9 points and 10 tricks
ma...@netzero.net
South dealt herself: KT4, AQT9852, 6, 96
What's the best start?
South actually opened 3H, hoping to describe her hand immediately and
stifle non-vulnerable competition.
North, holding: J963, J76, AQ8, T87 passed, and we missed a game.
At the other table, the bidding was 1H - 2H - 4H.
A teammate said "With 7 hearts and a singleton, it's obvious to bid a
vulnerable game."
What do you think?
brsri...@gmail.com
Why on earth does North pass 3H?
Boris
Eric Leong
You need to find the spade queen on sides and something nice in hearts
has to happen. So it is not a high percentage game. However, I agree
with the last auction. I really don't know who can make what but I am
not curious to figure out what the opponents can make during the
bidding. I would take the position that either the opponents might
make a game or our side might even have a lucky make in 4H so I would
bid 4H in case the opponents can make something.
Eric Leong
Eric Leong
Why on earth should North bid 4H unless he peeked at all the hands?
Eric Leong
brsri...@gmail.com
Why not? How many hcps do you expect South to have for his action? Not
that it does matter anyway.
Boris
Bud H
Any teammate that gives me grief for not being in game needs his head
examined and has a case of "resultitis". Responder has no shape, and
even if trumps come in for 7 tricks, it is unlikely that three other
tricks are there for the taking.
So you need both the heart king and the spade queen onside. About
25%. Sure, right, I should be in game.........
Bud H
By the way, where are your non-vulnerable opponents with their 23 HCPs
and 17 minor suit cards, who can make 9 or 10 tricks in diamonds
depending if the diamond king is onside or not?
Bud H
paul...@infi.net
They were launching a preemptive strike against their failure to bid
game with their 23 hcp and big double fit in the minors at favorable
vulenrability. Had they come in over 1H or 2H, they would be
congratulating you on shutting the opps out with your 3H opening.
Derek Broughton
> On Mar 20, 5:00 am, "ma...@netzero.net" <ma...@netzero.net> wrote:
>> Unfavorable vulnerability at IMPs
>>
>> South dealt herself: KT4, AQT9852, 6, 96
>>
>> What's the best start?
>>
>> South actually opened 3H, hoping to describe her hand immediately and
>> stifle non-vulnerable competition.
>>
>> North, holding: J963, J76, AQ8, T87 passed, and we missed a game.
>>
>> At the other table, the bidding was 1H - 2H - 4H.
>> A teammate said "With 7 hearts and a singleton, it's obvious to bid a
>> vulnerable game."
>>
>> What do you think?
>
> You need to find the spade queen on sides and something nice in hearts
> has to happen. So it is not a high percentage game.
Sure, but opposite partner's preempt, with my mere 8 points, I've got to be
expecting LHO to have a good hand. So I want to bid at least 4H.
--
derek
Will in New Haven
I don't mind the 3H bid at unfavorable and I would take the push to
game with the North hand because I don't know who can make what. I
also don't mind a 1H bid and that is the action I would actually take.
The auction would go the same, 1H - 2H - 4H if we had the hand.
Missing this game, however, is not all that bad. Even vulnerable at
IMP it is borderline.
--
Will in New Haven
Will in New Haven
Because the opponents can clearly make something.
Because partner was at unfavorable, so 4H may have an adequate play.
Because crowding the auction may cause an opponent to bid 4S.
dar...@gmail.com
I think that South needs to find some non-result merchants as
teammates. Game on those cards is dreadful. Even if the KH and QS are
onside, where are your entries to dummy to take all of the finesses?
It seems to me you need the KH doubleton onside so you can use the
third heart as an entry to dummy. Even then you might be short an
entry unless the QS is doubleton onside as well, or the opponents do
you the favor of leading a major suit for you, which is what I suspect
actually happened. South's teammate criticized her bidding to cover
for his incompetent defense on the hand. A different kind of preempt.
As to the opening bid, it is the type of hand where one could make an
argument for 1H, 3H, or 4H. 3H is fine.
Darin
boblipton
It happens. Sometimes you pre-empt the opponents, someimes you pre-
empt partner and sometimes the hands fit perfectly. Some people will,
of course, simply bid 4 Hearts with this hand. Some partners will
raise to 4 Hearts, pre-emptively. But 'obvious' requires choosing
your data, especially when the majority of hands with a seven-card
major s are going to hold a stiff.
I would suggest running this hand through a computer simulation and
figuring out how often it make,s how often it has a good result and
how often you push the opponents into a making game. But certainly
this is a very good hand for its type and the statement that any
random 7-card heart suit, a side-suit king and a stiff is worth
bidding 4 hearts on doesn't make sense to me.
Bob
Will in New Haven
I agree that the teammates ought to be criticized for their result-
merchanging. I would be in game on this hand because I'm in game on
most hands, not because it is a great game. However, I would not
criticize someone for not bidding this mildly odds-against game.
raija d
<brsri...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:af789404-7b06-4e50...@p11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
Boris
Because it is a good call?
Derek Broughton
_That's_ why I want to bid 4H, not because I expect to make. Sure, being in
3H passed out is better than going down in 4, but who would have expected
it?
--
derek
brsri...@gmail.com
> <brsrich...@gmail.com> wrote in message
Right, by my grandmother's standards.
Boris
Lorne
news:53e672d2-a9a1-449d...@w9g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
Find new team mates who understand that you can't look at all 52 cards
before bidding. Game is 25% needing the spade Q and heart K onside - who
wants to be in game on that?
And change souths spade suit to J763 and you need the spade Q onside
doubleton - how do your team mates propose you diagnose that in the bidding
so you only get to the 'good' games that are 25% and stay out of the 10% or
15% ones!
Tim DeLaney
>
>
>
>
>
> > Unfavorable vulnerability at IMPs
>
> > South dealt herself: KT4, AQT9852, 6, 96
>
> > What's the best start?
>
> > South actually opened 3H, hoping to describe her hand immediately and
> > stifle non-vulnerable competition.
>
> > North, holding: J963, J76, AQ8, T87 passed, and we missed a game.
>
> > At the other table, the bidding was 1H - 2H - 4H.
> > A teammate said "With 7 hearts and a singleton, it's obvious to bid a
> > vulnerable game."
>
> > What do you think?
>
> I think that South needs to find some non-result merchants as
> teammates. Game on those cards is dreadful. Even if the KH and QS are
> onside, where are your entries to dummy to take all of the finesses?
The DA is all you need; the heart spots are all equals.
Tim
Tim
dar...@gmail.com
Really? Let's say the defense starts with three rounds of clubs,
ruffed in the hand. Cross to the DA, and lead the JH, ducked by RHO,
ducked retaining the 2H by declarer, LHO showing out. What next? You
can play a second round of trumps but RHO will duck. If you finish
drawing trumps you are locked in your hand; now you have to find the
SQ singleton to make. If you switch to spades you are only a little
better off. Say LHO takes the AS (naturally the QS has to be onside as
well). LHO can safely play any diamond back, even the KD. Let's say
LHO plays the KD, setting up the QD in dummy. Declarer ruffs, and
again is locked in her hand. All she can do now is try to drop the QS
doubleton, since the KH is still out.
My point is that this game needs to find two cards onside and more
luck besides, making it a terrible game at any form of scoring.
Darin
dar...@gmail.com
Nor would I. Whether or not my teammates bid the game or not or
whether it made or not, I would not criticize since it is a hard hand
to bid.
Darin
agum...@gmail.com
> Unfavorable vulnerability at IMPs
>
> South dealt herself: KT4, AQT9852, 6, 96
>
> What's the best start?
IMO it is 3H. When vul against not, preempts should be sound. 3H could
easily win a board for the reasons you mention.
> South actually opened 3H, hoping to describe her hand immediately and
> stifle non-vulnerable competition.
>
> North, holding: J963, J76, AQ8, T87 passed, and we missed a game.
I have no problem with pass.
> At the other table, the bidding was 1H - 2H - 4H.
> A teammate said "With 7 hearts and a singleton, it's obvious to bid a
> vulnerable game."
I assume that your teammate made this comment in reference to the
auction at the other table. In terms of values, opener's hand is worth
a game try after a 2H raise. However, for tactical reasons 4H is
probably better a bid, since either it may make or the opponents may
make something.
Your auction was different. Since your 3H had already probably shut
the opponents out, there is less incentive to bid on, and from
partner's POV, game rates to be against the odds.
In reality, game was less than 25% requiring two cards on side (HK and
SQ) and no spade ruff so I would not feel ashamed of playing 3H. In a
sense both tables made reasonable bidding decisions. In the long run
stopping in 3H is a small plus position over 4H, but either contract
is a reasonable bet when vul at IMPs.
Andrew
brsri...@gmail.com
It doesn't change a thing. Even if it doesn't make 1000 times in a
row, who cares!
Boris
Hank Youngerman
I think your bidding is fine. You should be within 1 trick of your
bid at these colors, some aggressive bidders might be lighter.
Partner has one trick, maybe a second. He doesn't even have a
doubleton.
I would open your hand 4H at favorable, and maybe both white. It
seems like the game is certainly subpar, even for red at IMPs.
Tim DeLaney
You're right; even when both cards are onside, they can beat you when
trumps are 3-0 and the SQ is accompanied by two or more.
> My point is that this game needs to find two cards onside and more
> luck besides, making it a terrible game at any form of scoring.
No argument there.
Tim
Co
<ma...@netzero.net> schreef in bericht
news:53e672d2-a9a1-449d...@w9g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
lol
lets look at the north hand first
from the point of view of North
South typically has a hand like
xx
AKQxxxx
xx
xx
or
x
AQTxxxx
Kx
xxx
maybe even
Kxx
AQTxxxx
x
xx
I would not bid 4H
not only because the big chance that 4H will be short one
but also because I think that the chance of ending in 4H doubled down 2 is
bigger then the chance of 4H making
-----------------------------------
now the other bidding sequence
I can imagine that South wants to make a preemptive move at some point
like
1H-2H
3H
I think that should be enough to shut the opps out
and if that 3H bid is a game try , in their system
I think then it be better for South to pass 2H
or even bid 3H the first round
if North has a hand like
Qxx
Kxx
Kxxx
xxx
4H is absurt
or
x
K76
Qxxxx
Qxxx
or
J8xx
Jxx
AQx
Txx
I think
that from the point of view of the south hand
the chances of making game is less then 10%
it would be much different
if South could make a long suit trial bid ( 2S)
or short suit trial ( 3D )
cause then 4 Ha could be reached with any proper chance of making
--------------------------------------------------
with the actual hands
I would be proud to have stayed out of game
Co Wiersma