Why it's worth learning Chinese
Lewis Perin
Babelcarp database, I come across a website that shows how deep in tea
knowledge the Chinese Web is. Somehow this page shocked me when I
considered the odds of finding any of this knowledge in English:
http://scholar.ilib.cn/A-yyhx200604029.html
/Lew
---
Lew Perin / pe...@acm.org
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html
Twug Storn
Lewis Perin
> > http://scholar.ilib.cn/A-yyhx200604029.html
> >
>
> Uhh.. that's in some weird scratch-like language.
I think the scratches come from your browser lacking East Asian
character support. But I think you can see from the English on that
page that the technical level is pretty high, which was my point.
Dominic T.
Hey, I don't know about *YOU* but I certainly brew my tea by the A.I.
fuzzy logic algorithm string theory quantum pattern recognition
method, even my finest Red Rose! Sheesh, savages. I won't even *brew*
tea if it doesn't pass the Turing Test.
- Dominic
/honestly I couldn't even fathom brewing tea via some pattern
recognition method... I think it would become much less relaxing and
calming if I did. I deal with patterns constantly in my daily life, I
sure don't need more with my tea.
Lewis Perin
> On Aug 20, 11:13 am, Lewis Perin <pe...@panix.com> wrote:
> > "Twug Storn" <tytyt...@tytyttyty.com> writes:
> > > > http://scholar.ilib.cn/A-yyhx200604029.html
> >
> > > Uhh.. that's in some weird scratch-like language.
> >
> > I think the scratches come from your browser lacking East Asian
> > character support. But I think you can see from the English on that
> > page that the technical level is pretty high, which was my point.
> >
> > /Lew
> > ---
> > Lew Perin / pe...@acm.orghttp://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html
>
> Hey, I don't know about *YOU* but I certainly brew my tea by the A.I.
> fuzzy logic algorithm string theory quantum pattern recognition
> method, even my finest Red Rose! Sheesh, savages. I won't even *brew*
> tea if it doesn't pass the Turing Test.
Wow, you're pretty demanding when it comes to tea. I find myself
reading lots of Usenet posts that fail the TT. Not yours, I hasten to
add...
> - Dominic
>
> /honestly I couldn't even fathom brewing tea via some pattern
> recognition method... I think it would become much less relaxing and
> calming if I did. I deal with patterns constantly in my daily life, I
> sure don't need more with my tea.
I think they're talking about *manufacturing* tea, not brewing it.
Dominic T.
Ahh, I see the error of my ways... which is good because I just poured
a gaiwan of Huo Shan Huang Ya into my laptop to further analyze it and
it didn't respond well. :) Seriously though I now understand what they
mean and it's actually pretty cool. I don't know where my mind saw
brewing involved. The geek in me now wants to know more details.
- Dominic
/The cut of your jib, I like it sir
Twug Storn
> reading lots of Usenet posts that fail the TT. Not yours, I hasten to
> add...
Tell me about your lots of Usenet posts that fail the TT
Lewis Perin
I'm tempted to say that your response reminds me of Eliza:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ELIZA
But, honestly, I do think you're a human. When I wrote about Usenet
posts that failed the Turing test, I was actually thinking of spam.
/Lew
---
Lew Perin / pe...@acm.org
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html
recent addition: Mengban
Scott Dorsey
Maybe it is because of my mother.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Lewis Perin
> Twug Storn <tyty...@tytyttyty.com> wrote:
> >> Wow, you're pretty demanding when it comes to tea. I find myself
> >> reading lots of Usenet posts that fail the TT. Not yours, I hasten to
> >> add...
> >
> >Tell me about your lots of Usenet posts that fail the TT
>
>Maybe it is because of my mother.
Oh, right! And please forgive me, Twug - it didn't occur to me you
not only knew what Eliza was, you were channeling it^H^Hher.
Space Cowboy
Jim
Twug Storn
> not only knew what Eliza was, you were channeling it^H^Hher.
I must admit I'm amazed anyone picked up on my joke at all. Pretty good.
niisonge
You know, I actually download and read some of these studies from time
to time. If you're into tea cultivation, then yeah, it's useful to
know Chinese. But for ordinary tea drinkers, this kind of info isn't
really useful to tell you anything. There are all kinds of tea studies
like this going on all the time. And tea culture is evolving in China,
and I would hope, improving. Tea business practices and all that are
changing.
But reading studies on tea cultivation techniques isn't going to tell
you anything about the tea you're drinking now. Still, it is a very
deep field, and a very interesting one too.
Lewis Perin
I could be misreading you, but you seem to be saying that the way tea
is grown has nothing to do with what's in the cup. That's a very
strong statement, and not one I agree with.
(Or are you saying that when you buy tea leaves there's no way to know
how they were grown?)
niisonge
> is grown has nothing to do with what's in the cup.
>
> how they were grown?)
I'm saying the science of tea has little to do with how we enjoy tea.
Partly because we will never get to drink tea from experimental crop X
or experimental crop Y - unless we were to visit the tea research
center and taste it ourselves. And also because you can't taste the
science in tea - and you don't know whether experiment a or experiment
b was beneficial in producing the tea we drink today.
Of course, there's a lot of cool tea science going on right now - to
develop low-level fluoride strains of tea bushes or trees. And that's
actually good to help prevent tea-induced fluorosis - which is quite
common in Inner Mongolia and other regions.
And while the general result of tea science is to produce better tea -
that's mainly why we buy tea anyway - because it's good. But we don't
know whether it's because of some specific scientific variable or
intervention or whether it's a product of the environment - soils,
climate, etc; or how much it's due to the skill of the tea producers
in crafting their tea. And somehow, it seems in spite of science, some
really bad teas are the result. I have been to tea research stations -
trying to grow Anxi teas and Taiwan teas outside of the normal growing
range - but the result was always inferior product. Sometimes the
right environment is exactly what you need - the soils, climate, etc.
But on the other hand, yesterday, I was talking to some people and
they said Fuding is becoming quite the hotbed for new teas. They said
Fuding is now making a Longjing that is better than Xihu Longjing -
and they're even passing it off as authentic Xihu Longjing. But no
proof to back up that claim - though it seems believable. I should go
to Fuding sometime and check it out.
Lately, there has been a lot of rainy weather in Fujian, so this
year's Autumn Tieguanyin isn't very good. Nobody is happy.
Lewis Perin
> > I could be misreading you, but you seem to be saying that the way tea
> > is grown has nothing to do with what's in the cup.
> >
> > (Or are you saying that when you buy tea leaves there's no way to know
> > how they were grown?)
>
> I'm saying the science of tea has little to do with how we enjoy tea.
> Partly because we will never get to drink tea from experimental crop X
> or experimental crop Y - unless we were to visit the tea research
> center and taste it ourselves. And also because you can't taste the
> science in tea - and you don't know whether experiment a or experiment
> b was beneficial in producing the tea we drink today.
You're right: I don't know. But I'd like to know a lot more. Look,
science affects most aspects of our lives. The arguments you're
making apply equally well to medicine.
> Of course, there's a lot of cool tea science going on right now - to
> develop low-level fluoride strains of tea bushes or trees. And that's
> actually good to help prevent tea-induced fluorosis - which is quite
> common in Inner Mongolia and other regions.
>
> And while the general result of tea science is to produce better tea -
> that's mainly why we buy tea anyway - because it's good. But we don't
> know whether it's because of some specific scientific variable or
> intervention or whether it's a product of the environment - soils,
> climate, etc; or how much it's due to the skill of the tea producers
> in crafting their tea.
But that doesn't mean it's *impossible* to know. And I, for one,
would like to know.
> And somehow, it seems in spite of science, some really bad teas are
> the result. I have been to tea research stations - trying to grow
> Anxi teas and Taiwan teas outside of the normal growing range - but
> the result was always inferior product.
Right. I've been to a South Indian tea research institute where smart
and dedicated scientists try to do everything they can to increase the
yield in a way that's sustainable in terms of the land and the
workers. But quality isn't on their agenda.
> Sometimes the right environment is exactly what you need - the
> soils, climate, etc. But on the other hand, yesterday, I was
> talking to some people and they said Fuding is becoming quite the
> hotbed for new teas. They said Fuding is now making a Longjing that
> is better than Xihu Longjing - and they're even passing it off as
> authentic Xihu Longjing. But no proof to back up that claim - though
> it seems believable. I should go to Fuding sometime and check it
> out.
I'd love to hear what you find out.