Taming monsters...
John Red
they have X creature as a pet, and then i look at my kitten and sigh.
any recomendation? also recently i tried starting off as a wizard. bad
choice. i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
too difficult. continue? (yn)" y. suddenly my kitten attacked me and i
died. why? any tips starting off as a wizard?
Roy L. Fuchs
us:
You would need a scroll of taming, or learn the taming spell. The
other way is to throw a tripe ration at a "peaceful" monster.
ihope
Janis Papanagnou
> How do you do that? i see around the Newsgroup some topics saying that
> they have X creature as a pet, and then i look at my kitten and sigh.
> any recomendation?
One possibility is to polymorph your pet. You can do that if you find
a polymorph trap and, e.g., have a magic whistle to command your pet.
Then there is the wand of polymorph and the potion of polymorph that
does the job. Your pet will also change its form if it eats some chape
changing monster. And finally(?) there is the scroll of taming that
*may* tame quite any existing creature.
> also recently i tried starting off as a wizard. bad choice.
Hmm.., many consider wizards a very good choice.
> i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
> too difficult. continue? (yn)" y.
If a spellbook is currently too difficult for your level, follow the
warning and *don't* read it. Enhance your level and stats, or bless
the spellbook so that you can always read it.
> suddenly my kitten attacked me and i died.
There are several situations where your pet will turn against you.
Usually there is no problem.
> why? any tips starting off as a wizard?
Use and exercise spells. Avoid melee combat against non-trivial monsters.
Let your pets fight for you and you will increase your survival chances
a lot.
Janis
ihope
> John Red wrote:
> > i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
> > too difficult. continue? (yn)" y.
>
> If a spellbook is currently too difficult for your level, follow the
> warning and *don't* read it.
Is there any reason to read it, or is it simply "no" every time?
Inlaw Biker
ihope wrote:
> > If a spellbook is currently too difficult for your level, follow the
> > warning and *don't* read it.
>
> Is there any reason to read it, or is it simply "no" every time?
If it's too difficult to comprehend then it's also probably too
difficult for you to cast - yet. So keep it in a safe place until
you're more experienced. What I usually do is sell them to a shop,
because the gold is more valuable early in the game. Once you're
powerful enough to learn those spells, gold to buy them back should not
be an issue.
Gary Olson
either "charm monster" -- midlevel -- or "create Familiar" --high
level-- spell will do though.
Paul Lenz
> One possibility is to polymorph your pet. You can do that if you find
> a polymorph trap and, e.g., have a magic whistle to command your pet.
IMHO this is the only way. Why use a wand or a potion and turn my pet
into a fungus, a mimic, or a newt? And this way works better the more
pets you have.
But you have to be very patient. In my current game I tamed six cats and
dogs, and what did I get? Three Master Liches and two Baby Grey Dragons!
They are magic resistant and can not be polymorphed again. I had to
bring this useless bunch into the upmost level of Sokoban and say
bye-bye. Then finally I got my desired purple worm.
> > also recently i tried starting off as a wizard. bad choice.
>
> Hmm.., many consider wizards a very good choice.
So I do. A wizard was my first role who won the game. He had a ring of
levitation which is very useful after writing the E-word. The cloak of
magic resistance helps to use polymorph traps because usually they
find you before you find them :)
> > i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
> > too difficult. continue? (yn)" y.
>
> If a spellbook is currently too difficult for your level, follow the
> warning and *don't* read it. Enhance your level and stats, or bless
> the spellbook so that you can always read it.
IMHO spellbooks are rather useless since the player has to undress to
cast a spell. If you are fighting you don't have time and it is stupid
to undress.
If you are not fighting, there is only one useful spell: identify.
Paul Lenz
Janis Papanagnou
> "Janis Papanagnou" <Janis_Pa...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>One possibility is to polymorph your pet. You can do that if you find
>>a polymorph trap and, e.g., have a magic whistle to command your pet.
>
> IMHO this is the only way.
Not quite. Especially if you command several pets and you want a specific
weak one to land on the trap you would better stand on the trap yourself
and displace your pet onto the trap. Though that requires you having MR.
> Why use a wand or a potion and turn my pet
> into a fungus, a mimic, or a newt? And this way works better the more
> pets you have.
I used a wand occasionally when no polymorph trap was yet found, or if I
want to polypile and want to save a charge also polymorphing a pet in line
of sight. It's true that there's quite a risk that you're left with a yet
weaker creature than before, so you'll just use that method in specific
cases.
>>>i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
>>>too difficult. continue? (yn)" y.
>>
>>If a spellbook is currently too difficult for your level, follow the
>>warning and *don't* read it. Enhance your level and stats, or bless
>>the spellbook so that you can always read it.
>
> IMHO spellbooks are rather useless since the player has to undress to
> cast a spell. If you are fighting you don't have time and it is stupid
> to undress.
> If you are not fighting, there is only one useful spell: identify.
I used the healing spells quite a lot, not only to quckly heal myself
after a battle, but - and maybe more important - to heal your pets.
A happy new year!
Janis
Jove
<pa...@lenz-online.de> wrote:
<snip>
>
>IMHO spellbooks are rather useless since the player has to undress to
>cast a spell.
Not all armor prevents spell-casting when worn. Some armor
even enhances spell-casting ability when worn.
From my current game:
Currently known spells
Name Level Category Fail
a - force bolt 1 attack 4%
b - haste self 3 escape 4%
c - create monster 2 clerical 4%
d - sleep 1 enchantment 4%
e - invisibility 4* escape 4%
f - cure sickness 3* healing 4%
g - levitation 4* escape 4%
h - wizard lock 2* matter 4%
i - identify 3* divination 4%
j - slow monster 2* enchantment 4%
k - knock 1* matter 4%
l - light 1 divination 4%
m - clairvoyance 3 divination 4%
n - create familiar 6 clerical 16%
o - cure blindness 2* healing 4%
p - restore ability 4 healing 6%
q - detect food 2 divination 4%
Armor
A - an uncursed +3 leather armor (being worn)
B - an uncursed corroded +3 pair of iron shoes (being worn)
C - a blessed +0 cloak of magic resistance (being worn)
G - a blessed +2 pair of leather gloves (being worn)
W - an uncursed +3 dwarvish iron helm (being worn)
Jove the Mage St:18/90 Dx:17 Co:18 In:18 Wi:18 Ch:14 Chaotic
Dlvl:12 $:185 HP:406(406) Pw:850(850) AC:-17 Exp:30 T:50592
>If you are fighting you don't have time and it is stupid
>to undress.
If only your shield markedly interferes with spell casting
it only takes one turn to remove it. Another one turn is enough
to wear the shield again.
One turn to put on a shield gives plenty of time to Zap e.g.
force bolt at a line of oncoming monsters before they get into
melee range. One of the many great things about spell-casting
is the ability to affect things/monsters at a distance.
NB: more than "attack" spells are useful in melee battle:
enchantment spells are nice. Charm monster can change certain
death from a leocrotta into a powerful ally. And the "Escape"
spell school is called that for a reason.
"slow monster" is the equivalent of speeding yourself up
against a monster.
Character XP level, Int/Wis, and skill in a spell school also
affect spell failure rates. An armor combination that prevents
spell-casting early in the game may acceptable for spell-casting
later.
Base spell-casting ability differs from one character class to
another. Acceptable armor for a Wizard to cast spells may not
work at all for a Valkyrie.
>If you are not fighting, there is only one useful spell: identify.
>
Haste Self, confuse monster and invisibility are all spells
directly useful in melee fighting. They can also be cast in
advance and "pumped up" to last longer. (So can skilled+ "detect
monster".)
The spell of levitation can get you into places you otherwise
could not reach.
Magic mapping, clairvoyance, detect treasure/monsters/traps
and light make exploration much faster/safer.
Etc., etc.
--
All the best,
Jove
sjde...@yahoo.com
> IMHO spellbooks are rather useless since the player has to undress to
> cast a spell. If you are fighting you don't have time and it is stupid
> to undress.
My wizards never wear metal armor and never have problems casting
spells. Use studded leather armor or crystal plate mail until you get
dragon scale mail. Avoid shields (or take just the shield off to
cast). Prefer non-metal boots. And avoid metal gauntlets.
You can wear Helm of Brilliance, Gloves of Dexterity, Silver Dragon
Scale mail, Cloak of Magic Resistance, Speed Boots, and a shirt and
have no chance of spell failure. Throw a small shield on and you'll
still be fine with magic missile, or take the shield off to cast.
> If you are not fighting, there is only one useful spell: identify.
Just off the top of my head...
Remove curse, create familiar, stone to flesh (for food/to tame pets),
magic mapping, protection (cast it several times before going into a
zoo, bigroom, castle, etc), haste self (ditto), levitation, teleport
away, cancellation.
And apropos to this thread, polymorph.
Topi Linkala
From my current game:
Currently known spells
Name Level Category Fail
a - magic missile 2 attack 0%
b - wizard lock 2* matter 0%
c - create monster 2* clerical 0%
d - detect monsters 1* divination 0%
e - extra healing 3* healing 0%
f - detect food 2* divination 0%
g - drain life 2* attack 0%
h - healing 1* healing 0%
i - identify 3* divination 0%
j - jumping 1* escape 0%
k - knock 1* matter 0%
l - light 1* divination 0%
m - magic mapping 5* divination 0%
n - confuse monster 2* enchantment 0%
o - dig 5* matter 0%
p - polymorph 6* matter 0%
q - charm monster 3* enchantment 0%
r - remove curse 3* clerical 0%
s - invisibility 4* escape 0%
t - detect treasure 4* divination 0%
u - detect unseen 3* divination 0%
v - force bolt 1* attack 0%
w - slow monster 2* enchantment 0%
x - cure sickness 3* healing 0%
y - cause fear 3* enchantment 0%
z - sleep 1* enchantment 0%
A - cone of cold 4* attack 0%
B - fireball 4* attack 0%
C - protection 1* clerical 0%
D - restore ability 4* healing 0%
E - haste self 3* escape 0%
F - levitation 4* escape 0%
G - cure blindness 2* healing 0%
H - create familiar 6* clerical 0%
I - turn undead 6* clerical 0%
J - teleport away 6* escape 0%
K - clairvoyance 3* divination 0%
L - finger of death 7* attack 0%
M - cancellation 7* matter 0%
N - stone to flesh 3* healing 0%
Armor
D - a blessed +5 Hawaiian shirt (being worn)
E - a blessed +3 leather armor (being worn)
F - a blessed fireproof +5 cloak of magic resistance (being worn)
G - a blessed fireproof +5 pair of speed boots (being worn)
H - a blessed greased +4 dwarvish iron helm (being worn)
I - a blessed fireproof +5 pair of gauntlets of dexterity (being worn)
Lyra the Necromancer St:18 Dx:23 Co:16 In:20 Wi:20 Ch:18 Chaotic
Dlvl:3 $:0 HP:733(733) Pw:399(399) AC:-93 Exp:24 T:142486
Haven't found any Helm of Brilliance nor have I met any dragon. Only
conduct kept: no wishes. Have three WOW's at (0:3) and haven't even been
on the castle level.
That's pudding farming at altar for you.
Topi
--
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are
always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
- Bertrand Russell
"How come he didn't put 'I think' at the end of it?" - Anonymous
Paul Lenz
> E - a blessed +3 leather armor (being worn)
Never found a dwarf wearing a mithrill coat?
Paul Lenz
Janis Papanagnou
Mithril interfers with spellcasting.
Janis
Topi Linkala
Yes, but with AC -93 why would I use spellcasting inhibiting mithrill?
Tom Goodman
> "Janis Papanagnou" <Janis_Pa...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>One possibility is to polymorph your pet. You can do that if you find
>>a polymorph trap and, e.g., have a magic whistle to command your pet.
And by the way I've just found out that Poly traps wear out after a
bit, disappear (go elsewhere ?) anyway can only be used a certain
(uncertain ?) number of times.
Could the knowledgeable ones elucidate this behaviour quantitatively ?
Tom.
Jove
Plenty of them, and a +1 crystal plate mail. Crystal plate mail
doesn't raise spell failure rates when worn. The crystal plate mail
was too heavy for general use without a blessed bag of holding.
(I did wear the crystal plate mail while magic trap dancing.)
- Leather armor weighs the same as dwarven/elven mithril.
- A +3 leather armor gives the same AC boost as elven mithril,
and only one less than dwarven mithril.
- Leather armor doesn't adversely affect spell-casting (as I hope
the spell failure rates made clear.
From: <http://www.spod-central.org/~psmith/nh/armr-343.txt>
ARMOR COST WGT PR AC M EFFECT APPEARANCE
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ : ~~~~ ~~~ ~~ : ~~ ~ ~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~
leather armor : 5 150 82 : 2 L --
elven mithril coat : 240 150 15 : 5 M ### --
dwarvish mithril coat : 240 150 10 : 6 M ### --
crystal plate mail : 820 450 10 : 7 G ## --
Jove
wrote:
>Jove wrote:
>>
>> From my current game:
<big snip>
>>
>> Jove the Mage St:18/90 Dx:17 Co:18 In:18 Wi:18 Ch:14 Chaotic
>> Dlvl:12 $:185 HP:406(406) Pw:850(850) AC:-17 Exp:30 T:50592
>
> From my current game:
>
>Currently known spells
<big snip of lower spell failure rates>
>Lyra the Necromancer St:18 Dx:23 Co:16 In:20 Wi:20 Ch:18 Chaotic
>Dlvl:3 $:0 HP:733(733) Pw:399(399) AC:-93 Exp:24 T:142486
>
>Haven't found any Helm of Brilliance nor have I met any dragon. Only
>conduct kept: no wishes. Have three WOW's at (0:3) and haven't even been
>on the castle level.
>
>That's pudding farming at altar for you.
>
No pudding farming. No create monster. Just leading soldiers
from Fort Ludious to an altar and sacrificing them.
Self-portable armor-bearing foocubi creating sacrifices.
As a chaotic human I get major demons that way with no penalty.
Many of those demons are foocubi of the appropriate gender
preference.
Also about 100,000 fewer turns too.
I am very envious of your AC. Presumably through luck
management while sacrificing? I was hesitant to #pray at the
altar. It seemed better to keep praying for any emergency that
might come up. (None did, btw.)
I then got crowned through mis-managing my luck while #praying
at the altar, despite having plenty of mirrors to break. So any
specific advice on managing luck to maximize AC reduction would
be greatly appreciated.
Jeremiah DeWitt Weiner
> i tried reading one of the books I had and said: "this book is
> too difficult. continue? (yn)" y. suddenly my kitten attacked me and i
> died. why?
It doesn't look like anyone addressed this point. The only reason
your pet will attack you are
-it's starving
-it's confused
-you're causing conflict
You should have gotten a message about the first two cases, unless maybe
the kitten was in another room at the time. Did you put on any
unidentified rings? In any case, it was nothing to do with the book.
BTW, we have these things called "capital letters", which make
text much easier to read. You might want to learn about those also.
--
Oh to have a lodge in some vast wilderness. Where rumors of oppression
and deceit, of unsuccessful and successful wars may never reach me
anymore.
-- William Cowper
Xerophiliac
>cast a spell. If you are fighting you don't have time and it is stupid
>to undress.
>If you are not fighting, there is only one useful spell: identify.
People have addressed the AC issue pretty thoroughly already. One
thing that hasn't been addressed is the combat effectiveness of spells.
A melee class with a very good artifact (say, Mjollnir) will be doing
around 40-50 damage per swing against non-resistant monsters. A wizard
with attack spells at Expert can throw magic missiles for 10 pw that
can do upwards of 60 damage. If you have reflection, and you pin a
monster against a wall, you can throw a missile that will bounce a few
times and can potentially do around 200 damage. You can also take out
nasties before they get close. And there's the Finger of Death spell..
(slash'em only? haven't played Vanilla in a while.)
Combine this amazing destructive potential with the pw regeneration of
the Eye of the Aethiopica, and the fact that you can easily get over
600pw with a high-level wizard, and it seems to me that a high-level
wizard is in a league of his/her own as an offensive force.
The hard part is getting them there :)
Raisse the Thaumaturge
[how to tame potential pets]
> You would need a scroll of taming, or learn the taming spell.
Charm monster spell, but yes, it does the same as a scroll of taming.
> The other way is to throw a tripe ration at a "peaceful" monster.
Works only with domestic dogs and cats (little dogs, dogs and large dogs;
kittens, housecats and large cats). Horses (ponies, horses and warhorses)
can be tamed with fruit or vegetables; all other monsters need magic.
Raisse, killed by a kitten
--
ir...@valdyas.org LegoHack: http://www.valdyas.org/irina/nethack/
Status of Raisse (piously neutral): Level 8 HP 63(67) AC -3, fast.
Little White Mouse
BTW, you don't need to study your spellbooks unless you can't remember the
spell anymore. Just keep casting it and stash the spellbooks somewhere
safe (unless you really want to lug around lots of flammable weight)
--LWM
PS - Wand of Polymorph, man, Wand of Polymorph!