DD Please explain this.
mirade...@ynospamoohay.com
DD clearly stated on COB that provoke is being changed due to bards
killing tamed pets in houses.
Now last time I checked you cannot provoke tamed pets, only wild
animals and monsters.
Last time I looked on OSI having untame animals in your house is
illegal and if a GM sees them they will delete them.
SO please tell me exactly why is it that Bards are being penalised due
to an outcome that could be avoided if the people who complained had
just fed thier pets or stabled them (or if they wanted to keep them
illegally, trapped them better).
Second. This 1 tile snoop allowance? Please explain who you's came to
this conclusion? And please don't give me comparisons to real life, as
you know as well as I do the fact of what you can carry in your
backpack defeats that argument.
Seeing as there are two well known exploits for thieves that make a
complete mockery of the Rogue Class you's created (in a classless
game), why is it you's refuse to fix this, which is anti-social to
those who play under the Rogue system and anti-social to those people
who are stolen from by Rogues who are not (yes you don't have to be in
the NPC guild to steal, and you can report people who kill you when
you've stolen).
Why not just remove anything thief related and say your getting rid of
it? Because that's what it looks like your doing.
Sean
figured out how the pricks managed to kill off my bear and one of my two
sheep. (after reading why bards have LOS checks):
------> They were next to each other.
For future reference, a paladin will take out a grizzly bear.
<sarcasm>IMO, the bard should have his legs cut off because he upset my
gameplay.</sarcasm>
Personally, I can't wait for the LOS check.
-Sean
mirade...@yNOSPAMoohay.com wrote in message
<371fcca6...@news.earthlink.net>...
Matt Frisch
into the ether:
>Hi,
>
>DD clearly stated on COB that provoke is being changed due to bards
>killing tamed pets in houses.
>
>Now last time I checked you cannot provoke tamed pets, only wild
>animals and monsters.
Animals that are tamed but get stored in a house because the person is
unwilling or unable to stable it. They get un-tamed after a while, and can
be provoked.
Wouldn't you be pissed off if someone managed to provoke your great wyrm to
death? (Course, what they would find to provoke it against that would kill
it, I wouldn't venture to guess).
Hobbes
animals/monsters in your house. All the bard has to do is call a GM
and they will delete it. In fact I know a large number of bards who
are now going to call a GM from now on.
Try trapping your monsters better in your house if your so intent on
illegally having animals in your house.
Hobbes
wrote:
>Good idea, hope he takes your suggestion. *grin*
Thanks I hope so too. :) Because it means they will pick on another
skill. And prehaps you misread my post. People who play by OSI rules
as a Thief/Rogue are being explioted the hell out of, while it's still
possible to steal from people not following the OSI rules for Rogues
and people who are stolen from have no way of player justice open to
them.
Hobbes
wrote:
>My grizzly bear (that I paid for) went untamed in my house. I *finally*
>figured out how the pricks managed to kill off my bear and one of my two
>sheep. (after reading why bards have LOS checks):
Having untame animals in your house is illegal. Go read OSI's pages.
Second a few simple chests would of stopped the animals from killing
each other. Yea I know people don't want to do that, but I can't see
how Bards can be penalised for people who are breaking the rules.
Sean
was untame when I was asleep... 6 hours is not enough time.
Hobbes wrote in message <37205e7a...@news.earthlink.net>...
Raph Koster
>Hi,
>DD clearly stated on COB that provoke is being changed due to bards
>killing tamed pets in houses.
Pets that go untamed while left in there. :P You can't provoke stuff
that is still tamed, of course.
There's also the simple fact that you can kill massive quantities of
high loot, high power creatures with zero risk using this skill.
-Raph Koster
Lead Designer, Ultima Online
Dirk Fabian
Raph Koster <rko...@origin.ea.com> wrote:
>mirade...@yNOSPAMoohay.com wrote:
>
>>Hi,
>
>>DD clearly stated on COB that provoke is being changed due to bards
>>killing tamed pets in houses.
>
>There's also the simple fact that you can kill massive quantities of
>high loot, high power creatures with zero risk using this skill.
>
>
>-Raph Koster
Um, you didn't see this coming when you designed the Bardic powers? Why build a
provoke power in if you think it will be too powerful? Perhaps re-thinking how
the monster AI responds to the provocation would be a less damaging solution to an
entire character archetype.
And of course, no one ever uses Blade Spirits and EV's to harvest massive
quantities of high-power high-loot monsters with absolutely no risk. Standing on
a ledge is never exploited by the mages of the world. You build monsters that
can't be fought toe-to-toe by one person to encourage parties of adventurers, but
either a) the monster AI requires one sacrificial lamb fighter to keep the monster
still or b) a bard to keep the hordes of critters off of a few fighters OR c) ONE
SOLITARY MAGE in an inaccessible spot. What's the real problem here?
Personally, I think you are finally going to have to break down and do a major
re-write of the monster AI... I know it's a big coding task, but 1/2 the player
vs. monster exploits in the game come from the AI's inability to deal
intelligently with multiple targets and terrain.
-dirk
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>mirade...@yNOSPAMoohay.com wrote:
>
>>Hi,
>
>>DD clearly stated on COB that provoke is being changed due to bards
>>killing tamed pets in houses.
>
>Pets that go untamed while left in there. :P You can't provoke stuff
>that is still tamed, of course.
:P yourself :) it's your words.
>There's also the simple fact that you can kill massive quantities of
>high loot, high power creatures with zero risk using this skill.
So is the LOS going to be fixed for monsters? Am I going to be able to
walk along a corridor that a monster in a room can't see me, and
obviously can't hear me seeing as he can't hear my tamborine? How
about monsters that can target you when you are hidden? Or one that's
not even in view.
As for killing massive quantites, erm I play a Rogue/Bard
(music/provoke instead of detect hidden/remove trap) and there is no
way I can kill anything in hand to hand (regardless of what weapon I
use) Even if I provoke all the monsters there I'm still left with one,
I can't loot the corpses because if I try either the monster is
quicker or gives me a few whacks.
Anyway all this is based on being out in the open against non magic
creatures. In a dungeon I wouldn't have a chance.
Drake
sitting in the house naying and suck until I come home, retame him and feed
him. I suspect I'd have issue with the GM that came to make issue of me
having untamed animals in my house.
Hobbes <hob...@NOSPAMearthlink.net> wrote in message
news:37205e7a...@news.earthlink.net...
Mira de Vorsha
>Hmm, then I'm in a world of hurt. My dam back-up horse goes wild every day,
>sitting in the house naying and suck until I come home, retame him and feed
>him. I suspect I'd have issue with the GM that came to make issue of me
>having untamed animals in my house.
Go read the OSI site as to why they remove them. Basically at one
point no Sheep and Polar bears were spawning anywhere because they
were all trapped in peoples houses. You also mess up the spawning of
the area.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>The jerks in UO have spoiled a lot of good things, and they will
>continue to do so until OSI takes some positive actions.
>(They have taken a good step in that direction this week).
Actually the people who can't cope with the problem have been a bigger
effect in getting the game nerfed then the actual problem.
OSI implemented the new Rogue and Thief classes. In the Rogues case it
was to help out in the dungeons. The class is useless as they have to
use stealth to actually get anywhere and a semi decent mage will mess
up your stealth. Not to mention if there are two stealthers or Rogues
in the group they won't have a hope of crawling (snails pace) around
the dungeon.
Now the OSI Thief was designed to make it not only harder to steal (In
town is a joke) but also to allow the current players have justice
against them. How? By killing them, where as the Thief cannot fight
back, only run because if they kill them they get kicked out of the
guild.
How did OSI mess up?
Well instead of killing the thief, they kill the character by making
the thief autodefend then killing themselves so they can force a
murder count on them.
Because of the explioters killing off Thieves who are trying to play
by OSI's rules the thief is forced to play the new kind of Explioter
thief.
Basically, make someone go gray and steal from them. Or steal from a
Red. Tell them you have stolen, if they attack kill them or let them
kill you and give them a murder count. So no player justice except for
the thief who got thrown out of the guild. This is brought about by
the people who felt intent on killing the Thief class by expliots.
>I would really like to see the RPG Rogue in UO, but the UO Thief
>is just a pain in the arse.
Depends how it's played. I play in a RP guild of Thieves/Rogues. Some
of the guilds we have attacked have been ready and actually fought us
off with ease. Others that haven't expected us to show up have been
walked all over. We offer to sell back anything we steal to them, we
don't kill thier horses (although we do steal them). Also some others
quite simply haven't got a clue of how the Rogue/Thief class works so
in some instances I've walked into a bank and had it clear completly
simply because they knew me :) (Didn't take anything or snoop).
We also don't use exploits and we don't harrass players. We had one
new member (for 15 minutes) verbally and in game abused another player
(I'm not going into details, lets just say OSI should fix the way dead
bodies lie). Our guild returned all her goods, gave her an extra 1K
and some other stuff and kicked him out of the guild (which lead to
couple of attempted nukes).
However the so called "Role players" seem to be the first to pull the
expliots. Certain players have on every player in our guild BO'ed
them, nuked, threatening letters, verbal in game abuse, harrassment on
the players and attacks and harrassment on other characters which have
nothing to do with the original character (and my characters for
example have nothing to do with one another at all).
We wouldn't put up with that kind of crap from others so we don't see
why we should do the same as them.
We have no problem about people coming for us, but they should least
have the decency to play within the game.
I'm not sayying all UO Thieves are assholes but don't paint us all
with the same brush. Otherwise you might as well say all Mages are
PK's wussies who sit on a hill and EV monsters all day.
Michael Wiktowy
monsters.
For one, high power monsters usually don't occur in packs ... which bards depend upon.
Second, bards have very little else in their toolkit. Sure ... peacemaking is somewhat
useful but what else? They always have to have some secondary skill to rely upon.
throw them a bone!
Third, provocation is not a quick skill. You have to have a pretty high skill to
provoke at any reasonable rate to make those massive kills. Additionally, provoking is
one of the harder skills to macro ... it is definitely not impossible ... but it is
harder than most skills. The only way I can see is caging an animal in your house and
provoking it on yourself.
Therefore, I think a more effective way to change barding to satisfy the people who
think bards are raking in the loot is maybe to make it skill based much like taming.
Say base it off the monsters intellegence ... the higher the monster intellegence, the
higher your barding skill has to be to provoke it. I would imagine that the more
powerful monsters have the highest intellegence ... but even if some don't that would
be ok ... once again ... throw the bards a bone! this would cut down on the
effectivement of macroing too since the marcoer would have to cage smarter and smarter
monsters to build their skill up ... which would be more and more difficult to do ...
which would force them to do it the normal way. of course this would put all the
people who have macroed this to death at an advantage over others that are forced to
raise skill in a more legitimate manner ... but that has happened uncountable times in
the past (most recently with fishing) but the differences would even out over time.
I have a low level bard that is by no means a power-looter since the one monster left
would wipe him out in a hurry. But I would hate to lose the ability to get rid of
those damn annoying chirping birds on the top of every rooftop in town or those REALLY
annoying cats that wail and dogs that bark inside of serpents hold's walls .... they
make me maaaddd I tell you ... MAAAAADDDD!!! :] so i provoke them down to one barking
dog or meowing cat (which is much more tolerable :])
so please, please, please let me take care of those damn birds on roof tops and cats
and dogs stuck in the walls and don't introduce LOS checks for provocation. Otherwise,
my only alternative is to call a OSI-GM to take care of them since 50 dogs and cats
stuck inside a wall with no entrances detracts from my gaming experience ;] And we all
know, support costs money! (hehe ... hit 'em where it hurts ... their profit margin
>:})
just my thoughts ...
Dirk Fabian wrote:
*snip*
JubJub McRae
thieves in the game was a serious problem. In fixing it, someone had
to get hurt - that the few thieves who actually used the skill as
something other than a tool to harass was unfortunate, but it was a
very worthwhile sacrifine for the good of the game.
Lord Brend
The issue is the horrid NPC AI in this game. There are so many ways to
trick and exploit the NPC AI in this game.
Now.. Onto my question. What exactly are the proposed changes
to the provoke, I missed those. I have 180 points invested into music
and provoke.
Matt Frisch
scribed into the ether:
>On Fri, 23 Apr 1999 09:41:41 GMT, matu...@yahoo.spam.me.not.com (Matt
>Frisch) wrote:
>>Wouldn't you be pissed off if someone managed to provoke your great wyrm to
>>death? (Course, what they would find to provoke it against that would kill
>>it, I wouldn't venture to guess).
>
>Do you actually read the OSI website? You are not allowed untame
>animals/monsters in your house.
If this is actually true, then a lot of players are going to get screwed.
It is difficult to find a stable that isn't full, and that leaves only one
place to put a pet/horse...your house.
Not to mention that this really makes no sense. Why would OSI care if
someone trapped a monster in their house?
> All the bard has to do is call a GM
>and they will delete it. In fact I know a large number of bards who
>are now going to call a GM from now on.
Why would a bard care if someone traps a monster in his house?
And the more I think about it, the more it seems to me that you are full of
shit.
If keeping an animal/monster in your house is to become illegal, and the
GMs will delete them, why would it be necesary to prevent bards from
provoking? Answer: It wouldn't. Why code in something that is completely
useless? Keeping animals in your house is and will remain quite legal.
>Try trapping your monsters better in your house if your so intent on
>illegally having animals in your house.
If only I owned a house...
Matt Frisch
<sp...@remove-this.mindless.com> scribed into the ether:
>I honestly don't see bards as a major force wiping out major quantities of high power
>monsters.
>
>For one, high power monsters usually don't occur in packs ... which bards depend upon.
High power mobs also do not appear with any kind of frequency in the
wilderness, which last I checked was the only place you could put a house
in which to trap them.
Billy Pilgrim
have managed to reach GM (without macroing). It was a surprise to me
that GM level gave me no significant advantage over, say 70-80 skill.
This graduation is a part of so many other skills that I can't believe
it would be a huge coding exercise to extend it to bards. It would
preserve the logic of music as a non-visual medium and would give an
incentive to bards to attain higher skill levels.
On Sat, 24 Apr 1999 04:51:52 GMT, Michael Wiktowy wrote:
>Therefore, I think a more effective way to change barding to satisfy the people who
>think bards are raking in the loot is maybe to make it skill based much like taming.
>Say base it off the monsters intellegence ... the higher the monster intellegence, the
>higher your barding skill has to be to provoke it.
>
Billy Pilgrim
[Europa]
Patrick Roy
wrote:
>There's also the simple fact that you can kill massive quantities of
>high loot, high power creatures with zero risk using this skill.
Talking about eving/blading mages, right? ;)
Mira de Vorsha
Reread it again. The people who suffered at the ones who are trying to
play by OSI's rules. They get kicked out of the thieves guild by
people using an exploit.
Once they are kicked out the only way they can continue is by using a
exploit which allows them to steal without the person who they are
stealing from being able to kill them.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>The bear went untamed before I could have someone retame it. It probably
>was untame when I was asleep... 6 hours is not enough time.
There would have to be two animals in the house before it can be
provoked. If you didn't have two animals in there, then a GM would of
then deleted it.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>Pandemonium says he's working on that. And if he codes half the stuff
>he claims he will, you'll see me and half the membership cowering
>behind Lord British's throne - along with Lord British. >:)
Actually he said they were a list of suggestions that he gave. He's
currently working on the client code. I can't see it appearing any
time soon. They still have to put good and evil and Necromancy in.
They were promised before that.
Mira de Vorsha
Frisch) wrote:
>If this is actually true, then a lot of players are going to get screwed.
>It is difficult to find a stable that isn't full, and that leaves only one
>place to put a pet/horse...your house.
It is true, read the website. Actually I've pasted the page down below
for you to read.
>Not to mention that this really makes no sense. Why would OSI care if
>someone trapped a monster in their house?
Because it effects the spawn in the area. It also stops the creatures
from spawning elsewhere.
>Why would a bard care if someone traps a monster in his house?
>And the more I think about it, the more it seems to me that you are full of
>shit.
DD stated that they were nerfing bards because they were provoking
animals in peoples houses. They can only provoke "WILD" animals (not
tame ones) and having wild animals and monsters in your house are
illegal.
And if you can bring your argument across without being abusive, don't
bother commenting.
>If keeping an animal/monster in your house is to become illegal, and the
>GMs will delete them, why would it be necesary to prevent bards from
>provoking? Answer: It wouldn't.
Read above.
> Why code in something that is completely
>useless? Keeping animals in your house is and will remain quite legal.
Read the OSI page.
From the OSI page: http://support.uo.com/gm_npc.html
NPCs
Is it legal to trap NPCs or monsters in a house?
Game Masters will delete monsters and NPCs from houses and trapped
locations for a variety of reasons. If a GM finds or is alerted to one
of these houses, he will proceed to see if the monster or NPC should
be deleted or not. Due to the limited amount of monsters and NPCs that
the game world will allow at any given time, it is not fair to all
other players if a particular player “hoards” monsters or NPCs.
If the monster was tamed or the NPC hired, the GM will check to see if
there is any loyalty to the house owner.
If the loyalty is zero, then the GM will delete that particular
monster/NPC. The monster/NPC will spawn in its natural location once
again.
If the monster was never tamed or NPC never hired, the GM will delete
it, allowing the monster/NPC to respawn correctly.
Possibly the best examples of resources (or lack thereof) are the
trapping of sheep and polar bears. Due to the large amount trapped
within houses, these creature templates literally stopped spawning.
Lack of sheep in turn affected players’ ability to get wool from the
sheep, which in turn crippled tailors’ ability to weave clothes. The
trapping of polar bears meant that other players who ventured to Ice
Island seeking to gain valuable experience were kept from doing so
against the bears as they were all in houses. In each of these
instances the trapping of NPCs actually had ultimate dire
consequences.
If you do come across a house that you feel might possibly have
wrongly trapped NPCs and monsters, please contact a GM. Since we get
the location that you called from in our call queue, we can simply go
to that location as soon as possible and take care of any
inappropriately trapped monsters/NPCs.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>Now.. Onto my question. What exactly are the proposed changes
>to the provoke, I missed those. I have 180 points invested into music
>and provoke.
They are making Provoke line of sight. If you can't see the monster
you can't provoke it. But the monsters can still target you.
Sean
paladin? That doesn't make sense.
Mira de Vorsha wrote in message <3721c16...@news.earthlink.net>...
Michael Wiktowy
they will only delete animals/NPCs/monsters with "zero" loyalty. Maybe the animals
go untame even if they still have a little bit of loyalty left to the owner. This
could also factor into the unruly behaviour of tamed animals when they are close
to going wild. Are previously tamed animals easier to tame? I don't have the
taming experience to say but that also would indicate that thise "loyalty counter"
they seem to refer to may not decay to zero for quite some time after the animal
goes wild. That may explain why the GM gave you a hard time. <jail> for asking for
trapped animal deletion! *sheesh* tell him to get off his high horse! (like I know
you are quite capable of doing after lurking this ng for some time ;])
if you had a bard you could have "deleted" them yourself :] ... well ... all but
one actually.
icelady wrote:
> Some of the GM's must not have been given the word then.
> I called a GM to delete 15 sheep in a house last week. He told
> me that they were pets and that was an acceptable number.
> They were <all> gray and named a, aa, b, bb, etc.
>
> I also called a GM to delete 6 Griz. bear from one house that
> had never had their name changed (still said "a Grizzle Bear),
> again the same GM said they are pets, that is an acceptable number.
> I pointed out that they had never been renamed if they were pets.
> the GM told me I would be <jailed> if I called again.
>
> That is the second time I have had a GM tell me he would jail me
> if I bothered him with <pet> deletes again.
>
> They <will> delete monsters in houses with no questions ask, but
> animals is another story.
> --
> IceLady
> --
> Post in haste, repent at your leisure.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>Wrong. Raph said the <evil> patch had been put on hold for further
>study and Necromancy was on hold as well. No promised release
>date for either of them.
Well I normally read COB, but on there it was said that Good/Evil was
shelved indefinatly and may be turned into an extension of Chaos/Order
PvP extension and Necromancy/Alchemy was on hold.
>The other things are on their way. Read Raph"s posts in Deja News
>if you missed them.
They have promised numerous things before, but haven't delivered. Why
should I believe them now?
Mira de Vorsha
will see [Tame] on the name when they are gray.
however if they don't have that then they should be deleted.
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>If a GM was deleting the animals, why would they leave 1 sheep and a
>paladin? That doesn't make sense.
>
They check the loyalty and wages of the NPC's. If they are >0 then
they leave them. (after all your looking after them in that case).
Bob Roland
> >Talking about eving/blading mages, right? ;)
>
> There's no comparison. The day a bard starts breaking strings on his
> lute, and mages can kill fifteen or twenty Ophidians in three or four
> minutes, get back to us.
I would like to see the bard be a a character that croses the
combat/trade dichotomy. Bard skills should be usefull for raising money
(such as performing concerts) and a role in combat. The only a bard
could make money as an entertainer though would be for progamable music.
Great Bob
Niaca Lucinda
Kofu
OrionCA heeft geschreven in bericht <372442f...@news.earthlink.net>...
>On Sat, 24 Apr 1999 14:30:06 -0300, "Sean" <suny...@geocities.com>
>wrote:
>
>>If a GM was deleting the animals, why would they leave 1 sheep and a
>>paladin? That doesn't make sense.
>>
>
>...
>...
>...
>...
>...
>I can't do it. I CAN'T DO IT!!! I WANNA GO THAT LOW BUT I CAN'T MAKE
>MYSELF DO IT!!!
>--
>Think about the tiny, furry rodents scurrying around the
>Jurassic landscape being eaten by predators many times
>their size. To them, the asteroid wasn't a disaster,
>it was a Godsend.
>
Mira de Vorsha
wrote:
>I would like to see the bard be a a character that croses the
>combat/trade dichotomy. Bard skills should be usefull for raising money
>(such as performing concerts) and a role in combat. The only a bard
>could make money as an entertainer though would be for progamable music.
I could see it now with the programable music. Live in concert, one
time only in Moonglow. GoNaKiKyOaSs doodz tecno remix of "Slap my
bitch up - by Prodigy". :)
John Wagner
: On Sun, 25 Apr 1999 12:58:44 -0600, Bob Roland <b...@interfold.com>
:
Hilarious- bards and combat? Your average master bard has about
50 strength. Your average MAGE has about 90-100 strength. Now tell me -
who is more suited for combat- the bard or the mage?
John Wagner
Moonbat, ii, Catskills
Bob Roland
Mira de Vorsha wrote:
> I could see it now with the programable music. Live in concert, one
> time only in Moonglow. GoNaKiKyOaSs doodz tecno remix of "Slap my
> bitch up - by Prodigy". :)
But it has a beat the kids can dance to!
Actually I think that's what would make it so great. We would see "Dewd
Fests" and "classical" concerts (I guess a classical composition in the
UO world would be the annoying Bards song, but that's beside the
point). I can see people becoming reknown as a virtuoso who puts on a
great concert.
I would actually make a Johnny Cash-like character myself. True black
and songs like "A PK named De3Wd" and "GM prison blues" (sung to the
tunes of "A boy named sue" and "Fulsome prison blues" respectivly.)
Hell, I even have lyrics for those that I posted. He would sing the
songs of the outlaw, the PK, the exploiter. It would be great.
Oh well.....
Great Bob
Xigam
wrote:
GOOD!, you stay away from my babys!
Mira de Vorsha
On Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:30:08 -0600, Bob Roland <rolan...@tci.com>
wrote:
Bob Roland
>
> Somebody give this visionary a job in OSI :)
With *my* programing skills?
Aw, what the hell. I'll challange DD to a steel cage death match any
day.
Actually, you all would hate me. I'ld have meanigfull quests, balanced
combat, I'd re-do the skill system and probally do a housing wipe. You
would hunt me down and beat me like a dog afterwards. I would lose half
the player base in the first week or two. (I would give a players a fair
chance to stop the housing wipe through the quest though)
Great Bob
Richard Cortese
>
> On Fri, 23 Apr 1999 19:39:08 GMT, rko...@origin.ea.com (Raph Koster)
> wrote:
>
> >There's also the simple fact that you can kill massive quantities of
> >high loot, high power creatures with zero risk using this skill.
>
A good provoked dragon will kill ten drakes almost as fast as they
spawn.
One night, I took two tamed dragons into the lich room on Covetous 3. I
swear they were killing the liches so fast, I couldn't loot them as fast
as they were being killed. I lost loot just because the bodies would
disappear from the ground before I could get around to them.
I have been in that room with 6 other high level mages with summoned
elementals before the 'dispel' patch, and the dragons were killing the
liches much faster then the combination of 2-3 elementals with ebolts
from the mages.
But it was a real tough climb from about 60 taming to 95. You have 35
point you have to make before you can tame something tougher then a
grizzly bear.
The GM mage thing is kind of over rated. Soon as you can cast a blade
spirit, which just about everyone can do in this game, EV is just
showing off.
Grant Farrington
> Hilarious- bards and combat? Your average master bard has about
>50 strength. Your average MAGE has about 90-100 strength. Now tell me -
>who is more suited for combat- the bard or the mage?
My near GM bard has 100 str 95 dex and 30 int, 90 anatomy. I've driven
off quite a few pk's with him. Nothing like some fool attacking you in
a heavy spawn area and provoking every creature in sight onto him. If
there's a wisp around he'll be doing a whole lot of hurting.
Cheers,
-
Fazza - Jolly Swagman [BA]
Guildmaster of the Blue Heelers,
Sonoma Shard (Ultima Online)
John Wagner
: On 26 Apr 1999 07:42:58 -0400, jwa...@emory.edu (John Wagner) wrote:
:
: > Hilarious- bards and combat? Your average master bard has about
: >50 strength. Your average MAGE has about 90-100 strength. Now tell me -
: >who is more suited for combat- the bard or the mage?
My near GM bard has about 50 strength. So do most of the other
near GM bards I have met. You are the xecpetion. Note I said 'average'
above. Musicianship increases dex and int- so there is a tendency to have
high dex and int as opposed to strength. Not that I mind- I just think
it's hilarious that most mages, who have for some odd reason, no use for
dex (despite the lore saying Mages had high dex- note the Raistlin of
books who was a parlor mage, with high dex), and hence have 90's level
strength, while bards, who of lore were warrior types, generally have 50's
level strength. Seems a bit odd. Of course if stamina affected casting
speed, we would see more low strength, high dex mages out there.
John Wagner
:
: My near GM bard has 100 str 95 dex and 30 int, 90 anatomy. I've driven
:
Richard Cortese
>
> Grant Farrington (fa...@satcom.net.au) wrote:
> : On 26 Apr 1999 07:42:58 -0400, jwa...@emory.edu (John Wagner) wrote:
> :
> : > Hilarious- bards and combat? Your average master bard has about
> : >50 strength. Your average MAGE has about 90-100 strength. Now tell me -
> : >who is more suited for combat- the bard or the mage?
>
> My near GM bard has about 50 strength. So do most of the other
> near GM bards I have met. You are the xecpetion. Note I said 'average'
> above. Musicianship increases dex and int- so there is a tendency to have
> high dex and int as opposed to strength. Not that I mind- I just think
> it's hilarious that most mages, who have for some odd reason, no use for
> dex (despite the lore saying Mages had high dex- note the Raistlin of
> books who was a parlor mage, with high dex), and hence have 90's level
> strength, while bards, who of lore were warrior types, generally have 50's
> level strength. Seems a bit odd. Of course if stamina affected casting
> speed, we would see more low strength, high dex mages out there.
taming and occasionally lumber jack and fletching, both below 50 level.
Seems like it would only be a problem if you are going for GM
musicianship and master or better in all the disciplines related to
barding.
But then my musicianship always lags way behind provocation. Usually by
10 to 20 points. What I have noticed is musicianship only seems to go up
after a successful provoke, and goes up much slower then provoke due to
all the macroing. Provoke does not seem to change much of anything for
me as far as stats go.