wine tasting
Jeff Rosenfeld
to be able to sample more of the available
set of wines I have arranged with a group
of friends to have a regular tasting session.
This is all fine and happy but I would like to
hear from those of you have such sessions (and I
know you exist) about what classes of wines you'd
recommend we start out with, what sorts of features
we should look for in a wine, etc.
Basically, how does one run one of these things?
Thanks for any suggestions,
- Jeff.
David Dyer-Bennet
:In an effort to learn more about wines and
:to be able to sample more of the available
:set of wines I have arranged with a group
:of friends to have a regular tasting session.
:Basically, how does one run one of these things?
Well, here's what we've been doing:
We pick a single grape type or type-and-region for a single tasting.
We select 8 or 12 bottles of interest (supposed to be good examples,
in the price ranges of interest to the people involved or sometimes,
rarely, something superb to act as a control and benchmark). People
present themselves with their 4 tasting glasses at the requisite time
and place, to find themselves confronted with 4 bottles wrapped in
paper bags and labeled arbitrarily. We taste 4 wines and make
personal notes, then get out the next flight of 4. Afterwards we can
go back and re-sample everything, if needed. We ask everybody to pick
1st and second overall, and first and second in each flight. This
information is compiled and photo-copied and handed back to everybody.
Then we open the wrappings and let people write down what it really
was (it's also on the results sheet).
We normally provide cheese, crackers, french bread, and sometimes
other things either to "cleanse the palate" or to "snack on",
depending on your orientation.
Critical points -- tastings "as blind as possible" (sometimes a
participant has to arrange the order of the bottles and do the
wrapping). Serve the wines at the same temperature (what it is isn't
NEARLY as important). Limit the size of flights (4 seems perfect).
Limit the total number of wines sampled (12 is about max for
inexperienced people). The quality range shouldn't be too tremendous
-- or at least it shouldn't range down into the really unpleasant
stuff, which may warp your perceptions for the rest of the evening.
There are other kinds of tastings with other requirements; this is
intended as a low-to-midlevel tasting to support both serious inquiry
and lighter interests at once. The blindness both helps the serious
inquirer, and helps the casual drinker realize how much difference
there is between wines.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, d...@terrabit.fidonet.org
or d...@network.com
or Fidonet 1:282/341.0, (612) 721-8967 9600hst/2400/1200/300
or terrabit!d...@Lynx.MN.Org, ...{amdahl,hpda}!bungia!viper!terrabit!ddb
Pete Gibson
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jeff, [I tried to mail you directly, but this message bounced several times]
I'm involved in two tasting groups and have had involvement with others.
My suggestion is to start out with a zinfandel tasting, provided you and
your friends enjoy red wines. There's something fun, convivial, non-complex,
and overwhelmingly enjoyable about zinfandel. I can't explain it, but all
of my most fun wine tasting experiences have been at zinfandel tastings.
This is not to say that zin is the most pleasurable wine. Perhaps the
best lineup of wines was a St. Julien tasting I attended a few months back.
The wines were great, but we all concentrated too much on the wines and
neglected human interaction. In addition, zinfandels are very reasonably
priced -- rarely exceeding $14/bottle for the upper echelon.
If your group prefers whites, I suggest chardonnay. I must admit that I
drink few white wines, so my experiences with white varietals in tasting
groups is quite limited.
I suggest that you purchase one bottle for every 2 to 3 people. For a
tasting group of 16 members, 7 to 8 bottles is quite adequate. We usually
go with 7.
Wrap each bottle in a brown paper bag. Remove the lead
foil, mix the bottles up, and number each bottle sequentially so the host
doesn't know which is which. This is called blind tasting, and removes
predisposed biases for or against a certian bottle.
I caution against mixing varietals for any one tasting. Choose one (e.g.
zin or cabernet) and go with it. If, say, you put a pinot noir in with
a zinfandel flight, the pinot would look pale in color and its complexity
would hide due to the boldness of the zins.
If you really want to get serious about the side-by-side
differences amongst the wines, have one glass for each wine. The downside
to this is that the table gets filled with glasses and it can be a bit
clumsy.
Provide a tasting sheet for all members including such categories as color,
bouquet, taste, finish, and overall synergy.
As the members to rank which wines they preferred. The top three of the
group should be recognized (and you should post to the net!). We use a
simple scale: each first-place vote gets 3 points; each second-place
vote gets two; and each third-place vote gets one. There are fairer and
more complex weighting scales, but this works for quick and easy
calculation. Some people dock points for each last place vote.
Provide food and water. I can't emphasize how important water is. It not
only cleanses the palate, but also dilutes the wine in the stomach. Some
people get quite queasy stomachs from the acid and alcohol in the wine;
water helps to minimize this ill effect. As for food, mild cheeses
and good fresh bread are the most important accompaniments. Grapes and
other fruits are also enjoyable. Keep away from strong tasting foods
unless you wish to see how a wine holds up to the food's flavors.
We eat a pot luck dinner (each person provides a dish) before each tasting
to warm up the atmosphere and coat the stomach with some protection. If
you choose to do this, ask each member to bring his or her own china and
silverware. Also for the hosts' convenience, ask the members to bring
his or her own glassware, too.
Dessert and coffee is another option.
Lastly, and I'm sure I've forgotten some things but, may I suggest Dr.
Richard Gold's book, "How and Why to Build a Wine Cellar". You may
be asking, "what does a wine cellar have to do with tasting groups?"
Well, Dr. Gold's book goes beyond the topic of wine cellar construction,
into some excellent recommendations on wine-related publications,
tasting groups, cellar wine selection, etc. I have no relationship
with Dr. Gold, other than to say I'm a satisfied customer of his
book. You can order the book from the ad in the back of the Wine
Spectator. I think it ~$20, but well worth it. It's not glossy, but
the content I have found to be essential and substantial. I have
the address if you're interested.
Please feel free to mail me if you'd like more info. I wish you and
your group the best!
Enjoy!
Pete
pe...@sequent.UUCP
..{tektronix,ogicse,uunet}!sequent!peteg
Jeff Close
>In article <MZhaQT_00...@andrew.cmu.edu> you write:
>>Basically, how does one run one of these things?
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>tasting group of 16 members, 7 to 8 bottles is quite adequate. We usually
>go with 7.
>people get quite queasy stomachs from the acid and alcohol in the wine;
>water helps to minimize this ill effect. As for food, mild cheeses
>and good fresh bread are the most important accompaniments. Grapes and
>other fruits are also enjoyable. Keep away from strong tasting foods
I wanted to applaud Pete's response to this inquiry -- I have to agree
with most of your response, and thank you for the effort to educate
others (I'm sorry I didn't take time to respond).
I have some reservations with the two areas above. For a tasting (not
a dinner party), I don't think as much as one bottle per 2-3 people
is always necessary. Also, remember that if you need one or two
ounces of each wine, and a lot of people are involved, the formula
doesn't account for buying multiple bottles to have enough of each
wine to go around (i.e., twenty people can't split a single bottle for
tasting). On the second point, I personally am ambivalent about
serving fruit with tastings. I think the acid in fruit, especially
things like grape peels, can screw up tasting. Something more bland,
like bread, might work better.
These are really minor, and again thanks for the reply.
--
-^-
"Imagination is the one weapon in the war against reality." - Jules de Gaultier
"May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house" - G. Carlin
"Life is too short to drink bad wine."
-=.=-
J. Jeffrey Close : UUCP: sun!sundc!potomac!jclose
Advanced Decision Systems : InterNet: jcl...@potomac.ads.com
1500 Wilson Blvd #512 : VoiceNet: (w) 703-243-1611
Arlington, VA 22209 < SneakerNet
William J. Gilbert
>
>I have some reservations with the two areas above. For a tasting (not
>a dinner party), I don't think as much as one bottle per 2-3 people
>is always necessary. Also, remember that if you need one or two
>ounces of each wine, and a lot of people are involved, the formula
>doesn't account for buying multiple bottles to have enough of each
>wine to go around (i.e., twenty people can't split a single bottle for
>tasting). On the second point, I personally am ambivalent about
>serving fruit with tastings. I think the acid in fruit, especially
>things like grape peels, can screw up tasting. Something more bland,
>like bread, might work better.
>
I find that 5 or 6 bottles for 10 to 12 people works well.
We usually serve just fresh French of Italian bread at the tastings.
We also bring our own wine glasses, so that we can wash them ourselves,
and cannot blame others for any soapy tastes.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Will Gilbert, Pure Mathematics Department, University of Waterloo
wjgi...@water.UWaterloo.ca or uunet!watmath!wjgilbert
Anita Cochran
Various people have described tastings and done a good job. I just want
to comment on the subject of food. People have suggested cheese.
We serve cheese at our tastings only after everyone has ranked things,
never during the ranking. Why? Because cheese coats the palate and
renders it useless for accurate tasting. In a wine tasting course I
once took, the professor told us if you are buying wine, only eat
bread; if you are selling wine, serve cheese. If you do not believe this,
taste without cheese. When things have been ranked, eat some cheese
and then re-taste one of the lower ranked, harsher wines. It will taste
much smoother.
Blind tastings are the only way to go but they can be brutal. A wine which
is good with food may taste not so good against another, better wine. This
is important to understand. With our group (8 people generally), we
have each 2 people bring a bottle of the designated wine. This way, they
often bring a bottle "they know they like". Boy are we surprised when
one of our favorites doesn't do so well!
We also sometimes dabble in ringers. For a tasting of Australian Shiraz
recently, we had 3 Shiraz and a Napa Syrah (not petite Syrah) and a Cotes
du Rhone. The Shiraz is the Australian name for the Syrah grape and the
Syrah is the grape of much of the Rhone.
The most unique "ringer" we did was Oregon Pinot Noirs with a bottle of
decent burgandy along side. We did not taste the burgandy blind (we knew
which glass it was) but tasted it simultaneously. The styles are very
different and it was very informative. We did not rank the burgandy either
but if we had, about half the group would have ranked it #1 while the other
half wasn't that fond of the style.
Moral of this is to define your wine carefully -- the grape type is
important but the origin is important also. A California Riesling
tastes nothing like a German Riesling.
--
Anita Cochran uucp: {noao, ut-sally, ut-emx}!utastro!anita
arpa: an...@astro.as.utexas.edu
snail: Astronomy Dept., The Univ. of Texas, Austin, TX, 78712
at&t: (512) 471-1471
Scott Fisher
>
>Various people have described tastings and done a good job. I just want
>to comment on the subject of food. People have suggested cheese.
>We serve cheese at our tastings only after everyone has ranked things,
>never during the ranking. Why? Because cheese coats the palate and
>renders it useless for accurate tasting. In a wine tasting course I
>once took, the professor told us if you are buying wine, only eat
>bread; if you are selling wine, serve cheese.
The old saying is "Buy on apples, sell on cheese." The malic
acid in apples, as it was explained to me, will highlight any
defects the wine might have; some component of the cheese, on
the other hand, will make a fair wine taste very good.
In a more general sense, I am still often surprised to find
how a wine changes with food. Sometimes a wine that tasted
good on its own merits becomes unacceptable with food (and
I don't mean mismatching whites with reds, I mean an interaction
between some components of both wine and food that don't work),
while more frequently a wine that's only fair on its own tastes
much better when paired with the right food -- and the right
food can improve when paired with the right wine.
My most recent experience was with a 1987 Louis Martini petite
syrah, which I bought as an experiment. (Most Martini wines
taste like they've had about 20% water added, and since petite
syrah is such a powerful wine in most cases, I wanted to see
what a Martini syrah was like.) We opened it and it had
absolutely no taste whatsoever! "At least it's cheap," I
grumbled, and left it to breathe a bit while we finished making
dinner (pasta with red sauce).
When paired with the tart red sauce, the wine became much better.
Well, to be fair -- it developed some flavor. (This is not a
wine I'd recommend; there are LOTS of good, drinkable vin ordinaires
out there for less than $8.00 a bottle, but this one is off in its
own corner of oenology.) And also surprisingly, this wine took on
a stronger flavor with additional air time -- most wines I've tasted
get softer after they've been opened.
David Wright
buy Micheal Broadbent's "Pocket Guide to Winetasing" (Pub. Mitchell
Beazley). I'm sure you can get this - and their other pocket guides which
are also excellent - in the US. UK price is #4.95 - say $8. No doubt the
actual US price will differ. This seems a lot for such a small book until
you find how much is packed into it. And all good advice, from an expert,
very well and clearly written.
--
Regards, "Good wine ruins the purse; bad wine ruins the stomach"
David Wright STL, London Road, Harlow, Essex CM17 9NA, UK
d...@stl.stc.co.uk <or> ...uunet!mcvax!ukc!stl!dww <or> PSI%234237100122::DWW