OSI, you have made it practicly impossible to join the thieves guild
Edward Eade II
delete the skill and be done with it instead of nickle and dimeing it
to death like they are doing now. As it stands it is practicly
imposible to make a new charector without cheating (And yes I consider
3rd party macro programs to be cheating and so does OSI) First off is
the time requirment to join the guild, they say the charector has to
be 1 week old, but what they don't tell you is that the one week is
time spent online (I.e. the charector has to have been in played in
the game for 168 hours.) now for the average player who can only play
for 2-3 hours a day this could take months just to get the time
requirment. Next we have the skill requierment, now even if you were
to create a new charector with 50 stealing you still have to raise
that skill another 10 points now how can you do this? Well lets see
1.Steal from other charectors? Nope sorry can't do it not in the
thieves guild.
2. Steal from guildmates? Hmm Odds of finding a guild at war who is
willing to accept a newbie charector so he can raise his stealing
skill: Pretty damn slim
3. Steal from Monsters? Oops, can't steal in combat, sorry
4. Steal from chests? Sure you can steal from chests, to bad you're
not going to get any skill from it. (I can say this for a fact having
stolen from more that 100 chests of various types sizes and treasures
with no skill gain)
5. Steal from NPCs? Yeah right, we all know how likely it is that you
can find an NPC with *anything* in his pack.
Which leaves us with only one viable alternative, stealing from NPC
Wandering Healers, and if you look real hard you might be able to find
up to 5 a night that actually have something to steal. At that rate it
could take a year or more before you could actually get the skill
level to join. And if you don't make a new charector specificly to be
a thief? Forget about it, not going to happen.
Edward Eade II pyra...@erols.com
aka Eric MacDobhran
http://www.pyrates.com/fanclub/
RenMerc
Traviticus insanicus
The Wheels of the Temple, Carrier of the Heavenly Brew
Acolyte to the Goddess of Love, Gracious Pragmatist to Bared Minds and Sensitive Sipper of Life's Offerings
Nobility is not a birthright, it is defined by ones actions.
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.1
GCS/IT/O d-(+) s+:+ a- C++$ U- P+ L E? W++ N++ o K- w+$
O--- M V? PS+ PE+ Y+ PGP- t*+ 5++ X R+ tv+ b++ DI++ D-
G e*+ h- r-- y-
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------
Richard Cortese
Edward Eade II wrote:
>
> If Osi is so damn set against people stealing why don't they simply
> delete the skill and be done with it instead of nickle and dimeing it
Here here! I vote for this!
> to death like they are doing now. As it stands it is practicly
> imposible to make a new charector without cheating (And yes I consider
>
Like I *ALWAYS* say, Most of the people that try to play thieves aren't
really bright enough to figure out how to do it.
Let's say one of the newsgroup wags is running for King of Sosaria & he
is putting everyone that wants to be in his guild on the stone in 1
hour.
What do you do? Think quick now, this has a built in time limit. If it
takes you an hour to figure this out, you will miss one shot at it, but
don't worry because I am sure you can figure out another angle if you
miss this one.
If you need any other hints, just ask.
I look for Puck to join the GOD guild too, but he may have to cast
incognito first.
PannDorra
fill a backpack with items set it on the grounds out of guard zone and steal items out of it...Its the
weight of the items that give you the skill increases...Should be able to get to 60 in 3 hours or less...And no
need for 3rd party programs either
PannDorra
Dundee
<rico...@netmagic.net> wrote:
>Like I *ALWAYS* say, Most of the people that try to play thieves aren't
>really bright enough to figure out how to do it.
LOL!
>Let's say one of the newsgroup wags is running for King of Sosaria & he
>is putting everyone that wants to be in his guild on the stone in 1
>hour.
>
>What do you do? Think quick now, this has a built in time limit. If it
>takes you an hour to figure this out, you will miss one shot at it, but
>don't worry because I am sure you can figure out another angle if you
>miss this one.
He missed it.
Dundee * http://dundee.uong.com/
Skara Brae * http:/members.xoom.com/skara/
Lake Superior * http://mars.spaceports.com/~lakesup/
Cirander
Richard Cortese wrote:
> Like I *ALWAYS* say, Most of the people that try to play thieves aren't
> really bright enough to figure out how to do it.
Arrogance is always helpful. Uh huh. Helps to make a point, too, and
certainly boosts one's own ego. Did you actually read his post? He
basically said that building up a thief character has gotten very
difficult, if a player has two to three game hours per day. 2-3 hours a
day is probably enough if you possess the necessary knowledge and know
how the game works, and how to gain the most skill in the shortest
possible amount of time.
But how does one gain this knowledge? Right, by reading newsgroups, web
boards and perhaps even the latest exploits sites. But doing this
consumes time -- how much time per day do you spend gathering the latest
informationen, hints and weaknesses/features of the current game
version? An hour, two? That gives him 1-2 hours to actually play the
game. And how many days does it take to build up a character if you
don't have 200k in the bank to support your new guy? Right. Quite some
time. Perhaps he is European and pays $1-$3 phone charges per hour.
His actual point remains unchanged, even though his presentation was not
as professional as if you had written the message (uh huh): UO has
always been a hard game to play, but it becomes harder with every patch.
To a lesser degree to those who have enough free time (to play the game,
*and* to do the necessary information harvesting), but especially for
those players who have an hour, two or three spare time per day. People
like you, I, and most of the members of this newsgroup, are *not* the
average UO players. But the game appears to be made and constantly
changed based on our play style ... good for us, and our long-term
motivation, but certainly bad for folks who have a job, family and
perhaps even a life.
Ask yourself, what was the actual point of your post? I mean, besides
providing some excitement and entertainment for the intellectual elite
of this newsgroup, and gaining some attention, at the cost of someone
else?
- Cirander
Damocles
>
>
>Ask yourself, what was the actual point of your post? I mean, besides
>providing some excitement and entertainment for the intellectual elite
>of this newsgroup, and gaining some attention, at the cost of someone
>else?
>
>- Cirander
As part of that intellectual elite, I say let the uneducated masses
eat cake! My excitement and entertainment is far more important than
their enlightenment.
--------------
'Jesus died for somebody's sins, but not mine.'
- Patti Smith, "Gloria"
Cirander
Damocles wrote:
> My excitement and entertainment is far more important than
> their enlightenment.
Isn't that exactly what PKs, red or blue, say? :)
- Cirander
Damocles
Hey, I'm just a newbie tailor, I wouldn't know.
Dundee
>> My excitement and entertainment is far more important than
>> their enlightenment.
>
>Isn't that exactly what PKs, red or blue, say? :)
I've never heard one say that.
-
Dundee - http://dundee.uong.com/
Skara Brae - http://members.xoom.com/skara/
Lake Superior - http://mars.spaceports.com/~lakesup/
Jeff Gentry
: I've never heard one say that.
Mebbie that's what "lol! u SuK fag!! fukn newb" translates to?
LD
Richard Cortese
last round. Tried gaining skill on TC using that and both a tamed & wild
pack horse loaded with junk, neither way worked.
PvP theft from members in your own guild still works great though last
time I looked.
I should spend some more time on TC & see what is up, haven't been there
in a week or two.
But you never know. I mean it could be a bug with skill advancement or
the new way the skill will work.
Sometimes I get the impression there are "Let's see what happens if we
let a monkey reprogram skill XXXX" going on. Whatever happens, they
either say nothing or say that was what they planned all along.
Richard Cortese
Cirander wrote:
>
> Richard Cortese wrote:
>
> > Like I *ALWAYS* say, Most of the people that try to play thieves aren't
> > really bright enough to figure out how to do it.
>
> Arrogance is always helpful. Uh huh. Helps to make a point, too, and
> certainly boosts one's own ego. Did you actually read his post? He
> basically said that building up a thief character has gotten very
You are new to the newsgroup. Let me explain one of my duties in the
newsgroup.
Every time there is a thief patch, people 'role playing thieves' that
have never posted to the newsgroup before come into the newsgroup & post
about "OSI is crippling the thief chr!".
It is my job to start a new thief character every time there is a thief
patch or a wipe on Test Center. Understand that I created the position,
no one asked me to do it, I just volunteered since it seems like no one
minds. I would like to believe maybe one or two people even find it
interesting.
My thief on TC should be getting a keep this week. I know I publicly
announced I would never own another tower, but gawd I got to do
something with all those piles of 60,000 gold in my bank box. I am
running into that 125 item limit. Technically, a keep isn't a tower
anyway, so cut me some slack.
Now had you been reading this newsgroup while I was posting updates from
the TC, you would have seen several dozen posts about how great the new
thieving skills are, how much money can be made, how it is absolutely
pointless to use the skill against another player unless it is part of
guild warfare or you just plain want to be an annoying jerk.
Arrogance? Sure, I kind of like that! But give me my due, I have more
practical experience with the thieving patch then 99% of the people in
the game since I previewed it.
> difficult, if a player has two to three game hours per day. 2-3 hours a
> day is probably enough if you possess the necessary knowledge and know
> how the game works, and how to gain the most skill in the shortest
> possible amount of time.
No, we disagree here completely. What the original poster was talking
about and what you are advocating is completely with out merit in a
skill based system.
You might as well be saying, "Why can't my newbie mage trade energy
vortexes with someone that has been playing the game for a year?"
A thief right out of the box can from everything except other players.
Prior to that, they could steal from everything & everyone.
After a few days of thieving, they can join the thieves guild and steal
your socks.
No other character class in the game has that kind of zero to the best
'stuff' in the game curve.
>
> But how does one gain this knowledge? Right, by reading newsgroups, web
> boards and perhaps even the latest exploits sites. But doing this
> consumes time -- how much time per day do you spend gathering the latest
> informationen, hints and weaknesses/features of the current game
> version? An hour, two? That gives him 1-2 hours to actually play the
> game. And how many days does it take to build up a character if you
> don't have 200k in the bank to support your new guy? Right. Quite some
> time. Perhaps he is European and pays $1-$3 phone charges per hour.
OK, I know you haven't read my posts on the topic, but my Hokuto thief
mage is now up to 72.5 magery, has a house, and still has maybe 15k left
over in the bank after about 4 days of play.
Still haven't stolen from another player. All of this was under the new
patch level.
>
> His actual point remains unchanged, even though his presentation was not
> as professional as if you had written the message (uh huh): UO has
> always been a hard game to play, but it becomes harder with every patch.
This game is easy if you know how to do it. His presentation was an
uninformed opinion that cried out to be corrected. He obviously had not
even tried to find out how thieving works now, nor did he solicit how to
thieve.
Should be harder to be a thief, period. What it shouldn't be harder to
do is be an alchemist: They have a real complaint.
Thieving has been juiced! It has never been better! It isn't harder to
be a thief, it has never been easier.
<snip>
> Ask yourself, what was the actual point of your post? I mean, besides
> providing some excitement and entertainment for the intellectual elite
> of this newsgroup, and gaining some attention, at the cost of someone
> else?
>
> - Cirander
OK, you got me there. I thought that was the whole purpose of a
newsgroup.
Hmmmm, maybe I should give Man's Search for Meaning another read. How
about the poster tried to make a point which was in error, and my point
was pointing out the error in his post?
You also notice I gave him several suggestions for how he could get
around the new system.
Therefore, his post was completely devoid of useful content and
consisted of an uniformed opinion that was not substantiated by fact or
experience.
My post, while admitted reflecting a sense of humor nurtured by hours of
watching "The 3 Stooges" contained some useful hints for getting around
the new system.
So to quote you "Did you actually read his post?", did you actually read
mine?
I actually give people thieving lessons. Had he asked, "How does a thief
make it under the new patch?" I would have been happy to oblige.
Cirander
Thanks for explaining your role here in this newsgroup, I didn't know
about your history as "stealing skill tester". Look, I, too, find your
messages entertaining -- and they are part of the reason why I enjoy
reading this newsgroup more than the web boards --, but the game isn't
made for just a few of us. People who are not able to express themselves
well or who whine about everything pay their ten bucks a month too, and
without them there wouldn't be a Ultima Online.
Okay, back to topic ...
Richard Cortese wrote:
> OK, I know you haven't read my posts on the topic, but my Hokuto thief
> mage is now up to 72.5 magery, has a house, and still has maybe 15k left
> over in the bank after about 4 days of play.
I have indeed missed the thread you are referring to. Hokuto is not a
good example as it is a new shard. When Drachenfels launched (October, I
believe), my hiding went from 50 to 75 within two hours - while my
character was beating up a dummy and gained 30 strength. In the
following days, my miner become a master miner and my scribe reached
almost GM level. My point is: Skill advancement on new shards is really
fast. I have played on Chesapeake and Catskills before (started in '97),
and it took me ages to get my mage to GM level.
Okay, here's a question for you (I have never seriously played a thief,
simply because I didn't know how to): How did your thief make so much
money? By stealing from NPCs? The NPCs on Drachenfels usually have empty
bags. My test thief is able to open some chests, but stealing armour
parts and various items out of these chests hardly raises my stealing
skill (50.8 right now, I believe). (This character could not make a
living without financal support of my other characters ... the stuff I
get out of the game chests does not cover the expenses for the
lockpicks.)
- Cirander
Richard Cortese
>
<snip>
> Okay, back to topic ...
>
> Richard Cortese wrote:
>
> > mage is now up to 72.5 magery, has a house, and still has maybe 15k left
> > over in the bank after about 4 days of play.
>
> good example as it is a new shard. When Drachenfels launched (October, I
> believe), my hiding went from 50 to 75 within two hours - while my
> character was beating up a dummy and gained 30 strength. In the
> following days, my miner become a master miner and my scribe reached
> almost GM level. My point is: Skill advancement on new shards is really
> fast. I have played on Chesapeake and Catskills before (started in '97),
> and it took me ages to get my mage to GM level.
now. There is a mad race there right now to make as much money as
possible as fast as possible though, just like any new shard.
>
> Okay, here's a question for you (I have never seriously played a thief,
> simply because I didn't know how to): How did your thief make so much
> money? By stealing from NPCs? The NPCs on Drachenfels usually have empty
> bags. My test thief is able to open some chests, but stealing armour
> parts and various items out of these chests hardly raises my stealing
> skill (50.8 right now, I believe). (This character could not make a
> living without financal support of my other characters ... the stuff I
> get out of the game chests does not cover the expenses for the
> lockpicks.)
>
> - Cirander
quite the same thing twice.
One thing has always stayed the same when you have nothing else to do:
Find a deserted NPC building with books on the shelves. Stealing skill
seems to have a rather short delay, often only about 6 seconds. You
never miss stealing books, you never get guard killed if no one yells
guards. You can steal ~10 books a minute, 600 an hour, and they sell for
9 gold each. In other words, you can make 5,400 gold an hour doing this.
In practice, it does not work out that high because you spend so much
time trying to sell the damn things. I mean even if you were making 600
bows or fancy shirts an hour, you would have trouble selling them so at
worst you are in the same boat as a bowyer with out all the walking
around.
Books respawn, just like ore or trees. You never run out, you can steal
them much faster then you can sell them.
But my current hot thief chr is a little different from what the classic
method. I start off with 35 int, 11 dex, and 14 str. 50 magery, 49
meditation, 1 lumber jacking since I like the newbie hatchet.
First thing I do is get an escort, any escort. One of the great things
about the game is "I will take thee" works just as well for a 5 minute
old chr as it does for someone who is a GM mage that has been playing
since beta.
I have no trouble walking to any city that has a moongate in 12 minutes
or less, I have timed it. Average is MUCH better, I would guess about
6-8 minutes.
Hokuto where everyone & his brother is escorting right now for magery &
money, I made 2,100 gold the first hour escorting.
There is still a bug that has been around since escorts were first
started, they don't cross server lines to go to Minoc or Cove, so I let
other people that can gate have all of these and the ones that need to
go to one of the isles that doesn't have a moongate. No sense in being a
pig.
Power gaming all the way, I practice snooping while I am doing the
escorts. Just holding last object macro key down while I am walking.
With the initial cash, I buy stealing, 2 recall scrolls, 1 fire field
scroll, 2 mark scrolls, and at least 2 gate scrolls but will buy a dozen
at this time if the price is right & they are available. I get at least
one copy of the spells in my spell book.
I also buy some recall reagents.
The runes I buy are Serpent's Hold, Nujelm, and Ocllo. I buy one
unmarked rune & mark it right at the Jehlom moongate.
From there on, my thief is superior to a GM mage with a GM in meditation
for making money off escorts. Vastly superior! Not even close!
From here it becomes kind of mechanical, all about procedure. I only use
the gate scrolls to get escorts to or from the isles & towns with server
boundary problems, when traveling there to pick up escorts or return
empty handed, I use recall.
If by any chance the escorts are going to Jehlom, I walk them out of the
guard area of whatever gate required location they are in & rob them
blind before I take them back to moongate areas. That is, let's say I
pick up a Jehlom & Moonglow on Ocllo. I walk them out of the guard area
& rob them blind before I gate back to the Jehlom moongate.
I get paid by the Jehlom traveler as soon as we get to Jehlom, take 3
steps into the moongate while hitting both the last object key for
snooping and use skill meditation.
If I come out in Moonglow, fine, I just keep walking. It cost nothing to
walk an escort to town and takes about as long as it does for mana to
return for that GM mage. In other words, you can just about make as much
money as fast as a GM mage doing escorts if you know how to use the
moongates.
The bonus is thieving! I mean an insane bonus! Seekers of Adventure &
Nobles on average carry 500 gold. They also carry magic items and gems.
The best money in the game is when you show up at the Jehlom moongate,
and there are two nobles going to some place easy like Magincia and a
Seeker of Adventure there. You say, "I will take thee" 3 times, jump in
the moongate until you hit Magincia. Take a route off the beaten path
and rob them blind, 1,500 gp. Walk the two nobles to town to collect
another 600, then take the Seeker out of town & kill him with fire
fields. You net 2,100 gp for 6 minutes work and end up with a snazzy
outfit to boot.
Thieving is crippled??? Hahahah! Oh YEAH! I am thinking the same thing
as I burn reagents casting reveal with my Hokuto thief mage while they
are sitting in their new house. Think I will maybe go to Wind today.
The best or worst part of this is noto is already up to neutral after 3
days of thieving & killing NPCs. All it took was 20 minutes of killing
things like corpsers and snakes.
Now the other variation on this is if I want to build a head knocker
thief. You see, NPCs spawn, just like monsters. You have to kill the
NPCs in order for new ones to spawn. But guess what? Nothing is quite
like a NPC opponent for sparing. Your skills go up while you are
whacking them. After you kill them, you sell their shoes & everything
else they have. A new one spawns, you rob them then kill them. Just
don't carry anything you would mind losing, scale up from beggars to
mages in small steps. You end up with great weapon skills, tons of loot,
and magic resistance! Cost you nothing! There is the price of doing
business, that is every once in a while someone will attack you while
you are gray, but you only lose your current stash of loot, kind of like
a miner losing his ore, irritating but you end up with what you started
with. Every once in a while you even win one of these fights which means
more loot.
This is one of the reasons "The Farm", that Northern isle in the Jehlom
chain, is so popular. Non guard zone, NPCs to rob & kill. You don't even
need recall to get there.
Cirander
Excellent advice! Thank you! :)
- Cirander
Ingot Head
Dundee wrote in message ...
>On 2 Mar 1999 11:50:06 -0600, Cirander <mi...@netcene.com> wrote:
>
>>> My excitement and entertainment is far more important than
>>> their enlightenment.
>>
>>Isn't that exactly what PKs, red or blue, say? :)
>
That's because you never stick around after "Fuk u BiaTch Corp Por"
JubJub McRae
wrote:
The FuK U BiAtCH usually comes after the corp pors..
Ingot Head
JubJub McRae wrote in message
[snip]
>The FuK U BiAtCH usually comes after the corp pors..
k thx
JubJub McRae
wrote:
>
np dewd. U wanna go 2 deciet?
CRF
PannDorra wrote in message <36DAFE12...@mediaone.net>...