Cornbread - MSN: "Veteran went from homelessness to sweet success"

[leno...@yahoo.com]

Amusing! It all started with a cooking mistake.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/good-news/how-1-veteran-went-from-homelessness-to-sweet-success-after-making-a-delicious-mistake/ar-BBUn0Vr?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout



Lenona.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Nice story. Good to hear of someone's success like that.

[graham]

On 2019-03-05 9:05 a.m., leno...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Amusing! It all started with a cooking mistake.
>
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/good-news/how-1-veteran-went-from-homelessness-to-sweet-success-after-making-a-delicious-mistake/ar-BBUn0Vr?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout
>
>

How come he was homeless after retiring form the Coast Guard. Don't they
get pensions?

[dsi1]

Anybody could become homeless but my guess is that most people become homeless because of mental illness and/or drug addiction.

[Dave Smith]

From what I could find out, the full pension is 50% of their pay, but
they have to have 20 years service. It seems that anyone who has spent
any amount of time in the military gets to be called a veteran. This
guy was apparently in the CG and then, while volunteering, someone hired
him and he started as a dishwasher. One might expect anyone who had a
career in the CG would have had a trade of some sort. While working in
the restaurant he screwed up one of their trademark dished and there was
some serendipitous results.

[Julie Bove]

"graham" <g.st...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:q5mojl$u3v$1...@dont-email.me...

No. They get retirement if they buy enough years in. It's not enough to live
on though. Lots of homeless veterans here.

[Julie Bove]

"Dave Smith" <adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:GMCfE.2$np...@fx05.iad...

A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
starting over again at the bottom.

[GM]

A good number have extensive felony records, which precludes them from most jobs and most any type of normal housing...and of course this intertwines with mental illness and addiction, amongst other factors. Some lack work skills or even basic ambition, it is easier to depend on handouts - and believe it or not, a number actually *prefer* to live in homelessness, no responsibilites, no worries. Also, many diagnosed with mental illness abhor treatment/medication :-|

Also, the cost of housing in major metro areas has skyrocketed upwards, many simply cannot afford to rent an abode.

It is a complex issue, but these are some things contributing...you being in Hawaii encounter this every day, now in US cities or places with pleasant climes there are homeless everywhere, it has become endemic.

--
Best
Greg

[dsi1]

My wife has told me that there's a colony of vets living in the hills of Honolulu. Getting them back into the fold would be wonderful but they consider themselves no longer fit to live in society. There are some people that were homeless simply because they couldn't afford housing. Those are the easiest people to get on their feet.

[itsjoan...@webtv.net]

On Tuesday, March 5, 2019 at 6:05:10 PM UTC-6, Julie Bove wrote:
>
> A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
> specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
> starting over again at the bottom.
>

Thank you, Captain Obvious.

[Janet]

> On Tuesday, March 5, 2019 at 6:05:10 PM UTC-6, Julie Bove wrote:

> A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
> specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
> starting over again at the bottom.

Anyone with half a brain should have acquired from military life, some
transferable work skills which are very marketable in other fields in
civilian life; such as analysis and problem solving, resilience,
management, leadership, teamwork; at the very least, personal
presentation and attention to detail.


Janet UK

[penm...@aol.com]

In my experience most military jobs have a civilian counterpart,
however unfortunately most of those jobs don't pay well.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Some long term military do not adapt well to a different life though.
They are used to rules, specific orders, and often do not have to think
for themselves and make decisions.

I've hired a few ex-military with mixed results. One of the best was
actually kicked out of the Air Force because he was capable of thinking
and did not need a manual to do everything. Misfit there, but a leader
here.

[penm...@aol.com]

Behavoral issues is a whole nother topic... I've found that those who
haven't served have far more behavoral issues.

[Ed Pawlowski]

That is a different story. I think the country would have better
citizens if they brought back the draft. The military fixed a lot of
wayward teenagers.

[jmcquown]

My father was a career U.S. Marine. After he retired he got a job as
Director of Security at Rhodes College in Memphis for about 15 years.
They were looking for someone to maintain and direct a security staff
for the campus, deal with issues reported from the dorms and any other
sort of disturbance on campus. Call local police when required. His
background certainly qualified him for a job outside of military.

He was on call 24/7 and there was only one phone in the house. In the
kitchen. A wall mounted dial telephone. LOL I was a teenager so I was
once on the phone with a girlfriend in the middle of the night when the
operator cut in with an emergency call. Trying to reach my father. Uh,
okay. I'll go get him. It was about 2:00 in the morning and I had to
pretend the phone woke me up. I wasn't supposed to be talking on the
phone at 2AM. LOL

At any rate, that's what he did after he retired from the Marine Corps.
Took the skills he'd learned and put them to use in a second time around.

Jill

[Dave Smith]

Exactly. The military can be a great place to learn skills that will
help you in life. There are all sorts of opportunities to learn trades.
Then again, there are a lot of people who end up in the military because
they have no other prospects.

[jmcquown]

The Draft is still in affect, Ed. Men aged 18 are required to register.
They just haven't been "called up" using what we know of as the Draft.
Lottery numbers. Most of the the people serving right now are voluntary.

There's a move for a change in the Draft regulations to include Women
since women have been allowed to and have been serving in combat
situations. It's only fair they should also be part of the Draft. IMHO.

Jill

[jmcquown]

I remember when I was a teenager (1970's) some young guys I went to
school with got into minor scuffles with the law. They were given a
choice by the judge: jail or join the Navy. Most of them chose the
Navy. Not exactly the types you'd want defending the country. It was
what it was.

Jill

[tert in seattle]

j_mc...@comcast.net writes:
>On 3/6/2019 12:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2019-03-06 10:42 a.m., Janet wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2019 at 6:05:10 PM UTC-6, Julie Bove wrote:
>>>

>>> A > A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
>>> A > specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
>>> A > starting over again at the bottom.
>>>
>>> A A Anyone with half a brain should have acquired from military life, some

>>> transferable work skills which are very marketable in other fields in
>>> civilian life; such as analysis and problem solving, resilience,
>>> management, leadership, teamwork; at the very least, personal
>>> presentation and attention to detail.
>>
>> Exactly. The military can be a great place to learn skills that will

>> help you in life.A There are all sorts of opportunities to learn trades.

>> Then again, there are a lot of people who end up in the military because
>> they have no other prospects.
>
>I remember when I was a teenager (1970's) some young guys I went to
>school with got into minor scuffles with the law. They were given a
>choice by the judge: jail or join the Navy. Most of them chose the
>Navy. Not exactly the types you'd want defending the country. It was
>what it was.
>
>Jill

it happened during the Iraq War, too

<http://archive.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/07/13/more_entering_army_with_criminal_records/>


"Army officials acknowledge privately that the increase in moral waivers
reflects the difficulty of signing up sufficient numbers of recruits to
sustain an increasingly unpopular war in Iraq; the Army fell short of
its monthly recruiting goals in May and June."

[jmcquown]

I don't have any problem believing it happened in every war throughout
the ages. Got a choice: join our side or go to jail. We'll whip your
butts in line but the alternative might be worse.

Jill

[Bruce]

Yeah, let's teach all our teenagers to use weapons and kill. That will
fix them!

[Bruce]

On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 14:55:01 -0500, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

Yeah, who knows what happens to their butts in jail.

[Ed Pawlowski]

They do learn that. They also learn to have respect for authority,
follow orders, understand the importance of being responsible for your
actions. They get to know there are consequences for the wrong actions.

Are you suggesting we need no military? Would be nice, but I don't see
world peace any time soon.

[Bruce]

The military is necessary, but that old-skool view that the army makes
real, responsible men of teenagers is wrong. Many of them become
gungho mental patients with PTSD. And they know how to use a gun.
Yoohoo, party time!

[Julie Bove]

"Janet" <Ja...@somewhere.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.36e9fab75...@news.individual.net...

Most people have those things. Doesn't mean it will get you a job!

[Julie Bove]

<penm...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:l7rv7ehi4f02esdr5...@4ax.com...

True. And people that do certain jobs on ships, pretty much only know ship
things.

[Leonard Blaisdell]

In article <ugUfE.7497$1Q7....@fx46.iad>, jmcquown

<j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote:

> I remember when I was a teenager (1970's) some young guys I went to
> school with got into minor scuffles with the law. They were given a
> choice by the judge: jail or join the Navy. Most of them chose the
> Navy. Not exactly the types you'd want defending the country. It was
> what it was.

My dad was the District Attorney of our county the entire time I was
growing up. Troubled teens were given the military choice or jail.
Depending upon the offense, some troublemakers were told to hit the
road for good or go to jail. If you got a underaged girl pregnant, you
married her right now or went to jail. The rules were simple.
As draconian and obsolete as that sounds, Nevada had one prison. Now
prisons are a industry in small towns all around our state. I know that
we're not alone in that.
So...are we moving forward?

leo

[Julie Bove]

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.xxx> wrote in message
news:F4TfE.234$qm5...@fx01.iad...

> On 3/6/2019 11:55 AM, penm...@aol.com wrote:
>> On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 15:42:19 -0000, Janet <Ja...@somewhere.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2019 at 6:05:10 PM UTC-6, Julie Bove wrote:
>>>
>>>> A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
>>>> specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
>>>> starting over again at the bottom.
>>>
>>> Anyone with half a brain should have acquired from military life, some
>>> transferable work skills which are very marketable in other fields in
>>> civilian life; such as analysis and problem solving, resilience,
>>> management, leadership, teamwork; at the very least, personal
>>> presentation and attention to detail.
>>
>> In my experience most military jobs have a civilian counterpart,
>> however unfortunately most of those jobs don't pay well.
>>
> Some long term military do not adapt well to a different life though. They
> are used to rules, specific orders, and often do not have to think for
> themselves and make decisions.

Yes. I know some who were high up in the military and thought they could
waltz into any job and tell people what to do. Most people in civilian jobs
go into the job knowing what to do. They may need a day or three to
familiarize themselves with people, departments, equipment, etc. But beyond
that, they just do their job.

>
> I've hired a few ex-military with mixed results. One of the best was
> actually kicked out of the Air Force because he was capable of thinking
> and did not need a manual to do everything. Misfit there, but a leader
> here.

I had some young military guys that I worked with. Either active duty and
looking for extra money or in the reserves and needed a flexible schedule to
accommodate that. Low paying jobs but excellent workers.

One of my worst employees was an older man retired from the navy. I actually
was his boss. He didn't like me telling him what to do but I needed to tell
him as he just did what he wanted instead of what needed to be done. All he
cared about was making some extra money to play golf.

I wound up taking up golf. I began leaving him notes (we did not work the
same shift) of what needed to be done and adding little snippets of golf
related things in the notes. All of a sudden, he began doing his work like
he should! I found it slightly annoying to have to resort to that but it did
work. Lots of silly things went on in the military in those days. Time
wasting things, IMO. I believe a lot of that has been done away with or they
are now doing it on the sly.

[Julie Bove]

"Bruce" <br...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message
news:ts908elaep3stm598...@4ax.com...

I am not for the draft but would be for something that allowed a choice of a
non-violent, civil service type job.

[Bruce]

Yes, then the gung ho types can go to the army and the civilised types
can do something civilised.

[Bruce]

You've served (or cooked, I should say) and you're very badly behaved.

[Julie Bove]

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.xxx> wrote in message

news:4aWfE.3723$sw5...@fx21.iad...

I don't think being forced into it is the way to go. Had a BF (much older
than me) many years ago who was in combat in Vietnam. Not by choice. It
caused him to be almost totally deaf and he had PTSD that could be severe at
times. Did not seem to have worked for him.

More recently was involve with a guy who is retired from the Army. He went
in willingly, perhaps only because he lives in a somewhat isolated area and
there weren't; many available jobs. He served in Saudi and told me that he
witnessed so many horrible things. He too has PTSD and has been in and out
of therapy for some time.

I don't think the military is for everyone.

[Julie Bove]

"Bruce" <br...@invalid.invalid> wrote in message

news:h5e08e17g4n7nshjm...@4ax.com...

I couldn't agree more.

[penm...@aol.com]

Everyone, male and female, even handicapped, should have to serve, at
least two years... bootcamp will straighten out waywardness.... and
there are plenty of desk jobs for the handicapped. I meet more and
more people who never learned responsibility and respect. My wife
works part time as a substitute teacher (12 years now, 2-3 days a
week), she predicts about half the students are the future
penatentiary inhabitants. She keeps them in line but most teachers
let them run amok... she attended Cathelic school in Belize and no
one dared disobey those nuns.

[Bruce]

At what age did you leave elementary school again? Can't your wife
teach you English?

[Hank Rogers]

Don't just pick on the army. Look what the navy did to Popeye. They made
him serve with 100% homosexual officers, with Filipino sex boy toys.

To add insult to injury, Popeye had to cook their vittles whilst all
these homos cavorted around on the decks.

It must have hurt very much, especially since Popeye's brother was a
raging homo.

It's no wonder he suffers from phsd (post homosexual stress disorder)
aka Popeye syndrome.

[Ed Pawlowski]

> let them run amok... she attended Catholic school in Belize and no

> one dared disobey those nuns.
>

Agree! Discipline in schools is terrible and teachers get in trouble
trying to enforce some rules with the unruly. I'm glad I'm not a kid now
with many families, life would be tougher in the future.

[dsi1]

Yeah, maybe...

https://www.npr.org/2019/03/06/700838638/arizona-sen-martha-mcsally-says-she-was-raped-while-in-the-air-force

[jmcquown]

On 3/5/2019 11:05 AM, leno...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Amusing! It all started with a cooking mistake.
>
> https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/good-news/how-1-veteran-went-from-homelessness-to-sweet-success-after-making-a-delicious-mistake/ar-BBUn0Vr?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout
>
>
>
> Lenona.
>
I like the story but I have to wonder why adding cream rather than
buttermilk turned it into a success story. It's not miracle cornbread.

I never have buttermilk on hand. When I make cornbread I use plain milk
or milk I've soured with vinegar. If all I had on hand was cream or
half & half and I wanted to make cornbread, I'd use it. No big
surprise, it's still going to taste good.

Jill

[jmcquown]

Whether you enlist in the military or are drafted, expect to be trained
for combat. Boot camp/basic training weeds out the actual soldiers from
the desk clerks PDQ. And trust me, those clerks are needed. The
military generates a lot of paperwork.

Want to work for the Civil Service and be a government employee, sorta?
Go to work for the US Postal Service. Or become an Indian Agent on a
reservation. Yep, that's still a job. You do have to pass the Civil
Service exam. You do not have to have served in the military.

Jill

[Julie Bove]

"jmcquown" <j_mc...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1i2gE.12342$bK....@fx39.iad...

Boot camp is different for every branch,

>
> Want to work for the Civil Service and be a government employee, sorta? Go
> to work for the US Postal Service. Or become an Indian Agent on a
> reservation. Yep, that's still a job. You do have to pass the Civil
> Service exam. You do not have to have served in the military.

Okay. Then require them to work a job like that or be in the military. I
know people who were in the military and had desk jobs. They still had PTSD.

[Gary]

Julie Bove wrote:
>
> I know people who were in the military and had desk jobs.
> They still had PTSD.

Just a bunch of pansies. Yeah, desk jobs are so
traumatic. I wonder if corporate civilian jobs
have ptsd? These days? Probably.

[jmcquown]

While I realize PTSD is a valid disorder I have to wonder how anyone
could develop it while sitting behind a desk.

My father once told me one of the hardest parts of his job (speaking
about Vietnam, which he rarely did) was having to write to inform
parents of the young men under his command that their son had been
killed. And yes, he wrote to them personally, even though they were
also informed through official military channels stateside. I'm sure
that was extremely stressful but he never claimed to have PTSD.

He told me many of the parents wrote back to him, thanking him for his
kind words. His kind words often involved making them sound like they
died heroically even if their kid was an idiot who did something stupid
like try to pick up a land mine after being told to step around it. :(

Jill

[Dave Smith]

[Dave Smith]

On 2019-03-07 12:49 a.m., jmcquown wrote:

> Whether you enlist in the military or are drafted, expect to be trained
> for combat.  Boot camp/basic training weeds out the actual soldiers from
> the desk clerks PDQ.  And trust me, those clerks are needed.  The
> military generates a lot of paperwork.

True. Most military positions involve at least some combat training. I
was in the reserves in an technical unit and our basic training involved
the basics of combat. We had to do the route marches, field crafts,
hygiene, weapons training, play silly bugger. We had to do all that
stuff in addition to our trades training. It was the preparation for
defense when our units might be attacked.

> Want to work for the Civil Service and be a government employee, sorta?
> Go to work for the US Postal Service.  Or become an Indian Agent on a
> reservation.  Yep, that's still a job.  You do have to pass the Civil
> Service exam.  You do not have to have served in the military.

There used to be veterans preference in the civil service here. A lot
of men in the post war civil service were veterans of WWII. I don't know
about the civil service exam, but if you were a vet and had a friend in
politics you were in. In Ontario, being a Mason was having two feet in
the door.

[Dave Smith]

Yep. The military should have tougher recruiting standards to keep the
weirdos out. We see far too many people claiming PTSD who were never
exposed to the sorts of experiences that would cause trauma to a normal
person. People in some positions need to be trained to expect to see
horrible things. It's amazing that some people can undergo horrible
things and not be affected while someone who witnessed the incident
thinks it was traumatic to them.

[Dave Smith]

On 2019-03-07 10:02 a.m., jmcquown wrote:

> While I realize PTSD is a valid disorder I have to wonder how anyone
> could develop it while sitting behind a desk.
>
> My father once told me one of the hardest parts of his job (speaking
> about Vietnam, which he rarely did) was having to write to inform
> parents of the young men under his command that their son had been
> killed.  And yes, he wrote to them personally, even though they were
> also informed through official military channels stateside.  I'm sure
> that was extremely stressful but he never claimed to have PTSD.
>
> He told me many of the parents wrote back to him, thanking him for his
> kind words.  His kind words often involved making them sound like they
> died heroically even if their kid was an idiot who did something stupid
> like try to pick up a land mine after being told to step around it. :(
>

My father was quite normal. He spent 5 years in the air force and flew
19 operation flights over Europe. His squadron had a compliment of 189
men and had 1200 casualties. The squadron's men and planes had been
basically replaced 6 times. His plane was shot down on his 19th mission
and managed to bale out, hooked up with the Resistance and smuggled
over to Sweden and then back to the UK and was then sent back to Canada.
He went and visited all of the families of his crew mates, in the UK and
in Canada. A few years ago I talked with a woman from northern Alberta
whose brother was killed in that crash and she said that she remembered
him coming to visit.

[jmcquown]

Yes, I'm aware of what your father did and that he was the only survivor
of the crash. I applaud his efforts to get in touch with his crew mates
families afterwards.

It's perhaps all too easy these days to claim PTSD. If you've not done
anything but sit behind a desk processing paperwork... really? Unless
you're doing it in an active combat zone I fail to understand what is so
damn stressful.

Jill

[Bruce]

On Thu, 7 Mar 2019 10:02:50 -0500, jmcquown <j_mc...@comcast.net>
wrote:

>On 3/7/2019 9:19 AM, Gary wrote:
>> Julie Bove wrote:
>>>
>>> I know people who were in the military and had desk jobs.
>>> They still had PTSD.
>>
>> Just a bunch of pansies. Yeah, desk jobs are so
>> traumatic. I wonder if corporate civilian jobs
>> have ptsd? These days? Probably.
>>
>While I realize PTSD is a valid disorder I have to wonder how anyone
>could develop it while sitting behind a desk.

You haven't seen their colleagues.

[jmcquown]

I used to live right near what was known as "Shelby Farms". It was a
working minimum security county prison. When I say working, I mean the
inmates maintained gardens and engaged in animal husbandry. It was a
self-sustaining county prison. They raised, picked, and slaughtered the
food they ate. And also prepared and served it.

A snippet about Shelby Farms:

"Penal farm:

From 1929 until 1964 Shelby Farms was used as a penal farm, in which
the prisoners of the Shelby County Corrections Center were involved in
agricultural labor to provide food for inmates and staff, or to sell
overproduction for profit on behalf of the state of Tennessee.[7]"

Parts of Shelby Farms are still used as a semipenal farm. Some inmates
of the Shelby County Corrections Center as well as individuals sentenced
to community service are required to do yard work to keep Shelby Farms
fields in shape or to pick up litter on nearby streets.

It was self-sustaining until some rights activists asserted it was
"cruel and unusual punishment" to require prisoners to actually work on
the farm. I guess now they just sit around and wait out their
sentences. Better? Heh.

Jill

[Dave Smith]

On 2019-03-07 11:08 a.m., jmcquown wrote:
>
> Yes, I'm aware of what your father did and that he was the only survivor
> of the crash.  I applaud his efforts to get in touch with his crew mates
> families afterwards.
>
> It's perhaps all too easy these days to claim PTSD.  If you've not done
> anything but sit behind a desk processing paperwork... really?  Unless
> you're doing it in an active combat zone I fail to understand what is so
> damn stressful.

Some people will always be stressed. Sometimes it is a lack of training,
and sometimes it is just a personal trait. They aren't cut out for the
work. I have a friend who I have known since university. She has some
mental health issues. She suffers from anxiety. She has never worked.
She can't handle the stress. Just about everything caused anxiety for
her. She would be an extreme example, but there are lots of people out
there who just can't handle things the way other people. Some people can
go through a combat situation and come out of it feeling like a winner
while others are horrified by what they have just been through, and then
there are those who are just as stressed at having to deal with rude
customers.

[Bruce]

On Thu, 7 Mar 2019 13:54:03 -0500, Dave Smith
<adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote:

>On 2019-03-07 11:08 a.m., jmcquown wrote:
>>
>> Yes, I'm aware of what your father did and that he was the only survivor
>> of the crash.  I applaud his efforts to get in touch with his crew mates
>> families afterwards.
>>
>> It's perhaps all too easy these days to claim PTSD.  If you've not done
>> anything but sit behind a desk processing paperwork... really?  Unless
>> you're doing it in an active combat zone I fail to understand what is so
>> damn stressful.
>
>Some people will always be stressed. Sometimes it is a lack of training,
>and sometimes it is just a personal trait.

Thanks, Dave. Very informative.

[graham]

Canada used to have a prison farm that supplied the system with some
food and helped rehabilitate the prisoners. But it was closed by a
particularly vindictive and nasty primeminister.

[GM]

By the name of Trudeau...???

--
Best
Greg

[graham]

Hell NO!!! It was that right wing zealot, Harper!

[GM]

I've heard rumours that the younger Trudeau was actually sired by Fidel Castro...true or no one wonders, the facial resemblance is simply uncanny...IMWTK...!!!

--
Best
Greg

[cshenk]

Dave Smith wrote:

> On 2019-03-05 4:10 p.m., graham wrote:

> > On 2019-03-05 9:05 a.m., leno...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > > Amusing! It all started with a cooking mistake.
> > >
> > > https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/good-news/how-1-veteran-went-from-h
> > > omelessness-to-sweet-success-after-making-a-delicious-mistake/ar-B
> > > BUn0Vr?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout
> > >
> > >
> > >

> > How come he was homeless after retiring form the Coast Guard. Don't
> > they get pensions?
>
> From what I could find out, the full pension is 50% of their pay, but
> they have to have 20 years service. It seems that anyone who has
> spent any amount of time in the military gets to be called a veteran.
> This guy was apparently in the CG and then, while volunteering,
> someone hired him and he started as a dishwasher. One might expect
> anyone who had a career in the CG would have had a trade of some
> sort. While working in the restaurant he screwed up one of their
> trademark dished and there was some serendipitous results.

Correct Dave. A veteran is someone who served. An Hpnorable vet got a
good conduct discharge. A retired Vet (will have a good conduct
discharge) served 20 or more and gets a portion of their actual active
duty 'pay'. How much depends on how long they served and when they
entered.

Example: I came in in 1983. I was delayed entry to a year which
counted then towards 'years' but only for increments of pay. An E7
with 10 years of service makes less than an E7 with 20. If an
increment would kicl over at say 10 years, I got it with actually only
9 years in service. My deal then was 50% at 20 years then a prorated
increment higher per year over 20. I think it was 2.5% base pay per
year. Now it's 40% base pay at 20 but the increment for years over 20
is something like 3.5% so if you do 30 years, it's 75% of base pay. I
am at 65% of base pay.

Note I mention base pay. Military get all sorts of things that aren't
base pay, like a housing allowance based on where you are stationed and
the local costs, clothing allowances (enlisted only), sea pay, special
duty pays for certain jobs and so on. Those things do not carry over
to retirement but but generally offset costs just enough to keep us off
foodstamps while active duty. Without them, try living in Japan with
no free housing available on a 1500$ a month takehome pay.

Free housing is a misnomer BTW. Generally there is room for 20% at
best in any area to get in it (and of course, you don't get the housing
allowances if in it which are calculated to be no more than 80% of the
local cost).

So some brass tacks added. Congress seems to mandate Retired Vets only
get *at most* 1% less cost of living increase from the actuve duty. So
if Active duty get 2% in a particular year, Retired vets get 1% if
lucky. Slowly, they slip behind the ball curve. Don is now about 28%
behind on COLA raises. His 22 years of service yields less than
minimum wage today. Without me and my income, he'd be homeless and
that includes his Social Security which was based on his 'base pay'.

We aren't whining. We both chose to serve and had a good time in our
military years even if finances were thin. We get it though how even a
person pulling military 'retirement' money can go homeless.

Yes, that 'military retirement income' is taxable as is social security
though some states don't tax it. Federal still does.

[cshenk]

Julie Bove wrote:

>
> "Dave Smith" <adavid...@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:GMCfE.2$np...@fx05.iad...

> > On 2019-03-05 4:10 p.m., graham wrote:
> > > On 2019-03-05 9:05 a.m., leno...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > > > Amusing! It all started with a cooking mistake.
> > > >
> > > >
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/good-news/how-1-veteran-went-from-homelessness-to-sweet-success-after-making-a-delicious-mistake/ar-BBUn0Vr?li=BBnb7Kz&ocid=mailsignout
> > > >
> > > >
> > > How come he was homeless after retiring form the Coast Guard.
> > > Don't they get pensions?
> >
> > From what I could find out, the full pension is 50% of their pay,
> > but they have to have 20 years service. It seems that anyone who
> > has spent any amount of time in the military gets to be called a
> > veteran. This guy was apparently in the CG and then, while
> > volunteering, someone hired him and he started as a dishwasher.
> > One might expect anyone who had a career in the CG would have had
> > a trade of some sort. While working in the restaurant he screwed
> > up one of their trademark dished and there was some serendipitous
> > results.
>

> A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world. They are
> specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the military. It's like
> starting over again at the bottom.

This is true Julie. There can be high relevance if you know how to
sell it, but if your job was based on raising the right flags on a
ship's mast or flashing lights in morse code, it's not really relevant
now. There aren't many jobs for Parachute Riggers either... Both sell
on leadership knowledge which they will have in heavy doses.

[cshenk]

Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> On 3/6/2019 11:55 AM, penm...@aol.com wrote:
> >On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 15:42:19 -0000, Janet <Ja...@somewhere.com> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > > On Tuesday, March 5, 2019 at 6:05:10 PM UTC-6, Julie Bove wrote:
> > >

> > > > A lot of military jobs do not transfer into the real world.
> > > > They are specialized and no such jobs exist outside of the
> > > > military. It's like starting over again at the bottom.
> > >

> >> Anyone with half a brain should have acquired from military life,
> some
> > > transferable work skills which are very marketable in other
> > > fields in civilian life; such as analysis and problem solving,
> > > resilience, management, leadership, teamwork; at the very least,
> > > personal presentation and attention to detail.
> >
> > In my experience most military jobs have a civilian counterpart,
> > however unfortunately most of those jobs don't pay well.
> >
> Some long term military do not adapt well to a different life though.
> They are used to rules, specific orders, and often do not have to
> think for themselves and make decisions.
>
> I've hired a few ex-military with mixed results. One of the best was
> actually kicked out of the Air Force because he was capable of
> thinking and did not need a manual to do everything. Misfit there,
> but a leader here.

Varies Ed like everything else. It depends on the rank often to 'think
for yourself and make decisions'. The military tends to stifle that in
enlisted before E7 but it's also the primary trait folks got past that
makes an E8. It's the 'I got this' trait that then runs with it.

I never made E9 but I was in a case of rate drawdown when eligible and
they were promoting at the 2-4% eligible E8 to E9 for my last 6 years.
Grin, I was not the 2-4% top end in my rate. I was probably at the 10%
top of the pile.

Kinda like you may have 1 opening for the next level up but 10 folks
all capable. You have to pick 1.

After I 'retired' I was free and very much applied that. I am actually
more hampered as a now as a GS in the last year as before I just told
my contract boss what i had done. Now, I sometimes get in a little
trouble for backfilling my GS boss on a problem that i fixed and what I
did.

OOPS, I spent 72K today but it's an even tradeoff where we pay the USAF
72K to train some students early or pay 72K to have them wait for the
next class and push brooms until then. Result, faster fill to the
fleet who need the trained sailor. Better tell my boss.... Yes, I am
evil and he likes it.

[cshenk]

jmcquown wrote:

> On 3/6/2019 12:30 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> > On 3/6/2019 12:16 PM, penm...@aol.com wrote:
> >>On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 12:04:36 -0500, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.xxx>

> > > Behavoral issues is a whole nother topic... I've found that those
> > > who haven't served have far more behavoral issues.
> > >
> >
> > That is a different story.  I think the country would have better
> > citizens if they brought back the draft.  The military fixed a lot
> > of wayward teenagers.
>

> The Draft is still in affect, Ed. Men aged 18 are required to
> register. They just haven't been "called up" using what we know of
> as the Draft. Lottery numbers. Most of the the people serving
> right now are voluntary.
>
> There's a move for a change in the Draft regulations to include Women
> since women have been allowed to and have been serving in combat
> situations. It's only fair they should also be part of the Draft.
> IMHO.
>
> Jill

Apparently there was a rule made that omiting women from the draft was
not legal now.

[Ed Pawlowski]

The joy of equality.
There are plenty of jobs that women can do as well as men, so, why not?
Combat was always off limits, but there too, ability is what matters. I
know some women that I'd want with me in a tough situation rather than
some men. Not just for their ability to physically fight, but because
they can think and act under pressure.

[cshenk]

Julie, what do you actually KNOW about PTSD?

[cshenk]

PTSD is bandied about now and very watered down. Vietnam Vets do not
get VA benefits for it. The bad cases get 10% at best.

I know this one sadly, as I have lived it with Don for 30+ years now.
Julie doesn't know what she is talking about. Popular media makes
light of the real thing, and makes the much more mild type sound worse.

Until you spend 30 years hiding under beds or coffee tables randomly,
you do not understand the real thing.

My answer? I got a really big coffee table so I can cuddle him under
there.

[jmcquown]

On 3/7/2019 8:51 PM, cshenk wrote:
> jmcquown wrote:
>

>> The Draft is still in affect, Ed. Men aged 18 are required to
>> register. They just haven't been "called up" using what we know of
>> as the Draft. Lottery numbers. Most of the the people serving
>> right now are voluntary.
>>
>> There's a move for a change in the Draft regulations to include Women
>> since women have been allowed to and have been serving in combat
>> situations. It's only fair they should also be part of the Draft.
>> IMHO.
>>
>> Jill
>
> Apparently there was a rule made that omiting women from the draft was
> not legal now.
>

Yes, that's what I'm talking about. I saw a story on the news a few
mornings ago. Women will soon be eligible to be drafted since they
championed so hard to be allowed in combat situations. Fair is fair.

Jill