Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

license to murder black kids?

11 views
Skip to first unread message

O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 3:49:33 PM3/14/12
to
26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun. Skinny 17
year old black kid with skittles. He "looked suspicious" walking around a
gated community. (was visiting his dad)

Dead body. White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
arrest. They just take his word for it?? Can you imagine some burly 26
year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
free by claiming self-defense?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2114152/Trayvon-Martin-shot-dead-Police-say-theres-evidence-dispute-claim-neighbourhood-watch-captain-George-Zimmerman-acted-self-defence.html


Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

--- 


Clave

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 3:59:26 PM3/14/12
to
Scooped you by a week.



popinjay999

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 4:11:21 PM3/14/12
to
On Mar 14, 12:49 pm, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
> 26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun.  Skinny 17
> year old black kid with skittles.  He "looked suspicious" walking around a
> gated community. (was visiting his dad)
>
> Dead body.  White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
> arrest.  They just take his word for it??  Can you imagine some burly 26
> year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
> free by claiming self-defense?
>
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2114152/Trayvon-Martin-shot-d...
>
> Opie G. Manager
> Rec.Gambling.Poker
> Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)
>
> ---


Wow, this is like so one-week ago. This is why it's just as well that
you resigned as Asst.Coordinator, because I was going to have to let
you go anyway. Always slow on the draw. Always missing the first
boat. I'm here working my ass off every day, even when I don't feel
well, and where are you? Getting your nails done? Clave beat you by
a week on this news story. Yeah, that's right, fucking Clave.
Fucking douchebag Clave. CLAVE for cryin outloud! You need some
discipline in your life, Opie. It's time to grow up. Time to accept
some responsibility. You can't just hang out smoking weed with Chris
Robin all day. He's a bad influence.

Dave the Clueless

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 4:31:59 PM3/14/12
to
This is a new and interesting topic that warrants its very own new thread.

-------
Canada, keeping the brown people to a minimum for 80 years!

------- 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 6:52:05 PM3/14/12
to
Alright let me try again. Here's a delightful This American Life story at
24 minutes. Kid meets girl. Kid pursues girl for weeks. Girl asks him
to get her some weed. Kid tries for days and finally gets her $25 for
weed for which she insists on paying him for. Girl is undercover cop,
honors student kid with no record now is a convicted felon for drug
dealing on school property.

I wonder how many middle class white kids were swept up in this "criminal
sting" where police officers spent weeks and weeks undercover to procure
$25 weed busts.

http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/457/what-i-did-for-love

It won't be hard to guess.

Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

------- 


Frisbieinstein

unread,
Mar 14, 2012, 10:32:09 PM3/14/12
to
On Mar 15, 2:49 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
> 26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun.  Skinny 17
> year old black kid with skittles.  He "looked suspicious" walking around a
> gated community. (was visiting his dad)
>
> Dead body.  White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
> arrest.  They just take his word for it??  Can you imagine some burly 26
> year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
> free by claiming self-defense?
>
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2114152/Trayvon-Martin-shot-d...
>
> Opie G. Manager
> Rec.Gambling.Poker
> Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)
>
> ---

When Walter Cronkite was a kid in Texas he worked delivering pizzas.
One of the other pizza delivery guys was black. He was shot dead
while trying to deliver a pizza. There were no consequences for the
gunman.

Robert Ladd

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 1:38:32 AM3/15/12
to

"Frisbieinstein" <patmp...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:8bfa27f1-c900-454e...@x7g2000pbi.googlegroups.com...
**************************************************************
You didn't explain the entire circumstances of that particular situation.
That pizza had anchovies rather than pepperoni and the man that ordered it
specifically said he'd shoot the delivery person if the pizza was wrong.
Naturally, since it was in the days of yore, when people took those kind of
remarks as idle jokes, no one took his remark seriously. He later told
police that he was expecting a white person delivering his pizza, but was
surprised when a black person showed up at his door.

As he related to police, "What was I supposed to do, not shoot him because
he was black? That would be discrimination". Many of the cops from that
district had pizza delivered from that same pizza place and one even
remarked, "I've gotten home after a shift and ordered a pizza from there,
waited 45 minutes to an hour for delivery and then found out it wasn't made
the way I ordered. I pulled my gun and fired at the delivery guy too.
Fortunately, I'm a Texas cop and by the time I fumbled getting my revolver
out of my holster, the guy had jumped into his car and turned the corner,
and all I hit was a neighbor's dog. But, no matter whether the delivery guy
was white or black, delivering cold or incorrect pizza calls for drastic
action, and gunfire is justifiable".

And that's the way it is.

Robert Ladd

Steam

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 2:20:49 AM3/15/12
to
My friend was, and he was white

----- 


Robert Ladd

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 2:41:39 AM3/15/12
to

"O-PGManager" <ad6...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:db9739x...@app-01.ezprovider.com...
Surprise, an injustice may have occurred. It seems somewhat odd that every
day there are hundreds, if not thousands, of crimes against persons
committed and only one of them get isolated here to be analyzed.

How many other people were shot with the claim of self-defense, and the
shooter not arrested? If it were white on white or black on black or even
black on white, there would be no particular headlines screamed out nation
wide. But then those situations don't help Al Sharpton's political
aspirations.

Those other situations don't highlight BillB's point that America has a lot
of racists. Of course, maybe we American's are so close to the problem that
we don't see the forest for the trees. None of us are even aware that there
is racism here in America. We need some Canadian that had the great
eye-opening experience where a black Ethiopian family moved in next door to
explain to him how American's just don't know how to feel about someone
whose skin is a different shade.

I'll bet that was quite a culture shock when that Ethiopian that had enough
money to buy a house in a supposed $750,000 per house neighborhood moved in.
But Bill was able to overcome his prejudice by reminding himself that just
because the man's skin was darker than his, didn't mean that the man thought
any differently than he did.

So, Opie, why don't you open another thread with the subject line, "license
to murder, pizza deliverers?", or "license to murder, cab drivers?" or
"license to murder convenient store clerks?" when one of those headlines
scream out at us. Oh, that's right. Those things happen every day, but
they aren't elevated to headlines or discussion level unless they have the
right qualifications. I'd certainly be devastated if I lost a young son
that way and I'd scream to have the man arrested, and it seems that you can
find the time to join this boy's family in their anguish, but you don't seem
to have that same drive to join those pizza deliverers, cab drivers, store
clerks or host of other people that were unjustly killed when some moron had
to prove his idiocy.

Robert Ladd



Steam

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 3:01:45 AM3/15/12
to
Om, surely not the same drug sting, his experience with it was a long time
ago, so obviously had nothing to do with any current drug sting, but same
thing

--- 


bratt

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 10:25:13 AM3/15/12
to
On Mar 14 2012 9:32 PM, Frisbieinstein wrote:

> When Walter Cronkite was a kid in Texas he worked delivering pizzas.

OMG B-BillB just lost all respect for Walter.


------------------------------------------------------------------------

On Nov 8 2011 2:11 PM, VegasJerry wrote:
Jerry (almonst worthless) 'n Vegas

--- 


bratt

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 10:27:16 AM3/15/12
to
On Mar 15 2012 12:38 AM, Robert Ladd wrote:

> You didn't explain the entire circumstances of that particular situation.
> That pizza had anchovies rather than pepperoni and the man that ordered it
> specifically said he'd shoot the delivery person if the pizza was wrong.

There you go - definitely Justifiable Homicide.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

On Nov 8 2011 2:11 PM, VegasJerry wrote:
Jerry (almonst worthless) 'n Vegas

---- 


Abbey Johnsson

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:18:36 PM3/15/12
to
strictly curious....do you offer anchovies at your pizza place? i've
noticed a lot of pizza chains no longer have them on the menu. ( i love
anchovies on my pizza, btw)

----- 


bratt

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:24:35 PM3/15/12
to
we used to, but we only had one request every couple months so stopped.

same with deepfried pickles and Bologna


------------------------------------------------------------------------

On Nov 8 2011 2:11 PM, VegasJerry wrote:
Jerry (almonst worthless) 'n Vegas

______________________________________________________________________ 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:27:06 PM3/15/12
to
What was his crime/punishment? Was he from an all white school?

Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

----- 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:31:18 PM3/15/12
to
Robert if you'd like post stories of unstable black men gunning down
skinny unarmed white children (or taxi drivers, or pizza deliverymen, or
whoever) and the police shrugging their shoulders and saying "well, he
said it was in self-defense"... I would love to read about it and
participate in pointing out the injustice.

You're going to have a HELL of a time finding such a case, that's the
point.

Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

______________________________________________________________________ 


Steam

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:33:16 PM3/15/12
to
At the time it was very predominantly white, then years later it was only
I think 43% white. I don't know how white it is right now, nor do I know
his punishment and he is now passed away, so I cannot ask him

____________________________________________________________________ 


BeaForoni

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:38:58 PM3/15/12
to
On Mar 15 2012 6:18 PM, Abbey Johnsson wrote:
>
> strictly curious....do you offer anchovies at your pizza place? i've
> noticed a lot of pizza chains no longer have them on the menu. ( i love
> anchovies on my pizza, btw)
>
> ----- 

I know from when I used to make-a the pizza (as a teenager), nobody
ordered anchovies. If someone did, the pizza maker would have to go to the
pantry and find a can, open it, drain it, bring it back to the station,
make room for it in the topping section and lay the little fishes out to
make one for each slice (more likely 1/2 a pizza). Labor intensive and
better not get anchovie juice on anything else.

The best part of an anchovie order, is that I got to make an anchovie
meal for myself. Anchovie cheese steaks are good. They really brighten up
an Italian (pronounced EYE-talian) hoagie. Even today, an anchovie pizza
brings back memories of laboring my youth away.

Sometimes, it was custom, they'd save the anchovies to throw on the bride
at a wedding. To make her smell better. Or so I heard.

____________________________________________________________________ 


fffurken

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 8:47:25 PM3/15/12
to
On Mar 14, 7:49 pm, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
> 26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun.  Skinny 17
> year old black kid with skittles.  He "looked suspicious" walking around a
> gated community. (was visiting his dad)
>
> Dead body.  White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
> arrest.  They just take his word for it??  Can you imagine some burly 26
> year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
> free by claiming self-defense?
>
> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2114152/Trayvon-Martin-shot-d...
>
> Opie G. Manager
> Rec.Gambling.Poker
> Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)
>
> ---

Holy shit! So you can shoot someone to death on a public street in the
USA, then when the police come-a-knockin you can claim self defense
and not even get arrested? WTF?

You sure it's a good idea for y'all to have guns?

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 11:18:15 PM3/15/12
to
On Mar 14, 12:49 pm, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:

> 26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun.  Skinny 17
> year old black kid with skittles.  He "looked suspicious" walking around a
> gated community. (was visiting his dad)

> Dead body.  White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
> arrest.  They just take his word for it??  Can you imagine some burly 26
> year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
> free by claiming self-defense?

Well, let me play devil's advocate here.

First of all, your characterization of Martin as a skinny black kid is
misleading. He was 17 and a high school football player. The picture
of him shows his jersey number was 9, indicating he was likely a
quarterback. Quarterbacks tend to be tall, so Martin was likely at
least 6' and in good physical condition.

Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
his head were bloody, and his back was wet. Zimmerman claimed there
had been a scuffle, and that seems likely. We have no way of knowing
who started the fight, but what likely happened is that Martin punched
Zimmerman in the nose and knocked him to the ground. Realizing he was
getting his ass kicked, Zimmerman pulled out his pistol and shot
Martin.

Of course, that is sheer speculation, since no one has come forward as
a witness to what happened.

Third of all, the case has been referred to the States Attorney, who
has the option of bringing Zimmerman before a grand jury. So it's a
little premature to be getting all indignant because no charges have
been filed against Zimmerman at this point.

Here is an article with some background on Florida's "stand your
ground" self-defense law.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-57398005-504083/the-trayvon-martin-case-exposes-the-realities-of-a-new-generation-of-self-defense-laws


William Coleman (ramashiva)

Clave

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 11:34:43 PM3/15/12
to
"Wilhelm Kuhlmann" <ramas...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:9cabaa7a-63a7-48de...@p13g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...

<...>

> Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
> his head were bloody, and his back was wet. Zimmerman claimed there
> had been a scuffle, and that seems likely. We have no way of knowing
> who started the fight...

We have some pretty god-damned strong clues. The cops told Zimmerman to
stay the fuck where he was while they were en route, but he chose to chase
the kid down instead.

And there *was* a witness who said she heard the kid yell for help. The
questioning cop "corrected" her and told her, based on Zimmerman's hearsay,
that it was Zimmerman who had yelled for help.

http://gma.yahoo.com/orlando-watch-shooting-probe-reveals-questionable-police-conduct-032002155--abc-news.html

Jim



Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 15, 2012, 11:38:50 PM3/15/12
to
On Mar 15, 8:34 pm, "Clave" <clav...@the.monastery.com> wrote:

> We have some pretty god-damned strong clues.  The cops told Zimmerman to
> stay the fuck where he was while they were en route, but he chose to chase
> the kid down instead.

It was the 9/11 operator who told Zimmerman that, and Zimmerman was
under no legal obligation to follow that order. Please explain how
this is a strong clue that Zimmerman started the fight.

> And there *was* a witness who said she heard the kid yell for help.  The
> questioning cop "corrected" her and told her, based on Zimmerman's hearsay,
> that it was Zimmerman who had yelled for help.

It was dark and raining. Please explain how the woman knew it was
Martin yelling for help.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

Clave

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 12:04:10 AM3/16/12
to
"Wilhelm Kuhlmann" <ramas...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:029e1891-d841-4c50...@a20g2000yql.googlegroups.com...
> On Mar 15, 8:34 pm, "Clave" <clav...@the.monastery.com> wrote:
>
>> We have some pretty god-damned strong clues. The cops told Zimmerman to
>> stay the fuck where he was while they were en route, but he chose to
>> chase
>> the kid down instead.
>
> It was the 9/11 operator who told Zimmerman that, and Zimmerman was
> under no legal obligation to follow that order. Please explain how
> this is a strong clue that Zimmerman started the fight.

Who pursued whom here?


>> And there *was* a witness who said she heard the kid yell for help. The
>> questioning cop "corrected" her and told her, based on Zimmerman's
>> hearsay,
>> that it was Zimmerman who had yelled for help.
>
> It was dark and raining. Please explain how the woman knew it was
> Martin yelling for help.

Explain how the cop knew it wasn't.

Jim



Pepe Papon

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 12:59:32 AM3/16/12
to
Only if you're white and the person you shot is black.

Abbey Johnsson

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 9:41:46 AM3/16/12
to
On Mar 15 2012 8:38 PM, BeaForoni wrote:

They really brighten up
> an Italian (pronounced EYE-talian) hoagie.

i dont know if youre kidding or not.....but when i was in Italy, i was
told they hate that pronunciation....with the "EYE". the correct way (i
was told) is ee-TALL-ee.


>the pizza maker would have to go to the
pantry and find a can, open it, drain it, bring it back to the station,
make room for it in the topping section and lay the little fishes out to
make one for each slice


how long can that take - 60 seconds? to make a customer happy. btw, i
used to work for Pizzaman in canoga park.....lonnnnnnng tome ago....."I
delivered". remember them? i dont know if theyre even a chain anymore.

_____________________________________________________________________ 


Mossingen

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 11:53:53 AM3/16/12
to
"Clave" <cla...@the.monastery.com> wrote in message
news:nWy8r.346$pc1...@newsfe11.iad...
I suspect that a jury will eventually hear all of the evidence and decide
those questions. But I would think it's a stretch to swallow the OPs
assertion that Zimmerman just decided to shoot and kill this kid for no
reason, other than the kid was black. Shirley, you must believe there is
more to it than that.


Clave

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 12:11:00 PM3/16/12
to
"Mossingen" <jhan...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:jjvnm2$kvk$1...@dont-email.me...

<...>

>>> It was dark and raining. Please explain how the woman knew it was
>>> Martin yelling for help.
>>
>> Explain how the cop knew it wasn't.
>
> I suspect that a jury will eventually hear all of the evidence and decide
> those questions. But I would think it's a stretch to swallow the OPs
> assertion that Zimmerman just decided to shoot and kill this kid for no
> reason, other than the kid was black. Shirley, you must believe there is
> more to it than that.

Of course, and I don't think there's near enough for any sort of criminal
conviction in any state.

I think he'd lose a civil wrongful death suit in most states though. Deep
South, probably not.

Jim



Edward A. Falk

unread,
Mar 16, 2012, 1:37:29 PM3/16/12
to
In article <322212d1-9386-43c5...@z31g2000vbt.googlegroups.com>,
fffurken <fffu...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>Holy shit! So you can shoot someone to death on a public street in the
>USA, then when the police come-a-knockin you can claim self defense
>and not even get arrested? WTF?
>
>You sure it's a good idea for y'all to have guns?

Don't judge the whole U.S. by Texas. Texas is famous for a
shoot-first-ask-questions-later policy. And for racism.

--
-Ed Falk, fa...@despams.r.us.com
http://thespamdiaries.blogspot.com/

brewmaster

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 12:07:23 AM3/17/12
to
LOL "Pizza Man...We Deliver!"

no idea if they're around anymore..we can only get dominos delivery here,
so I pretty much eat no pizza

> _____________________________________________________________________ 


--
Brew "part of the 100%" Master

----- 


Steam

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 12:04:24 AM3/17/12
to
He sold a small amount of marijuana to a fellow student who was actually
an undercover officer who looked younger than he was

---- 


brewmaster

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 12:14:42 AM3/17/12
to
just do what the nice rent-a-cop tells you

Pepe Papon

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 12:25:35 AM3/17/12
to
I once ordered a pizza from Pizzaman. Possibly the worst pizza I've
ever had.

brewmaster

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 12:54:50 AM3/17/12
to
You're from Brooklyn, your opinion on pizza doesn't count. You are used
to better pizza than the rest of us will ever have.


--
Brew "part of the 100%" Master

------- 


Pepe Papon

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 2:47:50 AM3/17/12
to
But I've had pizza in many different parts of the world. I can put up
with so-so pizza. I've found several places in LA that I like.
Pizzaman is not one of them.

Clave

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 3:48:15 AM3/17/12
to


"brewmaster" <a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:imfd39x...@app-01.ezprovider.com...
That exact thought had occurred to me.

Jim



Iceman

unread,
Mar 17, 2012, 10:09:33 AM3/17/12
to
"brewmaster" <a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:q1id39x...@app-01.ezprovider.com...
New York pizza has really gone downhill over the last 20 years. Most of the
places are not even run by Italians anymore.


Edward A. Falk

unread,
Mar 20, 2012, 12:14:01 PM3/20/12
to
In article <jjvtop$vjk$2...@blue-new.rahul.net>,
Edward A. Falk <fa...@rahul.net> wrote:
>
>Don't judge the whole U.S. by Texas. Texas is famous for a
>shoot-first-ask-questions-later policy. And for racism.

My bad. It happened in Florida, not Texas.

Apparently Florida has three legal principals that contributed to
this mess: A "shall issue" law that allows nearly anybody who wants
one to get a concealed weapons permit, a "stand your ground" law that
effectively extends the castle doctrine to the street, and a requirement
that prosecutors *prove* that you didn't act in self defense if you
claim that you did.

It all adds up to a license to kill, especially if the local cops
like you better than they liked your victim. Simply claim self
defense, and the cops can't do much more than throw their hands up
and leave it to the prosecutor to deal with.

http://motherjones.com/politics/2012/03/what-happened-trayvon-martin-explained

BeaForoni

unread,
Mar 20, 2012, 4:05:40 PM3/20/12
to
It goes deeper than the senseless death of a promising youth, it changes
how people act in everyday life. Consider:

The very nature of being black in the United States is now marked
insidiously and essentially by the perceived reality of constantly being
forced to deal with malevolent police forces. Indeed, a representative
example of the black condition is what black journalist Deborah Mathis, in
her syndicated column in 1997, called “Blackmotheritis”: “a nervous
disorder afflicting millions of black women with adolescent or teenaged
children, particularly the mothers of boys.” Mathis explains how she told
her son:

Keep your hands out of your pockets. Don’t reach under your shirt. If
there’s an itch, just live with it. In winter, keep your jacket open.
Mathis wasn’t kidding:

The other day, on a brief shopping foray, Joseph popped his hand beneath
his shirt to rub a mosquito bite. “Joseph!” I shouted. My son’s name fell
hard from my mouth as if it were a pain to say it. “Get your hand …”
“Okay, Ma,” he said impatiently, then muttered something that seemed, at
once, mad and sad. “I just don’t want …” I began, ruefully. “I know, Ma, I
know. I’m sorry.”
http://www.tnr.com/article/101840/trayvon-martin-race-injustice

--- 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 12:31:22 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 16 2012 11:53 AM, Mossingen wrote:

> But I would think it's a stretch to swallow the OPs
> assertion that Zimmerman just decided to shoot and kill this kid for no
> reason, other than the kid was black.

That was not my assertion. Unprovoked, he started an altercation he later
decided he needed deadly force to get himself out of.

Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

________________________________________________________________________ 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 12:32:41 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 15 2012 11:18 PM, Wilhelm Kuhlmann wrote:

> On Mar 14, 12:49 pm, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
> > 26 year old highly unstable white guy with semi automatic gun.  Skinny 17
> > year old black kid with skittles.  He "looked suspicious" walking around a
> > gated community. (was visiting his dad)
>
> > Dead body.  White guy claims "self-defense" - 2 weeks later, still no
> > arrest.  They just take his word for it??  Can you imagine some burly 26
> > year old black man gunning down a skinny white kid and walking away scot
> > free by claiming self-defense?
>
> Well, let me play devil's advocate here.
>
> First of all, your characterization of Martin as a skinny black kid is
> misleading. He was 17 and a high school football player. The picture
> of him shows his jersey number was 9, indicating he was likely a
> quarterback. Quarterbacks tend to be tall, so Martin was likely at
> least 6' and in good physical condition.

He was 140 lbs.

>
> Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
> his head were bloody, and his back was wet. Zimmerman claimed there
> had been a scuffle, and that seems likely. We have no way of knowing
> who started the fight,

No way of taking an educated guess?

> Realizing he was
> getting his ass kicked, Zimmerman pulled out his pistol and shot
> Martin.

Assuming we accept this scenario that's still murder.

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 1:17:35 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 24, 9:32 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:

> He was 140 lbs.

Turns out Martin was actually 6' 3". One of Zimmerman's chief
accusers, Mary Cutcher, called Martin a "little boy". She claims to
have seen Martin lying dead on the ground. I'm sorry, but anyone who
describes a 6' 3" high school football player as a "little boy" has
absolutely no credibility as an eyewitness.

> > Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
> > his head were bloody, and his back was wet.  Zimmerman claimed there
> > had been a scuffle, and that seems likely.  We have no way of knowing
> > who started the fight,

> No way of taking an educated guess?

I don't see how, based on the facts we know. Zimmerman claims he got
out of his car to check a street sign, and Martin attacked him from
behind as he was getting back in his car. Care to cite any facts
which make that implausible?

> > Realizing he was getting his ass kicked,
> > Zimmerman pulled out his pistol and shot Martin.

> Assuming we accept this scenario that's still murder.

I don't know the details of Florida's "stand your ground" law, but if
Martin started the fight, I don't think it would be murder under that
law.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

Edward A. Falk

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 4:05:10 PM3/24/12
to
In article <9i9149x...@app-01.ezprovider.com>,
O-PGManager <ad6...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Realizing he was
>> getting his ass kicked, Zimmerman pulled out his pistol and shot
>> Martin.
>
>Assuming we accept this scenario that's still murder.

For the record, the Republican representative, Dennis Baxley, who
originally authored the "stand your ground" law says that it definitely
does not apply in this case.

http://www.newsmax.com/US/Zimmerman-Trayvon-Sanford-Baxley/2012/03/23/id/433671
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-57401955/fla--stand-your-ground-author-may-seek-changes/

Edward A. Falk

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 4:09:17 PM3/24/12
to
In article <4f863b8b-8408-41d3...@w1g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>,
Wilhelm Kuhlmann <ramas...@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Mar 24, 9:32 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
>> He was 140 lbs.
>
>Turns out Martin was actually 6' 3".

And weighed 140 lbs. And was 17. Pretty much the definition of
"skinny kid". He posed no threat to Zimmerman, especially since all
Zimmerman had to do was *not* chase the kid down.


>> > Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
>> > his head were bloody, and his back was wet.  Zimmerman claimed there
>> > had been a scuffle, and that seems likely.  We have no way of knowing
>> > who started the fight,

We know exactly who started it. Zimmerman. The kid was trying to
get away.

>I don't know the details of Florida's "stand your ground" law, but if
>Martin started the fight, I don't think it would be murder under that
>law.

The author of the law is on record as saying it doesn't apply here.

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 5:33:23 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 24, 1:05 pm, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> In article <9i9149xsae....@app-01.ezprovider.com>,
>
> O-PGManager <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
> >>   Realizing he was
> >> getting his ass kicked, Zimmerman pulled out his pistol and shot
> >> Martin.
>
> >Assuming we accept this scenario that's still murder.
>
> For the record, the Republican representative, Dennis Baxley, who
> originally authored the "stand your ground" law says that it definitely
> does not apply in this case.

How can he possibly say that when he doesn't even know the facts in
the case at this point???


William Coleman (ramashiva)

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 5:38:42 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 24, 1:09 pm, f...@rahul.net (Edward A. Falk) wrote:
> In article <4f863b8b-8408-41d3-97fb-3a871a068...@w1g2000vbx.googlegroups.com>,
> Wilhelm Kuhlmann  <ramashiv...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Mar 24, 9:32 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
> >> He was 140 lbs.
>
> >Turns out Martin was actually 6' 3".
>
> And weighed 140 lbs.  And was 17.  Pretty much the definition of
> "skinny kid".  He posed no threat to Zimmerman,

That's far from clear.


> especially since all
> Zimmerman had to do was *not* chase the kid down.

No persuasive evidence at this point that Zimmerman chased the kid
down. Zimmerman's story is that he got out of his car to check a
street sign, then Martin attacked him from behind while Zimmerman was
getting back in his car.

> >> > Second of all, when police arrived, Zimmerman's nose and the back of
> >> > his head were bloody, and his back was wet.  Zimmerman claimed there
> >> > had been a scuffle, and that seems likely.  We have no way of knowing
> >> > who started the fight,

> We know exactly who started it.

No, we do not.

> Zimmerman.  The kid was trying to get away.

We don't know that either.

> >I don't know the details of Florida's "stand your ground" law, but if
> >Martin started the fight, I don't think it would be murder under that
> >law.

> The author of the law is on record as saying it doesn't apply here.

And how can he say that when he doesn't even know what the facts in
the case are at this point?

You typify the public reaction to this case. Rush to judgement based
on incomplete information.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

fffurken

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 6:58:16 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 24, 9:38 pm, Wilhelm Kuhlmann <ramashiv...@gmail.com> wrote:

> We don't know that either.
>
> > >I don't know the details of Florida's "stand your ground" law, but if
> > >Martin started the fight, I don't think it would be murder under that
> > >law.
> > The author of the law is on record as saying it doesn't apply here.
>
> And how can he say that when he doesn't even know what the facts in
> the case are at this point?
>
> You typify the public reaction to this case.  Rush to judgement based
> on incomplete information.

It's clearly an example of a very probable racist killing and murder.

But what a surprise! Coleman (also without the exact facts) is
defending the nigger hating killer!

Sieg Heil etc.

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 7:02:53 PM3/24/12
to
On Mar 24, 3:58 pm, fffurken <fffur...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> But what a surprise! Coleman (also without the exact facts) is
> defending the nigger hating killer!

No I am not. Why are you lying? I am merely stating that we don't
have enough information at this time to draw any firm conclusions.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

fffurken

unread,
Mar 24, 2012, 7:12:27 PM3/24/12
to
Did I do this one?

I can't remember.

Anyway, cheetos dick!

O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 26, 2012, 9:12:17 AM3/26/12
to
On Mar 24 2012 5:38 PM, Wilhelm Kuhlmann wrote:

> No persuasive evidence at this point that Zimmerman chased the kid
> down. Zimmerman's story is that he got out of his car to check a
> street sign, then Martin attacked him from behind while Zimmerman was
> getting back in his car.

No persuasive evidence? How about the 911 call where he informed the
operator he was stalking the kid down and didn't want "the asshole to get
away"?

Now we're supposed to believe he exited the car for some completely
ancillary reason and Martin managed to sneak up on HIM? He turned his
back on the guy he was stalking? You've got to be kidding me.

> > We know exactly who started it.
>
> No, we do not.
>
> > Zimmerman.  The kid was trying to get away.
>
> We don't know that either.
>
> > >I don't know the details of Florida's "stand your ground" law, but if
> > >Martin started the fight, I don't think it would be murder under that
> > >law.
>
> > The author of the law is on record as saying it doesn't apply here.
>
> And how can he say that when he doesn't even know what the facts in
> the case are at this point?
>
> You typify the public reaction to this case. Rush to judgement based
> on incomplete information.
>
>
> William Coleman (ramashiva)


Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

________________________________________________________________________ 


O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 26, 2012, 9:14:14 AM3/26/12
to
On Mar 24 2012 5:33 PM, Wilhelm Kuhlmann wrote:

> How can he possibly say that when he doesn't even know the facts in
> the case at this point???
>
>
> William Coleman (ramashiva)

Because there is no plausible scenario whereby a skinny kid with skittles
could have posed a threat of death or serious injury to the armed man
stalking him down.


Opie G. Manager
Rec.Gambling.Poker
Assistant Newsgroup Coordinator Emeritus (2009-2011)

-------- 


Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 26, 2012, 9:58:00 AM3/26/12
to
On Mar 26, 6:12 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:

> Now we're supposed to believe he exited the car for some completely
> ancillary reason and Martin managed to sneak up on HIM?  He turned his
> back on the guy he was stalking?  You've got to be kidding me.

No I am not kidding. You don't know what happened, and all your so
called facts are speculation.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

Wilhelm Kuhlmann

unread,
Mar 26, 2012, 10:00:36 AM3/26/12
to
On Mar 26, 6:14 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:

> Because there is no plausible scenario whereby a skinny kid with skittles
> could have posed a threat of death or serious injury to the armed man
> stalking him down.

There is no evidence Zimmerman was stalking him down. Stop lying. A
6' 3" high school athlete is no threat to inflict serious injury???

Drop out of law school immediately, Opie. You are too stupid to even
sweep the floors at a law firm.


William Coleman (ramashiva)

O-PGManager

unread,
Mar 27, 2012, 11:03:47 PM3/27/12
to
On Mar 26 2012 10:00 AM, Wilhelm Kuhlmann wrote:

> On Mar 26, 6:14 am, "O-PGManager" <ad63...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
> > Because there is no plausible scenario whereby a skinny kid with skittles
> > could have posed a threat of death or serious injury to the armed man
> > stalking him down.
>
> There is no evidence Zimmerman was stalking him down.

Other than the 911 tape where he informs the operator he is stalking him
0 new messages