GCA "Ca. Cheating"
Newgca
This is addressed to the "uneducated in cheating".
Do you think I am a cheat? Do you believe I have cheated for over thirty years?
Do you believe I know about cheating in poker, as well as many other games? Do
you doubt I can spot cheating in a fairly quick manner? Do you think I will
know when marked cards are being played? Do you doubt I can spot many types of
marked cards?
Doyle Brunson and Chip Reese owned Oceanside Card Casino, in Oceanside Ca,
about the early 1990's. Doug Dalton was the manager there at that time. The big
game was crooked there, when it went. The reason Doyle and Chip couldn't get
the place going, was the California cheats would not play there, as they knew
they would be cheated.
When Len Miller bought Oceanside Card Casino, other cheats moved in and the
place did quite a business. When Ocean's 11 opened up, this basically put
Oceanside Card Casino out of business, better location and a new batch of
cheats. The old was replaced with the new.
I was in Oceanside when Doyle and Chip owned OCC. I was there when Len Miller
had OCC. Both places were crooked to the core.
I was also in Bell Gardens when Yosh Nakano hosted a high stakes game at the
Regency in Bell Gardens, Ca. This is the place Huck Seed and Phil Hellmuth, as
well as many others were cheated by Doyle Brunson, Chip Reese, Stu Ungar and
others. I was there also.
Only a person that is totally ignorant would doubt I couldn't spot a game with
marked cards in it. Only a person who is totally ignorant would doubt I could
catch a cheat.
Doyle Brunson, Chip Reese and Stu Ungar were among the cheats that played in
California during the early to mid 90's. I was there, just one game away, doing
my thing also.
If this isn't current 1st hand information, you people are idiots. I was there
watching them cheat as I was cheating myself. I would of been cheating the
people they were cheating except they had that management.
Bill Nirdlinger worked at the Regency where he was prosecuted for cheating a
jackpot. He wasn't caught, but the place was doing so badly, it couldn't pay it
off, and knowing his reputation, he was prosecuted and convicted under an
alias. John Martino was one of the players in this pre-arranged game to take
this jackpot off. Jack McClellan, your tournament director was also working
there. The Regency was the old Bell Club that took over when Gardena was coming
to an end. It is located about one mile north of the Bicycle Club on Eastern
Avenue.
This was California in the 90's. Doyle, Chip, Stu and many others were there
cheating the suckers who would play with them. I was there watching and doing
the same. You can deny all you want, but mine is 1st hand information for
decades. If you think I can't scam, cheat or catch someone cheating, you are
ignorant.
Russ Georgiev
Jeffrey S. Biship
> California Cheating
>
> This is addressed to the "uneducated in cheating".
Perhaps I think too highly of myself, but I feel like Russ is talking (at
least partly) to me here, so I'll bite....
> Do you think I am a cheat? Do you believe I have cheated for over thirty
years?
> Do you believe I know about cheating in poker, as well as many other games?
Uh, I believe you are a cheat. If you say thirty, it's thirty. I grant
that a cheat would know about cheating in poker. I believe these because
it costs me nothing to do so. You want me to think you're a cheat, okay,
I'll do you that courtesy.
Do
> you doubt I can spot cheating in a fairly quick manner? Do you think I will
> know when marked cards are being played? Do you doubt I can spot many types
of
> marked cards?
These last three I have no knowledge of. I've never seen you cheat. I've
read some of your posts, you seem pretty knowledgeable, so I would lean
towards yes, but wouldn't be surprised if I found out you overstate your
abilities.
> Doyle Brunson and Chip Reese owned Oceanside Card Casino, in Oceanside Ca,
> about the early 1990's. Doug Dalton was the manager there at that time. The
big
> game was crooked there, when it went. The reason Doyle and Chip couldn't get
> the place going, was the California cheats would not play there, as they knew
> they would be cheated.
>
> When Len Miller bought Oceanside Card Casino, other cheats moved in and the
> place did quite a business. When Ocean's 11 opened up, this basically put
> Oceanside Card Casino out of business, better location and a new batch of
> cheats. The old was replaced with the new.
So, what made Doyle and Chip's crew more scary than the new cheating crew?
Was the new cheating crew made up of out of work actresses and off-duty
Playboy Bunnies? I know it sounds like I'm being a smart ass, but either
you're prose style is slightly confusing, or this is an inconsistency.
This sort of thing colors how I read the rest of your story.
> I was in Oceanside when Doyle and Chip owned OCC. I was there when Len Miller
> had OCC. Both places were crooked to the core.
You've taken on an almost impossible task and for that alone I have to
admire you. I'm asking for proof. I don't think I'm alone, but you want
me to speak for myself. Can you think of anyway that you could make this
claim more compelling than just saying the words "Both places were crooked
to the core?" I doubt you have photos or video tape, but jeeze, is that
too much to ask. In this day and age of 24 hour news and scandal sheet
journalism, I have a hard time believing that SOME newsagency somewhere
wouldn't be interested in your story, if there were something there
beyond, "I saw it all, honest."
At least describe in some detail some of the scams that you claim you
witnessed Doyle and the gang pull off. I mean, give me something!
> I was also in Bell Gardens when Yosh Nakano hosted a high stakes game at the
> Regency in Bell Gardens, Ca. This is the place Huck Seed and Phil Hellmuth,
as
> well as many others were cheated by Doyle Brunson, Chip Reese, Stu Ungar and
> others. I was there also.
Now we could possibly be getting somewhere. Phil Hellmuth has posted to
this newsgroup. It would lend a little credence to you claims if he (or
Huck) posted that they witness cheating in Bell Gardens, or even that they
suspected something wasn't right. Mr. Hellmuth may have done this
already, but I don't remember it.
> Only a person that is totally ignorant would doubt I couldn't spot a game
with
> marked cards in it. Only a person who is totally ignorant would doubt I could
> catch a cheat.
Fair enough. I readily admit to being totally ignorant. But this is a
rhetorical ploy that you use often. Accusing someone of being stupid
because they don't agree with you is no way to win arguments beyond the
school yard.
> Doyle Brunson, Chip Reese and Stu Ungar were among the cheats that played in
> California during the early to mid 90's. I was there, just one game away,
doing
> my thing also.
>
> If this isn't current 1st hand information, you people are idiots. I was
there
> watching them cheat as I was cheating myself. I would of been cheating the
> people they were cheating except they had that management.
>
> Bill Nirdlinger worked at the Regency where he was prosecuted for cheating a
> jackpot. He wasn't caught, but the place was doing so badly, it couldn't pay
it
> off, and knowing his reputation, he was prosecuted and convicted under an
> alias. John Martino was one of the players in this pre-arranged game to take
> this jackpot off. Jack McClellan, your tournament director was also working
> there. The Regency was the old Bell Club that took over when Gardena was
coming
> to an end. It is located about one mile north of the Bicycle Club on Eastern
> Avenue.
Okay, so how was he prosecuted if he wasn't caught? Maybe this is just
another weakness of your writing style. You always say no one is ever
prosecuted for cheating in casinos, yet one of your associates was
"prosecuted." So which is it? What am I not understanding?
> This was California in the 90's. Doyle, Chip, Stu and many others were there
> cheating the suckers who would play with them. I was there watching and doing
> the same. You can deny all you want, but mine is 1st hand information for
> decades. If you think I can't scam, cheat or catch someone cheating, you are
> ignorant.
I know you're going to accuse me of being impossible to please, and you
keep talking about "first hand information," but you forgot the
"unsubstantiated" part of that. Once again, we're back to you saying,
"It's true because I say it's true." That doesn't cut it.
I'm going to stop replying to you because I don't really have any stake in
this fight. I'm really just trying to be helpful. I've said it a million
times. If you'd gone about things differently when you first started, you
could have done some good. Maybe you have and I'm just too dumb or too
out of the loop to see it. If so, then congratulations. You succeeded
dispite yourself.
Jeff
_________________________________________________________________
Posted using RecPoker.com - http://www.recpoker.com
Shawn Nelsen
such great players have to cheat?
Doyle says he never cheated, Russ, maybe you were just imaging things?
Probably just a coincidence that the people that you mentioned back then are
still in power now? If they were cheaters wouldn't someone have barred
them, or at least run them off?
Ahh never mind you were probably taking those zanex (sic) back then, huh
Russ? Can't play well when you're loaded, right? I mean just look at
Stuey, he was higher than most any kite, but, he couldn't play a lick. No
talent, drugged up piece of shit... Sound familiar?
Shawn Nelsen
"Newgca" <new...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021121024408...@mb-fp.aol.com...
Shawn Nelsen
come out and defend Doyle and the games he played in as being on the square.
You would think that if Russ was lying, all these high stakes players that
were there, would defend each other and their games, yet they don't. I
wonder why, do you?
Shawn Nelsen
"Jeffrey S. Biship" <anon...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:JD2D9.1482359$Xw1.1...@news.easynews.com...
Michael OMalley
"Shawn Nelsen" <shawn....@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:lC8D9.17583$We5...@nwrddc04.gnilink.net...
Michael OMalley
Shawn Nelsen
your opinion on the games in Oceanside, what Russ is claiming went on, and
why no one that was there (besides Russ & Doyle), will speak out?
I AM open minded on this, just leaning towards what Russ is claiming.
(makes sense vs. it all being a fabrication)
Shawn Nelsen
"Michael OMalley" <rzi...@lvcm.raise.com> wrote in message
news:Yj9D9.731$ro.6...@news2.west.cox.net...
Michael O'Malley
> Uh, Michael, did you say something and I missed it? Or what? I was
asking
> your opinion on the games in Oceanside, what Russ is claiming went on, and
> why no one that was there (besides Russ & Doyle), will speak out?
I was there, there was no cheating going on.
> I AM open minded on this, just leaning towards what Russ is claiming.
> (makes sense vs. it all being a fabrication)
So you believe fiction over fact? The fact is, there is no proof that what
Russ say's is true.
As many others have stated previously, and I believe the same, what Russ has
to say is actually a positive thing. It is the way he has gone about it
that is ridiculous. There are two approaches he could have taken:
1) There is cheating in poker. Watch out, be alert, here is what to look
for.
2)Doyle and Chip are cheats, Doug is a cheat too, everyone is a cheat.
To take the approach of #1 would have been good for poker. It would make
everyone aware that there might be something going on and what to look for.
Russ chose #2, and in doing so made a buffoon of himself by showing that he
just wants to try to damage peoples reputations and accuse people of doing
things that he has no 1st hand knowledge of them doing.
Newgca
>Open minded Shawn"
>
Mike O, you are a liar. You couldn't spot cheating if it looked you in the
face. You are even paid to try to keep poker with a good image, as you work for
the casinos.
As for you being at Oceanside, I doubt it. I played there everyday for about a
year, cheating and cheating the other cheats. If you were there, you were a
nobody, a pissant, an un-noticeable entity. I have you on an audio tape stating
I am a WCP, which I will play at my convience. Keep talking Mike O, because it
will be your down fall in poker.
Russ Georgiev
Michael O'Malley
those yet?
"Newgca" <new...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021121180836...@mb-fi.aol.com...
Michael O'Malley
> about the early 1990's. Doug Dalton was the manager there at that time.
The big
> game was crooked there, when it went. The reason Doyle and Chip couldn't
get
> the place going, was the California cheats would not play there, as they
knew
> they would be cheated.
>
> When Len Miller bought Oceanside Card Casino, other cheats moved in and
the
> place did quite a business. When Ocean's 11 opened up, this basically put
> Oceanside Card Casino out of business, better location and a new batch of
> cheats. The old was replaced with the new.
>
> I was in Oceanside when Doyle and Chip owned OCC. I was there when Len
Miller
> had OCC. Both places were crooked to the core.
>
Russ...As for you being at Oceanside, I doubt it. I played there everyday
for about a
year. If you were there, you were a nobody, a pissant, an un-noticeable
entity. Keep talking Russ, because it
will be your down fall.
FourFives
> Russ...As for you being at Oceanside, I doubt it. I played there everyday
> for about a
> year. If you were there, you were a nobody, a pissant, an un-noticeable
> entity. Keep talking Russ, because it
> will be your down fall.
Just how much further can he fall?
BigFlopForPresto
Michael OMalley
"FourFives" <anon...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fBfD9.769561$DB1.8...@news.easynews.com...
> On Nov 21 2002 3:23PM, Michael O'Malley wrote:
>
> > Russ...As for you being at Oceanside, I doubt it. I played there
everyday
> > for about a
> > year. If you were there, you were a nobody, a pissant, an un-noticeable
> > entity. Keep talking Russ, because it
> > will be your down fall.
>
> Just how much further can he fall?
Good point.
Jeffrey S. Biship
> Kind of funny how Huck Seed, Phil Hellmuth and others who were there won't
> come out and defend Doyle and the games he played in as being on the square.
> You would think that if Russ was lying, all these high stakes players that
> were there, would defend each other and their games, yet they don't. I
> wonder why, do you?
As opposed to O. J. Simpson's outspoken declarations of his innocence?
As opposed to Bill Clinton's famous "I did not have sex with that woman?"
It doesn't neccessarily follow that silence equals guilt or that speaking
up equals innocence.
The only thing that determines innocence or guilt is proof.
Shawn Nelsen
Is that really the best you can do? Takes one to know, one?
Na na na na na na. Liar, liar, pants on fire, hanging from a telephone wire.
You sound like a 7 year old for cryin out loud!
Shawn Nelsen
"Michael O'Malley" <rzi...@lvcm.raise.com> wrote in message
news:fWdD9.1454$ro.1...@news2.west.cox.net...
Shawn Nelsen
there's smoke, there's USUALLY fire!
Shawn Nelsen
"Jeffrey S. Biship" <anon...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:Y8hD9.773868$DB1.8...@news.easynews.com...