LOTR LE Playfield Planking
Drain Man
I looked at a HOU LOTR LE with less than 100 games on it a week ago or
so and there was clear evidence of planking on the playfield so I
didn't buy it. If you looked obliquely at the playfield with the
playfield lights on it was clearly visible.
Has anyone else seen or heard of this issue on any the newer Stern
games? LOTR LE in particular? Defect in manufacturing process?
Thanks...
Curt
compn
8fae06...@t19g2000prd.googlegroups.com:
"The wear from the five kickout holes can really be seen here. Also
notice the "planking" on the playfield (the vertical grain lines that
show through on really worn playfields). Planking happens a lot when
playfields are cleaned with water based liquids, and the grain raises,
leaving cracks in the finish. It also happens when the humidity swings
from wet to dry (the wood expands/contracts due to humidity changes at a
different rate than the lacquer playfield coating, which causes the
cracking in the lacquer playfield finish.) Add to this some 76,000 plays,
and you get this kind of wear as the ball travels over the raised grain
areas of the PF."
-from http://www.pinrepair.com/restore/2001pf.htm
maybe it was improperly cleaned?
CEllison
is the major factors. Take for instance a game that has/had factory
mylar on it. When the mylar and glue is removed and you see massive
planking there but yet it's an area that has never seen solvent/water
of any sorts. When I say planking, I am referring to where the ink
settled into cracks not the wood actually raising. Great topic to
discuss.
-=Chris=-
On Mar 11, 7:52 am, compn <patriot...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Drain Man <curtu...@comcast.net> wrote in news:fb529125-6ef7-4cfd-ae90-
> 8fae06d46...@t19g2000prd.googlegroups.com:
>
> > Guys:
>
> > I looked at a HOU LOTR LE with less than 100 games on it a week ago or
> > so and there was clear evidence of planking on the playfield so I
> > didn't buy it. If you looked obliquely at the playfield with the
> > playfield lights on it was clearly visible.
>
> > Has anyone else seen or heard of this issue on any the newer Stern
> > games? LOTR LE in particular? Defect in manufacturing process?
>
> > Thanks...
>
> > Curt
>
> "The wear from the five kickout holes can really be seen here. Also
> notice the "planking" on the playfield (the vertical grain lines that
> show through on really worn playfields). Planking happens a lot when
> playfields are cleaned with water based liquids, and the grain raises,
> leaving cracks in the finish. It also happens when the humidity swings
> from wet to dry (the wood expands/contracts due to humidity changes at a
> different rate than the lacquer playfield coating, which causes the
> cracking in the lacquer playfield finish.) Add to this some 76,000 plays,
> and you get this kind of wear as the ball travels over the raised grain
> areas of the PF."
>
> -fromhttp://www.pinrepair.com/restore/2001pf.htm
Drain Man
> Drain Man <curtu...@comcast.net> wrote in news:fb529125-6ef7-4cfd-ae90-
> 8fae06d46...@t19g2000prd.googlegroups.com:
>
>
> > I looked at a HOU LOTR LE with less than 100 games on it a week ago or
> > so and there was clear evidence of planking on the playfield so I
> > didn't buy it. If you looked obliquely at the playfield with the
> > playfield lights on it was clearly visible.
>
> > Has anyone else seen or heard of this issue on any the newer Stern
> > games? LOTR LE in particular? Defect in manufacturing process?
>
> > Thanks...
>
> > Curt
>
> "The wear from the five kickout holes can really be seen here. Also
> notice the "planking" on the playfield (the vertical grain lines that
> show through on really worn playfields). Planking happens a lot when
> playfields are cleaned with water based liquids, and the grain raises,
> leaving cracks in the finish. It also happens when the humidity swings
> from wet to dry (the wood expands/contracts due to humidity changes at a
> different rate than the lacquer playfield coating, which causes the
> cracking in the lacquer playfield finish.) Add to this some 76,000 plays,
> and you get this kind of wear as the ball travels over the raised grain
> areas of the PF."
>
>
> maybe it was improperly cleaned?
It was a brand new game (about 80 plays), so I don't think it ever
needed to be cleaned.
:-)
BC_Gambit
This is hard to tell without pictures; I have 2 new CPR playfields and
my HUO IM playfield, and you can see wood grain through the clear coat
and under the screened artwork if you look at the right angle.
Assuming this is what you saw, I assume this is just how playfields
look.
Or I have have had some massively bad luck :).
stevenp
Is the top surface completely smooth or is it ridged where you see the
planking?
--
stevenp
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com
turbo20lbs
eyes. Is this considered planking?
Captain Neo
> Seeing woodgrain under the clear on a Stern is completely normal in my
> eyes. Is this considered planking?
I can see wood grain in my LOTR under the clear too. This is not
planking. Planking is when it breaks the art and through the clear
leaving a crack that can actually get dirt and stuff inside.
Otherwise it's just vertical wood grain.
kruzman
There are 2 effects on pf's.
The first I call ribbed. It is on most sterns and IPB. IT is caused
from the wood not being fully cured when it was printed and cleared.
The ribbed look takes a couple of months to show up. It is simply
cheap wood, that is not dry. ( I was a cabinet maker for 15 years)
The other effect is planking. This is the actual cracking of the paint
and clear. Your finger nails will get stuck in planking, not ribbing.
All of my IPB pf's are ribbed for the most part, and my CPR BK is
ribbed really bad. I have examined hundreds, maybe thousands of pf's
and not one bally williams pf has the ribbed effect.
There ya go kids. You would be suprised how many people confuse the 2.
Both suck!
ron kruzman
captkirk
Good explanation.
Thanks.
captkirk
MB
So much for the LE's "extra clearcoat"
Graining on Stern's is horrible. Sad to hear it is present to this
degree on "LE's"
c2
Good description... and based on it, I have a brand new, clear coated
LOTR playfield that is ribbed. Still looks good, but the lines are
there if you try hard to see them.
-Craig
BC_Gambit
Thank you Ron for this explanation.
Given this effect is present in probably 99% of all playfields
produced over the last many years, it is hard to call this a defect.
An unfortunate aspect of the current playfield productions processes
yes, but not really defective.
I would be willing to pay an extra $25-50 on a PF or PIN to avoid this
issue, but not really any more than that (even $50 might be a stretch).
Rare Hero
> So much for the LE's "extra clearcoat"
> Graining on Stern's is horrible. Sad to hear it is present to this
> degree on "LE's"
It's really a crapshoot. My Avatar LE is nice and glassy-smooth....and
so was my WOF, POTC and Batman....those three were AMAZINGLY
perfect...they looked like A+ clearcoat jobs and they weren't special
or anything. My other Sterns have the wood-grain thing slightly...not
enough to bother me. You really have to be looking at it in the right
light and angle. I've seen some really bad ones on location...I
wouldn't think being routed had anything specifically to do with it,
though....my routed Elvis had over 30,000 plays on it, and it's only
got the "mild" woodgrain.
Greg
Drain Man
Ron... that sounds like the best explanation and is logical,
especially based on your experience.
Thanks...
Curt
JimS
I have a Fish Tales that I would say is ribbed based on your
description. It looks like thin clear over slightly grained wood, but
no breaks.
Jim
stangbat
My TSPP has some ribbing. Nothing terrible, not the entire playfield,
and you have to be in the right light to see it. I've wondered about
it, but never knew what was going on. Although I'd prefer to not have
it, I'm glad to learn that it isn't due to any specific defect with my
playfield.
--
stangbat
kruzman
The good news it that both of the 2 issues can be fixed, if necessary.
The first issue of fathom had some really bad ribbing. Really bad. I
have fixed 10 or so of them. Its a combination of propritary
processes. The result is sometimes getting all of it, sometimes only
about 50%. I have to sand down all of the clear, without damaging the
art, then level with clear. Some of the sterns like simpsons are
really difficult to achieve 100%.
The best case senerio is when it is a new/spare pf that the customer
wanted cleared anyway, or touched up/cleared. Then I can try to get
rid of the ribbing.
I deal with planking all the time, and it is fixable, no prob, as long
as you dont mind stripping the pf and sending it to me. Unfortunatly,
that is often impossible.
There is the method that I saw clay use where he wiped paint over the
planking then clear. I just repaint the area. Both work, but are
diffrent levels of restoration. To each their own.
Ribbing used to really bother me, but it is so common now, that it is
just normal. Like I said though, I never see it on the older pf's. I
see a whole lot of planking on old nos pf's. We are at the point now,
being 2011 that MOST of the nos pf's from the SS era, have a degree of
planking, or the finish is cracked up. I dont know of any paint/
finish that was made to look new after 30 years, used, or stored. It
gets brittle.
I know some disagree, but this is why I advise to never install a 30
year old pf in a game without clearing. Even if by some chance, it is
not showing finish problems, it will quickly after getting installed.
To me a pf swap is so much work, there is no way I would take the
chance. It seems like gambling. Sure there is a chance that you can
install a 30 year old nos pf, that has no finish degradation, and with
home use it wont wear really fast, but that is a chance. Gambling.
Also there are a lot of diffrent ways to do a good clear on older
machines without it looking wet, and super clear looking. It is just a
matter of experience.
So, there is the first installment of my new feature colum, Ron's pf
corner.
Next week... spell check.
kruzman
>
> - Show quoted text -
There was one thing I forgot to include: Although the ss era pf's
plank and crack really bad becauas of their age, the pre-lead ban,
pf's are in much better condition, for the most part. I have seen many
gottlieb nos pf's that were stored in basements and barns, with no
finish deteriation. Bugs, yes. But no cracking. Lead must have been
some pretty good stuff! Maybe someone can personally email me on what
leads application was in paint. I thought it was just used for the
tinting, and not a binder. Maybe it is not lead that is the reason for
the em era pf's to be in better shape. If you have expertice in this,
please inform me. rk
chuck
> The first I call ribbed.
Maybe ribbed for her pleasure?
kruzman
Or his. You sexist homophobe!
John Wart, jr
I'm a selfish b*stard. I turn them inside out, for *my* pleasure!
V|ncent
-first release : upper lighting effect
-secondary : more dark
-last, LE : upper lighting effect; ribbed on each, the same effect
than the first release, level on ring is good but the printing on the
ring is too up
each LE playfields are ribbed
the best Lord playfield for me is the first release but you need to
add more clearcoat layers because also the ring is not level
...my precious...