Or is Darjeeling black tea supposed to be a mix of un-oxidized,
partially oxidized, and fully oxidized leaves? Or is it the climate in
Darjeeling that contributes to the a special colour of a fully
oxidized Darjeeling black tea?
When I was a kid, typical Darjeeling teas were fully oxidized, but over
the years they have become greener and greener to the point where I would
not call a typical Darjeeling an actual black tea. It's... well... it's
New Darjeeling style.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Jim
So all the green and partially oxidized leaves in Darjeeling black
teas are really not intentional... meaning that the mixed oxidation
leaves from what we are seeing in single-estate Darjeelings is from
bad quality control? That would be kinda sad indeed. I'm hoping for
sanity sake that it's more like what Scott said above in that this is
the "New Darjeeling style" for making "black tea".
> So all the green and partially oxidized leaves in Darjeeling black
> teas are really not intentional... meaning that the mixed oxidation
> leaves from what we are seeing in single-estate Darjeelings is from
> bad quality control? That would be kinda sad indeed. I'm hoping for
> sanity sake that it's more like what Scott said above in that this is
> the "New Darjeeling style" for making "black tea".
Sure, they're intentional. The market for high-end Darjeeling, which,
as Jim noted, is led by Japanese and German customers, *wants* those
green leaves in the mix with the darker ones. There's been a similar
trend over recent decades in Taiwanese and Chinese oolongs.
/Lew
---
Lew Perin / pe...@acm.org
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html
Ah,....very interesting. I just received a parcel of Darjeelings that
I ordered directly from India. The estate Darjeelings:Rohini, Goomtee,
Maikaibari, Hillton etc. are a finer quality leaf - bronzed, red and
green partially oxidized and quite tasty. Several of these, were,
indeed, called "oolongs". These were, for me, lacking what I would
call "a finish" and could not be infused more than three or four times
without becoming truly insipid.
In the same order, I purchased "gift packages". These are absolutely
lovely little brocade bags, zippered with tiny bells, that are often
"taken with" for travel in India. The Darjeelings in these bags was
much more like my childhood Darjeeling tea - darker, not very complex
and can be infused several times (because of the stronger
oxidation ?). Although, very wrapped in very pretty packaging, the tea
was more one-dimensional and not marked to any particular estate.
Just my opinion.
Shen
Hmm... that would mean that calling most of the Darjeelings we consume
"black tea" is a misnomer. Maybe, one should consider it to be more of
an "estate blend" or an oolong then. To me, the latte sorta makes
sense, since the Darjeeling oolongs that I've tried really reminded me
much of their black teas, as well as vice-versa.
>> > So all the green and partially oxidized leaves in Darjeeling black
>> > teas are really not intentional... meaning that the mixed oxidation
>> > leaves from what we are seeing in single-estate Darjeelings is from
>> > bad quality control? That would be kinda sad indeed. I'm hoping for
>> > sanity sake that it's more like what Scott said above in that this
>> > is the "New Darjeeling style" for making "black tea".
>> Sure, they're intentional. The market for high-end Darjeeling,
>> which, as Jim noted, is led by Japanese and German customers, *wants*
>> those green leaves in the mix with the darker ones. There's been a
>> similar trend over recent decades in Taiwanese and Chinese oolongs.
> Hmm... that would mean that calling most of the Darjeelings we consume
> "black tea" is a misnomer. Maybe, one should consider it to be more of
> an "estate blend" or an oolong then.
I had never really tried a Darjeeling, so when I was at Chado tearoom
recently, I got a Castleton (sp?) first flush to try (I just asked the
guy there to recommend something, and he suggested that one, after I
said that I didn't drink my tea w/ milk or sugar).
I believe they have it classified as a black tea. To me, it seems very
delicate, with similarities to Bai Hao ("Oriental Beauty"), and even
some white teas I've tried. The leaves / buds are small, and they don't
seem completely oxidized to me.
w
In my words : In Darjeeling - The master tea maker called the Factory
Babu - becomes the one who performs the miracle of Darjeeling Tea, he
ensures that every roll - imparts an aroma with its own personality.
The slow, natural forces of dying, is - accelerated by heat, light and
humidity, and at a critical time of climax - this fusion is arrested.
The process is a mystery, the quality is the manifestation of the
magic.
Playing with fermentation has always been the key factor in Darjeeling
teas. No one till date has been able to determine - the time or
percentage - something that only comes with experience - for that you
need to stand and make tea for several years.
So ......... Darjeeling tea is a mystery...............
Please remember that this is a TEA group, with or without milk.
Of course it is. "Latter" was what I meant, " "latte" was typo on my
part. If you reread the post, you'll see it makes more sense :)
Hi and sorry,
I'd like some help in interpretation. The locals, presumably of India,
don't like their black tea green, so the Germans don't either, and the
green stuff goes the West, which excludes Germany?
For the record, I in Germany noticed a trend towards a more colorful
Darjeeling, too, but that may be due more to my purely biographical
changing my sources than to a trend in general. On the other hand,
what Indians seem to miss in Germany so they have it shipped from
their families is CTC tea for their chai.
klaus
To me, personally, Darjeeling means too delicate, light, or, well,
weak for a morning tea. After that, I don't care whether it's called
black, green, or something else. I think there are thousands of
people out there who are happy to take my share of Darjeeling, and
leave me to my Ceylons, Nilgiris, and Assams. Toci
I've ordered a cup or pot of Darjeeling a few times in Germany. Each
time, it was pretty close to the green end of the scale.
/Lew
---
Lew Perin / pe...@acm.org
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html
My understanding of the Darjeeling mystery:
Darjeeling is traditionally a black tea. Due to this tradition it
remains a black tea, but thanks to the trends that Scott mentioned up
top towards a 'new darjeeling', a variety of teas made from the CS in
that region, which are technically green or oolong, are uniformly
called darjeeling. Thanks to this, depending on how focused your local
tea seller is on breadth of darjeeling, we are blessed to be able to
find a full spectrum of very green to black first flush teas. From the
second flush on, the trend seems to be to follow with stronger
oxidations. Many American sellers, depending on taste of course, tend
to choose a greener first flush to show off the marked difference
between it and the follow harvests. Of course their European (more UK
than anywhere else) counterparts tend to prefer the darker, more
wholesome first flush.
Shen's mention of an "insipid" quality after a few steeps could either
be due to the infusing of the tea with boiling water, which is great
if you have one of the more traditional black darjeelings, but can
adversely affect the greener modern varieties, or of course it may
just not be good tea? I would love to hear if you try out other
temperatures Shen.
I have tried a few of the first flush darjeelings for the season, does
anyone have any thoughts on those they have tried? I have enjoyed the
lemon grass aromas and the sweet citrus mouth of the second and third
infusions in the greener styles, any thoughts?
AMA
I just want to say that I have just recently tried the Rohini Enigma,
and it's not exactly like the darjeeling I drank as a kid, but it seems
like a much higher grade version of that. Very open and flowery, with
an incredibly strong fruit and floral flavour when you first sip it,
which decays down into a tannic tea aftertaste but without the grass clipping
sort of flavour that I am accustomed to with modern Darjeelings. Highly
recommended.
I will second that opinion. Many of the Darjeelings I have tasted
recently are more reminiscent of oolongs than of red teas. I have been
very impressed by some of the Rohini estate teas of late. There is one
that I nicknamed "Juicy Fruit" because it is so lively. Another very
interesting darjeeling is called "Silver Thunder" which I "think" is
processed more like a white tea.
Now you went and got me in the mood for some, will have to brew it up
after work tonight.
Dear friends,
Ankit Lochan has posted an observation which indeed is from up close!
However, let me try to Demystify the Green in Darjeeling Black.
Traditionally, Darjeeling Planters pluck very fine. And then these
tender shoots, which as it is comes from the tiny chinary varieties,
are subjected to high degree of Withering. Withered Leaf : Made Tea
ratio of 60 % is not uncommon.
What happens due to such high degree of wither is that the shoots have
just sufficient amount of juice concentrates in them to ooze out and
cover itself when rolled under pressure.
Now comes the cach ; when the average recovery is 60 %, it is but
natural that there would be some shoots which have virtually dried up
during withering. These shoots are the ones which do get cell damage
and subsequent Oxidation, but lack the juices to cover themselves
with.
And hence, they remain Green inspite of being Black!
Any comments?
Regards,
Jayesh pandya.
Jim
PS It looks like to me a great Darjeeling would have to fall in your
lap more than what is available in the market place.
> PS It looks like to me a great Darjeeling would have to fall in your
> lap more than what is available in the market place.
This is definitely true in my case. I have some friends, with direct
estate connections, who have hooked me up some "pride of the estate"
lots. A marked difference from the average online fare. I have one
friend in particular who has started retailing these truly exclusive
lots, often only a kg or two is made available but they are truly
spectacular as far as the genre goes. One particularly noteworthy one
(Red Thunder I think) was bought entirely by TTG in NYC. So they are
around, just not plentiful.
--
Mike
http://www.pu-erh.net
Quote from rfdt Archives:
Yes Jon, these teas are indeed less fermented "greenish blacks".
There
are several ways to make a "green" tea (which is essentially a tea
without oxidation) or a "greenish tea" which is a tea with minimal
oxidation. In a tea factory some of these are purposeful methods,
others the results of poor processing.
The main causes are:
1. Inactivate oxidising enzymes before rolling using steam (Japanese
method)= green tea
2. Inactivate oxidising enzymes using dry heat (Chinese panning or
roasting method) = green tea
3. Avoid initiating oxidation by very gentle handling and drying =
white tea (a variant of green).
4. Oxidise for a very short time (minimal rolling, or CTC cutting) -
dry as soon as short rolling or CTC cutting is complete =
insufficient
time for full oxidation to black = anything from a green to a
greenish
black tea.
5. Oxidise at low temperature - this slows down enzyme action =
partial oxidation only = greenish black.
6. Hard wither (to a very low leaf moisture content) - this inhibits
enzyme action = partial oxidation only = greenish black
7. Insufficient oxygen present during oxidation (fermenting layers
too
thick) = partial oxidation only = anything from green to greenish
black
The partially oxidised oolongs fall into group 4. above though they
have other processing inputs (sun withering and leaf agitation and
high firing) that give their unique character.
The "greenish blacks" you find at high elevations in Sri Lanka and
Darjeeling are the result of partial oxidation due to very hard
withers and cool ambient temperature. It is perfectly possible to
make
a fully oxidised (black) Uva or Darjeeling, and in fact during the
rains in Darjeeling when a hard wither cannot be achieved, this is
exactly what happens (but these are not exported). Similarly we had
to heat up fermenter air to 90 deg F in early spring in Turkey as the
cool weather gave us a greenish tea - not at all what the Turks like
to drink.
The type of tea and degree of oxidation required is driven by the
market (or the producer's perception of the market). As increasingly
Darjeelings and flavoury high grown Ceylons are bought by non-milked
tea markets, so the dark srong liquors required in the English market
have given way to lighter ones, and the dry leaf shows green colour
rather than jet black . Producers could revert if the market
required
- the process is flexible and a skilled manager can alter his teas at
will. My point (in my previous posting) was to remind tea lovers that
a
tea's characteristics may change with time even if the names stay the
same.
Unquote
Nigel at Teacraft
On May 31, 12:48 pm, teapandya <teapan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Ankit Lochan has posted an observation which indeed is from up close!
> However, let me try to Demystify the Green in Darjeeling Black.
> Traditionally, Darjeeling Planters pluck very fine. And then these
> tender shoots, which as it is comes from the tiny chinary varieties,
> are subjected to high degree of Withering. Withered Leaf : Made Tea
> ratio of 60 % is not uncommon.
> What happens due to such high degree of wither is that the shoots have
> just sufficient amount of juice concentrates in them to ooze out and
> cover itself when rolled under pressure.
> Now comes the cach ; when the average recovery is 60 %, it is but
> natural that there would be some shoots which have virtually dried up
> during withering. These shoots are the ones which do get cell damage
> and subsequent Oxidation, but lack the juices to cover themselves
> with.
> And hence, they remain Green inspite of being Black!
>
> Any comments?
>
> Regards,
> Jayesh pandya.- Hide quoted text -