Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for some time.
Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, then I'll happily hand it over.
P.S.: I'm not intending to drop out of *band development completely. But I would like to go back to a different role - move to the background again. Porting variants, hunting bugs, fixing things that need fixing - the technical stuff - that is where I truly feel at home. That's where I want to move back to and "rekindle the fire".
-- Robert Ruehlmann ( r...@thangorodrim.net ) "Thangorodrim - The Angband Page" : http://www.thangorodrim.net/ Visit the #angband chat channel at irc.worldirc.org
Robert Ruehlmann <r...@thangorodrim.net> writes: > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a > chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times > between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is > piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for > some time.
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
> P.S.: I'm not intending to drop out of *band development completely. But I > would like to go back to a different role - move to the background again. > Porting variants, hunting bugs, fixing things that need fixing - the > technical stuff - that is where I truly feel at home. That's where I want > to move back to and "rekindle the fire".
> -- > Robert Ruehlmann ( r...@thangorodrim.net ) > "Thangorodrim - The Angband Page" : http://www.thangorodrim.net/ > Visit the #angband chat channel at irc.worldirc.org
Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a > chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times > between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is > piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for > some time.
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
> P.S.: I'm not intending to drop out of *band development completely. But I > would like to go back to a different role - move to the background again. > Porting variants, hunting bugs, fixing things that need fixing - the > technical stuff - that is where I truly feel at home. That's where I want > to move back to and "rekindle the fire".
It's good to hear from you. And I too thank you for all the hard work over the years.
PS: the NPP patch I sent you last month has some nits that have now been fixed. The latest is available on timo's home page. I really hope that this gets included in mainline. It has become a minor headache trying to maintain such a long changelist as a patch, rather than as part of the mainline code.
Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
Followup.
I understand that the Angband license is not sufficiently open for sourceforge. Is there another public source-control site that would accept Angband? That would make everyone's life a little easier.
On 2005-10-10 01:47:18, "pete mack" <pmac...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > > then I'll happily hand it over.
> Followup.
> I understand that the Angband license is not sufficiently open for > sourceforge. Is there another public source-control site that would > accept Angband? That would make everyone's life a little easier.
> -pete
I've already mentioned berlios.de. However, angband.oook.cz appears to be hosting a copy of the vanilla CVS, so I don't believe we need to move to a 3rd party hosted solution, provided this continues...
On 2005-10-09 23:41:23, Robert Ruehlmann <r...@thangorodrim.net> wrote:
> Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a > chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times > between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is > piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for > some time.
Its with some sadness that I hear this. Your contribution has been much appreciated, and will be hard to replace...
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
Andrew Doull wrote: > On 2005-10-10 01:47:18, "pete mack" <pmac...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > > > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > > > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > > > then I'll happily hand it over.
> > Followup.
> > I understand that the Angband license is not sufficiently open for > > sourceforge. Is there another public source-control site that would > > accept Angband? That would make everyone's life a little easier.
> > -pete
> I've already mentioned berlios.de. However, angband.oook.cz appears to be > hosting a copy of the vanilla CVS, so I don't believe we need to move to a 3rd > party hosted solution, provided this continues...
I'm not sure that's enough for distributed development. It would be unfair to put the burden of maintaining the cvs tree on the maintainer of oook, unless the^H^H^H poor^H^H^H sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H he is willing to take on such a burden.
Actually, I'd rather not use sourceforge, because it doesn't follow any standard source control model that I know. I'd rather use something more modern like darcs/arch/subversion, especially something with an eclipse plugin.
Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a > chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times > between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is > piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for > some time.
An era has ended. And what an era it has been. Let me sing of things accomplished.
- Vast improvements to user customizability. - A wealth of new and enhanced ports to new and old systems alike. Easier configuration and installation. Better compilation instructions. - Innumerable low-level code improvements that have made such things as outputting text, supporting graphics and lighting effects, and loading initialization files much easier and more reliable. - A thousand and one gameplay enhancements, including a host of new monsters, objects, and vaults. Everyone seems to have his own favourite new Angband feature: Mine is the cumulative light radius: When I wield my Broad Sword of Gondolin and the Phial, I can see forever!
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
Somebody *has* to sign up. We can't have a committee; as Ben Harrison so wisely said: "Committees have given us nothing but trouble". Who's got the guts to volunteer?
> P.S.: I'm not intending to drop out of *band development completely. But I > would like to go back to a different role - move to the background again. > Porting variants, hunting bugs, fixing things that need fixing - the > technical stuff - that is where I truly feel at home. That's where I want > to move back to and "rekindle the fire".
I bet you'll shed some serious light in this community, if past performance is anything to go by. Running the Standard Code can get terribly restrictive. So many ideas to pursue, so many neat opportunities, yet you have to stay Standard, whatever that means. Now you are free! Enjoy yourself!
[previous messages] "Robert escapes to wreck havoc!" (more) "You have a very good feeling about this..." (more)
Well, this is a sad thing to hear, but I certainly don't argue with your reasoning; if it's not fun anymore, then there's no point. This is, after all, a game, and should be fun for all those involved, espicially the developer who's putting his own time into it.
So, I'd like to say "Thank you" to you for your work over the last five or so years, and also for deciding to remain in the community to a degree.
I guess the next question is : Who can even begin to fill his shoes?
Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a
That's bad. Nobody deserves to burn out for a game. Not even this good game.
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
I don't think there are many that can. I have technical resources, but I'm not a coder so with me development would be more or less frozen. And other possibilities that I can think of all have their own variants to maintain.
> P.S.: I'm not intending to drop out of *band development completely. But I > would like to go back to a different role - move to the background again.
Could you host Thangorodrim as official page and keep source it as it is, just in frozen state until we find somebody that is willing to take over?
BTW. If you are willing to release one last version then FYI 3.0.6 source with squelch and wand/staff recharging fix from CVS added in is downloadable from my homepage:
Pete Mac did patch and I did test it and host it in my page. It runs fine (no crashes or errors or weird behavior this far) and compiles at least in OSX, cygwin, lcc-win32 and djgpp.
>> I understand that the Angband license is not sufficiently open for >> sourceforge.
>Wasn't there some effort made a while back to get all the relevant people >to agree to a GPL license? What happened to that?
There's a lot of relevant people, and not all of them are contactable. -- Julian Lighton j...@fragment.com /* You are not expected to understand this. */
On 2005-10-10 07:51:20, =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Timo_Pietilä?=
<timo.piet...@helsinki.fi> wrote: > Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a
> That's bad. Nobody deserves to burn out for a game. Not even this good game.
> > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > > then I'll happily hand it over.
> I don't think there are many that can. I have technical resources, but > I'm not a coder so with me development would be more or less frozen. And > other possibilities that I can think of all have their own variants to > maintain.
Andrew Doull wrote: > On 2005-10-10 07:51:20, =?ISO-8859-15?Q?Timo_Pietilä?= > <timo.piet...@helsinki.fi> wrote:
> > Robert Ruehlmann wrote: > > > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > > > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a
> > That's bad. Nobody deserves to burn out for a game. Not even this good game.
> > > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > > > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > > > then I'll happily hand it over.
> > I don't think there are many that can. I have technical resources, but > > I'm not a coder so with me development would be more or less frozen. And > > other possibilities that I can think of all have their own variants to > > maintain.
> Arguably, no one knows gameplay like you...
> Andrew
Does the maintainer actually need to code? Robert seems to be stepping down because he wants to get back to coding, rather than doing all the coordination. Surely knowing the gameplay inside out is one of the most important considerations so that new things incorporated are balanced.
Robert - good luck, and thanks for such a good game in Angband 3.0.6!
> Andrew Doull wrote: >> On 2005-10-10 01:47:18, "pete mack" <pmac...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> > Robert Ruehlmann wrote: >> > > Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if >> > > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, >> > > then I'll happily hand it over.
>> > Followup.
>> > I understand that the Angband license is not sufficiently open for >> > sourceforge. Is there another public source-control site that would >> > accept Angband? That would make everyone's life a little easier.
>> > -pete
>> I've already mentioned berlios.de. However, angband.oook.cz appears to be >> hosting a copy of the vanilla CVS, so I don't believe we need to move to a 3rd >> party hosted solution, provided this continues...
> I'm not sure that's enough for distributed development. It would be > unfair to put the burden of maintaining the cvs tree on the maintainer > of oook, unless the^H^H^H poor^H^H^H sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H he is willing > to take on such a burden.
Yes, I'm going to host that CVS repository for as long as needed. For the record, I'm also hosting ToME CVS repository, with 17 write accounts. I don't see how that's not enough for distributed development. It got anonymous access, up-to-date CVSweb interface (not that delayed nonsense like on Sourceforge), nightly HEAD tarballs for download.
I'm also willing to host website for downloads (Robert never needed that, DarkGod have ToME website here), mailing lists, whatever.
> Andrew Doull wrote: > > On 2005-10-10 07:51:20, =3D?ISO-8859-15?Q?Timo_Pietil=E4?=3D > > wrote: > > > I don't think there are many that can. I have technical resources, but > > > I'm not a coder so with me development would be more or less frozen. And > > > other possibilities that I can think of all have their own variants to > > > maintain.
> > Arguably, no one knows gameplay like you...
> > Andrew
> Does the maintainer actually need to code? Robert seems to be stepping > down because he wants to get back to coding, rather than doing all the > coordination. Surely knowing the gameplay inside out is one of the most > important considerations so that new things incorporated are balanced.
Are you getting some Timo for Maintainer t-shirts printed up?
> V Sun, 09 Oct 2005 19:17:30 -0700, pete mack napsal(a):
> > Andrew Doull wrote: > >> On 2005-10-10 01:47:18, "pete mack" wrote: > >> I've already mentioned berlios.de. However, angband.oook.cz appears to be > >> hosting a copy of the vanilla CVS, so I don't believe we need to move to a 3rd > >> party hosted solution, provided this continues...
> > I'm not sure that's enough for distributed development. It would be > > unfair to put the burden of maintaining the cvs tree on the maintainer > > of oook, unless the^H^H^H poor^H^H^H sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H he is willing > > to take on such a burden.
> Yes, I'm going to host that CVS repository for as long as needed. > For the record, I'm also hosting ToME CVS repository, with 17 write > accounts. I don't see how that's not enough for distributed development. > It got anonymous access, up-to-date CVSweb interface (not that delayed > nonsense like on Sourceforge), nightly HEAD tarballs for download.
> I'm also willing to host website for downloads (Robert never needed that, > DarkGod have ToME website here), mailing lists, whatever.
I'd like to add hear that I've had nothing but positive responses from Pav, and have found him extremely helpful, and a real asset to the community.
On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 19:17:30 -0700, pete mack wrote: > I'm not sure that's enough for distributed development. It would be > unfair to put the burden of maintaining the cvs tree on the maintainer > of oook, unless the^H^H^H poor^H^H^H sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H he is willing > to take on such a burden.
I think it'd be better if "distributed development" were avoided. Angband's gotten along pretty well using a single maintainer, so it'd be silly to change that practice without a good reason. And the only good reason I can think of would be the lack of a new volunteer.
On 2005-10-10 13:38:00, Andrew Doull <andrewdo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Yes, I'm going to host that CVS repository for as long as needed. > > For the record, I'm also hosting ToME CVS repository, with 17 write > > accounts. I don't see how that's not enough for distributed development. > > It got anonymous access, up-to-date CVSweb interface (not that delayed > > nonsense like on Sourceforge), nightly HEAD tarballs for download.
> > I'm also willing to host website for downloads (Robert never needed that, > > DarkGod have ToME website here), mailing lists, whatever.
> I'd like to add hear that I've had nothing but positive responses from Pav, and > have found him extremely helpful, and a real asset to the community.
I have exactly the same to say about Pav, who contributes lots of ressources to the *band communnity. He is always helpful! So a big thanks to you pav!
-- DarkGod comes from | Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards the hells for YOU ! :) | because they are subtle and quick to anger. -----------------------+---------------------------------------------- ToME power! http://t-o-m-e.net
Andrew Doull wrote: > Are you getting some Timo for Maintainer t-shirts printed up?
Heh. Timo does have a good point though, somebody has to code the next release of V. I can't imagine anyone willing to go through the hassle of doing the coding without wanting to be the maintainer - but perhaps there is someone.
Timo, perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to learn to code? Ask Jeff - it worked for him.
On 2005-10-10, Neil Stevens <n...@hakubi.us> wrote:
> On Sun, 09 Oct 2005 19:17:30 -0700, pete mack wrote: >> I'm not sure that's enough for distributed development. It would be >> unfair to put the burden of maintaining the cvs tree on the maintainer >> of oook, unless the^H^H^H poor^H^H^H sucker^H^H^H^H^H^H he is willing >> to take on such a burden.
> I think it'd be better if "distributed development" were avoided. > Angband's gotten along pretty well using a single maintainer, so it'd be > silly to change that practice without a good reason. And the only good > reason I can think of would be the lack of a new volunteer.
Note, final/solitary control and distributed development are not mutually exclusive. It's possible to use such tools to allow a maintainer to do more by filtering and handling code blobs from other people with less hassle.
Note I have no opinion either way on whether it's applicable, necessary or useful in this case.
"Robert Ruehlmann" <r...@thangorodrim.net> wrote in message news:3qtgudFgl29eU1@individual.net... > Over the past few months I have realized that I've lost the enthusiasm > necessary to maintain Angband. I'm feeling burned out. It has become a > chore instead of the fun it used to be. As a result the quiet times > between the development activity have become longer and longer, email is > piling up in my inbox, and Thangorodrim has only seen minor updates for > some time.
I understand. Due to alot of RL events this year I was having difficulty getting energy and time to work on NPP. Then, while playing basketball in June, I broke both my wrists, had surgery, had a cast on my right hand for 14 weeks and was unable to code for that time. That long break helped me get my fire back.
> Angband and the player community deserve an active maintainer. So if > somebody is willing to take the job and the community accepts him or her, > then I'll happily hand it over.
Whoever your sucessor should be, that person should follow in your footsteps in being the sole and final decision maker of what changes make it into Angband, while having an understanding of the game and what the Angband community wants from it. I do think Timo is a good choice in that regard, if he wanted to do it. As for his level of coding experience, I don't see that as too important. I am sure he could pick up the coding parts quickly, and he would be given plenty of coding support in areas where he wanted it. I mean, if he posted to the Angband newsgroup something like "Would somebody help me with this bug in the Mac OSX platform" or "can somebody make me a patch for this feature based on this variant" I am sure we would get plenty of support, me included. The important thing is that this person be the proper visionary for how the game progresses, and most importantly how it remains the stable gaming standard for the Angband gaming community.
> Porting variants, hunting bugs, fixing things that need fixing - the > technical stuff - that is where I truly feel at home. That's where I want > to move back to and "rekindle the fire".
Why am I reminded of Harry Potter and the paintings of the of the former Headmaster in the Hogwarts Headmaster's quarters who traditionally talk and confer with Dumbledore? Shall that be your role? :) {disregard the events in the latest book}
Glad to hear you will still be involved. And thank you again from all of us for your contributions and excellent maintainence of Angband.
On 2005-10-10 16:16:42, "magnate" <chr...@dbass.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Andrew Doull wrote: > > Are you getting some Timo for Maintainer t-shirts printed up?
> Heh. Timo does have a good point though, somebody has to code the next > release of V. I can't imagine anyone willing to go through the hassle > of doing the coding without wanting to be the maintainer - but perhaps > there is someone.
> Timo, perhaps you'd like to take this opportunity to learn to code? Ask > Jeff - it worked for him.
> Big thanks to Robert for all his efforts.
> CC
What are we looking for in the next release of Vanilla? I'm suggesting Timo, on the basis that he more than any one would know what the chewy caramel center of Angband consists of, and wouldn't start taking Vanilla too far away from what it is at the moment.
Robert, I just want to thank you for the great job you've done with Angband. It's a great game, due in no small part to the massive amount of work you've put into it. You've always been upbeat, professional, and helpful when people like me pester you with coding questions, and I really appreciate it.
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