Islamic justice - a nose for a nose and ears for ears
Irish Mike
fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece of
wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her". I
really don't think it's fair to blame these poor muslim men just because
the woman was so inconsiderate to not die from the strangulation - as any
good muslim woman should have.
"Islamabad, Pakistan (CNN) -- A court in Lahore, Pakistan, has ordered
that two men have their noses and ears chopped off, after the two were
convicted of doing the same to a young woman.
The islamic court also ordered that brothers Ammanat Ali, 29, and Sher
Mohammed, 27, spend life in prison and pay 700,000 rupees ($8,300) in
compensation to the victim, Punjab province chief prosecutor Chaudary
Mohammed Jahangir said Tuesday.
The sentence was handed down Monday in accordance with Islamic law and the
country's anti-terror laws, the prosecutor said.
The woman and her family had rejected an offer of marriage from Sher
Mohammed, the officer who investigated the case said.
The two men attacked the woman, Fazeelat Bibi, 22, on September 28, in the
village of Zafarkey, southwest of Lahore, Inspector Hakim Ali said. Along
with their cousin Mohammed Ali and two other men, they hid, stopped Bibi
on her way home from work, and strangled her with a wire, the officer said.
When they thought she was dead, they cut off her nose and ears, Ali said.
They mutilated her "to set an example," prosecutor Jahangir said.
Mohammed Ali, the cousin, was also arrested, while the two other men
allegedly involved in the attack have not been, the inspector said.
The brothers were tried under anti-terror laws because the incident
"created tyranny" in the district, Inspector Ali said.
The high court must confirm the sentence before it is carried out, and a
doctor must determine that they can survive the punishment.
The high court has suspended similar sentences in the past."
Irish Mike
______________________________________________________________________�
* kill-files, watch-lists, favorites, and more.. www.recgroups.com
ChrisRobin
> Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. However, I must be
> fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece of
> wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her". I
> really don't think it's fair to blame these poor muslim men just because
> the woman was so inconsiderate to not die from the strangulation - as any
> good muslim woman should have.
<snip>
Let's bomb 'em all into the stone age. That'll teach them to be civilized.
_____________________________________________________________________�
RecGroups : the community-oriented newsreader : www.recgroups.com
hanks
There goes the illegal alien with the cut and paste.
Do you want to hear about atrocities commited by
the Catholic church in the name of God?
Did you remember to send Christmas cards to Beck, O'Reilly and Rush?
And be sure not to forget Palin.
hanks
Kingo Gondo
missing something?
Shouldn't Jews be doing the same thing--they claim to (still) adhere to the
OT, don't they? Maybe the nutty Muslims are just more devout and observant.
I really don't understand why the "Jewish state" of Israel doesn't get into
the eye gouging, hand-chopping, etc. Isn't that what their God tells them to
do? Isn't that what their forefathers actually did in response to God's
instructions? Seems to me they've become a bunch of fallen-away liberals. I
guess their God will have to judge them someday.
Of course Christers try to use that OT/NT dodge to avoid such things--they
cite the OT when it is something they want to emphasize (gays are bad,
e.g.), but then turn around and cite Jesus as bringing in a "new deal", so
to speak, in the NT when they are just too embarrassed (or lazy) to follow
the OT injunctions about something else (e.g. "Really, I don't need to stay
away from my wife when she's on the rag--although maybe I'd like to").
By the way, if you want to see REAL jihad, you should bone up on the OT,
where God repeatedly instructs the Israelites to capture various cities
inhabited by infidels, and then slaughter every living thing in them--men,
women, children, cattle, you name it. He makes Osama sound like Mother
Teresa. Eichmann had nothing on him.
The fundamental (ahem) problem is that all the Abrahamic religions are
premised on a monotheism that worships a deranged psycho.
The Christers are the funniest of the lot, by far, in dealing with this
inescapable fact. They will repeatedly say things like "Can you imagine if
Christians reacted like that?" when the nutty Islamists go off the deep end
(e.g. with the Danish cartoons). Gee, I don't have to imagine--for many
centuries, longer than Islam has even been around, Christers DID behave like
that, killing non-Christians, and even other Christians, with the exact same
passion and glee, for their perceived "blasphemies". It was only after the
long, slow efforts of various deists, skeptics, freethinkers, and
"liberalized Christians" influenced by them, pushed the Christers into
semi-tolerance that freedom from such atrocities was assured. But for the
vast majority of Christianity's existence, such things were par for the
course. But still, you can almost hear the jealous wistfulness in the voice
of the Christers when they talk about the zealous Muslims of today--you can
hear them silently yearning for the "good ol' days" when they could get away
with that shit, too.
Merry Xmas, Mike!
Irish Mike
> On Dec 22 2009 1:46 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
>
> > Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. However, I must be
> > fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece of
> > wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her". I
> > really don't think it's fair to blame these poor muslim men just because
> > the woman was so inconsiderate to not die from the strangulation - as any
> > good muslim woman should have.
>
> <snip>
>
> Let's bomb 'em all into the stone age. That'll teach them to be civilized.
You're slowing down ChrisRobin. It took you nearly 25 minutes to jump in
and defend these muslim men for strangling and mutilating a 22 year old
woman for refusing to marry one of them. As RGP's constant defender of
islamic suppression, murder and mutilation of women, you really need to
speed up your reaction time.
Irish Mike
OK folks, our phone lines are open and the tenth caller will win... The
Nobel Peace Prize!
------�
buffalo
water borarding
a few hundred times...
Kingo Gondo
"Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:7dk707x...@recgroups.com...
> On Dec 22 2009 3:11 PM, ChrisRobin wrote:
>
>> On Dec 22 2009 1:46 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
>>
>> > Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. However, I must be
>> > fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece
>> > of
>> > wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her".
>> > I
>> > really don't think it's fair to blame these poor muslim men just
>> > because
>> > the woman was so inconsiderate to not die from the strangulation - as
>> > any
>> > good muslim woman should have.
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Let's bomb 'em all into the stone age. That'll teach them to be
>> civilized.
>
> You're slowing down ChrisRobin. It took you nearly 25 minutes to jump in
> and defend these muslim men for strangling and mutilating a 22 year old
> woman for refusing to marry one of them.
Ummm, who is doing that? Isn't even the legal system there, such as it is,
condemning them?
Do you often argue with the voices in your own head?
Irish Mike
> On Dec 22, 11:11�ｿｽam, "ChrisRobin" <a9db...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
> > On Dec 22 2009 1:46 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
> >
> > > Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. �ｿｽHowever, I must be
> > > fair here. �ｿｽThe muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece
of
> > > wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her".
�ｿｽI
> > > really don't think it's fair to blame these poor muslim men just because
> > > the woman was so inconsiderate to not die from the strangulation - as any
> > > good muslim woman should have.
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > Let's bomb 'em all into the stone age. That'll teach them to be civilized..
> >
> There goes the illegal alien with the cut and paste.
> Do you want to hear about atrocities commited by
> the Catholic church in the name of God?
This is extremely disappointing. It took Hanks nearly 45 minutes to jump
in to defend these muslim men for strangling and mutilating a 22 year old
woman. And, of course, to make his standard anti-Catholic bigoted
comment. Really Hanks, you're even slower than ChrisRobin.
Irish Mike
OK folks, our phone lines are open and the tenth caller will win... The
Nobel Peace Prize!
______________________________________________________________________�ｿｽ
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com
Irish Mike
> Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am I
> missing something?
Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
ten years. Now make a list of all the muslims who have killed and
mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last ten years -
assuming you can find that much paper.
Irish Mike
.
________________________________________________________________________�
ChrisRobin
> You're slowing down ChrisRobin. It took you nearly 25 minutes to jump in
> and defend these muslim men for strangling and mutilating a 22 year old
> woman for refusing to marry one of them. As RGP's constant defender of
> islamic suppression, murder and mutilation of women, you really need to
> speed up your reaction time.
You know, there are times when you could actually be mistaken for a
semi-literate person. This is not one of them.
________________________________________________________________________�
Kingo Gondo
"Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
>
>> Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am
>> I
>> missing something?
>
> Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
> have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> ten years. Now make a list of all the muslims who have killed and
> mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last ten years -
> assuming you can find that much paper.
>
> Irish Mike
The very article you posted states the Islamic courts are condemning these
guys. This males it a really a bad example to hang on Islam, since their own
justice system is dealing with these guys far more harshly than ours would.
I really think you didn't read what you posted. You thought it said
something you wanted to say, and regardless of what it actually said, you
are now trying to stick with that. Pretty embarrassing, man. Just drop back
and punt.
ChrisRobin
> On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
>
> > Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am I
> > missing something?
>
> Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
> have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> ten years.
Anyone have an IDF roster handy?
_______________________________________________________________________�
looking for a better newsgroup-reader? - www.recgroups.com
Will in New Haven
> On Dec 22 2009 3:38 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
>
> > On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
>
> > > Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am I
> > > missing something?
>
> > Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
> > have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> > ten years.
>
> Anyone have an IDF roster handy?
I know the Orthodox have more influence than they used to but the IDF
was never about religion. It was about paranoia, much of it seemingly
justified from their side of things. Of course, both sides seem to be
more about religion than they used to be. There used to be Christian
Palestinians and even Christian Palestinian extremists. There used to
be secular Palestinian extremists, many of them Marxists and there
were always secular Israelis. Now it is just Muslims against Jews.
--
Will in New Haven
Jerry Sturdivant
"Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:5pg707x...@recgroups.com...
> Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. However, I must be
> fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece of
> wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her".
Ah! Christianity, the religion of terror. Remember the Crusades? The Spanish
Inquisition? How about those Ku Klux Klaners? It wasn't burning circles that
planted in yards; before hanging Nig-ras and queers. And those abortion
doctors they slaughtered. And let's not forget the Westboro Baptist Church
folks. And Adolf Hitler, using the Christian god to justify slaughtering
millions.
Think of the lives we'd save if we outlawed religion; especially
Christianity.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- Liberal Arts Major Will think for food.
Jerry Sturdivant
"Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:8bn707x...@recgroups.com...
> On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
>
>> Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am
>> I
>> missing something?
>
> Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
> have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> ten years. Now make a list of all the muslims who have killed and
> mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last ten years -
> assuming you can find that much paper.
How about Adolf Hitler. Now there's a Catholic that killed millions.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- So many fundies, so few lions...
Puppytoes
Your choices were Jews and Muslims. Retention problems?
--------�
Puppytoes
Enjoy your Winter Solstice or is it Festivis this year?
_______________________________________________________________________�
Jerry Sturdivant
"Puppytoes" <a7e...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:hov707x...@recgroups.com...
> On Dec 22 2009 1:43 PM, Jerry Sturdivant wrote:
>
>> "Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
>> news:5pg707x...@recgroups.com...
>> > Ah yes, islam, the religion of peace and tolerance. However, I must be
>> > fair here. The muslim men strangled the 22 year old woman with a piece
>> > of
>> > wire before they cut off her nose and ears "to make an example of her".
>>
>> Ah! Christianity, the religion of terror. Remember the Crusades? The
>> Spanish
>> Inquisition? How about those Ku Klux Klaners? It wasn't burning circles
>> that
>> planted in yards; before hanging Nig-ras and queers. And those abortion
>> doctors they slaughtered. And let's not forget the Westboro Baptist
>> Church
>> folks. And Adolf Hitler, using the Christian god to justify slaughtering
>> millions.
>>
>> Think of the lives we'd save if we outlawed religion; especially
>> Christianity.
>>
>>
>> Jerry 'n Vegas
>>
>> - Liberal Arts Major Will think for food.
>
> Enjoy your Winter Solstice or is it Festivis this year?
Winter Solstice. And yes, I do celebrate it.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- No man's liberty is safe while legislature is in session.
FL Turbo
Really ??
You're a Pagan ?
BWAHAHAHA
Who wudda thunk it?
>
>Jerry 'n Vegas
>
>- No man's liberty is safe while legislature is in session.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
When buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first
things to be bought and sold are legislators.
� P. J. O�Rourke
Jerry Sturdivant
"FL Turbo" <noe...@notime.com> wrote in message
news:p2u2j59b4t4e4d3n9...@4ax.com...
And you've selected one of several superstitions and decided to believe in
it. Who's the stupid one?
Jerry (lol @ y) 'n Vegas
- Fundamentalist Fund v. to give cash, Amentalist n. without a mind
John_Brian_K
> in to defend these muslim men for strangling and mutilating a 22 year old
> woman. And, of course, to make his standard anti-Catholic bigoted
> comment. Really Hanks, you're even slower than ChrisRobin.
>
> Irish Mike
>
> OK folks, our phone lines are open and the tenth caller will win... The
> Nobel Peace Prize!
You are an EXTREMELY tough person 'to get' Mike. I see past alot of what
you write, but I have a hard time 'getting' where you come from and where
you are going.
==========================================
You must not think me necessarily foolish because I am facetious,
nor will I consider you necessarily wise because you are grave.
==============================
47.6% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
JBK
-------�
Irish Mike
> "Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> news:8bn707x...@recgroups.com...
> > On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
> >
> >> Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained? Am
> >> I
> >> missing something?
> >
> > Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews who
> > have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> > ten years. Now make a list of all the muslims who have killed and
> > mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last ten years -
> > assuming you can find that much paper.
> >
> > Irish Mike
>
>
> The very article you posted states the Islamic courts are condemning these
> guys. This males it a really a bad example to hang on Islam, since their own
> justice system is dealing with these guys far more harshly than ours would.
It also says islamic courts frequently "suspend" these sentences for
muslim men. Of course they have no problem with the rape of women or
sentencing them to be stoned to death. And those sentences for women
don't get suspended.
Irish Mike
_______________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
> On Dec 22 2009 4:38 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
>
> > "Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
> > news:8bn707x...@recgroups.com...
> > > On Dec 22 2009 3:41 PM, Kingo Gondo wrote:
> > >
> > >> Isn't this the kind of justice the God of the Old Testament ordained?
Am
> > >> I
> > >> missing something?
> > >
> > > Here's a thought numb nuts. Why don't you make a list of all the Jews
who
> > > have killed and mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last
> > > ten years. Now make a list of all the muslims who have killed and
> > > mutilated women in the name of their religion in the last ten years -
> > > assuming you can find that much paper.
> > >
> > > Irish Mike
> >
> >
> > The very article you posted states the Islamic courts are condemning these
> > guys. This males it a really a bad example to hang on Islam, since their
own
> > justice system is dealing with these guys far more harshly than ours would.
>
> It also says islamic courts frequently "suspend" these sentences for
> muslim men. Of course they have no problem with the rape of women or
> sentencing them to be stoned to death. And those sentences for women
> don't get suspended.
>
Proportionality in punishment is a mainstay of justice systems throughout
the world, even in the United States.
----�
Jerry Sturdivant
"garycarson" <garyc...@alumni.northwestern.edu> wrote in message
news:dnua07x...@recgroups.com...
>> It also says islamic courts frequently "suspend" these sentences for
>> muslim men. Of course they have no problem with the rape of women or
>> sentencing them to be stoned to death. And those sentences for women
>> don't get suspended.
>>
>
> Proportionality in punishment is a mainstay of justice systems throughout
> the world, even in the United States.
>
> ----
> RecGroups : the community-oriented newsreader : www.recgroups.com
While in the United States, a woman can be raped by a rapist; then raped by
the Christians when they try stopping her from getting an abortion from that
rape. It's obvious Christians don't think much of their women, either.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- The meek shall inherit the earth, but without mineral rights.
bub
<jer...@cox.net> wrote:
> then raped by
>the Christians when they try stopping her from getting an abortion from that
>rape. It's obvious Christians don't think much of their women, either.
obvious you don't think much of women by calling it rape when people
try and stop abortions.
equating the violent act of rape with someone trying to stop abortion
shows what a idiot you remain
Jerry Sturdivant
"bub" <b...@plottus.com> wrote in message
news:5ft6j5ptd0n0b8d2h...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 06:07:00 -0800, "Jerry Sturdivant"
> <jer...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>> then raped by
>>the Christians when they try stopping her from getting an abortion from
>>that
>>rape. It's obvious Christians don't think much of their women, either.
>
>
> obvious you don't think much of women by calling it
> rape when people try and stop abortions.
It appears that what you think is obvious is far from fact. You always this
wrong? And do admit they're going against women's rights, like I said?
> equating the violent act of rape with someone trying
> to stop abortion shows what a idiot you remain
And the fact my above statement remains true.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- Massage the data enough and the answers your employers want will emerge.
Follow
> And you've selected one of several superstitions and decided to believe
> in it. Who's the stupid one?
>
>
> Jerry (lol @ y) 'n Vegas
>
> - Fundamentalist Fund v. to give cash, Amentalist n. without a mind
So you have chosen a religion that is responsible for just as many
deaths, if not more than Christianity (just not lately) and you choose
to beat up on Christians? That's rich.
Just to be clear, I am not Christian nor Pagan, so this isn't a defense
for anyone, it's just fucking funny.
Did you know that the Gladius is the weapon responsible for more death
than any other single weapon in history besides the A-Bomb? What
religion were the wielders of the Gladius, Jerry?
Follow :)
garycarson
That doesn't even make sense. Lots of weapons have killed more people
than the atomic bomb. You're comparing a weapon that's been used twice
with weapons that have been used thousands of times over a very, very long
period of time.
________________________________________________________________________�
Will in New Haven
wrote:
> On Dec 24 2009 2:05 PM, Follow wrote:
>
>
>
> > Jerry Sturdivant wrote:
>
> > > And you've selected one of several superstitions and decided to believe
> > > in it. Who's the stupid one?
>
> > > Jerry (lol @ y) 'n Vegas
>
> > > - Fundamentalist Fund v. to give cash, Amentalist n. without a mind
>
> > So you have chosen a religion that is responsible for just as many
> > deaths, if not more than Christianity (just not lately) and you choose
> > to beat up on Christians? That's rich.
>
> > Just to be clear, I am not Christian nor Pagan, so this isn't a defense
> > for anyone, it's just fucking funny.
>
> > Did you know that the Gladius is the weapon responsible for more death
> > than any other single weapon in history besides the A-Bomb?
>
> That doesn't even make sense. Lots of weapons have killed more people
> than the atomic bomb. You're comparing a weapon that's been used twice
> with weapons that have been used thousands of times over a very, very long
> period of time.
>
And he pulled the gradius out of his ass to begin with. The gladius
was a very effective short sword but the legions marched for a long
time before they adopted it.
bub
<jer...@cox.net> wrote:
>It appears that what you think is obvious is far from fact. You always this
>wrong? And do admit they're going against women's rights, like I said?
>
not what you said . you said "then raped by the Christians when they
try stopping her from getting an abortion from thatrape. "
you are saying they are raped by christians. ever known a woman who
has been raped? and for you to equate the violent act of rape with
someone trying to talk them out of an abortion shows what a fucking
loser you are.
easd fatboy.
Jerry Sturdivant
"Follow" <lamema...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:hh0e27$gjb$2...@news.eternal-september.org...
> Jerry Sturdivant wrote:
>
>> And you've selected one of several superstitions and decided to believe
>> in it. Who's the stupid one?
>>
>>
>> Jerry (lol @ y) 'n Vegas
>>
>> - Fundamentalist Fund v. to give cash, Amentalist n. without a mind
> So you have chosen a religion
Atheist. No religion. I don't use a religion to hurt or kill people. Get it?
> that is responsible for just as many deaths,
Bullshit. Who kills in the name of No Religion? While Hitler killed
millions. The Crusades and Spanish Inquisition killed untold tens of
thousands. Your Ku Klux Klan killed. The Westboro Baptist Church champions
the killing of gays. Make a list, check it twice.
Jerry 'n Vegas
- Postmodern tagline: ����������������������������
Jerry Sturdivant
"bub" <b...@plottus.com> wrote in message
news:3ru7j5dj7v9kbma24...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 10:08:18 -0800, "Jerry Sturdivant"
> <jer...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>It appears that what you think is obvious is far from fact. You always
>>this
>>wrong? And do admit they're going against women's rights, like I said?
>>
> not what you said . you said "then raped by the Christians when they
> try stopping her from getting an abortion from thatrape. "
Right; rape; sexual assault. Quit dodging; you know exactly what I mean. The
woman is raped; finds herself pregnant; them some asshole Christians try to
keep her from having an abortion.
> and for you to equate the violent act of rape with
> someone trying to talk them out of an abortion
> shows what a fucking loser you are.
Is shows your ignorance. Do you really have no clue as to what the
Christians are trying to do? They aren't trying to talk her out of it.
They're trying to prevent it. They block the abortion clinics. They shoot
the doctors. They're fucking Nazis and they are against women's rights.
Jerry 'n Vegas
Jerry Sturdivant
"bub" <b...@plottus.com> wrote in message
news:3ru7j5dj7v9kbma24...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 24 Dec 2009 10:08:18 -0800, "Jerry Sturdivant"
> <jer...@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>It appears that what you think is obvious is far from fact. You always
>>this
>>wrong? And do admit they're going against women's rights, like I said?
>>
> not what you said . you said "then raped by the Christians when they
> try stopping her from getting an abortion from thatrape. "
Right; rape; sexual assault. Quit dodging; you know exactly what I mean. The
woman is raped; finds herself pregnant; them some asshole Christians try to
keep her from having an abortion.
> and for you to equate the violent act of rape with
> someone trying to talk them out of an abortion
> shows what a fucking loser you are.
Is shows your ignorance. Do you really have no clue as to what the