Does a protective 1NT need an alert?

[Dave D]

Country: Ireland

Someone alerted a protective 1NT over-call (10-14) last night; is this
alert required?

Thanks

--
Dave D

[Frances]

Assuming you mean Eire, then the alerting regulations on the CBAI
website say

" You should alert

(a) Any call that is a convention

(b) Any bid that is natural but unexpectedly weak

(c) A forcing raise of a natural opening one of a suit.

"

So the answer is that it should be alerted if it is 'unexpectedly'
weak.
Personally I would say that an immediate 1NT overcall (e.g. 1S - 1NT)
would be expected to be at least a good 14, the usual range being
somewhere around 15-18, but that a protective 1NT overcall (e.g. 1S P
P 1NT) is expected to be rather weaker. Hence I don't think it should
be alerted.

However, I don't know what is commonly played where you play - if it's
usual to play 1suit P P 1NT as strong, then 10-14 is unexpected and
should be alerted. You might do better to ask a local TD than to ask
a group of people on the internet none of whom play in Ireland!

[David Stevenson]

Dave D wrote

>Country: Ireland
>
>Someone alerted a protective 1NT over-call (10-14) last night; is this
>alert required?

No. It is normal bridge.

--
David Stevenson Bridge RTFLB Cats Railways
Liverpool, England, UK bluejak on BBO Mbl: +44 7778 409 955
<webj...@googlemail.com> EBL TD Tel: +44 151 677 7412
bluejak666 on Skype Bridgepage: http://blakjak.org/brg_menu.htm

[David Stevenson]

Frances wrote

>You might do better to ask a local TD than to ask
>a group of people on the internet none of whom play in Ireland!

None of whom? I do not alert a protective 1NT when I play in Ireland,
North or South, and I play it as 10-16.

[Dave D]

On 08/02/2012 13:29, David Stevenson wrote:
> Dave D wrote
>> Country: Ireland
>>
>> Someone alerted a protective 1NT over-call (10-14) last night; is this
>> alert required?
>
> No. It is normal bridge.
>

Thanks David


--
Dave D

[Dave D]

On 08/02/2012 11:00, Frances wrote:
> Assuming you mean Eire, then the alerting regulations on the CBAI
> website say
>
> " You should alert
>
> (a) Any call that is a convention
>
> (b) Any bid that is natural but unexpectedly weak
>
> (c) A forcing raise of a natural opening one of a suit.
>
> "
>
> So the answer is that it should be alerted if it is 'unexpectedly'
> weak.
> Personally I would say that an immediate 1NT overcall (e.g. 1S - 1NT)
> would be expected to be at least a good 14, the usual range being
> somewhere around 15-18, but that a protective 1NT overcall (e.g. 1S P
> P 1NT) is expected to be rather weaker. Hence I don't think it should
> be alerted.
>
> However, I don't know what is commonly played where you play - if it's
> usual to play 1suit P P 1NT as strong, then 10-14 is unexpected and
> should be alerted.

That makes sense, thank you.

> You might do better to ask a local TD than to ask
> a group of people on the internet none of whom play in Ireland!

I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
Americans, or at least affiliated to the ACBL; however, other
nationalities use this group as well, and there is always a chance that
one of them is familiar with our regulations. Indeed, one such
knowledgeable person did reply.

--
Dave D

[David Stevenson]

Dave D wrote

>I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
>Americans

Now there's a way to lose friends quickly ..... :))

[derek]

On Feb 8, 8:47 pm, David Stevenson <brid...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Dave D wrote
>
> >I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
> >Americans
>
>    Now there's a way to lose friends quickly .....   :))

Yeah, there's at least three of us regulars who are ACBL but not
American, and probably nearly as many from the rest of the world as
there are ACBLers among the regulars.

[Charles Brenner]

On Feb 8, 4:47 pm, David Stevenson <brid...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Dave D wrote
>
> >I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
> >Americans
>
>    Now there's a way to lose friends quickly .....   :))

Oh, I'm probably American and I don't feel offended.

Charles

[Dave D]

I humbly apologise ladies and gentlemen - I need all the bridge friends
I can get! :)

I didn't know that non-Americans can join the ACBL. Is it open to
worldwide membership?

--
Dave D

[John Hall]

In article
<901ee6ca-140d-485e...@dq9g2000vbb.googlegroups.com>,

And Frances, to whom Dave D was replying, is herself not American.
--
John Hall
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism
by those who have not got it."
George Bernard Shaw

[Frances]

The ACBL is really the 'North American' CBL and includes Canada and
Mexico - I think derek is Canadian(?). It also used to include
Bermuda but I think I vaguely remember seeing somewhere that Bermuda
had changed 'zones' for world bridge purposes.

There are also some outposts in the rest of the world e.g. the Young
Chelsea Bridge Club in London hosts a weekly American club meeting
(played under ACBL regs, giving ACBL masterpoints etc).

[derek]

Well I suppose it is - certainly the Bridge Bulletin routinely posts
milestones and in-memoriums for people outside North America - but
Canada _is_ part of the ACBL.

[blackshoe]

Bermuda is now in zone 5 (Central America and Caribbean) but maintains status as an ACBL Unit (Unit 198, part of District 2 (Ontario, Manitoba, Bermuda)) probably so that it can continue to run the popular Bermuda Regional every January.

The ACBL has always been the 500 pound canary of bridge. The current fiction is that the CBF and the FMB are the NBO's for, respectively, Canada and Mexico, and the USBF is the NBO for the United States. In reality, the USBF isn't much of an NBO at all, and the ACBL is the NBO for the US. All this in pursuit of "bridge as an Olympic sport". The current situation doesn't really pay more than lip service to the Olympic Charter, but that's the way it goes.

[David Stevenson]

Dave D wrote

Yes, I have been a member for ten years, but that is not the point
Derek is making. The ACBL includes both the USA and Canada, and
Canadians do not like being called Americans. North Americans, ok.

[Co Wiersma]

Op 8-2-2012 10:23, Dave D schreef:

It is in The Netherlands

Dont know about Ireland

[Dave D]

On 09/02/2012 16:53, David Stevenson wrote:
> Dave D wrote
>> On 09/02/2012 03:42, derek wrote:
>>> On Feb 8, 8:47 pm, David Stevenson <brid...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>>>> Dave D wrote
>>>>
>>>>> I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
>>>>> Americans
>>>>
>>>> Now there's a way to lose friends quickly ..... :))
>>>
>>> Yeah, there's at least three of us regulars who are ACBL but not
>>> American, and probably nearly as many from the rest of the world as
>>> there are ACBLers among the regulars.
>>
>> I humbly apologise ladies and gentlemen - I need all the bridge friends
>> I can get! :)
>>
>> I didn't know that non-Americans can join the ACBL. Is it open to
>> worldwide membership?
>
> Yes, I have been a member for ten years, but that is not the point
> Derek is making. The ACBL includes both the USA and Canada, and
> Canadians do not like being called Americans. North Americans, ok.
>

In fairness, I never called Canadians Americans. I am well aware of
these sensitivities.

--
Dave D

[Andrew]

On Feb 8, 4:47 pm, David Stevenson <brid...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Dave D wrote
>
> >I realise that the majority of users of this newsgroup are probably
> >Americans
>
>    Now there's a way to lose friends quickly .....   :))

Manners, David, manners.