OT: Saddest day

[Bruce]

What was the saddest day in the history of the US?

-9/11?
-The day America saw Janet Jackson's nipple?
-The day JFK was killed?
-Pearl Harbor?

No, according to D. Trump, the saddest day in the history of the US
was the day that D. Trump was arrested.

My condolences to the American people.

[dsi1]

My guess it was the attack on Pearl Harbor, but I might be a little biased.

[Bruce]

The US is a very warfaring country, but they're always extremely
surprised when someone hits THEM.

[dsi1]

Hawaii is a unique location, rich in the history of WWII. It embodies the beginning and end of American involvement in the war i.e., Pearl Harbor and the present home of the USS Battleship Missouri, on whose deck, the surrender of Japan was signed. The Missouri now serves as a memorial/museum.
Driving home today, we passed by the stairway leading up to the top of the crater wall that towers over the people of the Windward side of the island. It was built as part of a long distance radio station used for communication all over the Pacific. It's quite a dramatic stairway seemingly going straight up the side of a crater wall at some points. It's a remarkable feat of engineering and was constructed in secret. The state of Hawaii wants to demolish the site but it's pretty much a vital spot in the story of the War in the Pacific.

https://www.haikustairs.org/constructing-the-stairs

[Cindy Hamilton]

Stuff like that doesn't make me sad; it makes me angry.

I might go for August 6, 1945. It didn't happen directly to us, but
it represented a sea change in geopolitics that was caused by us.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[f...@sdf.org]

I'll have to say it was the Trail of Tears. White Supremacists gonna'
White Supremacy and all that. This Country has always sucked.

--
SDF Public Access UNIX System - https://sdf.org

That which does not kill you makes you stranger.
-- Trevor Goodchild - AEon Flux

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-06-14, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> No, according to D. Trump, the saddest day in the history of the US
> was the day that D. Trump was arrested.

He's a barker at a carnival freak show and his ardent supporters are
the freaks. It's just entertainment, mon.

[Bruce]

On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 11:22:00 GMT, f...@sdf.org wrote:

>On 2023-06-14, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> No, according to D. Trump, the saddest day in the history of the US
>> was the day that D. Trump was arrested.
>
>He's a barker at a carnival freak show and his ardent supporters are
>the freaks. It's just entertainment, mon.

Yes, he's very entertaining. It's just hard to believe so many people
don't see through him.

[lucr...@florence.it]

On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 21:40:09 +1000, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

I think it is a tragedy that some people unfailingly believe in him,
sign of bad times ahead I think. Basically a rerun of the 1930s.

[Bruce]

I think it's like a cult. The leader of a cult can never do anything
wrong either. There's no logic or reason, there's just belief.

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-06-14, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 11:22:00 GMT, f...@sdf.org wrote:

>>On 2023-06-14, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid> wrote:

>>> No, according to D. Trump, the saddest day in the history of the US
>>> was the day that D. Trump was arrested.

>>He's a barker at a carnival freak show and his ardent supporters are
>>the freaks. It's just entertainment, mon.

> Yes, he's very entertaining. It's just hard to believe so many people
> don't see through him.

I have family, friends, and coworkers who have gaslighted themselves
into believing anything that makes them feel good. It is impossible to
reason with them about Trump, all they can do is parrot talking points
and propaganda they see on social media. I just laugh at them until they
get frustrated and change the subject.

The worst offenders are my own bigoted parents. My entire life they've
always had someone to hate. Right now its LGBTQIA+ people, my parents
act as if they're out to destroy society when all they (LGBTQIA+) want
is to not be discriminated against. My response is if you don't like
LGBTQIA+, don't be one. "But the Bible sez....". Pah what the Bible
says, this is supposed to be a free society where people can choose how
to live themselves. "So you're saying people should be free to commit
murder?" For fucks sake, mon, that's a totally retarded thing to say
and it's from my own parents. All I can do is laugh at them at that
point and never ever make the mistake of telling them my second oldest
granddaughter is a lesbian.

[S Viemeister]

It's really frightening.

[songbird]

f...@sdf.org wrote:
...

> The worst offenders are my own bigoted parents.

i'm glad Mom is not as extreme as Dad, but either way
i just think it is a part of the older generation to be
more conservative about things that are different.

i was raised to take people based upon how they treated
me. somehow this got in despite what my parents said or
did.

others in my relatives are also that way and i do wish
they'd grow up.

Trump the conman and thug can never admit the truth
because then he couldn't fund his cons any more. it is
very sad though that so many supposedly decent people
have been hoodwinked by his buffoonery.


songbird

[Dave Smith]

On 2023-06-14 8:01 a.m., lucr...@florence.it wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 21:40:09 +1000, Bruce <Br...@invalid.invalid>

>> Yes, he's very entertaining. It's just hard to believe so many people
>> don't see through him.
>
> I think it is a tragedy that some people unfailingly believe in him,
> sign of bad times ahead I think. Basically a rerun of the 1930s.

What is really sad is the polarization of politics, especially in the US.

[lucr...@florence.it]

You have my sincere sympathies, a woman in my condo building is just
like that and when I went down to get my car this a.m. I was thinking
"I hope I don't run into Betty today" because I knew with all the news
she would be cranked up again :(

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-06-14, songbird <song...@anthive.com> wrote:
> f...@sdf.org wrote:
> ...
>> The worst offenders are my own bigoted parents.

> i'm glad Mom is not as extreme as Dad, but either way
> i just think it is a part of the older generation to be
> more conservative about things that are different.

Mine have always been bigoted racists as far back as I can remember. I
have always passed it off as they grew up in the Jim Crow Law era not in
the South but in an area where segregation policies were the norm. But
it is getting worse they older they get.

I've never in my life "seen" race, color or nationality. People are
people, we are all the same, nobody anywhere is superior to anyone.

[f...@sdf.org]

I know the feeling. They're 45 minutes from me. Sometimes I cringe with
dread the whole way there. :/

[dsi1]

It's what happens with people feel that their future is bleak and their options are limited. They feel threatened in their own country and their mood is a dark and angry one. Once again, they'll look to a father figure to lead them out of the wilderness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xxgRUyzgs0

[Bruce]

Yes, but is half the country doing that poorly?

[dsi1]

This is just my theory about the state of the union. I know a couple of Trump supporters. These guys are not dumb. They're owners of their own businesses and I respect them highly. I can understand where they're coming from. They believe that Trump will work for their benefit. They may be right.
OTOH, the regular Joe on the street won't get shit from Trump. Mostly, he'll leverage his cult status to pull more money out of their pockets. Is a rich guy soliciting money from his followers so he can pay his loan debts more honorable that people coming to your door asking for money to support their church? Well, duh!

[Bruce]

On Wed, 14 Jun 2023 12:18:14 -0700 (PDT), dsi1

He's only in it for himself, not for anybody else. Even if I
politically agreed with Trump, I still wouldn't vote for him. He's
such a scummy person. I'd vote for another rightwinger.

[Bering Sea Bar & Brig@MarthaStewart.GoodThing]

Someone dumped an "Obstruction" on a suburban train line last Sunday. The schedule was messed up and commuter departures cancelled. Oh and the I-95 bridge fire.

[Hank Rogers]

That I-95 bridge disaster makes me sad. Particularly for all
the jewish new yorkers traveling to florida and back.

That bridge would still be fine, if our rightful president was
still on the throne.

We need a constitutional amendment switching us to a monarchy,
or at least a dictatorship.

Biden done all this shit deliberately, cause he's jealous of
donald's success.

[dsi1]

My guess is that people would die for that guy. Some people would die for Jesus. Same ting.

https://www.politico.com/news/2023/06/14/trump-2-million-arraignment-fundraiser-00101931

[Hank Rogers]

I wouldn't, uncle, but I would gladly die for uncle Hirohito.
But no need, since he got off SCOT FREE, and remained emperor.

He sold lots of shitty hearing aides, but was the finest Jap on
da planet.

I would NOT follow jesus. He was not asian, and not even
christian. And he hated hiwayans. He even visited da rock and
tortured da poor hiwayans.

[dsi1]

Get some professional help gm.

[Gary]

I would never visit my parents (or anyone else) if I cringed with dread
the whole way there. WTH?

[songbird]

Gary wrote:
...

> I would never visit my parents (or anyone else) if I cringed with dread
> the whole way there. WTH?

it's sad when you love someone and they're really
broken.


songbird

[lucr...@florence.it]

On Thu, 15 Jun 2023 08:38:03 -0400, songbird <song...@anthive.com>
wrote:

'
Indeed and it's a rare case that you can fix it :(

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-06-15, Gary <g.ma...@att.net> wrote:
> On 6/14/2023 12:54 PM, f...@sdf.org wrote:
>> On 2023-06-14, lucr...@florence.it <lucr...@florence.it> wrote:

[...]

>>> You have my sincere sympathies, a woman in my condo building is just
>>> like that and when I went down to get my car this a.m. I was thinking
>>> "I hope I don't run into Betty today" because I knew with all the news
>>> she would be cranked up again :(

>> I know the feeling. They're 45 minutes from me. Sometimes I cringe with
>> dread the whole way there. :/

> I would never visit my parents (or anyone else) if I cringed with dread
> the whole way there. WTH?

I said *sometimes*. Last half dozen or so visits have been great. It
won't last though, the dreaded cringe will return. They're my parents,
I'd be an effin' monster if I ignored them. They're in their mid to late
80s and celebrating their 66th wedding anniversary today. Through hell
or high water if necessary they deserve a visit this weekend.

[Michael Trew]

On 6/14/2023 8:17 AM, f...@sdf.org wrote:
>
> The worst offenders are my own bigoted parents. My entire life they've
> always had someone to hate. Right now its LGBTQIA+ people, my parents
> act as if they're out to destroy society when all they (LGBTQIA+) want
> is to not be discriminated against. My response is if you don't like
> LGBTQIA+, don't be one. "But the Bible sez....". Pah what the Bible
> says, this is supposed to be a free society where people can choose how
> to live themselves.

"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone", is the only thing you
need to say to them. I see no need to call out the alphabet crowd,
because I'm sure not perfect; no one is. Live and let live.

[Michael Trew]

Except extenuating circumstances, it's never good to cut family off.
They are the only family you have. You don't visit your mother anyway,
Gary, so why does it matter?

[Dave Smith]

Unfortunately, Alphabet has became an appropriate term for them because
they keep adding them. Dave Chappelle has a good way of dealing with it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHpnc0oDauc&ab_channel=LifeisaJoke

[Cindy Hamilton]

On 2023-06-16, Michael Trew <michae...@att.net> wrote:
> On 6/15/2023 8:12 AM, Gary wrote:
>> On 6/14/2023 12:54 PM, f...@sdf.org wrote:
>>>
>>> I know the feeling. They're 45 minutes from me. Sometimes I cringe with
>>> dread the whole way there. :/
>>
>> I would never visit my parents (or anyone else) if I cringed with dread
>> the whole way there. WTH?
>
> Except extenuating circumstances, it's never good to cut family off.

Why?

> They are the only family you have.

So what? I don't have anything in common with those people except
an accident of genetics. I've never met my first cousin. I've got
four second cousins. One's a neo-Nazi. The other three are worthless
wastes of air.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[Bruce]

Also: it's not a sin to be gay, unless you're mentally still in the
Middle Ages.

[Michael Trew]

I keep distant contact with first cousins, and I think I've only met a
second cousin. I'm speaking more of direct family; siblings and
parents. If a truly toxic relationship, that's one thing. Elderly
parents who might be mentally slipping is another. Except in cases of
abuse, chances are that said parents spent a lot of their lives raising
and caring for you.

[Mike Duffy]

On 2023-06-18, Michael Trew wrote:

> I keep distant contact with first cousins, and

I am aware of the nomenclature for ordinally numerated
cousins cardinally removed. I am also cognizant of the
term 'double cousin'.

But what our language lacks are concise descriptions that
embody all that, as well as what we call 'half' siblings,
and the situation where a woman has children via both a
man and with his son from a prior marriage.

[Bruce]

That reminds me of a song by Ray Stevens from East Liverpool:
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYlJH81dSiw>

[dsi1]

I spent a lot of time with my cousins. My mom and her sisters would go to their mom's house every Sunday. There was a lot of sisters! Since my mom died, that link has been broken. We have three granddaughters and I hope my kids and their kids remain close for as long as possible. It's a lot easier to do if you all live on a rock in the middle of nowhere.
My wife is still angry at her aunties because of the awful way they treated her Korean mom. She had to isolate herself from them to be able to live free. If you look at pictures of my wife's aunts and cousins, they look like the typical American family. The reality is that a lot of her cousins have died from cancer, alcoholism, drugs, and suicide. It's an American tragedy.

[Cindy Hamilton]

My husband hasn't seen his brothers since 2016, when his father died.
He just doesn't have anything in common with them.

We used to visit his father once or twice a year. Not exactly cut
off, but as distant a relationship as you can imagine.

I see my mother 1-3 times a month. When her health was good, I
saw her 1-3 times a year. She's deaf and a little dotty now, and
it's sad spending time with her. I make myself do it anyway. That's
what duty is.

--
Cindy Hamilton

[songbird]

dsi1 wrote:
...

> I spent a lot of time with my cousins. My mom and her sisters would go to their mom's house every Sunday. There was a lot of sisters! Since my mom died, that link has been broken. We have three granddaughters and I hope my kids and their kids remain close for as long as possible. It's a lot easier to do if you all live on a rock in the middle of nowhere.
> My wife is still angry at her aunties because of the awful way they treated her Korean mom. She had to isolate herself from them to be able to live free. If you look at pictures of my wife's aunts and cousins, they look like the typical American family. The reality is that a lot of her cousins have died from cancer, alcoholism, drugs, and suicide. It's an American tragedy.

if true, it's sad, broken families can be trouble for
the kids and grandkids, but for me it forced me to be
independent in a lot of ways. thanks to Mom i was raised
well and know how to take care of myself. despite both
parents i was raised to take each person as decent until
shown otherwise - this has caused me problems at times
but no matter what i'm ok with how it has gone and i've
made some good friends quickly.


songbird

[Michael Trew]

On 6/17/2023 10:13 PM, Bruce wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Jun 2023 01:34:03 GMT, Mike Duffy<mxd...@bell.net> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-06-18, Michael Trew wrote:
>>
>>> I keep distant contact with first cousins, and
>>
>> I am aware of the nomenclature for ordinally numerated
>> cousins cardinally removed. I am also cognizant of the
>> term 'double cousin'.
>>
>> But what our language lacks are concise descriptions that
>> embody all that, as well as what we call 'half' siblings,
>> and the situation where a woman has children via both a
>> man and with his son from a prior marriage.

Is the latter a common enough scenario to justify a phrase?

> That reminds me of a song by Ray Stevens from East Liverpool:
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eYlJH81dSiw>

Haha, very funny. The original version by Lonzo and Oscar is better. I
first hear it on a "Grand Ole Opry" classics album years ago.

[Bruce]

I didn't know there was a more original version:
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3CvRC4fAmk>

My wife says they sound like they inhaled helium.

[Michael Trew]

Maybe a little bit. I dunno, you have to like classic country music.

[f...@sdf.org]

On 2023-06-16, Michael Trew <michae...@att.net> wrote:

One should always be mindful of the pardox of tolerance.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance