Some Economical Thoughts
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Article: 8430 of rec.games.mud.admin
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From: serh...@cobber.cord.edu (Error...core dumped)
Newsgroups: rec.games.mud.admin
Subject: Ideas about Economics
Date: 19 Aug 1995 04:17:07 -0500
Organization: Concordia College, Moorhead Minnesota
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Ok, here's the thing I've been working on:
player owned shops, where they take raw materials, convert them into other
materials, and eventually, when you have enough materials, you can make
useful items. Each stage would be able to buy and sell the materails
that the shop owns, and set prices and so forth. Here's my question, without
giving away too many of my own ideas (soas not to prejudice responces):
What features would you think a system like this needs?
Features I've thought up:
tools which can be used to wander around the Mud, hacking down trees and
harvesting crops (small time business, for newbies, really)
marketplaces with fluxuating prices and inventories of all the various
resources the businesses might (or might not) need, so players who own
a business don't have to rely on buying them from other players...
this is where the tool users would sell their product, usually
businesses where owners can store raw materials and procesed materials
and where, also, they can do the conversion from raw to processed
specialty shops which take processed materials and convert them into something
which can be 'used'... i.e. one might make drinks, one might make armor,
another makes weapons, a fourth makes containers, and so forth.
The sorts of businesses I have thought up for players to own:
pubs
blacksmithys
inns
farms
mines
logging camps
ranches
tool makers
jewelers
etc.
What sorts of other things would you suggest? What problems do you foresee?
What other businesses would you, as a player, want to be involved in? What
sorts of raw materials would you think you'd need to use to produce
processed goods? What sorts of processed goods would be needed?
Basically, the idea is that you could make money without killing monsters,
but rather from simply buying low, and selling high. Mr X makes a product
out of something he gets from Mr Y and Mr Z. He sells his product to
Ms A, who also buys somthing from Mrs B, and produces something else. She
sells that to Joe Armorer, and voila, you have the materials necessary for
making a customized suit of armor. Of course, everyone needs to keep their
prices down, since Joe Armor could buy Ms A's product type directly from
a marketplace, and bypass her altogether...
What do you think? Email is best, but a thread would be good too...
David W Serhienko
--
David W Serhienko.
serh...@cobber.cord.edu
<===== No fancy sayings!
--
David W Serhienko.
serh...@cobber.cord.edu
<===== No fancy sayings!
Simon Miller
> What sorts of other things would you suggest? What problems do you foresee?
Banks?
--
Simon Miller #####################################################
## ISLAND teaching4.physics.ox.ac.uk 2092 ##
## http://www.maths.warwick.ac.uk/~rmg/island.html ##
#####################################################
Herbert Rosmanith
earthly things: they decay!
if they don't, you gonna have a inflation of superb items real soon.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------
he...@wildsau.idv.uni-linz.ac.at | Fighting for peace is like
Rosm...@Edvz.uni-linz.ac.at | fucking for virginity
Simon Miller
> don't forget that all this items produced must go the way of all
> earthly things: they decay!
> if they don't, you gonna have a inflation of superb items real soon.
>
Yes, quite - and mineral resources will have to run out (god knows how you'll
handle that one...)
Claus S. Jensen
Error> Ok, here's the thing I've been working on:
Error> player owned shops, where they take raw materials, convert
Error> them into other materials, and eventually, when you have
Error> enough materials, you can make useful items. Each stage
Error> would be able to buy and sell the materails that the shop
Error> owns, and set prices and so forth. Here's my question,
Error> without giving away too many of my own ideas (soas not to
Error> prejudice responces):
Error> What features would you think a system like this
Error> needs?
Error> Features I've thought up:
Error> tools which can be used to wander around the Mud, hacking
Error> down trees and harvesting crops (small time business, for
Error> newbies, really)
Error> marketplaces with fluxuating prices and inventories of all
Error> the various resources the businesses might (or might not)
Error> need, so players who own a business don't have to rely on
Error> buying them from other players... this is where the tool
Error> users would sell their product, usually
Error> businesses where owners can store raw materials and
Error> procesed materials and where, also, they can do the
Error> conversion from raw to processed
Error> specialty shops which take processed materials and convert
Error> them into something which can be 'used'... i.e. one might
Error> make drinks, one might make armor, another makes weapons, a
Error> fourth makes containers, and so forth.
Error> The sorts of businesses I have thought up for players to
Error> own: pubs blacksmithys inns farms mines logging camps
Error> ranches tool makers jewelers etc.
Deeper Trouble Mud at mud.iesd.auc.dk 4242 has implemented
much of this system during the last 4 years. Our system works
the following way : players can own guilds and go buy
resources for their products at the shipping house.
The resources that the players can buy here, may also be
purchased cheaper from other player-owned guilds. The
shipping house is thus the limiter for the prices that
guilds can ask for their product. We feature the following
different player-owned guild types :
- Alchemists : they use dust from corpses processed at
corpse processers. They can use this dust and other
materials to enchant swords and armours. They also
buy drinks from pubs, and weapons and armours from
the blacksmiths to use for their products. They also
produce ink for the printers guild, etc.
- Blacksmiths produce weapons and armours. They buy
iron from corpse processers, and coal from the shipping
house.
- Brewers buy grain from the corpse processers, and hops
and yeast from the shipping house. They then brew and
distill this into various mixtures that can be sold to
the pubs. They also produce paper pulp which can be
strained and sold to the printers guild.
- Printers advertise for the merchant guilds. They buy
paper pulp from the brewers and ink from the shipping
house, and write flyers that can be used for a variety
of purposes.
- Corpse processers are the first step in the economic
chain. They pay players for corpses, which they process
into three distinct components : food, iron and magic.
Food is used in the production of alcohol, and soft
drinks. Iron is used in the production of weapons and
armours. Magic is used in the production of any magic
item.
- Pubs are the main producers of alcoholic and soft drinks
in Deeper Trouble. They buy materials from the brewers
and mix it into drinks. They also buy bottles from the
shipping house or back from the players. Some drinks
can be sold to and used by the alchemists.
Other guilds may later be implemented, such as the Mechanics
guild.
Greetings,
Claus S. Jensen
--
/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\
\ Claus Skaanning Jensen, cl...@iesd.auc.dk # Kickaha on Deeper Trouble MUD /
/ Aalborg University, Denmark # mud.iesd.auc.dk 4242 \
\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\_/\/
Aaron Brand
: - Pubs are the main producers of alcoholic and soft drinks
: in Deeper Trouble. They buy materials from the brewers
: and mix it into drinks. They also buy bottles from the
: shipping house or back from the players. Some drinks
: can be sold to and used by the alchemists.
: Other guilds may later be implemented, such as the Mechanics
: guild.
: Greetings,
: Claus S. Jensen
Yes! Yes! This is all well and good...but the bit question is
Can you PK (i.e. Player Kill)? 8-)
Schultz, Russell
[SNIP!}
> - Alchemists : they use dust from corpses processed at
> corpse processers. They can use this dust and other
> - Blacksmiths produce weapons and armours. They buy
> iron from corpse processers, and coal from the shipping
>
> - Brewers buy grain from the corpse processers, and hops
[SNIP]
>
"Soylent green is made of PEOPLE! Its PEOPLE!"
Whacky idea, but conceptually nifty.
Russ/Poo...@ronin.bchs.uh.edu 5000
Tim Hollebeek
Schultz, Russell <schultz...@semail.jsc.nasa.gov> wrote::> - Alchemists : they use dust from corpses processed at
:> corpse processers. They can use this dust and other
:> - Blacksmiths produce weapons and armours. They buy
:> iron from corpse processers, and coal from the shipping
:>
:> - Brewers buy grain from the corpse processers, and hops
: ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
:[SNIP]
:>
:"Soylent green is made of PEOPLE! Its PEOPLE!"
:
:
:Whacky idea, but conceptually nifty.
It looked like a cool idea, however I'm still wondering where the iron
comes from (hemoglobin?), and whether I would trust my life to armor
made from processed corpses.
--
Tim Hollebeek |"What is love? 'tis not hereafter; Present mirth hath
PChem Grad Student |present laughter; What's to come is still unsure: In
Princeton University |delay there lies no plenty; Then come kiss me, sweet and
---------------------|twenty, Youth's a stuff will not endure." -Twelfth Night
Dave Austin
serh...@cobber.cord.edu "Error...core dumped" writes:
> businesses where owners can store raw materials and procesed materials
> and where, also, they can do the conversion from raw to processed
>
> specialty shops which take processed materials and convert them into something
> which can be 'used'... i.e. one might make drinks, one might make armor,
> another makes weapons, a fourth makes containers, and so forth.
>
Avalon already does all or most of the things you mention. Virtually
every item is made by the players using raw materials
bought, processed and traded by the players. The main advantage of
this is that it is possible to become a powerful and influential
figure through shrewd trading as well as through the more usual
means. In answer to your question, the main problems of the system
we find is that many potential
new players are put off and comment that it is 'too real' , 'too
much like hard work', 'it's boring making your own weapons and
magical items' etc. These people tend to be after instant
gratification and not prepared to put the effort into the
strategy and tactics required. On second thoughts .... nope,
can't see any problems with such a system at all. Good luck,
I think you will find such a system makes you MUD all the more
worth while.
Dave Austin
--
+ - The Legend Lives - Avalon-rpg.com 23 (204.248.237.2 23) - +
+ - - http://www.avalon.co.uk - - +
Brandon Van every
>In answer to your question, the main problems of the system
>we find is that many potential
>new players are put off and comment that it is 'too real' , 'too
>much like hard work', 'it's boring making your own weapons and
>magical items' etc. These people tend to be after instant
>gratification and not prepared to put the effort into the
>strategy and tactics required. On second thoughts .... nope,
>can't see any problems with such a system at all. Good luck,
>I think you will find such a system makes you MUD all the more
>worth while.
It does indeed sound like you have a good system at Avalon.
I must admit, however, that I find "power through economic
accumulation" games to be extremely boring as of late. I've certainly
played my share of them. Ever since my early teens, I think I've
played games where to get more power, you have to capture more
economic resources. Linear accumulation produces some very
predictable relationships between people, especially with people who
have no alliances to each other, or who are not "beholden" to each
other in any way. Consequently, after 15 years of playing such games
I don't do it anymore. I know all the algorithms, and indeed such
games seem to be only so much hard, boring work.
Mind you, I enjoyed these games immensely up until about 3 years ago,
and about once a year I still "binge." :-)
I dream of a MUD that's not so much about accumulating things, as
about inventing things. Things which automatically "fit" into a
complex universe. Genetic things....
Cheers,
Brandon
--
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vane...@rbdc.rbdc.com | C++ UNIX X11 Motif | as white as
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