it to make others lose. Now that's
> aggravating. And unfun.
I didn't even think of such a factor, but you're right, as sad as it is it
might be relevant.
> > - the place taken by DIs can't be allowed to other Masters, and while
> > countering other player's strategies can be useful, it won't win you the
> > game in many cases
>
> Countering other players strategies is probably the single most
> efficient way to win. Sure, cancelling a single card is far from
> being a full counter-strategy, but well played, it's all the
> difference.
Well played it does make a difference, that was part of my point. But
countering other people's actions most of the time gains you time so it's
good for decks with a more passive strategy, while countering pooling (and
often Masters) is good for decks that want to kill faster. Also, masters
might be intercept, or much worse, Palla, Parthenon, Week... What use will a
Direct be when you're prey to a Week deck ? One less embrace for 1 pool ? So
SRs can also help towards defense.
> > - DI is best in defensive decks ; offensive decks will prefer Suddern
> > Reversals anytime, which is why I barely play any of the DIs I have
> > anymore
> > (I never play wall and prefer active decks to those which wait forever
> > and
> > ever).
>
> Nope. DI is better. If I'm playing bleedzooka (probably the fastest
> deck there is)... Suddening a Minion Tap means I need to get in,
> like, one or two bleeds fewer. Directing a PTO means I actually
> *have* the minion to place those bleeds... and maybe more.
PTO is a very strong exemple, as is Week : not every deck plays them, but if
they're played against you and you don't have that OOT Master you're
probably fried ; except that PTO can also be blocked, outvoted, Delayed etc.
So I wouldn't compare the effect of a PTO with that of a Minion Tap, played
by many players and with a less drastic effect. You might compare MT with a
Conditionning, maybe. So I still stand on the SR side.
> > So, wait and see, but I don't think there will be much more than a
> > fad -except of course for those very few people who actually would have
> > played thoroughly with DIs before but just didn't have them.
>
> No, don't think so. I would hope You are right - but my gut tells me
> You just aren't.
Damn your guts ! ;-)
> > And who knows, maybe it will be errated ? ;-)
>
> How exactly? Cancels a minion card *on Wednesdays*? C'mon, be realistic!
;)
Would be nice. I never play on wednesdays.
But other proposals have been made already. Although I also don't believe
"for real" that it's gonna get errated.
BTW, you say it's not the first card you'd ban, what is there on your hate
list ? Not wanting to start another "ban this, ban that" thread, just
curious. Oh, and I don't believe in DI as a remedy to abused minion cards,
either. Broken should never justify broken.
bluedevil
talonz wrote:
> How about 'once per methuselah per game'?
>
> Concrete, and already in use ala Retribution, which has a far greater
> opportunity cost and arguably less impact on the game.
How many times a game can I call PTO? I'm not trying to establish "PTO
Thread #372", but in my mind the fate of both of those cards are
tightly coupled. If we weren't living in voter-cap'able apartheid, I
would think once per game would be an adequate tweak of DI.
Or I would, if I believed in tweaking card texts instead of banning
(props to Anarch Revolt for being the exception to the rule).
Daneel
wrote:
>> On Mon, 31 Jul 2006 09:15:58 +0200, Orpheus <orphe...@DEADSPAMfree.fr>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I do think that for a while after 3rd Ed we'll see lots and lots of
>> > Directs
>> > everywhere, and that after a while it will calm down. Why ? Because :
>>
>> I'd challenge You to that statement.
>
> Ok, I bet you a drink, that one can pay the other when / if we meet. ;-)
> Let's say we'll value the situation one year after 3rd Ed (if we both
> still play lol).
You're on. ;)
> PTO is a very strong exemple, as is Week : not every deck plays them,
> but if
> they're played against you and you don't have that OOT Master you're
> probably fried ; except that PTO can also be blocked, outvoted, Delayed
> etc.
> So I wouldn't compare the effect of a PTO with that of a Minion Tap,
> played
> by many players and with a less drastic effect. You might compare MT
> with a
> Conditionning, maybe. So I still stand on the SR side.
Let's compare Minion Tap to something similar... say, Voter Captivation.
Now I'm not saying that I'd rather DI a Voter every time instead of
SRing the Minion Tap. Depends on the game, I would say. But I'd
generally prefer to kill a card that *creates* counters (like Voter)
as opposed to a card that *moves* them (like Tap).
> BTW, you say it's not the first card you'd ban, what is there on your
> hate list ? Not wanting to start another "ban this, ban that" thread,
> just curious. Oh, and I don't believe in DI as a remedy to abused
> minion cards, either. Broken should never justify broken.
Honestly, my hate list is pretty short by now. Or pretty long,
depending on how You look at it. ;) The throne is occupied by the
same contestant since about... Yeah, since about I'm playing the
game (and is PTO). I'm also pissed off at DI, but in a more reluctant
way, as I kind of see it as the last card to be banned (after every
broken card that makes You put DI in Your decks, like PTO, has been
pacified). That's all for specific cards; I'm kind of having a grudge
against the direr Gehenna events and a bit against the train
solitaire (imbued) simply because I find the game less and less
exciting as the number of conditions and factors to consider increase
at the table.
While I find conditional specials to be cool (wow, Batsheva gets +1
strength against Tzimisce! Great!), i'm kind of bored by overland
effects en masse to be evaluated on every action (ok, so now I
play this card. I flip the top of my library, ok, I could play it,
but I don't replace yet, plus it cost an additional blood, and...
oh, my capacity isn't what is used to be. By the way, did You
say "hunt action"?).
I also hate weak cards that outright burn vampires. Like Caiaphas,
Goratrix Adv., even though they almost never kick off. I thought
Kherebutu and Dauntain were enough, we didn't need any more
outright burning effects.
In the end it seems rather longish, I would say... ;)
--
Regards,
Daneel
Daneel
wrote:
> talonz wrote:
>
>> How about 'once per methuselah per game'?
>>
>> Concrete, and already in use ala Retribution, which has a far greater
>> opportunity cost and arguably less impact on the game.
>
> How many times a game can I call PTO? I'm not trying to establish "PTO
> Thread #372", but in my mind the fate of both of those cards are
> tightly coupled.
This is the yesman-post. I see the exact same link.
> Or I would, if I believed in tweaking card texts instead of banning
> (props to Anarch Revolt for being the exception to the rule).
Ok, if the game is evolving (as it is), there is no reasonable chance
of reaching a plateu where all broken/breakable cards and combos can
be cleansed from the game, so that Silver Bullets are no longer needed.
On one hand we need DI to kill the currently broken stuff like PTO;
but on the other, we also need these cancellers to provide a kind of
safeguard against any future over-the-top cards.
I'm not saying that the Silver Bullets (like SR, DI and NtB) un-break
every broken card in the game. They don't. Cards should be balanced,
and the Silver Bullets should not be needed. But in practice I'd
rather have them and not need them than the opposite.
--
Regards,
Daneel
talonz
bluedevil wrote:
> talonz wrote:
>
> > How about 'once per methuselah per game'?
> >
> > Concrete, and already in use ala Retribution, which has a far greater
> > opportunity cost and arguably less impact on the game.
>
> How many times a game can I call PTO?
Far more than either of us would prefer, obviouslly.
> I'm not trying to establish "PTO
> Thread #372", but in my mind the fate of both of those cards are
> tightly coupled. If we weren't living in voter-cap'able apartheid, I
> would think once per game would be an adequate tweak of DI.
>
Once per game, or once per methuselah per game? The difference is
slightly but noticeable.
And yeah, before confusion DI was my main defence against PTO too. Now
I just find DI annoying. Although PTO is still spite laden as well.
> Or I would, if I believed in tweaking card texts instead of banning
> (props to Anarch Revolt for being the exception to the rule).
I would have no issue with DI being banned from tourney play. As
pointed out, it tends to stall games rather than help resolve them.
G
as...@hotmail.com
eRol (no spam no spam) skrev:
> just found it:
>
> here is the link:
>
> http://www.sabbatinfrance.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5731
>
> have some fun ;)
This is only 49 rares and 3rd ed are bound to have something like 100.
What are the others? Crusades, clan hosers and Up Yours!? (I assume
that all the 100 new cards are vamps)
talonz
as...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> This is only 49 rares and 3rd ed are bound to have something like 100.
> What are the others? Crusades, clan hosers and Up Yours!? (I assume
> that all the 100 new cards are vamps)
Why would you assume that? I would imagine most are vamps, but I would
be very surprised if they were all vamps....
G