New online repair guides
Eric A.
After looking into the costs associated with hosting a site like this
I've come to the conclusion that it would be silly for US not to do
this.
First off I'd like to make a statement. I will NEVER and I mean NEVER
hold this information hostage! What I mean by this is if I ever decide
to get out of the hobby, tired of updating, etc. I will pass the torch
to someone else. I won't ask for donations but would do an annual
reminder e-mail similar to what Boag does for the IPDB. Basically I'd
be asking to give back to the organization of your choice. Hmmm maybe
even do a Paypal donate button on the home page for various
organizations. IPDB, PPM, PHOF, etc....
Now, I have yet to contact IPDB so they might be willing to handle
this hosting service so me being the gatekeeper might be a moot point.
I'd like to have people contribute with their own areas of expertise.
For example, if you have experiance in Gottlieb System 1 by all means
tackle that one. System 9-11? Then take that on! I think you all know
what I mean.
Anyways, I'll be open to suggestions and input on all counts. I'm
going to try my hand at HTML but not going to go out and spend 500
bucks on a first rate program. I have access to some free web building
software and if you can give suggestions I'd really appreciate it.
If there are any manual writers out there I'd appreciate the help you
can provide as well!
Hope this gets people as excited as I am!
webfart
Thanks for doing this! In the meantime, I don't understand why everyone
is getting so pissed. The info is still readily available, right now,
for no money. For some of the people on here who aren't so computer
savy, the key word is "archive".
--
webfart
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com
seymour.shabow
> Those interested in a new online repair guide please contact me.
>
> After looking into the costs associated with hosting a site like this
> I've come to the conclusion that it would be silly for US not to do
> this.
Eric, are you going to pool resources with Mario (pinthetic)? He's got
plans rolling to do the same thing.
-scott CARGPB#29
Jazman
Isn't someone already doing this? (ie: Repair wiki threads?)
Jaz
bayoubilly1970
Unless I missed the posting within all the fudge, I didn't see Clay
post anywhere that the repair guides were not coming back in any
form. It's only been a few days, let him figure out what he needs/
wants to do and go from there instead of 'reinventing the wheel'...
Bill Heatherly
Bill
Eric A.
>
> - Show quoted text -
I just don't want to ever have the risk of this happening again. So
even if his come up I'm still going forward.
Eric A.
>
> - Show quoted text -
Wiki stuff makes me nervous. Like someone might just delete everything
or change a bunch of the info, etc....Am I misunderstood isn't this a
possibility?
Eric A.
I'll e-mail him now. Thanks for the heads up.
seymour.shabow
>
> Wiki stuff makes me nervous. Like someone might just delete everything
> or change a bunch of the info, etc....Am I misunderstood isn't this a
> possibility?
It's policed by the community - any changes can be rolled back. You can
see what changed too with a 'diff' click.
Anyone abusing it will simply be blocked from editing, or there will be
a core group of editors that have access.
-scott CARGPB#29
CEG
>
> - Show quoted text -
It's backed up so if someone does mess with it-it can be restored.
MrMarco
Last I saw on Clay's site the indexes for repairs are all gone as if
none of them ever existed. It doesn't look like they are coming back.
Suerte,
MrMarco
On Apr 26, 9:40 am, bayoubilly1970 <bayoubill...@gmail.com> wrote:
> wants to do and go from there instead of 'reinventing the wheel'...- Hide quoted text -
Brian Shepherd
> Wiki stuff makes me nervous. Like someone might just delete everything
> or change a bunch of the info, etc....Am I misunderstood isn't this a
> possibility?
Wiki software typical track everything, so the only real concern is if
the site owner kills the site completely.
It works fine for Wikipedia and millions of other wikis, it'll work
for a repair guide. :-)
-- Brian
internet-guy
Kerry Imming
>
> I just don't want to ever have the risk of this happening again. So
> even if his come up I'm still going forward.
>
For those following along, the new guides have removed the word "free"
and any indication that they are/were a collaborative effort.
I for one fully appreciate the amount of work that went into
organizing the repair guides. I also appreciate your offer to host a
site, but I would really like to give http://www.pinwiki.com a chance
before we go that direction. For the record, the HOSTING costs were
never an issue with the repair guides as Mark has confirmed that he
has and continues to provide free hosting.
I try to help with repair problems here on RGP and there were a few
critical sections that I often referred people to. We have rebuilt
most of that information on http://www.pinwiki.com , so I'll refer
them there from now on.
The monarchy that was pinrepair was the most efficient, but stifled
alternate opinions. It also resulted in the situation we're in now.
I'm willing to invest effort in alternatives before we go back there.
Oh... and we WILL go back there. Those who study history are
condemned to knowing that we are repeating it :-)
- Kerry
Eric A.
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yep saw that as well. This was the final decision maker for me to go
forward.
I sent an e-mail to Mario and someone else has contacted me as well.
I'm going to be working with the masses. No sense in starting my own
project. We can make it better working together.
gangstarr
i also have been keeping notes and repair logs for many years, with
much info not on clays sight.
same with video games.
ill contribute....as long as its never brought to a "pay" measure as
well.
has to be free for all.
> I sent an e-mail to Mario and someone else has contacted me as well.
> I'm going to be working with the masses. No sense in starting my own
> project. We can make it better working together.- Hide quoted text -
Ray
>
> - Show quoted text -
Hey Guys, I have printed many of Clay's guides (yes hundreds of pages)
in 3 ring binders. Would it help your site to scan and upload those
to pinwiki? Thanks
Koz Pinlicious
Thanks Andy and everyone involved. Andy and Eric are two of the
smartest guys I know when it comes to repairs and Michigan has a great
source of *very* knowledgeable people. Maybe we should include a list
of known techs for each state that if people are having problems
working with the new guides that they can contact for additional help
or even maybe pay for house calls if they are in over their heads?
I think having *multiple sites* where all this info can be accessed is
for the better, like at least 3.
IPDB, Pinwiki, the one Eric A. is doing, and even others is a GREAT
thing.
The information that *many* have contributed to should not be
controlled by just one person or one group ever and should always be
public and free.
I am willing to donate as I have told Mario and am now telling others,
so please keep everyone in the loop as far as what you all have
planned.
Thank you, Koz :-)
ldnayman
it's a for-profit project in which all the participants will be paid.
We can sell access to RGP noobs for $30 a year.
Anybody want to start this project up for me?
The Baron
I'd like to make one suggestion for whomever decides to put up a wiki
or new restore/repair info. Please organize the information by topic,
heading, subheading, etc and write actual procedures for doing repairs
within those subheadings. A wiki will actually take care of a lot of
the headings, document structure, and hierachy.
I am in no way complaining about Clay's methods for documentation, but
for folks who want to dive in to a particular repair, a procedure
would be easier to follow than long paragraphs of information with
long winded procedure buried within paragraphs. Here's a basic example
of what I mean:
<heading 2> System 11 Flipper Rebuild
<intro paragraph> All info about flippers, parts needed, inportant
information, caveats, etc.
<heading 3> PROCEDURE
1. Lift playfield
2. Loosen bolt on... (see figure 1)
{figure 1}
3. Pull flipper up from top of playfield...
4. Do the hokey pokey
5. etc
Sorry if that seems too anal, but I'm a Technical Writer by trade and
it drives me nuts to not see technical information chunked and
organized properly. Plus, procedures are a tech's best friend. You can
dive right in and get exactly the info you need to get from point A to
point B.
Also assume your audience is a complete newbie who just bought their
first pin off craigslist. Write the procedures for them. In other
words, the more information, the better. If it's too simple for the
more advanced users, they can just skip to the steps they need.
I also really love the idea of a wiki. They are a great way to drill
down to the exact info you need quickly.
If you'd like me to help in any way, I'd be more than willing.
Obviously, with a wiki, my input wouldn't be needed as much, but I'd
still be willing to help with organizing the information.
Lloyd Olson
others. And make an even bigger mess. LTG :)
"Ray" <rutge...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:b34f8f21-b526-43ad...@j25g2000vbr.googlegroups.com...
Loki9
I'm sure that more than a few of us downloaded the entire pinrepair
website. I know I did. Either way, we can't use that info directly
on a new site.
miracleman
other people 're-write' his in their own words on these new sites?
On Apr 26, 12:11 pm, "Lloyd Olson" <l...@ssbilliards.com> wrote:
> That would be a huge NO. Has to be your own work. Don't go ripping off
> others. And make an even bigger mess. LTG :)
>
> "Ray" <rutgersr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
kbliznick
> But if CLAY 'rewrote' other people's info to put on his site, can
> other people 're-write' his in their own words on these new sites?
Yes
The Baron
>
> - Show quoted text -
Absolutely.
citznfish
I disagree. I think you can use it verbatim. I'd love to see someone
TRY tob ring about a copyright lawsuit on free content that they
didn't contribute to 100% themselves.
Hell, if I had a copy of the old PinRepair.com I'd just throw it up on
my site and see what happens.
Lloyd Olson
Has there not been enough bullshit and crap over this yet ?
Why keep it going ?
We have a chance for a fresh start and perhaps rebuild some of the damage
that has been done. Wouldn't it be better to keep moving forward in a
positive fashion.
Or should we keep up the crap and fighting as long as possible ?
Go ahead and destroy every ounce of good that has ever been done here on RGP
for pinball. Go ahead and kill your hobby. Will that satisfy you ?
Lloyd
"citznfish" <citz...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a4f03b7b-4aca-4102...@x8g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
CraigC
agreed.
Just because most people in Detroit are on crazy pills doesn't mean we
all need to dose up and go berzerk.
Write a new guide and make it a group effort, something that everyone
can own and contribute to. It would be great to have a central point for
all this information.
OR
Talk Clay off the ledge and get back to business as usual.
-c
Lloyd Olson;1684222 Wrote:
> Why ?
>
> Has there not been enough bullshit and crap over this yet ?
>
> Why keep it going ?
>
> We have a chance for a fresh start and perhaps rebuild some of the
> damage
> that has been done. Wouldn't it be better to keep moving forward in a
> positive fashion.
>
> Or should we keep up the crap and fighting as long as possible ?
>
> Go ahead and destroy every ounce of good that has ever been done here
> on RGP
> for pinball. Go ahead and kill your hobby. Will that satisfy you ?
>
> Lloyd
>
> "citznfish" <citznfish (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote in message
> news:a4f03b7b-4aca-4102-bf05-b110aa05b4f5 (AT) x8g2000prh.googlegroups
> (DOT) com...
>
> I disagree. I think you can use it verbatim. I'd love to see someone
> TRY tob ring about a copyright lawsuit on free content that they
> didn't contribute to 100% themselves.
>
> Hell, if I had a copy of the old PinRepair.com I'd just throw it up on
> my site and see what happens.
--
CraigC
Art
Art-
chuck
I agree that we should create a guide that is owned by the community
(with restrictions on commercial use.) Wiki is a good option but would
need to be locked down to a select group of editors. If anyone thinks
it wouldn't be the target of trolls they are mistaken. Also the idea
of chasing trolls by constantly rolling back entries is too much work.
See the wiki war on Scientology for a great example. The site would
need to be hosted on multiple mirrors around the world to share the
load and increase accessibility. Also no offense to anyone here but I
would like to see the project spearheaded by known people not some
anonymous user who suddenly appeared during this mess. Let's work it
out so there's one large effort and not multiple competing efforts. If
we can do this we'll have a better site in very little time.
freeman
Eric A.
Joke, right?
Tim N.
Of course it is.... Levi would do it for far less than $30 a year, he
is a pinball man-whore :)
goatdan
> I agree that we should create a guide that is owned by the community
> (with restrictions on commercial use.) Wiki is a good option but would
> need to be locked down to a select group of editors. If anyone thinks
> it wouldn't be the target of trolls they are mistaken. Also the idea
> of chasing trolls by constantly rolling back entries is too much work.
> See the wiki war on Scientology for a great example. The site would
> need to be hosted on multiple mirrors around the world to share the
> load and increase accessibility. Also no offense to anyone here but I
> would like to see the project spearheaded by known people not some
> anonymous user who suddenly appeared during this mess. Let's work it
> out so there's one large effort and not multiple competing efforts. If
> we can do this we'll have a better site in very little time.
Great way of putting it Chuck.
I'll say this for now -- I have offered to have the Midwest Gaming
Classic site host whatever is come up with. Our hosting plan makes it
so that we have both unlimited space and unlimited bandwidth to host
whatever, so we can come up with a full directory and turn the keys
over to the trusted people who want to do it. I'm totally fine with
doing that -- it costs me absolutely nothing -- but I'm also
absolutely fine with not doing it if people would rather use another
site for it. I'm happy to apply my knowledge in fixes as best as
possible, but I also know that I'm not the best at repairing things in
the world, so this is how I think that I can help the most.
Having said all this, I still support Clay doing whatever he wants
with the guides. I regret the fact that I know a lot of people who
have contributed to those guides and are disappointed that their work
was taken offline without their knowledge or permission and made into
what appears to be a pay thing. To me, that is not cool, and I don't
support that in any way.
With that, I have for a while thought that the guides could be
improved. I find that a lot of the time, I go out and am searching
and searching for things that the guides simply don't have, and to me
there is no reason that a new guide couldn't be made to help contain
even more great information. Whether that information is game
specific (ie how to fix your JP dino) or not about regular repair (ie
how to redecal your game), I think that consolidating as much of this
information as possible would be great.
I like the thought of a pinball wiki, but I think that it should also
be headed by a group (not one or two) of people who are in charge of
it. That way, if you have one person who decides, for any reason,
that he or she wants to spend their time doing something else, the
guides don't fall apart. Having maybe 10 people in charge of the
updates, with contributions being made by anyone would be great I
think.
It is in the time of things like this that the best things seem to
come out of the pinball community. Even if the Clay / PPM / whatever
they are now guides come back, to me this is something that is long
overdue, that we can now do whatever we want with. I do ask that we
all try to work together though to come up with the best solution, as
having 10 people running in 10 different directions instead of working
together would be a disaster.
And again, this has nothing to do with supporting or not supporting
Clay, the PPM or whatever -- it's just that for me, in my first 5
years I used the guides almost exclusively when working on repairs.
Since that time, I can't say I have used them at all because it is
usually more specific stuff I'm looking for (see my posts on removing
side rails just recently) that I think a new guide could also cover.
Clay's great, I got my JD from him and have talked with him on
numerous other occasions, and his help definitely got me more into
pinball -- but let's just all step it up so that no one person needs
to carry the burden.
citznfish
> Why ?
>
> Has there not been enough bullshit and crap over this yet ?
>
> Why keep it going ?
>
> We have a chance for a fresh start and perhaps rebuild some of the damage
> that has been done. Wouldn't it be better to keep moving forward in a
> positive fashion.
>
> Or should we keep up the crap and fighting as long as possible ?
>
> Go ahead and destroy every ounce of good that has ever been done here on RGP
> for pinball. Go ahead and kill your hobby. Will that satisfy you ?
>
> Lloyd
take a deep breath.
All I am saying is that I think anyone could rehost that content
verbatim and nothing would happen. It's the only comment I have made
on this entire debacle. and I'd rather have someone host the old
content then wait for it to be re-written again in a few months.
Seriously Lloyd, 50,000 posts and you shouldn't be over reacting like
that.
chuck
Casey contacted me and it turns out that I do know him ;-) So, I
really do believe he's genuine and taking good steps to help make this
a reality. I've suggested he contact Mario and Eric so that we can
unify and create a solution that benefits everyone.
AVP Pinball Division
> Overreacting a bit aren't you? Geeesh. Maybe you need to step back and
> take a deep breath.
Lloyd's not overreacting, merely stating fact. PPM can't sell DVDs because
Clay does not own the rights to all of the information from the repair
guides. Hosting the original guides verbatim, even for free, would violate
copyright on Clay's material. Taking his work and paraphrasing, rewriting
it or simply starting anew, which is what's happening right now, is the best
way to go.
A quick Google search on you reveals nine posts since November 16th 2007.
With that said welcome to my block list.
--
Pistol Pete
firepower
PinWiki.com site. It's the era I know best. Not pretty yet, as I
haven't published any diagrams or added pictures while I sort that side
of things out.
I have added to a few sections on System 7 MPU. I thought getting a
framework in there fast was the best way forward and then let others add
detail and correct any errors or outright mistakes. So far that's
working, and I'm not referring to *any guides* to write my entries for
fear of even paraphrasing other repair stuff. Except *my own*
previously hosted information.
I think it could take off, if enough people get on board to help.
http://pinwiki.com/index.php?title=Williams_System_3_-_7#Problems_and_Fixes
We don't want to host or copy anything from other people. That's a
sure fire recipe for disaster, way too polarising for RGP and pinball.
Lloyd as always is 100% on the money.
Instead, lets be positive and see if the people who wrote some of the
good pin guides and repair info out there are willing to add their .02
to the site(s).
-Richard
Eric A.
>
> - Show quoted text -
Totally agree andy! Thanks for volunteering! I'll pas it along.
Eric A.
Don't forget Mike Breakvelt! I still say his is the MAN! I aspire to
be as good as Mikey one day! An noooooo I'm not being sarcastic!
stevenp
Tim N.;1684269 Wrote:
> On Apr 26, 2:45*pm, "Eric A." <eavedes... (AT) comcast (DOT) net>
> wrote:
> > On Apr 26, 11:54*am, ldnayman <ldnay... (AT) aol (DOT) com> wrote:
> >
> > > I would like to contribute my vast EM repair knowledge, but ONLY
> if
> > > it's a for-profit project in which all the participants will be
> paid.
> > > We can sell access to RGP noobs for $30 a year.
> >
> > > Anybody want to start this project up for me?
> >
> > Joke, right?
>
> Of course it is.... Levi would do it for far less than $30 a year, he
> is a pinball man-whore :)
Levi would do it for a little WD40 on his plunger--even though we know
this is a no-no! :)
--
stevenp
Koz Pinlicious
Mike goes without saying, EM Dave, Jerry, Chance Tess, Many Many
others! :-)
-Koz
Mick McDonald
Dr_Gonzo
> I think it could take off, if enough people get on board to help.
Exactly right.
I wish I could do more but I'm not near experienced enough. I wanted
to put in basic info that pinwiki needs, added lists of games and
such. I didn't want to ripoff other pics and info from the web, so I
did what I could. Only pin I own currently is a sample Amazon Hunt.
http://www.pinwiki.com/index.php?title=Amazon_Hunt
yes there's more pics coming since I know AH is a A lister. Be
patient. Try not to constantly hound me because you guys can't get
enough AH.
William Brower
You don't want me to add to this thing, I'm the worst spelling and
typer on this group. Nobody would make heads or tales of it. I thank
all you guys for putting this BIG project together.
Just for fun, it would be nice to have a section of pinball related
song links, with a lyric section and Youtube links too. Is this
possible? Would other like myself like a "Fun" section?
Also maybe a hack section for good and bad hacks that could be added
to the "fun" section...Am I asking too much?...Please.
And maybe a visual pinball section and a custom pinball section added
to the "Fun" section too...pretty please.
How about some old vintage arcade pictures to have in the "Fun"
section. thanks.
After all Life and Pinball are "Fun", so I vote for a "Just For Fun
Section", That is Pinball related. Anyone agree or disagree with a
section like this?
I can help with finding some of this stuff, but as you all know, I
suck at spelling and typing.
Thank-You....You Guys are Great.
Bill
Tamster
THUMBS UP FOR CRAIG AND LLOYD! Let's move on... I'm tired of having
to see nothing but post on what is going on with Pinrepair and Clay!
I think it will be exciting to get new stuff out and new ideas...
This should be exciting! If Clay decides to reformat to his liking,
and his own information, great more power to him. THE MORE THE
MERRIER!
Nacman
I would have no problem hosting this resource. I think RGPARCHIVE track
record speaks for itself.
I have supplied RGParchive as a service to those who prefer a website
over a newsreader or google. I haven't overly advertised the site to
anyone and haven't clogged the newsgroup with "Please come to my site
type of posts either. The website has been up pretty faithfully for the
last last 3 years without fail except when I take it down for the
weather. I also make complete backups nightly when it does fail.
Lastly, I have experienced tremendous growth THIS year. I have gone
from 100 or so users to well over 700 in 5 short months. So there is a
base growing here.
This site has the capability of linking pictures directly and hosting
the resource. Let me know.
The vbulletin software I am runing and my marginal skills with PHP
could easily handle the resource.
Just food for thought, if you have other ideas or directions, no
worries.
Nacman Out
--
Nacman
seymour.shabow
> On Apr 26, 11:36 am, gangstarr <who_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> eric
>> i also have been keeping notes and repair logs for many years, with
>> much info not on clays sight.
>> same with video games.
>> ill contribute....as long as its never brought to a "pay" measure as
>> well.
>> has to be free for all.
>>
>>
>>
>>> I sent an e-mail to Mario and someone else has contacted me as well.
>>> I'm going to be working with the masses. No sense in starting my own
>>> project. We can make it better working together.- Hide quoted text -
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> in 3 ring binders. Would it help your site to scan and upload those
> to pinwiki? Thanks
No, you can't take copyrighted material and just upload it. The actual
words of the guide are copyrighted, even if the basic facts the comprise
them aren't.
seymour.shabow
> On Apr 27, 12:14 am, Dr_Gonzo <jsm...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> I think it could take off, if enough people get on board to help.
>> Exactly right.
>>
>> I wish I could do more but I'm not near experienced enough. I wanted
>> to put in basic info that pinwiki needs, added lists of games and
>> such. I didn't want to ripoff other pics and info from the web, so I
>> did what I could. Only pin I own currently is a sample Amazon Hunt.
>>
>> http://www.pinwiki.com/index.php?title=Amazon_Hunt
>>
>> yes there's more pics coming since I know AH is a A lister. Be
>> patient. Try not to constantly hound me because you guys can't get
>> enough AH.
>
> You don't want me to add to this thing, I'm the worst spelling and
> typer on this group. Nobody would make heads or tales of it. I thank
> all you guys for putting this BIG project together.
>
That's ok, minor edits will fix most of that. That's what's great about
wiki - you see the errors, and even if you didn't author the section,
you can just go in and fix it, so it's a better experience for everyone.
Edmond
Hi all,
I know you guys are looking for help/volunteers. I doubt that I am as
experienced as most people on this site (or any of the others that are
being started), but I do wish to offer my help in any way needed; I am
passionate about pinball and I am happy to help (or at least offer my
help if needed) to keep/get the information out and to the masses.
While I am far from a pinball expert, I think my experience/degrees in
English might be useful to your projects. I can help with proofreading,
editing, organizing, tagging, etc. I have years of experience working
with others and assisting with the various aspects of editing and
collaborative writing/projects.
Let me know if my help is needed,
--Edmond
I can be reached here, or emailed directly at: edmondjn3 at gmail dot
com
And while I am new to this site, I know several people from the
community; I am sure people can vouch that I exist, if need be.
FYI- my wife and I will be at the upcoming Allentown convention-- I am
happy to meet/ say "hi" to anybody else that will be there. :)
--
Edmond
firepower
it is a huge opportunity.
I think what people are missing is that you don't need to know anything
more than you do. It's completely collaborative, I don't make rules-
nor does anyone on a Wiki. Except where someone defaces it of goes
way,way OT. Then someone reverts the change and we start again.
These skills that you mention Edmond, sound fantastic. Same for a 'FUN'
section or 'Good-hack Bad-Hack' (we all play that and there are some
doozies out there!). Or Easter eggs and cows or hidden artwork you
found when working on your game.
The point is this: Sign up and take a few minutes and start someting.
You don't need to ask if 'It's OK'. It already is.
Best wishes, and in hopes we put bad blood behind us.
-Richard
firepower
other Wiki type pinball resource someone wants to start.
If you want to work on your own separate initiatives, I like that idea
too. It will probably have a different twist to it. The only downside
is we wont have a single 'goto place' for all types of pinball repairs.
But that's OK, we can have links to stuff when it's better on other
sites. If one site covered SS and DMDs, another might be better at EMs
and switch maintenace. Another could be a 'game mod Wiki' that stored
LED uses/debates, where to buy the best repro parts.
More than enough storage space being offered free on 'inter-web' via
HTML for all of us. We've argued for days only about how facts were
stored and formatted and who owns what. A bunch of crackheads after the
dealer split town ;->
-Richard
MrMarco
So, can anyone contribute?
Will someone review the content and verify the author?
The last thing the site needs is sabotage from trolls. I look forward
to seeing the site grow and hopefully contribute some of my own
experience with EMs.
Suerte,
MrMarco
Kerry Imming
>
> While I am far from a pinball expert, I think my experience/degrees in
> English might be useful to your projects. I can help with proofreading,
> editing, organizing, tagging, etc. I have years of experience working
> with others and assisting with the various aspects of editing and
> collaborative writing/projects.
>
> Let me know if my help is needed,
Hi Edmond, and welcome to rec.games.pinball.
You, as it turns out, have the skills that are MOST needed.
Organization is going to be key to making the http://www.pinwiki.com
useful. Proofreading is always important. Making sure things are
coherent and make sense to someone new is also important.
We really should have a page of "wanted" pictures and information. It
would also be good to have a standard way of flagging articles that
need references and/or grammar corrections. Those could be linked on
the flag page also.
Dig in.
- Kerry
citznfish
wrote:
> "citznfish" <citznf...@gmail.com> wrote in message
posts on rgp and several people can vouch for me . But now that the
great pistol pete has *gasp* blocked me, I dont know what to do!
John Bigbooty
mess if some careful thought is not put into organization and style
guidelines before a lot of content is created. I want this resource to
be useful to the masses and I also want everyone to feel free to
contribute. To meet that goal I think there should be a little thought
about the organization of the content beforehand.
For example, right now there are two main areas:
Repair Guides
Useful Information
I imagine we need more than just those two.
Looking at the Repair Guides section, I already see a few misnomers:
"Williams Games" actually covers some Bally titles as well.
Sure, I could start editing this and hopes my changes don't make
matters worse. I know everyone is eager to get content up. But maybe a
better course of action would be for those interested to work on some
structure for a couple weeks.
I'll give you a concrete example if it helps. I'd like to add some
specific repair tips that relate to Twilight Zone. As of now, there is
no entry for each individual game. I don't think we'd want to see each
game listed on the main page, but there needs to be links to them
somewhere. There should be back and forth relations (links) between
Twilight Zone, Bally, 1993, WPC, Pat Lawlor, etc.
Maybe I misunderstand how Wiki works, will it automatically create
links if it simply reference a pre-defined topic?
I know everyone is focused on the repair guides at the moment but I
want to see this Wiki turn into everything pinball, from playing tips,
tournament results, rules, shop-out guides and more. I know a lot is
covered by IPDB but couldn't that resource suffer the same fate as the
repair guides?
Just some thoughts. Take them for what they are, one man's opinions.
Mark
Atlanta GA
Kerry Imming
<BOGUSevileye0702BO...@bellsouth.netBOGUS> wrote:
> I am more than a bit worried PinWiki could turn into a unorganized
> mess if some careful thought is not put into organization and style
> guidelines before a lot of content is created. I want this resource to
> be useful to the masses and I also want everyone to feel free to
> contribute. To meet that goal I think there should be a little thought
> about the organization of the content beforehand.
You have valid concerns, but the outline that Casey put in place up
front was pretty good and it's already started to mutate in the right
direction. It's very easy to move sections around, so getting the
data in there is truly the most important thing right now. Once
http://www.pinwiki.com shows up in the top few Google search results
for "pinball repair", then organization will be more important.
Maybe we should add a "suggestions" page for people to dump content
for others to move into the correct page? Suggested outlines could be
generated there also.
- Kerry
martin
So please have a crack at it. There's a place for you to insert machine-specific tips.
martin
seymour.shabow
There's a discussions tab for every page that info can go into.
If you wait to get the info up until all the info's assembled and decide
on a formet, it will never work.
Put your tips in, and others edit it to format it correctly. Some
people are better at information dumping, and some are better at
organization and look and feel. That's the beauty of wiki.
A lot of web pages started out slow and sloppy and got more polished as
they went on.
John Bigbooty
Well, my skills are definitely on the organizational side so I will
attempt to make a contribution there. Hopefully I won't step on
anyone's toes.
I was never suggesting we wait for the "perfect" format before filling
it with content. Just trying to get some people thinking about
structure while they are creating content.
Mark
Atlanta GA
Hans
going to be coordinating. There's no lack of talent.
At this point, I don't even know how many concurrent projects are
running.
Mario/Pinthetic's project is one of them, Pinwiki is another.
For Mario's side, I've been struggling for a week to get in touch with
Network54 to solve some issues I had when trying to set up a forum, to
make coordination on that project easier. I finally gave up, and set
up a forum over at proboards. Not sure yet if I should be making it
public, or if it will be limited to just the group working on it. I
sent the new link off to Mario today, but don't have the slightest
clue who else is working on that one, so I haven't been able to send
it out to anybody else yet.
-Hans
Hans
up the Atari page. I don't know a huge amount about the system,
but I'm doing what I can to lay some groundwork in there at the very
least. Slow going though.
stevenp
I'm also volunteering to help with editing/proofing/organizing for
clarity where needed. I'll stop by pinwiki to tweak stuff as soon as I
get thru my current work crunch. I've done a lot of technical writing
and am a huge proponent of clarity. Probably won't be able to
contribute as much in the tech side, as pretty much everything I know or
have discovered while fixing pins is known and well-described by
others.
--
stevenp
Pinthetic
Things are still moving and arrangements are being made in the
background right now. It's a lot bigger than just throwing up a site.
We won't be the first kid on the block with a new bike, but we plan on
being one of the kids on the block with a really nice bike. And...we
plan on letting evryone ride on it too!
Mario
Pinthetic
> This USENET post sent fromhttp://rgparchive.com- Hide quoted text -
firepower
forum areas too, for discussions. Having anyone contribute (or review
existing content) as needed the is the whole point.
Regarding sabotage, it is community policed. Unlike here, once someone
proves all they are doing is ruining pages and are only damaging content
then their ID is blocked. Reverting to the previous version takes a
mouse click, it is not lost.
Trolls are a problem here, I agree. But unlike RGP and any newsgroup in
general, there is moderation and we can kick someone out. Once there is
a community consensus to do so. No one is stifled until they have
proved themselves to be useless and destructive to the goal.
I look forward to anyone adding useful or entertaining information, and
it can be moved to an appropriate area. I'm not expecting my
information to stay exactly how I entered it. I want someone to
objectively review and change it. That's how we 'nudge' it in to a
useful lane for everyone, to use a pinball analogy.
-Richard
firepower
Just used 'search' box and typed in Twilight_Zone. So far we did a
better job of complete lists of games for other eras.
Why we have Bally/Stern lumped together at the top level is beyond me! I
think someone added the SS boardset repair first (as the main thrust was
to get a repair guide online). Later that will get moved down and we
have separate Bally and Stern areas at the top level which both link to
that repair guide for the SS era. I think I'm making sense.
And yes, you can tie pages together to create a relationship. One way
would be an index page that had all the tags: WPC, Pat Lawlor, etc.
and was just a 'list of links'. I'm not sure it needs to be more
complicated than that. It took me 5 minutes to figure out how to create
a glossary entry for a TLA (three letter acronym) and add an internal
link in my entry to point to it.
There a button in the editor for adding both internal and external links
to any other pages, just like <a href> tags do in HTML.
-Richard
randome...@gmail.com
<BOGUSevileye0702BO...@bellsouth.netBOGUS> wrote:
> repair guides?
We have no plans to go anywhere. You know something we don't? :)
-W
randome...@gmail.com
wrote:
> We have no plans to go anywhere. You know something we don't? :)
>
With that said, everyone please stop trying to download/mirror
ipdb.org !!
Should it ever come to a point I can no longer host it, I will find it
a new home.
-W
Radius
>
> With that said, everyone please stop trying to download/mirror
> ipdb.org !!
>
> Should it ever come to a point I can no longer host it, I will find it
> a new home.
>
> -W
The prophecy has come true! It is the end times for IPDB.org!
Everyone send every byte of the site to a single workgroup printer, or
you will be the cause of the fall!! ;)
______________________
The proofing will be a casual contribution on my part, though I did
want to put out the idea of offering to illustrate such things as need
illustration; "The 13th microscopic tab in the 8th series, that wraps
around the end- not the side- is the one that needs to align with the
third hole, in the second board. If you do that incorrectly, in any
way, your machine will begin an unstoppable, 2.1 millisecond countdown
to self-destruction..." Having written that, I am not sure which part
more deserves the clarity of image. ;)
I want to offer images of typical, or more needed repairs/
understandings/procedures, rather than for specific games. I will
also offer to clean up photographs that people want to upload to the
wiki, as well as illustrate key elements, add text, etc., to existing
images. There are limits, and I cannot color correct several TB of
photo's of your last vacation, nor want to illustrate each individual
screw from a machine; I must emphasize discretion.
R~