Classic Stern flipper rebuild kit parts
Corey C.
I've done a fair amount of research and have found that all of the
parts required to do a proper flipper rebuild on classic Stern
machines are now available through a combination of Marco and PBR.
There are basically two generations of flipper on the old Sterns. I
*think* that the 1st generation ended with Ali and the 2nd generation
began with Big Game. The differences between the two generations are
slight. As far as I can tell, the base plate is different (but
interchangeable, I think), the plunger links were fiber on the 1st gen
and nylon on the 2nd gen (but, again, are interchangeable), and the
pawl has 'wings' on the 2nd generation where the 1st gen pawls do not.
I have not done an experiment to determine if the pawls are
interchangeable, but they could be.
Here's the info I gathered with help from Steve Young.
Parts available from PBR:
- 1st gen. Bushing #4A-111-W-1 $3.38ea
- 1st gen. Pawl right #A-191-R (with set screws #10-32) $5.63ea
- 1st gen. Pawl left #A-191-L (with set screws #10-32) $5.63ea
- 2nd gen. Bushing #4A-111-W2 $2.82ea
- 2nd gen. nylon flipper Link #4A299 $1.94ea (can be used with great
success on 1st generation assemblies)
- 2nd gen. Pawl Left #A632L $7.50ea (with set screws #10-32)
- 2nd gen. Pawl Right #A632R $7.50ea (with set screws #10-32)
- Flipper return spring #5A-175 or #5A-151 (interchangeable) $0.40ea
- EOS switch #SW-294-BR right $3.00ea (substitution for original part)
- Games like Meteor with multiple flippers used an EOS switch with a
two switch stack and an insulator in between. That part number is in
my catalog - I'll add it tonight.
- EOS switch #SW-294-BL left $3.00ea (substitution for original part)
- Cabinet flipper switches #SW-474 $3.00ea
To replace those old flipper buttons:
- Cabinet flipper button #4B-200 - Supplied as as Gottlieb #GTB-
B16680R $1.69ea - See: http://www.pbresource.com/buttons.html - Green
and red available only.
- 2 x flipper button housing #4B-199 -Would supply as Gottlieb #GTB-
C13900 $1.45ea - See: http://www.pbresource.com/buttons.html
Parts available from Marco that are not available from PBR:
- Coil stop #SFCS - substitute for original part #A-186 - No,
they're not copper, but they work: http://www.marcospecialties.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=SFCS&eq=&Tp=
- Plunger #02-3407-2 - substitute for original part #A-197
http://www.marcospecialties.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=02%2D3407%2D2&eq=&Tp
(thanks to seymour-shabow and the google archives for this one)
I believe the flipper coil sleeves are 1 3/4". Please correct me if
I'm wrong.
See here for flipper coil information specific to each classic Stern
game:
http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.games.pinball/browse_thread/thread/71f786d96020b971/04b7adfe8e6b55e3?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=classic+stern+flipper+coil#04b7adfe8e6b55e3
Using the above parts and your old plunger roll pin, pawl cotter pin
and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
Meteor and it plays splendidly.
Corey
seymour-shabow
> and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
> to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
> Meteor and it plays splendidly.
>
Glad to see you had more success with this with Steve then I ever did -
every time I asked for these parts I was told "not available" (I even
asked in person at Allentown '07.....)
Supposedly he also has the baseplates available according to either
Brian Saunders/Bannon (I forget who posted it.....) - but again, any
attempt I've made at obtaining some of these parts was met with "not
available".
I appreciate all that Steve does for the hobby in finding parts, but he
<A> needs to publicize that he has remade certain parts
<B> let his email person know the same
We'll see when I reorder next if I can get any of this stuff you listed!
I rebuilt my Meteor with the 2nd generation brackets and parts and it's
nice...... the EOS switches I make myself with WMS 03-7811 parts. I was
able to reuse the other parts, but a lot of the baseplates are hammered
and is really what I'm looking for - I have plenty of coil stops etc
from parted out games. (The pop and sling stops can be used for the
flippers too)
-scott CARGPB#29
mnpinball
> and red available only.
> - 2 x flipper button housing #4B-199 -Would supply as Gottlieb #GTB-
> C13900 $1.45ea - See:http://www.pbresource.com/buttons.html
>
> Parts available from Marco that are not available from PBR:
> - Coil stop #SFCS - substitute for original part #A-186 - No,
> they're not copper, but they work:http://www.marcospecialties.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=SFCS&eq=&Tp=
> (thanks to seymour-shabow and the google archives for this one)
>
> I believe the flipper coil sleeves are 1 3/4". Please correct me if
> I'm wrong.
>
> See here for flipper coil information specific to each classic Stern
>
> Using the above parts and your old plunger roll pin, pawl cotter pin
> and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
> to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
> Meteor and it plays splendidly.
>
> Corey
Thanks for taking the time posting this info !! I will print this and
keep in my parts folder.
As my collection of classic Sterns grows I am in need of alot of the
wear parts.
Also note that the new blue Data East pop bumper housings also work in
the Sterns.
I think BAA is the only one stocking those.
Jason.
kenny_ii
> and red available only.
> - 2 x flipper button housing #4B-199 -Would supply as Gottlieb #GTB-
> C13900 $1.45ea - See:http://www.pbresource.com/buttons.html
>
> Parts available from Marco that are not available from PBR:
> - Coil stop #SFCS - substitute for original part #A-186 - No,
> they're not copper, but they work:http://www.marcospecialties.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=SFCS&eq=&Tp=
> (thanks to seymour-shabow and the google archives for this one)
>
> I believe the flipper coil sleeves are 1 3/4". Please correct me if
> I'm wrong.
>
> See here for flipper coil information specific to each classic Stern
>
> Using the above parts and your old plunger roll pin, pawl cotter pin
> and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
> to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
> Meteor and it plays splendidly.
>
> Corey
So the idea is to put a new nylon link onto the new plunger with the
old hardware. Kind of a pain, but a good solution. Glad to see this
info put together and made available.
K2
Corey C.
so you don't have to take the old one out of the old plunger. Until
someone starts selling a complete, plunger-link-pawl assembly, there's
not much choice but to put it together yourself. I use vice grips to
get the old roll pin out and a small hammer to tap it into the new
plunger with the link in place.
Pinball Bob
I am doing a flipper rebuild right now on a Stern Dr*cula so this
info is timely and needed. Thanks for doing the research, Corey. I
have found that the flipper and other coil sleeves are very slightly
less that 1 3/4", probably 1 11/16". The longer sleeves do not seem to
pose a problem.
Does anyone supply PF bushings for the flippers ? I cannot find them.
Any definitive word on base plates ?
pinball Bob
MIKE PAYNE
> and red available only.
> - 2 x flipper button housing #4B-199 -Would supply as Gottlieb #GTB-
> C13900 $1.45ea - See:http://www.pbresource.com/buttons.html
>
> Parts available from Marco that are not available from PBR:
> - Coil stop #SFCS - substitute for original part #A-186 - No,
> they're not copper, but they work:http://www.marcospecialties.com/Itemdesc.asp?ic=SFCS&eq=&Tp=
> (thanks to seymour-shabow and the google archives for this one)
>
> I believe the flipper coil sleeves are 1 3/4". Please correct me if
> I'm wrong.
>
> See here for flipper coil information specific to each classic Stern
>
> Using the above parts and your old plunger roll pin, pawl cotter pin
> and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
> to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
> Meteor and it plays splendidly.
>
> Corey
Or do like I do, if I need to rebuild one I just replace the entire
thing with a Bally one. I redone a Meteor a while back and used
flipper assemblies from a Harlem Globetrotters. Worked just fine, and
the parts are EASY TO FIND, and are even available in a kit...
Brian Bannon
> > Using the above parts and your old plunger roll pin, pawl cotter pin
> > and washer, you can successfully rebuild your classic Stern flippers
> > to like-new condition. I just finished doing all the flippers on my
> > Meteor and it plays splendidly.
>
> Glad to see you had more success with this with Steve then I ever did -
> every time I asked for these parts I was told "not available" (I even
> asked in person at Allentown '07.....)
>
> Supposedly he also has the baseplates available according to either
> Brian Saunders/Bannon (I forget who posted it.....) - but again, any
> attempt I've made at obtaining some of these parts was met with "not
> available".
Not sure why you can't seem to catch a break on these flipper parts.
I have ordered them more than once in the past six months. Here are
the part numbers for the baseplates:
Flush mount, used on earlier games like Meteor and Galaxy:
STN-1B309-L
STN-1B309-R
Offset mount, used on later games like Seawitch, Nine Ball and others:
STN-1B572-L
STN-1B572-R
>
> I appreciate all that Steve does for the hobby in finding parts, but he
> <A> needs to publicize that he has remade certain parts
> <B> let his email person know the same
Several RGPers have posted this info, myself included. Steve Young's
business policies are his own and he is free to run his business as he
pleases.
Scott, you have been posting more than once that you need these
parts. C'mon man, push yourself away from the keyboard, pick up the
phone, and dial 845-473-7114 and order this stuff!:) I don't know why
Steve's email guy doesn't know this info but if I needed certain parts
and there was only one source, I would find more than one way to get
it done. If you call him up and you still can't get them, email me
and I will send some to you.
>
> We'll see when I reorder next if I can get any of this stuff you listed!
>
> I rebuilt my Meteor with the 2nd generation brackets and parts and it's
> nice...... the EOS switches I make myself with WMS 03-7811 parts. I was
> able to reuse the other parts, but a lot of the baseplates are hammered
> and is really what I'm looking for - I have plenty of coil stops etc
> from parted out games. (The pop and sling stops can be used for the
> flippers too)
I would not use the pop bumper coil stops in any classic Stern flipper
assembly. Might be a good short-term fix, but they won't hold up over
time. I have probably replaced over half a dozen of these, all of
them were broken at the same spot.
Brian Bannon
Dr. Dave
You are referring to the metal ones not the copper looking ones Scott
was talking about. The copper looking ones are THE SAME as the ones
on the flipper assemblies. but are still in perfect shape since they
don't get hit as hard as the flipper ones do. They work great when
you swap them and I've done this procedure to all 13 of my Classic
Stern pins so believe me...I know.
DR
seymour-shabow
>
> Several RGPers have posted this info, myself included. Steve Young's
> business policies are his own and he is free to run his business as he
> pleases.
>
I tell ya he's picking on me.
> Scott, you have been posting more than once that you need these
> parts. C'mon man, push yourself away from the keyboard, pick up the
> phone, and dial 845-473-7114 and order this stuff!:) I don't know why
> Steve's email guy doesn't know this info but if I needed certain parts
> and there was only one source, I would find more than one way to get
> it done. If you call him up and you still can't get them, email me
> and I will send some to you.
Oh, I'm making due with what I have. Anyone can order all new parts and
get your flippers working, it takes a real genius to take this old crap
and rebuild it like new. Or a real idiot :)
I'll try next time using your part #'s - the email guy probably looked
up the real stern part #'s and said not available - although it's
strange that Steve in person also said the same. Maybe he meant he
didn't have any At The Show. He also wasn't interested in me thanking
him for working with IPB re: hot stamped parts, so I thanked Don Murphy
and Gene instead.....
>
> I would not use the pop bumper coil stops in any classic Stern flipper
> assembly. Might be a good short-term fix, but they won't hold up over
> time. I have probably replaced over half a dozen of these, all of
> them were broken at the same spot.
>
The copper ones are the same (same part # stamped on both) - I've not
snagged any other coil stops of the type you describe (or Dr Dave
did....) If the flipper stop is too hammered I don't put them back on
the slings or pops, they stick if the stroke is too long.
-scott CARGPB#29
seymour-shabow
>
> Or do like I do, if I need to rebuild one I just replace the entire
> thing with a Bally one. I redone a Meteor a while back and used
> flipper assemblies from a Harlem Globetrotters. Worked just fine, and
> the parts are EASY TO FIND, and are even available in a kit...
Uh oh - WATCH OUT, the classic stern police will go after you like they
did for me when I was forced to do the same thing! (When seawitch gets
restored vs. just rebuilt to play, I will change them back to the proper
type..... What was I gonna do 5 years ago when it came with a bally
flipper mech in there???)
In fact I'm dumping all my linear flipper parts, if anyone want to buy
them. Some new parts and good used parts too. I'm a convert of Duncan
Brown's down/upgrade for these flippers.
-scott CARGPB#29
w-mor...@ti.com
OK, OK...Brian is right about 1 thing. The coil stop on the plastic
pop bumper is NOT THE SAME as the flipper stop. The flipper stop is
thicker and on the plastic pop bumpers though will work. WILL BREAK
or help shear off the screw because of the torque as on my Stargazer
at the TPF last year.
The coil stop on the older pop bumers is the same as the flipper
stop. i.e. Meteor, Galaxy and Seawitch. So yes these are good area's
to snag stops.
Oh Scott you are not kiddin on the linear flippers. I am part of that
police department. I will catch anybody doing this and unleash a
verbal assault on you for it. Oh yea. Get ready.
By the way thanks for the part numbers on the all of these flipper
parts. I snag alot of my parts from part playfields but this is a
great reference. For anyones reference I have a ton of Stern
assemblies and parts from playfields from this era. Just let me
know. I plan to keep my flipper parts but my other stuff is fair
game.
Bill
Pinball Bob
I converted my Stern Dr*cula to WMS style sys 11 flippers, and I
embrace them !
A fair amount of work must be done, but I shall list the positives
first.
1) Interchangeability with other games I own, so I can buy some links
or PF bushings or coil stops or EOS switches and they fit almost ALL
my games !
2) They really work well, proven technology. Very likely to be
available for many years to come, should I pre-decease my pin
collection.
3) Cheap to buy when you buy a complete assy from Terry
NEGATIVES
1) have to use WMS/BLY flipper bats, Stern too short. If you use the
generic bats, they look very close to stock.
2) non-stock
3) must change coils as well so more $$$. N.A. if you were going to
buy new coils anyway
This penitent is ready to receive his punishment.
Pinball Bob
kenny_ii
I'm not familiar Duncan's thoughts on Bally linear flipper mechs.
I've always thought it was a good design. What are you getting rid
of?
K2
w-mor...@ti.com
Oh Bob, I am getting ready to launch. So much so I have to cool
down. The police are coming. They are coming.......
Dr. Dave
Stern mechs just "feel" better in these pins. Putting Williams mechs
in there is just WRONG. It makes it a whole different style of play
than the sweet feel of those Classic Stern Flippers.
Put em back! Put em back!!!
Or just tape the name Williams over any Stern logo on the pin.
DR
(How's that for police enforcement)
Dr. Dave
are more reactive and less sluggish than the newer linear style.
Sometimes change is a bad thing. This change to linear flips
exemplifies that.
DR
Brian Bannon
> Brian,
> You are referring to the metal ones not the copper looking ones Scott
> was talking about. �The copper looking ones are THE SAME as the ones
> on the flipper assemblies. but are still in perfect shape since they
> don't get hit as hard as the flipper ones do. �They work great when
> you swap them and I've done this procedure to all 13 of my Classic
> Stern pins so believe me...I know.
>
> DR
>
> www.pinballdoctor.com
Dave, thanks for clarifying that. Yes, in each case where I had to
replace the broken coil stop it was one of the thin metal ones.
Brian Bannon
w-mor...@ti.com
I will say this. In order to play a Classic Stern game in the right
form you must have the Classic Stern Flipper with the appropriate
parts. There just is not a substitute that is even close in feel and
play. NO WAY...You are kidding yourself and your friends who play
your games. You are really missing out by doing this. My
recommendation is do it right and get the parts above. The sad part
is this affects how people feel about a game and I have seen all too
often poor parts put into a Classic Stern games that changes the game
play so negative that they tell everyone that they don't like that
game. When in fact the game with the proper parts is out of this
world.
My thoughts. I would fix it.
seymour-shabow
> I'm not familiar Duncan's thoughts on Bally linear flipper mechs.
> I've always thought it was a good design. What are you getting rid
> of?
>
Everything that's specific to a linear flipper - pawls, and plungers. I
have a lot of used plungers that are still serviceable ditto with the
pawls and some new - if you're interested I can make a complete list.
Duncan's theory is that the older mech with the fiberboard link is
lighter - so the flipper performs better (faster flip) and I agree. The
linear mech isn't bad in that it will last a long time without
maintenance - which is probably why they came up with it in the first place.
-scott CARGPB#29
rudy gulp ptooie
Ball. A previous owner installed Williams mechs in there. They work
great...no complaints at all with gameplay...but I would certainly
rather have the "right" equipment in there. Interesting to read
Dave's comments about how much better the game is with correct Stern
flipper mechs. I like my NB fine the way it currently plays, but am
sure intrigued to think it can be made even better.
I wouldn't mind redoing the flippers on my Star Gazer either. While
they are "correct" Stern flippers in most ways, one has a plastic link
and the other has a fiber link. Not surprisingly, they just don't
feel 100% right to me so I wouldn't mind rebuilding them with newer,
better parts. It would be nice to at least have them be the same on
each side.
Thanks to everyone for posting this great info in this thread. Nice
to have it all laid out nicely like this.
Ted
Pinball Bob
I know part of your response is in jest, & that's fine. But it seems
like you are serious with this statement.
There just is not a substitute that is even close in feel and
> play. NO WAY...You are kidding yourself and your friends who play
> your games. You are really missing out by doing this
If also in jest, then ignore the rest of this post. IMO, "feel"
unless OBVIOUSLY bad, is very subjective and may depend on what one is
used to. If all my games but one a WMS DMDs, then the odd Stern might
"feel" either somewhat bad or good, because it's different. If I
converted the Stern to WMS style flippers, then it might feel good to
me. I am not arguing that it seems that way to you, but rather, that
"it's not even close". Slop in the mechanism, badly adjusted EOS
switches, would make a "good" Stern flipper feel worse than a "bad"
WMS/BLY.
I realize that purists exist in all hobbies, and anything other than
original is always automatically bad. If you object to changeover just
on that basis, I can't argue about that. I just think conversion makes
sense for the reasons I stated in my original post, and for ease of
obtaining parts, some of which are non-existent.
My Stern Dr*cula plays fast and has nice strong flippers. I doubt
anyone would notice its non originality except for the flipper bats. I
wish I could keep the original bats, but I haven't figured out a way.
Pinball Bob
seymour-shabow
You can probably use the flipper bats for the newer sterns with the
offset mech. At least the 'profile' would be correct topside.
Bill's right though, there are different feels' depending on the mechs.
Although..... Dr Dave didn't notice anything about my Seawitch!
.....other than I beat him on it, and he complained about the tilt being
tight :)
BTW Dave the EBD tilt is fixed, no more walking the ball up the outlane
anymore!
-scott CARGPB#29
Dr. Dave
I look forward to kicking your arse on it......again!
What other games can I school you on while I am at it?
Only a few months away now....
= )
DR
Corey C.
As for the base plates, I didn't ask PBR about those. He may have
them. I'll get the part number from the Stern catalog and ask. I know
Game Plan base plates are the same footprint and will work with the
same hardware. In fact, they're a bit better than the original Stern
base plates because they don't have the thin part in the middle where
the Stern plates can (and sometimes do) break in half.
w-mor...@ti.com
Pinball Bob, This is not about originality at all. This is about game
play. I have well over 30 games in my collection and many classic
stern's, system 11's and used to own well over 100 DMD games. The
flipper in a classic Stern is one of the best flipper designs ever
made. It has the touch of no other. It is not about originality. It
is about game play. There is not a substitute. I play alot of
pinball and continue to do so. This is not about strength of the
flipper. It is about the "feel". None will compare to a good classic
stern.
I think we can agree to disagree and move on. If you are happy that
is all that matters.
Bill
cody chunn
old used stuff the best ever, beyond comparison? I don't get it...
--
-cody
CARGPB4
<w-mor...@ti.com> wrote in message
news:a08cb513-3da7-4d7c...@p43g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
seymour...@excite.com
> Uhh, don't you use used pulls from old playfields to rebuild stuff? How is
> old used stuff the best ever, beyond comparison? I don't get it...
>
Depends on the part - the pawls don't wear they can be reused..... the
coil stops I swipe from the pops (when they are the proper copper ones).
I do replace the main wear part - the plunger.
The plastic link never wears on the 2nd generation stern flipper.
They're really hard to break too - although now that I have the part #'s
for them I will probably order new since the originals always have
decades worth of WD40 gunked on them, you can never get it all the way off.
The main problem I've had is the coil stop screw holes being terribly
terribly hacked up - sometimes you can drill up and retap, but usually I
got through a couple plates to get a good one. Now that I have the part
#'s for those too, that won't be a problem either.
Bill means don't replace the STYLE of flippers with something else, just
because it's new. There's nothing wrong with re-using good serviceable
parts - as long as it plays the way it should.
-scott CARGPB#29
cody chunn
year old gear is not going to be the same as when it was new, so what's the
point?
I don't really care, I was just pokin a stick at Bill because he crows so
loudly...
:0)
--
-cody
CARGPB4
<seymour...@excite.com> wrote in message news:fpp33d$j5i$1...@aioe.org...
w-mor...@ti.com
> Whatever. He crows pretty loudly about used gear. I just don't get it. 20
> year old gear is not going to be the same as when it was new, so what's the
> point?
>
> I don't really care, I was just pokin a stick at Bill because he crows so
> loudly...
>
> :0)
>
> --
> -cody
> CARGPB4
>
> > cody chunn wrote:
> >> Uhh, don't you use used pulls from old playfields to rebuild stuff? How
> >> is old used stuff the best ever, beyond comparison? I don't get it...
>
> > Depends on the part - the pawls don't wear they can be reused..... the
> > coil stops I swipe from the pops (when they are the proper copper ones). I
> > do replace the main wear part - the plunger.
>
> > The plastic link never wears on the 2nd generation stern flipper. They're
> > really hard to break too - although now that I have the part #'s for them
> > I will probably order new since the originals always have decades worth of
> > WD40 gunked on them, you can never get it all the way off.
>
> > The main problem I've had is the coil stop screw holes being terribly
> > terribly hacked up - sometimes you can drill up and retap, but usually I
> > got through a couple plates to get a good one. Now that I have the part
> > #'s for those too, that won't be a problem either.
>
> > Bill means don't replace the STYLE of flippers with something else, just
> > because it's new. There's nothing wrong with re-using good serviceable
> > parts - as long as it plays the way it should.
>
> > -scott CARGPB#29
Oh, I know what you are up to Cody....I know. .....I will build a
sensor when Cody comes around my old junk flipper games at the TPF
that requires a dollar to be inserted into the Susan B. Anthony slot
so you can play it........I just have to figure out how to get the
sensor on you for 3 days..........hehehehheh
cody chunn
better play those first, then, before they start to show their
"Stern-ness"!!
:0)
--
-cody
CARGPB4
<w-mor...@ti.com> wrote in message
news:47507548-1da6-47f1...@d4g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
Corey C.
flipper assembly) is part #sw-481 (with pusher).
And Brian Bannon already answered the question regarding the baseplate
part #. So that's everything, I think. I have a 1981 Stern parts
catalog. If anyone needs any other part numbers looked up, just drop
me a note. cooke [at] jory.ca. A reprint of the catalog can be found
on ebay or at marco. Worth every penny for the assembly diagrams and
part numbers, as far as I'm concerned. I don't think there's a PDF
version on-line anywhere.
Corey