Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: Ray Dillinger <b...@sonic.net>
Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2006 08:28:10 -0800
Local: Mon, Dec 4 2006 11:28 am
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: j...@nonexistant.invalid (Jude H)
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 14:34:11 GMT
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 9:34 am
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: "Bongo Bill" <BongoB...@gmail.com>
Date: 5 Dec 2006 07:05:17 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 10:05 am
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: "Jeff Lait" <torespondisfut...@hotmail.com>
Date: 5 Dec 2006 09:13:12 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 12:13 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
I think you are drawing the wrong conclusion from that lesson. That
tells you that having various actions take different amount of times is *worse* than merely having fine graduation of monster speeds. At least, worst in the sense of being confusing and unpredictable. The speed thing is the most overrated aspect of Roguelike design. You If the pattern of double-attacks for monsters is sufficiently random, The fundamental flaw with the attempts to make ultra-realistic speed Having said that, I'll point out there are two things a speed system Please note that it is important to make #1 independent of the player My own suggestion for speed systems (which you can see in POWDER, You We divide creatures into 4 classes of speeds. Slow, Normal, Fast, and Anyways, implementation is straightforward. Track the current phase Then your time loop is... } A mob which is marked as SLOW will not act in the SLOW phase. A mob which is marked as QUICK will act in the QUICK phase. And a mob which is marked as FAST will act in the FAST phase. All mobs will act in the NORMAL phase. Note that you can have both SLOW and FAST and end up with 100% of the The heartbeat method is the constant in dungeon-time callback to do all One thing to note about this system is that it is simple enough for the Many people seem to think this sort of knowledge is a bad thing. Note that the deterministic timing may allow more precise back & hack, Martin Read's Dungeon Bash uses a similar system to this, except with SLOW,NORMAL,SLOW,FAST In his system, a mob gets a turn on any phase <= to its speed. SLOW He's got an out of date comment, however: So, in summary, I'd be more concerned about creating enough good You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: eri...@gmail.com
Date: 5 Dec 2006 09:30:23 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 12:30 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: g...@mail.ru (Timofei Shatrov)
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 18:34:19 GMT
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 1:34 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: Martin Read <mpr...@chiark.greenend.org.uk>
Date: 06 Dec 2006 19:16:48 +0000 (GMT)
Local: Wed, Dec 6 2006 2:16 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
In your opinion - which is a perfectly fair opinion to have. However,
*some* predictability is essential; we are not (in general) attempting to write Dada: The Roguelike. >4 monster speeds is just not enough. I think it's plenty. Hell, *one* monster speed is enough. >In my games Good. >speed can be any rational number greater than 0. >Various modifiers are also Good. >possible - for example one item multiplies player's speed by 19/20. >You'd think No, because I used to play ADOM. >it's barely noticeable? >Well, it's not - it gives you the edge over monsters All excessive game imbalance arises out of poor game design. >which are as fast as you, but not so unbalanced that you can run away from any >monster. Large speed variations create imbalance, so fine speed gradations are >necessary. Besides, there's always the option of making sure there is at least one >Consider Crawl, or ADOM or any other roguelike that allows a player Many roguelikes that allow players to become twice as fast as a normal >to become two times faster than normal monster. monster have monsters that are three or more times as fast as a normal player. In some cases, they're really quite *nasty* monsters. In Angband, Morgoth is speed +30, making him about 3.5 times as fast as an unhastened player. >A character with such speed is ADOM's seven-league boots are nice, but I don't think I've ever actually >practically unkillable, so Haste spell in Crawl or seven league boots in ADOM >are basically game-winners. won the game wearing them. They don't increase overall speed; they just reduce the energy cost of movement. Crawl's Haste spell is nice, but you can't (safely) use it all the time >Even 33% speed boost is too much, IMHO. Only if you haven't designed with it in mind. Fine-grained speed systems are good if the designer is competent. You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: Ray Dillinger <b...@sonic.net>
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 12:28:25 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 3:28 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: "Tarindel" <aapomer...@gmail.com>
Date: 5 Dec 2006 15:39:36 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 6:39 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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Newsgroups: rec.games.roguelike.development
From: Ray Dillinger <b...@sonic.net>
Date: Tue, 05 Dec 2006 19:34:52 -0800
Local: Tues, Dec 5 2006 10:34 pm
Subject: Re: Speed and motion
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