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Ideas for better rules for Cactus Canyon ?
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Aeneas - www.flippers.be
Sep 19, 2012, 6:25:58 AM9/19/12
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A while ago I started with FreeWPC ( http://code.google.com/p/freewpc/ ) on a new rom for Cactus Canyon. FreeWPC allows you to make a new gamerom, compatible with wpc, that you can run in visual pinball/pinmame and even burn to an eprom and run in the actual machine.
After brainstorming and getting a lot of new ideas, changing completely the way CC played (ie all modes started as a bounty, allowing for many more modes), I decided that I really like the flow and current rules.. so started programming based on the existing rules (ie shoot a ramp 3x and a mode starts immediately), but added more modes and made existing modes more challenging.
I'm still stuck however with the whole Bart / gunfight / quickdraw thing.
3 seperate things, but they're a bit related.
Quickdraws are one thing - hit the orange standups, light inlane to start, finish 4 and start showdown multiball.
Now a gunfight is qualified immediately after you defeat a Bart in the saloon, and winning a gunfight makes you increase a rank.
I don't really like that, but haven't found a better alternative.
Also have an idea to make the wizard mode in different levels (like CV), but don't have all of them defined yet (I do know what I want to do for Bionic Bart :)
So I'm looking for new ideas.
All of you who say that CC is too easy - please let me know how you would improve it ?
I'm interested in all ideas - either completely new rulesheets (you're only limited to the physical playfield layout, inserts, targets), or just small suggestions to improve the current rules.
After brainstorming and getting a lot of new ideas, changing completely the way CC played (ie all modes started as a bounty, allowing for many more modes), I decided that I really like the flow and current rules.. so started programming based on the existing rules (ie shoot a ramp 3x and a mode starts immediately), but added more modes and made existing modes more challenging.
I'm still stuck however with the whole Bart / gunfight / quickdraw thing.
3 seperate things, but they're a bit related.
Quickdraws are one thing - hit the orange standups, light inlane to start, finish 4 and start showdown multiball.
Now a gunfight is qualified immediately after you defeat a Bart in the saloon, and winning a gunfight makes you increase a rank.
I don't really like that, but haven't found a better alternative.
Also have an idea to make the wizard mode in different levels (like CV), but don't have all of them defined yet (I do know what I want to do for Bionic Bart :)
So I'm looking for new ideas.
All of you who say that CC is too easy - please let me know how you would improve it ?
I'm interested in all ideas - either completely new rulesheets (you're only limited to the physical playfield layout, inserts, targets), or just small suggestions to improve the current rules.
TheKorn
Sep 19, 2012, 6:58:01 AM9/19/12
to
"Aeneas - www.flippers.be" <ave...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:13ae90d5-d1a8-47f2...@googlegroups.com:
> After brainstorming and getting a lot of new ideas, changing
> completely the way CC played (ie all modes started as a bounty,
> allowing for many more modes), I decided that I really like the flow
> and current rules.. so started programming based on the existing rules
> (ie shoot a ramp 3x and a mode starts immediately), but added more
> modes and made existing modes more challenging.
>
> I'm still stuck however with the whole Bart / gunfight / quickdraw
> thing. 3 seperate things, but they're a bit related.
> Quickdraws are one thing - hit the orange standups, light inlane to
> start, finish 4 and start showdown multiball.
>
> Now a gunfight is qualified immediately after you defeat a Bart in the
> saloon, and winning a gunfight makes you increase a rank. I don't
> really like that, but haven't found a better alternative.
Why do they have to be correlated 1:1, though? Couldn't you make this harder / a
bit less rote by doing something like, "defeat bart after X pop hits" or something
along those lines?
> Also have an idea to make the wizard mode in different levels (like
> CV), but don't have all of them defined yet (I do know what I want to
> do for Bionic Bart :) So I'm looking for new ideas.
I'm familiar with CC but not familiar with its wizard mode. If you wanted to do a
progressive level thing, you could do something like, "there's his gang! get
'em!"... Pop all 4 drops, and then have a hurry-up countdown start at 15 seconds
and 9 gazillion points. Hit all 4, then "there's three more of them!"... pop any
random three, hurry-up restarts at 10 seconds with 2X multiplier, 'there's another
pair!', pop 2 reset hurr-up w/ 3x multiplier and 7 seconds, and then finish with
bart.
(Timing, hurry-up start value, and multipliers are all examples... or possibly
could be affected by play up to that point.)
--
Have a home video that's trapped on your camera? Want to share it on the web or
on DVD?
http://www.webwidevideo.com/
news:13ae90d5-d1a8-47f2...@googlegroups.com:
> After brainstorming and getting a lot of new ideas, changing
> completely the way CC played (ie all modes started as a bounty,
> allowing for many more modes), I decided that I really like the flow
> and current rules.. so started programming based on the existing rules
> (ie shoot a ramp 3x and a mode starts immediately), but added more
> modes and made existing modes more challenging.
>
> I'm still stuck however with the whole Bart / gunfight / quickdraw
> thing. 3 seperate things, but they're a bit related.
> Quickdraws are one thing - hit the orange standups, light inlane to
> start, finish 4 and start showdown multiball.
>
> Now a gunfight is qualified immediately after you defeat a Bart in the
> saloon, and winning a gunfight makes you increase a rank. I don't
> really like that, but haven't found a better alternative.
bit less rote by doing something like, "defeat bart after X pop hits" or something
along those lines?
> Also have an idea to make the wizard mode in different levels (like
> CV), but don't have all of them defined yet (I do know what I want to
> do for Bionic Bart :) So I'm looking for new ideas.
progressive level thing, you could do something like, "there's his gang! get
'em!"... Pop all 4 drops, and then have a hurry-up countdown start at 15 seconds
and 9 gazillion points. Hit all 4, then "there's three more of them!"... pop any
random three, hurry-up restarts at 10 seconds with 2X multiplier, 'there's another
pair!', pop 2 reset hurr-up w/ 3x multiplier and 7 seconds, and then finish with
bart.
(Timing, hurry-up start value, and multipliers are all examples... or possibly
could be affected by play up to that point.)
--
Have a home video that's trapped on your camera? Want to share it on the web or
on DVD?
http://www.webwidevideo.com/
seymour.shabow
Sep 19, 2012, 7:43:20 AM9/19/12
to
TheKorn wrote:
>
> I'm familiar with CC but not familiar with its wizard mode. If you wanted to do a
> progressive level thing, you could do something like, "there's his gang! get
> 'em!"... Pop all 4 drops, and then have a hurry-up countdown start at 15 seconds
> and 9 gazillion points. Hit all 4, then "there's three more of them!"... pop any
> random three, hurry-up restarts at 10 seconds with 2X multiplier, 'there's another
> pair!', pop 2 reset hurr-up w/ 3x multiplier and 7 seconds, and then finish with
> bart.
>
Awesome, just like Raven!
>
> I'm familiar with CC but not familiar with its wizard mode. If you wanted to do a
> progressive level thing, you could do something like, "there's his gang! get
> 'em!"... Pop all 4 drops, and then have a hurry-up countdown start at 15 seconds
> and 9 gazillion points. Hit all 4, then "there's three more of them!"... pop any
> random three, hurry-up restarts at 10 seconds with 2X multiplier, 'there's another
> pair!', pop 2 reset hurr-up w/ 3x multiplier and 7 seconds, and then finish with
> bart.
>
Rossz
Sep 19, 2012, 8:37:01 AM9/19/12
to
Aenas, did you check what's done by "epthegeek" using P-ROC ? Maybe you prefer to do your "own" thing and not to copy what's done elsewhere, but I find his rulesheet and additions very interesting.
The videos on youtube show what he has done, it's impressive. I really like the "tumbleweed", the "bionic bart" before High Noon, and the 2 other "Polly in peril". The super skill shot is great too.
The videos on youtube show what he has done, it's impressive. I really like the "tumbleweed", the "bionic bart" before High Noon, and the 2 other "Polly in peril". The super skill shot is great too.
Aeneas - www.flippers.be
Sep 19, 2012, 8:44:13 AM9/19/12
to
Thanks for your feedback.
> Why do they have to be correlated 1:1, though? Couldn't you make this harder / a bit less rote by doing something like, "defeat bart after X pop hits" or something along those lines?
That's indeed what I'm looking for - make a rank up depend on something different (or more difficult), and make defeating Bart more than just hitting the saloon/bart over and over.
> I'm familiar with CC but not familiar with its wizard mode.
Now it's one timed mode in which you have to shoot enough dropdown targets and can score jackpots too.
With multiple levels I meant one 'mode' for each star point (stampede, bartbros, showdown, combos, motherlode). So ie start with combo, you have to make a certain number of shots (like CVs spell cirqus). Bartbros lamp would be Bionic Bart, similar to a ringmaster battle. For 'motherlode' I don't have anything yet, and I want it to be more challenging than just shooting the mine 5 times :)
Aeneas.
> Why do they have to be correlated 1:1, though? Couldn't you make this harder / a bit less rote by doing something like, "defeat bart after X pop hits" or something along those lines?
> I'm familiar with CC but not familiar with its wizard mode.
With multiple levels I meant one 'mode' for each star point (stampede, bartbros, showdown, combos, motherlode). So ie start with combo, you have to make a certain number of shots (like CVs spell cirqus). Bartbros lamp would be Bionic Bart, similar to a ringmaster battle. For 'motherlode' I don't have anything yet, and I want it to be more challenging than just shooting the mine 5 times :)
Aeneas.
Aeneas - www.flippers.be
Sep 19, 2012, 8:47:45 AM9/19/12
to
Op woensdag 19 september 2012 14:37:01 UTC+2 schreef Rossz het volgende:
Aeneas.
> Aenas, did you check what's done by "epthegeek" using P-ROC ? Maybe you prefer to do your "own" thing and not to copy what's done elsewhere, but I find his rulesheet and additions very interesting. The videos on youtube show what he has done, it's impressive. I really like the "tumbleweed", the "bionic bart" before High Noon, and the 2 other "Polly in peril". The super skill shot is great too.
Yes I'm aware of his project with P-Roc but am set to do my own things and not copy what he is doing..
Aeneas.
epth...@gmail.com
Sep 19, 2012, 9:21:56 AM9/19/12
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-E
Mark ES
Sep 19, 2012, 10:01:15 AM9/19/12
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Aeneas - www.flippers.be
Sep 19, 2012, 4:22:48 PM9/19/12
to
> I am unfamiliar with accessing and altering software but does your platform allow changes to all games or just CC? I'm wondering if there is a way to enhance the software in TOTAN and TOM.
FreeWPC allows making new roms for all WPC machines.
New roms for Twilight Zone, WCS, Corvette and Demolition Man have been made and tested in the actual machines. Other games are in development but have not yet been tested in the real machine.
Especially the TZ rom is very 'finished' with a lot of new modes, dmd animations, .. Some other games are still in development or have only basic rules.
If you're interested:
https://code.google.com/p/freewpc/ has installation documentation and a user manual on how to code.
The source code is at: https://github.com/bcd/freewpc
There's a discussion group at:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/freewpc
Programming is in C. It's not a real complex language and there are a lot of code examples to learn from.
Note you cannot alter/import an existing rom. You have to make new rules and dmd animations. So yes, new/extended rules for tom or totan are certainly possible, but you have to make up everything yourself. Either re-write existing rules and extend them, or make up a completely new rulesheet.
So everyone who's interested, please have a look at the code, documentation, and join the discussion group :)
When I started on CC I brainstormed about what I could change.. anything is possible, you're only bound to the existing playfield layout (lamps, switches, ..) and existing sounds. But anything can change. Any lamp can get a new meaning, a total new mode that's started in another way, ..
I first thought of starting each mode as a bounty in the saloon, but maybe that would make the game too much stop-and-go, I like that modes in CC start now immediately when you make ie the third ramp shot.
Thought of making it like TSPP, having a lot of timed modes with a common timer. Considered making it like RS, travel to different cities to find and defeat Bart. Like JY/Transformers with good/evil, either you're the hero or the bad guy.
Had a lot of ideas but realised I do like how CC plays now. Was not sure if I'd like a totally different way of playing, so started with taking over most rules and making modes a bit more challenging. I do plan to add some video modes.
Aeneas.
-- http://www.flippers.be
George Hali
Sep 19, 2012, 11:00:17 PM9/19/12
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George
Aeneas - www.flippers.be
Sep 20, 2012, 3:35:03 AM9/20/12
to
> During a shootout when the drop targets (bad guys) pop up one at a time. It is always the last target that pops up that you have to shoot for. That makes it way too easy. It would be much better if it were more random. Also during one of the multiballs where you have to shoot all the bad guys there is a ball saver that makes it too damn easy and ball times are way too long. Also during quick draw you have too much time to shoot the bad guy. The target should go down after say three seconds instead of ten which it is now. George
Some of these timers you can adjust now already in the feature adjustments.
On default settings CC is too easy, either set it to the extra hard preset or change all timers individually in the adjustments menu.
Aeneas.
-- http://www.flippers.be
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