What happened to the New York Go Club??
samsloan
had been there in nearly one year.
In the past this was a friendly social club with several games going
on.
This time it was completely different. The club was empty except for
one Chinese man teaching the rules of go to two American beginners.
I had come with a lady friend. The Chinese man abruptly said almost as
soon as we had entered "If you want to play go you have to pay $8
each".
I asked him who he was. He said that his name was Vincent. I asked
what his Japanese name was. He said that he is Chinese, not Japanese.
I am wondering what happened. Have all the go players been kicked out?
Sam Sloan
Robert Jasiek
<samh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>"If you want to play go you have to pay $8 each".
So the $1 for a second time visitor of the Seattle Go Center was not
that outrageous after all...
marc
in go clubs for free. It's maybe the fault of go promoters who
desperately beg people to learn and play, and then people think they
should be rewarded and invited to meal and drinks.
In our club, monthly membership is EUR 7.5, and there are quite a
bunch of locals who say they "can't" afford it. They can, however,
afford other leisure activities and not fundamental expenses.
parim-nos...@gmx.de
> I wonder why Western go players tend to assume that they should play
> in go clubs for free. It's maybe the fault of go promoters who
> desperately beg people to learn and play, and then people think they
> should be rewarded and invited to meal and drinks.
Hallo, they tend to assume this because that's what they're
used to.
I can tell you only about the situation in Western Europe in
the eighties and nineties, when I travelled a lot. As far as
I know nothing has changed in the last 10-15 years.
Most go clubs in Germany, France, the Netherlands, Great
Britain etc. meet once or at most twice a week in pubs or
restaurants (bistrots, Kneipen etc.) on the understanding
that the clubs pay no rent but the players have to buy their
food and drink at normal prices. Other go clubs meet at
university or high school premises as part of the students'
activities, and therefore without paying a rent. The only
costs are therefore those for boards, stones and clocks. My
wild guess is that less than 5% of all go clubs in Western
Europe have to pay a rent.
When I was in Japan I found out that most go clubs there
meet in private rooms and the manager lives partly or wholly
on the income from the visiting players. Obviously a quite
different situation.
It would be interesting if you told us where you are from
and what is the situation in your country. What about eating
and drinking in your club?
Best regards,
Sergio Parimbelli
roylaird
As a longtime NY Go Center attendee, I would like to clarify a few
points that were raised here.
Wednesday is always a slow night at the Center, I doubt that there
have ever been "several games going on at once". I have seen as many
as thirty players there on the weekend.
The new manager, Vincent, is a friendly outgoing fellow and a very
strong player. He has dramatically improved attendance, especially on
weekends. If you're in New York or passing through, stop by and see
what I mean.
Vincent will ask you if you want to play and if so he will ask for the
$8 playing fee, especially if you have been there before. That is his
job. The Nihon Kiin provides support for some of the center's
expenses, but we have to do our share too. Maintaining a full time go
club in midtown Manhattan costs money. We hope you will appreciate the
opprtunity to meet players from all over; if nothing else, you'll get
a teaching game or two from a very strong player. Surely you don't
mind helping with expenses.
Vincent is indeed Chinese, which shows that the Center has begun to
reach out more actively to all go-playing communities in New York.
This is a good thing.
Roy Laird
parim-nos...@gmx.de
> Vincent will ask you if you want to play and if so he will ask for the
> $8 playing fee, especially if you have been there before. That is his
> job. The Nihon Kiin provides support for some of the center's
> expenses, but we have to do our share too. Maintaining a full time go
> club in midtown Manhattan costs money. We hope you will appreciate the
> opprtunity to meet players from all over; if nothing else, you'll get
> a teaching game or two from a very strong player. Surely you don't
> mind helping with expenses.
Hallo Roy,
thanks for the confirmation of the differences between
Europe and New York (and Japan).
New York Go Center and Japan: _open full time_ / Europe:
open 1-2 days a week, 4-5 hours or even less
NYGC and Japan: expensive rent / Europe: no rent (usually)
Now I am curious about eating and drinking between games at
the NYGC: green tea for free but nothing else, as in several
clubs in Japan, restaurant or coffee house food and prices,
as in many venues in Europe, bring-your-own-stuff and
vending machines (students' clubs), or what?
Thanks in advance.
Sergio Parimbelli
marc
On 16 Abr, 16:49, parim-nospam-be...@gmx.de wrote:
> marc schrieb:
>
> > I wonder why Western go players tend to assume that they should play
> > in go clubs for free. It's maybe the fault of go promoters who
> > desperately beg people to learn and play, and then people think they
> > should be rewarded and invited to meal and drinks.
>
> Hallo, they tend to assume this because that's what they're
> used to.
> I can tell you only about the situation in Western Europe in
> the eighties and nineties, when I travelled a lot. As far as
> I know nothing has changed in the last 10-15 years.
> Most go clubs in Germany, France, the Netherlands, Great
> Britain etc. meet once or at most twice a week in pubs or
> restaurants (bistrots, Kneipen etc.) on the understanding
> that the clubs pay no rent but the players have to buy their
> food and drink at normal prices. Other go clubs meet at
> university or high school premises as part of the students'
> activities, and therefore without paying a rent. The only
> costs are therefore those for boards, stones and clocks. My
> wild guess is that less than 5% of all go clubs in Western
> Europe have to pay a rent.
interesting comment. i am afraid your guess is correct.
>
> When I was in Japan I found out that most go clubs there
> meet in private rooms and the manager lives partly or wholly
> on the income from the visiting players. Obviously a quite
> different situation.
well, that's the way it has been. it is indeed of course possible to
play for free at home or at some public venues.
anyhow, this is normal. sport clubs require a fee in order to access
their facilities, why should that not be the case with go?
in the short term, it is ok to have these venues because they allow
for a quick setting of go clubs.
in the long term, using these kind of "free" venues (they are somehow
more costly because in principle it is required to purchase goods like
drinks and meals) is innefficient because no income means no
economical sustainability, which is needed to buy boards or to face
other expenses.
>
> It would be interesting if you told us where you are from
> and what is the situation in your country. What about eating
> and drinking in your club?
in my club it is possible to order drinks and meals once a week
(tuesdays). there is an unvaluable lady comes. for 5 euros you get a
meal with a drink, which is quite cheap and convenient. see http://lapedra.org
roylaird
> roylaird schrieb:
>
> > Vincent will ask you if you want to play and if so he will ask for the
> > $8 playing fee, especially if you have been there before. That is his
> > job. The Nihon Kiin provides support for some of the center's
> > expenses, but we have to do our share too. Maintaining a full time go
> > club in midtown Manhattan costs money. We hope you will appreciate the
> > opprtunity to meet players from all over; if nothing else, you'll get
> > a teaching game or two from a very strong player. Surely you don't
> > mind helping with expenses.
>
> Hallo Roy,
> thanks for the confirmation of the differences between
> open 1-2 days a week, 4-5 hours or even less
> NYGC and Japan: expensive rent / Europe: no rent (usually)
>
> Now I am curious about eating and drinking between games at
> the NYGC: green tea for free but nothing else, as in several
> clubs in Japan, restaurant or coffee house food and prices,
> as in many venues in Europe, bring-your-own-stuff and
> vending machines (students' clubs), or what?
>
> Thanks in advance.
> Sergio Parimbelli
There are at least 50 places to get food within five blocks of the
center, everything from four star restaurants to pub-style joints
(lots of those) or anything you can imagine. People get foods and
bring it in, or they take a dinner break and come back. Soft drinks
are available for $1.
Joel Olson
news:8862ffb5-76ef-44b8...@x3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
>I wonder why Western go players tend to assume that they should play
> in go clubs for free. It's maybe the fault of go promoters who
> desperately beg people to learn and play, and then people think they
> should be rewarded and invited to meal and drinks.
>
> In our club, monthly membership is EUR 7.5, and there are quite a
> bunch of locals who say they "can't" afford it. They can, however,
> afford other leisure activities and not fundamental expenses.
>
The places in the US that are able to charge the players generally
provide the venue, specialized equipment, and often administrative
support for the game activity. Sports bars, bowling alleys, shooting
ranges, movie theaters, titty bars, all sorts of thing.
Go players mostly meet in places open to the public, and bring their
own equipment and usually make some purchases if its in a retail
establishment. In this way, there is no restriction on supply of the
necessities of the activity, as there is in those listed above, once the
board and stones have been acquired.
Most players I know are still young and have not yet found a steady
positive cash flow. In many ways, go is still regarded as an educational
activity. If a club has a nucleolus of older members, money is less of a
problem.
Even so, there is no niche in the real estate market for a small club to
have a weekly meeting room for few hours for a dollar or two per member.
You'd think hotels would be more accommodating, but they're not.