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Chainmail - The Nerf Stick
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Justisaur
Apr 23, 2013, 6:12:33 PM4/23/13
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I was working on an ultra simplified version of OD&D, and was digging
through "Chainmail". I was extremely surprised at Wizards! Even the
lowliest Sage knows three spells, Invisibility, Fireball or Lightning
Bolt, and another spell! Not only that, but they can cast each at
will, whichever they want, as many times as they want, no Vancian
magic here!
Fireball or Lightning bolt weren't 4e wimpy spells either, they killed
all who they touched, although they allowed a sort of save for
powerful monsters or characters.
There's also an optional kind of spell - skill system, where higher
level spills may fizzle or take longer to cast if a roll is not met.
As well there's an optional sort of grenade like fire system for siege
weapons which also applies to fireball & lightning bolt. There's
historical precedent for requiring rolls to place these spells!
I was just so surprised by all this I had to post. It seems Wizards
got hit with the nerf stick pretty hard and early going from
"Chainmail" into D&D.
- Justisaur
through "Chainmail". I was extremely surprised at Wizards! Even the
lowliest Sage knows three spells, Invisibility, Fireball or Lightning
Bolt, and another spell! Not only that, but they can cast each at
will, whichever they want, as many times as they want, no Vancian
magic here!
Fireball or Lightning bolt weren't 4e wimpy spells either, they killed
all who they touched, although they allowed a sort of save for
powerful monsters or characters.
There's also an optional kind of spell - skill system, where higher
level spills may fizzle or take longer to cast if a roll is not met.
As well there's an optional sort of grenade like fire system for siege
weapons which also applies to fireball & lightning bolt. There's
historical precedent for requiring rolls to place these spells!
I was just so surprised by all this I had to post. It seems Wizards
got hit with the nerf stick pretty hard and early going from
"Chainmail" into D&D.
- Justisaur
Tetsubo
Apr 23, 2013, 6:27:21 PM4/23/13
to
overpowered Wizards until 4E. You have just given them ammo. For shame.
I have also been told that when I stated that I have only ever played a
single wizard (and a 1E one at that) I was lying. That my enjoyment of
3E was based *solely* on my love of overpowered wizards.
Sorry, this sort of thing bugs the crap out of me.
I don't think I ever actually read the Chainmail.
--
Tetsubo
Deviant Art: http://ironstaff.deviantart.com/
YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/user/tetsubo57
Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
Apr 23, 2013, 6:54:30 PM4/23/13
to
Tetsubo <tet...@comcast.net> wrote in
news:kl71m1$p9o$2...@dont-email.me:
While it's a direct ancestor of D&D, it's not a roleplaying game.
It's a set of miniatures rules. And yeah, Wizards were very high
powered, legendary figures, like dragons.
--
Terry Austin
"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek
Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
news:kl71m1$p9o$2...@dont-email.me:
It's a set of miniatures rules. And yeah, Wizards were very high
powered, legendary figures, like dragons.
--
Terry Austin
"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek
Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.
Justisaur
Apr 23, 2013, 7:57:22 PM4/23/13
to
On Apr 23, 3:54 pm, Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy
<tausti...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Tetsubo <tets...@comcast.net> wrote innews:kl71m1$p9o$2...@dont-email.me:
Hmm... Looking through a bit more, The Sage titled wizard has the
point value of a Super-Hero, which is the equivalent of 200 heavy
horse! Super hero is the 8th level title for Fighter in AD&D as well
(although I'm not sure even a well equipped 8th lv. fighter could take
on 200 heavy horse and have even a 50/50 chance of winning). But that
means we might be looking at something like a minimum of an 8th lv
Wizard, which is pretty potent in any edition (except 4e).
- Justisaur
<tausti...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Tetsubo <tets...@comcast.net> wrote innews:kl71m1$p9o$2...@dont-email.me:
point value of a Super-Hero, which is the equivalent of 200 heavy
horse! Super hero is the 8th level title for Fighter in AD&D as well
(although I'm not sure even a well equipped 8th lv. fighter could take
on 200 heavy horse and have even a 50/50 chance of winning). But that
means we might be looking at something like a minimum of an 8th lv
Wizard, which is pretty potent in any edition (except 4e).
- Justisaur
tussock
Apr 24, 2013, 12:16:37 PM4/24/13
to
Justisaur wrote:
> Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy wrote:
lesser Magic-Users only go down to what would become 8th level, as you note.
Though their spells are rather better in many ways, battlefield area
effects, at-will "artillery" fireballs, and so on.
> Super hero is the 8th level title for Fighter in AD&D as well
> (although I'm not sure even a well equipped 8th lv. fighter could
> take on 200 heavy horse and have even a 50/50 chance of winning).
It's the man-to-man rules for OD&D, 1:1 figures, so it's the same cost
as 20 heavy horse, which they ... I'm not sure, might beat, really they're
for handling the mid-range monsters. Same deal for Mages.
> But that means we might be looking at something like a minimum of an
> 8th lv Wizard, which is pretty potent in any edition (except 4e).
Yep. The Fighters are 4th or 8th, the Mages 8th-11th. That's where the
weird post-name-level progressions came from, all higher level than the most
mystically powerful humans could be, you see.
--
tussock
> Gutless Umbrella Carrying Sissy wrote:
> Tetsubo wrote:
>>> I don't think I ever actually read the Chainmail.
>>
>> While it's a direct ancestor of D&D, it's not a roleplaying game.
>> It's a set of miniatures rules. And yeah, Wizards were very high
>> powered, legendary figures, like dragons.
>
> Hmm... Looking through a bit more, The Sage titled wizard has the
> point value of a Super-Hero, which is the equivalent of 200 heavy
> horse!
The Wizard title is the same as Wizard title in AD&D, 11th level. The
>>> I don't think I ever actually read the Chainmail.
>>
>> While it's a direct ancestor of D&D, it's not a roleplaying game.
>> It's a set of miniatures rules. And yeah, Wizards were very high
>> powered, legendary figures, like dragons.
>
> Hmm... Looking through a bit more, The Sage titled wizard has the
> point value of a Super-Hero, which is the equivalent of 200 heavy
> horse!
lesser Magic-Users only go down to what would become 8th level, as you note.
Though their spells are rather better in many ways, battlefield area
effects, at-will "artillery" fireballs, and so on.
> Super hero is the 8th level title for Fighter in AD&D as well
> (although I'm not sure even a well equipped 8th lv. fighter could
> take on 200 heavy horse and have even a 50/50 chance of winning).
as 20 heavy horse, which they ... I'm not sure, might beat, really they're
for handling the mid-range monsters. Same deal for Mages.
> But that means we might be looking at something like a minimum of an
> 8th lv Wizard, which is pretty potent in any edition (except 4e).
weird post-name-level progressions came from, all higher level than the most
mystically powerful humans could be, you see.
--
tussock
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