Advice on first machine
Nick Olson
I've been looking for a first pinball machine for a while. I realize
this topic probably comes up often but I couldn't find a recent
discussion. I'm located in Minnesota and I'll be going to the Pinball
on a Stick this weekend to keep trying out some machines and try to
settle on one.
I'm looking to stay under 2000 for the budget, and being in good
condition would be nice so I could set up and play right away. There
are a few machines that hold a special place in my heart. I played a
lot of Super Mario Bros. pinball because we use to go on fishing trips
and at the end of the day the adults would go to the bar and that was
the only machine they had. My uncle also has owned a Stellar Wars
machine for at least 25 years so I've got some fun memories of that
machine as well.
I'm not a great player by any means so mostly looking for a fun
machine with good replay value. Any ideas or advice on someone
looking to start out?
IMMark
Hi Nick
Well with those machines you mentioned, you should be well under your
$2000 target.
If it is your first, getting one ready to go...is a good idea.
Also, I would suggest something local if you could. That way you can
go see/play the machine and know what you are getting. I would also
make friends/connections at Pinball on a Stick. You may find someone
selling one there.
Although I didn't mention any games, I hope that is of some help.
Good luck
Mark
Nick Olson
>
> - Show quoted text -
Hey, any tips are appreciated. I'm not particulary settled on either
of those machines, so I'm trying to find and play as many as possible
to come up with some ideas.
John In WI
Your memories of machines "back in the day" may be quite different from
how you see them now.
With a budget of $2k, you can even get a couple of pretty decent titles.
Lloyd Olson
idea of what kind of game would make you happy for a long time now.
Wouldn't hurt to brush up on clay's repair guides too. The more you learn,
the more you'll know when you look games over for possible purchase.
Especially if a game has problems and if you could fix them or need help.
LTG :)
"Nick Olson" <bignic...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3c216e7c-e2ae-4c0a...@a17g2000yqi.googlegroups.com...
> Hello,
Nick Olson
>
> - Show quoted text -
So maybe an interesting poll would be, what do you consider the best
game you could get in good condition for $2000 or less?
CDG
Stargate
BSD
Shadow
JM
JD
TFTC
trickpony
I don't think that will be helpful or necessary. There are people on
this group that seem to be able to get MMs and AFMs for 2000, but I
cant, and you cant. But, here is what I have learned:
1) Moving a pin is hard, the first time...afterwards easy.
2) If you buy a pin that is 10 years old or older, and buy it for a
reasonable price, and take care of it (buy new balls, rubbers, clean
and wax), you will be able to sell it with no loss.
Soooo, I wouldnt worry about what you get... in fact, stay well below
2000, I would say below 1000 for your first game. If you have the room
I would suggest that 2 machines at 1000 would be better than 1 at
2000. Sometimes a game just kicks your butt and you want to light it
on fire...With 2 just move to the other one.
Check IPDB.org for the ratings.
Hope that helps,
Ben in franceland
machine.slave
Peter K
First off get a machine that is 100% working and error free. The last
thing you need to get is problems form the start.
My personal favorites that should come under $2000 are Cylone, Bad
Cats, Corvette, T2, T3, Who Dunnit, Riverboat Gambler, High Roller and
Ripley's.
Peter
no_credit_dot
WW
HS
BSD
BOP
TFTC
JP
Tommy
RS
-mike
> game you could get in good condition for $2000 or less?- Hide quoted text -
Larry Esposito
one that you really liked. Easier said than done (to wait)
Lot of great machines in that price range. Some make better first
games than others. You didn't mention if you have kids or if you
wanted something assesable for friends and family to play. That might
factor into the decision too.
Here are my opinions on the usual recommedations in this $ range:
BSD, Shadow - Both are a bit hard and unforgiving for a first pin.
Shadow has more staying power, but the themes are dark and not really
easy for someone not familar with pinball to get into.
T2,JD,DM - T2 gets old fast, but it is a very reliable game. JD is the
best of the 3 and wouldn't be a bad first pin...cheap too, but the
crane and optos might be challeging to keep up with the maintenance.
None are keepers, IMO, either.
Whitewater - Good game, just not a keeper for me. This game's price is
all over the place due to the fact that replacing the ramps and
boulder cost mucho bucks. First time buyer might overpay here, and
nice ones go just outside your budget.
RS,FH - I hate funhouse, there are very few satifying shots. RS, I
think is a very good game. You s/b able to find a nice one for 1500 -
1800. Heads can be a pain to keep working and the opto boards on RS
Red and Ted can be flaky.
NGG.WOF,Ripleys - Might be just outside your budget, but any of those
3 would make an awesome first pin.
WCS,FT - This is my recommendation. Both games are super fun and can
be found well within your budget. Epect 1100 to 1500 on WCS and
1300-1600 on FT. Both are fairly deep and are easy enough for guests
to get into.
(Non-DMD) - EBD,Whirlwind,Diner,Paragon,EATPM - Too many to list, all
great games, just differenet play from a DMD. Maybe that is what you
like? Only you can say...These games are a blast and are not hard to
work on.
(Non-Williams) not much experience here, but many say Stargate and JP
and fun. Don't forget to include a few machines from other mfgs in
your search.
Enjoy the search, and make room for #2...#3 and so on..
Noahpdavis
- Buy a machine that is working 100%. Don't pick up a fixer upper
for cheap - chances are you won't fix it up, cuz these things are
complicated. It's a lot easier to troubleshoot a single problem on a
perfectly working game when it pops up . . . then to start from
scratch. Okay . . . maybe if a game needs a flipper rebuild (make
sure they work) - that's a good first time repair.
- Take an experienced friend or fellow RPG'r in your area to go look
at the game. They'll be able to tell whether or not it's 100% or not
and help you unhook/load etc.
- Buy 2 $800 games instead of 1 $2000 game. Having some money left
in your pin budget for parts . . . or even to call a repair person
isn't a bad thing. Plus . . . having 2 games is better than one.
If you like 90's DMD machines . . . Check out some WMS sys 11's.
Gameplay is very similar with simpler rulesets and sub 1k prices (a
lot of them anyway). First pins that got me into it.
If you go with early 80's classic solid states . . . ballys are where
it's at!!!
MetalPin
> to get into.
>
> (Non-DMD) - EBD,Whirlwind,Diner,Paragon,EATPM - Too many to list, all
> great games, just differenet play from a DMD. Maybe that is what you
> like? Only you can say...These games are a blast and are not hard to
> work on.
>
> (Non-Williams) not much experience here, but many say Stargate and JP
> and fun. Don't forget to include a few machines from other mfgs in
> your search.
>
> Enjoy the search, and make room for #2...#3 and so on..
Jurassic Park (JP) and Tales From the Crypt (TFTC) are awesome players
for first games (I own both), but if he doesn't have any repair
experience the ball troughs, upkickers (VUKs), and weak solder joints
on Data East games might frustrate him. I would go with WCS, T2, HSII
Getaway, BSD, or even a simpler Capcom Breakshot. I say Breakshot
because you can get a pristine BS for well under 2000 and it's easier
to maintain. It's also fun with new school and old school play. Some
people hate it; I like it especially as a first game. Once you get
one, you'll be getting more any way. I always wanted 1; now I own 25
with other possibilities looming.
Michael
rob046
well over a year now & still not looking to sell/trade it yet.
Considering how much the other widebody superpins can sell for, this
pin can be had amazingly cheap. However, I think people have caught
on to this, as I've noticed in just the time I've had my JD that
they've become a bit more valued & in demand, but still well within
your budget. My JD is HUO and like new in almost every way, & had the
deadworld mod & topper. I won't say what I paid, other than that
considering that the pin looks like it just left the factory floor I
still can't believe how these things end up so much cheaper than a RS,
IJ, or TZ. The pin is sturdy as a rock too, all parts stay locked in
tight. In 14 months I haven't need to take off the glass other than
to clean the PF occasionally. People who have played it don't believe
me when I tell them it is 17 years old.
My first DMD pin was a Hurricane, which I think was a good first pin
cuz it is a DMD pin, can be had pretty cheap even in good, clean
condition & 100% working. But I only had like an $1100 budget at that
time, you have $2000 so you got a few more options.
For pre-DMD @ $2000, you can have anything you want. Maybe get a real
nice Haunted House on that budget. A nice Eight Ball Deluxe or Fathom
would be cool. Black Knight, any of those 2 level pins are pretty
cool. This list could go on for quite some time!
Bottom line is that we can't even list all the great options you have
with $2000 in your pocket, especially if the prices there are
reasonable.
MetalPin
According to the new Pinball Price Guide (8th Edition), he can even
have 1 of 10 Goin' Nuts Prototypes for 2000, or multiple examples of
other rare machines in excellent condition. But the bottom line is for
a new owner, you can't go too wrong if you buy something you like to
play and make some effort to learn some basic and proper maintenance,
or at least know someone who can help you. Good luck and have fun.
Michael
Nick Olson
>
> - Show quoted text -
Lots of good advice coming in, thanks much to all. No kids for us
yet, and it would definitely be featured at some house parties and
such we have from time to time. I'm not entirely inept on working
with electronics, etc. I've built MAME cabinets in the past and like
to think I'm pretty handy, but no experience on a pinball machine
proper. Fish Tales looks fun but I don't know if I could resist
somehow modding in a singing Billy Bass, and I'm assuming that would
get me shot in the wrong crowd.
For the advice about getting two machines instead of one, I like the
way you think...can you sit down with my wife and sell her on it?
Trevor
flippers, pop bumpers, slingshots, kickouts, etc. Any circuit board
related stuff I send out to the Coin-Op Cauldron, though there are
many other reputable repair people that can take care of that stuff
for you if you aren't comfortable doing the diagnosis, soldering,
etc. Clay's guides at http://www.pinrepair.com are a great start for
understanding the many things that go into repairing and maintaining a
pinball machine. I would definitely suggest getting one that's in
working condition, but eventually things will start to break/wear out/
stop working. It's inevitable! Fortunately between Clay's guides and
the helpful folks here at RGP, you have some great resources for
repair advice etc. If you find a pin you like, ask for opinions
here. What to check for when scoping out the game, price range, and
overall replayability. There are many different opinions about
virtually all the games out there, so remember it's ultimately your
taste that should dictate what you buy.
That Pinball on a Stick should be an excellent way to get a taste of
what's out there. The Mr. Pinball Classifieds is also a good place to
look for games.
Ultimately, my best advice is to be patient. Don't jump into something
you aren't 100% certain about, there are tons of games available at a
variety of price ranges, and your budget should allow you to get a
good one for sure. Also, be prepared to want another one--it may not
happen immediately, but I started with one game and now own 4...with a
5th one bound to show up soon!
Good luck, and happy hunting!
Trevor
Nick Olson
> I would suggest getting familiar with how the mechanical parts work-
> flippers, pop bumpers, slingshots, kickouts, etc. Any circuit board
> related stuff I send out to the Coin-Op Cauldron, though there are
> many other reputable repair people that can take care of that stuff
> for you if you aren't comfortable doing the diagnosis, soldering,
> understanding the many things that go into repairing and maintaining a
> pinball machine. I would definitely suggest getting one that's in
> working condition, but eventually things will start to break/wear out/
> stop working. It's inevitable! Fortunately between Clay's guides and
> the helpful folks here at RGP, you have some great resources for
> repair advice etc. If you find a pin you like, ask for opinions
> here. What to check for when scoping out the game, price range, and
> overall replayability. There are many different opinions about
> virtually all the games out there, so remember it's ultimately your
> taste that should dictate what you buy.
>
> That Pinball on a Stick should be an excellent way to get a taste of
> what's out there. The Mr. Pinball Classifieds is also a good place to
> look for games.
>
> Ultimately, my best advice is to be patient. Don't jump into something
> you aren't 100% certain about, there are tons of games available at a
> variety of price ranges, and your budget should allow you to get a
> good one for sure. Also, be prepared to want another one--it may not
> happen immediately, but I started with one game and now own 4...with a
> 5th one bound to show up soon!
>
> Good luck, and happy hunting!
>
> Trevor
There's a cheap Meteor asking for 450 that just came up, would it be
worth it if I could get it for 350-400?
Bryan
1) Figure out what type of machine you want
a) EM or SS or DMD (I like all 3 :)
b) Short game times or long game times (I like both, but find more
time for short games)
c) themes that appeal
2) Play some of all the above first if you can
3) pick up a 100% working machine
4) go cheap unless you know exactly what you want
because
a) you'll spend money on tools/bulbs/clean materials/parts
b) you'll make some mistakes (you'll scratch something, poorly
repair something)
c) you'll want more games
5) Listen to other people some (most people aren't giant fans of
either machine you mentioned, so you might remember them better than
they are - I've never played either game)
6) Go with a relatively common and popular game because it is easier
to find parts, repair advice and working examples
My game suggestions
- Bally Eight Ball
* if you like SS, short games and you like pool.
* #2 most produced game of all time.
* Simple mechanics and electronics.
* Readily available parts. Inexpensive
* pretty light (making it easier to move for your first time)
- Midway Shadow
* if you like DMD, short games and you don't care about themes :)
* hard
* relatively inexpensive
- Bally World Cup Soccer (this would be TAF if it was cheaper)
* if you like DMD, long games, and like soccer (or just yelling out
GOAL!!!)
* easy
* relatively simple and inexpensive
- Gottlieb Royal Flush
* popular
* relatively easy
* plenty of repair advice
Trevor
Second: Have you played it? If not, you may want to download an
emulator and try it on your computer first. Get the gist of the
game. Then, if it is working, see if you like it. Just because it's
a low price doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be worth your
money.
Third: If it is working, assess the condition of the game: backglass,
cabinet, backbox, and playfield. For that price, there will probably
be nicks and dings on cabinet/backbox, wear on playfield, and some
backglass flaking. Check the circuit boards too, and verify there is
no battery leakage! Repairs for that kind of corrosion can be very
pricey if it's even fixable. If you can live with those things (and
hopefully they aren't too major), it may be worth it.
If you live near any RGP members nearby they may be able to aid you in
the evaluation.
Let us know what you decide!
Trevor
Nick Olson
Ill probably swing by and play it tomorrow. Guy Sent me a lot of pics
and there is a few cab dings but the back glass and play field look
pretty good. We'll see up close. Offered 350 for it pending seeing/
playing in person. At that price that still leaves me over 1500 in
the budget for a newer DMD machine. I'll let you know how things work
out! Thanks again for all the info everyone.
RD Reynolds
Second, I would echo the comments of everyone saying to try to find a
World Cup 94...that is a GREAT game. I HATE soccer, but got one and
loved it. I traded it away in a deal for a TSPP, and boy do I regret
it. I really miss my WCS94, and am sure I will get one again. Great
game, and very inexpensive!
RD
Nick Olson
So, he's willing to sell at 350, I'm going to check it out today and
possibly load it up and bring it home. If nothing else, it's a lot
cheaper machine to practice maintenance on, and possibly give as a
gift to my dad. He loves the older single level machines.
LRP
If you're in the Twin Cities, I highly recommend going to
Blainebrook Bowl in (go figure) Blaine. They have quite a few
machines (maybe three dozen) of various vintages, and you'll get to
try a bunch of different games all in one fell swoop. Some of them
are not in immaculate shape by any stretch of the imagination, BUT
they all seemed serviceable when I was there in May. Well worth the
time to run out there and maybe find something you didn't consider
right off the bat.
You should also run out to Lloyd's (SS Billiards in Hopkins). I'm
pretty sure all of his machines are out of the $2,000 price range, but
they're all in really good shape, A-list titles (there was a Big Bang
Bar set up when I was there, Twilight Zone, Addams Family), and Lloyd
does a lot here on RGP and is a good guy. So go play his games so you
have something to put on your "when I buy my favorite machine ever,
regardless of cost, I'm going to buy this" list. A really fun place
to spend an evening.
Luke
Glen Peters
putting it, DO YOUR HOMEWORK FIRST. Don't be in a rush to just buy a
machine. Take the time needed to see which machine you really want.
You may not like ANY of the machines that people are recommending to
you...but then again, you MAY. You just need to find out what
machine(s) Nick Olson likes.
TyEdit
>
> I'm not a great player by any means so mostly looking for a fun
> machine with good replay value. Any ideas or advice on someone
> looking to start out?
Hi Nick,
I got into pins just in the past couple years and what I did for my
first pin was give myself a break. I knew I was going to make
mistakes and I did. I went after a pin that I had fond memories of
that I knew I would like and I wasn't disappointed at all. It was a
blast and there is nothing like that feeling of your first pin in your
own home. As I went to shows, collector's homes bought books, etc. my
pin tastes "matured". I started to get into other eras and styles of
pins. Eventually, I ended up selling that first pin to a friend to
make room for another so I still get to play it. There are thousands
of pins and they were made for decades (not just two). Don't let
anyone tell you what pins are cool and what pins are not. You figure
that out for yourself. And when you buy a machine... A good deal is
when a deal is good to you. Yes, DO buy a "100 % working" pin for
your first pin. There will be plenty to learn and do anyway. There
is no one right way to enjoy this splendid hobby. I was completely
taken by surprise. I am still dumbfounded by it.
Welcome and enjoy!
Ty
Cudaman
that follow RGP, play around the area and have many machines in our
home. We also know of many titles for sale that people have listed
here. And many of us are the guys that helped with Pinball-On-A-Stick
(POAS) at the fair (although it was Brian Millard's idea and most of
the machines at the fair are his).
Many of us locals will be out at POAS this Sunday, and if you come out
there, we would love to meet you and provide any insight we could.
Some of us may have our POAS T-Shirts on.
Specifically, I know there is a fantastic World Cup Soccer 94
(Collector Quality) for sale in Mpls that was recently torn down and
rebuilt for under your price.
Look us up....happy to help. And like everyone said, do not be in a
hurry and know what you are looking for or have someone knowledgeable
go with you to point out various items on pins you may be looking to
purchase.
Dave
On Sep 2, 9:39 am, Nick Olson <bignickol...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I've been looking for a first pinball machine for a while. I realize
> this topic probably comes up often but I couldn't find a recent
> discussion. I'm located in Minnesota and I'll be going to the Pinball
> on a Stick this weekend to keep trying out some machines and try to
> settle on one.
>
> I'm looking to stay under 2000 for the budget, and being in good
> condition would be nice so I could set up and play right away. There
> are a few machines that hold a special place in my heart. I played a
> lot of Super Mario Bros. pinball because we use to go on fishing trips
> and at the end of the day the adults would go to the bar and that was
> the only machine they had. My uncle also has owned a Stellar Wars
> machine for at least 25 years so I've got some fun memories of that
> machine as well.
>
Glen Peters
buy a machine that is working 100%.
And I guess I can't say it enough, take the time you need to figure
out which game or games, you like the most. People's tastes in
machines really varies a lot.
Nick Olson
> HeyNick,
I appreciate the advice from everyone on taking your time and not
rushing into things, but like my dad always said, if it's worth doing,
it's worth over doing.
So with that in mind, I did end up picking up the Meteor machine for
350. It was actually in pretty good condition with and it works 100%
with new rubbers and everything. To top it off, we finally got our
$8,000 tax credit from Uncle Sam for purchasing our first house. The
same day we got it a listing came up on craigslist for a World Cup
Soccer and pool table for 1200.
I was the only one interested in getting both and he wanted to get rid
of them together so I scored that one as well. Pool table is OK
quality and in good shape so it may stay or we may sell it. If we
sold it I think we could get 300-400 for it.
So by my count we got a Meteor, WCS and pool table for 1550 or about
1150 for the two pins together.
WCS was dirty and a couple bulbs are burnt out but after cleaning it
up it looks great and works great. Maybe I'll post a link to picture
here once I've got them both downstairs.
Larry Esposito
>
> - Show quoted text -
Great choices! Thanks for the update and have fun!
JediTurtle
>
> - Show quoted text -
Oh man! You are off to a great start! Sounds like you got a couple
real nice deals. Both games will be great for getting your feet wet
as little repairs come up. The WCS being dirty and needing a shop job
will be a great way to get familiar with how these monsters work
without having to deal with a major repair. It will be a nice bonus
having the Meteor to play while you take apart and shop the WCS.
There's nothing worse than having only one machine and having it torn
apart when you just want to PLAY! :)
Congrats and best of luck. If you need any help as you go, you know
where to find it!
ldnayman
> Hello,
>
> I've been looking for a first pinball machine for a while. I realize
> this topic probably comes up often but I couldn't find a recent
> discussion. I'm located in Minnesota and I'll be going to the Pinball
> on a Stick this weekend to keep trying out some machines and try to
> settle on one.
>
> I'm looking to stay under 2000 for the budget, and being in good
> condition would be nice so I could set up and play right away. There
> are a few machines that hold a special place in my heart. I played a
> lot of Super Mario Bros. pinball because we use to go on fishing trips
> and at the end of the day the adults would go to the bar and that was
> the only machine they had. My uncle also has owned a Stellar Wars
> machine for at least 25 years so I've got some fun memories of that
> machine as well.
>
> I'm not a great player by any means so mostly looking for a fun
> machine with good replay value. Any ideas or advice on someone
> looking to start out?
Buy something cheap ($500 or under) and fully working. If it's for
you, you can start chasing expensive titles.
There are thousands of nice EM games available for around that price.
If you must spend $2000 on your first game, make sure it's 100%
working. Things will break soon enough, and it will be easier for you
to deal with problems 1 by 1.