Apology requested
Tony Marsland
Mr Rolf Tueschen
Dear Sir:
According to my information, on the 5 February 1997 (abstracted below) using
the account of one Andrea Tueschen, you posted a 71-line message to the
rec.games.chess.computer newsgroup. That message asserted that at some
time in the past I had been in daily telephone contact with Frederic Friedel.
You have repeatedly presented this information as fact and in so doing
have been misinforming the readers of that news group.
Further you have repeatedly used this "fact" in an attempt to malign
both me and the International Computer Chess Association.
Since there is no basis for your statement, indeed I
exchange messages with Frederic Friedel so infrequently that I cannot
even recall a single telephone conversation with him, a complete and humble
retraction on your part is necessary. For your information, in the 6
months prior to 1 October 1996 the total sum of my contact with Mr.
Friedel was precisely 3 email messages, one in July and two in May 1996,
and to my recollection no phone conversations.
In light of this information, I ask that you publish an immediate retraction
and apologize to the readers of r.g.c.c. for misinforming them. Further
I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
you may have done to my personal and professional reputation. Further
you should acknowledge that it is none of your business with whom I correspond.
The letter should be signed personally by you and mailed to:
Professor T.A. Marsland
Computing Science Department
University of Alberta
Edmonton, AB
Canada T6G 2H1
Yours sincerely
Tony Marsland
ICCA President
CC: rec.games.chess.computer
CC: Andrea Tueschen (email originator)
-------extract from original posting-------------
>
> From: And...@t-online.de (Andrea Tueschen)
> Newsgroups: rec.games.chess.computer
> Subject: Re: Does ICCA publish dissenting views ?
> Date: 5 Feb 1997 10:09:10 GMT
> Organization: Telekom Online Internet Gateway
>
> <.........lines omitted........>
>
> Why T. Marsland did telephone Friedel daily for each mail concerning Jakarta?
>
> <.........lines omitted........>
> Rolf Tueschen
>
> ----*Man is unable not to know what he knows.* Leibowitz----
>
mclane
to...@cs.ualberta.ca (Tony Marsland) wrote:
>Mr Rolf Tueschen
>In light of this information, I ask that you publish an immediate retraction
>and apologize to the readers of r.g.c.c. for misinforming them.
>Further
>I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
>no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
>you may have done to my personal and professional reputation.
Further you insist that he should apologize to you for any damage he
may have done to your personal and professional reputation ?!
You are kidding !
Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
Is frederic that LOW that one has to apologize when you speak with him
?????
Unbelievable ! Where are you living ? :-)
> Further
>you should acknowledge that it is none of your business with whom I correspond.
Hahaha !
Really not ?! Good that you explain this to us !!! :-)
>The letter should be signed personally by you and mailed to:
Brilliant ! Do you need any money or does he only has to send a letter
?!
I mean, if you are wishing anymore - let us know !!!
>Professor T.A. Marsland
>Computing Science Department
>University of Alberta
>Edmonton, AB
>Canada T6G 2H1
>Yours sincerely
I think this sincerely is the best lie I have ever read in this
newsgroups.
Yours sincerey !!! :-)
>Tony Marsland
>ICCA President
>CC: rec.games.chess.computer
>CC: Andrea Tueschen (email originator)
>-------extract from original posting-------------
>>
>> From: And...@t-online.de (Andrea Tueschen)
>> Newsgroups: rec.games.chess.computer
>> Subject: Re: Does ICCA publish dissenting views ?
>> Date: 5 Feb 1997 10:09:10 GMT
>> Organization: Telekom Online Internet Gateway
>>
>> <.........lines omitted........>
>>
>> Why T. Marsland did telephone Friedel daily for each mail concerning Jakarta?
>>
>> <.........lines omitted........>
>> Rolf Tueschen
>>
>> ----*Man is unable not to know what he knows.* Leibowitz----
>>
In my opinion somebody has to apologize when somebody has done
something wrong.
I can't see anything wrong in the fact that Rolf posted ( I think he
mixed you and David Levy up) that he asked why T.Marsland has
telephoned Friedel daily.
This statement is not damaging any reputation. I wonder that you claim
this.
Can you explain this ?!
If I were Rolf I would laugh about this request.
I could understand if you would explain to us (or even Rolf) that you
were hurt by some sentences. If somebody was hurted by another, I
think the other side has to consider if he should apologize.
What did hurt you ?!
If you were not hurted, I guess you request is as naive as Jonathan
Schaeffers strange request.
Sorry.
I don't understand your WAY of reacting.
Robert Hyatt
mclane (mcl...@prima.ruhr.de) wrote:
: to...@cs.ualberta.ca (Tony Marsland) wrote:
: >Mr Rolf Tueschen
: >In light of this information, I ask that you publish an immediate retraction
: >and apologize to the readers of r.g.c.c. for misinforming them.
: >Further
: >I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
: >no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
: >you may have done to my personal and professional reputation.
: Further you insist that he should apologize to you for any damage he
: may have done to your personal and professional reputation ?!
: You are kidding !
: Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
: telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
: Is frederic that LOW that one has to apologize when you speak with him
: ?????
I believe that when someone makes a false statement, he owes it to the target
of that statement to retract it publicly, since it was made publicly. Nothing
more, nothing else. We now know Tony didn't talk to Friedel, so it would seem
that the person claiming this as fact should simply retract it, simply,
politely, with a trailing "I'm sorry for posting misinformation."
: Unbelievable ! Where are you living ? :-)
: > Further
: >you should acknowledge that it is none of your business with whom I correspond.
: Hahaha !
: Really not ?! Good that you explain this to us !!! :-)
Seems to be a point that many overlook somehow...
: >The letter should be signed personally by you and mailed to:
: Brilliant ! Do you need any money or does he only has to send a letter
: ?!
: I mean, if you are wishing anymore - let us know !!!
If you didn't post the claim, wouldn't it be appropriate for you to keep your
.02 cents worth off the thread? Seems to be between Tony and "X", yet you like
to insert yourself in the middle...
: >Professor T.A. Marsland
: >Computing Science Department
: >University of Alberta
: >Edmonton, AB
: >Canada T6G 2H1
: >Yours sincerely
: I think this sincerely is the best lie I have ever read in this
: newsgroups.
Nah... the claim about Friedel was the best lie. this is an attempt at
clarifying things...
: Yours sincerey !!! :-)
Rolf Tueschen
mcl...@prima.ruhr.de (mclane) wrote:
>to...@cs.ualberta.ca (Tony Marsland) wrote:
>>Further
>>I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
>>no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
>>you may have done to my personal and professional reputation.
>Further you insist that he should apologize to you for any damage he
>may have done to your personal and professional reputation ?!
>You are kidding !
>Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
>telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
>Is frederic that LOW that one has to apologize when you speak with him
>?????
>Unbelievable ! Where are you living ? :-)
>>The letter should be signed personally by you and mailed to:
>Brilliant ! Do you need any money or does he only has to send a letter
>?!
>I mean, if you are wishing anymore - let us know !!!
>>Professor T.A. Marsland
>>Computing Science Department
>>University of Alberta
>>Edmonton, AB
>>Canada T6G 2H1
>>Yours sincerely
>I think this sincerely is the best lie I have ever read in this
>newsgroups.
>Yours sincerey !!! :-)
>>Tony Marsland
>>ICCA President
>In my opinion somebody has to apologize when somebody has done
>something wrong.
>I can't see anything wrong in the fact that Rolf posted ( I think he
>mixed you and David Levy up) that he asked why T.Marsland has
>telephoned Friedel daily.
>This statement is not damaging any reputation. I wonder that you claim
>this.
>Can you explain this ?!
>If I were Rolf I would laugh about this request.
>I could understand if you would explain to us (or even Rolf) that you
>were hurt by some sentences. If somebody was hurted by another, I
>think the other side has to consider if he should apologize.
>What did hurt you ?!
>If you were not hurted, I guess you request is as naive as Jonathan
>Schaeffers strange request.
>Sorry.
>I don't understand your WAY of reacting.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes and no, Thorsten.
We are only normal human beings. But since I live right near the floor of the
building next to Tony and Jonathan (you remember the two egg heads) I knew
after your relevation that I had to apologize for that mistake.
You know these professors of mindgames are so much higher /superiour that any
single confusion about their names should be regarded as a real big mistake.
And therefore I certainly will apologize. It's not a duty/burden it's a real
pleasure.
But you are right.
This *sincerely* and other unrealistic wishes of Tony are so strange, so nasty,
so absurd that now finally I must think about the security living nearby this
dangerous area these two experts do live in. Do you think thousands of miles
will be sufficient?
I'm sure that Tony will visit us many more times -- now the ice had been
broken. Now I can't see any more inhibitions for him. Now he could step out of
the shadow of Bob. Now it seems as if Tony could really *win* something. :)
(BTW Thorsten, das hat jetzt nichts mit Tony zu tun, hast du schon das Buch von
Silbermann, Titel so was wie die Kunst der Arschkriecherei gelesen? Muss ich
unbedingt haben. Nach den Vorberichten zu urteilen, ein Meisterwerk gelungener
Alltagsforschung. Immer wieder kann man auch hier Sachen lesen, die
ausschliesslich zu dem Zweck verfasst worden sind, sich in diese Zonen etwas
weiter vorarbeiten zu koennen. Wenn ich dann sehe, wie dieser Alphons mit um
die 90 vor Humor geradezu ueberquillt, wird mir ganz uebel bei manchen
Buerointrigen in dieser Gruppe. Hier machen sich die Profs ja, ohne rot (!) zu
werden, gnadenlos zum Affen. Oder ist d a s dieser *britische* Humor. Wohl
kaum. Da ziehe ich den Waideren von CrisTal vor. Wie koennen die ihren Mist nur
so bierernst vorzutragen wagen. Ma seen wat nu kuett. Besonders BH ist nu inne
Klemme, hatter doch all dat Telefoniere von Tony (in der Annahme et war dr
Tony) asl ganz normaaal hingestellt ... )
To prepare this outing I decided to post the following add to each of my posts
as long Tony suffered any pain before he finally will jump as a free user into
our rgcc and usenet.
Rolf Tueschen
----*Man is unable not to know what he knows.* Leibowitz----
P:S. For those who didn't know yet: In my post from last autumn I confounded
Mr. Tony Marsland with Mr. David Levy. The president of ICCA Mr. Tony Marsland
didn't do these continuous talks with Mr. Friedel concerning Jakarta and Plan
B.
I regret this confusion.
For me the two had become almost twin brothers after reading the editorial
about both their merits for computer chess in the past decades.
My sincerest apology for that mistake. Even for a newbie it was a very big
mistake. No doubt about it.
Hope Mr. Marsland now (after clarification of the big confusion) could finally
enter debate over ICCA, Jakarta and so on here in that newsgroup too.
mclane
hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
>mclane (mcl...@prima.ruhr.de) wrote:
>: to...@cs.ualberta.ca (Tony Marsland) wrote:
>: >Mr Rolf Tueschen
>: >In light of this information, I ask that you publish an immediate retraction
>: >and apologize to the readers of r.g.c.c. for misinforming them.
>: >Further
>: >I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
>: >no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
>: >you may have done to my personal and professional reputation.
>: Further you insist that he should apologize to you for any damage he
>: may have done to your personal and professional reputation ?!
>: You are kidding !
>: Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
>: telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
>: Is frederic that LOW that one has to apologize when you speak with him
>: ?????
>I believe that when someone makes a false statement, he owes it to the target
>of that statement to retract it publicly, since it was made publicly. Nothing
>more, nothing else. We now know Tony didn't talk to Friedel, so it would seem
>that the person claiming this as fact should simply retract it, simply,
>politely, with a trailing "I'm sorry for posting misinformation."
I understand that if somebody makes a mistake he excuses afterwards.
No problem with that. Although it depends of the cultural level or
also cultural common sense.
BUT: Why is a misinformation damagin Tony's reputation ??
I mean: it would damage his reputation if HE = Tony had done something
wrong (e.g. decided that the championship should take place in
Jakarta). But if somebody else made the mistake ?!
>: Unbelievable ! Where are you living ? :-)
>: > Further
>: >you should acknowledge that it is none of your business with whom I correspond.
>: Hahaha !
>: Really not ?! Good that you explain this to us !!! :-)
>Seems to be a point that many overlook somehow...
>: >The letter should be signed personally by you and mailed to:
>: Brilliant ! Do you need any money or does he only has to send a letter
>: ?!
>: I mean, if you are wishing anymore - let us know !!!
>If you didn't post the claim, wouldn't it be appropriate for you to keep your
>.02 cents worth off the thread? Seems to be between Tony and "X", yet you like
>to insert yourself in the middle...
Hahaha ! It is public !!! I can put myself into any thread I like.
This is not the ICCA here. Here we have different, more pluralistic
rules , I guess.
I don't care if I am between the two, it's better to be between 2 big
persons like them, other people prefer to be in somebody's asshole, I
prefer commenting a thread - in between.
>: >Professor T.A. Marsland
>: >Computing Science Department
>: >University of Alberta
>: >Edmonton, AB
>: >Canada T6G 2H1
>: >Yours sincerely
>: I think this sincerely is the best lie I have ever read in this
>: newsgroups.
>Nah... the claim about Friedel was the best lie. this is an attempt at
>clarifying things...
Sincerely is the kind of double-moral I would kick to the moon, if I
could. Chris' Fuck off is much more serious and also more the truth.
Robert Hyatt
mclane (mcl...@prima.ruhr.de) wrote:
: hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
: >: >Mr Rolf Tueschen
: >: You are kidding !
Easy to explain. I post here that you were arrested for raping a 7 year
old girl 4 years ago. Later I discover that it wasn't you, but someone
with the same last name, similar first name. Shouldn't I (a) appologize
to you personally for making such a claim and (b) publicly retract it in
the newsgroup to clear things up? Seems like the way I'd teach my kids
to handle making an incorrect statement...
Rolf Tueschen
hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
>mclane (mcl...@prima.ruhr.de) wrote:
[to Marsland]
>: >: You are kidding !
>: >: Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
>: >: telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
>: >: Is frederic that LOW that one has to apologize when you speak with him
>: >: ?????
>: >I believe that when someone makes a false statement, he owes it to the target
>: >of that statement to retract it publicly, since it was made publicly. Nothing
>: >more, nothing else. We now know Tony didn't talk to Friedel, so it would seem
>: >that the person claiming this as fact should simply retract it, simply,
>: >politely, with a trailing "I'm sorry for posting misinformation."
[to BH]
>: I understand that if somebody makes a mistake he excuses afterwards.
>: No problem with that. Although it depends of the cultural level or
>: also cultural common sense.
>: BUT: Why is a misinformation damagin Tony's reputation ??
>: I mean: it would damage his reputation if HE = Tony had done something
>: wrong (e.g. decided that the championship should take place in
>: Jakarta). But if somebody else made the mistake ?!
>Easy to explain. I post here that you were arrested for raping a 7 year
>old girl 4 years ago. Later I discover that it wasn't you, but someone
>with the same last name, similar first name. Shouldn't I (a) appologize
>to you personally for making such a claim and (b) publicly retract it in
>the newsgroup to clear things up? Seems like the way I'd teach my kids
>to handle making an incorrect statement...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob, it was mentioned elsewhere that well known experts' names could be very
easily damaged. Although it's not that easy to see but you are cheating on your
readers.
I already told you this. Now again you do this.
Proof:
In the first quotes above it was shown that there was no bad behaviour that was
reported but that there was a simple name confusion. (Tony/David).
For this mistake I was responsible. I made clear this mistake. And apologized.
Now mclane did a minor fault in the quoting above. He wrongly wrote that *only
if HE = Tony had done s.th. wrong ...*
It must better read: (IMHO) *if he = David had done s.th. wrong*.
It's interesting that you took this anyway to make your point. That's very
wrong.
And you made a fool of yourself:
1. You always defended *Tony* for doing what I erroneously reported he did ...
So you wouldn't condemn David now?
2. Now suddenly you compare that what *Tony* did (what I reported erroneously
he did) with a rape someone did do seven years ago to a four year old girl.
Just to make clear the big importance of apologies. (??)
Ahem ... <big sigh>
For your kids and your own information let me tell you:
Yes I made a mistake with Tony/David. And if I did report s.th. like rape or
the like I surely had to face other consequences than simply apologizing about
a mere name confusion. But it was no rape, it was s.th. Bob Hyatt always
defended as very normal and uninteresting! :)
With or without this mistake *your* Tony is the president of ICAA.
*Your* Tony decided for Jakarta. With or without dicussing with F. Friedel.
*Your* Tony is responsible for deciding for a country where hundreds of
thousands of people were killed in the past years.
*Your* Tony came very close to those who might be responsible for that mass
murder too.
*Your* Tony never showed up here in rgcc to discuss with the critics here in
this group last autumn.
But *your* Tony woke up when I already made my apologies about this minor
important mistake. He had the time to write emails and posts. To brabble about
possible damage his name might have taken by this confusion ... ROTFL.
But the decision for Jakarta still is no subject for *your* Tony.
You take *rape of a 4 years old girl* to make clear the big mistake I did. Yes
I did confuse David/Tony.
But you did never condemn mass murder as far as I could follow Jakarta threads
as newbie last year. You even took part in that Jakarta event.
And I like to declare my personal opinion: even for this Jakarta event I see
some arguments that speak for taking part AFTER ICCA made their decision!!
But don't get too far now.
Don't cheat your readers as if names were more important than people's lives.
Don't play dirty, *gazoline-Bob* Hyatt.
Bob come back to computer chess. Otherwise we end again in gazoline and death
row discussions. And you already made not so good an impression in those
fields. Look a hundred thousand of killed didn't bother you more than that
Tony, the Tony of ICCA was confused with David. Although these two are the most
prominent persons in the history of computer chess tournaments. And confusing
the two is more a thing for laughing than flaming. For me as new the two w e re
- it may be pitied - so close together that I unintentionally confounded them.
You got it?
And for you as scientist (?):
If you were so lazy to take your own look at the sources you may not beat the
guy on whose info report you so damn sure relied on. Why didn't you contact
Tony some weeks earlier if it was such a big (rape) thing for you.
NO, you're lying: it was NOT a big thing for you. You always claimed it as a
private and uninteresting thang. Now suddenly you changed the case to *rape*.
Dealing with comparisons -- I agree. Only for comparisison. But again.
IN COMPAIRISON WITH THE FACT OF THE KILLED IN INDONESIA YOU SHOULD SHUT UP AND
BE VERY VERY MUCH ASHAMED ABOUT YOUR FIGHT FOR A TONY WHOSE NAME WAS CONFOUNDED
WITH THE NAME OF DAVID. WHAT A SHAME.
Bob, you spoilt your good name here in rgcc.
Take back what you should take back.
And tell your friend some truths.
Rolf Tueschen
----*Man is unable not to know what he knows.* Leibowitz----
P.S. For those who didn't know yet: In my post from last autumn I confounded
Mr. Tony Marsland with Mr. David Levy. The president of ICCA Mr. Tony Marsland
didn't do these continuous talks with Mr. Friedel concerning Jakarta and Plan
B.
I regret this confusion.
For me the two had become almost twin brothers after reading the editorial
about both their merits for computer chess in the past decades.
My sincerest apology for that mistake. Even for a newbie it was a very big
mistake. No doubt about it.
Hope Mr. Marsland now (after clarification of the big confusion) could finally
enter debate over ICCA, Jakarta and so on here in that newsgroup too.
-----------------------------
Robert Hyatt
Rolf Tueschen (TUESCHEN.MEDIZ...@t-online.de) wrote:
: hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
: >mclane (mcl...@prima.ruhr.de) wrote:
: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
: Proof:
nope, because as I've said many times, private conversations are just that...
: 2. Now suddenly you compare that what *Tony* did (what I reported erroneously
mclane
hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
>: >Easy to explain. I post here that you were arrested for raping a 7 year
>: >old girl 4 years ago. Later I discover that it wasn't you, but someone
>: >with the same last name, similar first name. Shouldn't I (a) appologize
>: >to you personally for making such a claim and (b) publicly retract it in
>: >the newsgroup to clear things up? Seems like the way I'd teach my kids
>: >to handle making an incorrect statement...
You can post whatever you want, I don't take care.
If Tony is hurted by posts of others, his problem.
You can post whatever you want, when I am death, or still alive.
No problem.
>: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>: Proof:
>: Ahem ... <big sigh>
Yeah!
>: *Your* Tony decided for Jakarta. With or without dicussing with F. Friedel.
Yeah!
>: *Your* Tony is responsible for deciding for a country where hundreds of
>: thousands of people were killed in the past years.
Yeah!
>: *Your* Tony came very close to those who might be responsible for that mass
>: murder too.
????????? What ?
>: *Your* Tony never showed up here in rgcc to discuss with the critics here in
>: this group last autumn.
Yeah!
>: But *your* Tony woke up when I already made my apologies about this minor
>: important mistake. He had the time to write emails and posts. To brabble about
>: possible damage his name might have taken by this confusion ... ROTFL.
Yeah!
>: But the decision for Jakarta still is no subject for *your* Tony.
This is really THE POINT !!!
mclane
TUESCHEN.MEDIZ...@t-online.de (Rolf Tueschen) wrote:
>mcl...@prima.ruhr.de (mclane) wrote:
>>to...@cs.ualberta.ca (Tony Marsland) wrote:
>>>Further
>>>I insist that you write a personal letter to me recognizing that you have
>>>no evidence to support your statement and apologizing to me for any damage
>>>you may have done to my personal and professional reputation.
>>Further you insist that he should apologize to you for any damage he
>>may have done to your personal and professional reputation ?!
>>You are kidding !
>>Why is he damaging your reputation when he writes that you had
>>telephone-calls with frederic friedel ?????
Hello Rolf,
I think Tony Marsland is a friendly and nice person.
I would not have had apologized to this snobistic and formalistic
request.
But this it another point.
Also I think David Levy has done many good things, in the past.
Also I have nothing against what Frederic has done for computerchess
in the past.
I have great respect for anything they have done.
But when they go to the toilette they do the same things , we have
done.
And when they shit, they shit the same shit we do.
So: if they do stupid things I will comment.
I don't want to kill anybody or to attack somebody's reputation.
Over the years I have ever respected programmers work on
computerchess.
I have never taken my testing/report work easy !
Very often in my life, I have seen others throwing programmers work
onto the floor, spitting on it, or the vice-versa way: pushing
something that high (MM4-article Jan Louwmann, Nimzo-article,
Vincent about his program, Frederic in any statement he does,... )
that it damages the product.
Also they write about something very fast, in one or 2 days, a
week-end.
I think this is very shallow.
Programmers work needs much research.
Don't be influenced too much by wrong people.
If you come to Aegon tournament this year and meet Cock de Gorter, you
will really see an expert and a honest and fair guy.
If you have ever seen Bronstein or Seiravan or others, you will
understand why it is that difficult to be quiet when Fred invents the
(computer)chess by his own.
But accepting these things, and not accepting others is a different.
I will never stop commenting on decisions I don't like.
And I will not stop doing computerchess.
I am not interested in what other people say.
Rolf Tueschen
mcl...@prima.ruhr.de (mclane) wrote:
>hy...@crafty.cis.uab.edu (Robert Hyatt) wrote:
>>: And you made a fool of yourself:
>>: 1. You always defended *Tony* for doing what I erroneously reported he did ...
>>: So you wouldn't condemn David now?
>>nope, because as I've said many times, private conversations are just that...
>>: 2. Now suddenly you compare that what *Tony* did (what I reported erroneously
>>: he did) with a rape someone did do seven years ago to a four year old girl.
>>: Just to make clear the big importance of apologies. (??)
>>: Ahem ... <big sigh>
>>: For your kids and your own information let me tell you:
>>: Yes I made a mistake with Tony/David. And if I did report s.th. like rape or
>>: the like I surely had to face other consequences than simply apologizing about
>>: a mere name confusion. But it was no rape, it was s.th. Bob Hyatt always
>>: defended as very normal and uninteresting! :)
>>: With or without this mistake *your* Tony is the president of ICAA.
>Yeah!
>>: *Your* Tony decided for Jakarta. With or without dicussing with F. Friedel.
>Yeah!
>>: *Your* Tony is responsible for deciding for a country where hundreds of
>>: thousands of people were killed in the past years.
>Yeah!
>>: *Your* Tony came very close to those who might be responsible for that mass
>>: murder too.
>????????? What ?
mclane, did I mix up s.th. here. Did he have contact to some minister of the
indonesian government or what??
>>: *Your* Tony never showed up here in rgcc to discuss with the critics here in
>>: this group last autumn.
>Yeah!
Could you confirm this too? Bob made the point to me that it seemed as if *I*
missed some very important posts of Tony in this rgcc. I therefore asked him
for a copy. But Bob didn't react ... !
>>: But *your* Tony woke up when I already made my apologies about this minor
>>: important mistake. He had the time to write emails and posts. To brabble about
>>: possible damage his name might have taken by this confusion ... ROTFL.
>Yeah!
>>: But the decision for Jakarta still is no subject for *your* Tony.
>This is really THE POINT !!!
>>: Rolf Tueschen
>>: ----*Man is unable not to know what he knows.* Leibowitz----
>>: P.S. For those who didn't know yet: In my post from last autumn I confounded
>>: Mr. Tony Marsland with Mr. David Levy. The president of ICCA Mr. Tony Marsland
>>: didn't do these continuous talks with Mr. Friedel concerning Jakarta and Plan
>>: B.
>>: I regret this confusion.
>>: For me the two had become almost twin brothers after reading the editorial
>>: about both their merits for computer chess in the past decades.
>>: My sincerest apology for that mistake. Even for a newbie it was a very big
>>: mistake. No doubt about it.
>>: Hope Mr. Marsland now (after clarification of the big confusion) could finally
>>: enter debate over ICCA, Jakarta and so on here in that newsgroup too.
>>: -----------------------------
Again just for the record. Because Bob now wants to adjust you in a spooky
corner -- you were the only one reading that stuff exactly enough to see my
mistake. And you posted about it. Thanks again.
Keep cool when arrogant experts try to shut your mouth.
*They* didn't *see* it.
mclane
TUESCHEN.MEDIZ...@t-online.de (Rolf Tueschen) wrote:
>>>: *Your* Tony came very close to those who might be responsible for that mass
>>>: murder too.
>>????????? What ?
>mclane, did I mix up s.th. here. Did he have contact to some minister of the
>indonesian government or what??
Entschuldilge, ich las dein letztes Statement BILDLICH und nicht im
Sinne von NAHEKOMMEN.
Ich dachte im ersten Moment, du wuerdest dich zu dem Satz versteigen,
Tony kaeme einem Massenmoerder ideologisch sehr nahe. Du meintest es
aber wohl nicht so. Sorry. Mein Fehler.
Bitte sei vorsichtig mit solchen Vergleichen. Oder mit den
Satzkonstrukten.
>>>: *Your* Tony never showed up here in rgcc to discuss with the critics here in
>>>: this group last autumn.
>>Yeah!
>Could you confirm this too? Bob made the point to me that it seemed as if *I*
>missed some very important posts of Tony in this rgcc. I therefore asked him
>for a copy. But Bob didn't react ... !
Ich habe nicht viel von Tony gelesen, und was ich las war etwas
unverschämt, selbst WENN er beleidigt war, es war doch sehr
snobistisch.
Rolf Tueschen
mcl...@prima.ruhr.de (mclane) wrote:
>TUESCHEN.MEDIZ...@t-online.de (Rolf Tueschen) wrote:
>>>>: *Your* Tony came very close to those who might be responsible for that mass
>>>>: murder too.
>>>????????? What ?
>>mclane, did I mix up s.th. here. Did he have contact to some minister of the
>>indonesian government or what??
>Entschuldilge, ich las dein letztes Statement BILDLICH und nicht im
>Sinne von NAHEKOMMEN.
>Ich dachte im ersten Moment, du wuerdest dich zu dem Satz versteigen,
>Tony kaeme einem Massenmoerder ideologisch sehr nahe. Du meintest es
>aber wohl nicht so. Sorry. Mein Fehler.
>Bitte sei vorsichtig mit solchen Vergleichen. Oder mit den
>Satzkonstrukten.
Hast ja recht. Aber das passiert in der Eile. Ich tippe spontan meine Antworten
ein. Gerade das fasziniert mich. Das Medium eignet sich kaum fuer mehr.
Soll ich mal deine Stilblueten bringen? Das passiert. Und: d i e Leute, die
dann genau dieses aus dem Zusammenhang reissen, zeigen dann mehr ueber sich als
ueber den der dsas geschrieben hat. Deshalb bin ich immer noch nicht sicher,
dass Bob politisch/ ausserhalb von Schach wirklich sone Pfeife sein soll. Aber
was er da bringt, ist einfach reaktionaer. (!) :)
Bloss, was machst du, wenn er dann damit kommt, dass er chuckle chuckle, seine
Zunge in die Backe gebohrt hatte. Bildlich, das war doch alles nicht ernst
gemeint nach son paar Drinks. So aehnlich hat er vorigen Herbst die *Gazoline*
Story gebracht. Ich habe gewarnt: Bob, Vorsicht, wir Deutsche haben damit
Erfahrung: hier wurde schon Seife aus Juden gemacht,. Oder Lampenschirme.
Und was glaubst du, was passierte. Et Brucje kam an und machte deutlich, doch
nicht unvorsichtig mit Vergleichen zu kommen, die gar nicht passten ...
Tja, und da hatte er bei mir gleich ein paar Punkte weg. Bei Bruce muss ich
immer an den netten / etwas zu jungen Aussenamtssprecher von Bill Clinton
denken, der da zu allem und jedem aus der Welt offizielle kommentare spricht,
so, als haette er da selber drueber nachgedacht. Also Scientologen, Serbien,
usw.
Da ist einfach eine Luecke.
Aber ich schweife ab.
>>>>: *Your* Tony never showed up here in rgcc to discuss with the critics here in
>>>>: this group last autumn.
>>>Yeah!
>>Could you confirm this too? Bob made the point to me that it seemed as if *I*
>>missed some very important posts of Tony in this rgcc. I therefore asked him
>>for a copy. But Bob didn't react ... !
>Ich habe nicht viel von Tony gelesen, und was ich las war etwas
>unverschämt, selbst WENN er beleidigt war, es war doch sehr
>snobistisch.
-------------------------------------------
Alles klar. Versuch die Sache mit dem Tony und meiner Entschuldigung nochmal
von einer bisher nicht hervorgetretenen Seite zu sehen. Solche Sachen sind
meistens mehrschichtig angelegt. Wie immer.
(Lies Don Fong. Den verstehen manche -- deutsche Leser -- nicht, weil er
wirklich mehr/ tiefschichtig schreibt. Meist ironisch dazu.)
Wenn du das zum bitteren Ende siehst, wirst du nicht mehr daran festhalten, dat
dr Tooni (read in koelsch please :)) sowas wie snobistisch war. Nein, er war
einfach entlarvend ... Alles klar? Oder? Dann sag ich: der pfeift aus dem
(einem der) letzten Loch (Loecher). Dat koennen bruce oder Bob nit stopfe.
Please hold this:
Bob didn't answer my private email nor public wish to read one or more of
Tony's posts here in rgcc about Jakarta. *I* couldn't find any post about
Jakarta/ massmurder/ sponsor money / consequences for ICCA if Jakarta cancelled
and so on. As far Deja News TM had written 6 posts in the last 6 months. One
was Apology requested. One that ICCA was politically completely stupid
concerning visa. The rest about official dates or plans of ICCA. That was it.
If this is true Bob did lie about Potemkin letters of Tony's.
Look, Thorsten, from my side you won't find any actions or the like against
this mass killings in indonesia. That's why it always smells (a bit) stinky if
one uses this argument. But I think it's allowed against Gentleman-Tony.
Why? Well, because he was much more disturbed been confused with David (!!) for
supposed talks with Friedel -- than by mass murder in indonesia (!). The
country he -- so blindly -- enjoyed with ICCA and the tournament. He took the
money. ICCA needed so dearly. Read the editorial of F. Friedel. ICCA took the
money and ran away. Some people shout: Look!
And Bob/Bruce Moreland started crying *kill this topic, stop these people who
stick their fingers at/into Gentleman-Tony and shout so loud and so boring
(!)*.
Es tut weh, wenn Experten sich fuer sowas hergeben.